1 00:00:00,04 --> 00:00:03,71 You a tailor has gone it's good. 2 00:00:04,90 --> 00:00:10,77 Recording are you recording I am recording where you're going to Corning your mike sounds great dude I go. 3 00:00:12,07 --> 00:00:16,32 You know I'm on the Amazon Prime and I got all this xo lower this and that came in. 4 00:00:17,38 --> 00:00:25,53 And I got a I got it did Mike so and I know just like one step above just stick in some headphones and the Mike jet. 5 00:00:29,48 --> 00:00:34,02 I also did the X L R thing with that sense listen. 6 00:00:35,35 --> 00:00:41,82 Yes it's my Barry White impression as low as you are you ready for this blast from the past the Master Card this is 7 00:00:41,86 --> 00:00:49,89 saying. That yes listeners Taylor was McMaster Carr employee six yeah. 8 00:00:52,50 --> 00:00:57,93 So we're we're casting our voices Evans to do the voice I like this feeling 9 00:00:57,94 --> 00:01:04,08 and I think it's good that we're doing it at night it seems appropriate like going to the movies you have to go 10 00:01:04,09 --> 00:01:05,33 and it is yes. 11 00:01:06,55 --> 00:01:12,11 Unless you're sneaking off at lunch which maybe also is a good way to do our cast Oh man we'll see this is you should 12 00:01:12,12 --> 00:01:15,84 you should be able to know if you're like Mr corporates. 13 00:01:17,09 --> 00:01:27,60 I picture you like Mad Men drinking those tiny martinis many of. Sadly I. Don't do that I sit in front of a computer. 14 00:01:30,14 --> 00:01:37,33 And type things that people is it one of those those mythical hoodies you had to get on like a four month waiting list 15 00:01:37,34 --> 00:01:37,60 for. 16 00:01:38,70 --> 00:01:46,58 You know what it what Welcome money never heard that's like the classic Silicon Valley nonsense it's just you know 17 00:01:46,59 --> 00:01:52,21 somebody made a hoodie that wasn't manufactured you know by nine year old fingers 18 00:01:52,25 --> 00:01:56,87 and apparently there's a huge waiting list for it I mean it could be it's just one of those like Buzz Feed 19 00:01:56,88 --> 00:01:59,98 advertisements that you know where they're always showing. 20 00:02:00,15 --> 00:02:04,03 Like the back of somebody said with psoriasis on it or whatever yeah. 21 00:02:05,15 --> 00:02:11,43 So I don't know if it's a for real or if it's like. You know. Yeah. 22 00:02:12,66 --> 00:02:18,64 We'll have to put it in the comments yes yeah nice yeah. So. 23 00:02:19,68 --> 00:02:28,84 What Yeah yeah I have a I have a welcome sentence going into so yeah and then I have like an intro myself 24 00:02:28,85 --> 00:02:33,12 and then maybe you could intro yourself like projects I think you're working on and then we can 25 00:02:33,37 --> 00:02:36,77 and then we can talk about Challenge number one which which Taylor and I know what it is 26 00:02:36,78 --> 00:02:39,28 but we have not yet seen what the other person has done. 27 00:02:41,63 --> 00:02:48,42 So our podcast is called the opposable thumbs podcast so welcome to that because you are now somehow listening to it 28 00:02:49,30 --> 00:02:54,39 and opposable thumbs as a podcast for Taylor and I tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks 29 00:02:55,29 --> 00:02:58,41 and we talk about our accomplishments failures and lessons learned 30 00:02:59,31 --> 00:03:04,69 and I think we're going to also be inviting a guest to come on and do a challenge with us. 31 00:03:05,83 --> 00:03:12,84 And learn learn about what they do and that should throw some really great weird monkey wrenches into the whole works. 32 00:03:14,11 --> 00:03:22,15 My name is robbery a live in Los Angeles by day as Taylor has referenced I. 33 00:03:23,45 --> 00:03:27,72 Have a job with a very twenty first century title which is experienced director. 34 00:03:30,35 --> 00:03:30,67 Yeah 35 00:03:30,78 --> 00:03:38,66 and I imagine your resume just being like an abstract painting it is it is yeah yeah it's it works really great 36 00:03:38,67 --> 00:03:39,88 when you're trying to find a new job. 37 00:03:42,35 --> 00:03:46,56 Experience director is sort of like part tech director and part creative director or something like that 38 00:03:47,39 --> 00:03:50,01 and interactive agency here in Los Angeles 39 00:03:50,05 --> 00:03:58,31 and I commute very far by bicycle to get there as it is in the what is it so like so Ican Beach which is almost like a 40 00:03:58,99 --> 00:04:04,37 redundant thing right. Like that beach already has a lot of so. But if. 41 00:04:05,71 --> 00:04:11,58 They could just call it the beach and it would be already chock full of silicone But yes so I did that and then I. 42 00:04:12,90 --> 00:04:20,78 Run space very casually called exoskeleton here in Los Angeles and I host a very infrequent art openings 43 00:04:20,79 --> 00:04:21,53 and events there 44 00:04:22,10 --> 00:04:31,89 and I also have a newsletter called exoskeletal which is a sort of semi frequent e-mail blast that I do. 45 00:04:34,24 --> 00:04:38,74 To amuse myself and think through things 46 00:04:38,80 --> 00:04:43,57 and they'll be links all that stuff so you could sign up for a newsletter if you want and what not 47 00:04:43,58 --> 00:04:46,86 but that's what's keeping you busy and I me new. 48 00:04:48,27 --> 00:04:54,29 Dad So that's what you said Oh yeah yeah geez careful with that can of worms but we. 49 00:04:56,05 --> 00:05:01,18 Can talk about quite a bit about that too if we should I'm sure we just keep the recording going afterwards 50 00:05:01,19 --> 00:05:09,15 and we can release like. Like opposable thumbs just for. Yes. 51 00:05:11,23 --> 00:05:16,85 Another thing to throw in there have you have you ever found the secret art installation that Chris Riley 52 00:05:16,86 --> 00:05:23,48 and I did in the exoskeleton. I have not. Yet which is as rad. 53 00:05:24,55 --> 00:05:25,31 Taylor 54 00:05:25,87 --> 00:05:33,01 and our buddy Chris Riley who actually may be joining us on this podcast would be great if he is he's even teaching 55 00:05:33,02 --> 00:05:33,43 right now. 56 00:05:36,89 --> 00:05:43,48 Created a project inside of Texas Health and I know nothing about which is my favorite art piece in the world 57 00:05:43,49 --> 00:05:51,12 and it's fun to be near it when I'm there and also have no idea what it is or where it is then we should know that. 58 00:05:52,42 --> 00:05:59,98 I mean exoskeleton is a house like. Yes Yeah it's not like a little Chelsea White Cube or something that the. 59 00:06:00,01 --> 00:06:04,53 It has you have residents to regulate co-owners your neighbors that live with. 60 00:06:05,77 --> 00:06:14,09 Yet totally yeah my my neighbors are rad people we are what they call tenants in common which means all of us are on 61 00:06:14,10 --> 00:06:21,31 the what is that called mortgage yes you I don't know lease No not lease whatever that thing is title and 62 00:06:21,98 --> 00:06:28,98 and we share it together and it's actually not a bad way to live your life if you live in any kind of urban area where. 63 00:06:29,99 --> 00:06:34,29 Property is exorbitantly expensive Yes Gees and. 64 00:06:36,19 --> 00:06:43,11 So there was the exoskeleton point also before I forget regarding your your silicone beach comment I was just listening 65 00:06:43,12 --> 00:06:50,67 to Mark parents podcast about how he was interviewing Eugene Levy who was talking about some sports team called the. 66 00:06:51,94 --> 00:06:54,32 It was like the tiger cats or something like that 67 00:06:54,33 --> 00:06:57,85 and they had a friend who joked that it was like calling a sports team the monkey. 68 00:07:00,79 --> 00:07:08,43 Has to believe that he lives just up the hill for me I just think I'm sin you know Barack Obama just on down 69 00:07:08,44 --> 00:07:14,25 and we exactly like Obama just to take a left at that place where Rob was was attacked. 70 00:07:16,23 --> 00:07:19,28 That's right I got mugged Yeah yeah. 71 00:07:21,43 --> 00:07:26,13 I have yet to be mugged but I feel like when it happens it's going to be a real bummer like. 72 00:07:27,83 --> 00:07:32,88 More on that later as you'll see in my bio and they noted to tall person. 73 00:07:34,70 --> 00:07:39,67 I've I've met I've definitely talked to other dude's who are kind of nerdy like me 74 00:07:39,68 --> 00:07:46,84 and they're tall This actually makes them a bigger target and I don't know why that hasn't happened yet but anyway. 75 00:07:48,33 --> 00:07:54,58 OK well so I'm sailor and I'm an artist an educator I'm teaching. 76 00:07:56,18 --> 00:08:02,13 Art kind of generally although that's been really pretty beat of late. I just went through the whole process of. 77 00:08:03,20 --> 00:08:07,47 Applying for tenure rights of this involves putting this giant binder together 78 00:08:07,48 --> 00:08:15,42 and surprisingly that many institutions this is still a a paper document so here I am sort of pushing 79 00:08:15,43 --> 00:08:19,76 and pushing trying to distill these ideas for this particular audience 80 00:08:19,77 --> 00:08:23,54 and then filtering back through paper you know as a media artist 81 00:08:23,55 --> 00:08:31,97 and then also trying to think about like people interpret ing the value of the arts through the lens of how we value 82 00:08:31,98 --> 00:08:36,96 the sciences and there's just all these different layers of interpretation on the audience and everything. 83 00:08:38,27 --> 00:08:44,64 So I'm really excited to do a project like this where everybody started thinking you know is sort of the Fine Arts 84 00:08:44,68 --> 00:08:48,11 Gallery really the best place for my work 85 00:08:48,12 --> 00:08:52,91 and there's this sort of new audience that's growing out there that's really distributed 86 00:08:52,92 --> 00:09:01,71 and virtual virtual in nature so you know can publishing to get how can you know working in a collaborative where 87 00:09:01,72 --> 00:09:03,85 there's no primary and secondary authorship 88 00:09:03,86 --> 00:09:10,47 and so forth can that square with academia which is very concerned with these things so these are topics that are on 89 00:09:10,48 --> 00:09:16,65 the forefront of my mind and so it's really nice just to sit down with I almost gave away the challenge 90 00:09:16,85 --> 00:09:23,61 but with them how do you feel if you had to be revealed which are which are pretty I would call them non intellectual 91 00:09:23,62 --> 00:09:24,17 material. 92 00:09:26,41 --> 00:09:32,63 Depending on how you want to look at it yes so it's got its kind of ring to it you know you say yes I'm an artist 93 00:09:32,64 --> 00:09:34,00 and a designer and a D.I.Y. 94 00:09:34,01 --> 00:09:35,48 Engineer and blah blah blah 95 00:09:35,49 --> 00:09:42,69 but at the end of the day you're really you're interested in hanging out with creative people and drinking beer 96 00:09:43,11 --> 00:09:50,58 and you know forming objects that that seem to be interesting for some reason so I feel like if we think something's 97 00:09:50,59 --> 00:09:53,47 cool then you know it's worth investigating 98 00:09:53,48 --> 00:09:57,06 and you get a bunch of smart people to investigate it that are good with their hands 99 00:09:57,39 --> 00:09:59,98 and if that needs to be called making because that's. 100 00:10:00,07 --> 00:10:05,58 The term two sure you know whatever that's fine with me so all these all this terminology you know this too shall pass 101 00:10:05,98 --> 00:10:07,21 but at the end the day it's just. 102 00:10:08,25 --> 00:10:15,49 Interesting people you know sort of having a conversation by doing stuff as opposed to just by talking right yeah 103 00:10:15,50 --> 00:10:20,56 totally and there's certain structures right that's like this creativity becomes a halftime show 104 00:10:20,57 --> 00:10:27,08 or this creativity becomes a podcast or this creativity becomes an academic talk yeah right well you know 105 00:10:27,09 --> 00:10:32,93 and here I am I mean it may sound like I'm dissing academia but I have to you know I just talk like that now and. 106 00:10:34,19 --> 00:10:39,49 Have some tension the CEP say oh my God you know you're just you're sort of in teaching mode right now 107 00:10:39,50 --> 00:10:45,46 and we're just trying to decide which place to order takeout from you know like well yeah well let's assess the. 108 00:10:46,79 --> 00:10:50,85 Kind of the drawbacks of what could you Could you unpack that a little bit. 109 00:10:53,22 --> 00:10:57,07 So you know I can I can bring I know I mean I know you have the academic drives to you 110 00:10:57,08 --> 00:11:06,36 but you can bring the business language and I'll bring the. Pedagogy. Synergize and you can only. 111 00:11:07,46 --> 00:11:11,48 One one time I had the shining example of this is before I knew about Reddit 112 00:11:11,52 --> 00:11:19,62 but now I kind of crave to make my brother for the first time where you do a really deed of on two children's movies 113 00:11:19,63 --> 00:11:22,62 but like for me you know like a film theory perspective 114 00:11:23,08 --> 00:11:30,29 and so I had this really great conversation with somebody on Facebook at some point about the most recent Toy Story 115 00:11:30,30 --> 00:11:36,00 movie I can't remember which number it was but the idea that you did you see this one of. 116 00:11:37,12 --> 00:11:41,04 Your and you're a new enough parent it's actually it's kind of a sad one see 117 00:11:41,05 --> 00:11:44,41 but the there's this moment where Mr Potato Head. 118 00:11:45,88 --> 00:11:50,98 He needs to like slip under a door or something so he sticks all of his parts onto a tortilla 119 00:11:51,54 --> 00:11:59,98 and then he's like scooting around and I think he actually gets ripped in half and then the philosophical quit. 120 00:12:00,27 --> 00:12:03,33 Pose this like is it still both Mr Potato Head. 121 00:12:05,08 --> 00:12:08,84 Wound you know some of the pieces are in one half of the turkey and some on the other 122 00:12:09,28 --> 00:12:14,99 but then I had this whole thing about like Buzz Lightyear you know goes into all Spanish mode 123 00:12:15,00 --> 00:12:22,52 but then he also be has this sort of like child like hyper drive sexuality and it was like the lead Tino Mandingo. 124 00:12:23,77 --> 00:12:28,57 Like forcing the other to to be who hyper sexualized and. 125 00:12:31,24 --> 00:12:34,86 Yeah I don't know how I'm going to have the wrap that went up or up so just over eleven. 126 00:12:36,74 --> 00:12:41,07 Yeah are you working on yet any other stuff yes so the. 127 00:12:42,20 --> 00:12:48,59 Thing I was doing a little write up for for our podcast website this is a piece of I'm working on for a couple years I 128 00:12:48,60 --> 00:12:51,69 read that the prototype called controlled feeding status 129 00:12:52,13 --> 00:13:00,45 and this is the actual term that comes from some American prisons where if you commit certain you know misbehaviors 130 00:13:00,49 --> 00:13:03,47 that are specifically food related like stabbing a dude with a fork 131 00:13:03,48 --> 00:13:11,00 or something the put you on this controlled feeding status where you only get a cake of neutral loaf for every meal for 132 00:13:11,01 --> 00:13:11,20 X. 133 00:13:11,21 --> 00:13:17,65 Amount of time you know so it's like the equivalent of a solitary type punishment where you're taking some you know 134 00:13:18,34 --> 00:13:19,21 essential. 135 00:13:20,88 --> 00:13:25,83 Like you can survive in a solitary cell but clearly it's psychologically traumatic 136 00:13:25,84 --> 00:13:28,33 and this is a way to extend that to you in process. 137 00:13:29,50 --> 00:13:35,88 So there's actually you can look at this court case and get the recipe out of the documents for the court case 138 00:13:35,89 --> 00:13:40,83 and make your own neutral Oh so that you know and neutral is what they serve you right so so I made the stuff 139 00:13:41,30 --> 00:13:45,84 and then I also made a series of implements that are progressive Lee harder to eat with 140 00:13:46,68 --> 00:13:48,99 and I just got a grant to be a college. 141 00:13:50,66 --> 00:13:52,00 To get those all cast 142 00:13:52,01 --> 00:13:58,42 and sterling silver so I'm working on that right now so on the one hand there's going to be like the fancy people of 143 00:13:58,43 --> 00:13:59,98 the first world have the use to. 144 00:14:00,01 --> 00:14:07,53 The food problems that are related to too much to eat you know so you craft these like beautiful precious instruments 145 00:14:07,54 --> 00:14:08,87 that help you eat less. 146 00:14:09,93 --> 00:14:15,42 And then on the other side of that spectrum in American culture certainly you have the you know the way that the prison 147 00:14:15,43 --> 00:14:16,74 system drives. 148 00:14:18,74 --> 00:14:25,11 All of these decisions we make regarding people that don't have access well to their freedom and so forth and 149 00:14:25,38 --> 00:14:26,73 and the notion like whether 150 00:14:26,74 --> 00:14:33,87 or not a criminal deserves these essential pleasures of eating something that actually doesn't just say it's nasty. 151 00:14:34,90 --> 00:14:37,67 And so there's a there's a couple of topics wrapped in there 152 00:14:37,68 --> 00:14:44,01 but right now I'm really focused on the material which has been really exciting to work with with silver because I 153 00:14:44,02 --> 00:14:48,59 haven't done it. Yet it's cool wild Wow is that is that. 154 00:14:49,62 --> 00:14:57,80 Like something he the world will be seeing this year our summer or oh yes oh I just working with this great. 155 00:14:59,66 --> 00:15:06,73 Kater who also works at Columbia making I'm going to have to give her a shot at in the title because I'm not sure how 156 00:15:06,74 --> 00:15:09,21 to pronounce her name but vegan. 157 00:15:10,28 --> 00:15:13,28 Is a really great metalsmith And so I talked to her 158 00:15:13,71 --> 00:15:20,18 and was able to hire her to get these pieces put together so the thing was Shapeways 159 00:15:20,61 --> 00:15:26,54 and one thing I really hope to see in the future with these companies right is that they offer all of this. 160 00:15:27,55 --> 00:15:31,94 The separate patient services and it's all sort of automated but the second you know enough to get in there 161 00:15:31,95 --> 00:15:39,48 and say hey you know I'm exceeding the envelope honey you're building area you know could you guys this build me the 162 00:15:39,49 --> 00:15:44,21 two pieces of wax and then fuse them together before you do the silver last two X. 163 00:15:44,22 --> 00:15:47,08 Casting you know you would hope they could do something like that 164 00:15:47,09 --> 00:15:52,77 but through emailing the company a couple times they basically just like you pick the options on the site 165 00:15:52,83 --> 00:15:59,98 and we either do that stuff or we do but there's literally no way least they claim to reach out into the fabric a. 166 00:16:00,23 --> 00:16:01,47 Sector of the company 167 00:16:01,51 --> 00:16:08,06 and to make a specific request like please don't polish the ends that need to get soldered together whatever 168 00:16:08,95 --> 00:16:15,56 but so so I find that kind of interesting with that business model that you know it claims to be able to do anything 169 00:16:15,57 --> 00:16:18,45 right you can print anything as long as it's in this building 170 00:16:18,87 --> 00:16:22,91 and as long as the wire thicknesses you know exceeds the minimum size 171 00:16:22,92 --> 00:16:26,38 and so it's a pretty quickly you could run up against those limitations 172 00:16:26,39 --> 00:16:29,57 and it's pretty inflexible I guess just based on the business. 173 00:16:31,94 --> 00:16:38,05 Should be Diven a challenge number one let's do it and I'm very excited to see what you came up with 174 00:16:38,06 --> 00:16:44,74 and I'm also inseminated because when you were talking around that I mean at least started questioning it by putting. 175 00:16:46,93 --> 00:16:50,76 You you you'll find other wise when I when I share my but. 176 00:16:51,84 --> 00:16:59,67 I had big dreams and some of those dreams fell apart but our challenge number one is a paper clip and two by four. 177 00:17:02,16 --> 00:17:10,53 I forget even who I think I forget even how we came up with it we sort of decided exactly about two weeks ago maybe 178 00:17:10,54 --> 00:17:16,56 slightly less than two weeks ago which is sort of the time that we've decided to give ourselves to work on a project. 179 00:17:17,81 --> 00:17:23,27 We sort of kicked around like not that many ideas like maybe two or three and we landed on a paper clip 180 00:17:23,28 --> 00:17:25,56 and to buy for it do you remember how we did that. 181 00:17:27,44 --> 00:17:31,82 I think what we're going to do is we're moving forwards astray to evolve towards. 182 00:17:33,60 --> 00:17:37,99 It's this classic teaching thing right like Don't think of the limitations as a. 183 00:17:39,29 --> 00:17:47,76 Think of it is the structure of the world Yeah right yeah and so you know it has to be it has to be limited enough 184 00:17:47,80 --> 00:17:55,56 and not see limited so I think at some point you had you had pitched a two by four project which is a classic thing 185 00:17:55,57 --> 00:17:59,64 right like you'll find Instructables make a full chair and once you buy for whatever. 186 00:18:00,40 --> 00:18:07,71 And so the I think the addition of the paper clip in my mind was there's two things that are so different in scale 187 00:18:07,72 --> 00:18:15,12 and material so making something where both of those elements seemed completely necessary was was the challenge to me. 188 00:18:16,30 --> 00:18:23,37 Yeah and I totally came came back at me a number of times being like dang it one is really big 189 00:18:23,38 --> 00:18:24,55 and one is really small 190 00:18:24,56 --> 00:18:32,00 and like what is what does that mean like what is which one is the limit you know right do you want to go first so so 191 00:18:32,04 --> 00:18:38,15 so before we do that so we haven't seen one another's work at all we don't know what the other person's doing. 192 00:18:39,20 --> 00:18:47,38 And we're going to share it real time we'll be sending one another photos over are like a little slack channel probably 193 00:18:47,82 --> 00:18:49,14 And so we can see it 194 00:18:49,15 --> 00:18:54,56 and then we'll post those photos of course on line so people can see those in the show know it's so but 195 00:18:54,60 --> 00:18:58,13 but we've been working for two weeks it's actually kind of hard 196 00:18:58,14 --> 00:19:03,54 but we've been working for two weeks without telling one another what we're doing and now we're going to share it. 197 00:19:04,55 --> 00:19:08,60 And if you want to first say that that would be great yes so. 198 00:19:09,74 --> 00:19:17,69 Just first to talk about some of the things I was thinking about initially thinking a bunch of that it's temporary 199 00:19:17,70 --> 00:19:23,49 services right because Angelo just passed away from it this and you know the story 200 00:19:23,50 --> 00:19:29,01 but for those who don't separate services agree at this point in the international collaborative 201 00:19:29,05 --> 00:19:35,88 but it started as a bunch of folks in Chicago and they do these sort of social action. 202 00:19:37,64 --> 00:19:38,50 Performance works 203 00:19:38,51 --> 00:19:44,29 and a bunch of print publication things like that so one of their members what it was Mark Wright was communicating 204 00:19:44,42 --> 00:19:48,39 fairly well I think of it that way I'm not sure exactly 205 00:19:48,40 --> 00:19:52,56 but that's in my head that's out there it seems that I want to speak speak for these days 206 00:19:52,57 --> 00:19:59,98 but in some way the collaborative or perhaps Mark specifically were. Had this. Power relation. 207 00:20:00,01 --> 00:20:04,30 Ship with this do that was in jail and they wanted to allow him to be anonymous 208 00:20:04,31 --> 00:20:09,95 but the basic information was that he was you know in jail for a long time and I believe on the West Coast and believe. 209 00:20:11,10 --> 00:20:11,97 And so. 210 00:20:13,09 --> 00:20:15,79 You know they were pretty studious about never saying exactly what he did 211 00:20:15,80 --> 00:20:17,74 but he was also a pretty great drops person 212 00:20:17,75 --> 00:20:23,00 and so he started sending out these great drawings which I believe he was Tech he was technically illegal he was not 213 00:20:23,01 --> 00:20:25,71 allowed to be but he was he would set up the dimensions of this 214 00:20:26,01 --> 00:20:28,41 and start to detail you know this is what it said to go. 215 00:20:29,44 --> 00:20:37,10 So that separate services had all of these objects rebuilt in the material appropriate fashion in the outside 216 00:20:37,11 --> 00:20:42,71 and they actually got a whole full size cell going that was a traveling exhibit I set up a. 217 00:20:44,41 --> 00:20:51,36 Really great project so it's kind of thinking about that so it's first I was thinking maybe I would use like a two by 218 00:20:51,37 --> 00:20:55,50 four to make a device that you could use to blow out circuits 219 00:20:56,06 --> 00:21:01,00 and so like to have you know two little paper clips nailed to the end 220 00:21:01,41 --> 00:21:05,51 and then maybe wrap the whole thing in electrical safe and then jam it into a socket. 221 00:21:07,59 --> 00:21:13,59 I thought that was probably a bad idea because I wasn't sure exactly how that was going to go so I kind of put that one 222 00:21:13,60 --> 00:21:16,12 beside it but I was thinking about Angelo 223 00:21:16,62 --> 00:21:22,47 and then the local chairman I was thinking about I think one of the Tales From The Crypt or something that's like a. 224 00:21:23,59 --> 00:21:26,20 Doll that comes back to life and sticks paper clips of the. 225 00:21:28,05 --> 00:21:33,45 Grease the whore but anyway so so I was going where I started and then where I got to after that came from a. 226 00:21:34,46 --> 00:21:35,36 Discussion that my. 227 00:21:37,13 --> 00:21:42,71 Grad students were having so I'm teaching this have to have hundred or a class at Columbia College on the topic of C. 228 00:21:42,72 --> 00:21:43,02 and C. 229 00:21:43,03 --> 00:21:48,70 Milling and as a focus for our conversations I'm using this really excellent piece 230 00:21:48,99 --> 00:21:51,60 and I can't believe I didn't know about this till this year 231 00:21:51,61 --> 00:21:59,11 but it said Garnett Hertz's critical making series which I think is at least three years old at this point so the 232 00:21:59,56 --> 00:21:59,98 history. 233 00:22:00,01 --> 00:22:05,85 It was that met read who's working up in Canada so it's using this term critical making I think as early as late two 234 00:22:05,86 --> 00:22:09,55 thousand and seven but he's talking about it and says 235 00:22:09,93 --> 00:22:13,79 when he talks about it he says you know critical thinking doesn't sound strange 236 00:22:13,80 --> 00:22:20,75 but critical making kind of trips me up a little bit because it's less it just makes less sense and common language 237 00:22:21,58 --> 00:22:22,27 and so that at. 238 00:22:23,28 --> 00:22:30,21 That rather working out these workshops where people are working with a simple like Tronics in their hands as a way of 239 00:22:30,60 --> 00:22:34,76 thinking by by doing and then garden Herts comes by later 240 00:22:35,07 --> 00:22:41,59 and releases the set of sort of ten punk rock style scenes where he interviews that only German Janko 241 00:22:41,60 --> 00:22:44,13 and you know all these sort of folks from the scene 242 00:22:44,89 --> 00:22:52,28 but all the way from high to low so he you know talks to survival research labs and he talks the the T.V. Be gone. 243 00:22:53,75 --> 00:22:58,17 There's a lot of discussion like critique about Maker Faire and its acceptance of DARPA funding 244 00:22:58,18 --> 00:23:05,44 and all that so so so one of the pieces in there my grad student brought in to talk about had to do with this notion of 245 00:23:06,09 --> 00:23:07,49 prototypes of your own in the. 246 00:23:08,66 --> 00:23:15,00 Know So diet Jadick the place where I think out of the term before it had to do with whether 247 00:23:15,01 --> 00:23:22,68 or not this sound is originating from a direct source within a movie right so if there's somebody driving in a car you 248 00:23:22,69 --> 00:23:26,16 know they often do that thing with the credits where the credits will have a background track 249 00:23:26,62 --> 00:23:27,88 and then the guy pulls up in the car 250 00:23:27,89 --> 00:23:34,61 and turns off the radio in the sound actually stops right so that it's sort of a transfer from the sound being a 251 00:23:34,62 --> 00:23:40,61 fictional movie elements to a concrete movie elements when Yeah I think like reservoir of the movie 252 00:23:40,62 --> 00:23:47,50 or something like that yeah yeah totally It's exactly what I had my mind too so I always forget which one is digesting 253 00:23:47,51 --> 00:23:54,69 and which ones not I think I believe. It means it doesn't appear to have an origin within the fictional space but. 254 00:23:56,00 --> 00:23:59,94 So we can we could be that but so anyway there is this a little tiny essay. 255 00:24:00,49 --> 00:24:05,75 Within the critical making structure that's getting the author saying right now what he's talking about these digestive 256 00:24:05,76 --> 00:24:13,20 prototypes or these ideas for technology that are really only existing in the context of fiction 257 00:24:14,09 --> 00:24:16,13 and that how eventually those sort of. 258 00:24:17,53 --> 00:24:20,64 You know turn the loop and star they kind of wag the dog right 259 00:24:20,65 --> 00:24:27,78 and start informing where technology will go later so I think a lot of people credit Star Trek for example as being one 260 00:24:27,79 --> 00:24:36,20 of the big drivers of some technologies like the communicator or being such a bad truth in here 261 00:24:36,21 --> 00:24:43,30 but the you know the little things that medical things. Tricorder Oh yeah right think of it think of the hate mail. 262 00:24:45,12 --> 00:24:50,06 So you know the fact that and sure enough we don't have you know warp speed yet 263 00:24:50,07 --> 00:24:55,47 or any of that some of them is that you you start from a lot of fiction that winds up driving reality to a certain 264 00:24:55,48 --> 00:25:00,34 extent so it's a way that they can this prototype. And. 265 00:25:02,18 --> 00:25:14,04 We might have to edit a little bit of this rub on the selection for getting dressed for it. Well. 266 00:25:17,88 --> 00:25:20,50 OK So from my actual prototype. 267 00:25:21,97 --> 00:25:30,28 Step one is I decided that she almost immediately and the reason for that was my kid was sleeping in the other room 268 00:25:30,41 --> 00:25:39,23 and I realized that I didn't have any paper clips in my studio. So I did have to by force and so here. 269 00:25:40,26 --> 00:25:47,77 You know plug this and say here's my two by four my wired to four little chunk like about eighteen inches long 270 00:25:48,62 --> 00:25:56,89 and then what I got interested in with this study prototype thing is what would happen if I started looking at 271 00:25:56,90 --> 00:25:59,98 inexpensive materials as I often do like this to buy for. 272 00:26:00,61 --> 00:26:05,12 And one of its most interesting characteristics is the not so surface right so the. 273 00:26:06,47 --> 00:26:13,15 Fact that you usually pick wood so that it doesn't have nuts because they're effectively laws I wanted to sort of pick 274 00:26:13,16 --> 00:26:22,39 out a little bit so here if I press on this now you will see that they were totally Yeah so the not now has a passive 275 00:26:22,40 --> 00:26:25,31 touch sensor in it which is the same. 276 00:26:26,33 --> 00:26:29,60 Sensitivity that's used the touch screen phones yeah 277 00:26:29,64 --> 00:26:35,73 and that amid some work you know dealing with human computer interactive devices in the past says interested in them 278 00:26:36,29 --> 00:26:39,20 like what if instead of just taking a plastic mold 279 00:26:39,21 --> 00:26:44,92 and being able to blow you know whatever shape you wanted which can be kind of boring because if you can do absolutely 280 00:26:44,93 --> 00:26:51,19 anything well then you know what do you do so I thought it would be kind of cool if I if I were to pick up really 281 00:26:51,20 --> 00:26:52,30 gnarly weird. 282 00:26:53,38 --> 00:27:01,54 Sort of flawed pieces of material to turn this into human computer interface devices where you would use those flaws as 283 00:27:01,55 --> 00:27:10,97 the. As the as the moments. So that's awesome wow it's so cool yet so it's. 284 00:27:12,07 --> 00:27:18,26 That's really Wow That's great yeah that's really the I really like that idea of like taking the thing that people. 285 00:27:19,55 --> 00:27:23,65 Want to get rid of and sort of trying to find a way to it because it's like 286 00:27:23,66 --> 00:27:27,03 and what like like the not especially right like and what it's the thing that everyone's. 287 00:27:28,23 --> 00:27:33,14 Kind of naturally goes to right away and it's like that's actually you know you X. 288 00:27:33,15 --> 00:27:40,34 Folks spend a lot of time thinking through those issues and. You X. I mean OK Letterman's drops in terminology. 289 00:27:43,45 --> 00:27:46,14 Is it because this is a I'm really curious ab. 290 00:27:47,45 --> 00:27:55,34 You know just like a it's really cool to take something that a lot of maybe you know find woodworkers 291 00:27:55,35 --> 00:27:59,84 or something try to not a racist maybe too strong a word but. 292 00:28:00,04 --> 00:28:07,79 But deflector something right like like that you are sort of striving for this kind of perfection in the would take 293 00:28:07,80 --> 00:28:10,96 those imperfections that are our sort of. 294 00:28:14,47 --> 00:28:20,28 Millions of years of genetics have tuned us into right to sort of always peace looking for imperfections to sort of one 295 00:28:20,33 --> 00:28:25,07 better understand our world and question our safety in the world searching for patterns but. 296 00:28:26,43 --> 00:28:31,47 You know I was think of like if a stick if a stick breaks behind you like everyone knows what that is 297 00:28:31,48 --> 00:28:35,24 and hears it turns around you know kind of thing so yeah that's true great that's really rare 298 00:28:36,06 --> 00:28:43,02 and so I just want to indicate that all I really have at least visually is a two by four nothing special at all 299 00:28:43,30 --> 00:28:52,70 and then it has a little be inserted immediately above one of the prominent knots on the surface so that whenever you 300 00:28:52,71 --> 00:28:59,79 make contact with your finger it goes off now the cheating I alluded to before is that I used a coating. 301 00:29:01,75 --> 00:29:06,52 So it's known as reproduced so I had that was. 302 00:29:08,95 --> 00:29:14,30 Paperclip like was a coat hanger which is just embedded you know it's a hole drilled really close to the surface to 303 00:29:14,31 --> 00:29:19,92 give the feet so the field doesn't have to do so much work right so it's just just underneath the knots. 304 00:29:21,09 --> 00:29:27,28 But I imagine so basically I'm going to provide you know all of the stuff to get somebody to the point where they could 305 00:29:27,29 --> 00:29:29,94 now do something interesting with this so you know throw it up and get. 306 00:29:31,08 --> 00:29:32,12 So here's the code base 307 00:29:32,13 --> 00:29:38,17 and we know here's the there's a very simple wiring diagram that just involves one like one meg sister that's about it. 308 00:29:40,01 --> 00:29:43,61 Yeah so then hopefully if somebody is interested they could grab that and then go ahead 309 00:29:43,62 --> 00:29:46,98 and try to realize the promise of that kind of idea 310 00:29:46,99 --> 00:29:51,07 but this is certainly a prototype That's great yeah that's really cool. 311 00:29:53,25 --> 00:29:59,31 Yeah I can I can jump in on mine if you want do it yeah cool so it was so rad that you brought up the temporary 312 00:29:59,32 --> 00:30:04,51 services and. Angelo collaboration that was my literally second thing I wrote down after. 313 00:30:05,74 --> 00:30:12,24 This topic a little bit yeah I mean that show in two thousand and two I think it was was in Chicago 314 00:30:12,83 --> 00:30:19,83 and that show like blew me away like you know I'll put a link to temporary services dot org And the show notes. 315 00:30:20,95 --> 00:30:24,57 The prisoners invention books has been out of print for a long time in the book is amazing 316 00:30:25,30 --> 00:30:28,55 but there's tons of blog posts and all sorts of. 317 00:30:29,59 --> 00:30:31,53 Stuff online that you can see the stuff 318 00:30:31,54 --> 00:30:38,43 and some of the things that the prisoners make in prison sort of contraband I don't like amazing they're like. 319 00:30:39,60 --> 00:30:41,90 A lot of like cigarette lighters made out of. 320 00:30:42,98 --> 00:30:43,80 Like paper clips 321 00:30:43,81 --> 00:30:51,36 and that's sort of how I got got to that point to I was this like for I was yeah like paperclips are a big component in 322 00:30:51,37 --> 00:30:58,12 a lot of those works. So yeah that that I was like totally on that track for a while and. 323 00:31:00,88 --> 00:31:08,28 Let me since you think all this and over you know if that works you come up on selective Oh you are OK cool. 324 00:31:10,89 --> 00:31:21,84 To me yeah this is like where we're keeping it so new media here OK Also I'm wondering should we just do. Ads for. 325 00:31:23,61 --> 00:31:24,84 Post Office to come 326 00:31:24,85 --> 00:31:35,13 or them to kind of just until they start paying us yeah yeah we should definitely do Stamps dot com and. In. 327 00:31:36,36 --> 00:31:40,86 Software space yeah yeah. Yeah. 328 00:31:42,01 --> 00:31:50,05 Oh man this is this is great so why don't I describe what I'm seeing Yeah great so first of all you have a really moody 329 00:31:50,06 --> 00:31:59,91 photograph which I think matches the. The hit the nature of the intent but we've got lockpicks that are crafted from. 330 00:32:01,15 --> 00:32:07,50 Two by four chunks that are forming the handle with the tension wrench half the ball in a hook 331 00:32:07,51 --> 00:32:14,44 and apart from the I've been looking at this just a little bit but I don't know much about locks ports as the. 332 00:32:15,80 --> 00:32:26,86 Folks call I believe so so yeah. Yeah so I. I so I'll admit that I originally. 333 00:32:28,07 --> 00:32:31,98 So I at first I was like I'm going to just investigate the paperclip in a paperclip is. 334 00:32:33,55 --> 00:32:41,02 In my opinion like fairly junky metal right like it's not good metal but it has certain properties it's very Bindy 335 00:32:41,03 --> 00:32:45,72 but somewhat stiff in this way that like if you bend at a certain way can hold some papers together 336 00:32:45,73 --> 00:32:46,51 and that's really cool. 337 00:32:48,35 --> 00:32:54,21 But then you kind of dig until like OK what what are things in the world made of wire right like 338 00:32:54,49 --> 00:32:59,64 and I had like like a whisk like a kitchen with skin play carving tools 339 00:32:59,68 --> 00:33:05,40 and then I got into looking at think about like a compass needle and could you magnetize a wire or something 340 00:33:05,79 --> 00:33:09,27 and I got into all sorts of other places and I'll tell you where I went first 341 00:33:09,28 --> 00:33:16,23 and where I went first is a really big failure on my part but the first thing I wanted to make was this. 342 00:33:17,67 --> 00:33:23,36 They sell them online and my partner in crime Jinnah has one. 343 00:33:25,04 --> 00:33:30,65 And it's called a handheld sewing machine it's this very small stapler looking thing that has this other little 344 00:33:31,39 --> 00:33:36,25 and so I was like That's it that's what I'm going to do I'm going to I'm going to tell you make that and I'm going to. 345 00:33:38,23 --> 00:33:38,86 You know I'm going to 346 00:33:39,73 --> 00:33:45,05 and then I got to thinking like OK well a paper clip doesn't act as a spring break well because it's quite soft right 347 00:33:45,06 --> 00:33:48,70 like you squeeze it and it sort of stays squeezed. 348 00:33:49,92 --> 00:33:51,17 So I got to looking online 349 00:33:51,18 --> 00:33:56,83 and I found this cool post by this website called The Naked Scientist on stiffening paperclips It's called stiffening 350 00:33:56,84 --> 00:33:59,75 paperclips metallurgy in the kitchen. And they. 351 00:34:00,01 --> 00:34:04,39 And the differences between like work hardening which is like just bending something backing back and forth 352 00:34:04,40 --> 00:34:09,67 and that makes it more stiff which is something I've never even thought of before I sort of experienced it yeah I've 353 00:34:09,68 --> 00:34:10,49 only ever experienced. 354 00:34:11,98 --> 00:34:17,90 Yeah it was interesting like I think it and they go they have all sorts of great like illustrations 355 00:34:17,91 --> 00:34:22,52 and stuff that sort of show how bending a paperclip makes it more stiff through work hardening 356 00:34:22,66 --> 00:34:25,77 and then a kneeling right which is like heating it up very hot and then annealing 357 00:34:25,78 --> 00:34:30,82 and quenching which is you know you heat up super hot and then you quench it in cold water oil 358 00:34:30,83 --> 00:34:36,60 or something which is sort of like a blacksmith kind of move and so I did some experiments with annealing 359 00:34:36,61 --> 00:34:38,97 and quenching which would make the stiffest result 360 00:34:38,98 --> 00:34:45,45 and that's what I did do with the lockpicks if you zoom in on that image you'll see they look kind of Christian because 361 00:34:45,66 --> 00:34:51,48 yes I. Guess Yes torch and he did I'm up in and quenched him in cold water. 362 00:34:53,09 --> 00:34:59,54 And so I was really into that and I was going to make this and so I made a kind of sewing needle and I got going 363 00:34:59,95 --> 00:35:02,90 but then I realized super huge flaw 364 00:35:02,91 --> 00:35:08,39 and this is like a great lesson it's like always deeply investigate the thing you want to emulate before you just dive 365 00:35:08,40 --> 00:35:15,30 in and do it because you're going to run into something that is a surprise and what I had totally forgotten is. 366 00:35:16,93 --> 00:35:22,77 There's a magical component of most sewing machines that is not visible and that was the Bob 367 00:35:22,78 --> 00:35:32,15 and you know yeah yeah yeah the bobbin is this magical wondrous thing that you don't see in a sewing machine that 368 00:35:32,16 --> 00:35:33,94 actually makes everything awesome 369 00:35:34,24 --> 00:35:39,50 and it's this great mechanical I found an amazing animated gif of how a bobbin works 370 00:35:39,51 --> 00:35:45,49 and opened it was shown as just googling the gift. Of the penguin. 371 00:35:46,51 --> 00:35:51,07 I think it was like hand drawn kind of there's probably a lot of them maybe there's a guy 372 00:35:51,08 --> 00:35:59,28 but yeah I mean the bobbin is super rad like as if you're going to nerd out on a machine thing the bobbin is a great 373 00:35:59,65 --> 00:35:59,98 thing to. 374 00:36:00,57 --> 00:36:05,12 Anyway I realized quickly I cannot pull that off with just a paper clip 375 00:36:05,85 --> 00:36:13,58 and so I stared down failure on my first attempt at making something awesome with a paper clip in a two by four 376 00:36:14,39 --> 00:36:20,06 and then I and then I decided OK I'm going to make go for something simpler 377 00:36:20,29 --> 00:36:26,98 and actually ironically right I mean I think this is part of the making stuff in the world as you think oh even the 378 00:36:26,99 --> 00:36:32,60 simple The simple thing like oh actually this is also really hard so so I did make a tension wrench and a half ball 379 00:36:32,64 --> 00:36:35,41 and. A. 380 00:36:37,27 --> 00:36:42,97 Hook and I used there's this You Tube channel just called Reed which I really like 381 00:36:43,22 --> 00:36:47,03 and it's his channel block picking and it was very inspiring and he has a. 382 00:36:49,21 --> 00:36:52,11 Video on homemade lockpicks and a link to that in the show it's. 383 00:36:53,24 --> 00:36:59,18 Really cool and simple he doesn't know how to make lockpicks but he shows off the ones he's made. And I have. 384 00:37:00,26 --> 00:37:08,35 So I will also admit like I have been trying to pick a lock I said in about thirty minutes so far trying to pick a lock 385 00:37:08,36 --> 00:37:13,84 with these lockpicks and I have not succeeded and I will update online if I ever do actually succeed 386 00:37:13,85 --> 00:37:17,99 and I'm going to try to the point of breakage for these things is if it works I also. 387 00:37:20,84 --> 00:37:24,98 Want to make a set of pics actually also that have not been a new year old unquenched to see if. 388 00:37:26,26 --> 00:37:31,90 You know like just want to put Does one break sooner than the other yeah yeah Right exactly so we'll see but that's. 389 00:37:33,24 --> 00:37:35,30 That's when I made it in the spirit of time that's. 390 00:37:36,70 --> 00:37:39,19 The summary at that and I'll put in a post the photos 391 00:37:39,20 --> 00:37:43,75 and I'll post we can post like an animated gif of Taylor's video or something up as well 392 00:37:44,02 --> 00:37:51,54 and we admittedly haven't quite figured out how that's going to work but if you go to opposable podcast dot com. 393 00:37:52,64 --> 00:37:55,28 You will get to the opposable thumbs podcast website 394 00:37:55,29 --> 00:37:59,89 and you will see all of this glorious stuff on the website yeah the. 395 00:38:00,33 --> 00:38:00,77 Warts 396 00:38:00,78 --> 00:38:08,81 and all the I mean I mean maybe it sounds like we might have one minute of super boring getting things wrong to edit 397 00:38:08,82 --> 00:38:12,10 out but I don't know maybe we should leave that maybe we should and boring stuff. 398 00:38:13,95 --> 00:38:21,19 It's what all the podcasts are doing is adding boring stuff deconstructed man it's a new thing have you have you ever 399 00:38:21,54 --> 00:38:24,12 picked a lock with an actual with a non D.I.Y. 400 00:38:24,13 --> 00:38:25,73 Sit I have not 401 00:38:25,74 --> 00:38:32,58 and I've always wanted to acquire So in just a caveat that in many states in this here United States owning 402 00:38:32,59 --> 00:38:37,73 or are transporting or anything a set of lockpicks could actually get you arrested 403 00:38:37,74 --> 00:38:44,63 or whatever so really Yeah I think there's quite a bit of you could really get into some trouble with that So before 404 00:38:44,64 --> 00:38:48,72 you make a set Think about think about think about it before you take them out of your house but. 405 00:38:50,96 --> 00:38:55,89 I think you have to probably be like some sort of locksmith here you know license or something but. 406 00:38:57,26 --> 00:39:01,44 I've always wanted to own a set I've always thought about owning a set I never have been because they always are sort 407 00:39:01,45 --> 00:39:06,49 of like well you know I think I could make a set so then at least I sort of scratch that itch with this project can 408 00:39:06,50 --> 00:39:14,21 maybe maybe they'll actually work I think if I recall I've been following some luck pick stuff just for fun 409 00:39:14,22 --> 00:39:18,77 and Barrios is a company that seems to be popular I don't know any. 410 00:39:20,12 --> 00:39:27,30 But it would be in the interest of science I would be curious for you to start with a professional one just so that you 411 00:39:27,31 --> 00:39:33,29 know there are fights in the air exists between steering column and see if you know to totally yeah 412 00:39:33,30 --> 00:39:38,62 and I also have like zero experience it's like one hundred percent of a like you 413 00:39:38,63 --> 00:39:44,90 when you're one hundred percent novice everything is a possible problem it's like you're just could be the problem like 414 00:39:44,91 --> 00:39:46,30 you're the problem everything so. 415 00:39:47,35 --> 00:39:52,34 So you know it's like a gradual would willing a way of of ignorance right that we all do 416 00:39:52,35 --> 00:39:56,95 when we all recipient next podcast that we call the ignorance. 417 00:40:00,81 --> 00:40:05,22 I have a few links of things that I sort of jotted down 418 00:40:05,36 --> 00:40:11,81 or were into over the past two weeks do you have anything tailored that you have or are I can dive in on my list 419 00:40:11,82 --> 00:40:15,30 or whatever oh yeah I mean I'm going to have to go back 420 00:40:15,31 --> 00:40:23,31 and so I think in keeping with my lecture habits which tend to be more off the cuff than that. 421 00:40:25,40 --> 00:40:31,24 You know I don't really know what will be said until it comes out. Which which is both. 422 00:40:32,83 --> 00:40:35,53 Liberating and gets me in trouble. 423 00:40:36,90 --> 00:40:43,33 So I have to think back on what I had but certainly I would link to guard it hurts his piece and the. 424 00:40:45,12 --> 00:40:45,99 Obvious have to go back 425 00:40:46,00 --> 00:40:53,06 and figure out what I talked that all that stuff yeah cool I have a couple of things that I wrote down that I was very 426 00:40:53,07 --> 00:40:58,13 quickly mention one of the things that I use all the time 427 00:40:58,14 --> 00:41:03,23 and I kind of bought them thinking like I'm never going to use easel I might doing this is. 428 00:41:04,44 --> 00:41:08,23 Do waltz makes a set of very small trigger clamps 429 00:41:08,86 --> 00:41:14,63 when I think about your clamp I think of like a one that's probably twenty inches long or twenty four inches long 430 00:41:14,64 --> 00:41:16,04 or even like five feet long 431 00:41:16,29 --> 00:41:20,76 and then you know I think most people have one in their shop where you sort of squeeze the trigger over and over 432 00:41:20,77 --> 00:41:25,92 and over and the clamp gets gradually tighter tighter and tighter. I bought a set of. 433 00:41:27,05 --> 00:41:33,27 Small De Walt small trigger clamps I'm sure other companies make them as well I don't have those they're about five 434 00:41:33,28 --> 00:41:40,34 bucks apiece and I use them a ton on on this and everything else just like clamp small pieces of wood together 435 00:41:40,35 --> 00:41:45,89 and it's really nice and I think most troops are kind of horsey unless you're doing cabinet work 436 00:41:45,90 --> 00:41:51,34 or something kind of like that you know. I'm not from the usage of the term horsey. 437 00:41:52,40 --> 00:41:59,70 Horse like to big or like in the way I'm maybe I'm more then then helpful kind of thing. 438 00:42:00,52 --> 00:42:11,23 Is that a floor it probably is seriously that I literally have never OK yeah yeah yeah. Anyway I. 439 00:42:13,80 --> 00:42:16,17 May go into those unsure notes but they're there surprisingly handy 440 00:42:16,18 --> 00:42:23,24 and I think one thing I like about them the most is because they're trigger clamps you can actually adjust the pressure 441 00:42:23,25 --> 00:42:28,76 on them in a spare Lee precise way unlike you know I think a lot of people have the kind of spring clamps that are 442 00:42:28,77 --> 00:42:32,67 almost like a giant close pin that you squeeze with your hand to clamp things together 443 00:42:32,68 --> 00:42:35,58 and they they make those in different like small medium 444 00:42:35,59 --> 00:42:40,89 and kind of heavy you know like like lots of pressure on maybe not lots of pressure 445 00:42:41,01 --> 00:42:43,63 but what's nice about this lamp is you can sort of just. 446 00:42:44,90 --> 00:42:47,75 You know as you sort of are like oh this wood is really getting pressed together 447 00:42:47,76 --> 00:42:50,43 and all the glue glue is using out I'll let off the pressure 448 00:42:50,44 --> 00:42:55,42 and it's really handy anyway it's a really small weird tool but it's kind of boring but. 449 00:42:57,77 --> 00:43:00,02 I was I'm always surprised at how much I use 450 00:43:00,03 --> 00:43:07,82 and the other thing is this is just a shout out to a podcast that I'm taking called containers it's an eight part 451 00:43:07,83 --> 00:43:10,96 series hosted by Alexis Madrigal who's an interesting. 452 00:43:12,01 --> 00:43:14,28 Editor for the fusion website 453 00:43:14,29 --> 00:43:20,35 and I get a few years later he uses the Oakland seaport to talk about like globalization and immigration and crime 454 00:43:20,36 --> 00:43:21,15 and lots of other stuff. 455 00:43:22,31 --> 00:43:25,77 And it's a cool model for telling a story like kind of picking a location 456 00:43:25,78 --> 00:43:29,29 and you into it kind of extrapolating the story outward from it. 457 00:43:30,31 --> 00:43:33,08 And others podcast called Crime town that's kind of the same thing. 458 00:43:34,61 --> 00:43:39,41 Now though and it's so good yet so good it's about Providence Rhode Island the sort of organized crime 459 00:43:39,45 --> 00:43:43,53 and corruption world it's a good leadership Hyde Park gets a likable year 460 00:43:43,73 --> 00:43:48,92 and then they're going to pick other cities suppose that was that's my understanding too yes like they're on route 461 00:43:49,28 --> 00:43:53,40 right now and then they will go to something else it's really great 462 00:43:53,41 --> 00:43:58,44 and you know like the wire right is another kind of thing where it's like picking a city like Baltimore 463 00:43:59,14 --> 00:44:02,39 and using that as. Anyway so that's some stuff I'm into. 464 00:44:04,23 --> 00:44:07,46 I did see this one movie that I quickly mention called How to Draw a bunny. 465 00:44:09,33 --> 00:44:12,42 It's called a Ray Johnson portrait it's been two thousand 466 00:44:12,43 --> 00:44:18,12 and two I don't know anything about Ray Johnson except for what I saw on this film it was just like in my Netflix queue 467 00:44:18,13 --> 00:44:24,54 and I decided to watch it on the plane the other day and he was like a New York kind of got art scene guy 468 00:44:24,55 --> 00:44:26,08 but what was really kind of interesting. 469 00:44:27,13 --> 00:44:31,78 Cool about him is he was this really wacky guy he made a lots of closure and stuff 470 00:44:31,79 --> 00:44:38,16 and he said a lot are through the mill which I really like. But I think the thing that's interesting is. 471 00:44:39,51 --> 00:44:46,13 He sort of lived this like deeply artistic life in a way that I think I myself. 472 00:44:47,54 --> 00:44:53,11 Sort of always fancied myself living like when I was younger in a way or something like 473 00:44:53,12 --> 00:44:58,75 when you sort of think of like who artist is or like a New York artist is there sort of personas or something 474 00:44:59,29 --> 00:45:01,01 and he was like really just truly that 475 00:45:01,15 --> 00:45:08,77 and I thought that was really cool that they sort of dig into who is this person really you know or whatever 476 00:45:08,78 --> 00:45:13,22 and he's just like very deeply engaged in the process of looking at pieces the world 477 00:45:13,23 --> 00:45:15,77 and kind of reassembling them through collage 478 00:45:16,10 --> 00:45:20,62 and sort of changing the way maybe we look at stuff especially like advertising 479 00:45:20,63 --> 00:45:26,24 or magazine ever Testament's something anyway his life is kind of inspiring but also tragic 480 00:45:26,50 --> 00:45:30,90 and the documentary is worth watching it's kind of low budget but but really great and it's on D.V.D. 481 00:45:30,91 --> 00:45:37,21 and Affleck's so it gets some stuff checked out so now I understand what you were looking for Link wise and so 482 00:45:37,22 --> 00:45:45,66 and so one thing I would recommend for those who haven't checked it out yet is express if you get it oh yeah yeah. 483 00:45:46,69 --> 00:45:53,02 Maybe ordered one thing yeah yeah it's pretty specific I mean so my understanding is that I. 484 00:45:54,17 --> 00:45:59,98 Was like the Amazon to Asia and then Allie expresses a this. 485 00:46:00,01 --> 00:46:04,99 If a concerted effort on the part of the company to reach out to the English speaking world. 486 00:46:06,32 --> 00:46:09,51 Then I wonder if even Amazon has an interest in the I don't know 487 00:46:09,82 --> 00:46:18,79 but the so it's a way for individuals to get in touch with the show engine market and all that so so one thing that 488 00:46:18,86 --> 00:46:23,28 and they will my projects because you know I mean I have a bunch of our Dimino sitting around L.E.D.S. 489 00:46:23,29 --> 00:46:27,94 and Whatnot but one thing I always find myself running out of is resistors. 490 00:46:29,32 --> 00:46:35,38 You know if you if you ever experience the pain I think Radio Shack just went bankrupt for the eightieth time today I 491 00:46:35,39 --> 00:46:39,47 know you're right but you know I remember for a while you could go in 492 00:46:39,48 --> 00:46:42,83 and say Can I take a look at the electronics cabinet 493 00:46:42,84 --> 00:46:45,75 and they'd let you into the back room because they never used it anymore. 494 00:46:47,23 --> 00:46:55,69 But then you would buy you know five resistors for five dollars or whatever so so I finally got an express 495 00:46:55,70 --> 00:47:03,26 and ordered a combo pack of common resistor values from like you know whatever it was sixteen ohms all the way up to 496 00:47:03,37 --> 00:47:04,39 ten megs or something. 497 00:47:06,56 --> 00:47:09,37 That was really cheap it took a long time to get here 498 00:47:09,75 --> 00:47:14,26 but now that I have them finally graded out it makes projects like this a lot more doable. 499 00:47:16,32 --> 00:47:22,68 And sort of conventionally trained he came in and decided that and I know sort of put stuff together. 500 00:47:23,99 --> 00:47:30,17 Having that around is you know I went for far too long ordering resistors 501 00:47:30,22 --> 00:47:36,11 and I'm project by project basis the other funny thing about him though is that when they showed up they were all blue. 502 00:47:37,86 --> 00:47:45,18 They didn't have any color coding. Unfortunately they got it sent to me. They got it seven C.M.E. 503 00:47:45,66 --> 00:47:49,20 Did write the values on the little paper strip that was holding maul together 504 00:47:49,21 --> 00:47:51,81 and these are through hole units yep yep 505 00:47:51,82 --> 00:47:56,64 but pretty funny that once they once they come detached from the through hole either you're. 506 00:47:57,72 --> 00:47:59,63 You know measuring every single one with the. 507 00:48:00,04 --> 00:48:05,14 Oh mate you're just tossing about wow yeah that's that's a classic Alex press thing 508 00:48:05,15 --> 00:48:09,30 but I mean Alex presses Yeah I've only I think maybe ordered like a weird cable 509 00:48:09,31 --> 00:48:14,81 or something on there you know even if you don't have anything to buy just searching for various things that Al 510 00:48:14,82 --> 00:48:17,50 expresses very energy like like human hair. 511 00:48:20,26 --> 00:48:22,78 Who doesn't need some human error I'm telling you 512 00:48:22,95 --> 00:48:29,04 and then they I think they have it all graded out by like the ethnicity of the person well you know like like probably 513 00:48:29,40 --> 00:48:31,31 you know fifty kilo bundles or so. 514 00:48:32,41 --> 00:48:43,09 Oh yeah yeah I think there's a temple in India on the mistaken where you shave your head as a way to you know cast. 515 00:48:45,15 --> 00:48:48,30 Self-regard away I'm not coming up the term correctly 516 00:48:48,31 --> 00:48:55,93 but then like the Temple makes money by selling you know metric tons of this luxurious in here something. 517 00:48:57,38 --> 00:48:59,95 Maybe the next project should be hair. 518 00:49:02,71 --> 00:49:07,52 Cool I have a few just sort of housekeeping items 519 00:49:07,53 --> 00:49:13,11 and sort of like we're new podcast so I wanted to talk a little bit just about some various things and then 520 00:49:13,48 --> 00:49:15,56 and then we'll get on to the next challenge. 521 00:49:16,67 --> 00:49:19,45 OK so it's just a couple paragraphs 522 00:49:19,49 --> 00:49:28,42 and oh by the way you can get all this stuff at opposable podcast dot com we could get opposable thumbs dot com because 523 00:49:28,47 --> 00:49:30,89 what domain names are in the world are left anymore. 524 00:49:32,18 --> 00:49:36,44 You know you can subscribe opposable thumbs with i Tunes or overcast 525 00:49:36,45 --> 00:49:40,54 or whatever your favorite product has to happen is we'll have all that stuff up. 526 00:49:42,16 --> 00:49:46,33 If you to search inside those applications for opposable thumbs we should come up and be close 527 00:49:46,93 --> 00:49:52,44 or you can just go to opposable podcast dot com and listen directly on the site it's on your web browser 528 00:49:52,45 --> 00:49:56,76 and like a separate tab while you're at your computer doing something else and you can check out your notes 529 00:49:56,77 --> 00:49:59,12 and transcripts and other past episodes there. 530 00:50:00,01 --> 00:50:06,11 Is where I tell you we have a patriotic like you and all the rest of your other creative weirdo friends 531 00:50:06,12 --> 00:50:14,00 and everybody else we have a patron page link on the website as well we would love for you to become a patron of the 532 00:50:14,01 --> 00:50:20,62 opposable thumbs podcast you can go to patron dot com slash opposable thumbs to sponsor us we have a few sponsorship 533 00:50:20,78 --> 00:50:25,64 tears there that you in do to check us out I think it's going to be three tiers 534 00:50:26,63 --> 00:50:29,90 and the tie is two year which is maybe ten bucks a month or something. 535 00:50:31,07 --> 00:50:34,92 We'll we will read your name aloud at the Pine cast thanking you for that. 536 00:50:36,10 --> 00:50:40,70 And so you could maybe use that to share something that you're doing with the world and we'll tell people about it. 537 00:50:41,86 --> 00:50:43,61 We have recurring web hosting fees 538 00:50:43,62 --> 00:50:52,44 and the biggest thing actually is transcription cost transcriptions are quite expensive to do sadly. But. I feel. 539 00:50:53,49 --> 00:51:00,17 Pretty passionate about doing transcriptions because a lot of people including myself don't hear so well 540 00:51:00,99 --> 00:51:06,37 and so we want to pose it you know sort of the Yeah I mean it's not I think Jen. 541 00:51:07,86 --> 00:51:13,36 You know it's like your partner when they ask you like why do you say what all the time like. 542 00:51:14,46 --> 00:51:15,54 You realize like oh 543 00:51:15,90 --> 00:51:21,88 and then like genetically I think you know I think I'm destined to be wearing at least one if not two hearing aids. 544 00:51:23,81 --> 00:51:29,36 But anyway I think posing a transcript you know so folks who are hard of hearing are deaf can enjoy a podcast 545 00:51:29,73 --> 00:51:34,26 and if you like read the podcast there you can instead of listening or scan the transcript which some people do 546 00:51:34,41 --> 00:51:37,11 or you could share the transcript with someone who you know would enjoy it 547 00:51:37,87 --> 00:51:45,23 but it does cost money for every single episode and it's it's not like five dollars it's like between thirty 548 00:51:45,24 --> 00:51:50,42 and seventy dollars so. It's a lot of money to do well. 549 00:51:51,45 --> 00:51:55,15 But we would like to be able to provide that if we if at all possible but that requires. 550 00:51:56,56 --> 00:51:58,39 Your Help With little bit of money to make that happen. 551 00:52:00,42 --> 00:52:02,53 We'll be using Amazon affiliate links 552 00:52:02,54 --> 00:52:06,93 and these are always a little bit weird on internet people always think like what are you doing just creating content 553 00:52:06,94 --> 00:52:12,30 so you can make money or something. We won't be doing that. 554 00:52:13,53 --> 00:52:15,93 Most people who run Amazon a footling speak very little 555 00:52:15,94 --> 00:52:21,68 but it is a kind of nice tip jar kind of thing right so if you see something that we link to like will link to these to 556 00:52:21,69 --> 00:52:22,50 well squeeze clips 557 00:52:22,51 --> 00:52:27,59 or whatever probably to the Amazon affiliate link you buy them through Amazon it doesn't cost you anything more. 558 00:52:28,61 --> 00:52:34,64 But it does kick a little bit of money back to us and then we can you know host site and Taylor 559 00:52:34,65 --> 00:52:40,91 and I can have a beer with your Amazon affiliate link money next time we see one another so if you'd like to support us 560 00:52:41,42 --> 00:52:45,71 check out some of the links of things that we love you can buy something over Amazon and helps out the podcast. 561 00:52:47,21 --> 00:52:54,69 We will not be getting rich off your affiliate links we promise no you know I also wonder have you ever seen then I 562 00:52:54,70 --> 00:53:01,40 think there's a You Tube series where there are these guys where people can send in any material 563 00:53:01,41 --> 00:53:02,71 and they will skate it 564 00:53:03,18 --> 00:53:10,78 and I think this would be if you're Yes Yes And so what it was like a like a plate glass skateboard Yes How do you 565 00:53:10,79 --> 00:53:12,89 build that we skate it isn't like that 566 00:53:13,22 --> 00:53:21,56 but the evidence Oh yeah it's so good so you I mean you have the original street cred skateboarding I was I had the 567 00:53:22,02 --> 00:53:24,99 lime green skateboard that was never use. 568 00:53:26,08 --> 00:53:28,01 But you actually did the things 569 00:53:28,02 --> 00:53:35,90 but anyway I would imagine that if people were interested in sending us materials like oh yeah interesting way to 570 00:53:35,91 --> 00:53:43,59 involve our audience so we'll have that formalizing totally Yeah that's a great idea yeah that sounds rad. 571 00:53:45,17 --> 00:53:50,09 So one quick note also because I live in the world of Internet nerds and more 572 00:53:50,10 --> 00:53:54,90 and more I think we're all becoming Internet nerds because everyone was wondering what the heck people are doing with 573 00:53:54,91 --> 00:53:59,98 our browsing data and stuff. So I just want to talk a little bit about tech platform. 574 00:54:00,19 --> 00:54:04,30 And tracking and stuff just so you know where we're coming from and everything's on the up 575 00:54:04,31 --> 00:54:08,79 and up we use the mighty Dan Benjamin's fireside. 576 00:54:09,80 --> 00:54:16,63 Podcasting platform to host our podcast a website we're going to use patron to accept our nations we use she mail Oh my 577 00:54:16,64 --> 00:54:19,32 cat just stepped on the air conditioner and turned it on once like. 578 00:54:20,45 --> 00:54:26,68 We go thanks Mike had his name pancakes if you hear me use the word pancake I'm talking about a cat I just had my baby 579 00:54:26,69 --> 00:54:30,98 monitor on I realized for this entire thing until like I said that's so. 580 00:54:32,98 --> 00:54:37,68 So yeah so speaking of speaking of technology platforms and tracking. 581 00:54:38,71 --> 00:54:43,47 To tailor stocks this own child with the baby monitor the actual actually made a risk. 582 00:54:44,72 --> 00:54:48,94 Enabled a baby monitor that with night vision more 583 00:54:48,95 --> 00:54:56,80 or less so that on your site it's super cool it's got lots of cool looks like I think I R L E D's maybe yeah yeah also 584 00:54:56,86 --> 00:55:02,28 I think purchased a really. Nice It's all coming full circle so we do have a G. 585 00:55:02,29 --> 00:55:03,35 Mail account for email 586 00:55:03,36 --> 00:55:09,49 and we're going to use Mail Chimp for our very brief newsletter you can sign up for our very brief an infrequent 587 00:55:09,50 --> 00:55:10,44 newsletter on the website. 588 00:55:12,03 --> 00:55:16,04 We do use Google Analytics on our site just to understand how many who are coming 589 00:55:16,05 --> 00:55:17,35 but we don't track you know that way 590 00:55:17,36 --> 00:55:22,49 and we don't plan on tracking you in any other way if you'd like to visit our site without being tracked by Google 591 00:55:22,50 --> 00:55:27,87 Analytics we recommend visiting the site using a private or Incognito browser window. 592 00:55:29,49 --> 00:55:35,35 One last thing before we dive into the next challenge is just quickly I want to talk about code of conduct code of 593 00:55:35,36 --> 00:55:41,00 conduct is a thing that a lot of people are thinking about more on Internet chat rooms. 594 00:55:42,57 --> 00:55:47,50 Or you know things like Reddit or whatever but also in conferences. 595 00:55:48,78 --> 00:55:55,34 So I just wanted to tell you where we're coming from our podcast is you know dedicated to providing a harassment free 596 00:55:55,35 --> 00:55:59,95 experience for everyone regardless of race gender age sexual orientation disability. 597 00:56:00,29 --> 00:56:03,37 Parents body size knowledge of subject matter that's a big one 598 00:56:03,82 --> 00:56:08,75 or religion we don't tolerate harassment any form our overall belief is that a mutual respect 599 00:56:08,76 --> 00:56:14,40 and voices from all walks of life must be heard to create a balance interesting and inspiring world we want. 600 00:56:15,51 --> 00:56:16,42 To hear from you 601 00:56:16,43 --> 00:56:22,30 and we want all of you to we want to see what inspiring awesome things you're up to we want to have conversations that 602 00:56:22,31 --> 00:56:26,63 all of you but at the same time like the Internet is a gross place for a lot of people 603 00:56:26,64 --> 00:56:33,20 and like it would be it's our responsibility really to try to make it fun for everyone regardless of who you are 604 00:56:33,57 --> 00:56:38,34 and we want to welcome you no matter what your background is and we want to actually support 605 00:56:38,92 --> 00:56:41,59 and inclusive environment we want you to be a part of it so that's. 606 00:56:43,04 --> 00:56:49,19 So so a real world example of this that I thought was interesting and also some of the. 607 00:56:50,90 --> 00:56:56,95 The problematic aspects about inclusively like trying to navigate how to do it without like. 608 00:56:58,08 --> 00:57:04,88 Sort of going full circle and preventing other kinds of engagement Yeah there is a friend of mine 609 00:57:04,89 --> 00:57:11,04 and Bess Williamson who works and disability design at the Art Institute of Chicago 610 00:57:11,57 --> 00:57:17,55 and she was posting about how so you know how everybody feels free to hate Comic Sans you know. 611 00:57:19,09 --> 00:57:27,85 Like there's so few things like like we can hate seasons so that's why it's OK to kill them horribly and in movies 612 00:57:27,86 --> 00:57:34,97 but cannot make saying that she was saying is actually apparently it's one of the few that's really useful for people 613 00:57:34,98 --> 00:57:41,11 with dyslexia and I think the reason for that is that there are so maybe there's one pair 614 00:57:41,12 --> 00:57:46,83 but there are so few letters that are just slipped you know almost every other file you have a lot of mirrored letters 615 00:57:46,84 --> 00:57:50,02 and that's what causes you know particular problems for the dyslexic 616 00:57:50,96 --> 00:57:59,66 and so so that's this interesting point where I'm still not entirely convinced that I can't hate Comic Sans like it 617 00:57:59,67 --> 00:57:59,98 or not. 618 00:58:00,91 --> 00:58:09,94 It grows my appreciation for the surprising benefits that something that you sort of associate with low culture. 619 00:58:11,02 --> 00:58:17,02 Well you know this because I think it's an accident right I don't think that comic sans was developed for that reason 620 00:58:17,03 --> 00:58:18,25 in mind right 621 00:58:18,26 --> 00:58:28,04 and so I think as we move forward I want to continue to wrestle with this where it's not excess ability at all costs. 622 00:58:29,49 --> 00:58:31,46 Like as long as that doesn't beat. 623 00:58:32,78 --> 00:58:38,28 My perspective on it is that it's not a non-critical thing to offer you know what I mean 624 00:58:38,55 --> 00:58:45,45 and that it needs to be returned to constantly in part because like you did a great job listing all of these areas that 625 00:58:45,46 --> 00:58:48,89 may not have been considered before such as body size Yeah 626 00:58:48,93 --> 00:58:56,77 but you know who's to know what the next area is so you keep that critical conversation going both to make sure it's 627 00:58:56,78 --> 00:59:03,63 inclusive and also to make sure it doesn't become kind of ossified and that's right this doesn't make sense yeah 628 00:59:03,64 --> 00:59:10,18 and that it's not really about I mean I try to think of it as it's like it's not a set of rules it's a set of questions 629 00:59:10,19 --> 00:59:16,58 right it's like you know you don't you know like say like we're not doing this for not doing this for not doing this 630 00:59:16,59 --> 00:59:20,60 it's like what are we what questions are we asking to sort of be like OK. 631 00:59:21,83 --> 00:59:27,27 How are we thinking about our world differently as we know more about it you know 632 00:59:27,37 --> 00:59:31,80 and it's like a it's also I think a dislike I feel like as I get older 633 00:59:31,81 --> 00:59:37,23 and older as an adult like kind of it's kind of the job of adults to. 634 00:59:38,32 --> 00:59:43,70 Push themselves outside of like what they know instead of just cut of finding what they know and to me like. 635 00:59:45,25 --> 00:59:51,02 Think like that common sense is a perfect example it's like now it's like oh it's kind of on me to be like oh I can't 636 00:59:51,03 --> 00:59:56,34 just be a jerk about Comic Sans because I doesn't like aspire to be the future of 637 00:59:56,39 --> 00:59:59,98 or whatever you know so yeah it's cool that you know I was on the. 638 01:00:00,01 --> 01:00:05,44 Train in Chicago this week and there was an ad for a free i think it was free S.T.D. 639 01:00:05,45 --> 01:00:11,08 Test or and it was graphic designs like pokémon 640 01:00:11,72 --> 01:00:18,03 and wow I've still never played pokémon I know enough about it to recognize the visual styling of the font 641 01:00:18,04 --> 01:00:23,16 and the little ball and so forth but I thought Dude if they're if they're marketing S.T.D. 642 01:00:23,17 --> 01:00:32,96 Tests to a generation younger than me. Yep. We crossed the threshold for sure. 643 01:00:35,03 --> 01:00:43,91 But based on the your whole thing about questions not statements you are truly an experience director Yes thank you 644 01:00:43,95 --> 01:00:52,32 thank you I will put that in my own self evaluation. I will credit you though also don't worry about it. 645 01:00:57,12 --> 01:01:03,26 The next challenge so are we are we announcing the challenge now do we do we have one. 646 01:01:04,55 --> 01:01:09,37 Do you I don't I don't have one I. Do. 647 01:01:10,87 --> 01:01:16,51 Wow So yeah this this is like the past this is the crux right here as John Hodgman might say like. 648 01:01:18,54 --> 01:01:24,18 Yeah so we have to develop a challenge for ourselves every two weeks what's interesting is we're going to. 649 01:01:25,21 --> 01:01:26,69 Incorporate cas. 650 01:01:28,24 --> 01:01:34,10 Do we do we tailor I know you're sort of working on maybe scoring I guess is that still a little bit loose right now 651 01:01:34,11 --> 01:01:42,77 or you know I reached out to a number of people the main was reaching out to hasn't gotten back to me so I'm assuming 652 01:01:42,78 --> 01:01:50,09 that I mean we can do this like the dog way and the like this warts 653 01:01:50,10 --> 01:01:57,74 and all you know lay claim to the next to figure it out here in front of the ears of our delightful audience 654 01:01:57,75 --> 01:02:07,21 or we can make a cut and come back. Actually what are you. Wow Oh let's see. 655 01:02:08,28 --> 01:02:12,43 I think one of the things that's interesting about a guest we were Taylor 656 01:02:12,44 --> 01:02:18,56 and I were thinking in an advance of all this like it would be fun to have the guests shape the challenge right because 657 01:02:18,57 --> 01:02:26,49 they will bring a sort of set of. Skills in thinking and creativity to that challenge in a way that Taylor and I won't. 658 01:02:29,30 --> 01:02:31,90 But at the same time like we have two weeks so it's like 659 01:02:31,91 --> 01:02:36,22 when things really go if it takes three days then that's it's going to take us three more days 660 01:02:36,23 --> 01:02:41,94 and it would be great of course to tell you dear listeners like what the challenge is that you can sort of know what's 661 01:02:41,95 --> 01:02:42,14 up. 662 01:02:44,93 --> 01:02:46,74 There that I'd like to do so yeah thing Dungeons 663 01:02:46,75 --> 01:02:54,91 and Dragons oriented Yes Yeah yeah well let's shoot let's just let's just let's just make up a challenge now 664 01:02:54,92 --> 01:03:00,47 and then we'll if we can find a guest that comes on board then great this is our first five cast will we're allowed to 665 01:03:00,48 --> 01:03:07,28 make mistakes so yeah let's do it so. Denton Dragon story and it seems totally great. 666 01:03:08,90 --> 01:03:10,67 Are you currently playing Dungeons 667 01:03:10,68 --> 01:03:19,05 and Dragons I am I'm doing something slightly more nerdy than it then playing Dungeons and Dragons 668 01:03:19,06 --> 01:03:23,52 and that is I am listening to a podcast Dungeons and Dragons. 669 01:03:25,85 --> 01:03:28,99 It's called Nerd poker it's a park as it ran I think for years 670 01:03:29,00 --> 01:03:31,94 or something there's about one hundred fifty some episodes 671 01:03:32,30 --> 01:03:39,84 and I will admit it I'm on about forty eight which means I listen to forty eight hours of other people playing Dungeons 672 01:03:39,85 --> 01:03:45,82 and Dragons but it's with Brian to saying who's a comedian and a bunch of other comedians 673 01:03:45,83 --> 01:03:52,59 and friends of theirs is yeah it was in the serious Overman show he was yeah yeah it's like I don't want to do a bit of 674 01:03:52,60 --> 01:03:59,28 that yeah it's super entertaining you can get to it used to be here Wolf dot com And now it's. 675 01:04:00,89 --> 01:04:08,65 I think it's on how if him which is a sort of podcast consortium I think it may cost five dollars a month now 676 01:04:08,66 --> 01:04:15,10 but I was I will admit that I was listening to them and squirreled them all away and fortunately I got lucky 677 01:04:15,11 --> 01:04:17,39 and that now is a while 678 01:04:17,40 --> 01:04:24,14 but it's five bucks so you know come on people people five dollars is not a lot for one hundred fifty hours of 679 01:04:24,26 --> 01:04:25,91 listening to people played Dungeons and Dragons. 680 01:04:27,05 --> 01:04:34,03 Well we're talking to Mr original B.D.'s over here are you are you doing penance for your I don't exist your media 681 01:04:34,04 --> 01:04:41,49 sourcing ways I think so I am still a system admin for the body hammer B.B.S. By the way the B.B.S. 682 01:04:41,50 --> 01:04:48,70 Has not been online for about twenty five years yet I mean what what years are we talking about there this is nineteen 683 01:04:49,58 --> 01:04:56,71 Keith Allison who is a great friend of mine and is an amazing Asian cinema writer. 684 01:04:57,99 --> 01:05:03,41 And a wacky person in general ran the body hammer B.B.S. In Florida and one nine hundred ninety. 685 01:05:04,58 --> 01:05:10,73 Who three or four three four five something like that it was originally the yodel and yeti. 686 01:05:11,84 --> 01:05:17,02 B.B.'s and then it became the the body hammer B.B.'s and it's only tell me you had a really great like. 687 01:05:19,37 --> 01:05:24,71 Sign on screen what were those even called like us us you know it yeah yeah right when you're V.T. 688 01:05:24,72 --> 01:05:28,91 One hundred turmoil whatever fills up with characters right with this yeah. 689 01:05:30,29 --> 01:05:32,43 I don't know what it was but it was cool you know 690 01:05:32,44 --> 01:05:38,53 and yet he was particularly cool because it was a Yeti with I think musical notes coming out of his bow 691 01:05:38,54 --> 01:05:44,02 and circle circled the lips. So were these Elvis like totally Christian. 692 01:05:45,37 --> 01:05:49,75 Whose Was this even before the M P three file for oh yeah yeah 693 01:05:49,79 --> 01:06:01,06 and Keith I mean to his credit he went like on a very very very limited college income he ate Ramen a lot in order to. 694 01:05:57,90 --> 01:06:01,06 afford another phone line just. Run the B.B.S. 695 01:06:02,51 --> 01:06:07,72 And that's yeah so it was and I think we had like maybe two lines so it was like only one 696 01:06:07,73 --> 01:06:10,91 or two people at a time could be online but it actually got quite a bit of traffic 697 01:06:10,92 --> 01:06:17,07 and the big thing about time was like really just even gifts like sixteen coming gifs of like Anna Mae 698 01:06:17,11 --> 01:06:22,03 and other stuff and like the enterprise cookbook and text files and like that 699 01:06:22,92 --> 01:06:33,54 but yeah I remember very finally some of the ASCII images that I gathered during that time I remember getting a twenty 700 01:06:33,55 --> 01:06:38,26 six hundred magazine and finding some phone number in there and I called 701 01:06:38,27 --> 01:06:46,49 and tried to log in as John Johnson with password John Johnson and in my mind I remember this actually working 702 01:06:47,18 --> 01:06:55,18 and then I got so freaked out I had the like pull the phone cord out of the wall moment and the less the first 703 01:06:55,19 --> 01:07:01,84 and last hacking. That's awesome counterreaction shot it's here that no one at the time. 704 01:07:04,14 --> 01:07:10,30 Do it well the maybe should reach at the Keith with or I'm feeling like something in the Dungeons 705 01:07:10,31 --> 01:07:18,22 and Dragons territory and because there's all this like you can get a roll twenty in that and all that 706 01:07:18,23 --> 01:07:23,96 and they do I'm in a campaign with all my high school buddies now that we're all like investment bankers 707 01:07:23,97 --> 01:07:33,42 and whatever and you know it's so we never really did the maps of the figurines it was all just you know talk and 708 01:07:33,91 --> 01:07:39,17 but now you can get on line and the character sheets there and then it automatically calculates 709 01:07:39,21 --> 01:07:45,04 and rolls dice for you which I don't know maybe that maybe that takes away from it a little bit so so I could. 710 01:07:47,06 --> 01:07:53,86 Maybe maybe some way of sort of bringing the physicality back to. Sort of virtual. 711 01:07:55,20 --> 01:07:59,83 Game I don't know man I don't know if we'll be able to come up with a second what do you think can you. 712 01:08:00,34 --> 01:08:01,28 He would make a heck 713 01:08:01,32 --> 01:08:06,86 and he does see well there's there's certain obvious physical objects attached to the Indy which might be like a 714 01:08:06,87 --> 01:08:11,31 character sheet and dice right. I've seen. 715 01:08:12,33 --> 01:08:17,75 Like a Maker Bot kind of folks make these like crazy dice rollers where it's like you put ice on the top 716 01:08:17,76 --> 01:08:24,13 and I think they somehow are yes a dice tower Yeah a friend of mine at work has one that he made on our Maker Bot at 717 01:08:24,14 --> 01:08:43,53 work. Who maybe. What if it was a physical manifestation of. A character. 718 01:08:45,06 --> 01:08:49,52 I'm just throwing that out there like like that could be in any form either character sheet 719 01:08:49,53 --> 01:08:53,16 or the physical character itself that might be complicated but could be cool. 720 01:08:54,32 --> 01:09:02,67 Well I think that so there is this issue of you know once you start getting older it's hard to put time 721 01:09:02,68 --> 01:09:05,59 and things like video games and engines and again 722 01:09:05,60 --> 01:09:12,81 and so forth yeah like you know with our campaign everyone's got a kid except for one guy 723 01:09:13,30 --> 01:09:18,69 and he's on the West Coast you know living in San Francisco and being paid in this but. 724 01:09:19,95 --> 01:09:25,51 You know who knows how long that'll last but we have to get together at this very specific hour 725 01:09:25,55 --> 01:09:31,64 and I think it's like the two hours that everyone can do but that only happens once a week. 726 01:09:32,99 --> 01:09:38,21 So you know it's Sunday night we get dudes on the East Coast and dude's on the West Coast 727 01:09:38,22 --> 01:09:43,09 and like all these you know people have to put their kids down a different time it's very complicated 728 01:09:43,83 --> 01:09:52,26 and so I feel like sort of adjusting for age in reality perhaps there would be some kind of thing 729 01:09:52,48 --> 01:09:59,41 and this doesn't have to be physical right I mean this could be a little you know piece of code we whip up or whatever. 730 01:10:00,08 --> 01:10:08,83 Perhaps something that I'd knowledge is how modern day India is played by old people with with things to do. X. 731 01:10:09,62 --> 01:10:14,26 Probably like speed playing the N.B.A. or Something yeah like a chess master Yeah. 732 01:10:16,07 --> 01:10:21,95 You know what I mean the only other thing that popped in my head was making something out of the shapes of D.N.D. 733 01:10:21,96 --> 01:10:23,91 Dice sure. 734 01:10:24,98 --> 01:10:30,93 Yeah well I mean it's different for first trial and he was very material oriented so yeah yeah 735 01:10:30,94 --> 01:10:38,22 and so if you're comfortable this could just be it could just be Dungeons and Dragons as the starting points 736 01:10:38,66 --> 01:10:44,28 or if you want to throw one more limiter on there yeah I mean it could just you know it could be like the mathematical 737 01:10:44,29 --> 01:10:46,47 shapes of the dice is the starting place 738 01:10:46,48 --> 01:10:55,83 or maybe we should just make dice we could make dice dude yeah I'd say let's let's address the rocks rolling the dice 739 01:10:55,84 --> 01:11:02,41 let's admit it is the best part of them's the Dragons and I write as true as I was a star you played Dungeons 740 01:11:02,42 --> 01:11:07,67 and Dragons. It's been a long time. 741 01:11:08,72 --> 01:11:18,36 I was I was probably in Boy Scouts I got to say I got into battle Tech which was this other game my friends were into 742 01:11:18,37 --> 01:11:22,52 and that sort of derailed the Dungeons and Dragons thing but I did have the clerics in through its peers 743 01:11:22,81 --> 01:11:26,09 but a lot of culture or yeah yeah. 744 01:11:28,19 --> 01:11:34,95 Yeah let's make dice Yeah whatever that means whatever that means yeah I really Yeah so this is great seaman we worked. 745 01:11:36,06 --> 01:11:43,87 With the public ear I'm so cicle by the fact that like as long as we can get one person to listen to this then. 746 01:11:45,06 --> 01:11:47,92 I feel like I'm having a relationship right you know 747 01:11:47,93 --> 01:11:53,79 and say yeah the serious power of the voice yeah yeah sorcery magical 748 01:11:54,18 --> 01:11:59,92 and also we got to come up with some intro music yeah I know it seems like. 749 01:12:00,01 --> 01:12:02,65 It's it's actually kind of nice intro music 750 01:12:02,93 --> 01:12:09,67 or like you know a brief musical interludes some sort Yeah it seems good is the work of eighty thousand 751 01:12:09,68 --> 01:12:17,39 and one song is that just is that opened open whatever they do we could just open all of our shows with all the free 752 01:12:17,40 --> 01:12:26,69 Grateful Dead of archive dead or. Maybe that could be a challenge for us to. Make the music. 753 01:12:27,94 --> 01:12:29,91 Will be at Episode one hundred fifty before you know. 754 01:12:33,90 --> 01:12:40,87 Well that's awesome Well thank you man I'm super psyched about doing this it's as an avid podcast listener I've been 755 01:12:41,11 --> 01:12:48,05 always wanting to figure out how to do something that people would think is cool when I think it's cool it. 756 01:12:50,27 --> 01:12:57,92 You have been a friend of mine for cheese like fifteen year morally years and so it's been it's super great to. 757 01:12:59,20 --> 01:13:02,89 Be going down this very weird road with you and. 758 01:13:04,51 --> 01:13:11,77 Yeah we're going to make some dice agreed and yeah it's modern friendships in the modern era. 759 01:13:13,19 --> 01:13:18,05 Are Hard work yeah they are and when everyone's living in different places so. 760 01:13:19,21 --> 01:13:23,34 And also I mean I think it's just going to be good for my mental health to have. 761 01:13:24,44 --> 01:13:31,24 Sort of an entirely new audience so for the first audiences you you know we want to impress one another with their 762 01:13:31,25 --> 01:13:39,10 weird solutions Yeah I really like that idea of growing a community where it's completely self selected So if this is 763 01:13:39,11 --> 01:13:44,67 something that interests you you participate and if you don't like it then you just don't care. 764 01:13:45,98 --> 01:13:51,95 And that's that's an exciting way to yeah it's energizing I'm already I'm already all. 765 01:13:53,91 --> 01:13:59,98 Strategizing my desk nice nice yeah loosely defined thing I'll do differ. 766 01:14:00,06 --> 01:14:04,61 Now than I did before it was I spent like four days trying to figure out what I was going to do 767 01:14:04,62 --> 01:14:09,96 and then that puts you like four days behind doing the actual thing like it's like just get in the shop 768 01:14:09,97 --> 01:14:16,93 and start cutting things I'm going to go yeah it's been really nice to work those muscles because it's not good at that 769 01:14:16,94 --> 01:14:22,91 so it's thank you man we'll be posting a new episode in two weeks and hopefully you will tune in 770 01:14:22,92 --> 01:14:30,80 and then by other folks to check us out we are the opposable thumbs podcast we are at opposable podcast dot com. 771 01:14:32,74 --> 01:14:37,25 Thank you for listening Erm take it easy you're the best. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:00,66 --> 00:00:17,23 Intro music goes here. Eventually. Maybe. In the future. If we have a future let's pretend we have a future. OK. 2 00:00:18,28 --> 00:00:24,47 Let's do this welcome to the opposable thumbs podcast opposable thumbs is a progress where Taylor myself 3 00:00:24,55 --> 00:00:29,31 and this episode's guest even tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks 4 00:00:29,32 --> 00:00:31,17 and talk about our accomplishments failures 5 00:00:31,18 --> 00:00:36,20 and lessons learned my name is Robert I run the exoskeleton arts based in Los Angeles 6 00:00:36,24 --> 00:00:40,82 and which poses hosts is very infrequent openings and events 7 00:00:40,96 --> 00:00:48,15 and also I run the exoskeletal newsletter which is a somewhat frequently sent email newsletter I also the C.E.O. 8 00:00:48,16 --> 00:00:55,87 and Spiritually the C.E.O. In spirit. I was just I was just a drop in some of Living Color references now and then. 9 00:00:57,49 --> 00:01:05,57 This there should really be a reunion of that. I'm Taylor I mean artist and engineer and D.I.Y. 10 00:01:05,58 --> 00:01:15,31 Enthusiasts good came of Angeles etc Working out of Chicago. And an academic as well I'm in Toronto. 11 00:01:16,92 --> 00:01:24,37 I'm the engineer I currently work for Seems energy. R. and D. Serials and here. 12 00:01:26,88 --> 00:01:32,02 This is my first attempt it's assisting some pot. Luck. 13 00:01:33,58 --> 00:01:38,60 Assisting that you're like that you're the main course Baby you're the talent here that's a. 14 00:01:40,16 --> 00:01:46,50 Serious thing to do you know. And you know like engineers like like you know hang out like. 15 00:01:47,63 --> 00:01:49,38 Like we're not good on stage. 16 00:01:51,86 --> 00:01:57,51 Well so you know when they say I should I should note I should note that we grew up together full disclosure. 17 00:01:58,66 --> 00:02:01,27 Yeah that's and that's going to come. Back to plating isn't it. 18 00:02:03,42 --> 00:02:12,60 So yeah basically I like my bio as I grew up in Shaker Heights Ohio with Taylor we went to the same high school. 19 00:02:13,96 --> 00:02:15,48 And after. 20 00:02:16,82 --> 00:02:23,57 Dropping out of school multiple times after high school I ended up moving out west to California where that's where I'm 21 00:02:23,78 --> 00:02:30,50 kind of got and making stuff that's where I learned how to do carpentry work 22 00:02:30,51 --> 00:02:35,22 or as a contractor for a while so I'm not very heady stuff 23 00:02:35,26 --> 00:02:39,79 but I got introduced to a lot of crap such as you know like welding. 24 00:02:41,10 --> 00:02:47,71 But working things like that at some point when I decided I was ready to go back to school. 25 00:02:49,01 --> 00:02:49,83 And went back to school 26 00:02:49,84 --> 00:02:59,05 and got a degree in engineering from Virginia Tech which is how I ended up where I am now which is kind of a roundabout 27 00:02:59,06 --> 00:03:09,39 way. Doing design engineering work for a large national German operation which is not as bad as. These. 28 00:03:11,18 --> 00:03:23,86 Materials engineer. So in my Yeah I might well in my current position that's kind of like a broad. Job title so. 29 00:03:24,89 --> 00:03:32,72 So we do like development work a lot of it is materials related my background is more of like a mechanical engineering. 30 00:03:33,91 --> 00:03:40,67 Although I guess I got a degree in biological systems engineering which is more like chemistry chemical engineering 31 00:03:41,31 --> 00:03:49,75 but so right now we do materials system development we've been like we do tooling development we do process 32 00:03:49,76 --> 00:03:58,84 developments it's all so I guess specifically like I work in a division that designs and builds gas turbans like. 33 00:03:59,87 --> 00:04:02,88 Powered. Generation so like you know. 34 00:04:04,00 --> 00:04:06,66 You guys are familiar with a gas term and it's kind of like a jet engine 35 00:04:06,67 --> 00:04:13,81 but the ones we build are like the size of a house can power like small city let me ask you a question about this 36 00:04:13,82 --> 00:04:22,25 you're working on this huge stuff and it seems to me that creativity definitely comes into it but at the same time. 37 00:04:24,43 --> 00:04:29,81 It's I don't know I feel like your creativity might be different than my creativity I think we've talked about this a 38 00:04:29,82 --> 00:04:30,14 little bit 39 00:04:30,15 --> 00:04:38,01 but I'd like to hear you expound upon that are you creative it work is engineering more about applying like to me 40 00:04:38,39 --> 00:04:39,59 when there are so many rules 41 00:04:39,60 --> 00:04:46,45 and things that have to work I kind of can imagine being creative in that scenario say how do you deal with that sure 42 00:04:46,49 --> 00:04:54,20 so. Like from what I do on a day to day basis especially like in more. Like R. and D. 43 00:04:54,21 --> 00:05:01,57 Room I would say it's super creative every day we're we're basically trying to solve problems that at least to our 44 00:05:01,58 --> 00:05:09,86 knowledge nobody has had to solve before otherwise the technology that we're developing probably would already exist so. 45 00:05:11,23 --> 00:05:16,09 Although it's maybe not creative thing what you consider a traditional. 46 00:05:17,96 --> 00:05:24,39 Standpoint from an engineering standpoint like the technical problems or trying to solve our novel 47 00:05:24,48 --> 00:05:28,70 and a lot of the farm comes out of coming up with creative solutions. 48 00:05:30,68 --> 00:05:36,31 If if we promise that every one of our listeners will sign an N.D.A. Can you can you give us a real world example. 49 00:05:39,65 --> 00:05:40,74 Yes sure so. 50 00:05:42,54 --> 00:05:51,38 So so basically like we like right now I'm working in the casting industry which is I know you're super familiar with 51 00:05:51,42 --> 00:05:56,97 right Taylor Well not the industry but like casting right so like last last lacks casting right 52 00:05:57,32 --> 00:06:00,14 and one of the challenges that we. 53 00:06:00,21 --> 00:06:10,19 Have constantly is like we're trying to manufacture parts with incredibly complex shapes they're made out of wax 54 00:06:10,23 --> 00:06:18,07 and then they have to go through all sorts of different she treat cycles like we're constantly working with like you 55 00:06:18,08 --> 00:06:19,65 know material properties of those 56 00:06:20,05 --> 00:06:25,03 and so you know we're looking at like this wax structure that has a very complex shape 57 00:06:25,04 --> 00:06:28,57 and trying to figure out what how do we prevent it from forming under these. 58 00:06:30,22 --> 00:06:37,07 Conditions and sometimes it requires a process change sometimes changed geometry 59 00:06:37,69 --> 00:06:45,76 but ultimately it's probably very similar to some of the challenges you would find by liking a studio if you're trying 60 00:06:45,77 --> 00:06:52,26 to create art or some other creative structure there just going to be inherent problems with the materials 61 00:06:52,27 --> 00:06:54,57 or with the process and you have to troubleshoot 62 00:06:54,58 --> 00:07:02,95 and you have to find a creative solution to those maybe it's not what you consider to be the artistic aspect of what 63 00:07:02,96 --> 00:07:08,05 you're doing but it's definitely a creative problem solving. Process. 64 00:07:12,47 --> 00:07:16,27 Is good answer is I feel like a I had expected you to. 65 00:07:17,91 --> 00:07:22,77 You know open that goal wide open but Rup I feel like we're just all in it together. 66 00:07:24,58 --> 00:07:31,00 It's interesting that the last two acts casting is. I mean I think you like in the you know. 67 00:07:32,18 --> 00:07:36,72 It's not something that I think people sort of think about anymore you know like three D. 68 00:07:36,73 --> 00:07:40,03 Printing and people sort of I think think that all that stuff has changed 69 00:07:40,04 --> 00:07:44,48 but it's been lost much of the passing I think of as a kind of almost like an ancient art or so that. 70 00:07:45,66 --> 00:07:52,12 Oh yeah I mean if I recall correctly the they're doing that stuff in China with river of a couple thousand years ago 71 00:07:52,60 --> 00:07:56,14 well yes it may be but was it last can't specifically 72 00:07:56,15 --> 00:08:00,94 but that they were definitely casting in the river that much I remember. You know the Internet. 73 00:08:01,99 --> 00:08:06,88 Yeah but the fundamental fundamentals haven't necessarily changed 74 00:08:06,89 --> 00:08:15,60 but the challenges are still still there it's like so just to like just of I guess put it in context like usually I 75 00:08:15,61 --> 00:08:15,83 think 76 00:08:15,84 --> 00:08:22,07 when you're casting something I don't know exactly what kind of stuff you would cast like for an artistic standpoint 77 00:08:22,08 --> 00:08:26,74 but you know say you sculpt something in wax and then. You know. 78 00:08:28,03 --> 00:08:32,58 I don't know if you like put it in sand or you cast some kind of plaster of Paris around it 79 00:08:32,62 --> 00:08:39,90 and then you melt out the wax so you can have metal into that right so what we focus on is like we want to have of 80 00:08:39,91 --> 00:08:45,41 course there's a shape to the exteriors I think task part in our case is like a turban blade 81 00:08:46,00 --> 00:08:51,27 but what's like critical to the success of the trim and weight is actually the internal. 82 00:08:52,40 --> 00:08:53,28 Passages right 83 00:08:54,03 --> 00:09:03,39 and so a lot of our technology is focused on how do you make the most complex internal parts to that cast component so 84 00:09:03,72 --> 00:09:09,49 you have to manufacture something that then you cast your wax around which is like the last black part of it 85 00:09:09,53 --> 00:09:13,71 and then you cast again around that so that you can pour metal into it. 86 00:09:15,43 --> 00:09:22,97 A complex tester as well as like a crazy three dimensional interior. So there's actually two different cores. 87 00:09:25,40 --> 00:09:32,63 So the way that we do it is we create a solid interior structure which we call a core 88 00:09:32,90 --> 00:09:37,88 and then you would inject wax around that which forms the shape of the blade 89 00:09:37,94 --> 00:09:43,65 and then you shell it which becomes the structure that you pour metal into 90 00:09:43,69 --> 00:09:52,27 and after you leeched out the interior of the blade then you end up with a solid blade with a you know a solid 91 00:09:52,28 --> 00:10:01,83 exteriors with a hollow core which creates all of the cooling passages. Dude dude. That's awesome Wow. 92 00:10:04,14 --> 00:10:07,39 Do you do you what do you do you you are. 93 00:10:09,36 --> 00:10:15,58 Creative to Taylor's point really I guess you are a creative person also outside of your work 94 00:10:15,59 --> 00:10:24,21 and I was just curious if you tell us a little bit about that. I would I would let things. I like so. 95 00:10:25,57 --> 00:10:31,15 I don't know maybe this challenge. There's not a creative person outside of work. 96 00:10:32,20 --> 00:10:37,72 But I do you know like I have a lot of interests like whether 97 00:10:37,73 --> 00:10:45,91 or not it's usually it's related to building stuff I guess. You know working on the car or building three D. 98 00:10:45,95 --> 00:10:50,81 or I have like a process three D. Printer that I've worked like whether or not it's. 99 00:10:52,21 --> 00:10:59,24 Household projects I don't know I don't I'm not sure if I was. Creative or just somebody who likes to make stuff like. 100 00:11:00,69 --> 00:11:03,24 Building Well could I jump in here real quick 101 00:11:03,76 --> 00:11:11,37 and so so just if I so I Or if I remember to being a youth along with you some examples of your creativity. 102 00:11:12,41 --> 00:11:19,91 One was you were doing a video editing project in one thousand nine hundred ninety six I believe you were literally 103 00:11:19,92 --> 00:11:22,21 editing on a dinosaur If I recall. 104 00:11:23,26 --> 00:11:25,04 And so it's kind of so you get right 105 00:11:25,18 --> 00:11:34,26 but so the project if I remember right it was a mockumentary about the nonexistent gang problem at our high school 106 00:11:34,74 --> 00:11:38,64 including special effects where people were getting shot with sprays of blood 107 00:11:38,65 --> 00:11:48,19 and things like that yes this was far enough back that I. I think I as a very nervous child managed to. 108 00:11:49,21 --> 00:11:53,10 Anxiety myself out of all participation even though you were kind enough to offer 109 00:11:53,66 --> 00:12:01,52 but then you also taught yourself how to blow. Fireball set of your mouth with. Selina recall if. 110 00:12:02,65 --> 00:12:06,20 You like whether or not it's created yet that's not great. 111 00:12:07,76 --> 00:12:12,10 But yes I think it's a creative solution and to know you know continuing to masquerade. 112 00:12:13,81 --> 00:12:23,94 Her example is probably like when you remember when we like. Figured out how to make. So gas yes and all over. 113 00:12:25,03 --> 00:12:26,83 Like through all over the driveway 114 00:12:26,84 --> 00:12:33,40 and lit it on fire which was very creative not with foresight realizing that it would leave a lasting mark on the 115 00:12:33,41 --> 00:12:35,87 driveway that my mother Bangles However when she got. 116 00:12:38,09 --> 00:12:46,06 But it but even more creative and I think that the creativity here mixes together with a complete lack of foresight. 117 00:12:47,49 --> 00:12:48,70 Partially what you're describing 118 00:12:48,71 --> 00:12:54,34 but so basically to make this substance it's so particles super saturated in gasoline right 119 00:12:54,80 --> 00:13:00,91 and so anyone in their right mind would be would buy powdered soap in order to accomplish this feat 120 00:13:01,13 --> 00:13:08,60 but we actually actually but bars of solid soap and then tried to cut them into a desk. With a pair of notes. 121 00:13:10,12 --> 00:13:18,73 And then And then beyond that do you recall the way that we assembled the double boiler for this project I believe it 122 00:13:18,74 --> 00:13:27,63 was a tuna can filled with gasoline floating free in rapidly boiling water on a gas stove which which is not the. 123 00:13:29,52 --> 00:13:30,68 That's the smartest move. 124 00:13:32,56 --> 00:13:34,22 Rob you want to talk about projects 125 00:13:34,23 --> 00:13:37,66 or do you have more questions before we get down to you know let's do it Challenge number two. 126 00:13:38,81 --> 00:13:46,41 Is numberless number two now is number two is D. and D. Dice and do you want to go first you can do so so. 127 00:13:47,62 --> 00:13:54,95 How this works for if you're tuning into this podcast for the first time is we will be posting images for one another 128 00:13:54,96 --> 00:14:00,18 to look at and then describing the projects so you can sort of understand how they are. 129 00:14:00,91 --> 00:14:06,41 How they exist in the world but then you can go through the episode online and look at pictures if you want 130 00:14:06,42 --> 00:14:12,64 but we try to really work to make sure that you can have a good image of of in your head through listening to it 131 00:14:12,65 --> 00:14:18,74 and that's something you know we're graphic sure that's right Dungeons and Dragons Dace were on my mind. 132 00:14:19,79 --> 00:14:25,57 Like everybody else I watched stranger things and then realized you know I remembered there was so much fun 133 00:14:25,58 --> 00:14:32,62 when I used to play with my buddies and so weirdly I feel like in effect a couple people for whom this is true 134 00:14:33,08 --> 00:14:34,12 but that Dungeons 135 00:14:34,13 --> 00:14:40,35 and Dragons is kind of a way to get back in touch with the friends of your youth that is you know since got busy having 136 00:14:40,36 --> 00:14:46,84 kids and going corporate corporate selling out and so forth so so even though I along with three other folks. 137 00:14:48,03 --> 00:14:49,36 You know kind of got back together 138 00:14:49,75 --> 00:14:55,87 and it was it was pretty amazing to see how we just fell back into that that groove you know so thinking about the days 139 00:14:55,88 --> 00:14:56,97 it wasn't just. 140 00:14:59,54 --> 00:15:04,42 Being ironic and you know thinking about this goofy thing from the eighty's but it was something that I was actively 141 00:15:04,43 --> 00:15:06,19 and am actively engaged in. 142 00:15:07,47 --> 00:15:14,09 So of course the first thing that you do you know the most iconic from Denson Dragons is the twenty sided 143 00:15:14,37 --> 00:15:15,10 and I believe it's 144 00:15:15,11 --> 00:15:22,21 and I'm sure you guys look this up to what is it I could I can say he drowned in my getting that right I believe that's 145 00:15:22,22 --> 00:15:23,86 the show in any case. 146 00:15:25,52 --> 00:15:32,01 I think so so so I was looking online and you know there are plenty of sites that have already covered this kind of. 147 00:15:34,08 --> 00:15:38,50 Retro looking thing like Adam fruits I think has a giant three D. 148 00:15:38,51 --> 00:15:44,32 Printed twenty sided that makes sounds and says you know like critical head adventurer and so forth 149 00:15:44,33 --> 00:15:49,66 and Instructables had molds on lines that you could make like twenty sided die a bat 150 00:15:50,59 --> 00:15:54,93 or something like that so so there's all this set for later the twenty said it so I looked and looked and 151 00:15:55,38 --> 00:15:57,99 and was thinking about I don't know whether I'd make a big one 152 00:15:58,00 --> 00:16:00,18 or make one that was electronically unable to do something but. 153 00:16:00,48 --> 00:16:06,24 I realized after a while that I didn't want to necessarily mine that area I want to make sure that we you know had some 154 00:16:06,25 --> 00:16:13,65 space between our projects so I started looking into really old school dice games and the origin of days games 155 00:16:14,09 --> 00:16:18,84 and this led me to hope so if you if you google knuckle bones 156 00:16:19,73 --> 00:16:25,83 and this is one thing I love about the Wiki Pedia the Google hole like it just like I got a tattoo 157 00:16:26,26 --> 00:16:31,26 when I was eighteen which Ian was there for a Benz that I did not know 158 00:16:31,30 --> 00:16:37,17 and they discovered the band because of the tattoo similarly googling knuckle bones you can see that there's a movie 159 00:16:37,48 --> 00:16:38,24 that came out in two thousand 160 00:16:38,25 --> 00:16:44,10 and sixteen a horror movie about a group of college students who were somehow killed by an evil pair of dice. 161 00:16:45,13 --> 00:16:49,57 So it's like those two let me just mark but if you go through there with a pedia page 162 00:16:50,33 --> 00:16:56,19 and it talks about how knuckle bones are sort of the origin of the dice game you're talking about literal nickel 163 00:16:57,18 --> 00:17:02,46 and I've read a couple different scientific terms where I think there is one starting with the P. 164 00:17:02,47 --> 00:17:09,10 But on the Wikipedia page they talk with the extra leg and since this or a struck a strike unless I guess maybe. 165 00:17:10,15 --> 00:17:15,24 Or this bone found in these different farm animals that's probably of no use for anything else 166 00:17:16,07 --> 00:17:23,69 but the cool thing about the bone they have on this page if you go about halfway down it's called the pastern. P.D.F. 167 00:17:24,01 --> 00:17:31,57 and They have this really distinct shape where you can tell there's at least four sides I think the other two are 168 00:17:31,58 --> 00:17:36,92 unlikely to be landed upon but they're the sort of two convex sides and two concave sides and so forth 169 00:17:37,25 --> 00:17:39,32 but I guess this is the origin of Jack's 170 00:17:40,12 --> 00:17:46,80 and so I like that idea that you know people you can just kind of imagine it's like you imagine how did people ever 171 00:17:46,81 --> 00:17:53,10 figure out that they could like kimchi or whatever like there's some dude like sitting around 172 00:17:53,11 --> 00:17:55,52 and says you know guys just hear me out 173 00:17:55,53 --> 00:18:00,18 but what if we throw a bunch of knuckle bones of the ground I bet money on it so. 174 00:18:01,26 --> 00:18:09,26 Just really like that idea of using animal parts for that anyway it's very metal so this got me in that. One. 175 00:18:10,36 --> 00:18:16,61 So this got me into the the pastor bones and then like with so many things you can just pop on the Thingiverse 176 00:18:16,91 --> 00:18:18,08 and download a. 177 00:18:19,48 --> 00:18:25,81 Pair of you know past your bones that have been scanned up so make sure to have the link in them to show notes so I 178 00:18:25,82 --> 00:18:32,75 printed these out at work at work at Columbia College we have a great resin printer so I printed out a bunch of these 179 00:18:32,76 --> 00:18:33,38 pastor bones 180 00:18:33,39 --> 00:18:41,07 and then the idea was how could I find a way to integrate this really old ancient version of the game with this updated 181 00:18:41,08 --> 00:18:46,55 version of the game so what I decided to do was make this little Arduino enabled. 182 00:18:48,32 --> 00:18:54,92 This little Arduino enabled set up so so you go to processing right sets that three I.D.E.A. That you can open up. 183 00:18:56,47 --> 00:19:01,92 It's a programming environment that's open source and that runs on the computer 184 00:19:02,33 --> 00:19:10,06 and I had this connected out to a sensor so for those that aren't familiar a piece of electronics deal with the 185 00:19:10,07 --> 00:19:17,16 properties of crystal that move in two directions so he has a sensors are what makes the beeping sound an old phones 186 00:19:17,17 --> 00:19:24,06 or smoke alarms things like that and if you electrify this then layer of crystal sensor will make a buzz 187 00:19:24,71 --> 00:19:26,55 but that also if you flex the P.S.O. 188 00:19:26,56 --> 00:19:32,80 Sensor it produces voltage so it works in both directions so the idea is I made this a little wooden box 189 00:19:32,84 --> 00:19:36,35 and we throw the pastern bones into it it creates vibrations 190 00:19:36,73 --> 00:19:42,47 and you can teach an Arduino to interpret those vibrations as numbers and send those back to processing over a U.S.B. 191 00:19:42,48 --> 00:19:51,57 Cable once it hits the processing application you can pick which you want to be rolling so you can take your pastern 192 00:19:51,58 --> 00:19:57,78 bones and have them count as a coin flip or count as a ten sided die or a twenty or one hundred or whatever 193 00:19:58,28 --> 00:19:59,91 and I just got a little basic. 194 00:20:00,42 --> 00:20:01,70 The application going 195 00:20:02,33 --> 00:20:09,36 but some extensibility I'm really excited about are a you could have this thing mapped critical hits for example so if 196 00:20:09,37 --> 00:20:13,22 you're rolling a twenty sided die and you're doing slashing damage 197 00:20:13,23 --> 00:20:17,58 and you can have the program automatically decide you cut off every one of somebodies fingers 198 00:20:17,59 --> 00:20:19,29 or you stick it right in the eye or whatever. 199 00:20:20,76 --> 00:20:23,91 As a this thing could be you know sort of expanded out that way 200 00:20:23,95 --> 00:20:29,42 or essentially you could plug it into a role twenty which is the online system that my buddies 201 00:20:29,43 --> 00:20:35,95 and I are using to play Dungeons and Dragons So if you hooked into the three Java Script with a real twenty A.P.I. 202 00:20:36,33 --> 00:20:43,89 You could actually use this physical rolling device to interface with the virtual sort of videogame overlay on top of 203 00:20:43,90 --> 00:20:44,86 Dungeons and Dragons. 204 00:20:47,51 --> 00:20:51,29 And that's what tell you posted a video should Ian and I look at it 205 00:20:51,37 --> 00:20:55,17 and then talk about you know you know watch what you guys watch the video 206 00:20:55,18 --> 00:20:59,19 and there's a I guess there's kind of some sound you can decide if you want a role that's. 207 00:21:00,66 --> 00:21:09,29 Pretty crazy so you're like rolling. Three D. Printed knuckles and then. Your face it pops up a number. 208 00:21:12,27 --> 00:21:16,90 That's written and then the user can select what they're really branches. 209 00:21:24,54 --> 00:21:28,13 Like so you're rolling it into like a wood frame. 210 00:21:33,95 --> 00:21:40,89 So how and so how is it doing the process and then relationship between the three D. Printed knuckles and. 211 00:21:42,12 --> 00:21:47,72 Or do we know for sure so there is some I have this megabucks of. 212 00:21:48,73 --> 00:21:52,86 Sensors I got when I was building up a sledgehammer operated keyboard 213 00:21:53,78 --> 00:22:00,18 and I was interested in trying to make the key is on the keyboard sensitive to force so that the harder you hit a key. 214 00:22:00,25 --> 00:22:01,77 The bigger the font size would be 215 00:22:02,78 --> 00:22:10,12 and so I went up by you know just a metric shit some of these things that have been laying around so it's pretty simple 216 00:22:10,13 --> 00:22:15,68 I just took one and taped it to the back of this piece of wood and then when you roll the pastern bones 217 00:22:15,69 --> 00:22:21,26 and honestly you can roll anything that's is of a significant mass red so I could roll a bunch of like Loose Change 218 00:22:21,27 --> 00:22:22,62 your rocks or whatever in there 219 00:22:23,26 --> 00:22:31,45 but rolling them in there produces an analog voltage which goes to the OR do we know so that gets interpreted from 220 00:22:32,06 --> 00:22:35,12 between zero and five volts into. 221 00:22:36,46 --> 00:22:38,11 Some kind of numerical range 222 00:22:38,53 --> 00:22:44,55 and so I think if I'm not mistaken the are do we know will grab a number that's like between zero and five thousand 223 00:22:44,63 --> 00:22:48,68 or something like that so it takes that number and it shoots it to processing 224 00:22:49,35 --> 00:22:56,48 and then the user plugs in what the DI is that they're working with so if you select the D twenty then you can you know 225 00:22:56,49 --> 00:22:59,10 you'll get a roll ranges between one and twenty. 226 00:23:00,14 --> 00:23:06,02 And then the number that's coming from the analog sensor is used as the random seed so that's the one that ensures that 227 00:23:06,03 --> 00:23:11,50 you get fresh numbers instead of getting the same roles over and over again. Awesome. 228 00:23:12,63 --> 00:23:23,03 Already and is next Thank you think I'm going to give it a shot All right so. And. P.D.F. Your way. 229 00:23:24,37 --> 00:23:32,12 But so basically like what my my project Yorks considerably from the beginning to. 230 00:23:33,68 --> 00:23:40,96 The end of this project originally it was based off of Taylor and I and had a conversation with a month 231 00:23:40,97 --> 00:23:48,60 or so back about like like just what kind of crazy ideas can we do this with deicing one of the things that I had 232 00:23:48,96 --> 00:23:57,74 always like dreamed of doing was creating like an electronic set of dice of us essentially like maybe more like six 233 00:23:57,75 --> 00:24:00,18 sided dice and you could roll along and. 234 00:24:00,21 --> 00:24:05,33 It didn't matter what face it landed on like that all the faces were identical 235 00:24:05,60 --> 00:24:10,31 but essentially like it would have electronics inside of it that would. 236 00:24:12,03 --> 00:24:18,86 It would display a number that was you know randomly generated by the electronics so it's kind of like independent of 237 00:24:18,87 --> 00:24:20,88 how the actual physical device landed. 238 00:24:23,19 --> 00:24:32,61 And so anyway so I was like oh man I want to do something like see if I can make entice the backlit. 239 00:24:33,86 --> 00:24:36,68 And there was some kind of randomness to how they were. 240 00:24:39,00 --> 00:24:42,52 Like how you would roll them and what the results would be 241 00:24:43,01 --> 00:24:50,09 and very very quickly I realized that miniaturization of electronics 242 00:24:50,13 --> 00:25:00,27 and manufacturing incredibly small things that plastic or metal was a little bit beyond the scope of like a one 243 00:25:00,28 --> 00:25:04,94 and a half long project. And so. 244 00:25:06,48 --> 00:25:11,82 I decided the first thing I decided it was well I can't do something like super small so I'm going to do something like 245 00:25:11,83 --> 00:25:12,54 super big. 246 00:25:13,99 --> 00:25:20,11 So going going back to like the twenty sided die which is essentially like always 247 00:25:20,12 --> 00:25:27,10 or go to die for any kind of dragons I decided I would try to make a monstrous like. 248 00:25:28,42 --> 00:25:35,22 Twenty sided die that you could roll and. And maybe depending on the. 249 00:25:37,56 --> 00:25:46,16 Like whatever face it ends up like maybe the colors just change so the numbers are actually built into the. Color. 250 00:25:47,76 --> 00:25:54,74 And so so the original idea was I was going to get like an art we know it was going to make it was going to be backlit 251 00:25:55,08 --> 00:26:00,18 and all of the lights for each numbers were going to be like individually addressable so. 252 00:26:00,25 --> 00:26:03,43 Well I could like each number would have a different color 253 00:26:03,68 --> 00:26:09,84 and as you rolled it he would have like a little accelerometer that was you know kind of randomly at like how it 254 00:26:09,85 --> 00:26:18,59 generates the different colors anyway that also so once I actually got into building a twenty sided die 255 00:26:18,89 --> 00:26:27,29 and realizing how complex that process is like all the electronics just kind of went to crap. And. 256 00:26:28,77 --> 00:26:32,74 Spent and spent the past week and I have my doing nothing 257 00:26:32,75 --> 00:26:39,18 but just trying to figure out how in God's name do you make a twenty sided polygon like out of some kind of physical 258 00:26:39,19 --> 00:26:40,79 material and end up with something that. 259 00:26:41,97 --> 00:26:51,99 Resembles like that geometry so can you see any of the stuff that I sent over now yeah that's that's where I was 260 00:26:52,00 --> 00:26:56,17 getting so excited you have the P.D.F. Pulled it and I'm very excited. 261 00:26:57,20 --> 00:27:02,92 That I'm so excited so you know so so the first the first image I'm seeing is 262 00:27:03,79 --> 00:27:07,87 and then what do we call this an i cuss so he drove the set the way to say and. 263 00:27:09,26 --> 00:27:11,68 You're going to like that but it's a mess on like that. 264 00:27:12,76 --> 00:27:16,72 You know it's a twenty seven shape and it read what do you think is a thing like eighteen inches 265 00:27:16,73 --> 00:27:20,29 or two feet across it looks really pretty big yes. 266 00:27:24,40 --> 00:27:32,95 Yes So it's a it's a twenty seven it's black in color the finished object it has these red glowing numbers on every 267 00:27:32,96 --> 00:27:34,14 single face. 268 00:27:35,67 --> 00:27:37,32 Yet Yes it was tell a story 269 00:27:37,33 --> 00:27:44,58 and I mean that last bit alias to meet was it was a little complicated I have like So in true engineering fashion I 270 00:27:44,59 --> 00:27:53,44 created a powerpoint presentation that has all the different steps of manufacturing with photo documentation. So. 271 00:27:54,60 --> 00:28:00,07 That basically the one thing that really I guess kind of saved my ass which is really just. 272 00:28:00,60 --> 00:28:08,63 Function of geometry is that twenty sided die are just made of equal lateral triangles so all I had to do. 273 00:28:11,06 --> 00:28:16,70 You know figure out a size for the triangle and then the the complexity was really more like. 274 00:28:18,00 --> 00:28:22,36 Like the angles between them right. And. 275 00:28:23,70 --> 00:28:33,73 So I made them each one foot long twelve inches on each side so I think the max dimension across is somewhere around 276 00:28:34,66 --> 00:28:43,99 they were Templin three nine inches tall so that would give you like about twenty. Five things. 277 00:28:45,07 --> 00:28:48,71 In terms of with so it's a little over twenty inches wide. 278 00:28:49,74 --> 00:28:52,97 And then it took a lot of it took a lot of trial 279 00:28:52,98 --> 00:29:00,51 and error to try to I created some like fixtures to try to like all the different triangles angles right. 280 00:29:01,79 --> 00:29:08,44 And then in the end if you look at Lakes I'm going to the other thing I meant to mention I didn't mention this earlier 281 00:29:08,48 --> 00:29:14,89 it's like a lot of the projects that I try to do like making just out of trash especially trash that I find at work 282 00:29:15,16 --> 00:29:20,74 and luckily like working in heavy industry like you find all sorts of really cool stuff. 283 00:29:23,61 --> 00:29:27,85 And yeah in this case it was really just like we bought so recently we bought a new X. 284 00:29:27,86 --> 00:29:33,33 Ray machine and as you do monstrous Yeah I know you know. 285 00:29:34,50 --> 00:29:44,04 You never really it's like to be a stick to be interesting stuff. And so like the X. Ray machine like the X. 286 00:29:44,05 --> 00:29:45,79 Ray machine is cool in and of itself 287 00:29:45,86 --> 00:29:50,85 but it seems it is really awesome to Locke's to like so they shipped of some Europe. 288 00:29:52,12 --> 00:29:59,98 And they built a box that I could have like if I had given this box to my children. Or they could have played in. 289 00:30:00,30 --> 00:30:01,75 But it would just like tear it apart 290 00:30:01,76 --> 00:30:09,29 and throw it out so I took I have some pictures of like pallets that I took the pallets which had very nice with them 291 00:30:09,38 --> 00:30:17,07 and. Chopped pallets up and used all of that as like for the faces for the internal structure. 292 00:30:18,65 --> 00:30:27,08 And I cut them I actually had to cut so I ripped the ten point three nine inch wide strips out of the plywood 293 00:30:27,46 --> 00:30:39,33 and then actually three handed all of the triangles with the chicks. And the. Set and then to do the Pavel's I set. 294 00:30:41,05 --> 00:30:48,99 The table saw like a twenty degree angle which. Worked out like oh almost perfectly. And then. 295 00:30:50,15 --> 00:30:55,31 And then also made these blocks which if you go down to lace line seven. 296 00:30:56,91 --> 00:31:04,39 I put blocks with the same angle into them and then just like a brad nailer to nail the triangles of these blocks 297 00:31:04,67 --> 00:31:14,58 and kind of built out of structure a self. Dude. And so so the L.E.D.S. 298 00:31:14,92 --> 00:31:20,50 Are they still address book only these are just not currently addressing them at the moment I know so at this point 299 00:31:20,51 --> 00:31:27,12 like so what I did is a kind of. Short cut and that I have a large just R.G.B. 300 00:31:27,92 --> 00:31:37,65 Flexible alley district and actually if you. Can see that I had fourteen so I basically like made this rat's nest. 301 00:31:39,86 --> 00:31:40,84 Within the. 302 00:31:41,91 --> 00:31:48,30 Interior structure and so everything is kind of backlit because it turns out like if you want to light each. 303 00:31:49,87 --> 00:32:00,18 Number independently you have to create some kind of a light structure behind the number. And you know. 304 00:32:00,24 --> 00:32:05,62 So anyway it all became you know my original plans were quite grand 305 00:32:05,75 --> 00:32:13,11 but this is actually you know have been you'd also have like twenty different colors you'd have to come up with yeah 306 00:32:13,93 --> 00:32:18,66 yeah. I'm sure you know but yeah yeah. 307 00:32:20,35 --> 00:32:24,90 Maybe you could do like seeing color on each posing he's totally 308 00:32:24,94 --> 00:32:32,50 and I thought I thought so far I thought it turned out pretty well I can't roll the damn thing I don't think very well 309 00:32:32,51 --> 00:32:35,44 that it did this if you would like to the wealth. 310 00:32:36,82 --> 00:32:45,31 So right now it does but so it's just like it'll take five to twenty four volts my life a long term plan 311 00:32:45,41 --> 00:32:53,69 or you know if I had like another day probably would have just done a bunch of cell batteries you know created a pact 312 00:32:53,70 --> 00:32:57,25 that would be enough because it does with that many L.E.D.S. I don't know how many it's probably. 313 00:32:58,71 --> 00:33:04,82 Thirty thirty or forty ladies in there so have a pretty decent current draw. 314 00:33:06,15 --> 00:33:12,33 Excellent well done do that's a great project yes for the great it's I will admit in my head I was like how many 315 00:33:12,34 --> 00:33:19,67 triangles did he have to cut out and say oh yeah twenty to twenty. So that's what he's the engineer but yeah. 316 00:33:21,13 --> 00:33:29,74 Just so you know each so just maybe a little bit of a picture it's a twenty sided die so there's twenty triangles that 317 00:33:29,75 --> 00:33:31,68 are roughly eleven inches. 318 00:33:33,21 --> 00:33:36,20 On each side right so it's like eleven inch triangle 319 00:33:36,24 --> 00:33:43,22 and then so in I wanted to just double check this you use a roughly like a twenty degree angle on each side of the 320 00:33:43,23 --> 00:33:47,77 triangles on the plywood to sort of make sure that they all kind of press fit together is that right. 321 00:33:48,82 --> 00:33:53,11 Yeah they're apples like it's like a twenty degree level. 322 00:33:54,34 --> 00:34:00,09 Which is what kind of allows them and so once you know that each each side of the triangle actually. 323 00:34:00,28 --> 00:34:06,67 It's properly instead of being spaced out. Interference. Yeah. 324 00:34:07,69 --> 00:34:12,77 Totally yeah that was the thing that I had a fantasy myself about been like maybe I could make its way and it dies 325 00:34:13,09 --> 00:34:18,90 and I got so freaked out by the bevel I was like oh I don't I'm not going to do it pretty much did that. 326 00:34:20,98 --> 00:34:21,13 Well 327 00:34:21,14 --> 00:34:28,09 but we should also note that I think it's so funny that you know I know you get access to some really advanced tooling 328 00:34:28,10 --> 00:34:34,08 it work but you took the opportunity here I mean the fact that you freehand of those triangles and if I until Arius 329 00:34:34,09 --> 00:34:42,76 and terrifying and say yeah. Yeah out the the lettering for each number to write. Yeah I actually have. 330 00:34:44,23 --> 00:34:52,37 That there's a scroll you see so you get in there not I got the scroll saw which is ironically that was a gift to me 331 00:34:52,38 --> 00:34:56,86 from my uncle when I was like fourteen years old this was. 332 00:34:58,40 --> 00:35:05,94 A student and I swear to God like I have like I finally got it back from my mother like just a couple years ago 333 00:35:05,98 --> 00:35:15,31 and now all of a sudden it's like oh my god. Things with the school like it's not like your go to. School. 334 00:35:17,18 --> 00:35:25,32 Man if you want to cut corners out of a twenty sided die. That's the tool Yeah it looks beautiful Yeah looks great. 335 00:35:26,65 --> 00:35:30,22 Well plus with the scroll so one thing that I always love about it is 336 00:35:30,90 --> 00:35:35,27 when you set up the blade tension it's not so much that you're doing it with a torque wrench 337 00:35:35,28 --> 00:35:37,92 but you pluck it like a like a harp string 338 00:35:37,93 --> 00:35:44,11 and you're listening for a certain note you know so I'm just I'm loving that everything that he did was with these 339 00:35:44,12 --> 00:35:51,26 really sort of foot sea goofy to instead of you know like him sitting down at the seaman's mega brain 340 00:35:51,27 --> 00:35:59,12 and having it just crap out the project you know so. I did think we have like a five axis. 341 00:36:00,24 --> 00:36:07,08 Knowing machine network you know like we're doing like all these crazy complex tools that we manufacture you know now 342 00:36:07,09 --> 00:36:19,01 it's like. That creates. Something much. Worse the story in that I know it really. 343 00:36:20,13 --> 00:36:26,99 Is true I was curious about the materials that you there's a material that you put behind each number as a sort of 344 00:36:27,00 --> 00:36:31,86 light diffuser Yeah and it's also from the trash. 345 00:36:32,89 --> 00:36:41,64 Was somebody bought I think it's just like this like translucent polycarbonate class take that we like actually what we 346 00:36:41,65 --> 00:36:46,75 use it for this will take it will cut out like a big sheet like a two by three sheet of it 347 00:36:46,80 --> 00:36:52,65 and bolt it to the top of our metal work table so that like you don't scratch stuff. 348 00:36:54,23 --> 00:36:59,02 And so I just yeah but it works great for fusing like. 349 00:37:00,03 --> 00:37:06,66 You know light like you could make a light as a threat or something like that so yeah yeah. 350 00:37:07,84 --> 00:37:12,60 That's awesome wow this is so great thank you so much. 351 00:37:14,39 --> 00:37:20,94 For sure do that's an amazing present gives if it's amazing Yes Yes I'm I'm excited just to I'm excited to sit down to 352 00:37:20,95 --> 00:37:27,06 do it I get to post these photos to the Internet. Yeah that's awesome. 353 00:37:29,00 --> 00:37:32,86 Rob what do you have in store OK so I'm going to post. 354 00:37:35,16 --> 00:37:42,53 Five images there numbered one through five and if you want just kind of flip through me and look at them 355 00:37:42,70 --> 00:37:47,93 and to free to maybe just describe what you see yes for sure 356 00:37:47,94 --> 00:38:00,18 and then I'll just chime in as you go through your description here thank you. I'm. Well. 357 00:38:04,73 --> 00:38:13,11 So I'm seeing a picture looking more serious than I've ever seen him with what appears I believe this is a day 358 00:38:13,12 --> 00:38:19,38 strolling tower and also and it looks like he has some kind of leaped up integration too 359 00:38:20,38 --> 00:38:27,30 and even what do you make of the mind flick there yeah I was going to say it looks like his mind is like some melted 360 00:38:27,83 --> 00:38:39,56 melded with the. Indeed. That's I'm guessing that's what we're going to hear a bit. OK it looks like. 361 00:38:40,98 --> 00:38:43,51 We've got our do we know we have some kind of. 362 00:38:45,32 --> 00:38:53,03 Relay board and Blank Well one there Fred and I had a very parallel idea of some kind. 363 00:38:55,66 --> 00:39:01,75 I'm seeing it so little oil maybe in the that lets the dice into the top of the rolling tower. 364 00:39:03,95 --> 00:39:13,95 And I'm definitely seeing some trash play which unleavened a lot of that. Super glue or rather than testing. 365 00:39:16,81 --> 00:39:22,88 Yes I see I definitely see a bunch of like standard like Dungeons and Dragons dice However. 366 00:39:24,08 --> 00:39:27,47 No numbers appear to be in on them they're just like running like. 367 00:39:29,51 --> 00:39:36,46 Well so maybe maybe Rob has to send certain brain signals in order for the days to be released to roll is that 368 00:39:36,47 --> 00:39:41,59 when I'm understanding and seeing right there history would you like to know. 369 00:39:43,79 --> 00:39:51,24 Spill the beans or do you want to stick it now yeah yeah I'll go for it so it is a a mind controlled dice ruler. 370 00:39:55,22 --> 00:40:01,76 It is uses there is the game that was created by Mattel called the mind for. X. You know. 371 00:40:04,55 --> 00:40:12,61 That there are many Instructables styled. Kind of repurposed seeing. 372 00:40:14,29 --> 00:40:22,67 Instructables for for this mind flexi you can simply take the serial feed out of what is essentially like an E.G. 373 00:40:22,68 --> 00:40:31,12 Right like your detecting your. Changes and sume voltage but I should look into that. 374 00:40:32,25 --> 00:40:38,56 From your from your brain it's of the mind Flex has like a little small metal sensor that rests on your forehead 375 00:40:39,09 --> 00:40:41,69 and then you have two clips that clipped your ears. 376 00:40:43,77 --> 00:40:52,92 And then mine flex will send a serial signal to this sort of game this kind of plastic game console that will do things 377 00:40:52,93 --> 00:40:57,37 like rotate cubes or. Or whatnot. 378 00:40:58,50 --> 00:41:04,53 The game didn't do particularly well even though people liked it because the interface was super cool 379 00:41:04,54 --> 00:41:11,09 but the gaming itself was a little bit lackluster I think so Mattel canceled it. So I I. 380 00:41:13,31 --> 00:41:16,20 Initially was like oh I want to do something with dice and. 381 00:41:17,92 --> 00:41:24,53 I didn't because the twenty sided die is like the casting dice freaked me out. Also because. 382 00:41:26,49 --> 00:41:29,15 Todd Bailey who's who's a friend of ours. 383 00:41:30,77 --> 00:41:31,92 In I think two thousand 384 00:41:31,93 --> 00:41:38,49 and eight did a great Chicago presentation on making twenty sided dice using a mold in a pressure chamber 385 00:41:38,60 --> 00:41:39,95 and those are on You Tube and. 386 00:41:41,15 --> 00:41:45,32 I'll post his presentations there I will admit it meant that that was back in two thousand and six 387 00:41:45,33 --> 00:41:50,73 when You Tube would capture a video link that ten minutes so there's like twenty videos in order to do the whole thing 388 00:41:51,06 --> 00:41:56,57 which is what we are that you could be a city that kind of funny that it was only what like eleven years ago but. 389 00:41:58,45 --> 00:42:00,18 But if you know if you never thought. 390 00:42:00,30 --> 00:42:04,33 I need a large pressure chamber in my life if you watch these videos you know you'll immediately go 391 00:42:04,34 --> 00:42:07,50 and try to find one because you want to then pressure chamber everything. 392 00:42:08,91 --> 00:42:13,76 Anyway so I I got just blank dice because I wanted to I haven't I haven't done this 393 00:42:13,77 --> 00:42:18,28 but I would like to sort of create my own system that I could engraved on the dice 394 00:42:19,09 --> 00:42:23,14 and then I found out there's like a kind of communities of people who make their own games 395 00:42:23,15 --> 00:42:28,43 and so people make blank dice so you could put decals on the dice or whatever 396 00:42:28,44 --> 00:42:34,35 and so I thought for my own purposes it would be fun to. I recently took. 397 00:42:35,39 --> 00:42:40,19 Like a short Symon are on mindfulness and it was pretty interesting really 398 00:42:40,20 --> 00:42:47,86 and I was in an overlap with me working on this project about sort of using the mind to created a dice rolling tower. 399 00:42:49,00 --> 00:42:53,23 And so I thought like oh maybe I could sort of make these dice that are sort of more like. 400 00:42:55,87 --> 00:42:56,65 I don't know if you know like a. 401 00:42:59,22 --> 00:43:06,12 Bleak strategies which is this card deck that Brian you know created that sort of a lot in Peter Schmidt I think Peter 402 00:43:06,13 --> 00:43:11,69 Schmidt who they created this card deck that sort of is meant to get you sort of creatively stimulated 403 00:43:11,70 --> 00:43:19,91 or out of a creative trap that you're in so anyway so the mind flex is just a serial It sends a serial signal to an 404 00:43:19,92 --> 00:43:25,20 Arduino the Arduino I'll post the code but there are three No just looks for the serial signal 405 00:43:25,21 --> 00:43:30,60 and there's a couple of different parameters that could look for it but I chose the attention parameter. 406 00:43:32,14 --> 00:43:40,50 That is coming from the mine flex and when it gets more than sixty percent when I when I'm focusing my attention 407 00:43:40,90 --> 00:43:46,45 and there's some strategy you can you use like doing basic math in your head or something to sort of create. 408 00:43:47,77 --> 00:43:48,93 An attentive state. 409 00:43:50,84 --> 00:43:57,16 If I get above sixty percent from the mine flex it will fire so annoyed which pushes the dice from this sort of Clipper 410 00:43:57,17 --> 00:44:01,30 to about the top like a magazine like I'm. Magazine Exactly thank you. 411 00:44:02,75 --> 00:44:03,90 Through a hole in the top 412 00:44:03,91 --> 00:44:10,89 and then it sort of falls down through this box that I created that has different little pegs in it 413 00:44:10,90 --> 00:44:12,09 and the little pegs are just. 414 00:44:13,14 --> 00:44:19,93 I I madly collect stupid things that I'll never reuse in this case um I'm totally vindicated for that because I'm 415 00:44:19,98 --> 00:44:24,80 actually reusing these things these are like those little foam brushes you get at Home Depot that always get really 416 00:44:24,81 --> 00:44:29,25 hard and filled with paint and then I save the little brush dowels 417 00:44:29,26 --> 00:44:33,86 and so I use those to help the dice sort of jiggle its way down the tower. 418 00:44:35,08 --> 00:44:42,15 Yes So you put on the wind flex you become you sort of achieve attentive state and by doing 419 00:44:42,16 --> 00:44:49,53 when doing that the dice then topple down the top of the tower and at the bottom and this is using. 420 00:44:51,28 --> 00:44:58,26 There is a really great one of the videos that I'll post has. A really great graphing. 421 00:45:00,11 --> 00:45:05,99 Visualizer written by this great guy Eric Mike I think is his name who's written some really cool stuff 422 00:45:06,00 --> 00:45:11,26 and processing it's a visualizer for what they called the Neuro Sky E.G. The. 423 00:45:12,78 --> 00:45:18,52 Headset is this kind of very fancy version but it's the same chip that's in the cheaper Mattel mind flex 424 00:45:18,95 --> 00:45:20,65 and he has this really great graphing. 425 00:45:22,11 --> 00:45:24,96 Program that you can use to sort of see what your brain waves are doing 426 00:45:25,58 --> 00:45:29,98 and so I use that really just so I could kind of see if I was achieving an attentive state 427 00:45:29,99 --> 00:45:36,44 or not I kind of debugging the the dice roller but it was also really cool way in a way to. 428 00:45:37,62 --> 00:45:46,04 See if you're achieving attentive state so you can sort of use it as a kind of kind of feedback kind of Oracle to to 429 00:45:46,05 --> 00:45:51,34 get it going so that's a rough description of the project and if you have questions should we have to answer them. 430 00:45:52,62 --> 00:45:58,75 Or if I was unclear of things next instant did you feel like if you weren't looking at the pictures you would have. 431 00:46:02,49 --> 00:46:08,00 It's pretty awesome I was definitely trying. Trying trying to figure out like. 432 00:46:09,90 --> 00:46:19,61 Like what's the point in the graph like do you use the mindfulness. Which is ultimately I guess what Lisa's face. 433 00:46:23,16 --> 00:46:28,35 It's the light grey bar on the far left of the chart on the far left and. 434 00:46:31,65 --> 00:46:34,69 Yeah I remember being I came and it was secret for wood but I. 435 00:46:36,19 --> 00:46:41,94 Have a game like this where there was a little table and people would sit down at opposite ends 436 00:46:42,29 --> 00:46:44,34 and where had had bands like this 437 00:46:44,35 --> 00:46:49,62 and then there was a little ball attached to a wire so that the ball could travel towards either of the players 438 00:46:50,29 --> 00:46:52,92 and the idea was not to be extra mindful 439 00:46:52,93 --> 00:47:00,85 but the idea was to be as relaxed as possible so it was sort of an inversion of normal game states where you get kind 440 00:47:00,86 --> 00:47:02,70 of amped up in the attempt to win 441 00:47:03,45 --> 00:47:08,84 and so the people that could do the best were the ones that could just totally blank their brain so yeah yeah that's 442 00:47:08,85 --> 00:47:09,31 really smart. 443 00:47:10,92 --> 00:47:18,90 But yeah I kind of like mine which I feel like is is set up to be extended by somebody else I would love to see someone 444 00:47:18,94 --> 00:47:19,65 get in here 445 00:47:19,66 --> 00:47:27,04 and figure out you know what are other brain states that relate to say like if you're attacking with a die roll for. 446 00:47:28,59 --> 00:47:34,71 Rolling to perceive the existence of a trap or something you know could those actually be two different mind states 447 00:47:35,24 --> 00:47:41,33 and then could you have multiple dive magazines so you would have to put your brain into different. 448 00:47:42,99 --> 00:47:48,55 Statuses in order to roll different kinds of dice Yes This this project is ready to get much larger as with all three 449 00:47:48,56 --> 00:47:56,25 of these projects I think totally yeah yeah yeah I think that we all really tackle different components of a very small 450 00:47:56,32 --> 00:48:00,12 like it's easy to sort of think that maybe everybody would do X. but We. 451 00:48:00,29 --> 00:48:03,47 I actually read something quite different Thanks yeah that was great. 452 00:48:05,40 --> 00:48:09,84 Yeah it's really good well thanks thanks again for jumping in 453 00:48:10,05 --> 00:48:15,99 and we know like it's like any project that you do you're like Oh this I can probably do this in a night 454 00:48:16,00 --> 00:48:19,91 and then you're like seven nights later you're like oh my gosh I'm still working on this so. 455 00:48:21,08 --> 00:48:28,76 We really respect your time and thank you for diving into doing something super super great. Yet you know a lot of. 456 00:48:30,94 --> 00:48:37,19 Opportunity. To try to do something a little. Different from normal. 457 00:48:38,75 --> 00:48:43,72 Yeah it's only an end there it looks to be someone else in one of your photos who's also having a good time so 458 00:48:43,73 --> 00:48:50,96 hopefully your family was amused. Yes they've all been very and. It's great. 459 00:48:52,57 --> 00:48:58,15 There's a section of the podcast called what we're into. Were running a little bit long on time so. 460 00:48:59,18 --> 00:49:05,52 Maybe we'll just each list maybe one or two things that we have been inspired by or listen to or watched 461 00:49:05,53 --> 00:49:09,11 or tools we used or whatever that maybe came up with in the past two weeks. 462 00:49:10,17 --> 00:49:12,74 Maybe Taylor in a would you like to go first. 463 00:49:14,11 --> 00:49:23,60 Yes or so the printer I used is a resin printer called the jet and unlike the maker which operates on F.D.M. 464 00:49:23,61 --> 00:49:30,71 Refused to position modeling this is a print where you have a various then skim resin that's U.V. 465 00:49:30,72 --> 00:49:35,80 Cured so it looks kind of like a Xerox machine where you lay out your roll out a really thin. 466 00:49:38,28 --> 00:49:45,10 Sheet of slime basically and then come back over with points of U.V. Light. That put that into place. 467 00:49:46,29 --> 00:49:48,35 But apart from that and I just got really down 468 00:49:49,08 --> 00:49:54,03 and basic you know so I had some processing in our do we know code left over from our previous class 469 00:49:54,52 --> 00:50:00,18 and then I had pieces laying around my house so I don't think I bought anything except for the prince and. 470 00:50:00,21 --> 00:50:03,05 For the most part it was revisiting stuff that I already head 471 00:50:03,92 --> 00:50:10,99 but it was kind of a it was rewarding in that I've been using my website as sort of a way to keep notes from my so you 472 00:50:11,00 --> 00:50:15,79 know so I think we often think about Web sites completely as outward facing 473 00:50:15,98 --> 00:50:22,11 but this is an example where I just love you know here's how you get Arduino talking to processing 474 00:50:22,12 --> 00:50:23,89 and then just left it there and so 475 00:50:23,90 --> 00:50:28,61 when this project came up I was actually searching on my own website to you know try to pick that thing up 476 00:50:29,06 --> 00:50:35,17 and I think I'm going to keep it was really successful right so I'm going to keep going with this working style in the 477 00:50:35,18 --> 00:50:43,32 future where. I'm just documenting waypoints along the way and figuring out technical process he's. 478 00:50:44,37 --> 00:50:51,36 As much for myself as any other audience. That's cool. Indeed anything that we were into. 479 00:50:52,48 --> 00:51:02,90 Yes so I have to say this project really. Great appreciation for a lot of like just kind of basic tools that. 480 00:51:04,67 --> 00:51:06,13 I had like in the basement 481 00:51:06,14 --> 00:51:17,29 and that kind of collected over time so like a table saw like it's kind of weird it's like like table saws like the 482 00:51:17,30 --> 00:51:24,98 circular saw chop saw like all this stuff is really easy to use like when it comes to ninety degree cuts. 483 00:51:26,05 --> 00:51:32,88 When it comes to making like some kind of crazy geometric object like this. Like I just found like. 484 00:51:34,12 --> 00:51:40,42 Figuring out how to use all of these what you would probably consider basic tools to do something a. 485 00:51:41,63 --> 00:51:42,61 Little bit different 486 00:51:42,62 --> 00:51:50,79 but in contently more challenging to be a very like refreshing exercise so one of the things that I found. 487 00:51:52,31 --> 00:51:57,45 When I was like just trying out how to how to do all of this without cutting my fingers off. 488 00:51:58,56 --> 00:52:00,18 Like if you search around on. 489 00:52:00,21 --> 00:52:06,08 Amazon you'll find they have these like you can buy these like really cool tools that will allow you to grip stuff 490 00:52:06,95 --> 00:52:10,45 while putting through putting it through a table saw without chopping your fingers are. 491 00:52:11,75 --> 00:52:17,79 In all honesty I was trying to figure out if I could like cream one of these things where they're called like you know 492 00:52:17,80 --> 00:52:19,06 like like grip 493 00:52:19,07 --> 00:52:25,18 or like whatever it is it's really just like a plastic tool that allows you to like hold on to the part 494 00:52:25,38 --> 00:52:32,87 and push it through the saw and keeping your hands at a safe distance so I found that pretty interesting 495 00:52:32,88 --> 00:52:37,94 but really just like looking at like the basic cutting tools that we had. 496 00:52:39,40 --> 00:52:48,08 Around and Brad nailers at the wall Brad now are. Like I'm totally into that I just want to find stuff. 497 00:52:49,17 --> 00:52:54,42 Yet regulars are great yeah it's like if you've ever like like a stapler it could be a little bit bigger 498 00:52:54,43 --> 00:52:56,94 and more useful than that of the bread Naylor is your thing. 499 00:52:58,25 --> 00:53:01,82 You know is live this when you're him where every problem looks like and they'll. 500 00:53:04,57 --> 00:53:08,12 Act opposite it's like when you have a brad nailer you just want to like. 501 00:53:10,82 --> 00:53:15,77 Awesome thanks I have two quick things the first one is. 502 00:53:17,22 --> 00:53:24,34 I've been subscribed to this e-mail newsletter called a woman to know by Julia carpenter you get a daily woman to know 503 00:53:24,39 --> 00:53:30,26 e-mail in your inbox and a lot of them are historical figures are interesting women doing cool things 504 00:53:30,81 --> 00:53:36,51 and one of the most this week was particularly memorable It was really quite amazing 505 00:53:36,80 --> 00:53:42,84 and it was a woman named I'm going to mispronounce her name Helen hue lick who was jailed for wearing pants. 506 00:53:43,91 --> 00:53:45,26 While testifying in the U.S. 507 00:53:45,27 --> 00:53:46,35 Court one hundred thirty eight 508 00:53:46,39 --> 00:53:51,56 and she got this kind of ridiculous reprimand from a judge she was testifying in court so I assume she was like. 509 00:53:53,30 --> 00:54:00,48 Just kind of there you know on behalf of this other court case that was happening but she were slow. X.R. 510 00:54:00,49 --> 00:54:02,59 Pants you know to to court 511 00:54:02,63 --> 00:54:08,12 and the judge sort of gave her this ridiculous reprimand that said look if you insist on wearing slacks again you'll be 512 00:54:08,13 --> 00:54:13,67 prevented from testifying because that would hinder the administration of justice be prepared to be punished for a 513 00:54:13,68 --> 00:54:19,09 court according to the law for contempt of court and so on the next day she was like you know screw this dude 514 00:54:19,28 --> 00:54:26,24 and she came back to the court wearing pants and was jailed for. And so I thought like that was a totally awesome. 515 00:54:27,72 --> 00:54:33,32 Kind of. Protests approach well also did they give for. 516 00:54:35,19 --> 00:54:40,26 Jail or did you know right yeah Yeah exactly yeah good question 517 00:54:40,27 --> 00:54:43,09 and like that was one nine hundred thirty eight which feels like a long time ago 518 00:54:43,10 --> 00:54:47,08 but it wasn't even like a hundred years ago so that's kind of depressing. 519 00:54:48,23 --> 00:54:53,18 Though I'll admit like I did disparage a guy the other day wearing a utility belt so. 520 00:54:54,42 --> 00:54:57,66 He was in Portland and you know you can't wear you to look at Portland it's too obviously. 521 00:54:58,90 --> 00:55:03,38 Like it's you know come on it's it's like it's like if you're a barista you can't have a handlebar mustache 522 00:55:03,42 --> 00:55:04,39 but you know. 523 00:55:06,72 --> 00:55:13,35 But I wanted to give my other other link shout out to units which are a thing that I actually haven't had very long in 524 00:55:13,36 --> 00:55:17,31 my tool kit but I totally love they're also called Step bits. 525 00:55:18,47 --> 00:55:26,47 Like a cone shaped drill bit has a little steps by steps I mean that little kind of indentions walking up the incline 526 00:55:26,48 --> 00:55:26,97 of the bit 527 00:55:27,43 --> 00:55:32,76 and they're great for a number of reasons one the biggest one for me is you can drill acrylic with them so if you need 528 00:55:32,77 --> 00:55:39,27 to drill holes into an acrylic sheet regular job it will severely crack and kind of alarming way the acrylic 529 00:55:39,28 --> 00:55:41,39 and in a step it won't which is really nice. 530 00:55:42,99 --> 00:55:44,81 Because that acrylic always freaks me out because I think 531 00:55:44,82 --> 00:55:50,85 when a crack it Secondly you can drill like a really nice smooth holes of varying sizes into P.V.C. 532 00:55:50,86 --> 00:55:54,78 Pipe really well and I did that for this project and you can cut like thin aluminum 533 00:55:54,79 --> 00:55:58,39 and still sheets for them which is really good I have about four sizes some are quite thin 534 00:55:58,40 --> 00:56:01,11 and some are quite chunky you can get them out like a. I'm store or something. 535 00:56:02,72 --> 00:56:04,98 Or at like Harbor Freight or somewhere like that. 536 00:56:06,60 --> 00:56:08,51 And of course on line I think 537 00:56:08,52 --> 00:56:17,20 but one thing I wanted to note about them is it's important to look at how step on the bit is some are quite shallow 538 00:56:17,21 --> 00:56:24,71 and what I mean by that is so as you drill into a thing the depth of each step limits the thickness of your material so 539 00:56:25,25 --> 00:56:30,01 if each step is only like an eighth of an inch then the material that you're drilling needs to only be an eight their 540 00:56:30,02 --> 00:56:35,64 mentor at then or so if you wonder why you're looking at the different step it's like why are some of them so long 541 00:56:35,65 --> 00:56:37,80 and kind of wide and some of them are very thin 542 00:56:38,59 --> 00:56:42,28 and shallow it's because the depth of each of those steps actually matters 543 00:56:43,12 --> 00:56:49,53 and lastly the one thing that's kind of really cool about a step it is if you've ever used a classic circle cutter 544 00:56:49,54 --> 00:56:58,03 or a hole saw it right like I always cut a hole too small on accident so if you're cutting a one inch diameter hole 545 00:56:58,32 --> 00:56:59,70 with a hole saw and you cut it out 546 00:56:59,71 --> 00:57:04,44 and then you realize you need a one an eight inch diameter because your pipe your one inch pipe now doesn't fit in the 547 00:57:04,45 --> 00:57:14,08 one inch hole you don't have any way to make it one eighth inch bigger the hole because you know exactly exactly this 548 00:57:14,09 --> 00:57:21,94 interest blown out so what's nice about a step it is you can just push the drill the step that all the way through to 549 00:57:21,95 --> 00:57:27,12 the point where you need to start again and just make it that one eighth inch bigger and for me as someone who's. 550 00:57:29,74 --> 00:57:35,58 Stupidly imprecise often it's really nice to have a tool that allows you to be dumb you know 551 00:57:35,59 --> 00:57:38,56 and be like oh I made the hole too small now I can make it just a little bit bigger. 552 00:57:39,81 --> 00:57:40,28 And then 553 00:57:40,55 --> 00:57:44,92 and then do that thing instead of being like you know I have to draw a whole new piece of wood because I blew the hole 554 00:57:44,93 --> 00:57:47,25 out so anyway I link to some units and show notes 555 00:57:47,26 --> 00:57:54,00 but I they're super cool thing they're kind of weird for someone who maybe has a small tool kit it wouldn't be a thing 556 00:57:54,01 --> 00:57:57,98 that you would have immediately gravitate to in a home store or something but they're quite fun and 557 00:57:58,07 --> 00:58:02,27 and really easy to use and not scary. And they're pretty cheap. 558 00:58:06,10 --> 00:58:13,21 Let's see let's see what have we got so challenge wrap up if you've got a project that opposable podcast dot com will 559 00:58:13,22 --> 00:58:16,28 have also in show notes will have photos videos 560 00:58:16,29 --> 00:58:22,46 and all sorts of other things of all three of our projects you can listen to episodes directly on opposable Pike Ask 561 00:58:22,47 --> 00:58:27,39 dot com or you can subscribe to opposable thumbs through i Tunes over cast it your 562 00:58:27,40 --> 00:58:33,39 and all the other part cast that platforms just search inside those applications for the phrase opposable thumbs 563 00:58:33,40 --> 00:58:39,72 and you should see that there are logo. 564 00:58:35,37 --> 00:58:39,72 or is created by the mighty wolf mask you can check out his work with nascar dot co dot U.K. 565 00:58:40,93 --> 00:58:41,96 He's a really great person 566 00:58:41,97 --> 00:58:49,10 and we're super psyched that he made us such a cool awesome logo we have a patron page on the website as well please go 567 00:58:49,11 --> 00:58:50,69 to opposable podcast dot com 568 00:58:51,00 --> 00:58:57,32 or patriotic com slash opposable thumbs to sponsor us we have three sponsorship Here's a that you can check out so if 569 00:58:57,33 --> 00:59:00,36 you're not don't have a lot of money week until they accommodate that 570 00:59:00,67 --> 00:59:08,33 and would love to get hooked up by you so we can keep doing this podcast I would like to give a shout out to Kelly for 571 00:59:08,34 --> 00:59:13,39 being our very first patron Yes Thank you Kelly we are naturally. 572 00:59:15,54 --> 00:59:18,52 There can only be one first patron and you are that person so thanks. 573 00:59:19,79 --> 00:59:21,77 Kelly is an amazing guitar player and singer 574 00:59:21,78 --> 00:59:26,38 and you can check out her site Kelly married Martin dot com So thank you Kelly. 575 00:59:27,68 --> 00:59:32,44 Just a quick note we do have a code of contact conduct for on the podcast 576 00:59:32,45 --> 00:59:37,71 and also on the website we're dedicated to providing a harassment free experience for everyone regardless of race 577 00:59:37,72 --> 00:59:43,91 gender age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size or knowledge of subject matter or religion 578 00:59:43,92 --> 00:59:47,83 or that lack there of we actually support an inclusive environment 579 00:59:47,84 --> 00:59:52,03 and we want you to be a part of it you can check out our full cut of code of conduct over at our site. 580 00:59:53,24 --> 00:59:58,84 A real quick shout out to our roots this podcast is based loosely on a few podcast Firstly the do by FRIDAY podcast 581 00:59:59,29 --> 01:00:02,88 which is a weekly chat. Show hosted by Marilyn Mann Alex Cox and next time can. 582 01:00:03,89 --> 01:00:08,63 They decide on a challenge each week and then talk about how the challenge went so if you take that past 583 01:00:08,64 --> 01:00:11,45 and combine it maybe with the cool tools podcast by Kevin Kelly 584 01:00:11,46 --> 01:00:15,03 and Mark Frauenfelder you get about halfway to this part of past. 585 01:00:16,47 --> 01:00:22,99 Also another influence on this podcast is Todd Bailey's nerd battle events that he used to do in Chicago I hope to host 586 01:00:23,00 --> 01:00:26,18 one of them and it might be actually how Taylor and I met Taylor do you 587 01:00:26,19 --> 01:00:28,94 or do we know one of the before the nerd battle or. 588 01:00:30,45 --> 01:00:39,91 I mean so I performed in the near where I made a pair of light up shoes that lit up in time to Billie Jean Yep 589 01:00:40,19 --> 01:00:41,80 and I can't I can't 590 01:00:41,81 --> 01:00:50,14 and one thing you you were on yes I did with you one you know I'm blushing over here for a picture of me blushing see 591 01:00:50,15 --> 01:00:50,80 your website. 592 01:00:52,11 --> 01:00:59,51 Yeah maybe that is so we met I'm sure exactly I feel like you are such a fixture in the Chicago new media scene I sort 593 01:00:59,52 --> 01:01:03,93 of can't can't remember a time before I knew he was trying to remember 594 01:01:03,94 --> 01:01:11,55 but it certainly I was certainly wowed by Taylor at that winning of the nerd battle with his amazing shoes 595 01:01:11,61 --> 01:01:14,92 and there is a video of that somewhere on the Internet well I'll see if I can link to it. 596 01:01:16,50 --> 01:01:22,82 Hope so yeah I do and I am also psyched to say that on episode number two our podcast we have listener feedback. 597 01:01:24,60 --> 01:01:30,26 Listener rich Mansfield emailed us to suggest the complete metalsmith as a book that he really loves 598 01:01:30,27 --> 01:01:35,49 and is kept for almost twenty years and will put a link to that book in the show notes if you have 599 01:01:35,50 --> 01:01:40,61 or you know I I can't rich will have to tell me if this is apocryphal 600 01:01:40,62 --> 01:01:46,28 or not I went to grad school with rich Mansfield and I seem to remember him telling me a story so he is. 601 01:01:47,31 --> 01:01:55,16 He is not exceedingly tall and he was saying something about going into the army like the Marines or something 602 01:01:55,57 --> 01:02:00,12 and to put some meat on his bones they made him carry. 603 01:02:00,24 --> 01:02:03,28 Artillery shells back and forth across the field 604 01:02:03,69 --> 01:02:10,25 and then he had to eat at the beginning in the end of every single deal so I'll have to ask Richard this is true 605 01:02:10,26 --> 01:02:16,30 but the numbers that I recall were that he went from one hundred pounds to one hundred fifty amazing which I can only 606 01:02:16,31 --> 01:02:20,62 assume was just muscle Wow Which sounds pretty awesome to me 607 01:02:20,66 --> 01:02:28,58 but it is awesome yeah we should definitely would be great to get a picture of rich oh yeah I do 608 01:02:28,59 --> 01:02:37,45 and that's her work on that. OK At the next challenge this is the part where we get to sort of brainstorm. 609 01:02:38,59 --> 01:02:43,30 What we'll be doing for the next two weeks. Or so you're still with us you're very welcome. 610 01:02:46,75 --> 01:02:52,70 And what's what should the next challenge be what do you think. It. Was Here. 611 01:02:57,04 --> 01:03:03,23 What do you want something that's going to be like. Round about your old electronics. 612 01:03:05,05 --> 01:03:11,07 What's the starting point to knowing both of those is the starting point right downtown materials 613 01:03:11,08 --> 01:03:12,57 and electronics there were. 614 01:03:14,21 --> 01:03:23,04 Found electronics that better work yeah repurchasing repurposing found electronics yes I think we found our third 615 01:03:23,05 --> 01:03:28,40 episode yeah. Oh well that is right about the five seconds yeah. 616 01:03:32,46 --> 01:03:34,92 OK actually I'm going to put my brain on that 617 01:03:34,93 --> 01:03:41,23 and we still have to figure out who are the next guesses so that'll remain a mystery Rob unless you want to do some 618 01:03:41,24 --> 01:03:47,30 radio magic and come back and edit that and it will no believe in a mystery maybe we'll post it on a website 619 01:03:47,31 --> 01:03:47,64 or something 620 01:03:47,65 --> 01:03:54,09 and people are really curious perfect well thanks to you that was great yeah that was really great thank you so much 621 01:03:54,10 --> 01:03:56,76 for being our first guest I know that is kind of weird 622 01:03:56,77 --> 01:04:00,18 and maybe a little bit scary so thanks thanks for coming on board your project. 623 01:04:00,21 --> 01:04:08,94 It is totally amazing and you know it's an excellent third challenge. Thanks I appreciate the opportunity. 624 01:04:10,91 --> 01:04:13,98 Already I think that you know I'm going to go look at the ground 625 01:04:13,99 --> 01:04:24,49 and see if I can find some weird crazy electronics that might still work. All right outro music goes here. Eventually. 626 01:04:26,05 --> 01:04:29,03 Maybe. In the future. 627 01:04:30,56 --> 01:04:40,54 If we have a future we made more than one hour past where we were before I guess that counts for something. Right. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:00,69 --> 00:00:17,27 Intro music goes here. Eventually. Maybe. In the future. If we have a future let's pretend we have a future. OK. 2 00:00:18,31 --> 00:00:24,11 Let's do this opposable thumbs is a podcast where Taylor and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks 3 00:00:24,12 --> 00:00:26,05 and talk about our accomplishments failures 4 00:00:26,06 --> 00:00:31,48 and lessons learned we're joined by this episode guest Meghan Trainor Greetings Meghan. 5 00:00:33,63 --> 00:00:39,99 So you are you share a name with a famous person sure what you ripped I was here first yes. 6 00:00:41,11 --> 00:00:44,91 So I had I had a great challenge where it really 7 00:00:44,92 --> 00:00:50,59 and it is if you Google my name it would say to you mean Taylor Hanson. To which. 8 00:00:53,12 --> 00:00:58,90 I was very excited on the day that I exceeded Taylor it like it came no longer Taylor 9 00:00:58,91 --> 00:01:08,67 and it's really really it's I I think my official party line on the situation is I really envy the Nick Kates. 10 00:01:09,78 --> 00:01:17,32 Yeah Yes isn't it Nick Cave in that cave Yeah yeah I mean I you know I love both of them 11 00:01:17,66 --> 00:01:22,80 and I think they have a lot of sort of mutual enthusiasm 12 00:01:23,03 --> 00:01:30,94 and I think sharing anything with a very young pop star is a completely different aesthetic experience I mean 13 00:01:30,95 --> 00:01:34,31 and I don't know where she's going so this this could evolve into something 14 00:01:34,32 --> 00:01:43,81 but right now it's it really mostly it just messes with my Google Analytics it Robert you a hockey player I am I am 15 00:01:43,82 --> 00:01:52,61 also a hockey player to get away from yeah I would He was he retired by the time I mean a few years ago I guess 16 00:01:52,62 --> 00:01:59,61 but I get the occasional emails asking to come to office parties and stuff. Oh I get you would not believe it so. 17 00:02:00,39 --> 00:02:08,24 The amount of social media Thetic It's just like oh this is Tad from Island Records that we want to fly to Hawaii in 18 00:02:08,25 --> 00:02:16,02 like a rate and then they're like oh wait no. I just I get fan mail I get a mooching messages. 19 00:02:17,08 --> 00:02:23,12 Everywhere it's just kind of this like no that covers my conversations and digital space 20 00:02:23,62 --> 00:02:28,20 but as an artist it's the thing where I'm like This is interesting 21 00:02:28,21 --> 00:02:34,95 and someday it might be something I work with I mean it you know that's what it is to be an artist who's like that 22 00:02:34,96 --> 00:02:40,58 these are the facts right I did a project at. Making a little C.N.C. 23 00:02:40,62 --> 00:02:48,44 Mill kit to keep getting these come ons like everybody took it a couple of for China where they said we want to order 24 00:02:48,45 --> 00:02:51,58 fifty thousand of this particular transmission shift. 25 00:02:52,95 --> 00:02:59,18 That I get like that as you know diagram with all the things laid out that I was actually trying to stick couldn't it 26 00:02:59,35 --> 00:03:03,82 is there any way I could make that to us and electronics thing but I felt like it was pushing too far. 27 00:03:06,36 --> 00:03:13,35 My name is Robert I run the exoskeleton art space in Los Angeles which hosts very infrequent openings and events 28 00:03:13,39 --> 00:03:19,31 and I also run the exoskeletal newsletter which is a somewhat more frequently sent e-mail newsletter 29 00:03:19,36 --> 00:03:25,66 and I am an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 30 00:03:27,35 --> 00:03:31,99 So you are open sometimes a professor at Columbia College Chicago. 31 00:03:33,57 --> 00:03:40,76 Artist and educator and do you know if you're in the Kerry camp if that was so I Meghan Trainor the original 32 00:03:41,64 --> 00:03:46,90 but I did say I am a digital strategist at Turner arts because of my company 33 00:03:47,14 --> 00:03:53,09 but you know the important part is I am a new media artist and my practice is informed. 34 00:03:54,46 --> 00:04:00,19 By my utopian vision that leading healers have hidden centuries of technology away from the. 35 00:04:00,28 --> 00:04:06,32 Public that we currently face that on an army of robot battle it is that is my underlying manifesto. 36 00:04:08,07 --> 00:04:12,61 I write essay if I write manifestos about technology and history and social justice. 37 00:04:13,76 --> 00:04:20,53 I'm currently working on a project called Spagna in which is the collaborative performance series with Sarah lipstick. 38 00:04:21,62 --> 00:04:25,23 Which we're calling a narrative akin to Thomas Pynchon for girls 39 00:04:26,23 --> 00:04:34,43 and this project is exploring Bob rituals head to electronics living outside craftsmanship of conductive ink making in 40 00:04:34,98 --> 00:04:42,95 northwest history adventurer transformation I think I think I think that's what we're doing step that's me. 41 00:04:44,37 --> 00:04:51,56 And I think I think the things coming out for me is I'm going to give in attack it ain't got here in Seattle Washington. 42 00:04:52,73 --> 00:04:57,89 June twenty first called Solstice we may talk about hedges or resistance. 43 00:04:59,10 --> 00:05:03,93 Yes or make it I was curious about a couple things that there are so certainly as. 44 00:05:06,26 --> 00:05:13,33 Our folks I'm thinking about talking in a sort of academic with a kind I want to ask all my questions at once as I feel 45 00:05:13,34 --> 00:05:15,84 like some of the things that you're doing 46 00:05:15,94 --> 00:05:23,85 but I also interested in doing that challenge are exploring humor right I mean in that context 47 00:05:24,29 --> 00:05:33,01 and then also exploring Shandor in the context of humor so the fact that you're using terms like Lee These girls you 48 00:05:33,02 --> 00:05:41,01 know completely indicates that you're not taking standard issue capitally academic Here are the things we talk about it 49 00:05:41,02 --> 00:05:48,36 here are the things that which make up the names you know of so just curious Am I over thinking to ask you about your 50 00:05:49,08 --> 00:05:56,75 use of this particular terms those gender terms no not at all I mean I've been to space where I think like. 51 00:05:59,17 --> 00:06:07,83 It's informed by. And a comedy is actually Mia. Yeah how different are they really. They're not there. 52 00:06:09,57 --> 00:06:19,97 Yeah I'd I just yeah humor and maybe not so much humor but sarcasm is really for me an important part of my process 53 00:06:20,02 --> 00:06:24,30 and self-preservation in all of these spheres that I exist in and. 54 00:06:25,56 --> 00:06:26,31 So I think 55 00:06:26,32 --> 00:06:34,76 when I say stuff like you know Woody healers building battle robot which is you know that's the only rational response 56 00:06:34,77 --> 00:06:43,40 to the trumpet ministration. And and I own those terms right like I can do that you know. 57 00:06:44,63 --> 00:06:49,76 But yeah I think a lot you know Rob and I had sort of the preliminary attack 58 00:06:49,77 --> 00:06:51,85 and it was a really awesome conversation 59 00:06:52,45 --> 00:07:00,58 and a lot of what we talked about was you know one being a new media for this long with me both and tell us well. 60 00:07:01,60 --> 00:07:07,83 You know we've been in it for a long time and issues of gender and inclusive of the a lot of other ideas 61 00:07:07,84 --> 00:07:14,77 and these really kind of like gotten more problematic over time. And so what do you do with that how do you. 62 00:07:15,94 --> 00:07:19,56 Sort of preserve yourself in the space 63 00:07:19,57 --> 00:07:27,52 and so for me a lot of that yeah it's humor it's sarcasm it's kind of poking at things with these words that are well 64 00:07:27,93 --> 00:07:30,16 inflammatory but I think in a positive way. 65 00:07:32,32 --> 00:07:43,38 Meghan can you tell us one comedy oriented thing before we move on so yeah I you know I just I side see a monocle last 66 00:07:43,39 --> 00:07:43,97 last week 67 00:07:43,98 --> 00:07:54,68 and I spent a morning listening to birth the giant drill come through the earth you know like this from the bowels of 68 00:07:54,69 --> 00:08:00,22 Seattle in and I do sort of weird experimental new media art is. 69 00:08:00,38 --> 00:08:07,69 People I think are surprised to learn that like like my my grounding space is all about stand up comedy that you know 70 00:08:08,18 --> 00:08:17,31 Richard Pryor and Chris Rock and Cali and I like my moral center was probably problematic but. 71 00:08:18,40 --> 00:08:24,00 Yeah the first the first album I ever bought was first line a lever by woods I started out of the child by Bill Cosby 72 00:08:24,01 --> 00:08:27,79 and that's a problem Bennett thing at this point but that's who I am 73 00:08:27,80 --> 00:08:38,14 and so yeah well I mean does does Bill Cosby's transgressions do they destroy the work that he made I guess I mean I 74 00:08:38,15 --> 00:08:42,32 suppose he was potentially committing crimes while that work was being made 75 00:08:42,33 --> 00:08:45,10 but I don't know I mean we like Jackson Pollock OK 76 00:08:45,14 --> 00:08:51,06 and all sorts of other tricks I mean yeah I mean your fave is problematic it's a pretty constant thing especially as a 77 00:08:51,07 --> 00:08:58,35 woman in the arts Blake and it's I want to hold people accountable I want to have discussions 78 00:08:58,36 --> 00:09:03,86 but at the same time I won't stand up comedy and you know I mean Eddie Murphy Raw 79 00:09:03,87 --> 00:09:12,21 and the leary of like this problematic stuff I'm going to so the guys were like informing how my humor was formed I you 80 00:09:12,22 --> 00:09:18,52 know had Cat Williams Chris Rock like Chris Rock for a long time that was like all my dating advice came from Chris 81 00:09:18,53 --> 00:09:25,27 Rock Oh I just want the big piece of chicken and I'm like OK. Hey listen that's just for daddy's OK. 82 00:09:27,11 --> 00:09:29,54 But I don't I think I don't know if. 83 00:09:30,85 --> 00:09:36,41 I think I think you know words mean where you can find it we're going to give the brother a peek I think was one of my 84 00:09:36,42 --> 00:09:44,12 old it's ridiculous. I have a maybe somewhat related question but maybe not. I feel like. 85 00:09:46,00 --> 00:09:53,03 I'm really pretty intrigued by. Your I guess maybe. 86 00:09:54,38 --> 00:10:03,31 Practice our techno spiritual practice or I'm sure there's better other words for that but. I think. So. 87 00:10:04,55 --> 00:10:13,15 I feel like a number of people I know including myself have been trying to figure out especially maybe new media folks. 88 00:10:14,45 --> 00:10:23,47 Have been trying to figure out like how do we how do we navigate a world that has become sort of saturated with our 89 00:10:23,48 --> 00:10:35,18 practice in a way you know and become sort of very. Sort of also co-opted. Kind of painful ideologies. 90 00:10:36,92 --> 00:10:40,24 Like that are sort of embedded in like hyper capitalism 91 00:10:40,25 --> 00:10:49,55 and stuff so like like so to see like oh this sort of really intriguing interactive experiences now sort of fully 92 00:10:50,37 --> 00:10:55,96 consumed by you know the the Googles or Pepsis or whatever of the world and. 93 00:10:57,33 --> 00:11:08,13 So I think a lot of people who were intrigued by technology in say the ninety's into thousands are are now trying to 94 00:11:08,14 --> 00:11:17,51 sort of feel their way through to another place that that is maybe removed from where they were back in the day and. 95 00:11:19,33 --> 00:11:20,01 I was. 96 00:11:21,30 --> 00:11:25,72 Interested to hear your journey with that and 97 00:11:25,79 --> 00:11:30,57 and also like how it overlaps with your spiritual practice for all of us that came 98 00:11:30,81 --> 00:11:38,02 or are coming into new media you know there's like there's a sense of wonder there's sense of you know these things can 99 00:11:38,03 --> 00:11:43,15 happen and you know I have really distinct memories of first time like. 100 00:11:44,25 --> 00:11:51,72 The air that potentiometer affected the Flash file that we're all looking at on the projector in those moments a wonder 101 00:11:51,73 --> 00:11:58,08 that or maybe just just the order and circus but they touch something in you and you're trying to harness that 102 00:11:58,30 --> 00:12:06,69 and then yes you're right it does get. That it gets to a point where there's a saturation in the culture and. 103 00:12:07,86 --> 00:12:15,29 You try to reestablish a connection with whatever that initial experience was and I think for me it's about. 104 00:12:17,78 --> 00:12:23,80 You know I think I've always had this relationship with technology which is I'm not interested in the sense of it I'm 105 00:12:23,81 --> 00:12:25,69 not interested in screens or pixels 106 00:12:26,23 --> 00:12:34,10 but that's always been my mantra no pixels were harmed in the making of my artwork I make very physical digital artwork 107 00:12:34,14 --> 00:12:34,75 and. 108 00:12:36,68 --> 00:12:37,34 And so 109 00:12:37,67 --> 00:12:44,78 and so so it sort of pulling back into natural systems you know electricity is a natural system the universe you know 110 00:12:44,79 --> 00:12:50,66 the solar system is a natural system all of these things you know sort of sit on that same wavelength I'm told we could 111 00:12:50,67 --> 00:12:52,34 put up an advantage and already but. 112 00:12:53,38 --> 00:13:02,73 And so exploring those underlying lessons of of how does electricity work how the how physics affects how you build 113 00:13:02,74 --> 00:13:11,71 something those things seem on the one hand very much of the fab lab of the Earth we know the new space that we're 114 00:13:12,16 --> 00:13:19,18 we're concocting out of new media but at the same time these are ancient discoveries of mostly humans 115 00:13:19,19 --> 00:13:23,23 and I do want to give credit where you know like animals or working with tools 116 00:13:23,24 --> 00:13:31,96 or you know have profound understanding of whatever magnetic systems are you know the universe in their own language 117 00:13:32,00 --> 00:13:39,81 but I think it's just getting away from a kind of binary between oh you know you've been working in cyberspace for the 118 00:13:39,82 --> 00:13:46,58 last couple decades versus these are fundamental physical human experiences these are fundamental. 119 00:13:48,62 --> 00:13:56,94 Ways of interacting with material and information and you know a story is a story whether you tell in a cave 120 00:13:56,95 --> 00:13:59,51 or you tell us a Hypercard or you tell it on Twitter. 121 00:14:01,39 --> 00:14:05,48 Well you get where to get a Hypercard reference and there dude that's good that's cool. 122 00:14:08,96 --> 00:14:15,32 Well rub should we move on to the challenge portion let's do it yeah and who's first tonight. 123 00:14:18,19 --> 00:14:23,97 Taylor why don't you go first all right I can do that so. So I. 124 00:14:25,00 --> 00:14:28,16 Found electronics was definitely a challenge 125 00:14:28,58 --> 00:14:33,71 and that was pretty much the extent of the challenge this was laid by Ian Duran last times guest 126 00:14:34,21 --> 00:14:39,75 and you know initially it seemed like it was right up my alley I mean it's something that I've worked with a lot going 127 00:14:39,76 --> 00:14:46,38 back into in undergrad. My B.S.A. Shoe disassemble the A.T.M. 128 00:14:46,39 --> 00:14:52,22 Machines and maybe sort of boxes that replicated metabolic system so there was a box that heated up 129 00:14:52,23 --> 00:14:54,81 and cooled down in a box that circulated water and all that 130 00:14:55,11 --> 00:15:00,43 but they were all like horribly dangerous in retrospect so the heating 131 00:15:00,44 --> 00:15:07,96 and cooling boxes had an exposed resistance based heater on it was sitting inside it wouldn't you know wouldn't 132 00:15:07,97 --> 00:15:09,81 enclosure in the way just totally. 133 00:15:11,22 --> 00:15:16,22 I don't know that anybody was prepared for how how badly these things could fail and they didn't fail but 134 00:15:16,33 --> 00:15:23,39 when I came back around to this found predicate tried to give myself a really kind of difficult set of limitations so I 135 00:15:23,40 --> 00:15:32,33 started from this phone that my mother in law gave me a call the girl talk phone which is like a clear plastic saved by 136 00:15:32,34 --> 00:15:34,60 the bill you know the P.C.B. 137 00:15:34,61 --> 00:15:42,22 Is paying can has these rainbow wires coming out and stuff and so my mother in law often saves electronics 138 00:15:42,23 --> 00:15:47,30 and gives them to mean it's funny the number of times that she's half of the stuff on the head even though this isn't 139 00:15:47,31 --> 00:15:52,46 her area at all like she was the one that told me about Neil Gershenfeld for the first time you know so she does it 140 00:15:52,47 --> 00:15:58,24 every once in awhile she really really nails it so and so I open this thing up was taken all the parts apart 141 00:15:58,25 --> 00:16:01,92 and I was just trying to think. On the parts that have harvested. 142 00:16:03,05 --> 00:16:09,86 This off this board you know what something that you can actually make with that if I can anything else say I think 143 00:16:09,97 --> 00:16:12,87 basically I left myself there at wire but that was about it. 144 00:16:13,96 --> 00:16:20,70 So this got me around to really essential electronic circuits looking back through forest Mims and things like that 145 00:16:21,25 --> 00:16:29,06 and then I came up with sort of one of the most essential circuits which was the the multivibrator So those that aren't 146 00:16:29,07 --> 00:16:32,38 familiar with this if you take what are largely. 147 00:16:33,62 --> 00:16:40,96 Passive components so a couple of capacitors a couple of resistors and so forth but importantly two N.P.N. 148 00:16:41,00 --> 00:16:44,52 Transistor you can put them in the sort of mirrored orientation 149 00:16:44,93 --> 00:16:49,71 and the most simple implementation of this is known as the flip flop so 150 00:16:49,72 --> 00:16:55,11 when you power this thing up if you have a couple of really these to show you the operation if you're taking a look at 151 00:16:55,12 --> 00:17:01,08 the circuit put online the one thing I did add was there readily the I have to cop to that 152 00:17:01,09 --> 00:17:07,06 but the green one is original so the idea is that this thing sort of whole says back and forth 153 00:17:07,45 --> 00:17:14,14 and then for the for the audience at home I'm going to upload a little a little six second video from my collaborators 154 00:17:14,15 --> 00:17:20,37 to watch here so they can see the behavior so I want you guys what you guess describe it a little bit in case there's 155 00:17:20,38 --> 00:17:25,13 something I'm leaving out cool yeah make it do you want to play to maybe describe what you see 156 00:17:25,75 --> 00:17:29,09 and some seem to alligator clips etats to. 157 00:17:31,07 --> 00:17:35,61 What I'm seeing is that you actually tease a couple resistors there's about four resistors. 158 00:17:36,92 --> 00:17:40,45 Capacitors and those other two are that where the N.P.N. 159 00:17:41,05 --> 00:17:48,58 Are yeah OK And and that's it and there is that thought or even happening or yeah the so the pieces are a little bit. 160 00:17:49,64 --> 00:17:54,82 For anyone that's lived in Chicago there is this teacher at the Art Institute Steve wall deck 161 00:17:54,83 --> 00:17:59,19 and he was one of these guys that was so brilliant he could just make circuits with had a P.C.B. 162 00:17:59,20 --> 00:18:00,13 So he'd take a bunch of. 163 00:18:00,25 --> 00:18:05,21 Arts and Sautter and together and I think he even talked about this a long time ago 164 00:18:05,22 --> 00:18:09,95 but it was definitely beyond me at that particular point so it's you know it's going to like a circuit with no with no 165 00:18:09,96 --> 00:18:18,16 circuit board basically yeah it's beautiful like I've never seen a non breadboard instantiation of this combination of 166 00:18:18,17 --> 00:18:20,55 things like there's there's no P.C.B. 167 00:18:20,56 --> 00:18:26,73 There's no breadboard there's no strange copper's substrate it's just these things are soldered together 168 00:18:26,74 --> 00:18:33,07 and there are alligator clips and there's a purity to it what I see is just this is all we need. 169 00:18:34,28 --> 00:18:36,63 But yeah it's really cool it definitely has like. 170 00:18:38,50 --> 00:18:41,29 It's like oh this is I'm trying to say this in a nice way 171 00:18:41,30 --> 00:18:50,62 but it's like a lot of stuff right like like it doesn't have it doesn't have like the sort of like almost about how 172 00:18:50,63 --> 00:18:51,12 C.N. 173 00:18:51,13 --> 00:18:52,63 Kind of rigidity that you think of 174 00:18:52,64 --> 00:18:58,46 when you see a second you know which is really nice in a right to be a little bit of Pete blasters. 175 00:18:59,54 --> 00:19:01,83 He makes sense and stuff that are very. 176 00:19:04,92 --> 00:19:11,80 Kind of all over the place or sort of laid out in a way that is maybe more attentive to us that ICS them and. 177 00:19:13,38 --> 00:19:17,18 Yet traditional kind of what I like Eagle or chi cat 178 00:19:17,19 --> 00:19:24,13 or something might spit out is the go that made you know somebody released an album where they released it in the jewel 179 00:19:24,14 --> 00:19:29,91 case but it was actually just a circuit and so you literally plug your headphones into the side of the jewel case 180 00:19:30,34 --> 00:19:32,98 and then it ran us and hurts OK cool 181 00:19:33,12 --> 00:19:38,05 and I went to school if you will it will be a bit we'll put that in the show notes as well 182 00:19:38,06 --> 00:19:44,87 but yeah that was one of those projects where it was just so on the money that you go oh just like that kind of hurts 183 00:19:45,20 --> 00:19:51,48 you know so the last thing if you're watching this terribly short video is just that the lead these slip back 184 00:19:51,49 --> 00:20:00,22 and forth so one's on the other is off and it's not as instantaneous as a basic digital on operate so it has to. 185 00:20:00,30 --> 00:20:02,74 With the capacitor is filling in discharging 186 00:20:03,18 --> 00:20:09,57 and the size of the capacitor is what controls the timing of the circuit so as the capacitors get larger in their value 187 00:20:09,97 --> 00:20:11,21 it just means that each L.E.D. 188 00:20:11,22 --> 00:20:18,87 Is on for a longer period of time so so I made this little thing what I really wanted to do was to make what's known so 189 00:20:18,88 --> 00:20:25,67 this isn't a stable multivibrator what I really wanted to make was a bi stable multivibrator So that requires a couple 190 00:20:25,68 --> 00:20:29,50 of switches I only have one tactile switch and I didn't want to violate that rule. 191 00:20:30,82 --> 00:20:36,04 So with a couple of switches you can hit the switch on the left and cause one L.A.P.D. 192 00:20:36,05 --> 00:20:41,45 To eliminate and the other to go out and then if you hit the switch on the right moment serially read these are. 193 00:20:43,70 --> 00:20:49,85 Not momentary switches so it's basically the first example of a circuit that can contain one piece of memory you know 194 00:20:49,86 --> 00:20:50,51 one bit. 195 00:20:51,61 --> 00:20:57,84 And that leads to everything else at the same time in addition to the technical challenge of a sort of thinking about 196 00:20:58,40 --> 00:21:06,65 the ultra gendered nature of my girl to a phone thinking about women and women's roles traditionally and otherwise 197 00:21:06,66 --> 00:21:09,71 and technology and that got me thinking you know of course. 198 00:21:10,76 --> 00:21:15,47 What's the movie right now but the NASA scientists didn't figure take years yeah 199 00:21:16,09 --> 00:21:21,23 but there are also some great ones that come across me difference from earlier with the lovely summer work with 200 00:21:21,75 --> 00:21:27,88 Babbage's computer and then I was reading about the Harvard computers where this was in the era 201 00:21:27,89 --> 00:21:35,19 when the computer was still just a person you hired to do mathematical calculations Apparently I'm forgetting who the 202 00:21:35,23 --> 00:21:39,58 scientists was but there was a mill scientist that Harvard and this may be apocryphal 203 00:21:39,59 --> 00:21:45,23 but supposedly the story went that he was telling some group of men you know my housekeeper could do a better job 204 00:21:45,32 --> 00:21:48,40 calculating these things I believe they were astronomy. 205 00:21:49,47 --> 00:21:55,57 Tables and so he literally hired is housekeeper who is a woman to do these tables and she did a great show 206 00:21:55,84 --> 00:22:00,22 and then he he accumulated this group of women that were the polite. 207 00:22:00,57 --> 00:22:05,17 Term was the Harvard calculators the impolite term was like so and so's hair or something like that 208 00:22:05,18 --> 00:22:13,67 but really just maybe go down the rabbit hole that was all generated from this goofy Gen third telephone my mother in 209 00:22:13,68 --> 00:22:23,56 law gave. Also. Think that there's a great interview with. Dr Christine Darden who was who was one of the. 210 00:22:25,76 --> 00:22:29,73 Mathematicians in the book in the movie I haven't seen the movie I really want to see it 211 00:22:29,74 --> 00:22:32,32 but on a sixteen broadcast which is. 212 00:22:33,76 --> 00:22:40,14 A sort of unusually enlightened podcast for its topics and guests it's usually like you know how many how many more. 213 00:22:41,19 --> 00:22:46,13 Billions of points of data just Jeff Bezos have and stuff you know but they do they do. 214 00:22:47,24 --> 00:22:48,62 Have some pretty cool guests on 215 00:22:48,82 --> 00:22:55,97 and so I'm going to mention it all right so who's up next do we save our guest for the end we're going to go next yes 216 00:22:55,98 --> 00:22:59,30 just just to mix it up from last time I'll go next to that and then Meg 217 00:22:59,31 --> 00:23:03,81 and you can do you know what you mean yeah OK let's see so I have. 218 00:23:05,44 --> 00:23:17,11 We'll see how this goes I have nine images in one quick time. Well. 219 00:23:21,31 --> 00:23:28,77 I'm just seeing a shopping cart and I should point out that when I was going to you know some kind of knots Yeah. 220 00:23:30,65 --> 00:23:33,16 I'll come back but this is a story of my first hit you. 221 00:23:35,52 --> 00:23:40,73 Don't come back start there well so you guess I'm going to mispronounce it that you know that you haven't banned it 222 00:23:40,74 --> 00:23:48,81 something like gunge that that you know I bet that's I think it's nice that know about this I went to the parlor with 223 00:23:48,82 --> 00:23:51,56 the biggest Yellow Pages in Cleveland when I was eighteen 224 00:23:52,42 --> 00:23:58,86 and I just picked some question off the well that turned out to be their own their band logo so I got it as they hit 225 00:23:58,87 --> 00:24:10,18 the tattoo. Well there we're. Really. Beautiful That is you know. Dancing in the same at two in the same place even. 226 00:24:11,20 --> 00:24:16,84 Wow That's right dancing has annoyed and has to that's so weird. 227 00:24:18,94 --> 00:24:26,01 Wow they're actually a band I really like and they're a band also that cured my migraine. 228 00:24:28,30 --> 00:24:30,09 I went to Google migraine are for ever. 229 00:24:31,54 --> 00:24:34,51 Well you know that's a good question I don't get them nearly as much as I used to 230 00:24:34,52 --> 00:24:39,59 but I get them you see at them quite often because I never slept and was not healthy but. 231 00:24:40,71 --> 00:24:41,84 Maybe I just got them more often 232 00:24:41,85 --> 00:24:48,73 but I had committed to see the band with this guy who I didn't know really well who was from out of town 233 00:24:49,58 --> 00:24:51,91 and he was a klutz go see the show so I was like OK 234 00:24:51,92 --> 00:24:57,96 and I had a quick killer migraine like I was dying I had like vomited outside the show I was like dying 235 00:24:57,97 --> 00:25:01,86 but I was like I'm going to tough it out I don't want to like sell this person out so I go in 236 00:25:02,09 --> 00:25:07,08 and like literally they came on in like ten minutes later I was like I feel great. 237 00:25:08,21 --> 00:25:11,61 And so I attribute it to them and if you've. 238 00:25:12,66 --> 00:25:15,56 Listeners if you have not heard this banner not really a They're a band 239 00:25:15,57 --> 00:25:18,52 and most people associate with a migraine not curing a migraine 240 00:25:18,53 --> 00:25:23,18 but I like the it really play the electronic shopping cart which is oh. 241 00:25:24,43 --> 00:25:30,22 Yeah OK so you know what I'm getting weary excited here Meghan was talking about C.N.N. 242 00:25:30,57 --> 00:25:40,18 and I believe we're talking about the. Device on the bottom of a shopping cart we are. So yeah there's. 243 00:25:42,36 --> 00:25:45,76 So here and then combining that with a theorem and. 244 00:25:47,29 --> 00:25:50,43 So that's interesting so is this a theorem in kids that's not a true theorem 245 00:25:50,44 --> 00:26:00,22 but rather just a light sensor that's correct. They always get you in the marketing they do. Yes So in this video. 246 00:26:00,98 --> 00:26:03,32 We're going to work what do you make of the video. 247 00:26:05,85 --> 00:26:08,15 It's well first of all it's very 248 00:26:08,55 --> 00:26:15,52 and this may be a very gendered expect it's very cute it's like you sound like well it's a little robot they me making 249 00:26:15,53 --> 00:26:21,46 little chirping noises and there's a light on it and I'm just I want to put it in a blanket 250 00:26:22,21 --> 00:26:30,72 and take it we're both dead so I don't think that's incompatible with their experience yeah. It's. 251 00:26:31,91 --> 00:26:38,09 Yeah it's what it's OK So there's the little white in the center there's a little way P.C.B. 252 00:26:38,10 --> 00:26:41,63 Board with which has like one. 253 00:26:43,64 --> 00:26:49,74 Button on it and a couple of compact No no there's a third is inside there and a capacitor yep yep 254 00:26:50,58 --> 00:26:55,84 and then there's a beaker on one side and another green P.C.B. 255 00:26:55,85 --> 00:27:02,11 Board which is connected to the shopping cart you're going to make a guess that the green P.C.B. 256 00:27:02,12 --> 00:27:08,71 Was what he pulled out of the the device that thing that locks up the wheel OK And then there's the nine volt that 257 00:27:08,96 --> 00:27:20,52 someone is holding it's very good so it's a very. Intimate little sir. So if so is this is this you can defeat the. 258 00:27:21,95 --> 00:27:27,94 The anti-theft of a special meaning a light though on the false there remember is that we're seeing nobody 259 00:27:27,99 --> 00:27:28,62 but you're close 260 00:27:28,63 --> 00:27:36,12 and so I can describe what I did so so with the help of Ian from last episode we came upon found I try next 261 00:27:36,13 --> 00:27:41,15 and then two days two nights later I was walking down the street and I were walking down the street 262 00:27:41,55 --> 00:27:47,92 and I was like oh the shopping cart in our corner and I was like oh it's got one of those locking wheel things and. 263 00:27:50,58 --> 00:27:53,42 And I thought and I kind of walked past it was like. 264 00:27:55,52 --> 00:28:00,22 I wonder if I should do something else you know I mean I was like OK I'm going to go for it. 265 00:28:00,33 --> 00:28:07,35 And the reason I kind of one of these I pass' this project is a little bit of a revisitation for me because in two 266 00:28:07,36 --> 00:28:16,91 thousand and two. Was the first time I took one apart and kind of tried to figure out how it works and stuff. And. 267 00:28:19,46 --> 00:28:27,53 What is awesome is the best description I've ever seen of how it works was created by this person Nolan blender 268 00:28:27,66 --> 00:28:34,28 and he he built a web page back in February of two thousand called Reversing the operation of the caps shopping cart 269 00:28:34,29 --> 00:28:36,24 wheel locks and that he just. 270 00:28:37,89 --> 00:28:40,41 He had that page is still live 271 00:28:40,42 --> 00:28:47,36 and untouched from two thousand on the Internet which made me was super happy I was like so psyched that a page that I 272 00:28:47,37 --> 00:28:53,56 looked at fifteen years ago is still exactly as it was before it's the power of just pure H.T.M.L. 273 00:28:53,60 --> 00:28:57,32 You know it's like there's no and yeah it's just it's just hanging out. 274 00:29:01,24 --> 00:29:09,02 So I had been interested in it and hacking the shopping cart wheel because I was inspired by this. 275 00:29:10,59 --> 00:29:16,84 These actions called the world Mart actions in a world Mart it's where these actions done inside of Wal-Mart's by this 276 00:29:16,85 --> 00:29:20,98 trip called the breeding planet troop in the early two thousand and maybe two thousand and one 277 00:29:21,49 --> 00:29:25,50 and they would just go into Wal-Mart and everyone would get a cart 278 00:29:25,51 --> 00:29:32,64 and just have a parade inside of Wal-Mart as a kind of like a way to confuse the shopping experience 279 00:29:32,65 --> 00:29:37,55 or sort of confuse what what people who are at Wal-Mart for. 280 00:29:39,20 --> 00:29:42,70 And and also to sort of confound the security guards and stuff 281 00:29:42,71 --> 00:29:46,16 and so I was really interested in seeing like oh maybe you could. 282 00:29:47,61 --> 00:29:49,31 Do like a stop shopping action 283 00:29:49,32 --> 00:29:58,49 and find a way to with a radio transmitter activate all the shopping cart wheel locks at once so so everyone in the 284 00:29:58,50 --> 00:30:03,59 store would just have to likely. Really stop shopping because the wheel got stuck I found out. 285 00:30:04,61 --> 00:30:07,07 I found out that's not actually totally feasible so. 286 00:30:08,44 --> 00:30:12,52 But you know you have to broadcast that radio signal right yeah 287 00:30:12,53 --> 00:30:17,79 and the signals it's only eight kilohertz which is in the audio spectrum which 288 00:30:17,83 --> 00:30:20,90 but that also I'm not great like our friends near anything 289 00:30:20,91 --> 00:30:26,99 but as I understand it like it would be very difficult to actually broadcast a signal at that frequency. 290 00:30:28,19 --> 00:30:35,43 With a lot of power to sort of blanket if you if you will the the wall or in that signal to to trip that will ox. 291 00:30:37,30 --> 00:30:39,23 I also thought would be cool to make unlocker. 292 00:30:40,26 --> 00:30:43,44 This is kind of naive but like I was like oh if you could make an unlock 293 00:30:43,45 --> 00:30:49,59 or you could sort of distribute the on lockers to people who need a shopping cart and they could just go get one but. 294 00:30:51,48 --> 00:30:54,07 But anyway so that was sort of my original interest 295 00:30:54,08 --> 00:31:02,58 and so then I was like now it you know so then a week two weeks ago I was like oh I have a shopping cart wheel do I go 296 00:31:02,59 --> 00:31:05,92 down this path and I started to look and there was like tons of Instructables 297 00:31:05,93 --> 00:31:09,16 and stuff now you know who's sort of in much more meticulous 298 00:31:09,17 --> 00:31:14,29 and interesting detail than I could ever do show how it works and show how it can be unlocked 299 00:31:14,30 --> 00:31:17,30 and show it can be locks and stuff and so I was like well how do I then. 300 00:31:18,73 --> 00:31:22,00 Maybe just make the shopping cart an interesting different thing. 301 00:31:24,09 --> 00:31:27,93 And so I was like maybe I can make a shopping cart and instrument and so I. 302 00:31:29,91 --> 00:31:35,08 Thought like well I have this there I'm in kit that I got from my housemates William and Sandra for my birthday 303 00:31:35,15 --> 00:31:38,58 and I've just been kind of sitting on it and I hadn't opened it and I was like I really want to do something this 304 00:31:38,59 --> 00:31:45,14 but I haven't done it yet and then I was like I can make this the shopping cart and I Theron and Micah the whole thing. 305 00:31:47,01 --> 00:31:55,53 And because like as I understand it you know there are men as sort of has an antenna and and knows where your hand. 306 00:31:56,74 --> 00:32:00,22 Is and sort of proximity. And then out. 307 00:32:00,44 --> 00:32:03,41 But you could like turn the whole shopping cart into it there 308 00:32:03,42 --> 00:32:10,13 and so anyone who who leaves the store not only doesn't get a locked wheel they get to turn their whole shopping cart 309 00:32:10,14 --> 00:32:10,89 into an instrument. 310 00:32:12,62 --> 00:32:17,53 And that they would sort of have this musical instrument that's that's unleashed when they steal the cart. 311 00:32:19,45 --> 00:32:26,55 And so you're not only getting a shopping cart you're getting this instrument along with it so I was going to take this 312 00:32:26,78 --> 00:32:32,16 electronic gob of stuff and reverse shoplift it back onto a cart at the grocery store 313 00:32:32,17 --> 00:32:39,97 and I'd still like to do that so to return the wheel back to a cart so if that cart is ever stolen they would get 314 00:32:40,85 --> 00:32:44,90 they'll get a musical instrument but there was a big failure baked into all this 315 00:32:45,10 --> 00:32:51,77 and that is that there meant that I had is not a true theorem and OK Let your point it is it is. 316 00:32:53,80 --> 00:33:03,26 Off since if I have time or that is. Modulating did a photo resistor and I was like damn it like. 317 00:33:04,30 --> 00:33:10,24 I really thought like oh if it's a if it's that there I mean I could turn the whole shopping cart itself into it there 318 00:33:10,25 --> 00:33:12,34 are men but now I have this photo resister 319 00:33:12,35 --> 00:33:18,40 but I was like oh I know what I could do I could put the photo resistor on the side of the wheel so as you move the 320 00:33:18,41 --> 00:33:24,61 cart back and forth the shadow and late will still module eight the we the sound coming from the wheel. 321 00:33:26,31 --> 00:33:28,30 And so it's still sort of that there are men. 322 00:33:30,10 --> 00:33:36,20 Embedded inside of this what used to be a security device turned into a musical instrument so yeah that's what I mean 323 00:33:36,92 --> 00:33:45,61 let's talk about you know what I love it. Thanks it was it was it was a lot of failures combined into something that. 324 00:33:46,73 --> 00:33:48,18 Came out you know pretty good 325 00:33:48,19 --> 00:33:54,49 but I think I think that's the true nature of hockey rink like I think in this current climate like hackers you're sort 326 00:33:54,50 --> 00:34:00,22 of we want to you know take your bank accounts or your government or whatever but like there's this there's. 327 00:34:00,37 --> 00:34:09,01 Early sounds like you just want to interrupts reality yeah with more beauty then you realize isn't capsulated in the 328 00:34:09,02 --> 00:34:11,22 technology that's just sitting on top of you. 329 00:34:12,92 --> 00:34:16,09 Totally like being to sitting there kind of being incredibly boring 330 00:34:16,41 --> 00:34:23,63 and suppressive in a way right instead of being awesome Yes yes teaching a web design class 331 00:34:23,67 --> 00:34:30,68 and it was some dude crim Turkey figured out how to hack like three billion Wordpress sites at the same time 332 00:34:31,36 --> 00:34:31,98 and he just. 333 00:34:33,09 --> 00:34:37,59 A gift of Ataturk standing there at the Turkish flag waving the back room 334 00:34:38,05 --> 00:34:44,10 and so we'll just show the source on it like talked about a stage T M L And yet I think that it's. 335 00:34:46,67 --> 00:34:52,79 To Megan's point about natural systems and technology as a new type of natural system. 336 00:34:54,21 --> 00:34:56,13 You just get in there and see what can be done 337 00:34:56,21 --> 00:35:02,44 and I mean I am sure we all felt the same pressures working on these because you want them to be good with a capital G. 338 00:35:02,45 --> 00:35:08,16 but That. The undertaking itself is a big part of the result you know I'm going to share. 339 00:35:09,32 --> 00:35:19,34 Some photos give me one second. I don't. Want to. 340 00:35:23,55 --> 00:35:28,34 Basically what I did was I created a which is ladder and so Rob 341 00:35:28,35 --> 00:35:35,36 and I had a conversation last week we're kind of touching base about this and. Question about letting up your first. 342 00:35:36,58 --> 00:35:44,07 Right and with the end we know like you can do that immediately right like you just stick it into the pen and sister 343 00:35:44,08 --> 00:35:48,12 and you plug the computer you type in and you're done 344 00:35:48,13 --> 00:35:52,53 but back in our day like you had to learn how to breadboard work 345 00:35:52,57 --> 00:35:58,20 or you know to go to the earlier example like how to use alligator clips and solder together wire 346 00:35:58,21 --> 00:36:00,22 and all these sorts of things and in. 347 00:36:00,57 --> 00:36:07,19 There's a real materiality to working with electronics to working with electricity and and that leads 348 00:36:07,20 --> 00:36:08,91 and code eventually. 349 00:36:09,96 --> 00:36:17,16 And so that was like something I just kind of like stuck in me and I'm like I want to revisit that so I. 350 00:36:18,17 --> 00:36:24,77 Build this which is laughter which is that it's a kind of spell where you basically take string and feathers 351 00:36:24,78 --> 00:36:28,84 and maybe some sticks or some other stuff and you work a spell materially through this. 352 00:36:30,99 --> 00:36:40,60 Through this object but I was like I'm going to light up an L E D you know using electricity for Cato like you do. 353 00:36:43,08 --> 00:36:50,40 And use wire and so here's here's the potato I'm using And here's what you guys can describe what you're seeing in. 354 00:36:51,46 --> 00:36:56,60 Taylor dive and. Seeing that the first picture has a really. 355 00:36:58,98 --> 00:37:05,42 You know I think the pictures I were taking were were really descriptive whereas this is bore of the photograph as 356 00:37:05,43 --> 00:37:06,79 opposed to documentation 357 00:37:06,80 --> 00:37:14,65 and so there's sunlight falling out of wooden table in a sort of evocative wire object that has been. 358 00:37:15,81 --> 00:37:20,28 Weaved so to speak so that it can contain it looks like some chicken legs 359 00:37:20,29 --> 00:37:24,21 and then what we now know to be a potato hole that wasn't immediately obvious to me 360 00:37:25,03 --> 00:37:32,22 and so it's this long skinny kind of dragon or a snake looking form and part of it terminates I believe 361 00:37:32,23 --> 00:37:33,65 and suppose over a bowl. 362 00:37:34,85 --> 00:37:41,73 That has some kind of organic element then once you're well we'll get to that in effect yes I'm just going to keep. 363 00:37:44,08 --> 00:37:48,59 Point out these photos and no one took their order wait now here's our again and objects. 364 00:37:49,92 --> 00:37:58,32 They're up I'm going to let you take a crack at that one OK Yes So the first couple images of the canary snake lake to 365 00:37:58,33 --> 00:38:05,32 me are sort of. Elongated reptile kind of thing or a sort of. 366 00:38:06,34 --> 00:38:12,64 Intestinal tract or something with with things inside it to Taylor point an egg and also a potato 367 00:38:13,64 --> 00:38:16,46 and it's totally a meticulously. 368 00:38:23,33 --> 00:38:31,03 What's the word woven almost in a way like the wires are very interesting Lee intricately sort of twisted together to 369 00:38:31,04 --> 00:38:37,10 create this tube that then has these objects inside it. You know there's a really nice. 370 00:38:38,25 --> 00:38:43,65 Use of zip ties as these are almost a kind of mouth parts 371 00:38:43,66 --> 00:38:50,44 or something that feel like extending out from what feels like the front of the device it's really nice and. 372 00:38:51,79 --> 00:38:57,83 The third image is what looks to be going to guess. 373 00:38:58,89 --> 00:39:04,85 It looks like to be like a vertebrae of some sort not super large and has. 374 00:39:06,49 --> 00:39:18,73 Some sort of paraffin or similar sort of Vaseline looking substance that kind of dobbed on it are poured into it. 375 00:39:19,78 --> 00:39:23,27 And I just want to be greatly we're seeing process so. 376 00:39:24,77 --> 00:39:26,92 These are components that are going to be 377 00:39:27,79 --> 00:39:36,06 and I think the component actually better than the final image just more because of the shape of the objects so I'm 378 00:39:36,07 --> 00:39:43,36 just going to keep well. Really nice from the trial. 379 00:39:45,27 --> 00:39:51,78 And this is again it's the another image of sort of work in progress you can identify some of the components. 380 00:39:55,12 --> 00:40:00,22 We have getting and others Yep so you either have to work on text who are. 381 00:40:01,04 --> 00:40:06,70 Witchcraft and I'm interested to hear more totally Mostly it's like the serpent in the rainbow. 382 00:40:08,99 --> 00:40:16,59 And then in the new we have quills of soap and I know like yes piercing the potato we have we have quills 383 00:40:16,60 --> 00:40:19,57 but also in nails you'll notice the copper enters the nail. 384 00:40:20,85 --> 00:40:25,64 Up at the top because of course we're generating electricity right. 385 00:40:27,07 --> 00:40:34,55 Yet I'm also noticing that you get before I JUST THE WOMAN The Wire was a single strand but now it's apparent it's a. 386 00:40:36,05 --> 00:40:40,12 Wire pier yet it's wood colored to suggest that there is a ground and. 387 00:40:41,47 --> 00:40:47,39 So this is this is what our potato was doing this is where the electricity is going it's going into you. 388 00:40:48,46 --> 00:41:00,01 This sort of had what you guys I think are called in the snake and I'll go with that. So now the vertebrae vertebra. 389 00:41:01,21 --> 00:41:12,79 That's what. Is the thread you look at if you do you can lift it even vertebra so. I love it. Yes So I think. 390 00:41:14,06 --> 00:41:20,12 I'm reminded that you guys plead. Portal to any time recently. 391 00:41:21,36 --> 00:41:26,40 You know I know I know of the portal game but I've not played with you there's this whole sort of. 392 00:41:27,43 --> 00:41:36,47 There it of that goes on with this murderous. Computer woman that's. Kind of compressed into a potato battery. 393 00:41:37,97 --> 00:41:38,98 For a good portion of the narrative 394 00:41:38,99 --> 00:41:45,94 but yeah I guess so I have to check that out Yeah oh yeah definitely I think we're going to get this last image is sort 395 00:41:45,95 --> 00:41:52,75 of the piece in its entirety and again it's I think it's harder to capture because of the length 396 00:41:53,61 --> 00:41:57,70 but you can see sort of mechanically what's happening so let you guys. 397 00:42:00,56 --> 00:42:06,42 I think it's interesting that negative traduced is mechanic would help with a sampling mechanically Rob How would you 398 00:42:06,43 --> 00:42:16,55 interpret that. Yes it is mechanical I think of us mechanical and maybe also chemical Yeah yeah. 399 00:42:19,14 --> 00:42:25,45 So you get the I mean I'm assuming that the this is the potatoes the source of power in a fiber remembering correctly 400 00:42:26,08 --> 00:42:31,99 one of the electrodes has to be a different metal than the other electrode again remembering that right yes 401 00:42:32,28 --> 00:42:39,67 and so you create do I recall the dielectric effect which is the same thing that would tarnish your plumbing if you 402 00:42:39,68 --> 00:42:43,78 were to have two disparate metals touching each other right. 403 00:42:45,45 --> 00:42:48,01 I'm just going to go out on a limb here but you guys aren't stopping me so. 404 00:42:49,02 --> 00:42:53,03 I'm not going to correct you on plumbing technology. OK listen. 405 00:42:54,15 --> 00:43:01,16 I don't know nothing but now we get it hung on the wall and then so the snake form is in a vertical orientation 406 00:43:01,86 --> 00:43:08,20 and now we can see feathers quills eggs potatoes illumination 407 00:43:08,77 --> 00:43:15,51 and there's considerably more zip ties up around what we're calling the head so now it's like oh kind of a wall hanging 408 00:43:15,52 --> 00:43:18,62 but also a lamp or maybe. 409 00:43:19,81 --> 00:43:30,84 Like a fetish of some kind yeah yeah there's what I'm yeah there's like so it it feels still serpent like to me maybe 410 00:43:31,24 --> 00:43:37,39 three feet long on the wall and I feel like the head if it is the head to head is illuminated. 411 00:43:39,08 --> 00:43:44,41 From the inside and there's lots of zip ties that have a very a most feather like. 412 00:43:45,52 --> 00:43:50,46 Like sea urchin almost like a sort of coral reef vibe and. 413 00:43:51,87 --> 00:43:54,14 There are two eggs with the quills and feathers 414 00:43:54,15 --> 00:43:58,65 and I really like that now that I understand the potato I like that the potato is. 415 00:44:00,33 --> 00:44:05,71 Situated in a way that I feel like is a sort of either digestive tract 416 00:44:05,81 --> 00:44:12,17 or reproductive organ area like it's it's in your belly kind of and I like that the energy is coming from there. 417 00:44:13,36 --> 00:44:19,79 And it's sort of being. Sort of powering the head in this really interesting way. 418 00:44:21,36 --> 00:44:26,83 It's reminding the there's this artist Erik so there who works and. 419 00:44:28,91 --> 00:44:34,57 I met him through folks at the signal culture residency if you guys haven't seen that check it out it's in New York 420 00:44:34,58 --> 00:44:38,49 but they he was doing this like a live video modulations 421 00:44:38,72 --> 00:44:43,02 but he had a piece that was called a ceremony to cleanse neoliberalism. 422 00:44:44,46 --> 00:44:51,94 That's a yeah I totally want to hear more because the witchcraft areas where I'm completely informed so I'd like to I'm 423 00:44:51,95 --> 00:44:55,10 assuming there's references in here that are just could totally go to my head. 424 00:44:58,04 --> 00:45:06,39 Well I mean yes there are a lot of there are a lot of references again which is latter is the thing I'm referencing the 425 00:45:06,40 --> 00:45:15,35 most and that's that's a form of spell work where you you take string thread some kind of fiber 426 00:45:15,70 --> 00:45:22,83 and it's generally woven down maybe like a braid were just tied and there's usually sticks 427 00:45:22,84 --> 00:45:28,13 and feathers that are used in it and it's and it's a spell it's and. 428 00:45:29,14 --> 00:45:34,07 I think for people who don't practice witchcraft you know it's sort of this. 429 00:45:35,88 --> 00:45:37,05 This other thing 430 00:45:37,09 --> 00:45:43,82 but I think for those who practice it's just it's like career proceeds it's it's just a way of concentrating either an 431 00:45:43,83 --> 00:45:46,30 intention or and for me 432 00:45:46,31 --> 00:45:53,59 and I think for a lot of contemporary which is it's a lot about healing it's almost it's you know it's medicine it's I 433 00:45:53,60 --> 00:45:59,38 you know in the same way that meditation is the thing that we sort of all acknowledge is like just chill out breed. 434 00:46:00,29 --> 00:46:06,37 And in the same way you know there's there's just a little task that helps you go round an intentional ground something 435 00:46:06,38 --> 00:46:09,58 you're trying to do and so which is ladders our way of doing that 436 00:46:09,59 --> 00:46:14,93 and they may have this kind of a static of being this a long thing with feather sticking out 437 00:46:15,08 --> 00:46:23,11 and so for this piece you know I wanted to synthesize that practice that will work with the materiality 438 00:46:23,12 --> 00:46:30,02 or the mechanics or the physicality of building that circuit of that first time you light up an alley D. 439 00:46:30,03 --> 00:46:37,22 In you you understand what a circuit is you understand how a trust it electricity works you understand you know like OK 440 00:46:37,23 --> 00:46:39,13 this is power ground and all these things 441 00:46:39,14 --> 00:46:45,53 and so I think there's something really great in the way that you guys recognize that half of it we're like oh yeah 442 00:46:45,57 --> 00:46:46,83 power ground we get that. 443 00:46:47,85 --> 00:46:52,81 We've been working with and then this other half of it which is just the task of kind of grating. 444 00:46:54,04 --> 00:47:00,83 And that it was too you know braiding hair that goes to mean that goes to we mean that became computing 445 00:47:01,00 --> 00:47:02,96 and all those things kind of intersect 446 00:47:03,78 --> 00:47:11,71 and that's kind of what I'm trying to capture her where we have the space where there is this like binary computer 447 00:47:11,72 --> 00:47:22,26 culture that seems very ephemeral but it's it's mechanical right. 448 00:47:16,24 --> 00:47:22,26 and you know we can we can talk about like you guys were addressing hadn't figures but there's like L.O.L. 449 00:47:23,27 --> 00:47:26,90 Little old lady now it's a low memory very little lady. 450 00:47:28,25 --> 00:47:35,64 And so these were like the little ladies that were like literally physically creating code with wire that they were 451 00:47:35,65 --> 00:47:41,74 wrapping so you know computing was very mechanical banner it was very what Tron electrical 452 00:47:42,68 --> 00:47:48,84 and you know of course like little babies are good with string so there's that moment where you had knowledge like 453 00:47:48,85 --> 00:47:57,48 computers used to be women programmers used to be women the fabrication practice of computing you know also overlaps 454 00:47:57,49 --> 00:48:00,19 and spaces that are pretty ancient that are. 455 00:48:00,49 --> 00:48:06,85 About basket making they're about weaving they're about you know a little old lady with a couple things that she's 456 00:48:06,86 --> 00:48:07,61 going to get there 457 00:48:08,13 --> 00:48:15,72 and so that's kind of where I was going which is to intersect you know this this moment of wonder like understanding 458 00:48:15,73 --> 00:48:20,09 the mooning how electronics work and starting to work with programming as an artist 459 00:48:20,30 --> 00:48:26,95 but also coming from the history of just you know crochet which I mean I don't do 460 00:48:26,96 --> 00:48:29,48 but I understand it sort of like historically that's. 461 00:48:30,87 --> 00:48:35,43 You know that's a thing we associate with little old ladies not computer science 462 00:48:35,57 --> 00:48:40,27 but they're actually pretty intertwined I think totally or yeah and he ran. 463 00:48:41,59 --> 00:48:45,06 An affiliate of my own reaction because you know I'm ripping a grad school 464 00:48:45,07 --> 00:48:51,16 and doing some traditional brands casting which used to be in my I used to work in there before going to grad school 465 00:48:51,74 --> 00:48:55,29 and people would come to my studio and say oh aren't you put in an early deal on it 466 00:48:56,07 --> 00:48:59,07 and you think like don't fetishise that's the 467 00:48:59,11 --> 00:49:06,27 but here because the electronics were familiar to me I said yes the associate would tell me about this which he thing. 468 00:49:07,71 --> 00:49:14,61 So like I have to make sure that as Meghan was pointing out all of these you know so few of these things are dramatic 469 00:49:14,62 --> 00:49:18,14 to people that are both in the know and out of the know right 470 00:49:18,25 --> 00:49:23,92 and so to want to make that same mistake of holding it as weird or foreign or something you know 471 00:49:23,93 --> 00:49:31,29 and I think I mean I think I'm being provocative in aligning these things you know I would I want to bring people 472 00:49:31,67 --> 00:49:36,44 and I say this is much to my brothers and sisters and tack I say it's my brothers 473 00:49:36,45 --> 00:49:44,02 and sisters the witchcraft lake I want there to be more common ground you know I want to say. 474 00:49:45,24 --> 00:49:55,57 You know in in technology we're used to sort of OK there's a discrete box of the logic system that this exists 475 00:49:55,58 --> 00:50:00,22 and purses maybe in witchcraft there's more of a like this is a ritual and. 476 00:50:00,25 --> 00:50:06,89 As for Healy we're dealing with trauma like those things don't necessarily overlap but I want them to 477 00:50:07,08 --> 00:50:11,43 and so how do you bring those two goals I mean because they're very different goals 478 00:50:11,44 --> 00:50:16,62 and I think that each of them has this mission of each other because their goals are to lie 479 00:50:16,63 --> 00:50:23,85 and you know like witchcraft makes no sense if you're an engineer engineering makes no sense if your wits you know what. 480 00:50:25,09 --> 00:50:28,10 If if you start to put together like well 481 00:50:28,11 --> 00:50:34,86 but you're both those things how are you building Why are you building what's how do you a value weight the things 482 00:50:34,87 --> 00:50:38,00 you're building then you start to create a common language 483 00:50:38,01 --> 00:50:44,20 and so yeah i'm being provocative in putting these things together the same way I'm productive in the way he's gendered 484 00:50:44,21 --> 00:50:51,25 language because I'm trying to create a more common ground so yeah it's cool I mean I feel like it does a really. 485 00:50:52,56 --> 00:50:58,89 Interesting sort of provokes this thing and me that is something that I've been thinking about which is. 486 00:51:01,74 --> 00:51:08,13 I feel like my states of knowing in my states of knowing are only differentiated by. 487 00:51:10,82 --> 00:51:16,37 My own agency where I decide I'm knowing or I decide I'm a knowing you know like like if I'm looking at something 488 00:51:16,38 --> 00:51:18,95 or trying to learn something or or. 489 00:51:20,17 --> 00:51:21,02 Reading an article 490 00:51:21,03 --> 00:51:27,35 or something like like I could approach it like I don't I don't know enough I need I need to understand it more 491 00:51:27,41 --> 00:51:33,93 or I could approach it from like oh I know I know where this person is coming from or I know this coding technique 492 00:51:33,94 --> 00:51:39,07 or whatever it is but just as easy like like one hundred have a second later I could be like oh 493 00:51:39,08 --> 00:51:43,03 but I don't know this other thing that's connected to this and so I feel like. 494 00:51:44,48 --> 00:51:46,90 Your object in a way is doing that to me 495 00:51:46,91 --> 00:51:51,47 and this really interesting way where like I feel like I understand certain components of it 496 00:51:51,48 --> 00:51:58,08 and I don't understand other components of it and I my brain is sort of clicking back and forth sort of like Taylor's. 497 00:52:01,48 --> 00:52:06,24 It's sort of flipping back and sure if you have been sort of the glue that flipping back 498 00:52:06,25 --> 00:52:09,41 and forth between the state of like oh I know I and I get this 499 00:52:09,42 --> 00:52:14,77 and then being like I don't I don't understand it a set off so it's really it's really great like it's really cool 500 00:52:14,78 --> 00:52:19,66 and and as someone right now I'm at work I'm like in the weeds I'm learning this new thing 501 00:52:19,67 --> 00:52:22,90 and like every five minutes I think I'm the because it is in the world 502 00:52:22,91 --> 00:52:25,82 and then five minutes later I think I'm just like a super bad ass 503 00:52:25,83 --> 00:52:31,49 and so like I just like I'm exhausted at the end of the day because I was like oh my gosh I don't even know what I'm 504 00:52:31,50 --> 00:52:32,70 doing but but 505 00:52:32,92 --> 00:52:40,07 but the Such a beautiful place Yes Well I totally you know place to be I don't think I think we're overwhelmed we're 506 00:52:40,11 --> 00:52:43,23 not understand mean we just shut down and I think 507 00:52:43,24 --> 00:52:48,85 when we're overwhelmed with confidence we also shut down yeah we stop taking information in because 508 00:52:48,86 --> 00:53:00,09 when I go I got this and I think that juxtaposition of comfort and. Mystery I think that's a really good space. 509 00:53:01,26 --> 00:53:09,52 And and I think it works best when you're standing next to someone where you recognize that their sense of comfort 510 00:53:09,53 --> 00:53:14,44 and mystery is different than yours yeah totally Yeah that's very smart. 511 00:53:15,85 --> 00:53:23,67 Yeah thanks that all of our projects were for Ken awesome school a good job but still amazing. Really. 512 00:53:24,75 --> 00:53:25,74 Yeah thanks for doing it 513 00:53:25,75 --> 00:53:33,29 and well now you realize Meghan you have one more one more important duty which is what is what should our challenge be 514 00:53:33,30 --> 00:53:41,40 for next time oh man I didn't even Yeah but you should but you shouldn't be prepared this is the this OK I think it's. 515 00:53:42,53 --> 00:53:47,24 Off the top of your What's something that you're interested what would you be interested in seeing other people working 516 00:53:47,25 --> 00:54:00,22 on in the making spear. OK I'm going to have to like talk and think at the same time. So. 517 00:54:00,25 --> 00:54:04,55 A joke well you think I think I think I think stand up comedy. 518 00:54:06,06 --> 00:54:10,17 OK a possible request for what you're doing which make that. 519 00:54:11,24 --> 00:54:15,64 Like that's that's that's where you're going to have to go and yeah what you're saying. 520 00:54:17,91 --> 00:54:23,16 Is that there's certainly a lot of that and there's a lot of it both from Chicago and L.A. Writ that's true. 521 00:54:24,51 --> 00:54:36,42 So give us some place to start. That is also where so that was the cold open you know so screwed Yeah. 522 00:54:39,59 --> 00:54:44,07 Great now cool let's do it there it is stand up comedy I'm down with that. 523 00:54:45,47 --> 00:54:53,75 I have a I have a few listener feedback items that we could go through in a few their ministry to things. 524 00:54:55,24 --> 00:55:02,30 But first before I go on to listener feedback just I wanted to highlight that so so these photos that we're talking 525 00:55:02,31 --> 00:55:07,45 about you can go into projects that opposable podcast dot com to see these photos 526 00:55:07,46 --> 00:55:09,66 and video so you can sort of see what we were talking about. 527 00:55:10,75 --> 00:55:20,10 We would also totally love for you to jump into the challenge with this so if stand up comedy is a thing that speaks to 528 00:55:20,11 --> 00:55:27,30 you in whatever it is whether you're a baker or a knitter or mechanical engineer or chemist or. 529 00:55:28,90 --> 00:55:33,36 INTERPRETER or whatever it is that you do how your life 530 00:55:33,40 --> 00:55:38,29 or interests in life intersect with stand up comedy feel free to take this challenge with us 531 00:55:38,30 --> 00:55:41,10 and send us what you're working on and we would love to check it out. 532 00:55:43,14 --> 00:55:48,35 If you by chance are listening to this episode but not subscribe to you can subscribe to this podcast 533 00:55:48,36 --> 00:55:50,63 and i Tunes overcast at your etc etc. 534 00:55:53,42 --> 00:56:00,01 And we would love for you to become a subscriber we have hit we I'm pretty sure our one hundred subscriber mark so 535 00:56:00,02 --> 00:56:05,06 thing. You so much if you are a regular listener. We are stoked. 536 00:56:06,41 --> 00:56:10,05 That we had one hundred listeners and let's keep it on. 537 00:56:11,08 --> 00:56:17,51 A shout out to the mighty wolf mask you made our logo you can check out his work at will from Ask dot co dot U.K. 538 00:56:17,52 --> 00:56:21,55 He is a really bad person super great to work with and his art is amazing. 539 00:56:23,50 --> 00:56:28,13 We have a patriot on page you can get there from opposable park as dot com 540 00:56:28,14 --> 00:56:35,17 or go to patron dot com slash opposable thumbs we have a few sponsorship tears there that hopefully will suit your. 541 00:56:36,56 --> 00:56:39,34 Checkbook it would really help us out. 542 00:56:40,38 --> 00:56:46,25 We don't spend a ton of money doing this podcast but we do spend a little bit and we would love to have you help us. 543 00:56:47,41 --> 00:56:49,42 We do have a code of conduct here. 544 00:56:50,49 --> 00:56:53,77 In the podcast and also if we ever do Mr Ward anything like that 545 00:56:53,83 --> 00:57:00,03 and just in our lives we're dedicated to providing a harassment free experience for everyone regardless of race gender 546 00:57:00,04 --> 00:57:05,43 age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject matter or religion 547 00:57:05,47 --> 00:57:10,28 or the lack thereof we actively supported inclusive environment and we want you to be a part of it. 548 00:57:11,99 --> 00:57:20,37 Yeah thanks it matters. And it's it's it matters to say it all out a little bit of listener feedback. 549 00:57:22,23 --> 00:57:27,93 David thank you for sending us just a super simple great encouraging message just telling us to keep us going thank you 550 00:57:27,94 --> 00:57:28,45 so much. 551 00:57:29,82 --> 00:57:35,60 Did you know David or is someone is he someone unknown to us or just one of the fellow who Dungeons 552 00:57:35,61 --> 00:57:43,33 and Dragons players so on with the so you know that's a great well known to me Yeah thanks thank you David Federico 553 00:57:43,34 --> 00:57:47,02 also sent us a message that he has created something inspired by the first episode 554 00:57:47,03 --> 00:57:50,45 and he's going to put it in the mail to me and this is awesome 555 00:57:50,49 --> 00:57:56,82 and I'm going to post it on our website so people can check it out it was a really great illustrator an artist here in 556 00:57:56,83 --> 00:58:00,22 Los Angeles he's on Twitter at Wolf cat were. 557 00:58:00,32 --> 00:58:06,28 Happens to be oil F C A T W R K S H O P and he lets a great photos of his work up there 558 00:58:06,29 --> 00:58:11,49 and if you need to know straighter or an artist in your life he is a great contact to have. 559 00:58:13,39 --> 00:58:16,85 This anyone else have anything they want to do before we close out the show 560 00:58:17,39 --> 00:58:20,62 and he links there into videos they watch tools they use anything like that. 561 00:58:22,88 --> 00:58:31,49 Where you think maybe I'm the one rip something I just I want to talk about the sonic experience yet I didn't stand up 562 00:58:31,73 --> 00:58:38,56 so I kind of in the last Yeah I mean it's only about a couple of days that for anyone who's listening like there's not 563 00:58:38,57 --> 00:58:46,29 a lot of time in between hey do you want to do this and and make something but I saw the A month ago last in concert 564 00:58:46,94 --> 00:58:54,53 and that was amazing and I swept through the whole thing wow and then and then Bertha which is I think 565 00:58:54,54 --> 00:59:00,57 when it started was the largest drill on planet Earth it's you know it's boring underneath Seattle 566 00:59:00,58 --> 00:59:09,68 and she emerged on Tuesday and I did have had the no emotions about this drill under the city 567 00:59:10,09 --> 00:59:13,34 but as she was emerging there's this life feed 568 00:59:13,44 --> 00:59:23,80 and it was the most beautiful sonic listening experience it just sounded like like whales made out of machines and 569 00:59:23,84 --> 00:59:26,62 and like I mean you want to talk about an instance 570 00:59:26,63 --> 00:59:32,25 and know about look I mean it was just the SO JUST FEEL experience that was just like on the Department of 571 00:59:32,26 --> 00:59:33,58 Transportation's life. 572 00:59:36,23 --> 00:59:41,57 And so yes so that those were sort of like the two things that really grounded me in this 573 00:59:42,50 --> 00:59:45,41 and then sort of ten gentle to that was. 574 00:59:47,19 --> 00:59:56,13 There's this weird like seventy two hour like audio file of Blade Runner incidental sounds so it's not like it's just 575 00:59:56,14 --> 01:00:00,22 like the weird noises of all the machines but then also T.V. On the radio which. 576 01:00:00,25 --> 01:00:04,12 He's like a pop bands but that somehow like and I've always known them 577 01:00:04,13 --> 01:00:07,55 but like they just that the four of those things just were like 578 01:00:08,19 --> 01:00:13,94 and so I'm just in the room with the wire in the potatoes and it was so it wasn't really anything 579 01:00:14,06 --> 01:00:16,83 and with these props are so beautiful because. 580 01:00:18,25 --> 01:00:22,38 They're so articulated as far as like OK you're just going to do this thing 581 01:00:22,39 --> 01:00:25,87 and then everything becomes kind of input at that point 582 01:00:25,88 --> 01:00:31,08 and so these four sonic experiences just kind of hit me at the same time so it's really nice so I thank you guys for 583 01:00:31,09 --> 01:00:33,93 that wow and it's going to be there 584 01:00:33,94 --> 01:00:40,30 when you you mention Big Bertha tunneling under the city I was positive that you were speaking about something in 585 01:00:40,31 --> 01:00:43,55 metaphor and I just couldn't think of what it would be. 586 01:00:45,30 --> 01:00:51,41 Absurd please that just turned out to be the actual you were just quite literally describing what was happening there 587 01:00:51,42 --> 01:00:58,87 just a giant. I think I'd throw in I've been really digging following. 588 01:01:00,19 --> 01:01:07,89 The Arduino soap opera you get the been tracking this but there was this big trademark dispute when the original. 589 01:01:09,01 --> 01:01:13,86 Organisers started you know like as with all things when it gets big enough and there's money 590 01:01:13,87 --> 01:01:17,72 and people start arguing about origins and ownership and side of it 591 01:01:17,73 --> 01:01:21,28 but I think there was just another thing where the more astute trade 592 01:01:21,29 --> 01:01:27,36 and Philip to Ronnie actually revealed that this new stakeholder I think the new C.E.O. 593 01:01:27,37 --> 01:01:35,04 With or do we know that Lee allegedly you know claimed that he hadn't had gotten these degrees from MIT 594 01:01:35,05 --> 01:01:36,25 and he hadn't actually go out them 595 01:01:36,26 --> 01:01:42,19 and now apparently the only degree he claims on Linked In this is kindergarden attendance. 596 01:01:44,36 --> 01:01:49,74 So again I don't know if weapons story is with any of these details but it was just a hoe starting to read through 597 01:01:50,31 --> 01:01:57,08 and I love how you know technology and one associates it with being cold and dry but but here are these very human. 598 01:01:58,43 --> 01:02:00,22 You know stories to fall. 599 01:02:01,03 --> 01:02:07,54 Another great thing at this conference I was it today the fate conference in Kansas City talking about foundations 600 01:02:07,55 --> 01:02:08,66 and our education. 601 01:02:09,74 --> 01:02:11,69 I don't know if you guys have heard the story but apparently 602 01:02:11,70 --> 01:02:21,36 when brain Cousy was trying to import bird in space you know the stereo reading it into the United States it was not 603 01:02:21,40 --> 01:02:27,46 classifiable was or legally as far as the. What's the word I'm looking for the. 604 01:02:29,45 --> 01:02:33,19 You know the governmental agency that deals with imports but I try to think of here. 605 01:02:34,38 --> 01:02:36,35 Anyway oh well you guys are probably a bit but they. 606 01:02:37,66 --> 01:02:42,71 Say they couldn't classified as art so the closest they could get was to call it kitchen implements 607 01:02:43,21 --> 01:02:49,73 and because because of that instead of being taxed at zero percent because it was destined for an exhibition it was 608 01:02:49,74 --> 01:02:51,32 taxed at forty percent so I. 609 01:02:53,35 --> 01:02:57,12 Would make those are my own why I think what custom 610 01:02:57,67 --> 01:03:04,04 or asked I'm looking for yeah yeah wow that's awesome a kitchen implement it kind of is. 611 01:03:06,71 --> 01:03:12,67 Adequate if I had a couple of things couple things up with things so security bits so I had to. 612 01:03:14,39 --> 01:03:17,89 So I thought I had a set of security bits and somehow they went missing so I got another set 613 01:03:17,90 --> 01:03:22,22 and I was like oh security bits there thing that actually comes in pretty handy 614 01:03:22,23 --> 01:03:28,78 and it's there the word security is a little bit laughable here because it's sort of like a regular screwdriver 615 01:03:28,79 --> 01:03:34,15 but with like a little bit of extra thing and then you've probably seen these like in public bathrooms 616 01:03:34,16 --> 01:03:40,13 or something their screws that look a little funny and oh yeah like a little mysterious Exactly yeah yeah 617 01:03:40,49 --> 01:03:44,08 and so security bits are super cheap you can get them online 618 01:03:44,09 --> 01:03:51,41 or wherever they're quite handy to have a small set is typically plenty I think I mostly see the what they call a 619 01:03:51,42 --> 01:03:56,59 security torque spit which is like it looks like a little Asterix but then it has like a little peg in the middle. 620 01:03:57,65 --> 01:04:00,11 So a regular torques screwdriver. 621 01:04:00,25 --> 01:04:05,23 Didn't work you have to have this sort of extra one that has a hole in it anyway they're there quite handy 622 01:04:05,24 --> 01:04:10,26 and if you are into taking apart things that the designer hoped you wouldn't. 623 01:04:11,63 --> 01:04:13,83 Secure a set of security bits can come in really handy. 624 01:04:15,44 --> 01:04:18,15 I had another thing and I forgot what it was 625 01:04:18,16 --> 01:04:24,90 but I have another thing which is this website called I'm going to mispronounce it even though I've tried to pronounce 626 01:04:24,91 --> 01:04:25,36 it correctly. 627 01:04:27,65 --> 01:04:30,17 You'll be threads there like a clothing 628 01:04:30,18 --> 01:04:35,18 and accessories company in Pasadena which is really close to here run by extra Coghlan named Julie Penn's or. 629 01:04:36,74 --> 01:04:43,19 Her designs are like this super wacky and colorful style that is totally amazing and vibrant 630 01:04:43,20 --> 01:04:48,64 and like kind of explodes off of people I've seen people you know wearing it and it's really great and. 631 01:04:50,15 --> 01:04:56,25 I sort of imagine that my doppelganger wears only clothes made by this person because I wear only Black Berry 632 01:04:56,26 --> 01:05:04,20 and silver. And so I have this fantasy that I live this other life that where it's very exciting clothing all the time. 633 01:05:06,24 --> 01:05:08,65 Can be you tomorrow dude it could be. 634 01:05:09,74 --> 01:05:19,00 Fantasy fantasy is true I might have to into mice I stand up comedy somehow it was a don't dream it be it I believe oh 635 01:05:19,01 --> 01:05:27,33 no Rocky Horror Picture Show Oh you can do it yeah maybe speaking of stand up comedy Oh stand up comedy Meg 636 01:05:27,34 --> 01:05:28,17 and what have you done. 637 01:05:31,12 --> 01:05:38,55 Oh yeah it's great thank you that's a good one it's a very great I was always hoping like people will do like a totally 638 01:05:38,56 --> 01:05:44,24 left field and I think it only took three episodes here when. You're welcome yeah it's great. 639 01:05:45,70 --> 01:05:51,47 It was also curious who we're going to be able to convince to come in on it too yeah it will have to get them to agree 640 01:05:51,48 --> 01:05:58,27 first until a total hole or that. Will give make the email. 641 01:06:01,21 --> 01:06:08,25 I do feel there was great yeah Megan thank you so much your project was amazing and then you guys that was great 642 01:06:08,38 --> 01:06:12,12 and I will be posting photos and stuff online so everybody can see what they look like 643 01:06:12,49 --> 01:06:18,31 and Meghan If you as to close out the have you have a I think coming up in June if you could maybe just restate what it 644 01:06:18,32 --> 01:06:24,54 is so people can talk about oh well so I'm going to be I'm going to be doing. It so in. 645 01:06:25,95 --> 01:06:33,27 Here in Seattle on June twenty first I'm going to be doing something that's also a little indetermined Inc is doing a 646 01:06:33,28 --> 01:06:39,36 series has been doing a series for some time called this might not work in folks like Kerry Hill and Joe Maloof. 647 01:06:40,77 --> 01:06:45,10 You know sort of do experimental like let's let's try this out. 648 01:06:46,25 --> 01:06:52,54 But because most of my work is already experimental I'm sort of still struggling to come up with what it is 649 01:06:52,55 --> 01:06:55,11 and maybe I'm going to try stand up comedy I don't know 650 01:06:55,88 --> 01:07:01,00 but the name of the events is called Solstice we might talk about hedges or resistance 651 01:07:01,36 --> 01:07:05,50 and so maybe it'll be just a straight forward like artist presentation 652 01:07:05,51 --> 01:07:10,32 and maybe I'm going to try some jokes I'm not sure yet but that's going to be June twenty first here in Seattle 653 01:07:10,33 --> 01:07:13,78 and awesome So if you're in Seattle June twenty first get check it up. 654 01:07:15,09 --> 01:07:20,98 Well Meghan thanks so much in two weeks listeners will be back with stand up comedy We hope so. 655 01:07:23,16 --> 01:07:34,53 You know everybody from a good night thanks Meghan outro music goes here. Eventually. Maybe. In the future. 656 01:07:36,05 --> 01:07:46,06 If we have a future we made more than one hour past where we were before I guess that counts for something. Right. 657 01:07:49,54 --> 01:07:59,69 Yeah. I think we did. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:01,39 --> 00:00:07,12 Hey if you want to rob just a quick note for the pod cast starts in this episode we talk about the weirdness 2 00:00:07,13 --> 00:00:10,55 and gross miss that is the Internet and so there's some explicit language 3 00:00:11,03 --> 00:00:22,85 and other things in parts of this episode so just wanted to give a heads up there thanks for listening. 4 00:00:16,38 --> 00:00:27,39 and enjoy the show. Intro music goes here. Eventual E. Maybe. In the future. 5 00:00:28,91 --> 00:00:35,25 If we have a future let's pretend we have a future. OK. 6 00:00:36,29 --> 00:00:41,59 Let's do this welcome to the opposable thumbs pod cast opposable thumbs as a past where Taylor 7 00:00:41,60 --> 00:00:45,84 and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 8 00:00:45,85 --> 00:00:54,44 and lessons learned we're joined by this episode's guest Nick Bontrager Greetings NICK Hi I'm very happy to be here 9 00:00:54,98 --> 00:01:02,92 and I've really enjoyed listening to the first few episodes on excited to be officially guest number four Yeah yeah I 10 00:01:02,93 --> 00:01:11,23 think does that make him the first guest that's in the know because he's he's kind of looked at the past materials Oh 11 00:01:11,24 --> 00:01:20,99 it might be that's true I think that's I think that's OK too once I was invited to kind of do my due diligence do my 12 00:01:21,00 --> 00:01:27,30 research it helps also look for Henson clues I don't know if it's the same podcast if we're prepared 13 00:01:27,69 --> 00:01:32,26 but I don't know maybe it's a new day for us so let's see what happens. 14 00:01:33,97 --> 00:01:41,60 For those of you don't know my name is Rob Bray I run the exoskeleton arts based in Los Angeles which hosts infrequent 15 00:01:41,61 --> 00:01:42,57 openings and events 16 00:01:42,58 --> 00:01:48,55 and I also run the exoskeletal newsletter which is a little bit less infrequent e-mail newsletter I send out 17 00:01:48,60 --> 00:01:53,44 and I'm an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 18 00:01:54,98 --> 00:02:00,95 And I'm Taylor and I'm based in Chicago and many artists an engineer and. This and that. 19 00:02:01,41 --> 00:02:08,98 Nick was just alluding to the fact that Nick and I met at a conference in Kansas City a couple weeks ago 20 00:02:09,10 --> 00:02:17,36 and wherein he and I went out to get ribs we each ordered a whole rack of ribs he ate like three of his 21 00:02:17,37 --> 00:02:22,09 and then gave the rest to me and I think yes so I wound up like various very sad 22 00:02:22,10 --> 00:02:29,29 and happy at the same time in my hotel room later as say as I tore through those leftovers Anyway I feel like I need to 23 00:02:29,48 --> 00:02:38,60 jump in though because more than three I mean there was this like there were a lot of side of potato salad 24 00:02:38,61 --> 00:02:48,78 and we were sharing multiple things you know so I think I handled it OK You know you did a great job which you know you 25 00:02:48,79 --> 00:02:54,88 knew your limits I also knew I was about to get on a long flight so I was kind of weary about how much meat do I really 26 00:02:54,89 --> 00:02:56,09 want to my body. 27 00:02:58,26 --> 00:03:04,50 What we were in at that lunch we discussed many things but one of them was the way that as a 28 00:03:05,20 --> 00:03:10,33 and maybe you guys can reflect on this experience ephemera membrane correctly but the way that you do demonstrations 29 00:03:10,34 --> 00:03:13,91 and classy and Photoshop or video editing or whatever 30 00:03:13,95 --> 00:03:21,20 and you're trying to come up with demo material that that does not risk overtaking your students creativity in any way 31 00:03:21,55 --> 00:03:25,52 so for example my response was always just to Google the word guy 32 00:03:26,21 --> 00:03:30,71 and then like this for a long time this one particular ninety's rap group always came up 33 00:03:30,72 --> 00:03:33,74 and then I could just do my Photoshop manipulations on that 34 00:03:33,75 --> 00:03:38,39 and not fear that every student in the class would would just do guys 35 00:03:38,47 --> 00:03:47,81 and Nick years with pizza is that right mine is usually pizza just because I tend to do my demos either right before 36 00:03:47,82 --> 00:03:53,48 or right after lunch time and so it's usually something you know goal on my dream board 37 00:03:53,96 --> 00:04:00,95 but I'm also it's become something that almost everybody can identify with or at least. 38 00:04:01,01 --> 00:04:02,92 Has a stance on 39 00:04:03,60 --> 00:04:09,26 and so for my students it's really great because then they just start saying Well have you ever been to this pizza 40 00:04:09,27 --> 00:04:10,28 place if you're going to speak. 41 00:04:11,50 --> 00:04:19,31 But I also tend to go to my other demo Google search which is dogs on skateboards and that comes from. 42 00:04:21,85 --> 00:04:25,89 Artist Matt Kenyon my friend who teaches it now 43 00:04:26,37 --> 00:04:33,50 and he told me a story years ago about how you refused to look at You Tube videos on people's phones because it 44 00:04:33,51 --> 00:04:39,29 organically turns into you know let's look at this related video let's look at this related video 45 00:04:39,30 --> 00:04:43,39 and before you know it there's like dogs on skateboards or water slides or something. 46 00:04:45,43 --> 00:04:51,98 So this is Rob that you have one of these go to use this is like using Google as a sort of. 47 00:04:53,39 --> 00:04:56,89 A creative dice roll kind of thing right where you're just like oh I just got to type in something 48 00:04:56,90 --> 00:05:02,64 and start from there is that yes so I had this problem for example where I was doing a photoshop assignment 49 00:05:02,68 --> 00:05:09,83 and I always be so bored read so I want to do something creative to do so I do this demo where I would turn an elephant 50 00:05:09,87 --> 00:05:16,75 into like a Frankenstein Ian elephant where it had cat eyes and sutures all over its face and bloody tasks and so on 51 00:05:16,76 --> 00:05:23,50 and I feel like if you make a demo that's that specific it just totally zeroes that everyone's brain it's like it's 52 00:05:23,51 --> 00:05:29,87 like magnifying everyone's credit cards so I definitely had it headed in the direction of like here's the demist 53 00:05:30,19 --> 00:05:36,73 simplest thing I can think of and now beating that should be should be simple you would think I'm too O.C.D. 54 00:05:36,74 --> 00:05:44,43 Like I can never win and I'm always like OK so I have to have a prepared video starting place like yeah I can do it 55 00:05:44,97 --> 00:05:48,53 but I think similar to what Taylor saying it sets the bar so low 56 00:05:48,57 --> 00:05:56,62 when I have image that students kind of I think maybe they feel bad for me but. Do. 57 00:05:58,37 --> 00:06:00,95 You know they're kind of looking at each other oh OK. 58 00:06:00,98 --> 00:06:04,34 I'll play along and Google a picture of pizza do you want to give a very. 59 00:06:05,72 --> 00:06:09,14 Quick sketch of what you're doing in where you are 60 00:06:09,15 --> 00:06:17,65 and what you're up to yeah sure I teach at Texas Christian University I run the new media program here so this is my 61 00:06:17,66 --> 00:06:24,54 fifth year they invited me to to build it out of a small office where I started so I've kind of built labs for students 62 00:06:24,96 --> 00:06:27,67 I work a lot with our graduate program in sculpture 63 00:06:27,68 --> 00:06:32,70 and painting it's a free grad program with full funding if you will 64 00:06:32,71 --> 00:06:38,79 or anybody know anybody who's interested we're always looking for applicants and. 65 00:06:39,81 --> 00:06:44,71 I work a lot with our science faculty and engineering faculty on campus 66 00:06:44,75 --> 00:06:50,70 and in the local community so one of the things I'm super interested in 67 00:06:50,71 --> 00:06:55,60 and excited about is of course like Steam outreach for kids are teenagers 68 00:06:55,61 --> 00:07:02,27 and so I do a lot at the Science Museum in Fort Worth and Museum of Modern Art here. 69 00:07:03,68 --> 00:07:10,70 Are the modern art museum in Fort Worth where I kind of will do a lot of workshops with kids are teenagers 70 00:07:11,34 --> 00:07:18,80 or just in general interested adults where we might tackle casting or mole making or video game development 71 00:07:18,84 --> 00:07:25,80 and just yesterday I was at the Science Museum in Fort Worth doing this kind of thing on extreme weather 72 00:07:25,81 --> 00:07:29,33 and had to be prepared and I made like a little hacked red phone 73 00:07:29,37 --> 00:07:35,08 when you picked it up kids would hear you know stories about how people would survive tornadoes and floods 74 00:07:35,09 --> 00:07:37,19 and you know they were really excited 75 00:07:37,20 --> 00:07:42,38 and it gives them something to walk away with like oh maybe I should get in the bathtub next time there's a tornado 76 00:07:43,23 --> 00:07:46,03 and so I do a lot of that on the side as well just kind of. 77 00:07:47,17 --> 00:07:52,95 To get these students or kids are teenagers really engaged 78 00:07:52,96 --> 00:07:56,81 and excited just because I never really had access to anything like that 79 00:07:56,85 --> 00:08:04,83 and I feel like I would have really loved someone super excited. And is taking apart things or showing me a new skill. 80 00:08:05,98 --> 00:08:12,06 I just kind of like a newer version of like that boy scout relationship so you know a lot of I do a lot of that 81 00:08:12,07 --> 00:08:17,85 and then I get to meet people like Taylor when I go to art conferences and talk about my my teaching 82 00:08:17,86 --> 00:08:24,39 or my artwork let me let me pose you a question and see where it goes so themes I was 83 00:08:24,40 --> 00:08:33,86 when I was looking through your work I was wondering about I feel like there is a lot of military iconography in your 84 00:08:33,87 --> 00:08:38,64 work but also there is a lot of humor and I feel like usually 85 00:08:38,65 --> 00:08:43,59 when I see the military iconography it tends to be a little overly serious 86 00:08:43,60 --> 00:08:50,05 and I'm thinking in particular about the signals piece where you head is it is it some a force of the flashing lights 87 00:08:50,09 --> 00:08:50,74 it is you. 88 00:08:52,41 --> 00:09:01,34 Know semaphores the phone or the flag the flags or language but yes the signal lamp is flashing Morse code 89 00:09:02,14 --> 00:09:09,96 and so this was a system where there were screens you could an audience member could text to this number 90 00:09:10,37 --> 00:09:18,53 and then the artist Nick appears on the screen in the sort of dramatic outdoor location in appears to be writing 91 00:09:18,54 --> 00:09:21,68 semaphores text back in response to the S.M.S. 92 00:09:21,69 --> 00:09:26,38 Am I getting that correct that's correct so could you talk about that work a little bit 93 00:09:26,39 --> 00:09:30,32 and then you sort of your interest in the military sure sure so that work. 94 00:09:31,39 --> 00:09:37,67 Is called signals and you can see a video of kind of the walk through the experience on my site 95 00:09:38,41 --> 00:09:51,15 but it's completely rooted in my interest in both kind of cinema and how places that I see or have seen in film 96 00:09:51,16 --> 00:10:00,75 or television or read about in books again this really special kind of aura or mythology enough to where. 97 00:10:00,98 --> 00:10:03,70 Want to go see see those places or experience that 98 00:10:04,39 --> 00:10:13,87 and so that project was essentially me taking I think it was a five thousand mile road trip through all of California 99 00:10:13,88 --> 00:10:23,40 Oregon Washington and basically just making the most inefficient you know route as I could 100 00:10:23,41 --> 00:10:32,96 but it would go through as many locations that I could could identify from you know a love of Star Trek or Lost Boys 101 00:10:33,00 --> 00:10:39,99 or stand by me or twenty and kind of finding all these places that some existed in some were completely different 102 00:10:40,00 --> 00:10:45,20 but I wanted to see them in person and have a little bit of that put in my project. 103 00:10:46,30 --> 00:10:54,22 And like many projects that all of us having gauged in I had to continuously reinvent 104 00:10:54,23 --> 00:11:02,52 or change the project based on conditions so the signal lamp you see in the video is quite large it actually took me 105 00:11:02,53 --> 00:11:13,69 about a year to find because it's from a battleship and it was for in some guy man cave in Washington D.C. 106 00:11:14,41 --> 00:11:24,29 And so I set up like a script on Craigslist to search for keywords through every single Craigslist you know from every 107 00:11:24,48 --> 00:11:29,65 from every city and it took a couple days but it got like one response and it was this guy in D.C. 108 00:11:29,66 --> 00:11:33,61 That was was selling his. Man Cave object. 109 00:11:34,86 --> 00:11:39,59 And so I talked to them and got them to send it to me but in the in a ways quite a bit because it's solid steel 110 00:11:39,60 --> 00:11:47,30 and so I kind of reengineered it and added all these or do we know capable controllers and motors 111 00:11:47,31 --> 00:11:53,02 and you know lights that would allow me to basically hike into the mountains set it up 112 00:11:53,03 --> 00:12:00,32 and then film these segments for the live video and the feedback and then it never made it to L.A. Xx. 113 00:12:01,44 --> 00:12:06,47 When I flew there with like my kit in my recorders and my cameras 114 00:12:06,48 --> 00:12:12,62 and everything I needed to shoot on location so this this like three hundred pound crate that I had made just 115 00:12:12,63 --> 00:12:17,63 disappeared with all my stuff. And I had like my i Phone and my S.L.R. 116 00:12:17,64 --> 00:12:25,12 That was in my backpack and and like a week you know to film something and 117 00:12:25,69 --> 00:12:31,70 and so I had to in the airport parking lot kind of logistically see what was still possible 118 00:12:31,71 --> 00:12:35,58 and I ended up having to film at all the locations 119 00:12:35,59 --> 00:12:43,99 but then set up a really elaborate green screen system in my backyard in Texas that would match the lighting in each 120 00:12:44,00 --> 00:12:51,36 place. So I had to keep track of the time of day and the G.P.S. So that I could simulate it in three D. 121 00:12:51,37 --> 00:12:52,68 and See where the shadows would be 122 00:12:53,30 --> 00:12:58,72 and kind of like move this giant platform that I had built so that it would look like I was there. 123 00:13:00,15 --> 00:13:05,61 Anyway is that is this called signals this is a piece called signals and so. 124 00:13:07,08 --> 00:13:14,28 You know like many of the projects that I work on there's kind of a lot of effort put into something that has almost a 125 00:13:14,29 --> 00:13:21,71 very little impact or you know kind of excitement value just kind of blends in or feels like a set piece 126 00:13:22,60 --> 00:13:26,82 and the root of the project was I wanted to. 127 00:13:28,33 --> 00:13:32,81 Play with the idea of this kind of artificial intelligence 128 00:13:32,82 --> 00:13:38,36 or that's where that line is between what we believe if we're talking to a person or not 129 00:13:38,37 --> 00:13:43,54 and I think you know the best example I can make related to that right now is 130 00:13:43,95 --> 00:13:47,74 when you get on like a chat a shopping website like Amazon 131 00:13:47,75 --> 00:13:57,20 and the little pop up says like Hi I'm Jenelle can I help you and you can ask some basic questions 132 00:13:57,64 --> 00:14:00,41 and just like kind of a Turing test you know can you. 133 00:14:00,98 --> 00:14:06,41 What do you ask before it will say well let me connect you to my buddy or you know when it 134 00:14:06,45 --> 00:14:10,62 when it can no longer use a script to respond. 135 00:14:11,92 --> 00:14:14,80 And so I was really interested to see how how I could push that 136 00:14:14,81 --> 00:14:20,02 and so I used at the time it was a fairly new service but it's called twit Leo 137 00:14:20,53 --> 00:14:33,21 and what it allowed me to do was to use Maximus pea. Patch in that gallery were signals was that would King P.H.P. 138 00:14:33,22 --> 00:14:39,06 Script on my my web server whenever somebody would send a text message 139 00:14:39,11 --> 00:14:42,25 and then it would pass the text message to me wherever I was. 140 00:14:43,73 --> 00:14:49,49 You know in the world as long as I could get a text message and then I also set it up so that 141 00:14:49,50 --> 00:14:56,76 when I responded to the text it would take the my message convert it to Morse code 142 00:14:56,77 --> 00:15:01,85 and pass it back into the max patch to flash the light and change the video and 143 00:15:02,42 --> 00:15:05,54 and so that whole project I totally could not have. 144 00:15:06,68 --> 00:15:13,90 Completed without the help of my friend an amazing coder Joshua Penrose Where's the best place people can go to check 145 00:15:13,91 --> 00:15:21,13 it out. Siri just recorded that entire thing and something she Googled. 146 00:15:23,38 --> 00:15:30,03 And they can they can check it out on my website there's a there's a several you know kind of short writings about the 147 00:15:30,04 --> 00:15:31,52 project there's images 148 00:15:31,53 --> 00:15:39,50 and documentation of the project so you can check it out let's let's share these things I'm so excited yet 149 00:15:39,51 --> 00:15:45,93 and they're doing the first thing yeah for sure so so mine's going to be interesting on our end we're all going to 150 00:15:45,97 --> 00:15:52,92 listen to this audio and but before you play it I'll just set it up for you so some Meghan from last week Rob 151 00:15:52,93 --> 00:15:56,04 and I were talking about this and Nick I don't know about you 152 00:15:56,05 --> 00:16:00,83 but man this really threw me for a loop so I was just thinking and thinking about what to do and I. 153 00:16:00,98 --> 00:16:04,13 Through all these ideas like one of them was just go ahead 154 00:16:04,14 --> 00:16:11,66 and write a comedy set which would have been just horrible just terrible terrible if I did it because I just had no 155 00:16:11,67 --> 00:16:13,35 idea how to enter into such a thing 156 00:16:14,06 --> 00:16:21,40 and so then I was trying to look around at ways of getting at existing material so one idea head was it's relatively 157 00:16:21,41 --> 00:16:24,25 easy apparently to gain access to H.T.M.L. 158 00:16:24,26 --> 00:16:31,49 Five video controls so as thinking about setting up my elliptical machine I've got an old exercise machine with a 159 00:16:31,50 --> 00:16:37,87 little Hall Effect sensor so that it would control the speed of videos on Netflix based on how fast you were running so 160 00:16:37,88 --> 00:16:40,71 that I could like watch comedy videos 161 00:16:41,21 --> 00:16:46,71 but then I'd have to run at a specific speed to make it make the delivery correct and so just like on 162 00:16:46,72 --> 00:16:49,23 and on I went through all these ideas that I didn't wind up with so that 163 00:16:49,24 --> 00:16:56,94 when I finally settled on probably influenced in part from talking to Nick who like I was saying has a lot of scripted 164 00:16:56,95 --> 00:17:01,46 responses to these things I started noodling around with the Reddit A.P.I. 165 00:17:01,89 --> 00:17:08,25 and So that was a way to read it it's all open source code right and so it was a way to get in there 166 00:17:08,59 --> 00:17:15,33 and to scrape out material like posts and comments and so on so I started from the old. 167 00:17:17,05 --> 00:17:24,78 Turn of phrase that comedy is tragedy plus time so I had my little scripts get onto our slash all 168 00:17:25,08 --> 00:17:31,88 and then see look for alternately posts that included the word tragedy in posts that included the word time 169 00:17:32,34 --> 00:17:36,03 and then I was combining them together to see if I could get humorous results 170 00:17:36,07 --> 00:17:39,79 and then the whole thing was read by the O. S. Sex. 171 00:17:41,14 --> 00:17:48,39 Accessability voices so I just have a couple I think I have an example of four different jokes that this thing created 172 00:17:48,58 --> 00:17:55,10 and so if you guys are all on the Select page there we can just all hit play at the same time yeah as you can imagine 173 00:17:55,11 --> 00:18:00,95 it gets it's pretty weird I feel like the one of the things. 174 00:18:00,98 --> 00:18:08,99 But a giant content machine like Reddit is that you've either got really gross offensive next weird stuff 175 00:18:09,03 --> 00:18:15,43 and then on the other side you have like really open hearted very emotional stuff like 176 00:18:15,67 --> 00:18:23,36 and there was a lot of room in between which I was pretty delighted by your good I lost the thread on how what we're 177 00:18:23,37 --> 00:18:26,46 about to listen to yes or so the so the Reddit A.P.I. 178 00:18:27,22 --> 00:18:34,85 It's a script that plugs into that OK it looks it looks at all which is where all the comments are coming into at once 179 00:18:34,97 --> 00:18:41,09 like a read it's like last all that yeah so it's thousands of comments just landing you know constantly twenty four 180 00:18:41,10 --> 00:18:45,78 hours a day so the script it's just a terminal script which will post in the show notes 181 00:18:46,27 --> 00:18:52,13 and it searches for the terms tragedy and time and then mash is together two of those 182 00:18:52,14 --> 00:18:56,18 and then the O S X X S ability assistants read some out. 183 00:18:57,62 --> 00:19:04,83 To potentially humorous effect awesome so you guys are ready to play the Saudia Yeah I'm going to say three I'm going 184 00:19:04,84 --> 00:19:08,17 to say three two one go and we'll listen to it OK three to. 185 00:19:09,26 --> 00:19:13,43 Fuck him and fuck his family he and his wife actively condoned 186 00:19:13,44 --> 00:19:19,56 and participated in violence towards others for having differing opinions the only tragedy is that his wife wasn't 187 00:19:19,57 --> 00:19:25,57 killed as well then his kids would have had a chance of becoming productive and competent members of society. 188 00:19:26,88 --> 00:19:32,84 Nothing not a goddamned thing second time I smoked weed Oh oh boy. 189 00:19:34,54 --> 00:19:43,81 Ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha ha terrifying Here's a post from someone else from two years ago on slash our slash 190 00:19:43,82 --> 00:19:51,32 steroids first you can take Finisterre had fun history either type to five Greek smaller lighter Alpha redock 191 00:19:51,33 --> 00:19:57,45 disinhibiting or which prevents the conversion of testosterone to die he drove stocks or alone for underage 192 00:19:57,46 --> 00:20:03,37 and related hair loss D.H. Is many times more potent. And testosterone lower G.H. 193 00:20:03,38 --> 00:20:04,06 Do a limit 194 00:20:04,07 --> 00:20:11,51 or eliminate hair loss related to high levels of testosterone some people have side effects from Finisterre it I 195 00:20:11,55 --> 00:20:17,65 haven't that I can tell precise blood work indicated test at six hundred sixty eight D.L. 196 00:20:18,58 --> 00:20:20,00 You can wash your hair with 197 00:20:20,01 --> 00:20:27,44 and these are all shampoo nice oral contains ketoconazole which is a mild topical anti-androgen again this limits 198 00:20:27,45 --> 00:20:30,60 or eliminate hair loss related to high levels of underage 199 00:20:30,61 --> 00:20:38,58 and use my Knoxy do it twice a day with a wet scalp this is the active in a so many thousand Radzivill related it 200 00:20:38,59 --> 00:20:43,33 promotes hair grow slash if you are going sickly predisposed to this just. 201 00:20:44,44 --> 00:20:49,57 Started in my late teens by age twenty five I had noticeable thinning hair 202 00:20:49,61 --> 00:20:53,78 and I started using all three today I am in my early forty's 203 00:20:53,82 --> 00:21:02,41 and have a full head of hair this stuff works have you ever heard the tragedy of Darth flag was the wise have a ha ha 204 00:21:02,42 --> 00:21:09,40 ha never have oh no I could not tell us in short what actually happened behind your tragedy 205 00:21:09,44 --> 00:21:17,57 or how you ended up the way you are if it's not too painful much love we weren't having a lot of sex at the time so it 206 00:21:17,58 --> 00:21:24,89 was really hard sounds like a sticky situation you were in had all the HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. 207 00:21:26,15 --> 00:21:32,69 I know I was feeling I have to try limit my play time every evening so I can get up for work the next day I should get 208 00:21:32,70 --> 00:21:38,60 to finish it this weekend and then hopefully get to my backlog I was going to do a second play through on insane 209 00:21:38,61 --> 00:21:40,66 but it's an eighty hour play through out so far 210 00:21:40,67 --> 00:21:46,78 and I have not finished on normal difficulty that will at least double on insane if not more so I might have to put 211 00:21:46,79 --> 00:21:54,55 that on the back burner for now if there is no image there is no human tragedy burnin Kukunoor on the two thousand 212 00:21:54,56 --> 00:22:08,01 and four tsunami Hello never have. Wow. That is where you know. 213 00:22:09,46 --> 00:22:15,10 I was hoping at the end you would try to emulate the HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA. 214 00:22:16,21 --> 00:22:22,04 Ha that we heard it seems like there's some interesting stuff going on with the accessibility assistant because they 215 00:22:22,05 --> 00:22:29,28 even you can tell that they have them draw breath as well so it's still sense clearly so inhuman 216 00:22:29,43 --> 00:22:36,14 but there's some it's kind of getting into my really good Tory uncanny valley territory because they're sort of like 217 00:22:36,15 --> 00:22:44,29 the HA's if you just write out as I did ha ha ha ha depending on how many are in there it'll actually choose to put 218 00:22:44,30 --> 00:22:48,22 pauses in different spots so you can tell they're true you know that they're trying 219 00:22:48,23 --> 00:22:50,86 but it's still you know clearly a long way to go. 220 00:22:52,87 --> 00:22:58,98 And is just putting that through your sound card in terms of accessibility kind of like you say read this 221 00:22:59,28 --> 00:23:00,30 and then you converted it 222 00:23:00,31 --> 00:23:08,61 or does it give you an audio file you know it's just it read aloud so if you're in I think my operating system right 223 00:23:08,62 --> 00:23:14,44 now is ten points wealth point four so I don't know if this would be available in earlier versions 224 00:23:14,45 --> 00:23:19,79 but you just highlight some texts and then there's an accessibility short cut I think it was option escape 225 00:23:19,83 --> 00:23:26,66 and you can choose one of four voices to read and then I installed What was it sound flow 226 00:23:26,67 --> 00:23:32,22 or something like that so that I can capture the sound cards output directly into Audacity 227 00:23:32,52 --> 00:23:42,46 and that's how I got that file. I think there is this really nice connection as well between. How they'll take. 228 00:23:43,86 --> 00:23:54,23 Kids with reading problems as you read it like dogs just read I don't species so that they that's not on Judge 229 00:23:54,24 --> 00:23:56,98 but it'll feed back and catch their hearts then learning 230 00:23:57,35 --> 00:24:00,95 and so that's kind of what I kept thinking about was this you know this. 231 00:24:01,16 --> 00:24:08,08 This computer this voice learning how to speak by talking to me and not another computer Yeah. 232 00:24:09,21 --> 00:24:14,89 Yeah I know this one's different the normal life what kind of what do you think that's great yeah it's so. 233 00:24:17,57 --> 00:24:23,63 There's a lot of overlap with with with some of the things I did so I'll I'll I'll hold on some of that I talk about my 234 00:24:23,64 --> 00:24:25,85 pieces so we can gather but but. 235 00:24:28,05 --> 00:24:34,46 Could you do you have a sense of like how how those decisions got made or like sort of how the piece came together. 236 00:24:36,08 --> 00:24:43,21 Yes So my understanding is the way so read it is incredible as a database read just the amount of material that's being 237 00:24:43,22 --> 00:24:50,41 generated at every moment Yeah and they're they're trying to do this kind of transparency thing if I recall a year 238 00:24:50,42 --> 00:24:53,42 or two ago they had some C.E.O. 239 00:24:53,43 --> 00:24:59,19 That was not as transparent or maybe there is a big message and speculation it was around the same time that the good 240 00:25:00,14 --> 00:25:04,93 or was it the same person that ousted from good head that went to Reddit I can't recall exactly but. 241 00:25:06,01 --> 00:25:09,88 So they're totally into people doing scripted with their A.P.I. 242 00:25:09,89 --> 00:25:15,76 but They limit the number of calls you can make so presumably there's like a thousand comments going up a second 243 00:25:15,77 --> 00:25:20,33 or something and so you're only sample ing those in a really limited way 244 00:25:20,39 --> 00:25:26,35 and I don't think I don't think you really have any control over that so that part of it gets randomized 245 00:25:26,48 --> 00:25:31,33 and then there's some phrases you can look up like L O L 246 00:25:31,34 --> 00:25:34,98 or something where they'll just drop a million of those into your terminal at once 247 00:25:35,75 --> 00:25:44,34 but then the word tragedy as you might imagine was much less common than time so with time I would get I would really 248 00:25:44,35 --> 00:25:48,37 quickly get a response and then the terminal would wait for like ten 249 00:25:48,38 --> 00:25:53,07 or fifteen minutes before a tragedy example popped up so the way that the. 250 00:25:55,48 --> 00:26:00,95 The way that the code was looking for more and less common words was sort of a natural. 251 00:26:00,98 --> 00:26:08,11 Official limits a natural artificial to make sense litter and then ultimately also I just went through there 252 00:26:08,43 --> 00:26:16,28 and some things were a little bit more legible as humor if I reverse the order so I tried not to intercede soo much in 253 00:26:16,29 --> 00:26:23,60 it yeah there is definitely a lot of just total garbage so I try to pick the ones that seemed the most polar you know 254 00:26:23,61 --> 00:26:27,71 so there's somebody going on and on about his steroids regimen for hair growth 255 00:26:28,37 --> 00:26:34,27 and then there's like for example did you ever hear the tragedy of Darth plagues the wives is that a direct quote from 256 00:26:34,28 --> 00:26:39,96 the movie I'm trying to remember I don't know the novels I'm not sure if it's a direct quote 257 00:26:40,01 --> 00:26:48,44 but I know that if I see that phrase I instantly kind of it's kind of like look away like because then it just goes on 258 00:26:48,89 --> 00:26:52,61 forever spawns this really long response right. 259 00:26:54,23 --> 00:27:01,00 Are you talking about as a as a resident read it country person yes yes so you could you could definitely see you could 260 00:27:01,01 --> 00:27:09,30 use these tools to sort of pick up on means that were specific to Reddit comments you know so I don't know if you spend 261 00:27:09,31 --> 00:27:10,25 the time on the site 262 00:27:10,26 --> 00:27:16,24 but there's things after a while they come to be so familiar like I was thinking about looking at the relevant username 263 00:27:16,25 --> 00:27:18,51 comment Rob are you familiar with this you know. 264 00:27:19,65 --> 00:27:25,09 You know so all the user names on Reddit are generally phallic or you know scatological in nature. 265 00:27:26,12 --> 00:27:30,30 Somebody would comment on something and say you know blah blah blah who 266 00:27:30,95 --> 00:27:37,49 and then the next person down would say relevant username because the username also dealt with you know scatological 267 00:27:37,50 --> 00:27:38,47 material or whatever 268 00:27:39,44 --> 00:27:45,34 and of course to lay this all out is to completely crushed to death not that it was funny to begin with the relevant 269 00:27:45,35 --> 00:27:50,38 username thing but once you've spent if you're a lurker like me I just read that site a lot 270 00:27:50,39 --> 00:27:55,12 but I really very seldom participate Yeah but then you become you become. 271 00:27:56,15 --> 00:28:00,95 Conversant in its language so there are a lot of things that sort of break down into. 272 00:28:00,98 --> 00:28:04,83 To Like for example somebody might post a snippet of a song 273 00:28:04,91 --> 00:28:10,26 and then all of the subsequent nested comments continue to play out the lyrics of the song 274 00:28:10,27 --> 00:28:15,14 and it's the kind of thing where somebody apparently gets thinks that's fun but 275 00:28:15,15 --> 00:28:20,56 when you see it your eyes just glaze over it's just like Nick said there's like Whole sections of the site just you go 276 00:28:20,57 --> 00:28:25,30 blind in that particular range of your vision because you know exactly what it's going to be. 277 00:28:26,72 --> 00:28:28,45 So I like kind of pulling that back in 278 00:28:28,80 --> 00:28:34,54 and I just started to do some experiments to like tragedy was so hard to find that for a while I just substituted the 279 00:28:34,55 --> 00:28:41,68 word Trump because they were you know relatively soon you know and then you know so that kind of had it something 280 00:28:41,69 --> 00:28:47,37 and I think. Now that I did that did the work to figure out roughly how the A.P.I. 281 00:28:47,38 --> 00:28:53,92 Functions I'm looking forward to kind of crafting future experiments that deal with not just because it's not just 282 00:28:53,93 --> 00:28:58,72 random it's serial it's all filtered through this sort of Reddit culture that exists. 283 00:29:00,31 --> 00:29:07,14 Yeah that's cool yeah but it is definitely So Reddit is a place that I write I rarely go I'm not really sure why 284 00:29:07,15 --> 00:29:15,35 but I somehow I just end up not over there very much but I did this project kind of get over there for my own work 285 00:29:15,47 --> 00:29:24,49 and yeah yeah I immediately felt like way out of my league it was funny because I felt like I felt like someone like us 286 00:29:24,50 --> 00:29:27,12 someone who sort of came up on like bulletin board culture 287 00:29:27,13 --> 00:29:31,09 and Internet culture like it never felt that weird to me like. 288 00:29:32,35 --> 00:29:35,11 Like the internet in general and tell like last week 289 00:29:35,12 --> 00:29:41,05 and I was a psych whoa this is like there's a whole lot of like social protocol like I just don't know you know. 290 00:29:42,72 --> 00:29:46,05 So that's because you did you violate any and then learn from it. 291 00:29:52,30 --> 00:29:57,34 Yes and no you know I guess like OK I will so Nick do you want to go next or I can go next 292 00:29:57,35 --> 00:30:00,95 or whatever you like you can go next to X. Ray but I just. 293 00:30:00,98 --> 00:30:09,05 Kind of chime in on yeah yeah that your last question Taylor I think it also is interesting that the times I have 294 00:30:09,06 --> 00:30:16,20 learned about that social protocol on Reddit you know the few times I've tried to kind of contribute to a conversation 295 00:30:16,21 --> 00:30:19,37 or or or share something that was relevant. 296 00:30:20,67 --> 00:30:27,56 Almost immediately you know it'll say something like Your post has been removed because it doesn't have you know this 297 00:30:27,60 --> 00:30:35,40 really specific tag or D. Limiter almost to the point where it's the same kind of errors that you get with a compiler. 298 00:30:36,87 --> 00:30:44,18 Or in like processing so even a compiler It's kind of like yeah where is that line and P.D. 299 00:30:44,19 --> 00:30:48,17 Is very similar to right like I feel like every time I go to try to edit something I did it wrong. 300 00:30:49,63 --> 00:30:50,25 And that's in there 301 00:30:50,35 --> 00:30:55,61 and they've been accused of that sort of the nature of the message an evil look at Pedia right is that they made sort 302 00:30:55,62 --> 00:30:59,87 of intentionally made the formatting rules really obscure right. 303 00:31:01,22 --> 00:31:06,50 So I like Taylor mentioned in Kansas City a few weeks ago. 304 00:31:07,60 --> 00:31:12,75 You mentioned you know the podcast and gave me a really cool sticker 305 00:31:13,15 --> 00:31:18,26 and said you know the next episode was on stand up comedy 306 00:31:18,84 --> 00:31:23,91 and you didn't really know what you were going to do yet because it was so. 307 00:31:25,05 --> 00:31:26,67 Far out of your wheel house I think 308 00:31:27,07 --> 00:31:31,16 and I think we were just kind of sitting there waiting for one of the talks to start 309 00:31:31,17 --> 00:31:38,44 and I kind of rattled off like oh well wouldn't it be cool just to download a bunch of you know that the most you You 310 00:31:38,45 --> 00:31:46,55 Tube clips of stand up comedy and you know aggregate what's funnier look for the spikes in volume for clapping 311 00:31:47,03 --> 00:31:55,36 when the audience is gauged and make like the best of the best of the best. So I started doing that for a week and. 312 00:31:56,48 --> 00:31:59,85 I was kind of using you to D.L. Which is kind of. 313 00:32:01,26 --> 00:32:06,33 It's like a Python package I think and so I was just doing it by command line 314 00:32:06,34 --> 00:32:13,44 and I was I had kind of set it up to search by you know the top ten videos that have the highest if you count you know 315 00:32:13,45 --> 00:32:18,54 for the search stand up comedy or something and it would just kind of automate that process for me 316 00:32:18,55 --> 00:32:25,55 and download a really high quality version off the You Tube server and so I was kind of searching through those 317 00:32:25,56 --> 00:32:29,23 and kind of picking through audio files and then. 318 00:32:30,92 --> 00:32:38,52 Something came up where I was starting No wonder there was I think there was a clip from one of the stand up comedy. 319 00:32:40,16 --> 00:32:41,39 Videos where a character 320 00:32:41,40 --> 00:32:46,80 or a character I mean a comedian was talking about the green room they were saying something about like the 321 00:32:46,84 --> 00:32:54,46 conversation they had in the green room or the stress of getting prepared to go on stage and 322 00:32:55,19 --> 00:33:00,21 and so I kind of you know I had been in a few a few like you know green rooms or something for 323 00:33:00,74 --> 00:33:03,79 when I had help with like friends you know shows 324 00:33:03,80 --> 00:33:11,57 or festivals where you're you know like that's where the tech area is so you have to kind of go through that to find 325 00:33:11,58 --> 00:33:16,95 the right extension cord or whatever but I was trying to visualize this comedy green room 326 00:33:16,96 --> 00:33:19,98 and I couldn't really wrap my head around what it looked like and 327 00:33:20,08 --> 00:33:27,06 and I really couldn't find a lot of pictures online that I that I felt like were as descriptive as I wanted it to be so 328 00:33:27,07 --> 00:33:28,33 I got kind of obsessed with. 329 00:33:29,48 --> 00:33:33,62 Wondering what that might look like you're finding out if I could find more information 330 00:33:33,63 --> 00:33:37,48 or architectural drawings because I wanted to kind of see how big it would be 331 00:33:37,53 --> 00:33:44,10 or you know what because some one of them said like it went right to the stage that you just walked out of you know the 332 00:33:44,11 --> 00:33:48,09 door of this green room and you were on stage so I got kind of fascinated with that 333 00:33:48,42 --> 00:33:57,16 and what I ended up doing was trying to recreate that experience of being in the green room right before you go on 334 00:33:57,17 --> 00:34:00,95 stage. And I I well. 335 00:34:00,98 --> 00:34:06,33 I don't actually know what a green room is OK So yes so so I think it's just kind of a general term for this kind of 336 00:34:06,71 --> 00:34:14,22 area that you wait and or relax and if you're a performer where there's kind of filtered access 337 00:34:14,54 --> 00:34:18,08 and there's typically you know snacks or drinks 338 00:34:18,09 --> 00:34:25,46 or something so that you can prepare for your engagement with the public like if you're going to go on Conan O'Brian 339 00:34:25,47 --> 00:34:32,02 it's like where you are before you walk out correct OK that's called the green you know how cool I was assumed it was 340 00:34:32,03 --> 00:34:39,72 something with like green screen like that you're going to get maybe it is yeah there's OK I don't know yeah you know I 341 00:34:39,73 --> 00:34:45,84 think you see that's where the you know like the brown and green Eminem where the classic Guns 342 00:34:45,85 --> 00:34:50,02 and Roses tech writer stories straight that are brown and green 343 00:34:50,10 --> 00:34:55,68 or like I think it I think it was only one color was it Guns N Roses that I thought of anything else 344 00:34:55,86 --> 00:35:01,30 and handling it yeah there you go I think for those that don't know this story read they had it in the writers so that 345 00:35:01,31 --> 00:35:04,43 they knew if their pyro was going to be separate 346 00:35:04,48 --> 00:35:09,03 and I didn't write I believe so it was so that they knew that they read the whole thing and it was kind of. 347 00:35:10,68 --> 00:35:13,80 Like a blue dot test or blue dye test or whatever to. 348 00:35:14,90 --> 00:35:22,76 See if they had read the whole thing so so I used unity to create a space. 349 00:35:23,89 --> 00:35:30,25 And I made a Windows version that I'll share and we can put on the site 350 00:35:30,29 --> 00:35:37,13 and I was I was making a version for you guys so you could actually play it with me alongside me 351 00:35:37,75 --> 00:35:43,37 but it didn't finish compiling yet so I could put that on later so I'll just share my screen 352 00:35:43,83 --> 00:35:48,11 and then I'll kind of we can walk through and I'll talk about. OK. 353 00:35:49,27 --> 00:36:06,82 Here rabbit I think there's something kind of nice a bit having just total silence except for mouse clicks Yeah I think 354 00:36:06,83 --> 00:36:12,13 it makes you to keep those in there it's going to be like yeah probably there's probably like hours of You Tube like 355 00:36:12,61 --> 00:36:22,77 sound footage you know like you know quiet office All right. Yeah. So can he see my screen you know yeah. 356 00:36:23,99 --> 00:36:25,53 Here we go see in. 357 00:36:27,00 --> 00:36:31,49 This you do whatever you need to demand but I'm seeing this whole cluster of posters on a wall 358 00:36:31,50 --> 00:36:38,74 and we're definitely in a sort of ques a photo realistic three dimensional space yet you know what do you noticing rep 359 00:36:39,18 --> 00:36:46,60 Yeah it looks like there's a brick Karun it looks like definite like the back of a comedy club sort of. 360 00:36:48,51 --> 00:36:51,44 Is slightly seedy but like it doesn't know it 361 00:36:51,58 --> 00:36:56,45 or something like like it doesn't think of itself as being a little rundown but it 362 00:36:56,46 --> 00:37:02,76 but it is there's some nice like definite like a basement by where you've got some like sewer pipes. 363 00:37:03,94 --> 00:37:08,19 Running down the side of the wall and some random milk crates which is really great 364 00:37:08,43 --> 00:37:17,11 and a nice radiator definitely has a kind of maybe Midwest Midwest basement comedy club let me let me restart it just 365 00:37:17,12 --> 00:37:24,65 real quick to get sound through the chair so I feel like I can totally smell it to yeah yeah like it smells like like 366 00:37:24,66 --> 00:37:29,22 it floods periodic Yeah. It's kind of the musty. 367 00:37:30,45 --> 00:37:38,28 And it's it's green but only in the Lisa sense of the word yes it's like the weird room they had left over 368 00:37:38,29 --> 00:37:41,68 and I quote We need a green room so let's call that the green you know and. 369 00:37:53,85 --> 00:37:59,93 So so I recreated the space and not sure how much you can you can hear over the mike but. 370 00:38:01,26 --> 00:38:05,05 I'm a going to get really kind of like muffled. Comedy. 371 00:38:10,44 --> 00:38:14,69 Like this voice tells you that you're next like you're on stage in five minutes it's like. 372 00:38:16,56 --> 00:38:26,31 Yeah and so I made this I had this kind of a hole thank you I had this whole kind of. And I made everything. 373 00:38:27,67 --> 00:38:34,30 Quite physics economic not going over trash the green room but I had this kind of imagination of. 374 00:38:36,88 --> 00:38:44,60 This game starting with you having just spilled your beer all over your beer set notes or something 375 00:38:44,69 --> 00:38:52,44 or have accidently dropped here and your notes in the toilet which is overflowing a little bit in the sink. 376 00:38:54,86 --> 00:38:55,25 But 377 00:38:55,93 --> 00:39:01,64 and then so you have this like five minute window because this guy tells you you're on in five minutes to like figure 378 00:39:01,65 --> 00:39:05,68 out your set. So I put this is. 379 00:39:08,77 --> 00:39:14,76 Things like that's the talk back to follow and I even like drew a little penises 380 00:39:14,77 --> 00:39:21,14 and glasses all over the posters to kind of try to make it real See the green room real CD. 381 00:39:22,30 --> 00:39:28,06 You know that couch is amazing where it's I mean there's a couple of things about this I'm really into use of the 382 00:39:28,11 --> 00:39:31,12 coffee table as like that sort of. 383 00:39:32,51 --> 00:39:40,22 Showing the right you know like Poly coating on it it's reflecting the fear really harshly. 384 00:39:41,79 --> 00:39:49,66 And the coaches all ripped up that you know like fabric enough that it probably contains like it's kind of a wet. 385 00:39:50,72 --> 00:40:00,34 Yes any better than that. It's great I mean I feel like so Roebling see a space like this do you. 386 00:40:00,64 --> 00:40:07,25 Do you require that kind of really I mean it's you know it's interesting to me that we just exist in the space 387 00:40:07,26 --> 00:40:11,20 or you know an ocean of play here is one of the open questions. 388 00:40:14,47 --> 00:40:20,42 Yeah yeah it's cool you can kick stuff around so just to describe some of it we're in like a three D. 389 00:40:20,43 --> 00:40:23,88 Environment Unity three D. Environment and jump in if I'm wrong. 390 00:40:25,46 --> 00:40:32,85 And there's an assortment of what's great is there sort of in it I've been a little bit of work community and. 391 00:40:34,38 --> 00:40:36,01 You have these things called Unity assets 392 00:40:36,02 --> 00:40:41,98 and you can get like different things that you can put in a three environments like chairs or tables or whatever 393 00:40:42,54 --> 00:40:45,03 and so but you can make your own 394 00:40:45,55 --> 00:40:54,69 and there is a collection of objects in this room that immediately leap out to me is like a unity asset thing but in 395 00:40:54,81 --> 00:41:03,60 but also done so perfectly well that it's like this collection of totally random objects like like it feels a little 396 00:41:03,61 --> 00:41:06,02 bit like an apartment I would have had when I was twenty. 397 00:41:08,01 --> 00:41:12,98 Like I found this this chair but it only has three of the four legs 398 00:41:13,58 --> 00:41:18,50 and it's like the perfect comedy club like they just threw some for ensuring there. 399 00:41:19,53 --> 00:41:20,58 There's you know four 400 00:41:20,59 --> 00:41:26,83 or five people are shuffled through this room a night like you've got five minutes to get your set ready you you've 401 00:41:26,84 --> 00:41:28,03 done a horrible thing 402 00:41:28,94 --> 00:41:34,29 and now you have no material like what do you do it's a really really great interesting environment. 403 00:41:37,13 --> 00:41:39,86 And so to create Oh all these posters 404 00:41:39,87 --> 00:41:44,18 and things stuck on the wall I just kind of google image search stand up comedy 405 00:41:44,64 --> 00:41:53,82 and I found like the craziest weirdest events that people were were advertising you know this one says like the 406 00:41:53,83 --> 00:41:59,91 funniest female competition and has this woman screaming like her hair on fire. 407 00:42:00,70 --> 00:42:08,79 And there's one over here that says like the mother of all comedy shows and it's something about like grandma's or. 408 00:42:10,10 --> 00:42:18,45 Larry and I have like mothering comedy at the laughters Yeah laughter zone so I just found like the weirdest stuff 409 00:42:18,46 --> 00:42:18,87 and then. 410 00:42:20,51 --> 00:42:28,42 You know I I made these really high resolution things to stick on so in the future if I added this I can kind of zoom 411 00:42:28,43 --> 00:42:28,80 in 412 00:42:29,19 --> 00:42:36,23 but these are just all I just found like a redacted document of Operation Paperclip Wow that I thought was really funny 413 00:42:36,33 --> 00:42:37,10 and so on 414 00:42:37,82 --> 00:42:44,58 and so I just like Smash smash them all together I also kind of love that you know the kind of the essence of Operation 415 00:42:44,59 --> 00:42:51,74 Paperclip was bringing over these Nazi scientists to build our rocket program to help our rocket program 416 00:42:51,75 --> 00:42:57,09 and so I kind of thought about that in the sense of like I don't really know anything about stand up comedy sign 417 00:42:57,10 --> 00:43:02,53 outsourcing it to all these other people I love it also like I feel like the asset store here. 418 00:43:03,73 --> 00:43:08,37 When people create so the asset store and I'm not presuming that even if they come from there but 419 00:43:08,49 --> 00:43:11,81 but the assets are is the place where people sort of can create three D. 420 00:43:11,82 --> 00:43:14,00 Objects and sell them or give them away or whatever 421 00:43:14,29 --> 00:43:18,08 and they're always so loaded with intention like like you go there 422 00:43:18,09 --> 00:43:22,87 and you're like oh this is modernist furniture assets and so you could buy the modernist furniture. 423 00:43:24,02 --> 00:43:26,81 Modernist furniture asset package or you could or 424 00:43:26,85 --> 00:43:33,84 or like a lot of them have like kind of architectural desires like oh you're We think it's sort of like clip art right 425 00:43:33,85 --> 00:43:41,16 where they sort of assume we're going to do a thing with clip art just mini artists just like upturn in this really 426 00:43:41,17 --> 00:43:45,59 great way it's so it's like oh here's this really nice desk 427 00:43:45,60 --> 00:43:49,49 but then like you threw it in this like totally wrecked room and put a pizza box on it 428 00:43:49,83 --> 00:43:52,39 and like poured a beer over the top of it and stuff 429 00:43:52,40 --> 00:43:58,04 and it's like the person who ever made the asset assumed like you're going to be making the next Trump tower 430 00:43:58,05 --> 00:43:59,92 or something and instead you've made this like. 431 00:44:00,57 --> 00:44:07,17 Dungey great basement green room for a comedy club I think going back to the couch to one of the things Taylor said was 432 00:44:07,18 --> 00:44:11,82 it's all path towards the end it was this like really great modernist couch 433 00:44:11,83 --> 00:44:20,33 or something you know that I just grabbed but then I just grabbed some kind of like blue jean jacket texture. 434 00:44:21,44 --> 00:44:26,64 And dropped it on there and so the great polygons didn't line up in it and it just looked terrible 435 00:44:26,65 --> 00:44:32,76 but then yeah after a minute it looked like they had repaired this couch in a green room with about eight different 436 00:44:32,77 --> 00:44:34,58 fabrics so I said yes 437 00:44:34,59 --> 00:44:39,81 and I said I'm going to roles have been in this yeah yeah that's good that's what that's what that was. 438 00:44:42,13 --> 00:44:47,80 Man And this is an area that's totally outside I mean you know you talk about comedy being inside the wheel house 439 00:44:47,81 --> 00:44:50,46 but also working to do a lot of work in three D. 440 00:44:50,47 --> 00:44:52,35 but On its way to fabrication 441 00:44:52,92 --> 00:44:59,81 and so it's just blew my mind the way that Nick is talking about the organic quality of experimentation so you know 442 00:44:59,82 --> 00:45:02,69 going to these Creek created assets 443 00:45:02,70 --> 00:45:10,60 but then modifying them in a way that's not technically sound in order to arrive at an aesthetic experience is really 444 00:45:10,94 --> 00:45:13,15 opening for me yeah it's really really cool. 445 00:45:15,06 --> 00:45:15,51 Great work 446 00:45:15,52 --> 00:45:22,74 and yes really really cool it really the toilets great it's like perfectly haphazard you know like I didn't I would 447 00:45:22,75 --> 00:45:27,25 have never read that toilet as squeaky clean even though now that you mention it it is you know. 448 00:45:28,76 --> 00:45:53,76 There's some nice weird brown liquid in there. Excellent. All right rabbit stick your stuff family and all right cool. 449 00:45:56,38 --> 00:46:12,40 So I'm going to upload. One photo and then I'm an upload. Well. 450 00:46:17,21 --> 00:46:24,48 You know the video so I'm seeing a box with a mushroom cloud on the front of what is that a solar panel it looks like a 451 00:46:24,52 --> 00:46:34,82 it looks like a solar panel with. Like a wood. Brad nailed Wood case holding it on top of the box. 452 00:46:36,09 --> 00:46:43,46 Podium Yeah that's also looks like the mushroom cloud is etched into the surface 453 00:46:43,60 --> 00:46:50,28 and it's kind of painted red with little holes and some of the mushroom cloud. Like a speaker grill. 454 00:46:53,14 --> 00:46:59,38 And then it's also being presented on top of a stop. At table so. 455 00:47:01,02 --> 00:47:08,38 I like how they've branded the red color for something that doesn't get your hand downloaded whole thing go this guy 456 00:47:08,39 --> 00:47:16,50 with his favorite. Still rock in the universe over here. Tell me a bit yeah I have I think I. 457 00:47:17,51 --> 00:47:25,85 Have to start a fire in the morning and keep it going in order to get. Rockets to router Yes Yeah. 458 00:47:27,20 --> 00:47:35,32 I love these built so so I'm looking at the photo here. And it looks like I'm seeing inside of it. 459 00:47:36,52 --> 00:47:40,64 So I can see an Arduino. Yep plug with some. 460 00:47:42,40 --> 00:47:53,29 Kind of a generous amount of cat five stranded cable going to a speaker it looks like there's also a battery pack 461 00:47:53,30 --> 00:47:58,18 that's got blue tape. Taping it to the inside of. 462 00:48:00,48 --> 00:48:06,33 It To get to the inside of the project box and I can see a couple of other. 463 00:48:07,54 --> 00:48:10,46 Barrel Jack connections or audio connections 464 00:48:11,10 --> 00:48:14,87 but there's several small boards I can't quite make out in this first image. 465 00:48:16,05 --> 00:48:24,16 So I'm guessing want to him as a solar regulator Yep. Understand of looking at the images here there's also a. 466 00:48:25,88 --> 00:48:31,59 An image that looks like Rob is tracing the mushroom cloud off of a screen 467 00:48:32,50 --> 00:48:39,37 and there's something really nice about drawing on top of a very expensive MacBook screen. 468 00:48:40,56 --> 00:48:46,39 Because of the pressure that you apply on that very delicate look at the surface through like a piece of paper charade 469 00:48:46,40 --> 00:48:49,71 on the screen and yeah that's smaller did 470 00:48:50,31 --> 00:48:57,40 and rock despite your mention of using blue tape in loving it not a dab of blue tape is there to hold that tracing 471 00:48:57,41 --> 00:48:57,80 paper. 472 00:48:59,26 --> 00:49:07,12 So I'm getting kind of an anxiety attack from what happens if it moves and you can't trace the rest of your line. 473 00:49:08,43 --> 00:49:12,02 Yet and it's and it's a nuclear cloud so I was able to kind of freeform it 474 00:49:12,98 --> 00:49:17,81 and then the next series of images show what looks like a C.N.C. 475 00:49:17,94 --> 00:49:24,31 Car design in the top of the plywood box from the trace drawing very cool 476 00:49:24,99 --> 00:49:36,17 and then just a generous spray paint application to that C.N.C. Carving. And then some more build photos of the podium. 477 00:49:38,07 --> 00:49:44,33 And I'm kind of wondering how you. How you dealt with the overspray haven't quite gotten that part. 478 00:49:45,42 --> 00:49:50,60 Sanded off or did you have some kind of a mask I can't see yeah I sanded off so. 479 00:49:51,96 --> 00:49:56,94 Yes I can I can jump in with a little bit of a description so it's a little it's sort of a bird house sized box maybe 480 00:49:56,95 --> 00:49:58,21 for a very large bird. 481 00:49:59,61 --> 00:50:02,89 But I was that's kind of the vibe I was going for and it has a solar panel on the top 482 00:50:03,58 --> 00:50:07,20 and it's really just an audio jukebox that plays. 483 00:50:08,87 --> 00:50:15,75 A collection of jokes that I crowd sourced off the Internet from friends and family members and various other people. 484 00:50:17,84 --> 00:50:25,44 And. And yes so it so the on the outside of the box is a. 485 00:50:26,74 --> 00:50:32,97 Giant nuclear cloud that I took a picture off the Internet and then traced I just took a piece of paper 486 00:50:32,98 --> 00:50:35,89 and laid it down top of my screen and then traced 487 00:50:35,98 --> 00:50:41,85 and use that to my computer screen as a kind of light box to sketch out the nuclear clout and then. 488 00:50:43,18 --> 00:50:44,74 In this flip the piece of paper over 489 00:50:44,75 --> 00:50:49,83 and I corrupted on to the wood so then the nuclear cloud is transferred on to the thing 490 00:50:49,84 --> 00:50:54,80 and then I just took a tremor out or by hand and this routed. Profile out because. 491 00:50:56,09 --> 00:50:59,31 That's not for sure those was all C.N.C. 492 00:51:00,24 --> 00:51:02,59 Yeah thanks very yeah I really like doing that 493 00:51:02,60 --> 00:51:09,11 and if if there's I started doing that first because I was doing these I wanted to do a C.N.C. 494 00:51:09,12 --> 00:51:14,65 Style thing but I didn't have a C.N.C. Machine and the thing I want to do is quite large and so I was just taking. 495 00:51:16,15 --> 00:51:16,59 L.C.D. 496 00:51:16,60 --> 00:51:21,34 Projector and I projected the image onto the wood and then I would just take trim router 497 00:51:21,35 --> 00:51:24,50 and route out like where the lines were and it actually worked out pretty good 498 00:51:24,51 --> 00:51:30,80 and so now it it's kind of my go to thing if I want something to look a little bit more designed. I think. 499 00:51:32,86 --> 00:51:40,86 If you're listening to this podcast but there are so many lunch cuts in your design where they're not. 500 00:51:40,89 --> 00:51:47,44 Connected and I think that's always scary to me when you're doing that kind of free and trim routing 501 00:51:47,45 --> 00:51:51,69 or routing you've got you've got it lower the spinning. 502 00:51:53,05 --> 00:52:00,71 Plane or surface totally without it skipping your are going off and so that's why when I saw all those internal cuts 503 00:52:00,72 --> 00:52:08,30 and signs and line work I just kind of like no way somebody that owns a sauced up is going. 504 00:52:10,37 --> 00:52:13,61 Into their hands dropping a trim router 505 00:52:13,62 --> 00:52:22,71 and plywood repeatedly Yeah use a rounded bit you know like a I don't know what you call that spherical bit like a ball 506 00:52:22,72 --> 00:52:30,14 knows yeah I guess so yeah and so that is and it's also maybe only it's definitely not an eighth of an inch deep. 507 00:52:32,10 --> 00:52:36,39 And so you've got a pretty it's a trim router so it's not a full size router so it's. 508 00:52:38,07 --> 00:52:45,55 Quite small and pretty easy to hold in two hands and it's really. It's it's probably dangerous I'm going to say. 509 00:52:46,56 --> 00:52:48,69 But it doesn't it doesn't feel dangerous 510 00:52:48,70 --> 00:52:53,29 and I've never felt I've definitely done many stupid things right felt threatened in the shop 511 00:52:53,30 --> 00:52:58,17 and I was like This is a bad idea I shall never I'm never going to do that again or I got away with it this time 512 00:52:58,18 --> 00:53:02,13 but I don't I'm not going to do that you know like you push that limit of the you feel uncomfortable 513 00:53:02,14 --> 00:53:05,00 but I've never it's always felt. 514 00:53:06,36 --> 00:53:12,49 Good I think part of Leigh because it's a tremor it's so small like the bit it's an eight inch size. 515 00:53:14,05 --> 00:53:19,76 Collet I guess you know so it's pretty small and doesn't feel too threatening but you know 516 00:53:19,86 --> 00:53:28,82 and I also like it how it looks but yeah so anyway I am. I so so OK so let me. 517 00:53:29,86 --> 00:53:34,36 Dive in with the description really quick so what I wanted to do is I wanted to. 518 00:53:35,98 --> 00:53:39,38 You know stand up comedy Meghan Trainor our previous guest really. 519 00:53:41,20 --> 00:53:49,53 Gave us a doozy and was standup comedy became our topic this episode and so I decided like OK I'm going to. 520 00:53:51,26 --> 00:53:57,69 Die inside like the first week I was just like so lost 521 00:53:57,70 --> 00:54:03,29 and I was like oh my gosh what do I do like how do you I don't even know how to be funny like I don't know you just 522 00:54:03,30 --> 00:54:05,96 really blackout you know just like oh man what am I to do so then. 523 00:54:07,90 --> 00:54:11,66 Also at that same time that was happening you know in the news media 524 00:54:11,67 --> 00:54:16,19 and stuff like we kept there's been this for the past couple months 525 00:54:16,20 --> 00:54:21,11 but really especially lately this kind of renewed nuclear threat you know. 526 00:54:22,96 --> 00:54:28,56 And I was like wow what this is really freaky but it's also something that is been a part of my work for a while 527 00:54:28,99 --> 00:54:32,60 and so I was like wow it's really weird that this nuclear threat that I had always thought 528 00:54:32,83 --> 00:54:38,35 when it came up in my work before felt very dated or we hear something like antiquated 529 00:54:38,36 --> 00:54:41,53 and now all of a sudden like it's it's a real thing again 530 00:54:41,54 --> 00:54:47,80 and so that was you that just that just means you're getting old Yeah right yeah totally And so I was like OK. 531 00:54:50,00 --> 00:54:51,62 And then I was like Well where would I was. 532 00:54:52,67 --> 00:55:00,38 So then I was like Where would I want to be if I if it was going to if I was like OK well you know the bombs falling 533 00:55:00,51 --> 00:55:05,56 like where would I like to be and then I started thinking about that and then I was like well what would I do 534 00:55:05,57 --> 00:55:06,23 and it's like. 535 00:55:07,62 --> 00:55:12,00 You ask people that question and everyone has a different answer you know a lot of people like I would cry 536 00:55:12,04 --> 00:55:15,11 or I would hug someone or I would get busy 537 00:55:15,12 --> 00:55:18,38 or do whatever you know there's all sorts of things that you think about that you could do 538 00:55:18,39 --> 00:55:23,80 but they would also probably just be this weird gaps in time where you're just kind of hanging out and. 539 00:55:26,65 --> 00:55:31,47 And I was like you know I think it would be fun just to tell stories or tell jokes to one another or whatever 540 00:55:31,48 --> 00:55:40,83 and to sort of. Find a way to become at ease and so I started to wonder like what jokes would I tell. 541 00:55:41,06 --> 00:55:43,38 At that at the end of the world 542 00:55:43,39 --> 00:55:48,27 and so then I was like OK I'm not funny enough to come up with a standup routine about what jokes to tell the end of 543 00:55:48,28 --> 00:55:53,84 the world but like I bet I bet people have some interesting things to say and 544 00:55:54,05 --> 00:56:02,70 and I'll just make this phone number that allows them to call in I use that called burner it's a really cool app it's 545 00:56:02,71 --> 00:56:08,48 like five dollars and you just get a free phone number for a month. Yes really nice and you can. 546 00:56:09,64 --> 00:56:12,79 Get voice mails and stuff in the voicemail as well like sync right into Dropbox 547 00:56:12,80 --> 00:56:22,72 and stuff so it's really really really quite good as it just incoming You can make calls with it I never have I only 548 00:56:22,73 --> 00:56:27,29 have to just set up a voicemail and use it as a way to get get phone calls but it's pretty good like. 549 00:56:28,31 --> 00:56:32,58 I at first was like I'm going to go to Craigslist I'm going to start posting on Craigslist 550 00:56:33,10 --> 00:56:37,19 and see what people reply back with and they they. 551 00:56:38,64 --> 00:56:40,91 They did I didn't get much traction of that and I was like OK 552 00:56:40,92 --> 00:56:45,68 and I was like well I'm going to I also had the challenge of being like I know Taylor on social media. 553 00:56:46,87 --> 00:56:49,53 So but I don't want to spoil what I'm doing. 554 00:56:50,62 --> 00:56:55,08 So but then I was like oh screw it I'm just going to post on Facebook as I think anyway and. 555 00:56:57,19 --> 00:56:59,56 You know devil may care like to just go for it 556 00:56:59,60 --> 00:57:03,72 and because he won't tell you what I'm doing he does have a sense that I'm collecting jokes and so. 557 00:57:04,88 --> 00:57:09,91 I got tons of like a reach we'd send reposed in all this to Facebook as I'm going to have thousands of jokes 558 00:57:10,39 --> 00:57:15,93 and it just never happens you know as you all know like going through this like you know it's like everyone's going to 559 00:57:15,94 --> 00:57:21,24 be into this and maybe they are right but they still never actually do the thing you know so I got like seven 560 00:57:21,25 --> 00:57:27,68 or eight jokes and then I thought I like who's really going to get this piece who's going to really like understand 561 00:57:27,69 --> 00:57:32,45 and come from I was like preppers preppers are going to like the end of this because this is the thing that I think 562 00:57:32,46 --> 00:57:40,86 about all the time so I went on to this website called preppers Forum dot net and. I posted there. 563 00:57:40,89 --> 00:57:53,10 They're into a forum that they call. US foes zombies two thousand and twelve aliens Mayan end of the world apocalypse. 564 00:57:56,02 --> 00:57:59,31 There's one hundred sixty one threads and here there's four thousand and ninety seven posts 565 00:57:59,50 --> 00:58:05,57 and I was like These are my people you know like this is it this is this is it's not the economic precious metals 566 00:58:05,58 --> 00:58:13,44 investing and finance board it's. Fallen brothers and sisters board it's the U.F.O. 567 00:58:13,45 --> 00:58:14,64 Zombies twenty five aliens 568 00:58:15,05 --> 00:58:20,08 and into the world apocalypse board so they're there they're going to be down they're going to go for it so I post in 569 00:58:20,09 --> 00:58:24,97 here and I have never been a member of Pepper's forums dot net or anything like that 570 00:58:25,57 --> 00:58:33,14 and I post like call me with a nuclear holocaust or you know joke or story and I just get immediately lit up like like. 571 00:58:34,93 --> 00:58:37,56 Like no one thought it was funny like. 572 00:58:38,67 --> 00:58:43,73 I got like the moderator was like hello new guy and welcome to the forum there are some protocols around here. 573 00:58:46,73 --> 00:58:51,66 So so there they were like No but it now and then like. 574 00:58:53,80 --> 00:58:59,69 And then you know you get the very gross posts from people from someone like hey you know any hippy chicks that want to 575 00:58:59,70 --> 00:59:06,82 snuggle up in the apocalypse like you like just immediately gross dude factor just comes in full tilt you know and 576 00:59:07,66 --> 00:59:09,26 and then you get the people who are just like. 577 00:59:10,31 --> 00:59:14,05 What part of any nuclear holocaust nuclear otherwise is funny who would be you know 578 00:59:14,06 --> 00:59:19,12 and it's like OK like so I just that was a total implosion 579 00:59:19,20 --> 00:59:24,73 but it was very interesting to at least try to engage the preppers with this project and I did even post photos 580 00:59:24,74 --> 00:59:27,64 and stuff to them like they're going to get it from maybe like a maker perspective 581 00:59:27,65 --> 00:59:31,03 or something they'll be like oh this is cool I have a woodshop like that's in the project 582 00:59:31,38 --> 00:59:35,02 and a couple people were like OK yeah that's neat you know 583 00:59:35,41 --> 00:59:41,61 but really it was mostly just like really gross sexual innuendo that was horrible. And. 584 00:59:43,04 --> 00:59:47,66 People thinking just like humorless assholes you know just people being like like. 585 00:59:48,77 --> 00:59:52,86 Here's someone who's like there's a manual to deal with life after nuclear war that I find credible 586 00:59:52,87 --> 01:00:00,01 and I would read up on that it's like something to it it's like that's not the point so anyway it preppers for I'm told 587 01:00:00,02 --> 01:00:02,68 encourage people to go there I'll put a link to ensure notes but. 588 01:00:04,04 --> 01:00:12,18 So this is like an audio jukebox of jokes Taylor is one of the people who called in with a joke Thank you Taylor Taylor 589 01:00:12,19 --> 01:00:13,80 Shook is definitely the funniest 590 01:00:13,81 --> 01:00:20,14 and longest so I'm going to take this box with jokes it's solar powered so you can sort of listen to it where you want 591 01:00:20,15 --> 01:00:20,36 to be 592 01:00:20,37 --> 01:00:28,49 and I'm going to put it in a place in Los Angeles that is my favorite place that I would be want to be if if the bomb 593 01:00:28,50 --> 01:00:35,03 falls on us here in Austin and excellent That's awesome so just plays on a loop displays them all over 594 01:00:35,04 --> 01:00:41,56 and over Yeah it just plays its cards we know a little just a little quick tech walk through the Arduino really serves 595 01:00:41,57 --> 01:00:46,90 as. This is like a total advertisement for a different box the whole project there's. 596 01:00:48,34 --> 01:00:54,32 A different cells like a soundboard that you can load with Wave files or files or whatever and 597 01:00:54,42 --> 01:01:00,55 and that's what on there the Arduino is sending like a random string between zero and ten 598 01:01:00,74 --> 01:01:07,07 and then that tells the audio player to play for Track seven or Play Track six or Play Track two. 599 01:01:08,94 --> 01:01:14,24 And then there's a little amplifier board there the air makes it's like a two amplifier 600 01:01:14,25 --> 01:01:21,83 and that's what the speaker is plugged into. And then there's the solar part charging part there's. 601 01:01:23,07 --> 01:01:27,25 A small charge controller there's a six volt solar panel and then there's a. 602 01:01:29,09 --> 01:01:34,31 Power booster that takes I think like Poly batteries or what three point six volts or something like that 603 01:01:34,35 --> 01:01:40,82 or something kind of low and so you got to get up to. Five volts to run Arduino and stuff. 604 01:01:41,25 --> 01:01:44,02 And so there's a like a step up comforter I guess as we may call it. 605 01:01:45,35 --> 01:01:48,93 That converts the voltage up to five volts so you can run stuff up there so. 606 01:01:50,35 --> 01:01:53,67 Yeah it was like actually it was like I think you're like oh I'm going to do this one thing 607 01:01:53,68 --> 01:01:56,12 and you're like I have many technical hurdles to overcome. 608 01:01:58,56 --> 01:02:04,02 But which you both can relate to in this in this project oh yeah. Yeah yes. 609 01:02:05,62 --> 01:02:09,31 Excellent man so rubber we we arrived at that time when 610 01:02:09,41 --> 01:02:15,84 when Nick chooses the new the new challenge we have Nick what do you think made all right. 611 01:02:16,89 --> 01:02:22,66 So just kind of going through your your past episodes you've done a two by four done. 612 01:02:23,93 --> 01:02:31,55 And Dragons was at the for this or was it just gaming in general well dice says ICE and they seem to get it right 613 01:02:31,60 --> 01:02:32,02 and 614 01:02:32,34 --> 01:02:45,04 and then your last one was kind of focused on found electronics you know yes so it seems like there is maybe the missing 615 01:02:45,05 --> 01:02:48,02 element would be some kind of. 616 01:02:49,09 --> 01:02:58,04 Weight to makes decisions in your in your podcast maybe something having to do with random choice 617 01:02:58,08 --> 01:03:04,75 or how how algorithms have been used to make choices for us. 618 01:03:06,28 --> 01:03:10,62 Maybe if there's something like that that could be used for future projects. 619 01:03:13,60 --> 01:03:20,58 Oh I see so you're you talking about like the challenge is a way to address the manufacture of challenges moving 620 01:03:20,59 --> 01:03:24,97 forwards yes or no not the manufacturer challenge 621 01:03:24,98 --> 01:03:35,46 but I think the way that as a culture we have created ways to make our decisions yes that's great so like there's apps 622 01:03:35,47 --> 01:03:40,86 that will just choose where you want to eat because your significant other says I'll eat whatever. 623 01:03:41,56 --> 01:03:51,40 Whatever you know and you know. So I think it brings in a lot of options for thinking about game culture or. 624 01:03:53,26 --> 01:04:00,46 Pseudo Random versus actual random decisions. That would be my suggestion. 625 01:04:01,54 --> 01:04:09,69 I love it what do you think yes if you if you had like a phrase to sort of act as as our north star over the next two 626 01:04:09,70 --> 01:04:15,78 weeks what would be like where like as we sort of think through this for the next two weeks. 627 01:04:19,08 --> 01:04:19,76 So for me 628 01:04:19,77 --> 01:04:25,13 when I sort of work through a challenge I keep going back to what the for like for us it were a stand up comedy so Mike 629 01:04:25,14 --> 01:04:32,65 OK you're going to kind of come what would you how would you phrase that you just forgot I mean I've got to get a 630 01:04:33,00 --> 01:04:40,42 little ration in my head I'm going to go with. Real recorded and random decision making Wow OK. 631 01:04:42,65 --> 01:04:44,46 That's great yeah I'm writing this. 632 01:04:45,47 --> 01:04:51,84 And I feel like as a subheading I really like your way of thinking about it which is. I don't care you pick. 633 01:04:53,16 --> 01:04:58,34 Better phrase you should I think one. Still you're free it's OK. 634 01:05:00,51 --> 01:05:04,97 So I'm really diggin that we'll have to we have two really good ones to pick from maybe we could call it I don't care 635 01:05:04,98 --> 01:05:09,49 you pick and then the subtitle would be your original title which gives it a little bit more. 636 01:05:10,86 --> 01:05:16,79 Like sketches of the incident so yeah yeah yeah that's awesome OK cool yeah Excellent all right. 637 01:05:17,89 --> 01:05:23,76 Killer MAN Yeah that's great I have a few very quick things I'm going to be quick about them because we're a bit long 638 01:05:23,77 --> 01:05:29,65 on time. Just about people who've written in and stuff and then. 639 01:05:32,81 --> 01:05:38,44 Yeah and then we'll wrap it up so couple things a couple things wow that challenges get. 640 01:05:41,36 --> 01:05:43,49 First of all thanks to everyone who listens 641 01:05:43,50 --> 01:05:53,76 and we are just about at one hundred fifty average listens per podcast so we're doing really great there please help us 642 01:05:53,80 --> 01:05:57,50 share the word about the podcast you can tell your friends about it 643 01:05:57,88 --> 01:06:06,10 and to go to opposable podcast dot com And if you want to see details about our projects photos videos audio etc Those 644 01:06:06,11 --> 01:06:12,79 will be up at projects dot opposable podcast dot com And that's where we host more detailed rich media things about the 645 01:06:12,80 --> 01:06:14,44 products that we talk about on the podcast 646 01:06:15,21 --> 01:06:21,01 and I just updated that this weekend quite a bit so it's getting it's taking shape after me wanting to get to it for 647 01:06:21,02 --> 01:06:22,21 weeks and never having done it. 648 01:06:23,84 --> 01:06:27,57 So please tell your friends about it we don't we got our first i Tunes review 649 01:06:28,56 --> 01:06:30,47 and we got five stars so that's pretty great. 650 01:06:31,66 --> 01:06:36,25 If you want to have us on i Tunes That would be awesome Taylor did you did you see the review person. 651 01:06:37,40 --> 01:06:43,08 I believe it was from Richard Rooney if I'm not mistaken you had the you know who that person is I think that's rich 652 01:06:43,09 --> 01:06:49,55 MANSFIELD Oh OK cool how can I ask him who we were talking about yeah yeah great so is with Yeah absolutely yeah thanks 653 01:06:49,56 --> 01:06:53,90 Rich if you would like to give us a review whatever number of stars you'd like to give would be awesome. 654 01:06:55,05 --> 01:07:00,06 I'm always feels like that feels really weird in some ways to ask to like hustle people for positive reviews every 655 01:07:00,07 --> 01:07:01,95 podcast does it so it must do something. 656 01:07:03,38 --> 01:07:07,52 Well it's like I used to ask my students to get on great my professor 657 01:07:07,53 --> 01:07:16,24 and give me Chili Peppers just underscore to underscore how flood of a system it was and that worked as well. So. 658 01:07:17,37 --> 01:07:20,63 Yeah thanks thanks for the reviews and also just if you want to share it on social media 659 01:07:20,64 --> 01:07:25,86 or whatever that would be great we know there's a lot of people listen to and so your pockets time is limited 660 01:07:26,21 --> 01:07:28,60 and so thanks for spending an hour with us every two weeks. 661 01:07:30,24 --> 01:07:33,47 We have a picture on page if you go to a possible podcast dot com 662 01:07:33,48 --> 01:07:40,86 or patron dot com slash opposable thumbs it would be awesome if you became our patron we are accepting sponsor. 663 01:07:40,96 --> 01:07:46,79 Ships' we really need money to keep this thing going so if you have a small business or at sea 664 01:07:46,80 --> 01:07:51,15 or something like that and you would like to work out something where we talk about it 665 01:07:51,82 --> 01:07:56,73 when we do about casts we would be happy to do that we do prioritise independent businesses in my 666 01:07:56,74 --> 01:08:03,85 or any minority owned businesses and women owned businesses first but don't let that stop you so please or 667 01:08:03,90 --> 01:08:09,13 or let that encourage you so please give us a shout if that's something you would like to do 668 01:08:09,14 --> 01:08:18,71 and you can email us at opposable pod cast at G. Mail dot com. We got an amazing box from Federico. 669 01:08:20,57 --> 01:08:27,10 From a listener and it is the coolest thing they're going to briefly describe what it is 670 01:08:27,73 --> 01:08:33,33 and then maybe will will defer what some of the contents are to the next episode and I'll put a few pictures of them. 671 01:08:34,86 --> 01:08:40,32 On our website so you can see he sent us a really really sweet No just that thanks for putting the podcast out there I 672 01:08:40,33 --> 01:08:41,91 listen to a lot of podcasts while drawing 673 01:08:41,92 --> 01:08:47,45 but something make he was missing from my life I love that you're making efforts to be inclusive the code of conduct is 674 01:08:47,46 --> 01:08:50,33 great and the overall feel is very professional in a good way. 675 01:08:52,44 --> 01:09:00,26 And he made this really cool piece while he was getting to our two by four episode and. 676 01:09:01,98 --> 01:09:04,24 So I was going to describe it really quickly so 677 01:09:04,25 --> 01:09:08,81 when I put the photo you'll know what it is it says the story with this weird object is that I was playing around with 678 01:09:08,82 --> 01:09:16,00 the bandsaw in a scrap piece of two by four trying to improvise the shape by cutting on perpendicular faces of the 679 01:09:16,01 --> 01:09:24,89 block if you google band saw reindeer you'll see what I mean there's also a nice video by Jimmy to rest where he carved 680 01:09:24,90 --> 01:09:30,03 a spoon with the same technique in it and Federico has amazing. 681 01:09:31,12 --> 01:09:36,23 Pitman ship and also he drew this really great block diagram of like sort of. 682 01:09:37,36 --> 01:09:44,63 Carving a three dimensional object with a band saw out of a block of wood. And. So he. 683 01:09:45,96 --> 01:09:52,59 Started to put together this really cool. Little gear with. 684 01:09:53,74 --> 01:09:55,41 Two by four and paper clip 685 01:09:55,68 --> 01:10:03,50 and it's a really cool I'll show video of it because it's really cool I sent you a photo of it I think I don't know if 686 01:10:03,51 --> 01:10:10,02 you have a. What I'm what I'm worried about if there's probably a great name for this actual thing and maybe it is. 687 01:10:12,72 --> 01:10:13,87 A Banzai reindeer but. 688 01:10:15,05 --> 01:10:18,91 It's really amazing looking and so I feel nervous right now trying to describe it 689 01:10:19,55 --> 01:10:24,42 and it's motion it defies the kind of golden mean kind of motion to it. 690 01:10:25,49 --> 01:10:32,84 I feel like the way that you're being in fact if I could improve upon that I don't I mean I don't feel they're calling 691 01:10:32,85 --> 01:10:39,70 something a band reindeer because then you know my imagination goes wild Oh he won't tell what it is I just missed it 692 01:10:39,96 --> 01:10:48,95 it says their golden ratio calipers Oh yeah yeah they're really quite beautiful and really well done 693 01:10:49,38 --> 01:10:55,71 and Federico is is a really great illustrator and maker person in Los Angeles who I don't know super well 694 01:10:56,58 --> 01:10:59,04 but I always have had a great conversation with him when I see him 695 01:10:59,05 --> 01:11:03,62 and maybe I'll try to get him on the part cast to do something it seems like he would be great to have on. 696 01:11:06,13 --> 01:11:12,56 That's all I've got Does anyone have anything Nick do you have anything coming up that you would like the world to know 697 01:11:12,57 --> 01:11:20,56 about or TAYLOR Do you have anything as well I will be in Iceland for a month for a residency an artist residency. 698 01:11:22,54 --> 01:11:26,79 And of middle of June through middle of July so if anyone. 699 01:11:27,80 --> 01:11:30,64 Listening the podcast has like a cool place I should go 700 01:11:31,60 --> 01:11:40,68 or something would be really cool to see I would love to get some information there. Otherwise I'm definitely going to. 701 01:11:41,10 --> 01:11:46,43 Looking at some amazing landscapes and I've just learned that there is some kind of world. 702 01:11:47,84 --> 01:11:53,58 Only world penis museum or something you see I'm dedicated phallic imagery. 703 01:11:54,71 --> 01:12:04,99 So that's on my radar now thinking of like what would the world penis look like. You know. Fantastic. 704 01:12:06,00 --> 01:12:09,67 I have a project coming up I think I may have alluded to it before 705 01:12:09,68 --> 01:12:16,33 but the fabricator it's art a bit Macon's good seal you know maybe this trancing name on our first guest she's just 706 01:12:16,34 --> 01:12:20,68 help me finish fabricating this sterling silver flatware. 707 01:12:21,70 --> 01:12:27,82 Which I'm going to go pick up this week look at that that project into a post some pictures of that pretty excited 708 01:12:27,83 --> 01:12:33,04 about that yeah that's great. I saw the I think the three D. Maybe drawings of it on your website. 709 01:12:34,19 --> 01:12:38,94 Yeah they're beautiful. You know what I think read anything else on your end I'm good that's it. 710 01:12:40,22 --> 01:12:46,34 OK Well thanks everyone for listening and I'm so excited about this challenge yeah it's a good one yeah thanks thanks. 711 01:12:48,35 --> 01:12:52,35 Everyone it's Rob again I just wanted to announce a cool thing in. 712 01:12:54,29 --> 01:12:55,24 Front of the podcast 713 01:12:56,11 --> 01:13:03,87 but I said it's a really cool book improvisation he made over loops from a Lewis Black stand up comedy show inspired by 714 01:13:03,88 --> 01:13:11,03 this week's topic we're going to use his piece as the Ultra Music This week the piece he wrote 715 01:13:11,04 --> 01:13:17,41 and said the piece is inspired by a brilliant video piece called trilling by Katherine Ross and Taylor Haskins and his. 716 01:13:18,89 --> 01:13:23,73 Video Link he sent me so I'll post that and show notes and on our website so you can go check it out 717 01:13:23,74 --> 01:13:28,72 and it also has a link to the original piece chilling by Catherine Ross and Taylor Haskins. 718 01:13:29,88 --> 01:13:34,75 So thank you so much Randy for sitting sending this in we are psyched to be able to use this as our Ultra Music 719 01:13:35,05 --> 01:13:40,69 and looking forward has many amazing. Cool things on the. 720 01:13:41,08 --> 01:13:46,52 He's a really cool artist he did this project that he may still be doing where he made it 721 01:13:46,53 --> 01:13:54,55 and Sherman a day from many many things and he made as a minute a day also using paper clips so. I saw his piece. 722 01:13:55,64 --> 01:13:59,94 Related to our first episode a few weeks back so anyway thanks again Ranjeet 723 01:14:00,48 --> 01:14:41,67 and this inspires you to send something in please do and on the podcast Thanks. Q three. Years Sure sure. Sure. 724 01:14:42,79 --> 01:15:16,48 Sure there's no you. Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't. Do. Your. Hair hinting. 725 01:15:26,95 --> 01:16:00,10 Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't Don't. Rule. There are little it and that are left. 726 01:16:03,83 --> 01:16:10,66 To protect. Oh I checked. To catch the loony. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:00,69 --> 00:00:17,27 Intro music goes here. Eventual E. Maybe. In the future. If we have a future let's pretend we have a future. OK. 2 00:00:18,31 --> 00:00:23,78 Let's do this he sort of was an expert person like a radical pressure you know like story pressure 3 00:00:23,79 --> 00:00:28,62 or like it would gradually just become more and more engaging at first you're like What is this 4 00:00:28,63 --> 00:00:31,77 and then all of a sudden you're hooked and then I was on you're like I've been listening to this for an hour 5 00:00:31,78 --> 00:00:41,27 and a half so he has a deep voice he I think so I worked at an ad agency in Chicago and he was in. An elevator and. 6 00:00:42,30 --> 00:00:49,26 Because I was a sort of a weird fan of his I knew what he looked like he's not a very recognizable person particularly 7 00:00:49,27 --> 00:00:54,28 but I was like he's quite old and I heard him say something to someone in the elevator 8 00:00:54,29 --> 00:00:59,38 and I was just like you know you have that like a flash bang moment where you're like that's that's blah blah blah 9 00:00:59,68 --> 00:01:05,78 and so those can already and and I I mean I would just super geek and I was just like you're can or Dean 10 00:01:05,79 --> 00:01:12,24 and he was like yeah like I hope your your stuff on. On N.P.R. 11 00:01:12,43 --> 00:01:18,06 And so he had a total moment where he was like he went to like because he was probably you know at someone who he sees 12 00:01:18,07 --> 00:01:22,35 as a client you know so he was like well you should go to my website to listen to more. 13 00:01:24,22 --> 00:01:29,08 But he actually he literally gave you an elevator pitch at work I guess he did yeah. 14 00:01:31,30 --> 00:01:37,21 Excellence he did know that I was just some Goofus you know like I wasn't anyone who could ever hire but 15 00:01:37,61 --> 00:01:38,14 but it was cool. 16 00:01:39,47 --> 00:01:46,89 You know come on man I mean I love how our heroes have a much lower bar for their fandom I think that tends to make it 17 00:01:46,90 --> 00:01:53,41 more accessible although I'm sitting here I can only remember your stories I can't remember one for myself at all 18 00:01:53,42 --> 00:02:00,22 but oh my God what. Maybe I just did. 19 00:02:00,25 --> 00:02:06,44 And well I will I will blast forth I mean the best I can do up the top of my head is. 20 00:02:07,75 --> 00:02:14,05 I was walking down the street outside the House of Blues in Chicago and I walked by common 21 00:02:14,31 --> 00:02:19,74 and he was talking to this woman who was just totally freaking out and I looked at him. 22 00:02:20,83 --> 00:02:24,00 Like a huge common fan I'm just aware of him 23 00:02:24,01 --> 00:02:30,51 and think he's a cool guy you know just like like have you guess been listening to chance the rapper at all yeah so I 24 00:02:30,92 --> 00:02:37,26 cannot get into Chance's music and I think who a list. Oh. 25 00:02:39,45 --> 00:02:44,73 So OK So I mean I'm going to have to ask her to give me like the top three songs to listen to 26 00:02:44,74 --> 00:02:48,97 but I've been having these old man moments in class where I kind of can't get with it 27 00:02:49,01 --> 00:02:52,67 but I really really respond to the fact that he's supporting. 28 00:02:53,70 --> 00:02:57,83 You know the Chicago school system and then giving about you shit around 29 00:02:57,84 --> 00:03:05,80 or even other guys like twenty four whatever so my my standard for what makes a cool pop star is definitely changing 30 00:03:05,81 --> 00:03:07,33 but so I was walking by common 31 00:03:07,97 --> 00:03:12,90 and he was a really tall guy because he could he could look me in the I am really tall too and I was walking by him 32 00:03:12,91 --> 00:03:18,89 and I looked at him and I must've looked at him like do I know that and then he looked me in the out he was like yep. 33 00:03:21,34 --> 00:03:29,83 He just gave me this tiny nod which said yes you know who I am that famous guy it's nice to see you too he just packed 34 00:03:29,84 --> 00:03:36,02 so much into that little glance I thought it was very nice pro that's I mean that's all I got I think of a better one 35 00:03:36,03 --> 00:03:52,06 later. So. So welcome to the park. Thank you yeah yeah we. Can kick us off official like you it's maybe OK cool. 36 00:03:53,36 --> 00:04:00,22 Because I rely on the structure so here we go with a structure. Welcome to be a puzzle book. 37 00:04:00,38 --> 00:04:06,18 Pod cast opposable thumbs as a pipe cast where Taylor and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks 38 00:04:06,45 --> 00:04:09,01 and talk about our accomplishments failures and 39 00:04:09,35 --> 00:04:20,11 and lessons learned we're joined by this episode guest no readings try so my name is Robert Ray I run the exoskeleton 40 00:04:20,12 --> 00:04:26,09 arts base in Los Angeles and I'm also an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 41 00:04:27,45 --> 00:04:34,17 Oh well that was fast. Sailer hope concent newly tenured faculty at Columbia College moving. 42 00:04:36,98 --> 00:04:45,30 And I've got a sabbatical coming up for this year so hung I'm looking at you let's do a price oh OK projects now I'm 43 00:04:45,31 --> 00:04:49,18 very excited because it's a they have been teaching for thirteen years 44 00:04:49,22 --> 00:04:56,80 and it's the first time I really have a large you know period of time I get to dedicate to studio practice some super 45 00:04:56,81 --> 00:05:02,67 excited about it so that's that's what I'm getting into right now if people normally get sabbaticals right after tenure 46 00:05:03,62 --> 00:05:09,11 I think it's common so usually at institutions it's seven years in between each application. 47 00:05:10,51 --> 00:05:13,15 So generally Yeah they've been workin in the trenches 48 00:05:13,19 --> 00:05:29,39 and then the first time you're allowed to apply his immediately following. And. In Chicago the moment and kind of. 49 00:05:30,48 --> 00:05:34,77 I tonight for a few years but now I'm more solid the. 50 00:05:36,52 --> 00:05:44,84 My work is multi-disciplinary to and work with a lot of textiles do a lot of arm and your collaboration 51 00:05:44,90 --> 00:05:57,51 and video sounds I kind of do everything usually not painting but. What kind of artist are you a not painter. 52 00:06:00,61 --> 00:06:06,90 Now that's how that's how I don't know that's how sometimes people describe me but then I sometimes I play 53 00:06:06,91 --> 00:06:11,09 and I'm like oh oh I kind of like this is nice you know but. 54 00:06:12,12 --> 00:06:18,57 Yeah conceptual research space typically I do a lot of aberrations I mentioned that I maybe. 55 00:06:20,70 --> 00:06:27,67 That I'm working on right now it's been in the process for three years I started the research three years ago 56 00:06:27,68 --> 00:06:32,61 and have been kind of off and on and then I started doing the. 57 00:06:35,17 --> 00:06:37,66 Production in earnest about a year ago 58 00:06:37,67 --> 00:06:45,81 and started with looking at the police records of the needs woman that was part of the anti-colonial movement. 59 00:06:47,20 --> 00:06:53,89 Part of the resistance against the French and and then through her records her name it's maintaining high 60 00:06:54,41 --> 00:07:04,99 and through her records found out much more than I expected about the movement in general the surveillance that was 61 00:07:05,00 --> 00:07:10,10 used against the resistance and then the way that people were evading that surveillance 62 00:07:10,57 --> 00:07:18,80 and then because of that there's because of all these different layers of you know evasion and you know kind of. 63 00:07:20,54 --> 00:07:22,20 The different layers of. 64 00:07:23,60 --> 00:07:30,85 The station all of those kinds of things you know that it's really difficult to have trust in the original document 65 00:07:30,89 --> 00:07:38,46 or the way that we tell this history so you know when that is the kind of like questioning of the historical events 66 00:07:38,47 --> 00:07:44,04 or our narrative particularly around these knowledge. 67 00:07:46,88 --> 00:07:55,27 As I have a title yet well there's right now there's a exhibition the project all to name it is to. 68 00:07:56,71 --> 00:08:00,22 That's and that's the name of the exhibition and I haven't quite decided. 69 00:08:00,69 --> 00:08:07,92 In the name of the entire I checked so I'd like to flesh it out through a few other exhibitions 70 00:08:08,32 --> 00:08:14,43 and then maybe one to figure out if I don't for the whole day care to be. 71 00:08:15,99 --> 00:08:21,82 Awesome that's cool thing you know I feel like I mean that reminds me in rep tell me this is You Tube it 72 00:08:22,18 --> 00:08:25,16 and I really don't like bringing any projects to an end. 73 00:08:26,34 --> 00:08:26,91 And it 74 00:08:26,97 --> 00:08:32,69 and I can really dig that method of working where because his songs were you doing a Fulbright are you actually went 75 00:08:32,94 --> 00:08:40,34 and research in reference library is in Vietnam right yeah I was so it started in France I was doing research in the 76 00:08:41,18 --> 00:08:50,17 overseas territories archive there. And acts in the south and then and then I got a Fulbright to go to. 77 00:08:53,63 --> 00:08:56,17 Last year and 78 00:08:57,07 --> 00:09:05,04 and I mean it got to a point for me it's like I have to I have to stop the research at a certain point in order to 79 00:09:05,39 --> 00:09:11,73 start making nowhere and then once once I get the word going it feels really good to have some kind of. 80 00:09:12,88 --> 00:09:20,90 And not conclusion some someone you know moment to present it and reflect on it and then I feel like I can move on 81 00:09:20,98 --> 00:09:26,92 and there I don't yeah I really like that part of it I'm realizing the project 82 00:09:27,66 --> 00:09:33,33 but it is always really difficult to figure out what that I don't think yeah dude 83 00:09:33,34 --> 00:09:38,44 and I think it's interesting that you introduced yourself sort of talking about all these different media because I 84 00:09:38,50 --> 00:09:44,17 really feel like one of your primary identifiers is politics at least over the last couple of years that I've tracked 85 00:09:44,18 --> 00:09:52,21 your work is that is that there. Yeah I mean definitely my work has always been political in nature you know I think. 86 00:09:53,29 --> 00:10:02,22 At a certain time it might be more social political but it always. Always. 87 00:10:03,78 --> 00:10:11,06 And the indefinitely in relationship to a new understanding ideology understanding like language 88 00:10:11,07 --> 00:10:17,99 and the construction of different I thin to. National identity. 89 00:10:19,18 --> 00:10:24,47 All of those kinds of things and all of those are matters of their matters of politics 90 00:10:24,48 --> 00:10:25,98 but they're matters of the body 91 00:10:25,99 --> 00:10:32,92 and how we perform you know our identity so you know yeah it's like definitely political 92 00:10:32,93 --> 00:10:37,94 but then there's like there's there's other aspects of it that. 93 00:10:38,98 --> 00:10:43,82 Go beyond the typical realm of what you consider political Yeah yeah 94 00:10:43,94 --> 00:10:49,03 and often it seems like language is a sort of manifestation or component 95 00:10:49,85 --> 00:10:55,53 or sort of represents that ever again of who a person is 96 00:10:55,54 --> 00:11:01,57 and how they are in the world do you think you could describe a work of particularly the visual elements either the 97 00:11:01,61 --> 00:11:06,68 thing that's up at the pole or museum right now or some other work that you think is you know typifies or practice. 98 00:11:08,24 --> 00:11:15,31 You know I had to kind of like I first practice that I've always had a really difficult time like choosing something 99 00:11:15,32 --> 00:11:19,69 that typifies that but one project that I did really recently 100 00:11:20,12 --> 00:11:28,18 and in pretty recently that I felt like really helped me to understand where I wanted to go or where 101 00:11:29,04 --> 00:11:37,60 and also kind of pulled together a lot of things that I had been thinking about over the years was a project the video 102 00:11:37,61 --> 00:11:46,27 that I made with my sister and I me where we are listening to a recording of my mom being in a song. 103 00:11:47,39 --> 00:11:50,12 And trying our best to imitate it 104 00:11:50,52 --> 00:11:56,05 and the project is called The Voice is an archive it's very simple we made it in one afternoon. 105 00:11:57,09 --> 00:12:00,22 With just a few takes each of us you know and then I added. 106 00:12:00,42 --> 00:12:07,27 Yeah there very quickly you know it has it's still has that feeling to it there's I've left a lot of. 107 00:12:08,92 --> 00:12:15,25 The outtakes in the final video to gesture towards that. 108 00:12:16,78 --> 00:12:22,44 And we're all kind of failing in these daily different ways you know even though my so that my sister 109 00:12:22,45 --> 00:12:26,25 and I have some good news we're just like terrible at this thing 110 00:12:26,65 --> 00:12:33,37 and you know we just like our I mean you know we're not are not we're trying to work concentrating too much on the 111 00:12:33,38 --> 00:12:37,97 meaning sometimes you know my niece is like nailing at. 112 00:12:38,99 --> 00:12:42,94 Many times even though she doesn't have any Vietnamese at all 113 00:12:43,13 --> 00:12:46,43 and you hear in her voice her first language was Mandarin. 114 00:12:47,48 --> 00:12:52,79 She was adopted which is really proud of so you know I can say this she's been telling everyone everybody. 115 00:12:54,14 --> 00:13:02,92 So she's she's pronouncing things with that very kind of Mandarin pronunciation for a consonant so it's just beautiful 116 00:13:02,93 --> 00:13:08,19 these things that come out of my mom she's always you know as I was always singing. 117 00:13:09,50 --> 00:13:12,46 She is really or just vulnerable voice 118 00:13:12,47 --> 00:13:19,72 and it's just even more vulnerable as she gets older so the names in to just have this moment to. 119 00:13:23,12 --> 00:13:32,01 Think about this you know this lineage you know just of course broken kind of lineage the new genetic. 120 00:13:33,36 --> 00:13:35,74 And to think of what kind of. 121 00:13:37,02 --> 00:13:42,20 What kind of an archive exists within something like our boy you know what body 122 00:13:42,58 --> 00:13:47,33 and what kind of you know layers of history we wear on ourselves all the time. 123 00:13:48,72 --> 00:13:53,93 So that I know that when it's a singleton a video with or you know three videos me 124 00:13:53,94 --> 00:14:00,22 and I think my niece then you hear that also my mom's and it was a really important one for me. 125 00:14:00,39 --> 00:14:08,13 Because I was working in the middle of this very different type of archive which is like documents tax you know all of 126 00:14:08,14 --> 00:14:13,58 this stuff like this is it carries the weight of history. 127 00:14:14,87 --> 00:14:22,77 You know as as we value it as as a society and it was a really important one for me to make in order to and 128 00:14:23,02 --> 00:14:28,82 and possibly It doesn't possibly I can think about and undoing of that. 129 00:14:31,28 --> 00:14:36,42 You have to throw the book it reminds me too I mean it's I don't know read about your motivations for starting the pod 130 00:14:36,43 --> 00:14:38,11 cast that you were the one who had the initial idea 131 00:14:38,12 --> 00:14:47,38 but I do feel like as I get older I try to make more of my work naturally give me opportunities to hang out with people 132 00:14:47,39 --> 00:14:54,38 they're like. Even if it's harder and harder once you have kids and all these other zero people problems. 133 00:14:55,61 --> 00:15:01,57 I could imagine one of the reasons that you got into it was just to spend some time with with your family is that true 134 00:15:02,57 --> 00:15:06,20 you know my family and I have been working on things for the past three years. 135 00:15:07,89 --> 00:15:14,15 We have like quite this interesting family culture where we have these very we have these annual things that we do like 136 00:15:14,44 --> 00:15:18,15 it's either like a talent show oir we threw like. 137 00:15:19,75 --> 00:15:25,29 I don't know these very elaborate game and or like this last year we did. 138 00:15:26,63 --> 00:15:34,93 A Story Corps Day of Listening and my family is really we have twenty five of us total just on my side. 139 00:15:36,24 --> 00:15:39,04 Of my four sisters and my brother 140 00:15:39,05 --> 00:15:46,98 and they all have kids so you know doing a Day of Listening where one person interviews another person it took like a 141 00:15:46,99 --> 00:15:48,86 few days it was many days of. 142 00:15:51,92 --> 00:15:58,96 So I think actually those kinds of low pressure activities warmed them you know I used to try 143 00:15:58,97 --> 00:16:00,22 and get them involved in there. 144 00:16:00,25 --> 00:16:06,26 Our all the time and they you know was always just really awkward but I think those kinds of things 145 00:16:06,60 --> 00:16:13,44 and use to us were there and so you know we did this video and it's really really natural for us do it 146 00:16:14,23 --> 00:16:18,63 and then Recently my sister and I three nieces came to visit in Chicago. 147 00:16:19,79 --> 00:16:26,31 And I asked them to be a part of this video that it's showing us for the project 148 00:16:26,91 --> 00:16:33,18 and they were they were really good there was one niece that was a little bit reluctant 149 00:16:33,19 --> 00:16:35,31 but I mean I don't blame her that's you know. 150 00:16:37,43 --> 00:16:43,71 But you know reluctant in a very teenager way you know she's like No I don't want to do that no I don't want to do it 151 00:16:43,72 --> 00:16:44,02 and then 152 00:16:44,03 --> 00:16:50,94 when she gets into it it's like completely crazy dancing you know all of you know if I really like the idea of a talent 153 00:16:50,95 --> 00:16:52,64 show as being a part of a thing that. 154 00:16:54,61 --> 00:17:00,58 A family does could just seems like a really interesting way to be able to express yourself in a way that like I don't 155 00:17:00,59 --> 00:17:02,41 know is feels somewhat safe 156 00:17:02,42 --> 00:17:07,63 but also allows you to kind of maybe let some of your family members in on who you are in a way that isn't like an 157 00:17:07,64 --> 00:17:12,35 awkward conversation face yeah completely and I mean you know it's always. 158 00:17:14,10 --> 00:17:17,04 The kids that would do that talent and my dad. 159 00:17:18,90 --> 00:17:25,08 My dad always for that like high cheer or something like that and then the kids I do like piano are eccentric 160 00:17:25,09 --> 00:17:31,06 but you know I was like it was the way that we could like living far away 161 00:17:31,07 --> 00:17:35,81 and we could have this window into what activities they're right 162 00:17:36,23 --> 00:17:42,43 and one year we did it amongst the adults we had kind of a show and tell like hey this is what I'm doing 163 00:17:42,44 --> 00:17:45,49 and this is something interesting that I want to share. 164 00:17:47,66 --> 00:17:54,90 So that's great I just I can't even imagine the large family angle I've got I've got such a small circle although now 165 00:17:54,91 --> 00:18:00,22 that there's kind of one grand kid for a million grandparents who in this wing and the other. 166 00:18:03,46 --> 00:18:11,01 All right what do you think should we look at some inventions let's do it so our challenge just as a reminder is I 167 00:18:11,02 --> 00:18:15,59 don't care you pick real recorded in random decision making. 168 00:18:16,66 --> 00:18:24,23 Brought by our last guess Nick intriguer from last time he was doing our stand up comedy episode so he gave us you know 169 00:18:24,39 --> 00:18:30,03 Rob mentioned to me as a very polite aside you know how things got a little academic last time. 170 00:18:31,43 --> 00:18:35,47 And I remind myself like oh I just thought that's how people talk but you know that's. 171 00:18:36,48 --> 00:18:37,96 That's that's the ivory tower 172 00:18:37,97 --> 00:18:45,06 and I think we were just ready to go with the first thing are you guys ready to see a thing yeah who who would like to 173 00:18:45,07 --> 00:18:48,65 go first. Let's see we. 174 00:18:49,76 --> 00:18:54,75 I think usually we just do what is me and then the guest 175 00:18:54,76 --> 00:19:02,08 and then you are me then you then the guest it typically one of us goes first I think just so our guests sort of get a 176 00:19:02,09 --> 00:19:05,06 sense of how about like that in a pocket you know is like describing the piece 177 00:19:05,07 --> 00:19:10,72 and stuff that's a little bit weird at first but you know and when it's you go first to change it OK cool. 178 00:19:11,75 --> 00:19:17,13 So one of the things that we often do is apply little little bit of our work 179 00:19:17,14 --> 00:19:20,71 and then have the other two people who look at it 180 00:19:20,75 --> 00:19:28,86 and talk about it so that way it becomes less lecture like in you know the describing of the work 181 00:19:28,87 --> 00:19:33,72 and let's listen to it thing. And let's other put other people's. 182 00:19:35,05 --> 00:19:39,31 You know experiences of the work sort of come through in that way also you 183 00:19:40,01 --> 00:19:46,81 but also the creator doesn't sort of feel burdened by having to I go through everything in detail I uploaded a small 184 00:19:46,82 --> 00:19:57,30 zip file to. Channel. So I knew there were bulletin involved I saw the Instagram. 185 00:20:00,67 --> 00:20:05,77 But yes I miss you absolutely higher but. Here's the thing. 186 00:20:07,47 --> 00:20:12,45 So are you ready to play how long are you have you get your IT OK I'm going to go through to one clip. 187 00:20:13,86 --> 00:20:23,07 And I see I see a robe with a curve I think helium balloons that Eleanor NJ What do you see now next seen as Kodak 188 00:20:23,11 --> 00:20:30,72 and Dr now there are some yellow paper being but it's the same yellow it's like a posted no 189 00:20:30,73 --> 00:20:37,59 and there is a bone folder good because I was hoping we'd be able to talk about the boulder I thought it was just 190 00:20:37,60 --> 00:20:41,19 filler ten who is in a room and a U.S.B. 191 00:20:41,92 --> 00:20:48,24 and He's making Well I heard like going out into the war all of this is exciting. 192 00:20:49,43 --> 00:20:58,04 Little package Oh he's going to let a little U.S.B. Drives out into the letting them out there that you want it in the. 193 00:20:59,49 --> 00:21:02,84 Now so we have some Spanish is that open to me in Spanish. 194 00:21:05,03 --> 00:21:09,39 And then here and this windy launching Oh yeah my dear 195 00:21:09,40 --> 00:21:14,15 and then to be air I think that's going to make it about fifty feet now there it goes. 196 00:21:16,31 --> 00:21:22,31 At first it looked like it was going to land in Rob's neighbor's backyard so that was the first this is the test flight 197 00:21:22,35 --> 00:21:29,94 and then I have a couple more flights Rob has some fancy neighbors and some nice the neighbors there is that palm tree. 198 00:21:30,98 --> 00:21:37,63 Right next to like a pine tree. And there's. 199 00:21:39,34 --> 00:21:45,67 There is yeah there's a hill it looks very California you know this is you in California. 200 00:21:47,95 --> 00:21:50,09 You live in Elm Street right wow. 201 00:21:51,90 --> 00:21:59,91 Welcome to My Nightmare You know I happen to know this is just read at the front of house and he's he's launched a U.S. 202 00:21:59,92 --> 00:22:07,53 Speed. Out into the world on an orange balloon do you do you get any meaning out of the orange color what do you think. 203 00:22:09,11 --> 00:22:10,66 I think it's really nice again. 204 00:22:13,66 --> 00:22:19,50 And then the other thing I'm going about this I think so so hung if you don't already know. 205 00:22:20,75 --> 00:22:26,42 Sort of a pied piper in his neighborhood so this little children kind of walking in and out of this house all the time. 206 00:22:27,92 --> 00:22:31,09 And I think I can hear little children dancing around robes 207 00:22:31,10 --> 00:22:37,99 and he is out of the camera angle i lot see that high type right because I never really figured out what that phrase 208 00:22:38,00 --> 00:22:48,77 meant so I'm like you know what Frank imagining little show magically children letting it out it. Is freaking out and. 209 00:22:51,64 --> 00:22:59,73 He just I believe when I've experienced it is a refuge for children that are bored or would like a snack 210 00:23:00,43 --> 00:23:06,99 or whatever else and so OK so you know Bill and verify and you know I like you and I like anything with Bill 211 00:23:07,00 --> 00:23:15,77 and indeed you know I mean my work is usually so over thought like and I was just like I want a piece that could just. 212 00:23:16,94 --> 00:23:20,71 I don't have control over so I was biking home in the wind 213 00:23:20,89 --> 00:23:24,65 and it was super super windy like really really hardly windy and so. 214 00:23:26,46 --> 00:23:33,63 And I saw like a plastic bag blow like right into my face and and I was like when like that's so. 215 00:23:36,21 --> 00:23:41,30 Really blowing you're safe in your have. It did yeah. 216 00:23:44,20 --> 00:23:48,68 Yeah it was growth but it was also cinematic You know what kind of big was it. 217 00:23:49,87 --> 00:23:52,44 Like a black plastic you know a liquor store but. 218 00:23:54,31 --> 00:24:00,22 You know I also wonder because when i hope was doing her show it did to she was doing that radio. 219 00:24:00,25 --> 00:24:03,08 Receiver thing on the end of a balloon right yeah like that yeah. 220 00:24:04,83 --> 00:24:07,74 If that influenced you whether consciously or subconsciously. 221 00:24:11,41 --> 00:24:15,71 So you I hope you might be saying the same thing I'm there it's that maybe a little bit less when the right now 222 00:24:15,72 --> 00:24:20,29 and there being lots of balloons. Yes each of these have a U.S.B. 223 00:24:20,30 --> 00:24:27,34 Card in a text in Spanish and English that ask you to. Put things on the card that you like. 224 00:24:29,74 --> 00:24:36,02 But mail it not by balloon Yeah there's something. In the car to you yes yes. 225 00:24:37,13 --> 00:24:42,79 And so then there was a camera one that I couldn't sin because I didn't have enough balloons I was like damn I really 226 00:24:42,80 --> 00:24:46,29 want to do this so I went and got more balloons. 227 00:24:47,81 --> 00:24:52,30 Later And so there's a video coming up that you're about to see of me watching the camera. 228 00:24:53,63 --> 00:25:02,21 A camera like a little of those things go straight to us via camera this is like a disposable like like one that you 229 00:25:02,22 --> 00:25:08,48 would mail in and like the cameras at the images back but it did there they would they would mail the camera to me 230 00:25:08,52 --> 00:25:15,97 and then I would process digital or actual film I think it's actual actual film yes they still make up 231 00:25:15,98 --> 00:25:24,32 and you know it's actually kind of hard to find a place that will do. Yeah oh there's. What is OK and. 232 00:25:27,81 --> 00:25:32,59 You know we have a super grungy old people can replace this all the. 233 00:25:33,83 --> 00:25:41,17 I sent one of my students over there to get it was some camera that you could really easily richer engineer just to 234 00:25:41,18 --> 00:25:46,80 tear it into a digital camera for your own use if you hacked it so at a student go in there and ask for it 235 00:25:46,86 --> 00:25:51,83 and they knew exactly what he was trying to do the second. So when you see the way it's. 236 00:25:54,05 --> 00:26:05,08 Like THAT ONCE FOR REAL minute Yeah but I really I suppose yeah that and going up. On the atmosphere. And. 237 00:26:06,80 --> 00:26:11,01 Straight to the tree like a Charlie Brown. It's really. 238 00:26:12,76 --> 00:26:19,57 Really cloudy OK What I'm saying is it's like this stock I think it's a different chance really cloudy you know and 239 00:26:19,77 --> 00:26:23,06 and the balloon and it's like another cloud but you know. 240 00:26:24,22 --> 00:26:31,05 OK here I was getting the launch so this is I've now added twenty four more balloons. 241 00:26:32,15 --> 00:26:37,10 It's not going up faster then is it that heavy it's really great if I went and I went 242 00:26:37,11 --> 00:26:44,32 and there's a you know yet there's yellow. It's nice just like it is and. 243 00:26:45,58 --> 00:26:46,44 Is that Yankee 244 00:26:46,45 --> 00:26:53,58 and what cardinal direction is that Rob is that away from your host snoring Yeah Northnortheast sort of weird I would 245 00:26:53,59 --> 00:27:06,52 have assumed that there would be what with the jet stream and I know yeah it's weird that wave thanks. So NASA. 246 00:27:08,95 --> 00:27:15,13 So I found out the hard way that different balloons have a different mix of helium and oxygen. 247 00:27:16,42 --> 00:27:19,94 So I went to balloon important which I this is not in Atlanta 248 00:27:19,95 --> 00:27:28,04 but out there I wholly support it they're not open on Sunday and so. I had to go to. 249 00:27:30,25 --> 00:27:37,23 And they close quite early on Saturday so I had I went to balloon him poor him closes early onset 250 00:27:37,24 --> 00:27:42,82 or they find they did hit the very poor business decision that it's a miscalculation for sure 251 00:27:42,83 --> 00:27:50,42 and I think that's a business opportunity that's right so speaking of the pied piper I got as you saw in the video. 252 00:27:52,30 --> 00:27:56,08 I launched twenty four white balloons with a camera attached 253 00:27:56,09 --> 00:27:59,76 and in less than fifteen seconds got it immediately stuck in a tree. 254 00:28:01,22 --> 00:28:05,73 And my neighbors who are the best neighbors ever 255 00:28:06,07 --> 00:28:15,24 and the My other neighbor the woman who owns that tree all helped me in it in a life risking fashion involving very 256 00:28:15,25 --> 00:28:23,40 tall ladders and sticks in a high wind conditions to try to get the balloon out of the tree and we epicly failed 257 00:28:23,92 --> 00:28:31,90 and then by chance there's a knock on my door and my neighbor and friend who is eight. 258 00:28:32,93 --> 00:28:35,41 Says we have your balloons him 259 00:28:35,78 --> 00:28:40,73 and they have the balloon things I'm not quite sure what happened except I think maybe the balloons fell out of the 260 00:28:40,74 --> 00:28:47,75 tree but they don't want some so many were popped that I couldn't launch them because like for four had popped 261 00:28:48,00 --> 00:28:55,40 and so then I got twenty four more because I was I what I wanted to do with save twelve to launch for my neighbors to 262 00:28:55,41 --> 00:29:01,04 launch for themselves you know so they could make a drawing or something but but the twenty four I got were so wimpy 263 00:29:01,05 --> 00:29:08,46 and weak that I had to use all twenty four to launch my camera so I owe them so one time I took So this is the reason 264 00:29:08,47 --> 00:29:14,03 why we have a global helium shortage. Cats can cost so much. 265 00:29:16,33 --> 00:29:19,85 They were expensive those will and so anyway I did I was able to launch the camera. 266 00:29:21,99 --> 00:29:28,78 I don't care you pick as has been made manifest I don't know if I'm going to get anything back from anyone this could 267 00:29:28,79 --> 00:29:32,37 be the place to be if you're writing that isn't running and you need. 268 00:29:33,46 --> 00:29:45,37 Very true very I think I think this is I think this is more about. And after. A P.R. 269 00:29:45,49 --> 00:29:55,08 Campaign getting to know you maybe that's Or that's true create like like miniature. Cress he's. 270 00:29:56,27 --> 00:30:00,22 You know mentioning what is it Munchausen syndrome like you could just have this whole. 271 00:30:00,88 --> 00:30:03,91 You could find it what tools every neighbor has in their garage 272 00:30:03,92 --> 00:30:09,67 and then have some kind of mini crisis right in front of them like if only someone had a weed wacker and. 273 00:30:12,67 --> 00:30:23,84 We could get this child unstuck. You know I mean like a balloon launch you know it's. When it does. 274 00:30:24,93 --> 00:30:33,11 Wonderful childhood memories that now I don't know how to reconcile knowing that the balloon launch is like I don't 275 00:30:33,12 --> 00:30:45,24 know and I am an elite. I forget what they do you make what it is they get like. Birds or D. 276 00:30:45,25 --> 00:30:47,67 Birds like what happened to the balloon. 277 00:30:48,75 --> 00:30:54,83 There's a couple of things I did research this a little bit because I did have that same paranoia of like well you know 278 00:30:54,84 --> 00:31:02,04 it seems so chill and it was very chill and I've never done anything like throw a no in a bottle in the ocean 279 00:31:02,05 --> 00:31:03,19 or anything like that and so 280 00:31:03,88 --> 00:31:08,79 but I would say like the euphoria of letting a balloon go with a message on it is really really awesome. 281 00:31:10,54 --> 00:31:12,06 I did not use Mylar balloons. 282 00:31:13,60 --> 00:31:19,18 I didn't use Mylar balloons because I had heard that they get stuck in electric lines and cause major problems. 283 00:31:20,42 --> 00:31:25,03 I don't know if that's totally true or not but it's true enough and so I. 284 00:31:28,74 --> 00:31:34,73 Decided to use latex balloons at least I thought especially in the Southern California sun they would break up into 285 00:31:34,74 --> 00:31:40,71 smaller pieces that I wouldn't feel too hard about about. And they seem to not be going very. 286 00:31:43,03 --> 00:31:50,55 Notice no yeah I don't expect you I don't expect someone like Barstow California mailing me anything. 287 00:31:52,58 --> 00:31:59,47 Well why don't we do you next and I'll go a list where you say yeah. OK so. 288 00:32:00,25 --> 00:32:02,53 Prefaced knowledge of that 289 00:32:02,54 --> 00:32:07,94 but it's more dislike that kind of things that I was thinking about you know before I made this. 290 00:32:09,32 --> 00:32:17,70 I was thinking of I really like the way that the previous guest framed the project I forget what its name is. 291 00:32:19,02 --> 00:32:21,48 Nick trigger on this planet or. 292 00:32:23,06 --> 00:32:28,46 I like how he talked about random numbers or not really random or senior and him 293 00:32:28,47 --> 00:32:33,35 or something like that you know because I was already thinking about that like the moment you sent me that text about 294 00:32:33,36 --> 00:32:37,79 it I was like oh randomness that is not actually random you know 295 00:32:37,80 --> 00:32:48,01 but I mean I think within that is this whole idea that sometimes random numbers get presented as something that is 296 00:32:48,05 --> 00:32:53,78 actually there and when all random numbers have some kind of limitation you know. 297 00:32:55,80 --> 00:32:59,47 So I was talking to Danielle my partner about this 298 00:32:59,65 --> 00:33:08,90 and he we were talking about like you know he brought up a few really great examples about you know randomness in the 299 00:33:08,91 --> 00:33:15,55 literature of economics. You know and one of the really great ones was about. 300 00:33:17,35 --> 00:33:22,10 There how there's a world champion for rock paper scissors. 301 00:33:24,70 --> 00:33:33,21 When you think about it it shouldn't have a world champion because it's random right you know yeah yeah right 302 00:33:33,73 --> 00:33:36,64 but there is no so that's a really one really nice thing. 303 00:33:42,97 --> 00:33:50,13 And I threw something in there real quick I assume you remember there was also there was a robotics team that made a 304 00:33:50,14 --> 00:33:51,14 robot that could always 305 00:33:51,15 --> 00:33:56,87 when a rock paper scissors because it would analyze your hand as you were starting to through the sun 306 00:33:57,61 --> 00:34:04,18 and it could tell just from your initial muscle. Flexing what but sign your bad throw so when every time. 307 00:34:05,90 --> 00:34:13,58 Yeah I don't know I was kind of like close to the what a human mind do you know. And I don't. 308 00:34:17,64 --> 00:34:18,81 Think you know man I mean like 309 00:34:18,82 --> 00:34:26,70 when you're playing out paper scissors you you read the other person you know you kind of can find it so they're going 310 00:34:26,71 --> 00:34:30,40 to do based on their other actions such as Oh 311 00:34:30,41 --> 00:34:37,85 but the other example that he was telling me about is how people OK this is really general and like you know. 312 00:34:39,58 --> 00:34:40,25 The details 313 00:34:40,40 --> 00:34:50,23 but how there are some companies that will pay people to choose a random number because they don't trust a random 314 00:34:50,24 --> 00:34:51,25 number generator. 315 00:34:52,51 --> 00:34:55,25 So it's like that it's the opposite I don't know 316 00:34:55,26 --> 00:35:03,02 but anyways it's like this funny thing where you know it's all about kind of you know trusting people to be random 317 00:35:03,03 --> 00:35:10,87 or knowing that that it's maybe not just random but that there's this one source and. 318 00:35:12,48 --> 00:35:18,29 You know things actually not being and anyway so that was a really fun conversation that we had. 319 00:35:19,36 --> 00:35:29,31 And the so I was also thinking about some really intense real world aspect of random numbers the person being like how 320 00:35:29,32 --> 00:35:31,90 the Bitcoin completely based 321 00:35:32,28 --> 00:35:41,15 and you know these prime numbers that are used for security because you know if you were to just create a random number 322 00:35:41,16 --> 00:35:48,64 generator it's based on something that could easily be figured out unless you have a really nice prime number you know 323 00:35:48,65 --> 00:35:57,92 so like this like this that this entire economy that's just based on trying to find something that is not as random as 324 00:35:57,93 --> 00:36:05,34 possible but where you can't figure out. The origin of it. You know it's random algorithm. 325 00:36:07,00 --> 00:36:13,76 The I thing that yeah yeah exactly you know thing that I was thinking of is like stop 326 00:36:13,77 --> 00:36:20,49 and frisk you know this program in New York where it's like supposed to be based on choosing a random person from the 327 00:36:20,50 --> 00:36:21,25 street and. 328 00:36:22,69 --> 00:36:24,70 They don't have any jokes or whatever 329 00:36:25,24 --> 00:36:40,75 and you know it's shown to absolutely not be human so that like this one especially stop. 330 00:36:33,48 --> 00:36:40,75 and frisk is what I was thinking when I created a project I will send you the U.R.L. 331 00:36:42,70 --> 00:36:51,76 Very much it's a very functional project. And it's just one page and then. 332 00:36:56,35 --> 00:37:13,80 You can make it into just like Can I just send it over this way when. I'm not. I'm not I love how her. 333 00:37:15,96 --> 00:37:23,08 So I was thinking about how you know like that your guest last week it was like OK what if it something that can help 334 00:37:23,40 --> 00:37:24,24 you as. 335 00:37:26,40 --> 00:37:27,43 That or what not 336 00:37:27,66 --> 00:37:36,07 and I was thinking about it as a kind of pedagogical that you could use like for instance let's say in your bathroom 337 00:37:36,11 --> 00:37:44,26 or lights up you know because I mean there's always this really silly thing where it's like oh well I would I would 338 00:37:44,31 --> 00:37:45,26 show more. 339 00:37:47,38 --> 00:37:52,00 You know more artists of color or more women artists but I just don't know them 340 00:37:52,04 --> 00:38:00,22 or whatever so this is kind of like OK no more it's. Can I describe this yes but let me describe real quick set. 341 00:38:00,25 --> 00:38:04,54 So this is the reason I'm laughing is that this is going to be so useful in my class here. 342 00:38:05,57 --> 00:38:07,85 So all the page says is women 343 00:38:07,86 --> 00:38:13,37 and trans artists of color database you have one option which is a button that says choose 344 00:38:13,79 --> 00:38:20,69 and then every time I click it it brings up a different person in Google presumably that fits those characteristics 345 00:38:20,70 --> 00:38:27,77 and then down below is an opportunity to submit the names of female a trans artists of color that you went to really 346 00:38:27,78 --> 00:38:29,02 great really great so. 347 00:38:30,04 --> 00:38:36,53 That is how I thought it out yeah so that you described it perfectly I mean the database right now is like this that 348 00:38:36,54 --> 00:38:39,90 I've generated so you know it's completely not random 349 00:38:39,91 --> 00:38:49,19 and something that I've just pulled from whatever sources I could think of for something that Crusoe really nice in 350 00:38:49,20 --> 00:38:57,84 range of artists category and it is something that like I you know it would be great to have this. 351 00:38:59,15 --> 00:39:04,09 Where you could see the entire mess if you wanted to so then if you're adding other Iris 352 00:39:04,27 --> 00:39:12,76 and you know you know which ones are already tight. And yet very simple does one thing. 353 00:39:14,89 --> 00:39:17,70 Well really cool yeah it's really really cool 354 00:39:18,53 --> 00:39:25,29 and yeah as us walk you through the process of making it which is you know going back 355 00:39:25,30 --> 00:39:28,16 and reminding myself how to write javascript. 356 00:39:30,24 --> 00:39:37,43 Through all of the various you know tutorials and I mean I used to do a lot of coding and now it's arrest 357 00:39:38,06 --> 00:39:46,28 but one thing that was so funny is that I found it to be so hard to find a place just to upload this one single you 358 00:39:46,29 --> 00:39:55,04 know single page because now like my own web site it sounds where stays like you can't do this you can't post it to my 359 00:39:55,98 --> 00:40:00,11 Google Drive or Dropbox anymore so I had to go through all these options. 360 00:40:00,43 --> 00:40:08,50 And I finally did I'm getting like I tried to get help a long time ago and it. Still scary. 361 00:40:09,73 --> 00:40:12,45 Yes but it did it for you guys. 362 00:40:14,57 --> 00:40:18,00 This is really cool Yes So when you get to choose just describe a little bit more 363 00:40:18,08 --> 00:40:25,09 when you get shoes at least in my browser a new tab is open. And there's a phrase that's loaded into Google. 364 00:40:26,29 --> 00:40:30,06 That is the person's name and so it's it might be a phrase 365 00:40:30,07 --> 00:40:36,81 and I assume that like I'm getting an A person's name with the word artist at the end which maybe gives that Google 366 00:40:36,82 --> 00:40:38,94 Search Result little bit more specificity as to. 367 00:40:40,81 --> 00:40:48,81 That's really great and the Submit looks like goes to your unison in knowledge us very very you know low technology. 368 00:40:50,13 --> 00:40:57,40 That's cool too I mean I think it seems like a human touch there might be good just in case like if you got like of 369 00:40:57,41 --> 00:40:58,12 weird. 370 00:40:59,26 --> 00:41:06,13 I don't like it seems like it's a it's a little bit like a database of someone's a people's names is always a little 371 00:41:06,14 --> 00:41:08,78 bit sketchy so it's nice to have a human touch 372 00:41:08,79 --> 00:41:14,83 and they're going to make sure everything is kosher that is it's just that's only what needs to be there 373 00:41:14,89 --> 00:41:20,15 and it's way up front like yeah this isn't Again this is a group of names that hung knows. 374 00:41:21,18 --> 00:41:26,50 It's a starting place you know it was talkin to well to a kid to do an atom 375 00:41:26,51 --> 00:41:30,72 and make sure I'm pronouncing his last name right he said I'm going to try to get it for a future episode he was 376 00:41:30,73 --> 00:41:36,40 working as a visiting artistic Colombia but I was talking to him about diversity programming 377 00:41:36,97 --> 00:41:41,24 and he was saying you know diversity programming should often feel uncomfortable. 378 00:41:42,30 --> 00:41:49,25 And so he was really pushing against the notion like OK we have our diversity officer so everyone can you know back to 379 00:41:49,26 --> 00:41:51,99 business as normal and I feel like. 380 00:41:53,21 --> 00:42:00,22 Yeah it's not universal and it's not perfect and that's not truly random like consing but the way to go. 381 00:42:00,25 --> 00:42:08,44 That representation is to get this it's like halfway between crowdsourcing and curation and it's great and I'm 382 00:42:08,48 --> 00:42:10,85 and this is a tool I can actually use. 383 00:42:11,97 --> 00:42:18,05 I'm really excited about it yeah it's really cool it's cool it is I mean it is a tailor 384 00:42:18,06 --> 00:42:20,04 and I have had many conversations about. 385 00:42:21,94 --> 00:42:27,10 Who even with a podcast like this that has like one hundred eighty listeners an episode 386 00:42:27,11 --> 00:42:34,24 or whatever like you are making choices every yes we do you're making choices about who you're foregrounding 387 00:42:34,25 --> 00:42:38,32 or who yours you know speaking with their whatever 388 00:42:38,33 --> 00:42:45,19 and so like it it's important even at a small scale to just be thinking through like who who's work. 389 00:42:46,28 --> 00:42:50,22 And this goes back to Taylor saying about who do we just want to be hanging out with you know like 390 00:42:50,23 --> 00:42:56,16 and who want to be like and how do we sort of be thoughtful about who we pick so that's cool really cool. 391 00:42:57,77 --> 00:43:01,32 Awesome OK So let me show you this. 392 00:43:03,86 --> 00:43:07,32 Might might take a little bit more in there aeration than everybody else's 393 00:43:07,33 --> 00:43:14,05 but so so I had two arms to my project initially I was thinking about bleak strategies 394 00:43:14,41 --> 00:43:19,90 and yeah for those that are unfamiliar at this was Bryant you know and you guess remember who the collaborator was. 395 00:43:21,58 --> 00:43:27,85 Heater Schmidt Peter Smith excellent so I'm uploading like my skin angles you know you know. 396 00:43:32,63 --> 00:43:36,88 So I'm uploading images for these guys for them not to talk about them just yet. 397 00:43:38,10 --> 00:43:40,06 So initially I was seeing a bit overly strategies 398 00:43:40,07 --> 00:43:44,41 and I thought well I've been really into so I did this panel at the college 399 00:43:44,42 --> 00:43:50,55 or association this year where it turned me on to and I think we might have talked about this previously 400 00:43:50,56 --> 00:43:57,18 but it turned me on a critical making There was this piece critical making which I think was a series of Tenzin this 401 00:43:57,57 --> 00:44:00,22 and it was coming out of a couple of academic. 402 00:44:00,35 --> 00:44:06,98 Let's And it was guarded Hertz who was responding to read O's use of the term in two thousand 403 00:44:06,99 --> 00:44:13,47 and seven so kind of trying to think about how critical thinking stacks up against critical making right 404 00:44:13,55 --> 00:44:20,20 and how critical thinking seems like a totally sensical term of a critical making did not 405 00:44:20,60 --> 00:44:25,64 and so I was trying to approach Oblique Strategies which is usually stuff like do it backwards 406 00:44:25,68 --> 00:44:31,37 or like doing you know upside down or like these really sort of Oblique Strategies 407 00:44:31,66 --> 00:44:35,38 and I was trying to think of how to make them really specific 408 00:44:35,39 --> 00:44:40,69 and practical so I was coming at it from this idea of like orthogonal strategies 409 00:44:40,98 --> 00:44:44,34 and I was just trying to come up with a list of suggestions that I had 410 00:44:44,35 --> 00:44:50,80 when working in the wood shop that were sort of creative or philosophical in nature 411 00:44:50,81 --> 00:44:58,00 but definitely really practical so that there are things like stuff that I do like it the second I make my second big 412 00:44:58,01 --> 00:45:00,62 mistake I always quit for the day you know that was one. 413 00:45:01,97 --> 00:45:07,27 There's other stuff like try to end the day on a solution rather than a problem because then you're happy on the night 414 00:45:07,35 --> 00:45:09,38 and you're excited to get back the next day. 415 00:45:10,95 --> 00:45:16,21 And then there's really direct stuff like if you think something might be hot test the heat with the back of your hand 416 00:45:16,22 --> 00:45:19,81 instead of your palm because you can't keep working if you burn your. 417 00:45:23,75 --> 00:45:25,25 Seriously but then your pipe 418 00:45:25,26 --> 00:45:31,08 and smoke it there is stuff like Avoid the temptation to save coded aeration is with names like new test twelve. 419 00:45:34,31 --> 00:45:40,26 The process of articulating questions online will often offer insight or fully answer that very question 420 00:45:41,25 --> 00:45:47,10 and then one that I was really excited to put down was if the whole internet hasn't figured out your question yet you 421 00:45:47,11 --> 00:45:54,40 probably haven't either unless you have them good job so I was working on this project with the scripts of mine Woody 422 00:45:55,19 --> 00:46:00,22 and so he's making this big he comes from the heart of like letterpress background. 423 00:46:00,25 --> 00:46:08,18 So he's making the equivalent of a typing keyboard it's called a California case if I'm not mistaken where you would 424 00:46:08,19 --> 00:46:13,76 actually pull out the metal letters and then arrange them to make no physical prints 425 00:46:14,56 --> 00:46:20,91 and so he's making one that's a digital version where you interrupt these beams of light so you reach your fingers into 426 00:46:20,92 --> 00:46:26,06 the same boxes you would normally use to pull out a metal character but in this case it's digital. 427 00:46:27,38 --> 00:46:34,72 And so he came up with this thing while we're working together to it's a python script to help a particular version of 428 00:46:34,73 --> 00:46:38,74 the or tween Omega act like a keyboard which it can't do natively 429 00:46:39,30 --> 00:46:45,02 and as we are working on the solution I was saying will do we can't find the solution anywhere online really developed 430 00:46:45,03 --> 00:46:50,01 doubtful that we figured it out but we did. And that was like a good tip. 431 00:46:52,04 --> 00:46:55,43 Anyway so so I had a whole list of these I was kind of going through me 432 00:46:55,44 --> 00:46:59,15 and I felt like there was some cool stuff in there but I'm just I'm no writer 433 00:46:59,98 --> 00:47:03,09 and I felt unsatisfied So the thing that I wound up on. 434 00:47:04,31 --> 00:47:09,95 Which did it was kind of a return to code if you guys take a look at the first image 435 00:47:09,96 --> 00:47:18,57 and upload it I took a metal pipe in the bin this was an attachment a friend of mine Brant Stansbury at the Art 436 00:47:18,58 --> 00:47:21,75 Institute in the home you might remember Brian his client. 437 00:47:22,85 --> 00:47:26,71 Who I think is now to Baltimore but he had made a spring loaded attachment for the C.N.C. 438 00:47:26,72 --> 00:47:29,73 He could put a big pan into so that you could use the C.N.C. 439 00:47:29,74 --> 00:47:34,49 Is a big plodding machine so I reverse engineer it a little bit 440 00:47:34,50 --> 00:47:40,76 and swap it out for an etching needle so the same for like dry points in a copper sheet 441 00:47:41,21 --> 00:47:49,46 and then you guys are seeing the results of those experiments so when you go ahead and describe. A. Cup or say and. 442 00:47:51,83 --> 00:48:02,91 Then you know they're. Tired. And by. Well. And sound. 443 00:48:04,46 --> 00:48:17,64 And then the second one and a trend that came from that which is. Like the family and. Would. 444 00:48:19,00 --> 00:48:20,63 Like nice people and he is. 445 00:48:23,35 --> 00:48:31,05 This is so this is a show it's a Meghan Sterling at the at the print shop at Columbia so she looked me up because I had 446 00:48:31,06 --> 00:48:35,70 it's been twenty years since I did this kind of printing so I have to ask men to 447 00:48:35,74 --> 00:48:43,96 but it was it was whatever paper she provided and when. In Like point like. 448 00:48:46,43 --> 00:48:53,08 Kind of its core just isometric drawing and it's like the Revici kashrus 449 00:48:53,53 --> 00:49:06,88 and being like you know yeah objects that are coming in the toys bottom right. And. 450 00:49:11,37 --> 00:49:16,54 Indeed you know what was the decision making that was going on read and now. 451 00:49:17,73 --> 00:49:23,76 Yes curious about it yes so so one of the things I've really enjoyed about this podcast is that. 452 00:49:25,10 --> 00:49:28,08 I have this ongoing deadline read every two weeks 453 00:49:28,12 --> 00:49:32,97 and so in a lot of cases I'm returning to in some cases it's ideas that are brand new 454 00:49:33,75 --> 00:49:41,25 but in other cases it's something that's been sitting in a waiting for instigation to move the process you know a 455 00:49:41,26 --> 00:49:42,63 significant step forward. 456 00:49:43,74 --> 00:49:46,05 So I've been playing around and processing 457 00:49:46,06 --> 00:49:51,24 and later with grasshopper in terms of these semi random arrangements of isometric cubes 458 00:49:51,83 --> 00:49:56,06 but I hadn't really been sure about the output because I find digital printing kind of coal. 459 00:49:57,27 --> 00:50:00,96 And so this was an opportunity once I realize the sea. And C. 460 00:50:01,84 --> 00:50:03,92 Was a good fit for this kind of production 461 00:50:03,93 --> 00:50:12,41 and I like the way that the sort of classical printing method brought some warmth Bethany back into the process so 462 00:50:12,42 --> 00:50:19,69 there's a bunch of moments where I'm relinquishing control first of all I give the control over the computer 463 00:50:20,24 --> 00:50:23,17 and that's you know debatable as to whether I'm losing control 464 00:50:23,18 --> 00:50:27,23 or not because the computer is supposedly so good at reproducing. 465 00:50:28,51 --> 00:50:32,40 Instructions but then again I'm not doing this by hand the computers doing it 466 00:50:33,06 --> 00:50:39,59 but then at the same time because this has been sort of in process for about ten years you know brand stands for a made 467 00:50:39,60 --> 00:50:43,51 the original attachment I modified it to put the needle and 468 00:50:43,67 --> 00:50:50,14 but that I had a student in one of my classes who was at a stopping point in his work so I test him with sort of 469 00:50:50,15 --> 00:50:57,08 finishing off this attachment I work with the shop staff to get it integrated with the tool correctly I worked with 470 00:50:57,09 --> 00:51:00,39 Megan Sterling in the printing process which I was really 471 00:51:00,40 --> 00:51:05,09 and familiar with so there were all these different hands in the mix and I think that. 472 00:51:06,13 --> 00:51:10,61 You know at the end of the day that's the most honest way that an artist works or I mean clearly 473 00:51:10,62 --> 00:51:13,05 when you are researching those 474 00:51:14,00 --> 00:51:19,60 when you're looking through this kind of colonialist documents there's a lot of people participating in your work 475 00:51:20,11 --> 00:51:25,67 and I think there's a pressure on us to carve out a space and say this is me you know this is mine 476 00:51:26,20 --> 00:51:32,12 but then at the end of the day it's just this kind of cast of thousands and you dip in there for a moment 477 00:51:32,51 --> 00:51:38,45 and add your particular flavor so so I just really enjoyed being super honest about that like here's all these 478 00:51:38,46 --> 00:51:43,77 different people not only is it processing doing something so my random but it's like five 479 00:51:43,78 --> 00:51:49,73 or six different people some of whom are in a position above me you know 480 00:51:49,74 --> 00:51:57,28 and some of whom are in position below me in a very stupid way of assessing those things make sense for it like they're 481 00:51:57,29 --> 00:52:00,22 students and they're working their staff and they're working. 482 00:52:00,25 --> 00:52:07,82 And faculty other friends that are artists to get to that result. Yeah it's cool I mean I really think. 483 00:52:09,03 --> 00:52:14,22 I had this epiphany and I'm sure this is a very low bar epiphany for a multitude of Mobile 484 00:52:14,54 --> 00:52:20,69 but like you know that like phrase pull yourself up by your bootstraps sure you know and it's like OK 485 00:52:20,70 --> 00:52:24,78 but then like someone actually made those bootstraps 486 00:52:24,83 --> 00:52:29,50 and designed this so that you could do that right like I like that 487 00:52:29,51 --> 00:52:34,55 and yet no no no go ahead I want to say Hawking to someone to. 488 00:52:35,79 --> 00:52:42,08 People about this phrase and how it was coined by Benjamin Franklin 489 00:52:42,44 --> 00:52:50,28 and thing about his success is that it's all due to like his sister and his wife and their incredible support 490 00:52:50,29 --> 00:52:59,71 and labor so yeah that's a nice part of the entire mythology of you know this kind of individual labor 491 00:52:59,72 --> 00:53:08,66 and you know genius that yeah I need. You to yourself up by your bootstraps that your sister and wife made. 492 00:53:11,57 --> 00:53:17,45 It Out Of You And of course part of the point of that old saw was that it's impossible to do. 493 00:53:18,53 --> 00:53:20,72 And it is indeed possible that. 494 00:53:22,16 --> 00:53:30,31 Right here I have I have a nerdy question for you were you know about the modification to make the etching. 495 00:53:31,61 --> 00:53:34,89 My my I think that's super rad 496 00:53:34,90 --> 00:53:42,64 and I am I I'm a fan of the actually draw which is like an Evil Mad Science This varies like it's like a C.N.C. 497 00:53:42,65 --> 00:53:47,95 Machine for repaint and then markers and it's really super cool and. 498 00:53:49,37 --> 00:53:56,55 I had been curious about something very similar to what you just did for a long time so I'm always hope Wow he did it 499 00:53:56,56 --> 00:54:01,97 he did it. It's the it's. Seems like a hard ons on your C.N.C. 500 00:54:01,98 --> 00:54:08,59 Machine because of the drag is it just so light in copper that it doesn't it's not actually big of a deal at all 501 00:54:08,76 --> 00:54:12,44 or is it. So you have to multiple passes or. 502 00:54:14,02 --> 00:54:20,51 So my understanding is that there's two ways to go about making it edging plate so copper of course is saw you know 503 00:54:20,52 --> 00:54:24,40 that you have a steel needle so I get like a really ill cheapo needle 504 00:54:24,88 --> 00:54:29,51 and if you imagine take a steel tube that's half an inch in diameter 505 00:54:29,69 --> 00:54:32,41 and then the interior diameter of course is less 506 00:54:32,94 --> 00:54:40,14 and then if you come up with an additional two that nests really well in that master two so it kind of slides down in 507 00:54:40,15 --> 00:54:47,15 there you cut you cut the larger tube in such a way that you leave it on it so if you slide the smaller tube inside it 508 00:54:47,16 --> 00:54:52,69 can't fall at the bottom OK so if you have a couple of those pieces you can 509 00:54:52,70 --> 00:54:59,23 and so this is originally made for a Bic pen right so if you imagine jamming a big hand into that smaller tube 510 00:54:59,79 --> 00:55:05,81 and then sliding both of those into the larger two it's going to allow just a small part of the pen departure route. 511 00:55:06,89 --> 00:55:11,75 And then on the back end he make a little plug with similarly sized to the interior diameter 512 00:55:11,76 --> 00:55:16,03 and put a spring on it so depending on how long you make the master to 513 00:55:16,41 --> 00:55:22,21 and how hard the spring is you can adjust what the tension of the springs going to be. 514 00:55:23,23 --> 00:55:28,22 So so what I had my student Michael working on was he threaded the inside of the large two 515 00:55:28,82 --> 00:55:31,25 and then we ran a bolt into it 516 00:55:31,29 --> 00:55:36,59 and then ground down the head until it was the same diameter as the threads themselves 517 00:55:37,36 --> 00:55:39,84 and the nice thing was that the collet on the C.N.C. 518 00:55:39,85 --> 00:55:46,47 Machine could accept a half inch diameter so we could just stick this thing in and pretend like it was any other C. 519 00:55:46,48 --> 00:55:53,72 and C. and Mill but then when we were calculating the tool pads we just told it not to sweet talk to spin that. 520 00:55:55,31 --> 00:56:00,18 The cutting motor at zero basically so you just so in other. 521 00:56:00,25 --> 00:56:02,80 Ace's you would have had it like strap it to the side of the thing 522 00:56:03,27 --> 00:56:11,09 but yes case we just inserted it right in there so this was if I understand correctly this is dry point where we just 523 00:56:11,10 --> 00:56:14,39 had a piece of copper and you're scratching pretty deep. 524 00:56:15,77 --> 00:56:18,45 So what that means is that you had really high birds 525 00:56:18,51 --> 00:56:26,64 and sort of surprisingly even though it's a computerized approach the lines are pretty hairy right so you get a lot of. 526 00:56:28,05 --> 00:56:32,04 Some people might say it's like a warmth in the land some people its might say it's a bit print. 527 00:56:33,34 --> 00:56:40,85 Those And those birds will get knocked down as they subsequently run through the press so so the next test is to back 528 00:56:40,86 --> 00:56:43,97 up the spring temp the spring tension a way off 529 00:56:44,51 --> 00:56:50,84 and then to try running this with a sheet of resists applied so you're just barely scraping off the resists 530 00:56:50,88 --> 00:56:58,84 and then you go through a chemical edge that may produce a much finer result it's not going to have those hairy edges 531 00:56:58,85 --> 00:57:08,93 on the print. Well it's that hard to actually second way and with that resist and. Try playing. 532 00:57:10,03 --> 00:57:13,84 And I think you know when thing that you can chime in that. 533 00:57:16,50 --> 00:57:23,85 Insists that you and or with this in general with pain making is that you have like. 534 00:57:25,02 --> 00:57:28,73 Like a finished version here you know it's like the composition is right 535 00:57:29,50 --> 00:57:34,87 but you could try something where you do like when she print and then. 536 00:57:35,95 --> 00:57:41,12 Run it through the thing again and add another shape print that and that 537 00:57:41,28 --> 00:57:48,80 and you know keep going with ink keep layering net so that you then have like all of these you know different trains 538 00:57:48,84 --> 00:57:51,10 that show the faces that it. 539 00:57:52,32 --> 00:57:54,07 You know and I mean 540 00:57:54,08 --> 00:58:00,16 and then within that there's like so many different variations printmaking it's actually a really interesting one. 541 00:58:00,56 --> 00:58:06,57 To do in relationship to algorithms like in the solo it kind of way of thinking about all of the different variations 542 00:58:06,58 --> 00:58:11,52 because when you think about it like there's so many different variations like 543 00:58:11,53 --> 00:58:17,88 and you know just like the way that you're using the ear whether you're doing it as a relief or. 544 00:58:19,15 --> 00:58:24,94 Putting in you know in the groups at the plate different color combinations 545 00:58:25,02 --> 00:58:31,69 and working with paper you know there are so many different. So yes only really fun. 546 00:58:34,37 --> 00:58:36,50 And yet about it in this like time. 547 00:58:38,30 --> 00:58:46,49 I think it could certainly occupy months at this point so great example of a project where I mean I think I got the 548 00:58:46,50 --> 00:58:53,52 start I got this done because I had the design already I get it done between like ten am and three pm. 549 00:58:54,99 --> 00:59:01,34 It was a funny example of working all week I get obliques melodies with I'm going to do it 550 00:59:01,35 --> 00:59:07,19 and I had to say was like yeah I think it was Wednesday because I thought initially we were taping on Thursday 551 00:59:07,20 --> 00:59:11,11 and it just came out really fast so that was that was great that's great. 552 00:59:12,75 --> 00:59:17,96 That's awesome Wow Solent mic great show dude's Yeah I don't care you pick we nailed it. 553 00:59:19,04 --> 00:59:24,77 Yeah sure now how do you do you realize what's next the crucially part is on the edge 554 00:59:24,78 --> 00:59:30,75 and you know it says that now we're going to talk about folders I was wrong last. 555 00:59:32,98 --> 00:59:36,85 Week so so we could do that what we're into the past or we could. 556 00:59:37,97 --> 00:59:40,89 Listen to we can really win this to what we're into OK cool. 557 00:59:43,50 --> 00:59:49,24 I could go back you go first I guess the I only have one I have a couple things I guess the 558 00:59:49,28 --> 00:59:54,28 but the one item I have is is the bone Holder and the bone folder. 559 00:59:55,60 --> 01:00:00,07 Is really cool my partner Jim introduced me to this really. 560 01:00:00,38 --> 01:00:06,89 Device it is called a bone folder because it's made out of bone you can also get the made out of plastic 561 01:00:06,90 --> 01:00:12,78 but there are some actual kind of structural reasons why they're made out of bone I made the little yellow fold over 562 01:00:12,79 --> 01:00:17,36 postcards of my project with the bone folder and what you how you use it is you. 563 01:00:18,54 --> 01:00:24,06 Bookmakers I think especially you know you're folding paper a lot and what you want 564 01:00:24,10 --> 01:00:27,46 when you fold a piece of paper over is a very clean edge on your folder 565 01:00:27,47 --> 01:00:29,92 or what you might want is a very clean edge on your fold. 566 01:00:31,49 --> 01:00:37,15 And for a couple reasons one is you know your it takes up less vertical space so you can sort of pack more pages into 567 01:00:37,16 --> 01:00:41,08 your book if they have a very clean edge in it and it just looks nice right. 568 01:00:42,18 --> 01:00:49,66 And folder just to describe it a little bit is it looks like a giant popsicle stick 569 01:00:49,70 --> 01:00:53,88 or like a tongue depressor I mean if they make those like wooden tongue depressors 570 01:00:53,89 --> 01:00:57,03 but I think of it as a giant popsicle stick kind of shape. 571 01:00:58,93 --> 01:01:07,17 And the is nice about it being made out of bone is it's extremely rigid so like you could really bear down on it if you 572 01:01:07,18 --> 01:01:10,50 want to and it's not going to been really at all because it's a this is. 573 01:01:11,74 --> 01:01:16,80 Rigid and secure as a as your your own bone is and these are here to be made out of how bone. 574 01:01:18,91 --> 01:01:21,77 And you know a bone is there it's highly polished bill 575 01:01:21,78 --> 01:01:27,77 and so it's extremely smooth so it rolls quite smoothly over cardstock and it doesn't sort of Mar disco 576 01:01:27,78 --> 01:01:30,50 or the paper in a way that plastic or something might 577 01:01:30,51 --> 01:01:36,24 and so it's a really really cool device if you buy one it will last you a lifetime. 578 01:01:37,60 --> 01:01:42,04 And my partner Jen has a couple and she is working with that tool. 579 01:01:43,53 --> 01:01:45,91 Probably at least a weekly basis if not almost daily 580 01:01:46,29 --> 01:01:52,58 and it has a really nice aware mark in it where you can kind of see that she's used it a ton which is a really 581 01:01:52,59 --> 01:01:57,73 beautiful in the aspect of the tool and all that to want to show it so if someone wants to. 582 01:01:58,74 --> 01:02:04,00 Get one at all sure the one I have. If I were to let you have one as well I could show that one as well. 583 01:02:05,02 --> 01:02:13,77 So I have a bogus story all right surely the shorts so there's a there is this I supply store can now. 584 01:02:15,05 --> 01:02:17,13 I think it's canal. 585 01:02:18,75 --> 01:02:24,54 It's the one I'm in New York on can now I can remember what it's called now but it was never ever just recently. 586 01:02:25,62 --> 01:02:33,53 Fortunately because that is going to like massive change but OK I used to go to the store like weekly 587 01:02:33,74 --> 01:02:42,07 and ask for book because it merely wanted a book every week they're like oh we're going to order and kept going 588 01:02:42,08 --> 01:02:45,86 and going and going and then the damn place closed down I was like. 589 01:02:48,48 --> 01:02:57,66 I'm never going to get my phone fall there and then so I just recently. Have. My own. 590 01:02:59,66 --> 01:03:04,54 That's my story you can edit that out it's not that crazy but that's right yeah. 591 01:03:07,20 --> 01:03:11,52 OK So do I go now my list of things that I'm into because there are. 592 01:03:14,74 --> 01:03:24,04 I so I want to bring up another project that involves randomness that that I have been touching 593 01:03:24,09 --> 01:03:33,74 and I've had goings for twelve years now and it's it could be a fun one for your audience of the dream machine 594 01:03:34,46 --> 01:03:35,90 and it's a. 595 01:03:37,50 --> 01:03:44,30 It's an archive a dream archive an exchange and it's one where you just call a number 596 01:03:44,31 --> 01:03:49,02 and record your dream like the dream that you have the night while you're sleeping 597 01:03:49,66 --> 01:03:57,89 and then it calls you back with somebody else's dream. Chooses from the database randomly quote unquote. 598 01:04:01,13 --> 01:04:09,51 So it's an effort to send this out there in the world if anybody's interested in it seven seven seven seven five two 599 01:04:09,88 --> 01:04:14,44 soprano and thinking about her and things but as far as things and. 600 01:04:16,45 --> 01:04:27,08 OK so connected to chance the rapper I've been really into no name it's musician and rapper coming out of Chicago. 601 01:04:28,91 --> 01:04:35,91 It's. Hope and inspiration in these times. 602 01:04:37,08 --> 01:04:45,44 I also owe Oh OK So this is connected to the whole stand up comedy thing which I was really sad that I think yet 603 01:04:45,45 --> 01:04:48,92 actually I was really fat even so I have the cut to a lot after. 604 01:04:50,83 --> 01:04:56,30 But I've been listening to a lot of two ducklings it's a really and yes. 605 01:04:57,35 --> 01:05:02,56 And then also I saw Laurie Anderson the other night and. 606 01:05:04,49 --> 01:05:09,08 And it's hanging out or so we were just you know picking at you know. 607 01:05:11,83 --> 01:05:14,47 I went to see her live issues amazing 608 01:05:14,86 --> 01:05:23,57 but she started this set with I really wanted to do a stand up comedy act tonight but I only know two shows 609 01:05:23,77 --> 01:05:32,45 and of course in a very Laurie Anderson way her entire act and being in comedy it was hilarious and dark and you know. 610 01:05:33,57 --> 01:05:41,84 It was amazing. And then S. Far as I'm reading it right now I'm in the middle of reading. 611 01:05:43,72 --> 01:05:54,71 The other direction or yeah and you know it's. On the. Wrong. 612 01:06:00,50 --> 01:06:06,30 Wow that's a hell of a list that's awesome as a great list yeah yeah thanks for thanks for sharing those it's really 613 01:06:06,31 --> 01:06:12,56 important part of the podcast The my opinion like I think it's like a thing that is just really nice 614 01:06:12,57 --> 01:06:17,47 and I think in the air like in The Post blog Internet world like we kind of get so little of that these days. 615 01:06:18,97 --> 01:06:24,19 We get a lot of opinions but not a lot of things that we are like and so it's really nice to hear this I think. 616 01:06:25,91 --> 01:06:31,15 And you know I'm just going to follow it up with some sort of showed 617 01:06:31,16 --> 01:06:37,00 and for oid snark I've shared with you guys this links if you've been following the whole thing with you sero. 618 01:06:38,80 --> 01:06:39,45 Know it and. 619 01:06:40,72 --> 01:06:48,05 So if you follow this link so you Syria is this start if they get I think it was one hundred twenty million dollars in 620 01:06:48,76 --> 01:06:49,38 funding 621 01:06:49,84 --> 01:06:56,65 and they spent it all before they do it to say allegedly all the time like I don't even know so I read your listener. 622 01:06:58,33 --> 01:07:01,22 Anyway it's so there's this there's this device that you cereal 623 01:07:01,23 --> 01:07:06,98 and you buy these really special juice packs in mylar and you stick it in that you cereal and it squishes 624 01:07:06,99 --> 01:07:13,25 and it makes you juice and it reads the Q.R. Codes and all this sort of high sixty. And see if it's like. 625 01:07:15,61 --> 01:07:18,39 It's like seven hundred bucks Yeah it's an Internet 626 01:07:19,36 --> 01:07:23,36 and I think it I think the price drops after people start getting freaked out 627 01:07:23,37 --> 01:07:27,43 but the thing was that if you just take the bag and squeeze it with your hands he. 628 01:07:28,83 --> 01:07:34,84 Makes an excellent thing so there's this really I believe I got to the stewardess technic had this great Chicago based 629 01:07:35,71 --> 01:07:38,66 technology journalism outlet but if you look at this. 630 01:07:40,28 --> 01:07:48,09 Blog deadbolt IOW this guy does a tear down kind of like what's the big teardown site that does all the new Apple 631 01:07:48,10 --> 01:07:51,20 products is just tear down the name for it but. 632 01:07:52,25 --> 01:07:54,15 So this guy tears it tears down that you sirrah 633 01:07:54,16 --> 01:08:00,22 and comes from supposedly really you know intense industrial design background and really talk. 634 01:08:00,34 --> 01:08:07,39 About all of these ridiculous decisions that were made throughout the design which include things like a lot of custom 635 01:08:07,40 --> 01:08:08,02 C.N.C. 636 01:08:08,07 --> 01:08:08,76 Parts 637 01:08:09,24 --> 01:08:16,56 and then there's some basically talks about how the design is to get it right because this thing he's doing is just 638 01:08:16,57 --> 01:08:21,34 squishing a plastic bag. But it does you know with this big lake. 639 01:08:22,37 --> 01:08:23,67 Custom gear motor 640 01:08:23,68 --> 01:08:30,54 and there's all these parts I think he goes into this whole thing about how there's multiple melted plastics where you 641 01:08:30,55 --> 01:08:36,38 have to have these really special is that can cast a plastic on top of another plastic and. 642 01:08:37,97 --> 01:08:38,75 Just take a look 643 01:08:38,76 --> 01:08:47,34 but it's like it's it's industrial fetishism to the extreme even as it's also taking the piss out of this company for 644 01:08:47,35 --> 01:08:51,78 making these ridiculous choices like the choices are so good they're bad 645 01:08:52,19 --> 01:08:54,76 but I found the state really incredible to follow 646 01:08:55,28 --> 01:09:02,37 and instead of just being that sort of standard issue let's laugh at a Silicon Valley startup This is a really really 647 01:09:02,89 --> 01:09:06,52 really research version of laughing at Silicon Valley start. 648 01:09:07,98 --> 01:09:15,39 That's what I fix it I fix it I think is the type fix that that's exactly right I think yeah I followed that a little 649 01:09:15,40 --> 01:09:18,59 bit and. I was like I mean. 650 01:09:19,63 --> 01:09:27,76 I am me a master of brainstorming something that could totally be solved by something way simpler like that like it's 651 01:09:27,80 --> 01:09:34,19 really my coding style is like like let me make this like Dick Asli overbuilt thing in order to do something that like 652 01:09:34,63 --> 01:09:37,89 if I just read the documentation thing already does or something but. 653 01:09:40,70 --> 01:09:44,84 Did you say right you I said there I imagine there's some sort of like. 654 01:09:47,25 --> 01:09:55,25 You get these bags of fruit or something to stick in the juice or than that you say oh sort of is a I mean. 655 01:09:56,83 --> 01:10:02,68 Like a motorized clamp kind of squish is the bag and. Come here Jews and I mean it. 656 01:10:05,31 --> 01:10:13,83 I can't help but be like you know like the point of drinking having a juicer is that you're using fresh fruits 657 01:10:13,84 --> 01:10:17,79 and vegetables to make the juice with Mike who. 658 01:10:18,95 --> 01:10:30,27 You know getting on a subscription based like cryogenically like whatever pacts bags of fruit just seems like really 659 01:10:30,28 --> 01:10:31,35 missing the point like. 660 01:10:32,71 --> 01:10:37,20 The can you know I don't know like seems not too hard to like core an apple 661 01:10:37,21 --> 01:10:42,63 and throw it in there as opposed to like I'd still have time to do that but you know maybe our next show 662 01:10:42,64 --> 01:10:46,34 and see we can't suggest a challenge so this is out but 663 01:10:46,35 --> 01:10:52,16 but imagine the look on Larry the next oh don't worry OK I don't know if it was really. 664 01:10:54,10 --> 01:10:56,62 You know how to make this possible to Syria. 665 01:10:58,84 --> 01:11:04,33 To maybe United just to try to do that anyway on the united effort there if you ever have an audience member 666 01:11:04,34 --> 01:11:10,97 or a challenge or drop it will make it to Syria I just you know I just feel like there are stories behind the. 667 01:11:13,01 --> 01:11:28,02 You know. Yeah there. Was his writing in the back and forth and this is just trash. Now that one sentence there. 668 01:11:31,02 --> 01:11:39,63 So that you are just teasing your idea hung so I think that time has come together so OK you know I have been thinking 669 01:11:39,64 --> 01:11:42,71 about this time I mean not this particular 670 01:11:42,72 --> 01:11:51,69 but I've been thinking about this the larger issue of nacre culture you know this culture that we you know that we're 671 01:11:51,70 --> 01:12:05,10 all like engaging and hard. And I think it says. Very much. White male audience and you know producers and. 672 01:12:07,67 --> 01:12:12,38 And there's also this really rich conversation around race right now that. 673 01:12:15,57 --> 01:12:19,71 You know I'm sure you guys have been a part of and different ways 674 01:12:19,72 --> 01:12:25,16 and you know the missing heart that I see is that there's not a lot of. 675 01:12:26,65 --> 01:12:28,36 There's not a lot of artists 676 01:12:28,37 --> 01:12:35,03 or not a lot of people in general that are talking about whiteness you know like average tired of everybody every time 677 01:12:35,04 --> 01:12:38,69 somebody want to talk about race they choose like an ethnicity 678 01:12:39,04 --> 01:12:46,83 and they talk about it that they choose to make of that historic event and then they you know make a project. 679 01:12:47,94 --> 01:13:05,87 So the problem for next week is whiteness. Love it. That's good that's good it's good. 680 01:13:09,21 --> 01:13:11,54 Those great statesmen you know that. 681 01:13:13,06 --> 01:13:21,29 You mind if I just give a few like a little bit of information about what's going on with me in case people want to 682 01:13:21,59 --> 01:13:29,84 check out yeah so the show is that right now to name in his head and that the art museum 683 01:13:30,44 --> 01:13:39,32 and there is a curator Stuart was Julie Rodriguez went home and made and this lens Oh I don't know 684 01:13:39,33 --> 01:13:50,08 when this episode is going out but it will be a May tenth one P.M. and Then also I'll be doing. At the new. 685 01:13:51,57 --> 01:14:06,26 Major twenty four by thirty and that will be with. Laura King and three days. And that will be moderated by the. 686 01:14:10,93 --> 01:14:14,00 Nice yeah that's great but yeah it's awesome 687 01:14:14,34 --> 01:14:21,93 and just one more thing to finish with yeah wrist no no go for it because we needed it we needed something to show up 688 01:14:21,94 --> 01:14:24,04 and screw for Ken Nordine and so is thinking that 689 01:14:24,08 --> 01:14:29,02 when I was a kid I went to a non-denominational Unitarian youth group. 690 01:14:31,10 --> 01:14:38,34 Which the Simpsons always makes fun of and so in we did it we did a version of Joseph in the Technicolor Dreamcoat 691 01:14:38,38 --> 01:14:44,90 and I think I still remember the colors from Joseph So I think I dreamed that are you ready to hear them in a bar Yes 692 01:14:45,62 --> 01:14:47,08 OK So it was. 693 01:14:48,16 --> 01:14:53,59 Red and yellow and green and brown and her and black in ochre and peach and Ruby and Olive Violet fondly like 694 01:14:53,60 --> 01:14:58,51 and golden chocolate a mop and cream and crimson and silver and rose and eleven and rest and gray and purple 695 01:14:58,52 --> 01:15:07,41 and white and pink in Origin blue blue. So So Rob if you could if you could shop and screw that. 696 01:15:08,60 --> 01:15:15,46 When you look if you hadn't said this OK I'm going to go yes you know as low as I can you know let's hear it ready 697 01:15:16,26 --> 01:15:27,11 Rob's lips. Folders are really. Yeah I mean how that's just like can already. 698 01:15:28,46 --> 01:15:33,72 We could drop that every time right before it rubs it to mention his picks for the week. 699 01:15:42,04 --> 01:15:46,70 It's anything else we're going to cover you know. I have a couple I have a. 700 01:15:48,57 --> 01:15:57,29 I have a couple of things to cover there just sort of. You know putting a bow on the episode type item he's. 701 01:15:58,96 --> 01:16:04,36 There there always are. And get. So. 702 01:16:06,73 --> 01:16:12,54 Website and our our stuff as well will be on projects that opposable podcast dot com. 703 01:16:13,66 --> 01:16:17,99 Will have tons of links to the show notes to all that stuff we talked about so if you're like What was that thing they 704 01:16:18,00 --> 01:16:25,83 said Who was that obelisk what all that stuff will be linked in the show so if you're in the pockets app or overcast 705 01:16:25,84 --> 01:16:29,95 or whatever it is you use if you just use the swipe down you'll be able to see all those links. 706 01:16:32,59 --> 01:16:39,78 And if you go to opposable podcast dot com you'll see those show links right there for you to click on full of cool 707 01:16:39,79 --> 01:16:47,44 stuff. I just wanted to second and say that we're at about one hundred and. 708 01:16:49,15 --> 01:16:59,37 Eighty or so average listens per pod cast so thank you to everyone who's been sharing it. I think I'm going to write. 709 01:17:01,08 --> 01:17:08,98 Well it's humble because it's not that big of a number. But it is also just bragging. 710 01:17:11,82 --> 01:17:22,66 I bet you're bragging to people that are ready in the know like yeah right that's you know yeah yeah yeah I guess I 711 01:17:22,67 --> 01:17:30,49 just wanted to say like if you like this podcast please share it like. We. 712 01:17:31,93 --> 01:17:37,22 Are a better podcast when we have a more interesting and diverse and broad set of listeners 713 01:17:37,64 --> 01:17:42,56 and people who respond to us and stuff so we would like to have people hear this 714 01:17:42,60 --> 01:17:44,64 and let them know let us know what they think and 715 01:17:44,95 --> 01:17:51,81 and help shape the podcast Also you're doing your laundry right now don't forget I mean separate those colors take the 716 01:17:51,82 --> 01:17:58,12 time that's right that's right usually warm is a just fine setting you don't have to hop. 717 01:18:01,95 --> 01:18:08,52 A shout out to the mighty wolf mask you did our logo you can check out his great illustration work at mask art U.K. 718 01:18:08,56 --> 01:18:15,86 He's a super super nice person and was really great to work with. And makes really wacky and fun stuff. 719 01:18:17,15 --> 01:18:23,25 A big shout out to the art supply posse which is a cool podcast who talked about art supplies 720 01:18:23,26 --> 01:18:24,39 and many other things they. 721 01:18:25,63 --> 01:18:29,39 Were a park as I had heard and definitely considered charming 722 01:18:29,40 --> 01:18:31,86 when I was thinking about what this podcast could be like 723 01:18:32,81 --> 01:18:36,69 and they gave us a really super nice shout out on their latest episode 724 01:18:36,74 --> 01:18:44,68 and I had to pull my car over because I was like oh my gosh this is so cool so so it was really really nice that I had 725 01:18:44,74 --> 01:18:49,69 I had a yeah unfortunately like with having coming back from work you're never on the freeway in L.A. 726 01:18:49,70 --> 01:18:53,77 You're always on like somebody's neighborhood street that they thought was quite peaceful 727 01:18:53,78 --> 01:18:59,79 and now there's everybody on the way is going through there but so I pulled over in a very residential neighborhood. 728 01:19:00,81 --> 01:19:02,20 But yeah it was rather. 729 01:19:03,67 --> 01:19:11,28 A big shout out to Luke our latest picture on patron Luke is a super cool great amazing interactive artist 730 01:19:11,29 --> 01:19:12,55 and virtual reality wizard. 731 01:19:13,68 --> 01:19:21,28 His work is is totally amazing and he does lots of stuff for the five inch really cool 732 01:19:21,74 --> 01:19:24,50 and if you'd like to join Kelly and Luke in the league of Patron support 733 01:19:24,51 --> 01:19:29,35 or bad asses please go to patron dot com slash opposable thumbs to sponsor us. 734 01:19:31,99 --> 01:19:37,01 If you want to sponsor the podcast with a thing that you make or build 735 01:19:37,02 --> 01:19:45,92 or service you provide We are accepting sponsorships money helps keep us paying the bills they're not big 736 01:19:45,93 --> 01:19:53,51 but we would like to to get some help paying those bills for what play hosting in our city didn't like kind of stuff 737 01:19:54,11 --> 01:20:00,14 and we give priority to independent businesses minority owned businesses and women. So if you have something. 738 01:20:00,32 --> 01:20:05,44 You want our very nerdy and enthusiastic listeners to know about give us a shout at opposable podcast. 739 01:20:07,88 --> 01:20:11,81 We do have a code of conduct on the pod casts and on the website 740 01:20:11,85 --> 01:20:18,10 and any message boards we post in our podcast is dedicated to providing a providing a harassment free experience for 741 01:20:18,11 --> 01:20:23,34 everyone regardless of race gender age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size 742 01:20:23,35 --> 01:20:26,03 or knowledge of subject matter or religion. 743 01:20:27,74 --> 01:20:32,93 We really support an inclusive environment and we want you to be a part of it so if we say something ridiculous 744 01:20:32,94 --> 01:20:38,09 and you're like What's up with that let us know you can check out our full code of conduct over at our site. 745 01:20:40,85 --> 01:20:48,15 What else what else I think that's it if you want to give us a shout like I said our e-mails probably the easiest way 746 01:20:48,16 --> 01:20:56,43 right now which is opposable podcast at GMO dot com I have some Annecy about creating some sort of form or something 747 01:20:56,44 --> 01:21:00,32 but I don't know it's hard to get all that stuff them into the park us at the same time. 748 01:21:02,91 --> 01:21:04,91 Hunger Taylor anything else on the way out. 749 01:21:08,26 --> 01:21:14,66 Yeah thanks thank you so much it's been really great story Yeah really great to to hear about your work 750 01:21:14,67 --> 01:21:22,86 and be able to help you know help share the word about what you're up to. Your work just so I can. 751 01:21:23,96 --> 01:21:32,75 Let people know about it willing to insurance is that your website know dot com and that's about H U O in. Com. 752 01:21:34,02 --> 01:21:43,76 There I have a he said I'm super into affairs right now. Called the bilinguals and it's a really cool. 753 01:21:44,86 --> 01:21:49,22 Investigation Yes maybe in a way of the Carolina chickadee which is. 754 01:21:52,00 --> 01:21:56,45 Has sort of two dialects that it can speak at the same time and. 755 01:21:57,51 --> 01:22:06,48 One of its own dialect and one of its kind of cousin and. It's a really great investigation into language and. 756 01:22:07,50 --> 01:22:11,76 Into relationships connected to language I felt like in this really neat way 757 01:22:11,77 --> 01:22:13,99 and so if you go to her website you can see that 758 01:22:14,00 --> 01:22:20,33 and a whole lot more Thank you that's a project that I want to do more of but I'd love to work on. 759 01:22:21,65 --> 01:22:35,69 A listener and you in a bilingual Housefull and I like to make noises for me. And yeah I get it in me. 760 01:22:37,96 --> 01:22:50,79 Yeah people please please give a shout. Thanks to all the. White ness is our next topic to vent. You know I'm. 761 01:22:54,61 --> 01:23:06,30 OK thanks a lot everybody thank you man outro music goes here. Eventual Lee. Maybe. In the future. 762 01:23:07,82 --> 01:23:17,81 If we have a future we made it more than one hour past where we were before I guess that counts for something. Right. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:16,07 --> 00:00:19,48 The time is now Marvin K. Mooney would you please. 2 00:00:21,13 --> 00:00:30,53 Have you have you started in your dead I'm reading Dr Seuss and so I have not we are reading. We are reading. 3 00:00:31,59 --> 00:00:43,35 We are reading books. But they are and we do have some doctors who books book Bedtime Stories. 4 00:00:45,98 --> 00:00:51,01 And some other doxies items. And. 5 00:00:55,67 --> 00:01:02,28 The White House you know the pronunciation close to the state rep it can you believe that it was not until this very 6 00:01:02,29 --> 00:01:10,00 second that I realized of course one of the central personal experiences that you have to draw upon your poster child. 7 00:01:11,13 --> 00:01:14,75 Yes it's true I'll be curious to hear if he comes up in this process 8 00:01:14,76 --> 00:01:18,97 but I guess I'm getting ahead of myself should we do the she would do the business to the. 9 00:01:20,57 --> 00:01:22,47 Well the entryway diamond cool. 10 00:01:23,50 --> 00:01:29,44 Welcome to the opposable thumb podcast opposable thumbs up I guess where I'm Rob tackling the creative challenge every 11 00:01:29,45 --> 00:01:32,49 two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 12 00:01:32,65 --> 00:01:38,38 and lessons learned we have no guest this week our guest of the episode could make it. 13 00:01:39,42 --> 00:01:45,24 An emergency So where where we're just flying pilot and copilot and a pilot pilot. 14 00:01:46,39 --> 00:01:50,12 For this episode if you want to be if you want to be a pilot it's cool it's going. 15 00:01:51,22 --> 00:01:58,70 It's like I remember somebody when I was a kid they had like it was like the wife and husband's name on the mailbox 16 00:01:58,71 --> 00:01:59,98 and it was the. 17 00:02:00,01 --> 00:02:04,58 Was written on there twice one with the woman same person with the man's name first 18 00:02:04,62 --> 00:02:10,75 and I thought that was like a little bit of like suburban. Equality I don't know what you call so. 19 00:02:12,57 --> 00:02:23,78 That's what we call woke suburban Yeah well. Yeah. I interrupted you as oh no it's all good. 20 00:02:25,23 --> 00:02:29,48 Yeah my name is Robert I run the exoskeleton arts based in Los Angeles 21 00:02:29,54 --> 00:02:37,70 and I'm also an experienced director at an interactive you can see here in Los Angeles Taylor Hall consider them an 22 00:02:37,71 --> 00:02:47,13 artist and educator based in Chicago had kamma Vangelis. Open source advocate cetera et cetera. 23 00:02:48,93 --> 00:02:59,60 So we are Challenge number six is whiteness. Such a good one that's a hard one yes very hard given to us by. 24 00:03:01,11 --> 00:03:03,41 Electioneering hung know who was on Episode five 25 00:03:04,27 --> 00:03:13,69 and he was if you're listening we're going to do your best this week to lack of this one I'll get ready now I did feel 26 00:03:13,70 --> 00:03:19,79 a particular amount like usually I feel mostly responsible to the other people that will be on the podcast 27 00:03:20,51 --> 00:03:27,53 but this time I felt I felt responsible to a much grander Yeah like like this wasn't the kind of thing where I could 28 00:03:27,57 --> 00:03:33,96 risk it was I mean a lot of the show is about quick and dirty 29 00:03:34,00 --> 00:03:37,55 and making it happen so that we can sort of show the warts and all that you know 30 00:03:37,87 --> 00:03:44,26 and I felt like man this was I really didn't want to feel I didn't want to make an object that felt dismissive. 31 00:03:46,25 --> 00:03:52,42 What was your experience like yeah very very similar I mean I stewed in my own juices for a long time trying to spin 32 00:03:52,43 --> 00:03:59,55 the one who I want to say and when I say something. Like what is that say about. 33 00:04:00,16 --> 00:04:05,15 What I thought you know like I just really digging into like what do I think I'm like how to how do I make a. 34 00:04:06,71 --> 00:04:11,28 Usual object or experience or something that represents that and an accurate 35 00:04:11,32 --> 00:04:21,07 and useful way of like I know it was it was quite tough. But I think I got to a place but I definitely. 36 00:04:22,38 --> 00:04:27,12 You know the primes the pack ice is we have roughly two weeks to do something and I definitely spent. 37 00:04:28,49 --> 00:04:30,19 A long time too long. 38 00:04:32,54 --> 00:04:38,07 Freaking out well you know I am starting to find interesting Lee with this format that two weeks is kind of a long time 39 00:04:38,31 --> 00:04:40,92 yeah and and I think that. 40 00:04:42,29 --> 00:04:48,71 I mean I think it's good in terms of making sure we have enough to say as we often talk about things happening in the 41 00:04:48,72 --> 00:04:52,95 world I mean just today Chris Cornell and Roger Ailes died I mean. 42 00:04:54,39 --> 00:04:58,81 You know great combo of like well I don't know how to feel right now. 43 00:05:00,65 --> 00:05:08,73 But yeah yeah I want to make sure you know there's only so many bullshit juicing machines that come out of Silicon 44 00:05:08,74 --> 00:05:13,66 Valley and or. Sexual predatory. 45 00:05:15,09 --> 00:05:19,73 Personalities that kick the bucket I mean you got to give it a little time to air out you know yes yes. 46 00:05:21,89 --> 00:05:23,56 Yes So so one idea. 47 00:05:24,60 --> 00:05:25,72 You and I have a little bit 48 00:05:25,73 --> 00:05:31,36 when we were like We don't have a guess like how do we want to tackle it was to maybe interview one another a little 49 00:05:31,37 --> 00:05:38,60 bit about what we thought about the topic and I thought that was a cool idea of yours and seen seem smart. 50 00:05:40,58 --> 00:05:45,37 But maybe let's do a couple questions and I think a lot of my thoughts are going to be through the work 51 00:05:45,41 --> 00:05:47,10 but bubble up to the work 52 00:05:47,14 --> 00:05:53,75 but also I think it would be good to talk a little bit about how you sort of work through the topic this week 53 00:05:53,88 --> 00:05:59,98 or last week. You know yes so because original guest couldn't make a. 54 00:06:00,39 --> 00:06:03,77 One of the people I reached out to use a shot at Walter could do 55 00:06:04,35 --> 00:06:09,36 and he I met him because he was working as a visiting artist a Columbia College 56 00:06:09,40 --> 00:06:17,72 and working on this really great kinetic sculpture that was a sort of a funerary monuments to somebody who had died in 57 00:06:17,73 --> 00:06:23,02 Texas I'm not exactly sure the details and I'm hoping he'll come out in the future and let you know us more about it 58 00:06:23,03 --> 00:06:27,69 but it was this great piece it was really complicated it was all manufactured by hand 59 00:06:27,73 --> 00:06:33,40 and so he seemed to have a real interest in not using the tools that we had right there like the scenes the machine 60 00:06:33,41 --> 00:06:39,76 even though it would have made it you know easier in a certain way. And so Walter you know we haven't talked. 61 00:06:41,08 --> 00:06:45,47 Specifically about his background but I do know he identifies as a person of color 62 00:06:45,48 --> 00:06:50,66 and so I was reaching out to him I think a month or two ago and saying oh you should come on and then 63 00:06:50,76 --> 00:06:54,03 when we lost our original guess I reached out 64 00:06:54,04 --> 00:06:59,19 and said oh you know I guess I thought he might be interested the topic and he has great response which was so nice 65 00:06:59,20 --> 00:07:06,91 but also just cut right to it which is like you know you guys don't need the permission of a person of color to talk 66 00:07:07,16 --> 00:07:09,74 like you don't need a monitor and I think he was yes 67 00:07:09,86 --> 00:07:13,84 and then he of course went on to say not not that you're just inviting me for that reason yeah I mean I think he's a 68 00:07:13,85 --> 00:07:18,21 dope producer and also has a lot to say on that topic as well 69 00:07:18,34 --> 00:07:24,17 and so we wound up going out for drinks I was helping him with some Arduino stuff and we did 70 00:07:24,18 --> 00:07:28,17 and I just said oh you know can we just talk about it generally so he had a lot of really great. 71 00:07:30,01 --> 00:07:35,67 Ideas to talk about you know one of them being I can read cynically how it was phrasing it soon 72 00:07:35,68 --> 00:07:39,28 but he reminded me that it is after all a talk about whiteness 73 00:07:39,32 --> 00:07:46,61 and I did find myself into new Asli framing whiteness through its interaction with other races 74 00:07:47,04 --> 00:07:50,47 and so I thought that was interesting to be reminded like oh you know whiteness. 75 00:07:51,64 --> 00:07:57,86 Oh I guess it's a question Can whiteness exist separate from it's treating other people poorly. 76 00:07:59,20 --> 00:08:06,85 Read like as if there's a. I have an identity that's not drawn from it's colonial kind of awful history. 77 00:08:08,16 --> 00:08:14,57 What did you come up with as an answer the question so I read a little bit about whiteness you know there's a pretty 78 00:08:14,58 --> 00:08:17,19 interesting. Paper. 79 00:08:18,26 --> 00:08:19,99 On the women's game right now which they're saying 80 00:08:20,00 --> 00:08:30,23 but written about this concept of white privilege which is sort of dissects in some ways like a white mindset in this 81 00:08:30,35 --> 00:08:38,05 the you're seeing way and like it's a pretty skinny thing critique of whiteness which is it's interesting and cool 82 00:08:38,15 --> 00:08:45,64 but also like a very I found it to be very poignant just like oh wow this there's there's a lot that's sort of being 83 00:08:45,65 --> 00:08:57,15 unpacked here that I can relate to and. Sort of connect with. I think the thing that was you thinking it. Yes. 84 00:08:59,64 --> 00:09:06,99 From twenty eleven it's like in one way like I really like that it's just you and I are this episode. 85 00:09:08,79 --> 00:09:11,15 To you know white people talk about when US 86 00:09:11,46 --> 00:09:20,79 but like in a way I would also just be interested in hearing from a person of color about whiteness because there's an 87 00:09:20,80 --> 00:09:24,11 argument and I think it's dead on like that. 88 00:09:26,49 --> 00:09:30,44 Someone who is a person of color understands whiteness 89 00:09:30,45 --> 00:09:37,97 or sort of experiences it in this way that is much more probable than someone who sort of unconsciously wallowing 90 00:09:37,98 --> 00:09:42,08 around in it you know like like I am because I am a white white Exactly. 91 00:09:44,26 --> 00:09:51,85 You know white people white people sort of experience whiteness the least Yeah right right right well in some ways 92 00:09:51,86 --> 00:09:58,89 and so you get to the privileged conversation Yeah right yeah there are certainly are in the conscious of it at least 93 00:09:58,93 --> 00:10:01,25 right like. Yes So. 94 00:10:04,33 --> 00:10:07,01 You had us and he lots of big gaps sorry listeners 95 00:10:07,02 --> 00:10:14,00 and this episode they feel like it's like so I feel myself sort of digging into like everywhere that I'm shooting which 96 00:10:14,01 --> 00:10:15,44 I like and it is healthy 97 00:10:15,45 --> 00:10:22,86 but I don't know man I want to get out in front of that a little bit because I think that this sort of the white guilt 98 00:10:22,90 --> 00:10:29,74 parts like you know certainly the communities that we're both and whether academic or you know Los Angeles art 99 00:10:29,75 --> 00:10:37,63 or whatever however you define that I think there is a we understand the appropriateness of certain feelings 100 00:10:37,67 --> 00:10:45,73 and I think that you know you can have in your head this list of things that you should and shouldn't feel or say 101 00:10:46,29 --> 00:10:51,67 and it's really easy to it's sort of like like cutting yourself flagellation 102 00:10:51,68 --> 00:10:56,14 or something where you're aware that you have these bad thoughts 103 00:10:56,15 --> 00:11:01,57 and that sort of constant minor league painful penance somehow matters at all 104 00:11:01,82 --> 00:11:09,69 and of course it matters not at all to other people's experience if there's just this internal sure an about like 105 00:11:09,73 --> 00:11:15,81 coming up to correctness you know to me and so I felt like that was one of the things I struggled with where. 106 00:11:16,89 --> 00:11:25,13 I didn't want to celebrate the rightness of my thinking you know what I mean so yeah I want to like yeah yeah 107 00:11:25,17 --> 00:11:25,56 and it's 108 00:11:25,68 --> 00:11:31,83 and it's one of the reasons because we also talk that from a practical perspective you know do we make this podcast ten 109 00:11:31,84 --> 00:11:39,66 hours long and then edit it down to the greatest shit or do we kind of risk and this is sort of my take on it 110 00:11:39,67 --> 00:11:42,83 and I'm curious for years but do we risk saying the wrong thing 111 00:11:43,30 --> 00:11:46,66 and leave it in there because those discussions are uncomfortable 112 00:11:47,04 --> 00:11:53,34 and that struggle is what important what's important not just like polishing our reputations you know them saying Yeah 113 00:11:53,35 --> 00:11:53,71 yeah so 114 00:11:53,72 --> 00:11:59,62 and I think that gets a little bit into this you know there's this sort of running joke of this kind of persona that is 115 00:11:59,66 --> 00:12:02,30 the one. It's Witter ally you know which is someone who. 116 00:12:03,33 --> 00:12:08,81 Isn't very deep in yeah who is exactly who isn't very good at projecting a certain. 117 00:12:10,53 --> 00:12:14,47 Hugel stance or mind frame or whatever but like is not. 118 00:12:15,65 --> 00:12:19,29 Doing the work her it's not like like it really comes down to like how it is you. 119 00:12:20,50 --> 00:12:30,45 How how who are you to yourself and to your people around us yeah and so. Yeah I hear you like I think it's better to. 120 00:12:34,23 --> 00:12:35,95 You know be powerful about what you say 121 00:12:35,96 --> 00:12:43,56 but like be also with like pushing yourself through the paragraph that you're saying into places you maybe haven't 122 00:12:43,57 --> 00:12:47,38 fully thought out yet and you know what yeah yeah. 123 00:12:49,33 --> 00:12:56,51 Yeah I mean I'm really looking forwards to I think that if anything the so far this episode will generate feedback from 124 00:12:56,52 --> 00:13:04,02 the audience Yeah and I'm really curious you know certainly we take a risk 125 00:13:04,03 --> 00:13:08,68 and I think the whole podcast has been about a certain kind of risk because creativity is a risk 126 00:13:09,49 --> 00:13:15,03 but I think this one has this great extra layer because we really want to layer selves out there 127 00:13:15,04 --> 00:13:19,09 and say you know this is where we're at and it's flawed and what we're thinking about 128 00:13:19,49 --> 00:13:24,04 and certainly will have people say Oh you did a good job or you did a bad job 129 00:13:24,05 --> 00:13:29,91 but I'm really looking forward to the stuff that sort of beyond that because the topic is so much bigger than you 130 00:13:29,92 --> 00:13:30,67 and me you know. 131 00:13:31,99 --> 00:13:36,91 I don't know I feel like your history is really interesting I don't understand it super well 132 00:13:37,43 --> 00:13:44,73 but my understanding of where you come from strikes me as intersecting with a lot of stereotypical whiteness So we're 133 00:13:44,74 --> 00:13:51,31 talking about Florida we're talking about skate cultural though interestingly I think that skate culture is becoming a. 134 00:13:52,33 --> 00:13:56,57 Really popular in the black community too but you know it many years away from 135 00:13:56,61 --> 00:14:02,77 when you were doing it there's the straight edge community. There's this there's like the early dot com. 136 00:14:03,86 --> 00:14:04,11 Yeah 137 00:14:04,35 --> 00:14:11,19 and so I can think of so many ways in which you intersect in my stereotypical understanding of whiteness you know there's 138 00:14:11,20 --> 00:14:17,80 also just that incredible story of when you were considering getting into foster parenting. 139 00:14:18,83 --> 00:14:20,76 When you had your friends out to dinner 140 00:14:21,75 --> 00:14:26,05 and if you don't want to talk talk about it in this context that then feel free not to but 141 00:14:26,09 --> 00:14:28,52 but those were two things that just made me think like. 142 00:14:29,58 --> 00:14:36,60 I want to hear you unpack those experiences Yeah yeah yeah I mean I I if you were to sketch out. 143 00:14:40,95 --> 00:14:47,93 What it looks like Yeah if you were to if you're going to make like a scatterplot diagram of whiteness like I would get 144 00:14:47,94 --> 00:14:53,05 straight arrow you know like like. Like it would just you know like there is. 145 00:14:56,00 --> 00:15:02,02 Yeah I mean I I grew up in the south I grew up and largely suburbia. 146 00:15:06,50 --> 00:15:12,99 Experience to people of other races a largely through school you know like. 147 00:15:14,13 --> 00:15:21,65 As opposed to through social organizations and stuff. Or through neighborhood like relations or whatever. 148 00:15:26,39 --> 00:15:30,13 Yeah I was into like extremely. 149 00:15:33,00 --> 00:15:38,34 White things you could you you know I things like people like you know judges and Dragon 150 00:15:38,35 --> 00:15:41,27 and skateboarding all stuff I think is all right in there. 151 00:15:43,62 --> 00:15:49,38 Although I do believe that now talking to my students that both of those things are crossing the which I'm really 152 00:15:49,39 --> 00:15:52,89 excited about yeah yeah I mean it certainly. 153 00:15:54,75 --> 00:16:05,98 Being heard are certainly different than they were when I was a kid which is good. I yeah I am a foster parents. 154 00:16:08,42 --> 00:16:19,65 A foster parent to a mixed race child so as a foster parent you were this is a specific so US Angeles County 155 00:16:19,66 --> 00:16:25,54 but probably true everywhere else but L.A. County is the only experience I have so you. 156 00:16:28,11 --> 00:16:31,20 You decided to become a foster parent you. 157 00:16:32,54 --> 00:16:36,68 Do all the things you need to do to become eligible you work with the nonprofit to. 158 00:16:37,95 --> 00:16:42,13 Become eligible and you are training in that kind of stuff and they were great because. 159 00:16:43,36 --> 00:16:46,48 Actually they took quite a bit about whiteness and race 160 00:16:46,49 --> 00:16:53,81 and just the numbers of the situation like like if you were to look at the demographics of what children become 161 00:16:54,60 --> 00:17:07,67 available to be. Foster Foster to adopted. You. It's in there it's a very high percentage of. 162 00:17:09,06 --> 00:17:14,03 Mixed Race or children of color that become available to be. 163 00:17:17,31 --> 00:17:25,51 Foster adopt kids so it's just built in like you can't even if you were like I'm a person who I did I just went white 164 00:17:25,52 --> 00:17:32,48 kid because I could I can't handle this responsibility racial response like social responsibility of foster adopting 165 00:17:32,49 --> 00:17:36,53 or say this is an example an African-American child or whatever. 166 00:17:38,08 --> 00:17:43,67 Fostering through the county tries not to you because they're just so it's not going to work out like you wait a very 167 00:17:43,68 --> 00:17:45,38 long time in order to do that 168 00:17:45,89 --> 00:17:52,59 or if you were just some kind of freak who was like I want to only foster a white kid because you're an asshole 169 00:17:52,60 --> 00:17:57,19 or something like like that actually would also be very hard because that there just don't have anything for you you 170 00:17:57,20 --> 00:18:07,14 know. So. Then though you're sort of like OK well I will probably be helping raise. 171 00:18:08,21 --> 00:18:13,03 A kid who is not my race and so what is that what is that me my how do I do that. 172 00:18:14,14 --> 00:18:15,19 Any and 173 00:18:15,35 --> 00:18:22,83 and do you start answering those questions because you do it yeah right yeah let's hear about it yeah I mean it's every. 174 00:18:23,86 --> 00:18:27,81 I mean genocide this is something we try to talk about nearly every day. 175 00:18:29,01 --> 00:18:33,44 And because of this the sort of machinations of the whole thing like like 176 00:18:33,48 --> 00:18:39,51 when you start to think about like who who is my kid with that day care 177 00:18:40,18 --> 00:18:49,86 or who is my kid you know having a playdate with or who is my you know what you quickly get I didn't realize this 178 00:18:49,87 --> 00:18:52,33 but you kind of quickly get into like what schools are around 179 00:18:52,58 --> 00:18:58,92 and ironically like in our neighborhood in Los Angeles most public schools are are. 180 00:19:01,18 --> 00:19:03,65 Probably eighty some ninety percent percent. 181 00:19:04,93 --> 00:19:05,89 Latino or Latino 182 00:19:06,01 --> 00:19:12,87 and so we if you are a child of another race there's not going to just be many people who look like you at that school. 183 00:19:14,39 --> 00:19:18,17 So you know that's a mentioned the mixed race question generally yeah 184 00:19:18,18 --> 00:19:25,51 or which you know I relate to a lot as well might My wife is mixed race Asian you know 185 00:19:25,97 --> 00:19:33,68 and our kid has that sort of ambiguous ethnic feature although I think some of the challenges due to the you know 186 00:19:33,69 --> 00:19:37,68 so-called positive stereotypes of Asians are somewhat different 187 00:19:37,69 --> 00:19:44,73 but I think one of the consistencies is just if you're with people either race they just see the other part. 188 00:19:46,45 --> 00:19:48,44 I mean I think for us our sort of M.O. 189 00:19:48,91 --> 00:19:59,98 Is think about it a lot try not to speak grew up in a glorious fashion just do your best you know. And also just. 190 00:20:00,01 --> 00:20:02,61 And is the rug biscuits billed as a as a new parent. 191 00:20:03,71 --> 00:20:08,77 Of an infant who is grows a lot every day the rug is sort of gets pulled out from underneath you every day you're just 192 00:20:08,78 --> 00:20:13,28 like oh well this is what's going on now so you kind of have to stand her toes 193 00:20:13,29 --> 00:20:18,94 and that seems like to me a better way of approaching it than sort of. 194 00:20:20,35 --> 00:20:26,40 Like drawing all these sort of absolutes around yourself in order to feel like you're doing the right thing because the 195 00:20:26,41 --> 00:20:28,13 situation is going to change you know you have to. 196 00:20:30,76 --> 00:20:37,63 Then And it which I think is just a parenting thing you know so if I put on my most cynical hat you know because it 197 00:20:37,64 --> 00:20:45,62 seems like a lot of whiteness studies tend to be pretty cutting in their critique right I know that you know if we 198 00:20:45,63 --> 00:20:52,16 think about sort of the position that you are in as opposed to and I know you don't want to talk specifically about. 199 00:20:53,68 --> 00:20:56,02 Your foster kids biological parents. 200 00:20:58,32 --> 00:21:02,11 But just to talk about how as I would imagine part of this whiteness 201 00:21:02,12 --> 00:21:06,98 and privilege conversation is the fact that you are in a position to foster somebody 202 00:21:07,56 --> 00:21:15,98 and that you know the children go into the foster system for a whole variety of reasons many of them probably stemming 203 00:21:15,99 --> 00:21:20,17 from the social inequalities brought about by whiteness 204 00:21:20,58 --> 00:21:26,12 and so I'm curious how you feel about that loop like clearly if a kid needs a home 205 00:21:26,34 --> 00:21:33,04 and you can provide that there's an essential there yeah but do you do you like if you step back and look at it 206 00:21:33,77 --> 00:21:39,93 and I feel like kind of a jerk. But you know do you do you feel like you. 207 00:21:41,01 --> 00:21:45,38 Participate negatively in that system by virtue of you 208 00:21:45,39 --> 00:21:55,66 or your power positions I don't feel like I just I don't feel like my impact is negative through the group fostering I 209 00:21:55,67 --> 00:22:02,67 feel like my work is negative and. The ignoring or. 210 00:22:03,92 --> 00:22:10,88 Not acting on the things that make this is great some of the first place you know like like what what is so liberating 211 00:22:10,89 --> 00:22:15,66 about being a foster parent if someone ever wants to do it there's a lot of decisions that just aren't yours. 212 00:22:17,24 --> 00:22:24,03 The court. Decides a lot. In our case D.C. 213 00:22:24,04 --> 00:22:31,14 FS decides a lot so there's a lot of things that the judge decides not so you're just sort of. 214 00:22:33,02 --> 00:22:34,93 Always your opinion doesn't matter like 215 00:22:34,94 --> 00:22:42,13 when I if we ever have to go to court we we're never spoken to you know like it's not about what we think it's just 216 00:22:42,14 --> 00:22:46,06 about we're just there to like about the kidney you know so. 217 00:22:47,58 --> 00:22:50,97 What you realize as a foster parent is you actually have very little. 218 00:22:52,23 --> 00:22:55,85 Say so and in this sort of mass nations of the foster system. 219 00:22:57,99 --> 00:23:06,05 But you know I do have personal responsibility and say so and like how I live my life and like. If I. 220 00:23:07,08 --> 00:23:13,54 Am doing things or contributing to something that is negatively impacting. 221 00:23:16,19 --> 00:23:23,82 People of color part of that is going to be made manifest and through something like the foster system right like. 222 00:23:25,54 --> 00:23:28,21 So yes so I try to think of it that way 223 00:23:28,83 --> 00:23:36,10 and in general as a foster parent you realize like it's smart the smartest move you can make is to realize like there 224 00:23:36,11 --> 00:23:40,36 is no here with her roses I'm in this system and this you know it's just like. 225 00:23:41,51 --> 00:23:48,64 It's a grind it's tough to be supportive to everyone as much as possible and just hope I don't work out. 226 00:23:49,71 --> 00:23:54,90 But it is a fellow parent I mean I think there's heroes says every parenting activity 227 00:23:55,46 --> 00:23:59,98 and then to add to that the just the practical difficulties with Austria. 228 00:24:00,66 --> 00:24:08,31 Yes this is me talking out of a set out I mean I'm just I'm trying to make sure I represent I'm trying to I think 229 00:24:08,32 --> 00:24:11,06 William Gibson has this great quote speaking of whiteness. 230 00:24:13,24 --> 00:24:15,86 Something like you know we can't and I talk to this in the park 231 00:24:15,87 --> 00:24:21,79 and we it's hard to see the culture because the culture is what we see with you know. 232 00:24:23,19 --> 00:24:29,24 Which I just love as a quote some trying to make sure I'm representing like any time I let something go. 233 00:24:30,46 --> 00:24:39,59 I'm trying to think about it from it's sort of cynical angle even as I'm trying not just to be like you know winning 234 00:24:39,60 --> 00:24:43,10 points for not allowing a single beautiful thing to go untouched. 235 00:24:47,63 --> 00:24:55,33 And absolutely that having it I get no conclusion and yet. So so ask me a question What questions do you have. 236 00:24:57,57 --> 00:24:59,29 So I'm going to talk about myself for a second 237 00:24:59,30 --> 00:25:06,02 but the question it will go back into that so one of the things that that came up for me and this is. 238 00:25:08,64 --> 00:25:11,51 Approach is a little bit about talking about the projects we did but. 239 00:25:13,36 --> 00:25:24,05 So I have a relative who was a Confederate soldier in the Civil War. And interest yeah if you get a D.N.A. 240 00:25:24,06 --> 00:25:31,73 Test or has you know I sort of had always heard about this person. But didn't. 241 00:25:33,91 --> 00:25:37,60 Need never really in my whole life just dug into it or cared about that much but. 242 00:25:38,96 --> 00:25:44,53 It came up ironically because my dad has been like scanning old photos of family photos and stuff 243 00:25:45,25 --> 00:25:55,54 and his grave site photo came through like whoa this C.S.E. Green marker like like like OK. 244 00:25:57,38 --> 00:26:05,84 What is C S A sock confederate states in America. Yes it's America and. So that was interesting and then of course. 245 00:26:07,00 --> 00:26:15,40 Attached so that thinking was all this like there's been a lot about Confederate monument. People in. 246 00:26:16,50 --> 00:26:24,78 In the Carolinas and in Louisiana Yeah yeah so. It was enlightening for me to be like OK I'm like there's. 247 00:26:27,58 --> 00:26:32,87 Like I've got skin in the game in some way like but you feel like you didn't or you knew about this guy. 248 00:26:35,88 --> 00:26:39,62 Or really brought it home or yeah yeah right just to be like oh OK like 249 00:26:39,66 --> 00:26:43,39 and so I was curious for you like if you had anything like that or if you had sort of. 250 00:26:46,48 --> 00:26:51,32 Had any kind of family situations that sort of put things into perspective 251 00:26:51,33 --> 00:26:55,78 or into focus that you had been thinking over the past. Interesting. 252 00:26:59,12 --> 00:27:05,11 Family seven mean for me I really feel like my family experiences really been more of a. 253 00:27:06,20 --> 00:27:12,35 Chosen family you know so I know there's people that are really close to the family that they have 254 00:27:13,09 --> 00:27:18,19 and it sounds like you're kind of in the middle you know if I'm not mistaken where you have frustrations 255 00:27:18,20 --> 00:27:20,56 but you still have those connections 256 00:27:20,57 --> 00:27:27,84 and for me my family is pretty small so most of my interaction has been with my wife's family 257 00:27:27,85 --> 00:27:31,58 and there's this sort of Anglo-Saxon in the Taiwanese. 258 00:27:32,59 --> 00:27:39,36 And then my brother in law and his partner visiting and they're doing their. 259 00:27:40,65 --> 00:27:46,64 Thing you know and they're not married but it doesn't matter and so they're you know aunts and uncles who are kid 260 00:27:46,65 --> 00:27:54,21 and so so all those definitions are kind of. Blowing up a little bit. Trying to think. 261 00:27:55,23 --> 00:28:03,32 And I've got a couple stories that I really can't tell yet. Because because I don't want to sell out the. 262 00:28:05,20 --> 00:28:10,28 Relatives you had hard you know. So I guess the closest I could get was. 263 00:28:11,42 --> 00:28:18,36 Wow man that's a really tough question I mean I think I feel like I have I have no problem talking about it. 264 00:28:19,39 --> 00:28:21,52 I guess the issue is that. 265 00:28:22,84 --> 00:28:29,90 You know things lay that bare I don't know it that I want to set my family members up for that yeah I mean you know I 266 00:28:29,91 --> 00:28:32,77 did not want to yes I was curious like you know maybe. 267 00:28:33,93 --> 00:28:39,76 I'm trying to trying to figure out how to articulate it without going to specifics I mean it was OK So I mean 268 00:28:39,77 --> 00:28:48,11 definitely I had some issues growing up with the white side of my family. Having fairly casual use of. 269 00:28:49,39 --> 00:28:55,92 Racial slurs and yeah and I think one thing I do recall you know my my parents. 270 00:28:56,99 --> 00:29:05,30 You know for all their faults as we all have I'm sure I have to as a parent. Really never instilled in the. 271 00:29:06,60 --> 00:29:14,77 Racism in me in an explicit way now I've certainly come to understand my kind of implicit biases 272 00:29:14,78 --> 00:29:18,78 and try to be really cognizant of them for example 273 00:29:19,36 --> 00:29:24,91 when I went to high school I went to high school that was basically fifty percent black and fifty percent white 274 00:29:25,54 --> 00:29:33,44 and so there when it being defacto black and white entrances you know in the ninety's because. 275 00:29:34,68 --> 00:29:39,27 The kids that were bused tended to be black and the kids they were neighborhood tended to be white 276 00:29:39,43 --> 00:29:44,19 and so it made a certain amount of sense that they would leave through these different entrances the entrance of the 277 00:29:44,20 --> 00:29:49,56 not Center but then it wound up you know mirroring the behavior of a. 278 00:29:50,60 --> 00:29:54,96 You know of a more segregated state of an earlier historical period. 279 00:29:57,03 --> 00:29:59,89 OK so maybe those are the stories that make more sense so. 280 00:30:00,01 --> 00:30:06,45 In terms of memories from that school I was in the Afro section of the high school yearbook. 281 00:30:08,24 --> 00:30:13,07 And so you know this is a school that's fifty fifty black and white so I had really big hair 282 00:30:13,70 --> 00:30:21,72 and also listen to Nirvana and so there is this like really interesting fusion of sort of baggy pants 283 00:30:22,26 --> 00:30:30,19 but also like you know button down shirts. Like that I mean there are lunchroom was shaped like an L. 284 00:30:30,20 --> 00:30:35,35 So there was basically a black side and a white side so there was cultural crossover 285 00:30:35,36 --> 00:30:37,90 but it was kind of sad in some ways 286 00:30:37,91 --> 00:30:44,55 and kind of limited so while you might you know experience the culture say in the form of music 287 00:30:44,56 --> 00:30:48,05 or whatever because what's new I mean you know white people liking music 288 00:30:48,46 --> 00:30:55,35 or black music doesn't necessarily mean they're you know they're really integrated only so I feel I feel like I had a 289 00:30:55,36 --> 00:31:03,66 weirdly historical experience in high school. And then the serial kept it off with this is the. 290 00:31:04,67 --> 00:31:05,55 Guidance Counselor's 291 00:31:05,56 --> 00:31:12,39 or who knows who had this sort of brilliant awful idea to get the races together to have them ask each other questions. 292 00:31:13,55 --> 00:31:16,68 So so this must have been like one thousand nine hundred four 293 00:31:16,69 --> 00:31:21,90 or something so so we all sat in this room with blankets on one side and white kids on the other 294 00:31:22,49 --> 00:31:28,15 and we just let loose night and I can only remember one question where this one kid asked. 295 00:31:29,24 --> 00:31:34,27 He was black and he said Do white people get it and because they want to be black 296 00:31:34,93 --> 00:31:40,63 and then the white kids found it so amusing you know but you know and 297 00:31:40,64 --> 00:31:45,79 when you sort of think about it I feel like there was a lot down and up in that other something 298 00:31:46,35 --> 00:31:48,40 and then that you know that for sure 299 00:31:48,41 --> 00:31:55,90 and the school had you know a terrible history of guidance counselors directing black students towards lower level 300 00:31:55,91 --> 00:31:59,98 classes and white students towards upper level so they were definitely to society as it were. 301 00:32:00,04 --> 00:32:04,31 Yeah they were aided and abetted by the administration so that was sort of. 302 00:32:05,84 --> 00:32:10,57 My first entree to those that topic matter Yeah so who's going first. 303 00:32:13,54 --> 00:32:21,73 I want first last episodes I think he is that OK sure. So when I was thinking about this. 304 00:32:22,79 --> 00:32:27,23 And I'll push some images up on slack for you in just the second go I feel like 305 00:32:27,24 --> 00:32:31,30 and Audrey was really helpful in this because you know she. 306 00:32:32,53 --> 00:32:38,11 All though she is ethnically part white is sort of the consummate outsider 307 00:32:38,17 --> 00:32:45,08 and so I think she was doing a good kind of keeping me honest so some of the approach approaches I was thinking about 308 00:32:45,09 --> 00:32:53,15 were sort of through the contemporary art lens so I was thinking about how whiteness there is a nice metaphor in 309 00:32:53,96 --> 00:33:02,53 modernism right so you have a sort of modernism For those unfamiliar is the notion that a gallery needs to have white 310 00:33:02,54 --> 00:33:06,90 walls and track lighting and you sort of have these trappings of what a gallery space is 311 00:33:07,32 --> 00:33:13,94 and then those things are supposed to be invisible right so you hang a painting it's context free 312 00:33:14,02 --> 00:33:18,77 and then an audience member can just sort of bask in the painting alone and no other. 313 00:33:19,88 --> 00:33:25,39 External variables and then of course postmodernism comes in and says you know the myth of the White Cube is false 314 00:33:25,40 --> 00:33:30,28 and you know you had shitty traffic on the way here and it's raining outside 315 00:33:30,29 --> 00:33:33,41 and there's a you know there's a hobo eating at that she's table or whatever 316 00:33:33,42 --> 00:33:35,94 and that all these things sort of influence your experience 317 00:33:36,18 --> 00:33:44,70 and the fact that you know a space is trying to present itself as rarefied So I like the idea that whiteness was you 318 00:33:44,71 --> 00:33:52,15 know figured into that myth Well the original notion of modernism and it's and it's postmodernist a myth 319 00:33:52,80 --> 00:33:56,95 and so I thought you know how can I make this sort of like inscrutable white object 320 00:33:56,96 --> 00:34:00,45 and then uses it for oil for conversation or something. Like that. 321 00:34:01,70 --> 00:34:08,15 The other thing I was coming up with In Conversation with Audrey who's my eternal collaborator whether she likes it 322 00:34:08,16 --> 00:34:13,89 or not. You know she enjoyed it. Yeah depending on the day. 323 00:34:17,10 --> 00:34:21,40 But the notion that we were go out with electricity and the fact that the 324 00:34:22,38 --> 00:34:25,41 and how we're going to look this back up I was just debating this with Walter but 325 00:34:26,27 --> 00:34:30,97 when you have up to code wiring in the wall so white is neutral 326 00:34:31,39 --> 00:34:35,93 and that from a technical standpoint tells you have electricity operates but it also seems to plug 327 00:34:35,94 --> 00:34:44,28 and to wait in this political conceptual realm because whiteness can project itself as that the fault 328 00:34:44,29 --> 00:34:45,67 or neutral culture 329 00:34:46,46 --> 00:34:54,74 and so one thing to constantly press back against is that sort of Euro centric understanding of a thing that is 330 00:34:55,61 --> 00:35:02,44 baseline is already pregnant with whiteness meaning and so forth so so I like both of those ideas 331 00:35:02,45 --> 00:35:04,69 but it was just sort of like. 332 00:35:06,23 --> 00:35:14,08 What am I trying to say here the more I tried to get the concept in bedded in the object the more pressure I felt to 333 00:35:14,09 --> 00:35:15,63 make it really really good 334 00:35:16,29 --> 00:35:24,90 and I felt like two weeks was not enough time to really in bed all of the stuff in an object so what I decided to do 335 00:35:24,91 --> 00:35:56,88 instead. Go ahead and. Upload some images from here yeah. Well. There's two images here. The first some in. And but. 336 00:36:00,65 --> 00:36:03,70 And it is on the what looks to be. 337 00:36:06,08 --> 00:36:10,94 By time but I mean it's sort of looks like roughly an eight half mile of paper or something like that 338 00:36:11,50 --> 00:36:23,11 and it looks like it's breaking down onto. A board. That board looks like it is or. 339 00:36:25,06 --> 00:36:29,59 Could be like a waste board or a C.N.C. Mill or something. 340 00:36:31,74 --> 00:36:37,49 Which room in oh yeah I see the boards cut the shape the same size of a piece of wood 341 00:36:37,91 --> 00:36:51,99 and there's one two three four five six. Things that I was going to say look like. Digits been there. Because they are. 342 00:36:56,35 --> 00:37:04,46 A spinner is is as many people who have this product probably know but as I understand it is this is a thing that. 343 00:37:06,13 --> 00:37:15,96 It's a very kind of knowledge worker object if you like where like you need something to like entertain your hand with 344 00:37:16,87 --> 00:37:24,51 while you're doing something else to very like a multi kind of object. Let's say you're like. 345 00:37:25,92 --> 00:37:30,55 Sitting in a boring meeting at work or like that there's this. 346 00:37:31,59 --> 00:37:37,13 Object that sort of hand size and really has ball bearings in it that you can. 347 00:37:38,94 --> 00:37:45,97 Kind of spin in your hand while a sense of the listening to this boring meeting or like checking that you know or 348 00:37:46,35 --> 00:37:55,75 or thinking through some sort of programming problem that in the second photo looks like what is the fidget spinner. 349 00:37:57,00 --> 00:38:03,36 And it's sort of shapes but. You could have said it's almost like an old school like a. 350 00:38:04,78 --> 00:38:10,63 Symbol without a ring around the outside. And there's a ball bearing kind of a skate. 351 00:38:13,16 --> 00:38:17,15 A back ball bearing in the middle and then when exactly a skate there yeah. 352 00:38:18,19 --> 00:38:24,95 That's what I'm saying yeah yeah so I mean unlike some other ones this one's pretty direct So so what I ultimately came 353 00:38:24,96 --> 00:38:28,19 up with was I wanted to make a thing 354 00:38:28,78 --> 00:38:36,00 but I didn't want to have to in bed all of the material in just the thing as I felt like it was too tall an order 355 00:38:36,01 --> 00:38:45,96 Marines who weeks so the idea was you know that I should just take some time as a white person. Just to read. 356 00:38:47,16 --> 00:38:54,15 And just feel like you know get get educated about this yeah so so this is sort of the beginning of a much longer 357 00:38:54,16 --> 00:39:00,73 project which is to become more educated and more thoughtful and hopefully leading to action 358 00:39:00,92 --> 00:39:10,08 when it comes to you know my position as a privileged person so I made these fidget spinners because they're popular 359 00:39:10,15 --> 00:39:11,60 right now but they're also doing. 360 00:39:12,80 --> 00:39:17,98 No there's no confusing like I'm not trying to say that I just cured whiteness with the fidgets I. 361 00:39:19,19 --> 00:39:22,34 Know it's going to have to wonder that so the idea was so I made these 362 00:39:22,35 --> 00:39:26,18 and then I would just sort of spin them in my hand while I was reading critical theory. 363 00:39:28,62 --> 00:39:34,82 So that there were a couple of pieces that I was reading about that I pulled some nice material out of 364 00:39:34,83 --> 00:39:38,39 and not nearly enough you know granted and more to come 365 00:39:38,40 --> 00:39:45,47 but But what I did so far was I was checking out this little speech given by W.E.B. 366 00:39:45,48 --> 00:39:53,01 Dubois about Jefferson Davis right of course Jefferson Davis the president if you can call him that of the of the 367 00:39:53,02 --> 00:39:59,72 Confederacy so. To voice gave the speech at Harvard and I think. 368 00:40:00,43 --> 00:40:05,91 It was eight hundred ninety and there's just some nice stuff in here so just to read a couple of quotes. 369 00:40:07,18 --> 00:40:14,63 Through the glamour of history the rise of a nation has ever been typified by the strong man crushing at the feet 370 00:40:14,67 --> 00:40:20,26 civilization and so has he often goes back to talking about the two tonic ideal 371 00:40:20,68 --> 00:40:25,71 and this understanding that you just sort of bulldoze and crush those before you 372 00:40:25,72 --> 00:40:31,98 and then he goes on to say in the history of this people we see conveying the elements of the tonic the if a patient 373 00:40:31,99 --> 00:40:38,82 the self the Roman brute force but we did not find an idea of submission apart from carrot of sleaze in this 374 00:40:38,83 --> 00:40:46,42 or stupidity. Which I thought yeah I mean it made a lot of sense like those notions I remember seeing for example in. 375 00:40:48,28 --> 00:40:55,30 An exhibit in Detroit that was talking about colonialism through African eyes this incredible exhibition 376 00:40:55,31 --> 00:40:59,56 but they had these these great like people like carving top hats out of wood 377 00:41:00,03 --> 00:41:06,88 or are making these gold watches that were purely visual in nature Of course they had no time keeping or whatever 378 00:41:07,54 --> 00:41:14,22 and then they would talk about the cultural differences like how the way that they stated it as I recall that in the 379 00:41:14,23 --> 00:41:16,81 United States we spend time 380 00:41:16,90 --> 00:41:22,85 or in Western culture we spent time where as an African culture you make time rites of the ideas the day starts with 381 00:41:22,86 --> 00:41:23,47 nothing 382 00:41:23,86 --> 00:41:30,90 and then you say I'm going to place an hour on this task which is very different from I have twenty four hours what 383 00:41:30,91 --> 00:41:32,21 have I wasted so far. 384 00:41:35,02 --> 00:41:37,73 So just to finish this off and I want to do too much quote reading 385 00:41:37,74 --> 00:41:44,72 but that the submission of the strength of the strong so the advance of awe not in mere Amla sacrifice 386 00:41:44,73 --> 00:41:52,78 but recognizing the fact that no one type of mind is given to discern the totality of truth that civilization cannot 387 00:41:52,79 --> 00:41:56,82 afford to lose the contribution of the very least of Nations for its full development. 388 00:41:57,86 --> 00:41:59,98 You know so he's talking about at least. 389 00:42:00,04 --> 00:42:08,56 To my mind the fact that yeah you have a nation that is not as advanced in its you know colonial bloodthirsty way 390 00:42:09,04 --> 00:42:13,15 whatever but there's there's really interesting ideas to be found in there 391 00:42:13,63 --> 00:42:16,97 and so the notion that you have these sort of strong nations 392 00:42:16,98 --> 00:42:22,41 and these weak nations is really just on this one particular analytical spectrum 393 00:42:23,35 --> 00:42:27,53 and I mean you know that the point is making is almost so obvious as to be unspoken 394 00:42:27,54 --> 00:42:36,05 but basically just that you need this multiplicity of civilized approaches to really get a you know you know an 395 00:42:36,06 --> 00:42:37,17 interesting a whole. 396 00:42:38,72 --> 00:42:40,09 So it's great to learn more about him 397 00:42:40,10 --> 00:42:47,28 and then I finally took the time which I've been holding off on along with my fish it's better to read the I'm going to 398 00:42:47,29 --> 00:42:51,63 have to double check on his name because often mispronounce of. 399 00:42:53,42 --> 00:42:58,44 The is it Tom a house a coats and I'm getting that right is how. 400 00:43:00,23 --> 00:43:02,36 I mean it says so well that will check it 401 00:43:02,37 --> 00:43:10,21 but he did of course the now sort of classic recent classic piece in The Atlantic about the case for reparations Have 402 00:43:10,22 --> 00:43:14,58 you read that piece I have not. But I and you know that. 403 00:43:16,34 --> 00:43:19,98 Yeah so so we'll link to it and I'd be really curious to hear your thoughts about it 404 00:43:19,99 --> 00:43:23,25 but just as a as a way to sort of lay out what I got out of 405 00:43:23,26 --> 00:43:32,10 and of course it's it's really hard to talk about this notion of reparations right like how do you take a nation like a 406 00:43:32,11 --> 00:43:38,91 sub nation of people you know African-Americans in the United States and figure out exactly what they lost 407 00:43:38,92 --> 00:43:44,42 and be able to the still that into a practical dollar amount or some other kind of resource 408 00:43:45,09 --> 00:43:55,19 and so it was interesting to hear him write about I mean it's it's easy it's frankly easy to make a case for 409 00:43:55,20 --> 00:43:59,93 reparations in general like to say you know here's an example of. 410 00:44:00,73 --> 00:44:07,31 Another nation doing it not too long ago like when Germany was making reparations towards Israel 411 00:44:07,89 --> 00:44:14,08 and I was interested to learn through coats piece that the Israelis were actually really pissed off about it right 412 00:44:14,09 --> 00:44:20,53 because they didn't want was richer money to be able to say we've placed a dollar amount on these horrors 413 00:44:20,57 --> 00:44:26,71 and now that it's been paid for sort of off the hook rents there actually a lot of people in Israel protesting against 414 00:44:27,12 --> 00:44:29,11 those reparations which I found fascinating but 415 00:44:29,12 --> 00:44:34,62 but also you know Germany was actually willing to do it just the fact that they you know 416 00:44:34,63 --> 00:44:40,71 and I think that at least a portion of the political drive behind that was saying here here's a way to get started as 417 00:44:40,72 --> 00:44:41,83 opposed to a way to finish. 418 00:44:43,23 --> 00:44:43,44 That 419 00:44:43,48 --> 00:44:50,24 but that you know sentiment is not shared by all this really so so cotes is going on talking about you know these different 420 00:44:50,25 --> 00:44:53,24 metaphor is like if you ring up a bunch of credit card debt 421 00:44:53,51 --> 00:45:00,54 and then you stop ringing up credit card debt you still have the interest that's chipping away you know at your you 422 00:45:00,55 --> 00:45:05,10 know you're not whole just because the debt has stopped accruing actively. 423 00:45:06,29 --> 00:45:11,73 In terms of new purchases it was also there was a more graphic one where he was talking about you know you've been 424 00:45:11,74 --> 00:45:13,70 stabbed twenty times 425 00:45:14,01 --> 00:45:20,16 and just the station of the stabbing doesn't necessarily mean that everything's hunky dory right now stabbing him 426 00:45:20,49 --> 00:45:29,65 but that doesn't make everything fine yeah yeah now now then you know the so to the cold hearted you are a reader one 427 00:45:29,66 --> 00:45:35,68 might say Well so what's the proposal that right I mean what do we do like is this practically Is this something that 428 00:45:35,69 --> 00:45:37,00 can actually be addressed 429 00:45:37,41 --> 00:45:46,41 and so coats goes to pieces far back as one nine hundred seventy three where he was you know a law professor Boris bit. 430 00:45:47,69 --> 00:45:54,26 And he argues that the rest price tag could be determined by multiplying the number of African-Americans in the 431 00:45:54,27 --> 00:45:59,98 population by the difference in a white and black per capita income so that's actually. 432 00:46:00,15 --> 00:46:05,64 A pretty you know you can explain it one sentence so in one thousand nine hundred three that's three thirty four 433 00:46:05,65 --> 00:46:09,97 billion dollars which And you know I have it on the calculation with interest 434 00:46:10,02 --> 00:46:12,18 or rather inflation as to what it is today. 435 00:46:13,25 --> 00:46:16,44 But there is this sort of number out there which is great 436 00:46:16,45 --> 00:46:21,32 but then of course you have to figure out where does it come from like is it just a straight up has just come from the 437 00:46:21,33 --> 00:46:24,95 federal government or is it somehow you know other other Spurs. 438 00:46:26,20 --> 00:46:32,01 And so the only other thing that's see that I wanted to point out about this in the bill check. 439 00:46:34,52 --> 00:46:40,78 So he also refers to John Conyers apparently in Congress introduces H.R. 440 00:46:40,79 --> 00:46:44,66 Forty and I have to double check and make sure that you know this is linkable and so forth 441 00:46:44,67 --> 00:46:51,97 but the idea is that we just need to have a team that's investigating you know the government has to have an official 442 00:46:52,05 --> 00:46:57,32 inquiry into what reparations might look like and the fact that he introduces this every year 443 00:46:57,36 --> 00:47:03,36 when Congress starts it session and then nobody ever says let's do it. You know both Democrats and Republicans. 444 00:47:05,67 --> 00:47:14,76 So yes I found the piece really illuminating I think that coats you know I mean he does manage to sort of make the case 445 00:47:14,98 --> 00:47:22,59 for reparations generally but does not necessarily land and say this is what must be done and 446 00:47:22,81 --> 00:47:29,65 and I don't know that that's necessarily his responsibility it does make me it does leave me feeling a little bit like 447 00:47:30,13 --> 00:47:33,48 you know you take me to the river but then sort of what next 448 00:47:34,28 --> 00:47:41,30 and a lot of his writing in this piece is through this lens of redlining right where even after slavery 449 00:47:41,31 --> 00:47:46,31 and all these things are done you still have you know the governments 450 00:47:46,32 --> 00:47:51,74 and also lending institutions Cifelli cramming black people in to get those 451 00:47:52,09 --> 00:47:55,69 and refusing to offer mortgages in certain neighborhoods to black people 452 00:47:55,70 --> 00:47:59,98 and so forth so so it's it's a fascinating read I'm also in the middle of a real. 453 00:48:00,01 --> 00:48:01,62 State transaction myself 454 00:48:02,27 --> 00:48:08,25 and so it's just made it really clear to me the types of things that I alluded to at the top of the show that I don't 455 00:48:08,29 --> 00:48:12,31 have to worry about in the same way as something somebody else so that that is. 456 00:48:13,72 --> 00:48:20,25 One expression of yeah I will read that article because I had heard it explained to me in a way that was pretty 457 00:48:20,26 --> 00:48:25,32 compelling and that was that this idea of reparations is. 458 00:48:28,13 --> 00:48:32,44 A lot of people sort of would see as a pretty outrageous thing of of like you know. 459 00:48:33,92 --> 00:48:37,07 It says that you know paying a payout right. 460 00:48:38,15 --> 00:48:45,00 But what what I heard about that article was that by the time you finish you're like oh it's actually the least we 461 00:48:45,01 --> 00:48:47,51 could do it's like now how big of a deal you know like it like when you 462 00:48:47,77 --> 00:48:50,33 when you sort of start to unpack the whole situation 463 00:48:50,71 --> 00:48:57,56 and I go well reparations to your point Taylor is like a starting place it's not like you know let's just put some 464 00:48:57,57 --> 00:49:03,61 checks in the mail and you know wash your hands of the whole situation it's like oh there's this is like actually not. 465 00:49:04,66 --> 00:49:08,12 This doesn't reparation would even really scratch the surface like 466 00:49:08,13 --> 00:49:14,14 but it would be at least a mark on the surface you know like it would be a place. 467 00:49:15,80 --> 00:49:18,76 To begin or at least like start lots of conversation about. 468 00:49:20,24 --> 00:49:26,78 Things that need to be talked about that's cool or talk about I will admit like that article crossed my path 469 00:49:26,79 --> 00:49:32,41 and a total like you know Internet a you way and I was like oh read this like. 470 00:49:33,59 --> 00:49:40,15 Oh me too yeah me too and I will freely admit that it was this challenge that got me to read the article 471 00:49:40,61 --> 00:49:46,61 and so so yes so I'm sitting here right now with my fits better spinning it around as we're talking 472 00:49:46,62 --> 00:49:51,48 and I'll put one in the mail so you know I was just going to ask if you would because I'm like I want to wait in a 473 00:49:51,49 --> 00:49:59,87 spinner. The one thing I'm discovering is that I made it just for my hand so it doesn't work for most people. 474 00:50:01,51 --> 00:50:09,85 So you know another expression of my. Period listener or whatever but. Yes So for me it was like just. 475 00:50:11,04 --> 00:50:18,34 I wanted to make a thing I didn't want that thing to have to embody in an explicit way a topic that was far too 476 00:50:18,35 --> 00:50:23,09 complicated for that period of time you know so it was intentionally didn't he 477 00:50:23,14 --> 00:50:29,43 but it did actually participate in my trying to expand my horizons on the topic 478 00:50:30,20 --> 00:50:35,26 and so you know that's that's a baby step but it's I mean it you know I read the article 479 00:50:35,27 --> 00:50:40,85 and then hopefully we reach an audience you know through the nature of the podcast 480 00:50:40,86 --> 00:50:47,55 and hopefully there's an actual effect that happens so maybe the spinner is more than just goofy Yes. 481 00:50:48,59 --> 00:50:50,29 I like that it has almost like a. 482 00:50:52,38 --> 00:50:53,07 Hotel MC 483 00:50:53,18 --> 00:50:59,26 or like prayer be like It's a cigarette like sort of anchors you to a task that you want to do like that's pretty 484 00:50:59,63 --> 00:51:07,77 normal that's cool. Sure that's rad Yeah that's that's cool. I had a similar. 485 00:51:08,89 --> 00:51:14,50 In one room and that I was but what was interesting is I decided I wouldn't do any reading. 486 00:51:16,96 --> 00:51:19,05 As yet as it's funny because we. 487 00:51:20,15 --> 00:51:31,04 I was just like I don't know like I need to think about what this means for me just like what is my baseline you know 488 00:51:31,05 --> 00:51:34,86 like I don't even know if I could like I think I certainly need to do. 489 00:51:36,02 --> 00:51:39,16 More self study and more will study about this 490 00:51:39,20 --> 00:51:45,91 but like I was like I don't even know where to start so I I just started to write down questions 491 00:51:45,92 --> 00:51:49,96 and then I would still go sort of strike through the questions over and over and over again and. 492 00:51:51,57 --> 00:52:06,80 Then keep rewriting them till I kind of got somewhere. And I can I can share where that landed. Well. 493 00:52:11,04 --> 00:52:19,38 All right so I've got a I've got a subdomain. Which is but the supplement persists if I say it aloud It's a. 494 00:52:20,51 --> 00:52:26,55 Yes No ant anti-venom parade. And I. 495 00:52:29,21 --> 00:52:30,57 Anti-venom dead rubber it 496 00:52:30,58 --> 00:52:37,29 and yep it's rubber duck come take it in his nose about that hockey player how it is taken I think it's taken by a used 497 00:52:37,30 --> 00:52:38,85 car sales person in Arkansas. 498 00:52:41,16 --> 00:52:50,56 OK So not unlike Congress website I get a very simple web page here that reads white fragility got you down tried 499 00:52:50,97 --> 00:52:59,94 whiteness anti-venom. Send a dose to your phone to see where some going to click on this so I can type in my number. 500 00:53:01,89 --> 00:53:13,02 Shows she answered it on the radio. And then the time. I mention I'll just say like a minute in the future. 501 00:53:14,64 --> 00:53:24,47 And I go see where am I And then we have a chance to put in the time zone it in right now it's like three is it going 502 00:53:24,52 --> 00:53:27,69 OK They're like three thousand yeah. 503 00:53:29,54 --> 00:53:32,31 It's all the time the Europe times yes 504 00:53:32,32 --> 00:53:40,55 or the very sunny Glenn you look at US Central get it if you see us central right now it is twenty thirty four for me. 505 00:53:42,45 --> 00:53:52,43 Right. Twenty two or so so that part of it automatically weirdly open it gets the rightness get your IP. 506 00:53:53,54 --> 00:53:59,98 On a schedule mug DOS well so it got the right it got the right time it just did not get the right times. 507 00:54:01,47 --> 00:54:08,22 And now I'm getting at Tex saying where is whiteness most present in this room how can I sit for it. 508 00:54:10,00 --> 00:54:12,82 And test it so in this particular room. 509 00:54:14,67 --> 00:54:20,94 It is I and my darling sister in law is trying to sleep while I'm talking right now. 510 00:54:23,48 --> 00:54:26,38 So I think it's more me than her that we are both white. 511 00:54:27,63 --> 00:54:28,18 Right now 512 00:54:28,19 --> 00:54:38,99 and sitting in my studio which is which I purchased so there is a certain amount of privilege there I don't think that 513 00:54:39,00 --> 00:54:45,73 the previous owner I think the previous owner was also white but there's sort of an aspect there of. 514 00:54:47,26 --> 00:54:53,38 Economic privilege that I associate with white Yes. So in terms of subverting it. 515 00:54:54,76 --> 00:55:05,53 I don't what I can do at this point I mean I'll certainly attempt to sell it. G.'s it's a really tough one right like. 516 00:55:06,98 --> 00:55:11,37 It's the whole problem like you know if you are white and or gay 517 00:55:11,55 --> 00:55:16,87 and move to a neighborhood that's not yet fully developed you're participating in. 518 00:55:18,76 --> 00:55:20,65 Gentrification whether you like it or not 519 00:55:21,26 --> 00:55:28,49 and then what do you do do you determine you know it's only move to host gentrify neighborhoods it's all very thorny. 520 00:55:30,84 --> 00:55:37,71 In terms of active subversion I guess I guess the perhaps slightly lame answer that I give is that I'm going to make a 521 00:55:37,72 --> 00:55:42,43 pub kiss with Robert Ray. Where we talk about. 522 00:55:44,37 --> 00:55:50,52 Whiteness and then hopefully you know introduce our audience to some uncomfortable thoughts that lead to some. 523 00:55:53,15 --> 00:56:03,32 Breakthroughs on their part I don't know man did I cheat. So I can describe sort of my goals of the site. 524 00:56:06,34 --> 00:56:11,97 I had been writing down questions and I kept rewriting them and kind of trying to keep putting a finer point on them 525 00:56:12,39 --> 00:56:16,84 and I sort of picked up from you certainly this is from. 526 00:56:19,36 --> 00:56:26,04 Kind of micro site as well but this happened sort of late in the game like I I had been writing no questions 527 00:56:26,05 --> 00:56:28,23 and I was originally thinking I wanted to make. 528 00:56:29,88 --> 00:56:39,49 A card deck similar to what you mentioned in the last episode of the strategies that sort of is a. 529 00:56:40,83 --> 00:56:44,82 A deck that you could sort of pick up and shuffle through and. 530 00:56:47,37 --> 00:56:57,31 Do some thinking on what happens to be on the card and so I had been writing down questions about whiteness for myself. 531 00:56:58,36 --> 00:57:04,40 And I was going to make these cards. So I could sort of carrying them around with me in my bag and. 532 00:57:05,99 --> 00:57:10,56 On a poem out when it felt like seem like a good time and then. 533 00:57:12,94 --> 00:57:20,43 I like that idea but then I was like it's a little like just for me you know like it's like a little bit. 534 00:57:22,17 --> 00:57:25,55 In some ways like maybe the act of making the cards is the most interesting thing 535 00:57:25,56 --> 00:57:31,55 but like it I don't really know how other people might. Might. 536 00:57:33,84 --> 00:57:38,61 The intuit or something like that I was like Oh that seems like there's something else there and then I was like. 537 00:57:41,88 --> 00:57:46,49 Oh like there's this what I like about the questions that they're meant to sort of. 538 00:57:47,56 --> 00:57:51,98 Ask you to reexamine your surroundings and I'll read out what some of the questions are. 539 00:57:53,51 --> 00:57:58,45 The person you got to there is where it's a white Christmas present in this room how can I subvert it I would not I 540 00:57:58,46 --> 00:57:59,95 only have six questions of our. 541 00:58:00,16 --> 00:58:01,13 That I actually like 542 00:58:01,98 --> 00:58:09,85 but I'm more I'm working on more Another one is where is whiteness hiding in this room how can I suppose it is another 543 00:58:09,86 --> 00:58:16,06 one of the questions is how is whiteness benefiting from my actions how do I divert my energies elsewhere. 544 00:58:18,52 --> 00:58:22,03 Another question is. 545 00:58:23,98 --> 00:58:30,32 How was whiteness causing me here in the situation how can I diffuse it so there are sort of question pairs that are 546 00:58:30,36 --> 00:58:33,34 around like asking you to look at. 547 00:58:34,61 --> 00:58:40,03 Whiteness in your life or in a situation and then another question that's asking you to. 548 00:58:41,09 --> 00:58:44,37 Dismantle or rethink or challenge yourself. 549 00:58:46,32 --> 00:58:52,57 And so then I was like well you know we live in a world of interruptive technology right like like we live in this 550 00:58:52,58 --> 00:58:53,16 world the. 551 00:58:54,25 --> 00:58:57,88 Phones going off on stuff and it's something that causes a lot of people strife 552 00:58:57,92 --> 00:59:01,02 but then I was like can you flip that on its head like can you. 553 00:59:02,07 --> 00:59:09,60 Can you create an interruption in your life that actually feels good or encourages you in some interesting way 554 00:59:09,61 --> 00:59:15,81 and there's not a lot out there that does that which is kind of strange there is. 555 00:59:19,00 --> 00:59:30,70 Healy's who to comic is a comic book author who has a really cool text message based platform that I have to subscribe 556 00:59:30,71 --> 00:59:42,51 to for a while. And it is. Just that. You did yeah you did yeah I saw it I was like oh I just got to pick the hood. 557 00:59:45,31 --> 00:59:49,69 It's called bitches get shit done and it said A B G S T. 558 00:59:52,13 --> 00:59:59,95 Dash archived dot com It's an archive of the messages and you can sign up for bitches get it done and it's this. 559 01:00:00,11 --> 01:00:07,15 Kind of a motivational text message platform. That sends you a text message occasionally that says something like. 560 01:00:10,99 --> 01:00:14,54 Be a miser with your time choose carefully and on what 561 01:00:14,58 --> 01:00:17,77 and on whom you spend it you have no idea how much you have left. 562 01:00:19,03 --> 01:00:23,79 And another when is you almost done with that so some of them are like kind of snarky and funny 563 01:00:23,80 --> 01:00:28,90 and some of them are more kind of gracious and it's a really cool platform. 564 01:00:29,91 --> 01:00:31,41 And they come through just sort of randomly 565 01:00:31,42 --> 01:00:34,71 and what's nice about it right is you're in the middle of doing something and all the sudden it comes through 566 01:00:34,72 --> 01:00:36,03 and it makes you kind of think about. 567 01:00:37,34 --> 01:00:43,33 Your what you're doing a little bit differently and so I'm definitely lifting off that concept a bit and. 568 01:00:44,74 --> 01:00:50,18 I like that this allows more people into this concept you know the end of the idea and sort of. 569 01:00:52,28 --> 01:00:57,06 Into the project I have a lot of hooting work to do to make it. 570 01:00:58,07 --> 01:00:59,85 A little bit more secure and that sort of thing 571 01:01:00,30 --> 01:01:08,98 but I yeah right now my phone number is just completely visible on the list so yeah I expose that just so you could see 572 01:01:08,99 --> 01:01:09,15 it 573 01:01:09,16 --> 01:01:13,85 but I was going to turn that off like we have right now you can there is a list of you so you can see everybody's text 574 01:01:13,86 --> 01:01:22,29 messages that went through without logging in or anything sorry sorry yes. It also. I'm using. 575 01:01:23,70 --> 01:01:27,51 To send the text messages. And I did kept. 576 01:01:28,52 --> 01:01:34,35 My credit card so won't keep renewing my credit card and descending book like most someone's salad dressing. 577 01:01:36,46 --> 01:01:44,21 Will be OK you didn't you a quick update. Fortune tension I did get four chan tension print my. 578 01:01:45,83 --> 01:01:47,88 Audio nuke box I got 579 01:01:47,89 --> 01:01:57,05 and I got rank calls from people who said they were from four chan is a great where from were from four chan Yeah 580 01:01:57,09 --> 01:02:01,77 and they sounded like they maybe had been. It's not a very high but. 581 01:02:02,99 --> 01:02:08,51 I do get some I do get some nice prank phone calls to my box what's weird is I did. 582 01:02:09,89 --> 01:02:14,13 I was curious about how this this these people who were calling my. 583 01:02:15,67 --> 01:02:22,15 Old Line how they found out about it and I did look on I did some searches for like you know site searches reports 584 01:02:22,16 --> 01:02:23,67 and see if I got posted or something 585 01:02:23,68 --> 01:02:30,11 but I couldn't find anything in our as to how this how it would have gotten traction but I assume well for chanters 586 01:02:30,12 --> 01:02:35,94 and Reddit they're there all around me are there are honest I say it was probably because I had posted on some sort of 587 01:02:35,95 --> 01:02:44,61 message board like the preppers friends more so than that. But speaking it wait yes we can wait that's for sure. 588 01:02:46,30 --> 01:02:51,78 Yes So these questions are questions that I think I want to keep adding to but there are questions that. 589 01:02:54,86 --> 01:02:59,10 I mean I think what's funny about this kind of whiteness thing is whiteness is that. 590 01:03:00,54 --> 01:03:05,06 Gives us a lot of pass in the world you know our privilege. 591 01:03:08,18 --> 01:03:14,57 But I think it's also anything like that that sort of gives you a privilege is also giving you a blind spot right like. 592 01:03:16,02 --> 01:03:19,24 And so I've been trying to sort of pick up that blind spots to be like what is. 593 01:03:20,42 --> 01:03:28,12 What do I miss out on when I rely on my whiteness in whatever way or you're consciously or unconsciously so. 594 01:03:29,62 --> 01:03:35,17 Hopefully what this will become is a little like kind of weekly text message that you'll get somewhat randomly 595 01:03:35,18 --> 01:03:42,14 and I wanted to select people's time zone so I wouldn't send it to them too in the morning it would sort of always sort 596 01:03:42,15 --> 01:03:49,32 of people who worked in him or something but. But I would like it was a cool little service that I could sign up for. 597 01:03:50,84 --> 01:03:54,94 Like I'm curious to think about what whiteness is and what white privilege is. 598 01:03:56,71 --> 01:03:59,68 Maybe I could get a little message that would. 599 01:04:00,67 --> 01:04:07,73 Had me think about it in the situation I'm in through sort of interruption as opposed to being more self driven like a 600 01:04:07,74 --> 01:04:13,81 card deck would be like you have to think about it in order to do it more text messages the the system going to the 601 01:04:13,82 --> 01:04:20,42 side when you think about it. So let me ask you this the titling of the project is and. 602 01:04:21,74 --> 01:04:35,31 Do you think that whiteness is essentially venomous. Yes. I think well I think it's a toxin right. 603 01:04:36,66 --> 01:04:42,18 I don't know if it's that I haven't I don't know the chemistry well enough to know what the differences 604 01:04:42,22 --> 01:04:47,66 but what I like that you have a degree and that I have I have a minor in and biology 605 01:04:47,67 --> 01:04:57,35 but I didn't buy a cam I should know the difference between a toxin and a venom but I don't remember. But what I. 606 01:04:59,04 --> 01:05:04,12 Thought was interesting about the if you've been in concept it's a little bit weird and harsh the phrase the word but. 607 01:05:05,33 --> 01:05:13,05 What I like about it is that you and it's even as I understand it is this sort of it's almost like an inoculation 608 01:05:13,06 --> 01:05:21,64 or something where you're getting a little dose of the thing that would hurt you you know order to keep it from hurting 609 01:05:21,65 --> 01:05:24,68 you or to fix a problem you know like like. 610 01:05:28,51 --> 01:05:34,40 Like I think of like snakebite antivenom as being generated problems like bite from snakes themselves 611 01:05:34,83 --> 01:05:39,96 and so I kind of like that. The concept of thinking about whiteness. 612 01:05:41,20 --> 01:05:49,56 Coming coming from whiteness like like to be more thoughtful about your white ness the Rue through your whiteness was 613 01:05:49,57 --> 01:05:51,19 this kind of similar 614 01:05:51,64 --> 01:05:57,87 or a Borroughs snake eating its tail kind of thing that you could that in some ways was I don't know seemed seem 615 01:05:57,88 --> 01:05:59,84 interesting to think about so that's kind of how I got to that. 616 01:06:00,17 --> 01:06:00,67 That were 617 01:06:00,71 --> 01:06:07,27 but it was one of those things again where this creating the website for this was an idea that kind of popped into my 618 01:06:07,28 --> 01:06:07,61 head. 619 01:06:09,08 --> 01:06:10,07 Day or two ago 620 01:06:10,42 --> 01:06:15,49 and so you know you then you sort of realize like OK I've got the thing now I have to like assemble all the components 621 01:06:15,87 --> 01:06:20,65 I like the. Name but I mean it is not working. 622 01:06:23,06 --> 01:06:27,89 That's what I was going for so listeners if you have a thought about a better site name 623 01:06:27,90 --> 01:06:31,48 but sort of still get that idea maybe send us a note maybe. 624 01:06:32,71 --> 01:06:40,93 I like your description I feel like you know you could just maybe just talk about that on the P.S. Itself. And then. 625 01:06:42,65 --> 01:06:50,19 I also wonder if I wouldn't mind seeing the list of questions even though that makes it less mysterious in some ways 626 01:06:50,20 --> 01:06:55,29 yeah if somebody who's good point going to contribute a question they should know what's on there yeah hopefully if I 627 01:06:55,30 --> 01:07:01,33 have enough questions like to show you on the page just gives people a bit of framing right 628 01:07:01,37 --> 01:07:04,03 and then you will get other stuff and you're wonderful and. 629 01:07:05,84 --> 01:07:12,44 I love seeing the stuff like the first ideas thirteen so I have a sense of how many test and how many have to leave. 630 01:07:13,50 --> 01:07:25,75 Last night and they write for the podcast. So Rob did we fix it or we've done. It we just got started. 631 01:07:26,80 --> 01:07:30,36 Exactly and that's I think that's the thing I learned with this was. 632 01:07:32,16 --> 01:07:36,92 You know whether it's reading articles or spreading the word to your buddies 633 01:07:36,93 --> 01:07:42,15 or are deciding exactly you know what tangible effect you hope to have. 634 01:07:43,63 --> 01:07:47,86 It opens up just I mean it's stuff I was already doing in the context of teeth yeah 635 01:07:48,79 --> 01:07:57,55 but I feel like maybe I could be more explicit about it even if it's just internally that you know I'm doing this 636 01:07:57,56 --> 01:07:59,82 and I'm doing that with these specific. 637 01:08:00,71 --> 01:08:07,73 Political motivations so yeah I think I think this challenge will have a much larger this will stay with me for longer 638 01:08:07,74 --> 01:08:11,30 than two by four and paperclip Yeah right right I mean yes 639 01:08:11,64 --> 01:08:18,66 and give us a great I mean the thing that's interesting about making a project attached to a concept is you really. 640 01:08:19,78 --> 01:08:23,52 Just do your own ego want to think about it a lot because you want to do something cool 641 01:08:23,67 --> 01:08:31,13 and like I dug into this topic a lot just because I was like I really want to do something interesting like I don't 642 01:08:31,14 --> 01:08:37,46 want to do that well I I mean a white cube isn't that funny like or whatever like I went to the I went to Home Depot 643 01:08:37,47 --> 01:08:39,34 and I got all the chips that are white 644 01:08:39,38 --> 01:08:44,27 and I don't know you know like I wanted to make something that was substantive then like and I really. 645 01:08:45,28 --> 01:08:55,28 Dug And so what I think challenges me think about all this differently so I don't know I mean it's ironic Mike I will 646 01:08:55,29 --> 01:08:59,00 admit like there's deep irony I'm being like I'll make a website. 647 01:09:00,25 --> 01:09:04,50 Like like you know like here's the wake up crying technology to a problem 648 01:09:05,07 --> 01:09:07,85 and you know thinking everything going to be OK but. 649 01:09:09,06 --> 01:09:15,04 I but you're not saying no no no no but it but you know when I was like yes so don't 650 01:09:15,09 --> 01:09:19,18 but don't apologise man because I think I think that's the other arm of this 651 01:09:19,67 --> 01:09:26,58 and just you know being a good white boy and apologizing for everything you do that doesn't help anybody 652 01:09:26,59 --> 01:09:31,19 but you know you know it's just it's scratches a and it yeah 653 01:09:31,45 --> 01:09:34,47 and I you know apologies are necessary at points in time 654 01:09:34,48 --> 01:09:42,23 but I think you know we're trying to be aware of the stuff so let's let's not make this like the Coney Facebook video 655 01:09:42,99 --> 01:09:48,07 like let's actually do something about it yeah apology should be the exception rather than the rule. 656 01:09:49,40 --> 01:09:54,88 Well now unless there's other stuff you want to talk about I think we have to come up with their next week's challenge 657 01:09:54,89 --> 01:09:59,98 you know. What one of the things that I was like It's nice to have a guest even though I think the. 658 01:10:00,07 --> 01:10:02,27 I guess is really super cool 659 01:10:02,31 --> 01:10:08,97 but I was like oh we get to the challenge is next for next time like that's fun you know because it it is such a fun 660 01:10:08,98 --> 01:10:15,10 and pleasurable thing to think on the sound is like it's funny. That you think about it so. 661 01:10:16,44 --> 01:10:27,85 So up when it's you pick oh no it's a good and well let's get together. But I did have some I have so many. That are. 662 01:10:28,88 --> 01:10:32,71 Kind of abstracted but I'll just throw one or two of them out 663 01:10:32,72 --> 01:10:38,48 and then if you have some that are good to you we can suck them up going but one of the ones I have 664 01:10:38,49 --> 01:10:49,78 and this is a like maybe boring but maybe comical is. For us to pick a project that we have put on the shelf. For X. 665 01:10:49,79 --> 01:10:53,67 Amount of time in our whatever we want to come up with and like dust it off 666 01:10:53,68 --> 01:10:58,93 and be like you know I'm doing this like I did this I started this thing but I had to put it aside whatever reason 667 01:10:59,40 --> 01:11:04,32 but now like this is like I'm going to. I'm going to make. 668 01:11:05,39 --> 01:11:07,38 A man or I'm going to have our restart 669 01:11:07,60 --> 01:11:12,28 and then I'm going to finish it so that was one thing that I thought would be kind of cool because I have a million 670 01:11:12,29 --> 01:11:16,14 projects like that and some of my think are cool but I just don't get around to finishing them. 671 01:11:17,91 --> 01:11:25,13 So that was one I hadn't had did you have any in your in your head well I'll tell you secret almost every project I've 672 01:11:25,14 --> 01:11:33,48 done so far on this podcast has been a shelf project. For it so there's always like it I find that often. 673 01:11:34,64 --> 01:11:40,48 For example my etching with the scene see machine for the last time you know that it didn't sit around for like ten 674 01:11:40,49 --> 01:11:48,13 years and so and so I mean I think it's a great way of working it's I mean it largely be doing it the same way a lot 675 01:11:48,14 --> 01:11:52,53 and I was just look at my pimp shoes the other day. Anyway. 676 01:11:53,77 --> 01:11:59,98 I don't know I mean I try not to think about it until we're actually talking about. So. 677 01:12:00,01 --> 01:12:02,42 So the first thing that came to my mind was edibles. 678 01:12:04,95 --> 01:12:08,84 And I have no particular you know I feel like that 679 01:12:08,85 --> 01:12:14,16 when it's broad it touches an area that we haven't really gotten into yet 680 01:12:14,91 --> 01:12:20,98 and that's it I will admit I have a guest we have a guest on our list that has said yes 681 01:12:21,73 --> 01:12:25,18 but won't be happening soon who would be perfect for that topic. 682 01:12:26,30 --> 01:12:26,51 But 683 01:12:26,78 --> 01:12:32,78 but here's the conundrum it is like starting in two weeks we don't think the topic anymore aside getting back around the 684 01:12:32,79 --> 01:12:39,34 edible. Would only be at the whim of someone else. So I like I do. 685 01:12:40,54 --> 01:12:48,87 Interesting I mean I think that that you know it could also inspire the incoming guests to see what somebody else did 686 01:12:48,88 --> 01:12:56,17 with you know quote their chop Yeah you know. So you give me another one what do you want to do. 687 01:13:01,38 --> 01:13:04,34 I have some that are I jotted down. 688 01:13:05,68 --> 01:13:12,52 That are kind of very formal or something like like like better skills that I want to improve 689 01:13:12,53 --> 01:13:22,05 or something like that you know. Two birds birds. With one so yes you have right yes thank you yeah yeah yeah. 690 01:13:24,24 --> 01:13:36,31 I mean everyone. But two birds on it yeah. I mean we could do we could do one that's like a Made in China. 691 01:13:37,94 --> 01:13:42,24 You know where whatever you do it has to be through like or something. 692 01:13:43,75 --> 01:13:46,82 I just know that if we get it done in two weeks of that when you know. 693 01:13:50,89 --> 01:13:58,55 Then again we're sort of where we are on a weird schedule because it's just the two of us proposing it. 694 01:14:00,99 --> 01:14:11,92 OK I'll back up a little bit oh how about how about homemade chemicals who yeah that's cool. Let's do that Stu that. 695 01:14:14,12 --> 01:14:20,23 Who you know who I don't think get out of that we should say anything else yeah that's Himachal Both Oh man yeah that's 696 01:14:20,24 --> 01:14:28,14 not what I was a lot of room now and that's good. A lot of room to get in trouble yes in all sorts of. 697 01:14:31,76 --> 01:14:36,37 US will take us out on the business yes or. 698 01:14:38,07 --> 01:14:39,44 So the projects we just discussed 699 01:14:39,45 --> 01:14:44,68 and all the other projects that we have done are going to be up on projects that opposable park as dot com apologies 700 01:14:44,69 --> 01:14:50,02 that we've been a little bit late some weeks getting those up there it's a little bit it's that like a little extra 701 01:14:50,03 --> 01:14:52,99 push to have to get the documentation done that's a month six a little while 702 01:14:53,45 --> 01:14:55,53 but thanks to people who go to the website 703 01:14:55,54 --> 01:15:01,64 and check out the been a tool to just see traffic coming into that people checking it out. 704 01:15:03,91 --> 01:15:08,92 If you're new to the podcast welcome you can subscribe on i Tunes or overcast 705 01:15:08,93 --> 01:15:16,18 or set your all your whatever high class platform you like if you enjoy the pipe last pod cast please I always do that 706 01:15:16,24 --> 01:15:25,84 if you enjoy the podcast please share it with someone he think would dig it. We're sort of below the do like we do you. 707 01:15:28,21 --> 01:15:30,32 Do like kind of weird. 708 01:15:32,76 --> 01:15:35,05 SEO and all that kind of stuff for our podcast 709 01:15:35,06 --> 01:15:40,92 but like just share it with someone else who you think would be cool who you think would like it would be really cool. 710 01:15:42,37 --> 01:15:50,44 And really help us out our logo was created by mask and you can check out his art at will mask our code at U K. 711 01:15:51,66 --> 01:15:53,46 The a great person to work with. 712 01:15:54,47 --> 01:15:59,98 And really sort of helps I think Tim and I both sort of get excited about the podcast like as. 713 01:16:00,32 --> 01:16:04,52 Like when we had to load them and it was really pro with one of the cool kids 714 01:16:04,53 --> 01:16:07,11 and I were with like yeah this is awesome we're doing a thing 715 01:16:07,12 --> 01:16:11,71 and it was like a really nice kind of boost to work with someone who was so great to work with 716 01:16:11,72 --> 01:16:17,79 and also such a bad ass so and and the thing that I loved was that. 717 01:16:18,90 --> 01:16:23,88 There really are version and we're like dude we make it glue Yeah 718 01:16:24,52 --> 01:16:30,54 and he said he said oh it was I was being conservative on the glue we're like why else do we come to the mighty well 719 01:16:30,55 --> 01:16:34,83 it's not it's it's true but if not for it yes he's got he's got some 720 01:16:35,00 --> 01:16:42,38 and we are going to see is a really great sort of zombie style that is is obviously apparent look up 721 01:16:43,06 --> 01:16:44,86 but we we haven't heard of Eclipse. 722 01:16:47,77 --> 01:16:54,98 We do have a patron page if you would like to kick us a little bit of money on the regular We would be super happy 723 01:16:54,99 --> 01:16:59,72 about that to get a picture on dot com slash available. You can sponsor us. 724 01:17:01,66 --> 01:17:09,79 We are also accepting other kinds of sponsorship so if you. Would like to. 725 01:17:12,17 --> 01:17:18,02 Use our podcast as a small platform to talk about what you do we would be interested in talking with you about it 726 01:17:18,03 --> 01:17:25,01 coming up with a solution. We get parity to independent businesses minority owned businesses and women in this. 727 01:17:26,93 --> 01:17:29,30 So if you have something you want are very nerdy 728 01:17:29,31 --> 01:17:35,93 and enthusiastic I guess listeners to know about please give us a shout out opposable cast at G. Mail dot com. 729 01:17:37,07 --> 01:17:42,98 We do have a code of conduct it's were dedicated to providing a harassment experience for everyone regardless of race 730 01:17:42,99 --> 01:17:49,65 gender age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject matter or religion 731 01:17:49,66 --> 01:17:52,80 or lack thereof we actively support an inclusive environment 732 01:17:52,84 --> 01:17:57,37 and we want you to be a part of it you can check out our full code of conduct over at our site. 733 01:17:58,62 --> 01:18:06,24 We don't have a listener feedback. This week we do we have listener feedback. You want to highlight. 734 01:18:07,80 --> 01:18:11,58 It came to me through conversations so. 735 01:18:12,71 --> 01:18:20,91 Walter said that he really appreciated in our code of conduct that you just finished. Noting that. 736 01:18:22,11 --> 01:18:30,07 It's important to say and that when it comes at the end you can skip it you cannot skip but you know it's there 737 01:18:30,08 --> 01:18:34,21 and that's crucial. And you have a question for listeners. 738 01:18:36,15 --> 01:18:37,49 You know you and I haven't really talked about this 739 01:18:37,50 --> 01:18:42,54 but I I was I've been curious about how to you have more conversations with listeners. 740 01:18:43,95 --> 01:18:49,27 On various platforms whatever they may be in these books I don't really know I don't know what would be good. 741 01:18:51,36 --> 01:18:55,45 So I thought around some ideas but I would also be interesting to hear about. 742 01:18:58,57 --> 01:19:02,52 It to hear ideas from my listeners and people are like oh you should be on Instagram 743 01:19:02,53 --> 01:19:09,47 and whatever like that we called here because I I'm kind of stuck not quite sure how to do it but it would be great to. 744 01:19:11,84 --> 01:19:12,45 Hear from you and 745 01:19:12,49 --> 01:19:20,62 and we are almost up to one thousand downloads which is a very we've already I was asked yes cool I checked a couple 746 01:19:20,63 --> 01:19:22,86 days ago and it was at nine seventy or something and I was like. 747 01:19:24,30 --> 01:19:32,03 We're getting close so thanks to everyone who listens and it's really cool it's nice to think that in your. 748 01:19:33,05 --> 01:19:37,32 Town are conversing on the podcast that other people are into it so. 749 01:19:39,65 --> 01:19:46,44 Yeah that's all I've got a big shout out to Hong very challenging topic definitely definitely was just a comfort zone 750 01:19:47,02 --> 01:19:53,32 quite a bit and I think we're in a pretty interesting place and. You have a reading list us and you know. 751 01:19:55,48 --> 01:19:59,46 And if you know your size fits better I can like it I can. 752 01:20:01,11 --> 01:20:06,01 Little if you get a pretty big hand strike you can you can handle it which you may want to trump as a control move. 753 01:20:08,48 --> 01:20:17,36 You know you know I was reading that in Chicago somebody wanted to get like the Pink Floyd inflatable to block the 754 01:20:17,37 --> 01:20:24,44 trumpet name. And I think it's actually moving forwards them this bridge. 755 01:20:25,52 --> 01:20:33,24 That's cool or links were links for the links. OK ideas Well I'm scared but what I'll do with chemical. 756 01:20:34,94 --> 01:20:44,09 Testing it's good I don't know where that came from. Yeah OK we're sending it sounds good thanks man you get there. 757 01:21:02,09 --> 01:21:02,86 I'm terrified. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:16,59 --> 00:00:21,17 Welcome to the opposable thumbs podcast opposable thumbs as a part cast where Taylor 2 00:00:21,35 --> 00:00:25,84 and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 3 00:00:25,85 --> 00:00:31,27 and lessons learned Dan Bruce Dio is our guest this week I think isn't so sure. 4 00:00:32,73 --> 00:00:37,50 My name is Robert Ray I run the exoskeleton arts based on Los Angeles 5 00:00:37,51 --> 00:00:45,50 and hosts infrequent art openings at events there I also run the exoskeletal newsletter which is a less frequently sent 6 00:00:45,51 --> 00:00:47,81 e-mail right now but I'm trying to get one out next week 7 00:00:48,47 --> 00:00:55,15 and I'm an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles also my preferred gender pronoun is he 8 00:00:55,19 --> 00:00:55,90 and his. 9 00:00:57,46 --> 00:01:01,17 Sailor ho concerned I'm an educator an artist in Chicago 10 00:01:01,18 --> 00:01:08,48 and I think on sabbatical as of forty eight hours ago so so I have no excuses now 11 00:01:08,52 --> 00:01:14,84 when it comes to getting projects done this is this is going to be my focus very exciting so what we get are we going 12 00:01:14,85 --> 00:01:21,59 to make us all academic like yes. Which I do you live so you'd love nothing more than I could do it could do. 13 00:01:26,75 --> 00:01:32,71 It then would you get to get introduced yourself Yes Yes My name is Dan we see you know at night I think you know. 14 00:01:38,87 --> 00:01:55,94 And are Yes All right Gerri. Why are they speaking more. Workshops. And part of the collaborative. Transforming a. 15 00:01:58,43 --> 00:02:08,59 Joint is a. And that's it's only going in and it was an experiment. Dissension last activity. 16 00:02:09,60 --> 00:02:14,55 Where we almost like expertness one shot he said. And I also work with the only thing. 17 00:02:15,68 --> 00:02:25,77 Which teaches and I think action one it was very basic thing. How to use Tor and have a sentencing. And. 18 00:02:26,82 --> 00:02:28,93 Yes I think that's part of. 19 00:02:31,89 --> 00:02:34,65 It one thing I'd like to hear about right off the bat is 20 00:02:35,60 --> 00:02:43,11 when it comes to it sounds like some of the stuff that you're doing is organize towards education workshop community 21 00:02:43,12 --> 00:02:49,10 engagement and I'm curious do you think of that as your creative practice 22 00:02:49,14 --> 00:02:53,54 or is it an outlet for other things that you would define as your creative practice 23 00:02:53,81 --> 00:02:58,11 and yeah that's a question I do think about isn't practice 24 00:02:58,32 --> 00:03:08,43 and I think most of the work that I do now is an organization based in terms of our shops and then the other outlets 25 00:03:08,44 --> 00:03:15,46 and that's one outlet and then the other outlets are similar kind of my concerns that I address in this one shops is 26 00:03:15,47 --> 00:03:19,77 and I just don't want to stray from writing with such and. 27 00:03:21,68 --> 00:03:30,61 Excellent So Rob It occurs to me that I always make us wait for the big show we go right to the inventions are about to 28 00:03:30,81 --> 00:03:35,35 hit then up with some work questions yeah I have I mean I guess I would say. 29 00:03:37,41 --> 00:03:40,77 Dan it's it's great to have you on I think for me want to when Teller 30 00:03:40,78 --> 00:03:45,75 and I were for a sort of sketching out the podcast you 31 00:03:45,76 --> 00:03:51,02 or work came to mind right away I think for obvious reasons through your work with the best friends are in a gang 32 00:03:51,03 --> 00:03:57,41 and just like your approach in general life I find like really of kind of liberating and that. 33 00:03:58,94 --> 00:04:00,73 When I think of your work. I think of. 34 00:04:03,21 --> 00:04:08,48 It's a very smart work but I feel like it's also like very much guided by your enthusiasm 35 00:04:08,52 --> 00:04:16,25 and I think I find that super refreshing and like I miss that a lot of times I feel like when I go see an art show 36 00:04:16,26 --> 00:04:17,62 or see someone give a talk 37 00:04:17,63 --> 00:04:24,53 or even a workshop you know like I feel people get really caught up in sort of other components of of what they do 38 00:04:24,54 --> 00:04:25,64 other than just like. 39 00:04:27,10 --> 00:04:28,32 Being really interested 40 00:04:28,33 --> 00:04:33,84 and excited about what they do so it's I'm really psyched to have you on the podcast because this is to me like this 41 00:04:33,88 --> 00:04:43,06 podcast for me was sort of trying to tap into that with for myself so many yes so it's been really nice to think about 42 00:04:43,16 --> 00:04:49,91 this podcast but also sort of inspired by your practice So yes it's cool yeah let's let's dive in. 43 00:04:51,07 --> 00:04:58,09 You know what if you go first this Cohen think you never never get the chance to OK I go first so I'm going to upload 44 00:04:58,10 --> 00:05:04,08 some photos and Rob I'm trying to remember your is your hundred undergrad degree chemistry related 45 00:05:04,09 --> 00:05:05,97 or was it biology biology Yeah 46 00:05:06,57 --> 00:05:13,54 but I imagine some of that intersects there if it's chemistry class Yeah bio chem is known as being the sort of most 47 00:05:13,95 --> 00:05:21,29 one of the most brutal classes for a biology person just because it's it's like hard chemistry plus biology so. 48 00:05:23,21 --> 00:05:33,31 To a biology person. The I was really not a robot. Person and also made it biological matter yes. 49 00:05:34,80 --> 00:05:58,66 I WOULD YOU ASK Yeah turning to. Dust. Oh I see OK give me just once again so do your listeners nothing this is really. 50 00:05:59,78 --> 00:06:06,38 Not. Only watching somebody navigate through their finder but to do so only. Yes. 51 00:06:08,18 --> 00:06:13,65 Oh I had to have it with actually in mind as well the idea like now there's often no moment you know joining like a 52 00:06:13,66 --> 00:06:21,18 talk or something or when some of the. Projector doesn't sync up or someone hasn't their system preferences and so I. 53 00:06:23,83 --> 00:06:26,25 Read and write and what kind of. 54 00:06:28,52 --> 00:06:31,75 Assistance and when tenses sit and watch 55 00:06:32,05 --> 00:06:36,55 and see something different what happened this time you know I think everybody. 56 00:06:37,87 --> 00:06:42,47 So there must be something that went wrong. And unexpected. 57 00:06:44,26 --> 00:06:47,87 Then I would like to ask you a question while we're waiting for Rob's material 58 00:06:48,68 --> 00:06:53,26 and it's funny I don't know if it's just you know there's people whose work we're attracted to 59 00:06:53,35 --> 00:06:57,39 and then they wind up I'm just seeing a lot of similarities with the different people we've had on 60 00:06:57,75 --> 00:07:04,84 but one thing that I'm hearing just on the surface with your work is the combination of some pretty serious technical 61 00:07:04,85 --> 00:07:08,17 material like with the cryptography but then also. 62 00:07:09,64 --> 00:07:15,14 Using the term wrong there but that cryptographic know how it needs its generous. 63 00:07:16,59 --> 00:07:22,74 OK well you uses a tour and all that but then the fact clearly the name of your super friends. 64 00:07:23,96 --> 00:07:26,44 Could use could use a best friend and they're best friends learning. 65 00:07:27,82 --> 00:07:33,65 Yes So so I enjoy how that is informative about the content to be found within 66 00:07:33,66 --> 00:07:41,39 but it's also completely disarming right off the bat I was curious you know is that was that an intentional bit on your 67 00:07:41,40 --> 00:07:44,71 part to diffuse some of the kind of uptightness 68 00:07:44,72 --> 00:07:52,16 and serious seriousness surrounding technology Yes And Carolina something that I think is brought to both kind of like 69 00:07:52,17 --> 00:07:55,30 an issue has been the best friends learning we intentionally 70 00:07:55,31 --> 00:07:59,98 when we chose that name we wanted something that we just kind of weed out. 71 00:08:00,01 --> 00:08:05,46 Anybody who has very kind of like Rich expectations of why don't work that might be. 72 00:08:06,49 --> 00:08:15,64 And was kind of like down for something ridiculous while in a you know wild in like a positive sense. And with that. 73 00:08:16,92 --> 00:08:17,37 And with. 74 00:08:19,78 --> 00:08:25,42 Initially were inspired by actual cooking parties and since you hadn't noticed 75 00:08:25,43 --> 00:08:35,73 or like heard of any of the parties in L.A. I mean we heard it once and they. I really wanted to host one in L.A. 76 00:08:35,74 --> 00:08:39,54 but I wanted to host one like not as someone who is an expert in corruption 77 00:08:39,58 --> 00:08:45,14 but is an artist who is interested in the ways in which encroaching could be. 78 00:08:46,45 --> 00:08:53,06 As effective for instance different communities differently and how that kind of like really connected 79 00:08:53,07 --> 00:08:59,81 or could connect just all of us in terms of communications ideology surveillance and. 80 00:09:01,54 --> 00:09:10,72 That's why I wanted to kind of emphasize just work it to the end like social connection over technical competence 81 00:09:11,18 --> 00:09:12,83 or you know dominant 82 00:09:13,19 --> 00:09:20,77 and whereas like it because I thought of anything that made it like a hard core group of parties were present you know 83 00:09:20,78 --> 00:09:26,82 by my public key right now I'm like a piece of paper at the door someone can physically verify that I am the person I 84 00:09:26,83 --> 00:09:34,99 say I am. Actually I wouldn't even make make it to the door so so basically in the in the group there are three of us. 85 00:09:37,61 --> 00:09:45,70 Who also change our names in separate ways who are trying to build up credit that's a tazer proxy and I take. 86 00:09:47,03 --> 00:09:53,50 He is more of a he comes from computers and. Brings more of the technical and it. 87 00:09:56,35 --> 00:09:59,98 Pays brings a lot of a lot of flair and I tend to be like the. 88 00:10:00,01 --> 00:10:08,88 Amateur historian so I try to offer I usually do that kind of some kind of intro before and offers some alternative 89 00:10:08,89 --> 00:10:12,95 or tangentially related history to impression 90 00:10:12,96 --> 00:10:20,22 or privacy just in case there's a bring something to challenge like whatever Kramatorsk we're trying to think through 91 00:10:20,56 --> 00:10:27,89 things. I don't want to put you on the spot but I just I want to hear one of those lectures and yeah like is is there. 92 00:10:29,13 --> 00:10:34,96 But you could share that you think makes a nice little get that so laser to happen to be the one that is kind of 93 00:10:34,97 --> 00:10:36,43 interesting who. 94 00:10:38,00 --> 00:10:47,56 Offers a very distinct way of thinking about information and hiding information and like stealth when it comes. 95 00:10:49,03 --> 00:10:59,41 To have to be familiar with the you know I'm not going so. We come to like heroes down from. 96 00:11:00,63 --> 00:11:03,35 Seven hundred friends and family was born. 97 00:11:05,46 --> 00:11:10,73 Very modest family lived in the countryside and he had like a voracious appetite 98 00:11:11,05 --> 00:11:16,18 and by the time he was seventy eight so much that his family could no longer afford to keep the money there. 99 00:11:17,37 --> 00:11:18,45 And asked him to leave. 100 00:11:19,61 --> 00:11:23,80 So check him out and so he starts a kind of like wander around the age of seventeen 101 00:11:23,81 --> 00:11:27,18 and I think he joins the like the circus at some point. 102 00:11:28,62 --> 00:11:35,29 And the thing with his appetite is that it's not just it's far surpasses any kind of like you know tale someone might 103 00:11:35,30 --> 00:11:39,31 have heard of like a really intense appetite and he according to. 104 00:11:40,74 --> 00:11:48,89 What you what we can access now and I think one person documents life as much as best as you possibly can the face 105 00:11:49,86 --> 00:11:53,94 but that can only would have such an intense hunger it is like he has. 106 00:11:55,56 --> 00:11:59,95 His eye he can control it so he would he could eat absolutely anything and. 107 00:12:00,53 --> 00:12:06,06 With no regard to like physics I actually get the classic metal wax. 108 00:12:07,25 --> 00:12:10,69 As he would kind of ravage dumpsters and like who are cats you know. 109 00:12:11,78 --> 00:12:12,64 And he pounds 110 00:12:12,65 --> 00:12:19,92 and pounds of like just anything he can find a question of how many until a stomach would expand to a sufficient I 111 00:12:19,93 --> 00:12:24,23 guess like level is ice kind of like a lot like glaze over and he would. 112 00:12:25,97 --> 00:12:31,91 And he would be satisfied and so the military like gets a hold of his story in his eyes to use it 113 00:12:31,92 --> 00:12:39,78 and to smuggle messages across enemy lines so he's kind of like I guess you mean like a container for an action 114 00:12:39,79 --> 00:12:43,31 basically But of course during the test once they ask him to 115 00:12:43,76 --> 00:12:46,56 and they run tests on him first where he was asked kind of like. 116 00:12:47,98 --> 00:12:53,84 Eat like intensity amounts of like well I'm testing how much is the mic and he was pretty much at once. 117 00:12:54,90 --> 00:13:00,48 And so then they asked him to eat to swallow and inside and there was a piece of paper 118 00:13:00,74 --> 00:13:06,15 and secret top secret confidential message that he and his mother were cross any lines along 119 00:13:06,23 --> 00:13:08,09 but he gets caught in the process 120 00:13:08,41 --> 00:13:13,08 and of course as they're keeping him for questioning I guess I'd want a gesture takes place 121 00:13:13,59 --> 00:13:14,74 and so he kind of changes 122 00:13:14,75 --> 00:13:20,16 and tells them no I was asked as well this woman boss with a message you don't believe him then of course he puts out 123 00:13:20,17 --> 00:13:24,73 that when box and we're trying to be a mistake or have it in the stomach 124 00:13:25,03 --> 00:13:31,13 and there is like a white piece of paper with a message that says must everyone's dismay like this is a test. 125 00:13:32,92 --> 00:13:40,19 Kind of and he said it's not. That's that's a. Different way of thinking about and. 126 00:13:43,82 --> 00:13:51,55 You know I'm always interested in how of course the notion of digital media you know goes back quite some time it is 127 00:13:51,56 --> 00:13:57,38 really fabric and so it's to orient to I saw some great things go on the line 128 00:13:57,39 --> 00:13:59,98 and I don't know what the portal was so this might just be both. 129 00:14:00,04 --> 00:14:04,22 Speed but it was something about little old ladies that were. 130 00:14:05,36 --> 00:14:08,63 That would sit in their windows and and knit scarves 131 00:14:08,95 --> 00:14:11,83 and I forget which war it was during But the idea is that they would. 132 00:14:13,46 --> 00:14:20,85 Make maps of the train schedules in occupied territory dropping stitches and having this you know prearranged code 133 00:14:21,26 --> 00:14:26,44 and then they would give the scarves to young servicemen you know just seeming like they were interested in keeping 134 00:14:26,45 --> 00:14:27,39 them warm but. 135 00:14:28,66 --> 00:14:32,38 Anyway yeah I knew I needed to find a source for that so we could post it yeah 136 00:14:32,63 --> 00:14:35,08 and there's an interesting history from all of them. 137 00:14:36,29 --> 00:14:44,52 Spies and especially especially in months like seemingly And there's an end and have to start. 138 00:14:46,00 --> 00:14:55,42 And so in this case like you know kind of that innocent old ladies needing the seemly. In the seventeenth century. 139 00:14:56,85 --> 00:14:57,43 Women. 140 00:14:58,87 --> 00:15:05,98 Not just kind of like living noblemen but also like shopkeepers women who work in shops who smuggle messages 141 00:15:05,99 --> 00:15:12,57 or messages and like with artichoke she was ill or in Hanks also going to the market and. 142 00:15:14,27 --> 00:15:15,80 Coded messages 143 00:15:15,81 --> 00:15:22,12 and so I'm going to put three images They're all this roughly the same just like a little bit so different. 144 00:15:37,85 --> 00:15:39,66 So right off the bit. 145 00:15:41,19 --> 00:15:47,59 And Dan do it do I detect the classic Homer bucket is that your read on this orange cylinder that we're seeing here 146 00:15:47,60 --> 00:15:59,98 and yet. What document. And. Is this a home a toilet and you know is this the scale kind of their government. 147 00:16:00,42 --> 00:16:06,30 Oh I first noticed that there's a white wall in the second like a roll of white paper 148 00:16:06,31 --> 00:16:10,65 but it's like a little bit too large to be told they don't have to say oh that looks like quality French ident 149 00:16:10,66 --> 00:16:21,43 and that brought my attention to another but it is anything. That seems like overlap. Appears to be. 150 00:16:24,02 --> 00:16:26,50 The Senate does look very much like that on the job. 151 00:16:28,45 --> 00:16:35,03 And some of the other details that I'm finding really attractive you know as somebody working with a lot of computer 152 00:16:35,04 --> 00:16:41,13 aided fabrication is delayed when somebody just make something with you know kind of by hand with available tools 153 00:16:41,52 --> 00:16:48,92 and so the lid is kind of the second image in particular you know you can see where it was sort of carved out with a 154 00:16:48,93 --> 00:16:55,21 jigsaw or something and then the screws are all off center and that's somehow that makes it that much more adorable 155 00:16:55,28 --> 00:16:57,26 and say I find this to be a very cute toilet. 156 00:16:59,30 --> 00:17:07,04 You know it's a wonderful and interesting I mean what's kind of cool about this and he enjoyed everything singing he. 157 00:17:08,10 --> 00:17:15,04 Was like amateur in some way or more importantly intentionally not stable 158 00:17:15,81 --> 00:17:22,44 and then it really challenges the sounds neat a question like would I actually use this and not trust this well. 159 00:17:25,45 --> 00:17:34,32 I haven't used it yet so that it is a good I sort of tested usability but I thought it didn't go all the way. 160 00:17:36,86 --> 00:17:38,11 What it wanted to. 161 00:17:39,75 --> 00:17:45,64 Yes So I guess what I'm seeing is I'm having some trouble figuring out if the lid is here 162 00:17:45,94 --> 00:17:47,79 and I guess that's just the angles of the. 163 00:17:49,16 --> 00:17:53,85 The angles of the shot and then the home where bucket appears to be full of sawdust 164 00:17:53,86 --> 00:17:59,98 but I'm assuming it would rub talks about it maybe it's going to be more complex than that yeah it is no more. 165 00:18:00,04 --> 00:18:05,25 Complex than it is honest. And so so is this a composting toilet is that what. 166 00:18:06,61 --> 00:18:15,55 It is it's what I have learnt come to learn as a what they call a dry toilet which where composting So yeah. 167 00:18:16,91 --> 00:18:25,61 It's a roughly twenty inch by eighteen inch cube with a circular hole cut in the top with a lid 168 00:18:26,41 --> 00:18:33,36 and then there's a bucket of saw and there's an orange bucket down inside the cube that you can put in and. 169 00:18:34,48 --> 00:18:41,86 There's a roll of toilet paper for your sanitary use and and additional orange bucket of sawdust and. 170 00:18:42,99 --> 00:18:51,73 It's what you call the dry it's called a dry toilet. Dry So it is composting itself does not happen in the toilet so. 171 00:18:53,64 --> 00:18:59,25 There's no breakdown of materials or additional bacteria 172 00:18:59,26 --> 00:19:08,20 or anything added to the mixture to begin the composting process inside the bucket it's really just meant to collect 173 00:19:08,64 --> 00:19:21,35 your poop for for use in a compost pile somewhere else and this week's This episode's challenge is homemade chemicals. 174 00:19:23,66 --> 00:19:28,85 So I was trying to think about all sorts of different homemade chemicals 175 00:19:28,86 --> 00:19:40,68 and then I sort of got to thinking about how I make chemicals and. As a biology person yes I say about your person and. 176 00:19:41,94 --> 00:19:47,99 So I was like oh I could I I think it would be interesting to try composting my own poop. 177 00:19:49,76 --> 00:19:53,29 And pee waste also and just sort of see what that's like 178 00:19:53,30 --> 00:20:00,42 and set up maybe a separate compost pile we have a compost bin now but to sort of see how that goes and. And. 179 00:20:01,84 --> 00:20:02,57 I don't know C. C. 180 00:20:02,58 --> 00:20:07,10 What happened so there's a little bit of follow up perhaps in a few months that could happen to sort of see where I'm 181 00:20:07,11 --> 00:20:14,19 at but I read in researching this project I read a really cool book called The Human newer handbook. 182 00:20:15,22 --> 00:20:17,42 By Joseph Jenkins he. 183 00:20:18,63 --> 00:20:23,49 Wrote the book in the mid ninety's I think I looked at the second edition which I think is one thousand nine hundred 184 00:20:23,50 --> 00:20:32,86 nine. And I had I have used a dry toilet before a really cool like design and build group called Sim park and Chicago. 185 00:20:34,56 --> 00:20:42,12 Has built a little kind of off the grid residency space in Utah connected to the Center for land use interpretation 186 00:20:42,13 --> 00:20:45,49 and there is a dry toilet there and so that was my first sort of use of it 187 00:20:45,50 --> 00:20:50,86 and I was shocked at like kind of how well it worked and how not smelly It was. And stuff so. 188 00:20:52,38 --> 00:20:54,56 I thought I put you know I could probably have one in my backyard 189 00:20:54,57 --> 00:21:02,62 and actually won't you know be this like Fly magnet and stuff. And I read this I also read a really interesting. 190 00:21:04,07 --> 00:21:07,49 Academic paper called the characterization of feces 191 00:21:07,50 --> 00:21:11,22 and urine a review of the literature to inform advance treatment technology. 192 00:21:13,91 --> 00:21:17,66 And it really gets it and it really gets into the chemical makeup 193 00:21:17,67 --> 00:21:24,19 and biological makeup of what what Coop is from around the world like they do a sort of comparative study of like what 194 00:21:24,20 --> 00:21:29,29 is different group like in different animals and what is different in different cultures and different countries. 195 00:21:30,87 --> 00:21:33,15 Which is really interesting and a link to that stuff in show notes 196 00:21:34,06 --> 00:21:38,25 and I also looked a little bit into what Mr Fuller has a kind of democracy in toilet. 197 00:21:39,48 --> 00:21:46,40 But he kind of missed the mark a little bit like he has this toilet that is a dry toilet but it is essentially like. 198 00:21:47,49 --> 00:21:51,09 Like a foil pack that you put into and then you like to wrap up the foil 199 00:21:51,43 --> 00:21:58,47 and then throw the for oil into sort of compost bin that your city would pick up you know to use 200 00:21:58,48 --> 00:21:59,98 but he didn't go for company. 201 00:22:00,01 --> 00:22:06,17 Sting in the backyard he was and he was kind of a city fell as I think I think of him so maybe he had a backyard 202 00:22:06,41 --> 00:22:14,68 but picturing his toilet to be G. It is it in nature as well which yes a couple of oh man that would be so cool. 203 00:22:15,87 --> 00:22:20,82 So so yeah so I went for the composting toilet I have a dry show that I haven't used it yet. 204 00:22:22,08 --> 00:22:24,05 But I do I did order 205 00:22:24,06 --> 00:22:30,51 but I haven't got a yet like a little nitrogen in carbon testing kit so I thought I could do some studies to see like 206 00:22:31,05 --> 00:22:37,61 how much nitrogen and carbon are in my compost pile and kind of how that that goes. 207 00:22:39,12 --> 00:22:45,87 Yeah yes I mix that about that I learned a lot about poop. Which is really really cool. 208 00:22:48,72 --> 00:22:53,81 There there is actually more nitrogen and pee in there isn't poop which I didn't know 209 00:22:54,18 --> 00:22:59,19 and so if you're trying to add nitrogen to your compost pile just peeing in a compost pile occasionally can really help. 210 00:23:01,09 --> 00:23:08,81 And so the sawdust so to talk about a failure that sawdust is a sawdust I should not be using I went to the home store 211 00:23:09,12 --> 00:23:15,48 looking for like. Maybe sawdust chips or something like that in the garden section and they didn't have any. 212 00:23:16,50 --> 00:23:22,83 And so I was like oh I'll just and so I asked like four or five different people at the homes 213 00:23:22,84 --> 00:23:25,80 or if they had sought us and everyone gave me a different answer 214 00:23:25,84 --> 00:23:28,97 but then the fourth person was like Oh just just come to the back 215 00:23:28,98 --> 00:23:34,50 and we'll fill you a bucket full from where we do all of our cuts and I was like OK awesome and then I realized 216 00:23:34,51 --> 00:23:43,79 when I got home like that sawdust is full of like grocer treated lumber pressure treated lumber exactly and like other. 217 00:23:45,75 --> 00:23:48,53 Like it he says from plywood and stuff 218 00:23:49,00 --> 00:23:57,34 and I was like poop it would be the least of my problems in this compost then if I use this as compost so so I need to 219 00:23:57,35 --> 00:23:59,10 get some different side us in order to actually use. 220 00:24:01,98 --> 00:24:11,72 ACTUALLY GET OVER IT Yeah thanks that is amazing it's interesting to. Think also about the history of who. 221 00:24:13,55 --> 00:24:15,33 Like who can pay basically. 222 00:24:16,58 --> 00:24:20,45 Relation to sanitation and sanitation to Elegy 223 00:24:21,38 --> 00:24:27,26 and Urban Development like out like so not just for kind of like fertilizer for instance. 224 00:24:28,34 --> 00:24:36,54 Gardens but also in the structures. And I'm reminded of like pre-Enlightenment like. 225 00:24:38,03 --> 00:24:44,69 London I think Edinburgh also this was. Was known I think Edinburgh is not known it's like old. 226 00:24:45,76 --> 00:24:53,57 And the name was it was in that way before kind of like blossom during the lightning because people would toss their 227 00:24:53,58 --> 00:25:01,21 pots chambers directly from the windows to the streets and supporters of it I think London has similarly like. 228 00:25:06,74 --> 00:25:11,16 So Sudan would you care to go the next one you think oh sure 229 00:25:12,06 --> 00:25:15,62 or would you like to go list prepare It's what you call it I like and I think. 230 00:25:21,28 --> 00:25:27,91 Well that's what I have two quick links just to share those up which are happening one is Judge Incans is this person 231 00:25:27,92 --> 00:25:33,00 on You Tube has a video called The lovable loo which is really funny and and get 232 00:25:33,01 --> 00:25:39,07 and he has like a very deadpan sense of humor so it's nice to hear him talking about this stuff he has some like dry 233 00:25:39,08 --> 00:25:44,07 toads in his cabin himself but then also Nancy Clinton pretty cool. 234 00:25:45,27 --> 00:25:49,05 Plant person in Chicago and her Web site is called spontaneous vegetation 235 00:25:49,06 --> 00:25:58,60 and she has all sorts of cool projects attached to using different you know things we think of as waste whether it's 236 00:25:58,61 --> 00:26:05,81 human waste or are you. Used tires or what not to. In to sort of repurpose that stuff and so. 237 00:26:07,25 --> 00:26:12,36 To her insurance as well you know were there many years ago my wife 238 00:26:12,37 --> 00:26:19,24 and I did we took this camping bettery around they were doing sled lectures in public parks so it's cool to hear a name 239 00:26:19,50 --> 00:26:27,35 pick up again you know I was away as like fifteen years ago or something. Is great. Aha I see a link. 240 00:26:31,84 --> 00:26:36,72 There of I'm looking at the link going to start with the images of where I'm seeing. 241 00:26:38,32 --> 00:26:42,66 Some kind of maybe a stainless kettle or something like that with. 242 00:26:44,33 --> 00:26:50,39 Styrofoam you can see a little cylindrical or rather a spherical beads of styrofoam in Riyadh 243 00:26:50,40 --> 00:26:52,52 and yes it's own as it were seen there yes. 244 00:26:55,51 --> 00:27:02,79 For it so it's looking like making a type of plastic wrap What are you picking up there yeah so. 245 00:27:05,49 --> 00:27:06,66 He asked how it is like a. 246 00:27:07,77 --> 00:27:10,33 Looks like about a half gallon or a quarter something and there's some foam 247 00:27:10,34 --> 00:27:17,21 and it's in a stainless steel pot there's some use of rubber gloves vinyl gloves which seem smart. And well this. 248 00:27:21,20 --> 00:27:24,06 Oh yeah oh yeah there's like a. 249 00:27:25,24 --> 00:27:30,93 Well oh that's really neat there's a OK yeah there's like a turkey frying a turkey cooking pan. 250 00:27:32,74 --> 00:27:38,47 That is looks like holding a mold or maybe that's what's being used as a receptacle in some way. 251 00:27:40,72 --> 00:27:45,95 Oh it's biodegradable plastic Oh that's I think well I think these are these are two different kinds for it because it 252 00:27:45,96 --> 00:27:59,98 looks like the first one is listed as acetone and Styrofoam the second one is milk and editor I had no idea. So. 253 00:28:00,22 --> 00:28:07,69 Also with the images it looks to me like as is so frustratingly cover the biodegradable one doesn't seem to have that 254 00:28:07,70 --> 00:28:12,30 same excellent consistency you know the first one really looks like taffy or something. 255 00:28:13,57 --> 00:28:18,72 And then the second one appears to maintain a little bit of its shonky nature. 256 00:28:20,02 --> 00:28:20,79 Interesting 257 00:28:21,60 --> 00:28:28,68 and they do it there is another link here that some of the there's a microwave looking object that is looking very 258 00:28:28,69 --> 00:28:35,06 threatening So yeah all that. Microbes on the floor is suggestive of some. 259 00:28:36,25 --> 00:28:42,24 Skullduggery going to get there they'll survey your experiences of the first one he describes 260 00:28:42,77 --> 00:28:51,24 and that one is a best friend signing and it's all plastic and it was actually our very first image out. 261 00:28:52,43 --> 00:28:53,90 And that came out. 262 00:28:55,39 --> 00:28:59,27 I discussion is actually pretty much how divestments and again he 263 00:28:59,61 --> 00:29:04,81 and I was having a discussion with a friend of mine and I was describing some like experiment 264 00:29:04,82 --> 00:29:06,92 or kind of I was working on what I was trying to like. 265 00:29:09,53 --> 00:29:14,69 Like Make it was trying to me like some high magnets that like high magnets 266 00:29:15,51 --> 00:29:20,64 and cutlery so that people would just accidentally kind of like make sounds well. 267 00:29:22,61 --> 00:29:29,19 And and so my mate livelier Joey was like well how you can do that you know how to do that no speaker now 268 00:29:30,00 --> 00:29:35,55 and so then we had this long conversation about like figuring things out and this like D.I.Y. and. 269 00:29:36,78 --> 00:29:46,06 Approach and disregard for kind of like. The higher easel and I can turn my eyes from passionless them. 270 00:29:47,18 --> 00:29:52,95 And then from that you know we decided to host Michael Billy workshop and we would just like get together 271 00:29:52,96 --> 00:29:59,98 and tackle when I take on a different. Topic musically and learn how to do something. 272 00:30:01,13 --> 00:30:03,17 And that's kind of how the best friends in the game 273 00:30:04,03 --> 00:30:14,91 and so our very first workshop Joey who wanted to learn he felt that he is like hung up on too needy by soldiers 274 00:30:14,92 --> 00:30:21,88 and nothing about sculpture anybody want to plaster so we decided that trying to figure out how to make plastic. 275 00:30:23,22 --> 00:30:29,84 And so that's what moves in this case the kind of documentation from a very first hand which is making pasta 276 00:30:29,88 --> 00:30:36,18 and so we just kind of got a vibe we sent out like an e-mail to folks and people showed up 277 00:30:36,19 --> 00:30:45,16 but in this case this was Joey's house. And we got as many materials as we could. For instance cheap. 278 00:30:46,23 --> 00:30:50,65 And and tended to me like my consulting gods that. 279 00:30:51,76 --> 00:30:55,11 Tried to make two different version the plastic one was like highly toxic. 280 00:30:56,50 --> 00:30:59,07 And the other one was about agreement and 281 00:30:59,69 --> 00:31:08,72 and so the highly toxic one turned out pretty wonderful me on the current times mold We think that they actually want 282 00:31:08,73 --> 00:31:15,24 present leasing. With Amy at that workshop into an existing ongoing project working. 283 00:31:16,80 --> 00:31:23,05 On the second version which was a great day ended up looking like cottage cheese. 284 00:31:24,09 --> 00:31:34,63 And wonder it's our Someone bought a dog so much up and. Ate what they got that's. Which I'm sure that's fine. 285 00:31:35,82 --> 00:31:39,81 Since everything seems and it's basically just like milk and. 286 00:31:40,95 --> 00:31:46,30 And apply heat so and that is so is it just like a like a super curdling use 287 00:31:46,31 --> 00:31:55,42 or you know does it's I'm curious to hear more about the sort of tangible being that this activates the senses 288 00:31:55,87 --> 00:31:59,76 interestingly enough biodegradable version didn't. 289 00:32:01,01 --> 00:32:04,16 And yet it did have kind of like a very like bio smell 290 00:32:04,17 --> 00:32:09,99 and I think not to our Yeah just that having us carry over into the kitchen 291 00:32:10,00 --> 00:32:17,51 but somehow the vinegar like cancelled out some rolls but it I mean this this knowledge from the biodegradable. 292 00:32:18,61 --> 00:32:26,51 Plastic which really was not at all paled in comparison to what the very obvious toxicity of. The non-biodegradable. 293 00:32:27,85 --> 00:32:28,97 Plastic was for a moment 294 00:32:29,32 --> 00:32:37,95 and it worried actually I mean that like styrofoam is pretty like unmanageable the acetone having that many people 295 00:32:37,96 --> 00:32:41,74 and I think over and over you know and Jane you know and pouring acetone in. 296 00:32:43,72 --> 00:32:54,80 That was you know for a minute we kind of tested maybe us behind like hosting an amateur hour because it's right on the 297 00:32:54,81 --> 00:32:59,28 one hand it's really exciting and you know easy to kind of like get into that that zone 298 00:32:59,29 --> 00:33:07,89 but there is some kind of response of them or there might be as hosts you know other people in the space trusting us 299 00:33:07,90 --> 00:33:16,37 or we're trusting each other but we really have absolutely no idea. Causing brain cell damage you know to people. So. 300 00:33:17,46 --> 00:33:27,34 And so some of. The questions that came out of this person workshop basically in terms of trust. Kind of led to. 301 00:33:31,56 --> 00:33:42,09 The micro. So we really wanted to push the boundaries of. What we can. Do we have done everything from like checks and. 302 00:33:43,11 --> 00:33:52,35 Urban Design. And. Fog machines me to one dollar projectors I mean these kinds of things. 303 00:33:56,37 --> 00:34:03,83 But the idea kind of like trusting each other the game really. Million points. To host. 304 00:34:05,11 --> 00:34:16,95 Machine project and welcome to our missions as part of the intercept. Which already came from like a an F.A. 305 00:34:16,96 --> 00:34:27,08 On the tenth that really were interested in failure to me. And then it Diamond. In an icon. And we actually. 306 00:34:29,38 --> 00:34:41,32 In the process. But they are. Kind of. Probably more alarming to the neighbors since we had to do this. 307 00:34:42,86 --> 00:34:58,80 In the parking lot away from ours. But we found. Like some. Tutorial on how to like synthetic diamonds in the grate. 308 00:35:02,53 --> 00:35:08,19 And we really want to try it so we did and it's pretty fabulous that. 309 00:35:13,91 --> 00:35:21,94 Inspired this and there's a whole like you also then I found some of it in. In a book. 310 00:35:25,30 --> 00:35:27,57 And that kind of the core of that but in this. 311 00:35:29,23 --> 00:35:35,17 In this kind of a tutorial it takes forever but the idea is you can in theory. Diamonds and. 312 00:35:36,33 --> 00:35:43,71 Peanut butter charcoal and a lot a lot of pressure. But aren't. 313 00:35:47,06 --> 00:35:54,01 So it so where does the pressure come from in that place. So in the in the microwave I think you have to kind of what. 314 00:35:55,54 --> 00:35:59,20 You place like your church inside like tons of people. 315 00:36:00,10 --> 00:36:09,06 INS and then you place that inside of like high rights hands that you cover them with and then you place that inside 316 00:36:09,85 --> 00:36:18,03 and that's supposed to and have to like microwave. And that's where I guess that person. 317 00:36:19,27 --> 00:36:29,46 Is somehow like flies efficient fashion or it should. Do kind of like force or mini what would happen in terms of life. 318 00:36:31,06 --> 00:36:43,90 I guess is that question for a diamond. Outside Isn't that a. Whole journey. Here. 319 00:36:46,78 --> 00:36:49,96 You know it reminds me and perhaps he already investigated this 320 00:36:49,97 --> 00:36:54,71 but I think that there's a there's a little foundry kit you can get it's a foundry in a microwave 321 00:36:55,18 --> 00:37:01,18 and I'm not sure how they get around putting out the metal in there maybe it's just a particular kind of metal I mean I 322 00:37:01,19 --> 00:37:06,98 would assume you guys of put metal in my career it's like a crazy Yeah crazy result but 323 00:37:07,35 --> 00:37:14,59 but there it's a thing about how you need to get a restaurant grade microwave because those are intended to run for you 324 00:37:14,60 --> 00:37:21,51 know multiple hours time so that if you if you guys are using just like a conventional household microwave maybe that's 325 00:37:21,52 --> 00:37:28,72 where some of the problems came from you know you're probably right removing five things. So yes probably. 326 00:37:30,96 --> 00:37:35,84 You know staying within the average your budget also and your hand for you know patients 327 00:37:35,85 --> 00:37:41,07 but you're right yes industries are going in there and standard. Market. 328 00:37:43,68 --> 00:37:47,78 And it's not it's not to say it was a bit of edge to me as it is trying to think of 329 00:37:47,79 --> 00:37:54,40 when I've encountered microwaves The other story of that is a friend of mine claimed that he figured out how to defeat 330 00:37:54,41 --> 00:37:59,98 the lock out on the door so he just take a marker just point it at something and. 331 00:38:00,01 --> 00:38:02,26 He was talking about being out in the field 332 00:38:02,76 --> 00:38:07,09 and pointing this defeated you know this prepared microwave it a nail sticking out of a board 333 00:38:07,10 --> 00:38:12,99 and like catching the board on fire some of them to see up to see if you documentation it through on live 334 00:38:13,00 --> 00:38:16,02 but yet say it sounded like there is a really dangerous. 335 00:38:17,25 --> 00:38:23,48 I mean it's funny right that you could say this like what's especially a rig as if it was going to see at thrift store 336 00:38:23,52 --> 00:38:27,24 doesn't it sound like and that's right well I can't. Really. 337 00:38:28,28 --> 00:38:33,25 I think it probably not focus it will but dangerous to the US A good good 338 00:38:33,26 --> 00:38:43,71 and I was he said hurt in a similar project and that some persons like. He Masters I think and. 339 00:38:45,41 --> 00:38:52,42 He also has like Rand someone. Post different things. And one of those things. 340 00:38:54,13 --> 00:38:57,38 Yet to me by salvaging what the president runs from. 341 00:38:59,67 --> 00:39:07,61 And he made this like really powerful yet and proceeded to then like melt pennies and to test it 342 00:39:07,88 --> 00:39:16,10 and then I think cooked like eggs and I called his kids over test the eggs like E.P.A. and He was friendly. But. 343 00:39:17,67 --> 00:39:26,73 You know it's of like it's old enough to participate in life in my bed it is. But I have a question about this and. 344 00:39:27,93 --> 00:39:34,54 The sense that gross plastic I guess the one made with acetone and Styrofoam. Was it. 345 00:39:38,37 --> 00:39:44,30 I mean I it's very intriguing like in a like if you could mold that stuff successfully. 346 00:39:45,71 --> 00:39:53,45 It seems like it there's a lot of possibility just around like making. Instead of like a three D. 347 00:39:53,57 --> 00:40:02,62 Printer or plastic object making a plastic object that is more so. Sort of formed to like a. 348 00:40:03,94 --> 00:40:05,23 Kind of wet clay sculpture 349 00:40:05,24 --> 00:40:10,93 or something I guess is the same holds true with with the biodegradable plastic I was curious like about the properties 350 00:40:10,94 --> 00:40:11,25 of each 351 00:40:11,26 --> 00:40:19,23 and sort of how you felt like they could be used to to make like to make a sculpture in a way that Joey felt threatened 352 00:40:19,24 --> 00:40:31,47 by. Yeah and I think at the earlier Colleen one giant. But it was definitely an. Like in terms like functionality. 353 00:40:32,53 --> 00:40:40,14 Worked best because it's not. To. Get things exactly. 354 00:40:41,37 --> 00:40:49,00 Plus the fact that like I mean if for some reason you happen to have lots of styrofoam around what do you do that you 355 00:40:49,01 --> 00:40:59,24 know yeah yeah and we we just have is that we did have a bunch of styrofoam and I found a bunch at it and it tossed 356 00:40:59,29 --> 00:41:12,35 and like. And so that's that was also one. Outlet for. Managing something that just tossing. 357 00:41:15,65 --> 00:41:18,40 A yarn in terms of properties against you know this 358 00:41:18,41 --> 00:41:25,38 and then it plastic like in our application was way more appealing to let me work with. 359 00:41:26,44 --> 00:41:32,47 That I'm sure that with some tweaks in like like her scene or like perfecting that bio degree when you need. 360 00:41:33,57 --> 00:41:40,62 Critical things a scene like in our research or like during the questions. And we came across like people. 361 00:41:41,74 --> 00:41:44,57 Jewelry actual objects well. 362 00:41:49,07 --> 00:41:56,21 Yeah that's cool that there's a reason I asked about that is because there's there's a really cool podcast out of Los 363 00:41:56,22 --> 00:42:01,81 Angeles called route simple it's. Eric Newton and Co. They clean and they interviewed. 364 00:42:04,74 --> 00:42:07,98 I think I think his title is Master recite Claire 365 00:42:08,02 --> 00:42:12,79 or something he's the Burbank he runs the Burbank recycling program 366 00:42:13,24 --> 00:42:17,57 and his interview is totally amazing I'll link to the show it's. 367 00:42:19,63 --> 00:42:25,07 Seems crazy Hampel And he he talks about recycling styrofoam 368 00:42:25,08 --> 00:42:29,93 and that like it's not actually recital how we think of recycling they really just sort of put it through a wood 369 00:42:29,94 --> 00:42:37,68 chipper and get it down into this sort of reusable size as opposed to treating it in any way or something like that. 370 00:42:39,09 --> 00:42:39,64 And. 371 00:42:41,60 --> 00:42:48,60 It was quite fascinating to see like what you think about recycling isn't isn't totally accurate you know 372 00:42:48,86 --> 00:42:56,58 and like could you actually read use something like Styrofoam could you make something as like disposable as the 373 00:42:56,59 --> 00:43:00,02 styrofoam pieces from your new MacBook Pro 374 00:43:00,22 --> 00:43:05,29 and turn it into an art object that you actually would never want to throw away you know like like could you actually 375 00:43:05,30 --> 00:43:08,05 take that said I don't know I was kind of compelled by that 376 00:43:08,06 --> 00:43:12,18 when I saw this like goofy plasticky stuff coming out the other side. 377 00:43:13,89 --> 00:43:20,42 That looked really cool so you know yeah I think that's. You know have you get is are you guys from earlier with. 378 00:43:21,82 --> 00:43:23,69 I'm totally drawing a blank on the artist's name 379 00:43:23,70 --> 00:43:28,18 but they did this great piece where there was this huge Hopper full of plastic pellets 380 00:43:28,59 --> 00:43:34,97 and then it would just extrude a big pile down onto a belt and then feet along so it just would sit there 381 00:43:34,98 --> 00:43:41,44 and automatically make these sculptures that resort of piled up to look like toothpaste you know like a two hundred 382 00:43:41,45 --> 00:43:42,32 pounds of toothpaste. 383 00:43:44,12 --> 00:43:47,11 The name of I will find it and post it up there 384 00:43:47,12 --> 00:43:52,61 but yeah I think there's some really nice stuff that doesn't necessarily like on the one hand you expect plastics to be 385 00:43:52,62 --> 00:43:59,98 really functional right but that was just letting them be gross and staying that way so it's conversion and not. 386 00:44:00,77 --> 00:44:07,63 Just a blob of stuff that's cool yeah. Great OK should I show you guys my pictures here yeah yeah. 387 00:44:09,40 --> 00:44:12,06 So I just to for pictures for you. 388 00:44:27,36 --> 00:44:33,70 And this is so this is so hot off the presses I was trying to do was once in a field. 389 00:44:35,01 --> 00:44:38,31 And so this was like me running around today buying chemicals 390 00:44:39,26 --> 00:44:54,90 and stuff you know just a couple of hours ago often seems to me and it only Nixon leaves out materials. But. A. Rank. 391 00:44:58,19 --> 00:45:00,91 And more you know. March. 392 00:45:06,04 --> 00:45:13,00 Yeah and then in the second photo if you know we can trade off in the second photo there looks to be a copper plate 393 00:45:13,36 --> 00:45:20,87 and three there's a looks like sharp beat on to this the copper plates maybe the size of an index card maybe a little 394 00:45:20,88 --> 00:45:23,35 bit smaller a credit card to an X. Card size and. 395 00:45:24,48 --> 00:45:28,37 I think it's tailor seems to be wearing a very heavy duty industrial rubber gloves. 396 00:45:31,22 --> 00:45:34,88 Any holding a plate and sharpie down to the plate. 397 00:45:36,21 --> 00:45:45,88 Is three sort of lines are kind of nodes and the first one says signal the second one in the middle says power 398 00:45:46,23 --> 00:45:53,86 and then at the bottom of the plate is one that says ground. And it seems that seeing. 399 00:45:55,71 --> 00:46:09,60 A plane as being placed into some chemical. Some continually holes and and slung on me. Last line it seems. 400 00:46:13,06 --> 00:46:22,87 And even then horns. And Sharkey's And yes. Martin signal ground is now asking. 401 00:46:25,84 --> 00:46:33,35 Exactly yes so this was something I had tried a couple of years ago and couldn't get to work 402 00:46:34,04 --> 00:46:41,20 and I have to just say I was shamelessly hitting at Instructables for this process and my initial idea was to try 403 00:46:41,21 --> 00:46:43,59 and work with the material ahead and seen before 404 00:46:43,64 --> 00:46:51,89 and so I started looking at gallium So I've got this background in foundry but for you know some of the. 405 00:46:53,03 --> 00:46:57,96 Permanent metals like bronze and steel and things like that are bronze in aluminum rather. 406 00:46:59,07 --> 00:47:04,94 So I was interested in seeing gallium which you can if you just heat it with your hand it reaches its melting 407 00:47:04,95 --> 00:47:09,55 temperature and so there are these cool tutorials where you would take. 408 00:47:10,64 --> 00:47:15,06 Just a little I don't know if this particular Instructable covers it because I wear some videos too 409 00:47:15,51 --> 00:47:18,98 but you'd mix them gelatin like just straight up jello gelatin 410 00:47:19,40 --> 00:47:25,80 and then casts a key in existing house key into that gelatin and then take that out 411 00:47:25,84 --> 00:47:29,57 and then just heat up some gallium I think it's melting point is like eighty five degrees 412 00:47:29,58 --> 00:47:31,34 or something so you pour it in there 413 00:47:31,78 --> 00:47:37,55 and then as long as it wasn't too hot on your way to the door you wanted to open it 414 00:47:37,66 --> 00:47:43,02 and you would want to keep in your pocket but but apparently it's you know it's beefy enough to do that 415 00:47:43,30 --> 00:47:49,27 but then the problem I found of course was that they didn't want to send gallium in the mail through anything 416 00:47:49,28 --> 00:47:52,51 but the slowest possible U.P.S. Ground so I could get it in time. 417 00:47:54,37 --> 00:47:59,95 And then so the recipe years really simple you just take myriad a guess at which is used for. 418 00:48:00,29 --> 00:48:04,52 Cleaning or to resetting pool ph but also for etching brick 419 00:48:04,53 --> 00:48:10,18 and concrete to prepare it for painting Oh yeah so this is something I was kind of surprised to find me just get it 420 00:48:10,19 --> 00:48:15,87 anywhere it's really cheap I think this way you get like a gallon for eight bucks or something like that 421 00:48:16,43 --> 00:48:26,60 and then you just combine that in a really simple ratio by volume so it's one part. One part myriad of acids two parts. 422 00:48:28,72 --> 00:48:35,15 I'm sorry what was that I have there again and then you have I forget Yes So so my understanding 423 00:48:36,17 --> 00:48:38,87 and this is not I don't understand it super well 424 00:48:38,88 --> 00:48:43,44 but I believe the peroxide is just there to sort of error rates the myriad of gases 425 00:48:44,17 --> 00:48:49,99 and then once you introduce copper so you guys are defiant you describing as a copper plate I think slightly more 426 00:48:50,00 --> 00:48:58,05 accurately it's a copper clay and plastic right so that we had some of the copper away your isolating traces. 427 00:48:59,20 --> 00:49:04,23 So yes it was it was research for me just trying to figure out not really having worked with this stuff before 428 00:49:04,72 --> 00:49:10,13 and trying to learn some of the safe practices like I do like you had acid to water. 429 00:49:11,90 --> 00:49:20,17 Oh not the opposite not adding well into acid well and see this because so do you guys is it liquor before beer. 430 00:49:21,22 --> 00:49:27,88 In the clear or liquor then beer in the clear you see it I mean I think that's the wrong example 431 00:49:27,89 --> 00:49:30,41 but that always confused me because I felt like you could turn it over 432 00:49:30,42 --> 00:49:37,05 and it still worked in the rhyme anyway so apparently this is just something it's not a chemical thing 433 00:49:37,06 --> 00:49:42,80 but it's like if you pour the acid into the water you're less likely to splash the water out. 434 00:49:43,88 --> 00:49:48,00 Whereas if the acid goes in first and I guess that's more of a safety risk 435 00:49:48,52 --> 00:49:55,00 and I do stuff like you know these are I think. You know verifying I had that first. 436 00:49:56,03 --> 00:49:59,94 Spoiler alert but the first couple episodes of Breaking Bad right there's a really specific. 437 00:50:00,45 --> 00:50:07,80 Discussion about melting a body in a particular kind of plastic and then they get the wrong plastic number 438 00:50:07,81 --> 00:50:12,69 and you know and shit hits the fan so yes certainly not to try to do due diligence 439 00:50:12,70 --> 00:50:17,72 and do this safely that is pretty straightforward I just did it outside fumed a little bit 440 00:50:17,73 --> 00:50:23,70 when the two fluids went together but I was surprised to Fest it works you know so I just threw the. 441 00:50:25,22 --> 00:50:31,14 Little Copper panel in there I think it was only in there about twelve minutes and I sort of agitated it a bit 442 00:50:31,67 --> 00:50:37,91 but once the majority of the copper was gone you could really you could almost watch it dissolving it would kind of 443 00:50:37,92 --> 00:50:39,72 went faster and faster as it goes. 444 00:50:40,98 --> 00:50:45,14 So the thing with this stuff apparently is that and I'm forgetting the chemical name for it 445 00:50:45,15 --> 00:50:50,27 but it will continue to work and it will get greener and greener and that once it gets sort of sludgy 446 00:50:50,28 --> 00:50:56,86 and brown you can just updated a little bit by blowing more air through it so apparently you can just stick like an 447 00:50:56,87 --> 00:50:57,98 aquarium pump in there. 448 00:50:59,37 --> 00:51:02,75 Or put a little bit new a little bit more hydrogen peroxide in 449 00:51:02,82 --> 00:51:07,12 and occasionally a little bit more asses so it's it's kind of indefinite 450 00:51:07,16 --> 00:51:13,94 but eventually you'll wind up with a bunch of copper salts that you have to get you know professionally disposed by the 451 00:51:13,95 --> 00:51:15,22 city or something like that. 452 00:51:16,90 --> 00:51:23,80 Because the copper goes in a solution I guess that yes a combination of neurotic acid and yeah that's cool wow yeah 453 00:51:23,81 --> 00:51:29,61 and that's what turns back green like that yeah I saw that I mean I was like Man those two chemicals turned super green 454 00:51:29,62 --> 00:51:30,33 when you put it together 455 00:51:30,34 --> 00:51:35,69 but you know what what's happening instead is the copper is going to solution into that it's clear though 456 00:51:35,70 --> 00:51:37,39 when it starts the two when you combine them. 457 00:51:39,04 --> 00:51:40,61 Yeah so you put them together 458 00:51:41,61 --> 00:51:48,46 and was describing there is a little glass vessel because this is the stuff is really aggressive on metals 459 00:51:48,50 --> 00:51:53,82 but as far as I can tell there's no plastics that it eats but you know I wouldn't I would not take my word for it. 460 00:51:55,23 --> 00:51:59,95 So I was you know I was trying to do some basic internet research but ultimately had to remind myself you know. 461 00:52:00,01 --> 00:52:07,41 It's one thing to research like I don't know like Recently I was researching the best way to roll up my new character 462 00:52:07,42 --> 00:52:12,40 and that is the dragon said you know I can get different views from different people on line and that's fine 463 00:52:12,74 --> 00:52:19,27 but if I just you know go with one you know some guy in Instructables I have to remind myself like if I if I put this 464 00:52:19,31 --> 00:52:23,56 these two chemicals together and I blow up that's it's not nobody but me. 465 00:52:25,16 --> 00:52:31,07 So yes there is interesting stuff to read about like I guess the safety warning I think you're supposed to flush it 466 00:52:31,08 --> 00:52:38,65 with water and then cover the area with baking soda to. To to help the acidity Yeah. 467 00:52:39,72 --> 00:52:45,66 So it was kind of cool to get some indications about that so now I've got this material it's just in the sea a little 468 00:52:45,67 --> 00:52:48,87 bucket and then presumably I can use it sort of in perpetuity 469 00:52:48,88 --> 00:52:54,20 but I am going to have to you know treat it with respect and then dispose it correctly at some point. 470 00:52:55,75 --> 00:53:03,38 Yeah and that's really the answer to go Wayne let me something you know when the. Chinese don't wash. 471 00:53:05,45 --> 00:53:08,05 You know that the first time around I had and they gave her a bottle 472 00:53:08,06 --> 00:53:14,34 and this time it's been upgraded to a vessel that I can make very clear because when you put in the Gator it 473 00:53:14,35 --> 00:53:23,84 but I mean it's just bright green it looks totally like iterated. Kind of a Putin ask. You know dangerous implement. 474 00:53:25,35 --> 00:53:31,60 Because what was his THINK didn't wasn't there some suggestion that Russia tried to assassinate a guy by putting like a 475 00:53:31,61 --> 00:53:36,54 radioactive isotope in his takeout sushi or said you guys remember the story. 476 00:53:38,72 --> 00:53:41,52 But apparently it was something like you know there were 477 00:53:41,53 --> 00:53:46,62 but there were maybe five people on earth that could actually get this stuff because it had to fall out of like an 478 00:53:46,63 --> 00:53:48,13 actual nuclear power plant 479 00:53:48,72 --> 00:53:55,76 and so it was one of those ways where you know it was basically a state actor saying we are a state actor attacking you 480 00:53:55,77 --> 00:53:59,98 because nobody else could get this really bizarre. And when you. 481 00:54:00,23 --> 00:54:06,15 Elements I'll see if I can find that story for the yeah he has hands sounds worth reading for sure do you feel like 482 00:54:06,16 --> 00:54:09,51 that so it's a so it's a copper clad board 483 00:54:09,52 --> 00:54:17,62 and just sussed out all about that I think of as a like a fiberglass panel with a copper copper layer I guess glue 484 00:54:17,63 --> 00:54:25,26 or something I don't know how they attach that to lay down on top of it and then where you drew on the sharpie. 485 00:54:26,39 --> 00:54:28,59 The etchant doesn't doesn't. 486 00:54:30,03 --> 00:54:36,70 Hit that part of the copper so the copper stays in so where you wrote signal power and ground you now have copper 487 00:54:36,71 --> 00:54:40,10 but where you hadn't written anything all that copper has disappeared right. 488 00:54:41,29 --> 00:54:49,00 Read in this this is late it too I was thinking about making some little breadboard it will be cds that represent 489 00:54:49,19 --> 00:54:56,06 common circuits that oh yeah so I have a little drawing of the circuit diagram for an N.P.N. 490 00:54:56,07 --> 00:54:58,37 Transistor like a TIP one twenty Yeah 491 00:54:58,41 --> 00:55:04,80 and I think I think I have that drawing like in fifty different places in my notes I just read I was I mean I was even 492 00:55:04,81 --> 00:55:07,63 think about getting it set to have it it just comes up so commonly Yep 493 00:55:07,74 --> 00:55:12,49 and so I thought this could be a cool way to take something that doesn't have to look beautiful 494 00:55:12,50 --> 00:55:18,80 but it's sort of a little like you were saying like a little credit card that not only has a functioning circuit on it 495 00:55:18,87 --> 00:55:26,24 but that also I can just write my notes sort of on the card itself so it's the traces the traces are formed of 496 00:55:26,25 --> 00:55:31,08 functioning you know the letters are actually forming the functional part of the circuit that's really cool you know 497 00:55:31,09 --> 00:55:38,44 like a circuit circuit notebook that is the board's that's the US allow us with a cool idea do you feel like that 498 00:55:38,73 --> 00:55:44,91 copper that was remaining could. Did it did it work I guess to feel like there's enough copper there left it. 499 00:55:46,99 --> 00:55:52,28 You could make a board out of the you could make a circuit out of the motor made Yeah yeah for sure it's so the other 500 00:55:52,29 --> 00:55:54,77 things I was looking at apparently you can. 501 00:55:55,95 --> 00:55:59,98 You can make a layout in one of the free programs like eagle or something in the. 502 00:56:00,08 --> 00:56:02,57 Prints it out using a laser printer 503 00:56:02,92 --> 00:56:07,14 and he actually prints on to magazine pages so depending on where you go like hack a day 504 00:56:07,15 --> 00:56:12,10 or whatever you know one guy says the Atlantic works the best or the you know New Yorker 505 00:56:12,28 --> 00:56:17,62 or the New York Times Sunday magazine or whatever yet so you're actually trying to find a glossy page 506 00:56:18,02 --> 00:56:23,06 and then you tape that onto a standard piece of paper and then make your laser print 507 00:56:23,54 --> 00:56:29,72 and then the material kind of wants to fall off if you reheat it so you use an iron to transfer it onto the board. 508 00:56:31,78 --> 00:56:37,74 So if the if that were to work really smoothly that would be a great way to do stuff that was too complicated to do by 509 00:56:37,75 --> 00:56:38,61 hand yeah 510 00:56:38,65 --> 00:56:45,66 but apparently that is just a total black magic where you have to like you know have an iron with a really specific 511 00:56:45,67 --> 00:56:49,16 temperature range and you know do these tricks with that and pressure 512 00:56:49,17 --> 00:56:52,75 and all that stuff so I was definitely interested because I've ordered P.C.B. 513 00:56:52,76 --> 00:56:56,38 Used from China they just take a long time to yeah but they're great 514 00:56:56,52 --> 00:57:01,72 and so I was trying to think you know what would the kind of circuit be that you could make that would actually just be 515 00:57:01,73 --> 00:57:04,04 really fast like you draw it you know with a pen 516 00:57:04,05 --> 00:57:09,79 and then plop it in the water so once you have all the stuff you know assuming that the it doesn't take you a long time 517 00:57:09,80 --> 00:57:11,20 to draw the P.C.B. 518 00:57:11,65 --> 00:57:15,68 I mean the whole process is less than an hour but then I have not tried to populate it yet 519 00:57:15,73 --> 00:57:22,60 but yeah I think it'll work yes he seems to me it's unlikely that he did this because I thought and I don't think. 520 00:57:24,24 --> 00:57:30,98 Trying to make my own P.C. Points and never mentioned. That you did and also when you were talking about. 521 00:57:32,28 --> 00:57:40,36 The changes you said to one Chinese and I and one minute and. When I'm so glad when I was asked once and. 522 00:57:42,18 --> 00:57:47,49 When they weren't in time and I can't well when I was working on. 523 00:57:51,69 --> 00:57:59,01 Two point lead ins and and I can't he can't tell me like you need to order you know like Stop trying to like salvage. 524 00:58:00,08 --> 00:58:01,78 I was going. To. 525 00:58:03,16 --> 00:58:07,54 Get like you know a newer transistor because he just 526 00:58:08,42 --> 00:58:14,18 and I think you can't exactly what I think like yeah like you know resisting that 527 00:58:14,19 --> 00:58:22,18 and just kind of like scrapping kind of all devices for. Us we ended up writing a whole article in response to like. 528 00:58:24,47 --> 00:58:33,02 We're going to send you a link that's you know you mean it's not. Very fast so well. So this was just. 529 00:58:34,28 --> 00:58:41,53 So the what I looking for that portal where this write up happened was as website it wasn't for like an academic papers 530 00:58:41,54 --> 00:58:48,25 something like No no this is website where I like you know he's ended up going on this like really amazing right it's 531 00:58:48,29 --> 00:58:55,90 like you know he no it's not you know I think I'm going to get like my stats. You know like it's like ten cents. 532 00:58:57,36 --> 00:59:04,70 Just by a musket and I insisted on that and then she got me thinking. Right yeah. 533 00:59:06,65 --> 00:59:12,78 That's so you know this is exactly the stuff. That's what I want to read that because he Tom I mean Tom's. 534 00:59:13,89 --> 00:59:16,79 Life histories tele interesting and his work is really cool 535 00:59:16,96 --> 00:59:25,76 and he is also like a super Rambler restore So like it's interesting that like as someone who I feel like a lot of his 536 00:59:25,77 --> 00:59:32,62 time is probably spent overhauling used parts it's interesting that the TIP one twenty triggered him in this way. 537 00:59:34,31 --> 00:59:35,49 Yeah actually pretty. 538 00:59:37,02 --> 00:59:41,33 Well yeah yeah yeah yeah are you are you called it by name 539 00:59:41,34 --> 00:59:48,48 and this I don't think I am right I wouldn't allow you to be anonymous I don't think I mean who knows maybe it wasn't 540 00:59:48,49 --> 00:59:52,77 like. You know rushing to me but I think. 541 00:59:54,36 --> 00:59:59,98 Yeah oh yeah well but my guess is he wasn't working with multiple people that all. The. 542 01:00:00,01 --> 01:00:05,23 No ignited passions regarding that's what I have I have to say I'm so proud that. 543 01:00:06,32 --> 01:00:10,79 I can tell you guys a story where the punch line is. 544 01:00:11,99 --> 01:00:13,76 Tip one twenty and everyone says Oh yeah 545 01:00:13,77 --> 01:00:17,61 and in fact you know people have their own personal stories about things so it's great. 546 01:00:19,90 --> 01:00:25,61 And I have to admit it let me apologise I was using the term loosely 547 01:00:25,62 --> 01:00:32,21 but I hope that this gentry didn't come across as inappropriate so then is there anything you want to say to 548 01:00:32,22 --> 01:00:37,84 something's up it's funny because I was thinking about that one home some things that were sending home. 549 01:00:39,22 --> 01:00:47,83 And when I was when I was thinking about just coursing through some of. Our. Ideas and think that will. 550 01:00:49,58 --> 01:00:55,76 Hold chemicals in general to listen to it and like alchemy transforming things in the. 551 01:00:57,43 --> 01:00:58,17 German way 552 01:00:58,59 --> 01:01:06,18 and any of the things that I the first three things that I thought of one was kind of like you know bio chemical like 553 01:01:06,19 --> 01:01:11,73 more poor and Spanish and shipped all security and then I also thought of like. 554 01:01:13,28 --> 01:01:20,11 These you know sanitation I was thinking like that sewage me sickly as a technology and. 555 01:01:21,19 --> 01:01:29,29 Covered that in some way like and it got me there. But covered it with sawdust. Like other that he said yeah. 556 01:01:30,95 --> 01:01:37,44 And then the idea of like making you know your own boards things. That you know you covered. 557 01:01:39,42 --> 01:01:42,74 Yes and these is voluntary million just in. 558 01:01:45,58 --> 01:01:52,14 Case I think we're at a pretty round approach Yep Dan we've we've entered the part of the podcast where you get to come 559 01:01:52,15 --> 01:02:12,45 up with our next challenge well. I mean. What about. Security Oh. Yeah that's great. 560 01:02:13,55 --> 01:02:15,30 Do you feel like you feel like that. 561 01:02:16,34 --> 01:02:20,44 We could we could run if you want with just the word security and sort of see where that takes us 562 01:02:20,45 --> 01:02:22,48 or if you want to add us. 563 01:02:23,95 --> 01:02:31,17 Adjective or component to that we could we could do that or if you want to disco a sick plane also like security in. 564 01:02:32,26 --> 01:02:44,45 And all of its iterations that that's cool to me to be. Directed you have a. Cracking security. Oh OK yeah that's. 565 01:02:45,63 --> 01:02:52,25 Cool that's great. Yeah yeah that's awesome OK. Cool we'll go with that and then. 566 01:02:53,32 --> 01:03:01,96 Oh yeah cool I had just had an awesome idea OK. OK so you can find photos of our finished projects. 567 01:03:03,24 --> 01:03:06,37 On our project site called projects that will podcast dot com. 568 01:03:08,02 --> 01:03:17,39 Big shout out to our logo designer with mask we have a logo that I love every time I see it which is two masked thumbs 569 01:03:17,40 --> 01:03:23,57 wrestling and you can check out his work at wolf mask art dot co dot U.K. 570 01:03:24,15 --> 01:03:26,27 He's a really great person if you need any design work done. 571 01:03:28,39 --> 01:03:32,59 I'd like to give a shout out to two new patriotic supporters gin and Mike. 572 01:03:33,84 --> 01:03:41,92 Their newest picture on patrons gin I checked out with the work she was doing and she hosted a cool pop gas called K. 573 01:03:41,93 --> 01:03:45,02 Pop and beer that I listened to and learned a lot about K. 574 01:03:45,03 --> 01:03:48,55 Pop stars that I didn't know anything about so it's really cool and also beer 575 01:03:48,73 --> 01:03:56,72 and then also some really cool designs work design work in her at the store Mike is a tech director 576 01:03:56,73 --> 01:03:59,95 and a Python developer who I know fairly well because. 577 01:04:00,01 --> 01:04:05,22 He works with me and he's moving his family from California to Texas this weekend 578 01:04:05,54 --> 01:04:11,65 and he wanted to kick us a few dollars on patron because we're helping him stay awake on the road as he drives twelve 579 01:04:11,66 --> 01:04:12,84 hours to try to get. 580 01:04:14,19 --> 01:04:20,30 A tight think El Paso or somewhere like that so he's probably cruising through West Texas right now so Mike. 581 01:04:21,56 --> 01:04:22,66 We hope you're spotting Big Foot 582 01:04:22,67 --> 01:04:29,65 or something interesting as you plow through one of the most notice to west west Texas but one of the most Monday 583 01:04:29,66 --> 01:04:34,22 and drives you could do. Across that state. 584 01:04:35,35 --> 01:04:40,33 So gentle Mike thinks you are now members of the league a patron supporter bath bad asses 585 01:04:41,23 --> 01:04:47,36 and if anyone else would like to join that go to patron dot com slash opposable thumbs and you can sponsor us. 586 01:04:49,45 --> 01:04:55,71 We do have a code of conduct here on the site our podcast is dedicated to providing a harassment free experience for 587 01:04:55,72 --> 01:05:02,58 everyone regardless of race gender age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject 588 01:05:02,59 --> 01:05:07,11 matter or religion we actively support an inclusive environment and we want you to be a part of it 589 01:05:07,28 --> 01:05:13,82 and you can check out our full code of conduct over at our site. We do also have some listener feedback. 590 01:05:16,87 --> 01:05:23,37 Gin has two recommendations for us it's different not the picture engine in episode five we talked quite a bit about 591 01:05:23,38 --> 01:05:23,97 bone folders 592 01:05:23,98 --> 01:05:30,58 and she had to online stores she wanted to share with everybody that she really recommends for purchasing bone folders 593 01:05:30,59 --> 01:05:38,28 and other book making supplies one of the stores is called Tallis I think it T A L E S in another is Hollanders have 594 01:05:38,32 --> 01:05:40,57 have you ever used any of these sites. 595 01:05:42,50 --> 01:05:48,79 And I haven't either I did check them out and it was really neat it was like so many esoteric items. 596 01:05:49,95 --> 01:05:57,28 They're both paper bookbinding archival kind of conservation kind of supply shops they have some really neat stuff they 597 01:05:57,29 --> 01:05:59,98 sell one of the things that really struck me was. 598 01:06:00,01 --> 01:06:07,94 They sell bottles of ox gull an ox gull is the juice squeeze from the gall bladder of an ox. 599 01:06:10,84 --> 01:06:17,34 That is used to what they call it as a spreading agent so it makes include on top of the water so you can marble eyes 600 01:06:17,35 --> 01:06:17,84 paper. 601 01:06:19,45 --> 01:06:26,84 So that you mix the ink I think with the Oxcart that makes the ink float stay on the top of the water I don't know why 602 01:06:26,85 --> 01:06:30,54 you wouldn't just use vegetable oil or something but you know ox calls the jam and then 603 01:06:30,88 --> 01:06:37,07 and then you dip your paper in it and it marble ises ink onto the paper so that seemed super neat 604 01:06:37,08 --> 01:06:41,47 and I was kind of interested in getting some to see what's up. Oh I did. 605 01:06:42,54 --> 01:06:47,50 Wonder if if either of you had any cooling sort things that you were into that you wanted to share. 606 01:06:49,00 --> 01:07:05,24 Thank you for the information I want to share and that I mean I want. Insulation by Alice. And she is a show coming. 607 01:07:09,02 --> 01:07:24,44 In. And all the. Projects should be nice and. Exploration of light. Take on. 608 01:07:25,64 --> 01:07:39,12 Black holes and like cyberspace I like and have a good. Yeah. Cyber Space Oh situation. One. 609 01:07:41,20 --> 01:07:47,60 Wow that's an adequate analyser reason yes OK cool that's right by my house that's in Los Angeles do you do you know 610 01:07:47,61 --> 01:07:55,89 does that person they have work on my arm and yes you could see. The actual person shown it's. 611 01:07:57,37 --> 01:08:02,49 I think that's all I've got you. Anything coming up that you want to share with the world. 612 01:08:03,87 --> 01:08:13,17 Well events actually yeah so that's been something he's starting next week actually a series and a challenge 613 01:08:13,18 --> 01:08:26,74 and John songs. And we're going to be part of. Your class and. Try will attempt to let you. Go home. To change. 614 01:08:28,94 --> 01:08:31,85 Champs next year are our times. 615 01:08:33,63 --> 01:08:39,90 And after that we'll do a couple of other called least you know junk science workshops epicenter. 616 01:08:41,48 --> 01:08:46,56 Other topics that have yet to be yet to be determined but they have in some way have to do with 617 01:08:46,57 --> 01:08:50,41 and like the junk science pseudo science or junk in science. 618 01:08:52,60 --> 01:09:01,59 Awesome there will be and you know like yes and also other. Great yeah and if people want to check out. 619 01:09:02,73 --> 01:09:10,59 The best ones learning website it's the best friends learning gang dot info and the site is is awesome 620 01:09:10,81 --> 01:09:16,23 and so I'm excited to see what comes out of those workshops and what comes of what ends up on the site so that's cool. 621 01:09:17,43 --> 01:09:23,26 Dan thanks so much for being a guest on opposable thumbs episode seven Home homemade chemicals. 622 01:09:24,80 --> 01:09:30,63 It's been really great to to have you on and hear all the stuff that you're up to and also thinks for. 623 01:09:31,65 --> 01:09:37,89 Crafting security. Which I'm going to get started on as soon as I hang up. 624 01:09:38,96 --> 01:09:48,54 So yeah so yeah thanks again Well thanks thanks to. That site that I got to be part of it. 625 01:09:49,84 --> 01:09:59,51 So yeah yeah first an episode you reckon Oh gee. Thanks again for coming on yeah I think. 626 01:10:16,69 --> 01:10:22,00 We should have a we have like a safe word for things that have been on the podcast before like. 627 01:10:25,04 --> 01:10:36,63 Let's see work it like we would get good use. Ear lobe. Yeah yeah that's good. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:16,24 --> 00:00:20,18 Welcome to the opposable thumbs podcast opposable thumbs is a park asked where Taylor 2 00:00:20,19 --> 00:00:24,55 and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 3 00:00:24,59 --> 00:00:30,10 and lessons learned that the bone is our guest this week welcome Federico. 4 00:00:31,33 --> 00:00:38,42 Thank you really excited to be here my first book is yeah we were definitely it's our first guest to. 5 00:00:40,50 --> 00:00:49,55 I mean generally speaking. Generally speaking at number eight Crazy My name is Rob Ray. I used he has dinner pronoun. 6 00:00:50,76 --> 00:00:58,39 I host exoskeleton Artspace in Los Angeles and run exoskeletal newsletter which is a tiny e-mail newsletter 7 00:00:58,84 --> 00:01:03,08 and I'm an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 8 00:01:04,43 --> 00:01:12,80 Sailor Hoke and cinnamon educator an artist based in Chicago right now researching C.N.C. 9 00:01:12,84 --> 00:01:17,69 Printmaking like using a dry point a lot of C.N.C. Machine. Three D. Printing. 10 00:01:19,49 --> 00:01:24,80 And some other stuff I was about to give away what I made this week that was a close call. 11 00:01:26,81 --> 00:01:34,05 He has coming so my name is the one. I will so he is going to. 12 00:01:35,81 --> 00:01:44,44 And then make your art is living in Los Angeles I was born in South America Colombia in particular. 13 00:01:47,07 --> 00:01:56,80 And you have questions about that we're going to go in. And. My cadres jumped on the table. So. 14 00:01:57,91 --> 00:01:58,98 I have that every single. 15 00:02:01,44 --> 00:02:11,06 So I I do a lot of art like illustration but I consider myself a maker I use sensually dabble 16 00:02:11,07 --> 00:02:18,76 or play with everything that I can get my hands on so I don't know I call myself like your cures generalist. 17 00:02:19,95 --> 00:02:22,05 Jack of all trades but like more currency. 18 00:02:24,03 --> 00:02:30,54 I think one of my favorite takes on that is that my mind now is like a rice paddy it's miles wide and inches deep. 19 00:02:33,42 --> 00:02:37,91 Not to put that on you Bay but I enjoy that one myself. I get it. 20 00:02:39,89 --> 00:02:46,42 Yeah I think what I discovered at some point is that working with my hands use made me. 21 00:02:47,84 --> 00:02:49,77 Made me happy Michelle even than 22 00:02:50,21 --> 00:02:56,17 and then I mean I've been kind of going away from happy I think is more about meaning and fulfillment. 23 00:02:58,07 --> 00:03:07,82 And so I just really enjoy like you know sewing woodworking welding. Playing with wood and metal I don't know. 24 00:03:08,99 --> 00:03:17,04 And I also teach. Right now I've been working at a local nonprofit choral hard to listen to his teaching and. 25 00:03:18,36 --> 00:03:20,45 Signs and technology the partment. 26 00:03:22,18 --> 00:03:30,25 I've been teaching for about a year mostly like opera is after school programs with middle school and 27 00:03:31,08 --> 00:03:40,86 and high school and and that has been hard it's like a serious. Earning curve for me. But it's been very interesting. 28 00:03:43,29 --> 00:03:49,30 When what do you think would you mind give us giving us an example of one of those big challenges with you know 29 00:03:49,31 --> 00:03:57,72 teaching with that age well I had no experience and classroom management was difficult for me. 30 00:04:01,25 --> 00:04:07,65 I mean they were even teaching like a hardy of things mostly like made stuff like so called like. 31 00:04:09,05 --> 00:04:16,45 Radio control airplane class and I thought some like simple machines with Lego and then I tried to also make some. 32 00:04:18,65 --> 00:04:23,58 Cardboard and things like that. And the thing I keep on running through is that. 33 00:04:24,92 --> 00:04:25,47 So for example 34 00:04:25,48 --> 00:04:30,77 when I told the Lego class I was thinking like oh working with Lego is super simple right you just put a bunch of Lego 35 00:04:30,78 --> 00:04:34,27 on the table and just go with it and 36 00:04:34,50 --> 00:04:41,78 and some things that there's not the case like getting people gets much money they do work on some things not that 37 00:04:41,79 --> 00:04:46,12 straightforward. Because like. 38 00:04:47,52 --> 00:04:53,93 I think because I'm excited about the project doesn't mean everyone's going to be excited for it it doesn't mean that I 39 00:04:53,94 --> 00:04:57,33 can communicate that excitement about why it's fun to build these 40 00:04:57,34 --> 00:05:02,79 or that you know to your point about Lego being a sort of universal I feel like with young people 41 00:05:02,83 --> 00:05:07,03 and I generally work with college students but you know that there are still young people 42 00:05:07,04 --> 00:05:11,89 and either the thing that you want them to do is hard so they're worried about looking stupid 43 00:05:12,62 --> 00:05:16,37 or the thing that you want them to do is easy and so they're worried about looking stupid. 44 00:05:17,84 --> 00:05:24,22 Red light like that like there's a way for them to fear how they will look if they get it wrong no matter what the 45 00:05:24,23 --> 00:05:32,16 level of challenges it's just a different like it's a different flavor of looking stupid I guess is their fear. 46 00:05:33,36 --> 00:05:38,24 So one thing I've definitely tried to do is on the first day of a lot of my intro classes I'll try to do something 47 00:05:38,25 --> 00:05:39,53 where I look really stupid. 48 00:05:41,28 --> 00:05:48,61 So I've had these classes where all the students have to built like a nick a sound suit for those that aren't familiar 49 00:05:48,62 --> 00:05:51,76 with this you know it's like found materials and cut totally covering the body 50 00:05:52,11 --> 00:05:59,14 but they have to make me a suit as a group just out of paper and I want some totally covered we get a Dunkin Donuts 51 00:05:59,15 --> 00:05:59,98 and does. 52 00:06:00,35 --> 00:06:06,22 That's And the attempt is to like right after that like he really vulnerable 53 00:06:06,23 --> 00:06:13,86 and in public I don't know if that's something you'd like to try but there's a freebie for you. That's really nice and. 54 00:06:18,27 --> 00:06:21,66 I know the thing that I've been thinking a lot about lately related to teaching is. 55 00:06:23,17 --> 00:06:26,94 I've been teaching middle school and. 56 00:06:28,45 --> 00:06:37,63 And then some high school classes and and what I you know what they've been telling me is that. Women tend to drop out. 57 00:06:38,76 --> 00:06:43,20 When they get to high school out in Europe drop out of this kind of like science the Mekhi sort of stuff. 58 00:06:44,42 --> 00:06:49,12 That working with these girls has been amazing is like. 59 00:06:51,25 --> 00:06:58,25 I don't know like they're really good like they're crafty they're interested they pay attention so I'm like super 60 00:06:58,26 --> 00:07:01,30 puzzle I mean I don't know much about these with like 61 00:07:01,61 --> 00:07:06,83 and so we're puzzled about you know why do we assign these like gender roles at some point. 62 00:07:07,88 --> 00:07:11,97 Like why are boys like morning to you know science and making things. 63 00:07:13,22 --> 00:07:19,89 When like what I'm experiencing right now in middle school students is that working with the girls is amazing. 64 00:07:21,98 --> 00:07:29,39 I mean obviously I suppose there's also these big kind of maturity level that you see at this particular age were the 65 00:07:29,40 --> 00:07:34,81 girls are you know kind of several years ahead in many different ways. 66 00:07:38,55 --> 00:07:44,56 But you know for example is teaching an electronic class last session and did a lot of soldering. 67 00:07:46,11 --> 00:07:52,55 And and they were good like I mean like they've fine motor skills and the sort of attention to detail. 68 00:07:53,92 --> 00:07:59,56 It's easier to get women to do it. Then. 69 00:08:00,01 --> 00:08:05,94 As for me to get boys and things just because you want to be like you know job disorder and Iris on the table 70 00:08:05,95 --> 00:08:14,69 and you know burn whatever is at hand. Which is a legitimate thing to do. You know. 71 00:08:15,80 --> 00:08:21,35 We have been working to line up other guests on the pod cast. 72 00:08:22,66 --> 00:08:28,31 And one of the people actually we mentioned them last we which is Eric Newton 73 00:08:28,32 --> 00:08:32,94 and Kelly Coyne of the route simple podcast I had asked them like hey would you would you want to do an episode 74 00:08:32,95 --> 00:08:36,60 and they seen a def interested that could be great that's awesome 75 00:08:36,64 --> 00:08:45,81 but Eric Yeah Eric said that specifically he said you should ask him about getting the beehives on to the roof of the 76 00:08:45,82 --> 00:08:54,15 eco village. So I'm asking you about getting the beehives on the roof of that. 77 00:08:55,39 --> 00:09:04,24 So so first the eco village is where you live and this is. It's like a house it's a house and call up. 78 00:09:05,37 --> 00:09:12,61 It's in the late it's in the middle of a lake in Korea Town. And it's a very interesting place. 79 00:09:14,19 --> 00:09:18,88 It was founded in ninety two and. As an intentional community. 80 00:09:19,95 --> 00:09:25,97 Is actually two buildings fill it with people that are interested in living a sort of like sustainable lifestyle 81 00:09:26,17 --> 00:09:31,59 or something along those lines and. So I've been here for a good number of years. 82 00:09:33,84 --> 00:09:39,21 They call things that they let us do crazy things like that you know having beehives on the roof 83 00:09:39,85 --> 00:09:48,80 and Eric was super helpful with that one so basically we wanted to start Starwood beekeeping there's like a wonderful 84 00:09:48,90 --> 00:09:56,74 group of people in L.A. That they call themselves the Backwards Beekeepers they do sort of like natural beekeeping. 85 00:09:58,01 --> 00:09:59,98 And Eric is you know let's have a little and. 86 00:10:00,61 --> 00:10:06,65 And so a friend another friend had a beehive in his backyard and he was it was moving 87 00:10:07,33 --> 00:10:10,14 and he was he told us like you guys want to be hugged 88 00:10:10,74 --> 00:10:13,64 and we were like Yeah yeah that sounds like an awesome way to get started 89 00:10:13,72 --> 00:10:18,20 and the only place we can put it here on the roof this is a two story building. 90 00:10:19,92 --> 00:10:23,95 And that was the safest place because anywhere else in the garden they would be like people or children. 91 00:10:25,89 --> 00:10:31,05 And so we Eric Eric was like very important in this operation to he helped us. 92 00:10:32,10 --> 00:10:42,25 Move these beehive and so we decided to sew a giant bag for the beehive and so I've got a bunch of. 93 00:10:43,39 --> 00:10:51,41 There's a there's a great dumpster in Culver City where you can. Where you can get like. 94 00:10:53,15 --> 00:10:59,88 You can get these vinyl or like other plastic banners like there's a big company that makes banners and as. 95 00:11:01,18 --> 00:11:05,04 I understand that at the end of a roll they have like these giant printers 96 00:11:05,05 --> 00:11:08,55 and at the end of the roll they have to essentially discard a bunch of the and. 97 00:11:09,64 --> 00:11:15,61 You know because of the features one like passage with a printer something so you get you know chunks of material that 98 00:11:15,62 --> 00:11:25,70 are like sometimes like six by ten pieces of like nice nice plastic so I frequent this dumpster I collect the bunch of 99 00:11:25,78 --> 00:11:28,44 you know my scavenger and so it's I. 100 00:11:29,99 --> 00:11:38,38 I I made these really big bag and so you know we went at night we set up the bag and there is a beehive. 101 00:11:40,23 --> 00:11:47,63 We bagged it all together you know like homemade bag and then we. Would you know truck. 102 00:11:49,18 --> 00:11:52,76 And and very carefully like simply through the. 103 00:11:54,06 --> 00:11:59,98 You know it was it was a series of ration like we were very happy at the end because no one gets. 104 00:12:00,01 --> 00:12:02,80 Song there was like you know. 105 00:12:04,51 --> 00:12:11,18 What vendors and there were because it had to go truly holes we had to label it they don't have a lot or. 106 00:12:12,68 --> 00:12:13,72 And that's fairly heavy. 107 00:12:15,50 --> 00:12:22,78 Into the bees the bee stay inside or they kind of buzzing around so the whole time or so yeah I guess the. 108 00:12:25,13 --> 00:12:30,69 They usually they going there behind said Knight And so what we did was 109 00:12:31,58 --> 00:12:37,18 and beehives usually have one entrance so you can relatively easily covered the entrance. 110 00:12:39,64 --> 00:12:45,99 And the whole point of having the bag was just in case you know we dropped it or. 111 00:12:48,54 --> 00:12:54,96 And so we wouldn't you know it would be kind of catastrophic to have like you know crazy B.S. 112 00:12:55,93 --> 00:12:57,55 Inside an apartment building. 113 00:13:01,18 --> 00:13:06,08 And so the focus you had you had to move it through the building in order to get it on the reed Yeah. 114 00:13:07,15 --> 00:13:14,27 Oh yeah so we have to and you know enter to in entrance of the building there go to the holes and access a roof. 115 00:13:15,59 --> 00:13:22,40 And then inside. There's there's a hatch. That is about the size of the B. Have. 116 00:13:25,37 --> 00:13:25,66 And then 117 00:13:25,67 --> 00:13:32,89 and there was there was there a technical reason for doing it it was that just for the drama dramatic Yeah they think 118 00:13:32,90 --> 00:13:34,96 of recently as we waited 119 00:13:35,82 --> 00:13:42,17 when the sun goes down the bees go back to their high of course so as to get get all the bees because if you move it 120 00:13:42,18 --> 00:13:45,59 during the day you could probably but you would lose a good amount of workers. 121 00:13:46,60 --> 00:13:49,80 When they return and if they don't see every have lost. 122 00:13:51,71 --> 00:13:55,65 Yet and to Rob's point did you if you pre-measured this thing 123 00:13:55,66 --> 00:14:01,26 or was it just like moving apartments where you find it when you get there. You know. Pre-measured. 124 00:14:03,41 --> 00:14:14,01 Crazy smart no Intergroup Yes Marts how many people I am so I I'm at the eco village somewhat frequently as I have a 125 00:14:14,36 --> 00:14:17,24 child in daycare at the eco village a couple days a week 126 00:14:17,28 --> 00:14:26,75 and I was always curious do you know roughly how many people live at the eco village. The thing is about forty people. 127 00:14:27,84 --> 00:14:31,17 Yeah that's what I think I just wanted to give people the sense of the size you have because it 128 00:14:31,26 --> 00:14:34,11 when you hear the word eco village like oh maybe it's a house or something 129 00:14:34,39 --> 00:14:36,94 but it's like a Briley big apartment building. 130 00:14:37,97 --> 00:14:45,44 Two apartment buildings Yeah yeah with like a really nice like open area in the middle it's really quite something. 131 00:14:46,90 --> 00:14:47,55 I'm always impressed 132 00:14:47,56 --> 00:14:54,41 and I go there every morning you know the building is really beautiful I always feel guilty quoting certain things on 133 00:14:54,42 --> 00:14:58,00 the podcast because they don't feel unusual enough 134 00:14:58,43 --> 00:15:04,84 but man there is this fantastic ninety nine percent where they were talking about squatters rights in New York 135 00:15:05,52 --> 00:15:08,26 and it just really reminds me 136 00:15:08,31 --> 00:15:15,68 and I know you guys probably have a different set up going on I'm assuming you're occupancy is more well maybe I should 137 00:15:15,69 --> 00:15:16,85 ask about it 138 00:15:16,86 --> 00:15:21,38 but are you guys really with the whole the renters thing in the eighty's with people squatting in buildings just 139 00:15:21,39 --> 00:15:30,23 because they weren't being. Yeah. This was a different story yes yes this is a different story entirely. 140 00:15:31,45 --> 00:15:37,25 But we will put they want to show notes just because it's it's reminding me of the topic matters so I take it that this 141 00:15:37,26 --> 00:15:44,23 was a planned community where the building was rented and everything was you know performed on the up and up. 142 00:15:45,91 --> 00:15:47,39 I wouldn't describe it as an app and. 143 00:15:51,11 --> 00:15:59,98 But it was somewhat planned and there's a woman that was the founder and like an incredible amount of work. But it is. 144 00:16:00,26 --> 00:16:09,75 Scepter the riots in nine he too. I think the main building here was like partly burned or something like that and so. 145 00:16:10,92 --> 00:16:17,48 And there in the night in the ninety's wasn't like great so they put the building for sale 146 00:16:17,98 --> 00:16:27,55 and this woman lawyers like the founder. She. Put a lot of effort and ended up buying the building. 147 00:16:29,70 --> 00:16:36,62 But the cool thing is that she didn't so she wanted to start a community of shooting kick people out who are living 148 00:16:36,63 --> 00:16:43,85 here already so these days there are people that live has been living have been living here since the ninety's were 149 00:16:43,86 --> 00:16:50,94 like we're in necessarily interested in the whole community project interesting there are still here too 150 00:16:50,98 --> 00:16:55,10 and so I mean essentially they're all the kind of up sort of members of the community. 151 00:16:56,74 --> 00:17:01,60 And they're kind of like renters but also committee members in their own way. 152 00:17:04,30 --> 00:17:09,73 Yes I often say because I'm dropping off my foster child in the morning I often see them sort of walk staring around 153 00:17:09,74 --> 00:17:13,09 you know early in the morning as as older people tend to do 154 00:17:13,34 --> 00:17:20,27 and it is cool to be like oh that that person was has been here a very long time probably been here a very long time 155 00:17:20,28 --> 00:17:24,66 before the eco village was eco village but they're still there 156 00:17:24,67 --> 00:17:30,73 and sort of part of the whole fabric of the place which is really neat I love it here I was a guy that. 157 00:17:33,38 --> 00:17:38,07 A few years ago and he had been living here for like forty years 158 00:17:38,08 --> 00:17:42,87 and so it was kind of really cool talking to him about that the stories of this building hat. 159 00:17:44,20 --> 00:17:52,99 Incredible like the building has lived many lives. In the twenty's. And so I mean. 160 00:17:54,23 --> 00:18:01,15 The building was a hotel well as related to there was there used to be. What springs on the street. 161 00:18:02,52 --> 00:18:06,01 And so it was like a really fancy hotel in the twenty's where people would come in. 162 00:18:09,58 --> 00:18:15,87 And then but then I know the hot springs there was a big scandal and they were closed. 163 00:18:17,02 --> 00:18:22,53 And the building became I mean they got some point they were in the building they were running. 164 00:18:25,46 --> 00:18:28,42 Or you going there was a lot of illegal gambling going on. 165 00:18:29,76 --> 00:18:36,45 Here one of the stories that this guy told me once was like there used to be a room. One apartment that was like. 166 00:18:37,60 --> 00:18:43,37 Jews empty and there was a phone in the corner and so people would go there to take bets. 167 00:18:44,61 --> 00:18:48,35 And then they would leave and those like they only thing that the room would do. 168 00:18:49,83 --> 00:18:57,05 I love the I thought the more I learn about history the more illegal stuff I find out about. History is an F. 169 00:18:57,06 --> 00:19:03,00 or A long time you could go to the theater in Chicago just stick your fingers in the bullet holes 170 00:19:03,04 --> 00:19:05,21 when they shut the front of it. 171 00:19:07,19 --> 00:19:09,20 And that's that's been plastered over 172 00:19:09,21 --> 00:19:17,35 but I also find it really interesting as as we get more distant from violent crime it's starts to become huge you know 173 00:19:17,57 --> 00:19:22,21 like I mean I can't you do aren't there like recreations of the. 174 00:19:23,67 --> 00:19:27,08 Titanic or something I just my God you know 175 00:19:27,09 --> 00:19:34,13 or for example if you really think about what A is all about like that's just it's such a horrifying. 176 00:19:35,59 --> 00:19:42,88 Kind of celebration of this this dangerous and deathly vents but I guess what's X. 177 00:19:42,92 --> 00:19:49,96 Amount of time passes it's you know it's kind of safe like theme park I don't know where I'm going with that it 178 00:19:49,97 --> 00:19:54,87 but I feel like a all crimes become kind of cute in the rearview mirror right. 179 00:19:55,99 --> 00:19:59,98 And like Civil War reenactments like that must have just been a nightmare. 180 00:20:00,78 --> 00:20:07,41 And now we're like on your weekend deal go in like a lead up your truck and polish your gun your musket 181 00:20:07,42 --> 00:20:14,05 or whatever in the whole the whole United Yeah Civil War sounds horrifying horrifying yet. 182 00:20:16,79 --> 00:20:22,39 Well right should we jump in to challenge them right let's let's pivot so that the challenge is arresting security 183 00:20:22,40 --> 00:20:28,48 anything Security her to see it in the studio I'm really curious to see how you guys interpret this you know I was just 184 00:20:28,49 --> 00:20:30,80 talking to somebody about the whiteness episode 185 00:20:31,28 --> 00:20:35,62 and they were saying you know if I was on it I think I just would have done something about negative space 186 00:20:35,63 --> 00:20:36,94 and made everybody really mad. 187 00:20:38,99 --> 00:20:43,36 So so I think there is an aspect of like you talk to the person 188 00:20:43,37 --> 00:20:50,64 and you kind of know what you think they're into so I feel like the interpretation starts to lean before we even get 189 00:20:50,65 --> 00:20:55,07 started but so I'm going to uplift some pictures for you guys 190 00:20:55,11 --> 00:20:59,86 and I think I'll be really interested to see if you can I have two projects 191 00:21:00,54 --> 00:21:05,10 and I'll be interested to see if you can tell what the second one is with me describing it 192 00:21:05,66 --> 00:21:10,77 but the first one I think we have we have a fighting chance of figuring out here. 193 00:21:12,35 --> 00:21:19,57 And I'm uploading this on my absolutely atrocious eighty and C. U. Verse or whatever it is. 194 00:21:21,01 --> 00:21:37,44 So we'll see rapping cut out the next thirty minutes of silence as. Well. So I see a fork. 195 00:21:38,57 --> 00:21:49,33 Caught on the handle out of the fork and he seems like you're using it. Initially. So the tips of the fork are bend. 196 00:21:50,77 --> 00:21:52,97 It's about a quarter inch or so 197 00:21:53,43 --> 00:22:01,80 and initially told you were going to because then the next picture show was in the fork. When the door locked. 198 00:22:03,18 --> 00:22:09,08 And I thought you were going to use it to open the door then the door is closed 199 00:22:09,09 --> 00:22:16,00 and then the handle is going through that fork so now I realize I mean I'm guessing he's actually got luck. 200 00:22:18,07 --> 00:22:26,91 Is it that you're stopping the door from you know open for. Yeah exactly right. 201 00:22:27,94 --> 00:22:34,91 Yeah wow yeah yeah yeah the fork is sort of hooked into the strike plate of the door frame. 202 00:22:36,68 --> 00:22:42,55 Yeah and then the door's closed and then the handle is threaded through the times of the fork. 203 00:22:45,44 --> 00:22:53,66 And like he said Federico it. Then blocks the door from opening because if you tried to open it the hand the. 204 00:22:55,08 --> 00:22:58,58 Fork can't dislodge itself from the strike plate because the door is closed. 205 00:22:59,79 --> 00:23:05,89 In creates a sort of mini me law that's no good way of describing it Rev I was not sure how you guys are going to 206 00:23:05,90 --> 00:23:08,61 visualize that. Listening audience. 207 00:23:10,17 --> 00:23:11,01 I suppose that 208 00:23:11,29 --> 00:23:17,50 when you imagining these kind of object it would be like a really big piece of wood that goes across the door. 209 00:23:18,91 --> 00:23:20,34 Yeah but then you made it like. 210 00:23:21,50 --> 00:23:28,44 Elegant is like you could put it in your pocket yet is heavily seen strong enough that you're very hard to open the 211 00:23:28,45 --> 00:23:34,23 door. I have to admit I did not test this thing fully as I was doing this at work. 212 00:23:35,42 --> 00:23:43,12 And so so both of these things that I did I'm going to see more images here first of all I can't take credit for the 213 00:23:43,13 --> 00:23:50,70 original designs so I was looking around online and Robin have talked to this since a previous episodes 214 00:23:50,71 --> 00:23:56,40 but we did some really code heavy work and so I was trying to come up with stuff that was a little more tangible 215 00:23:56,93 --> 00:23:59,86 and I often wind up coming across other people. 216 00:24:00,39 --> 00:24:03,42 I have a dress like I'll find a tutorial 217 00:24:03,43 --> 00:24:09,93 but it won't necessarily be explicitly within the content area of the challenge so I feel like part of what I'm trying 218 00:24:09,94 --> 00:24:19,46 to do is to re in textual eyes an existing idea that through the lens of craft for example so so some guy was talking 219 00:24:19,47 --> 00:24:25,15 about on line we can put this in the show notes but a demonstration of how to make a lock with this fork 220 00:24:25,16 --> 00:24:30,62 and one of the things I was interested in was thinking about the security of locks 221 00:24:30,63 --> 00:24:36,62 and especially if you're a renter you know you're always sort of aware that the lock is not your Isn't that somebody 222 00:24:36,63 --> 00:24:38,84 else has complete access to it. 223 00:24:40,53 --> 00:24:46,45 You know this what this is a way to sort of democratize the locking of the door and now whether 224 00:24:46,46 --> 00:24:49,96 or not it could hold up to somebody kicking it is another question 225 00:24:49,97 --> 00:24:56,63 but if it starts to pick apart it aren't our sense of security when staying behind a locked door 226 00:24:56,64 --> 00:25:03,25 when it's clear that the locks are so easily opened by whether it's the fire department or your landlord 227 00:25:03,26 --> 00:25:05,55 or whatever yeah that's really cool 228 00:25:05,94 --> 00:25:12,61 and it's a lock that is not pick a bowl as there is no key for it right it's like essentially jamming the door as 229 00:25:12,62 --> 00:25:13,15 opposed to. 230 00:25:14,19 --> 00:25:20,54 Something that you would flip open with a key Yanez Federico it was saying it is kind of like the barbarian bar which 231 00:25:20,55 --> 00:25:27,25 which I've also installed in my previous apartment threats so I had to bring it in St Louis where I'm assuming just a 232 00:25:27,26 --> 00:25:33,48 teenager kicked in my back door because the lock you know I think a bull was anchored into like a quarter inch of 233 00:25:33,49 --> 00:25:37,03 wooden molding or something and then and then I came home 234 00:25:37,04 --> 00:25:41,53 and I was a blacksmith at this point in time so I get home at like three P.M. 235 00:25:42,02 --> 00:25:46,23 and I think I weighed like eighty more pounds than I currently do and so. 236 00:25:47,30 --> 00:25:53,84 Sixty workouts and so I came home in these overalls and covered in soot and this huge dude 237 00:25:54,13 --> 00:25:58,36 and the saw someone had broken in my house and I was really mad and so I was standing in the yard 238 00:25:58,45 --> 00:25:59,98 and I called nine one one from. 239 00:26:00,01 --> 00:26:07,00 My Radio Shack cell phone that had twenty minutes a month and yes police showed up and they were talking to me 240 00:26:07,01 --> 00:26:13,19 and you know as a white dude I didn't really have a lot of experience with this so the police were saying you know cob 241 00:26:13,20 --> 00:26:16,60 them let's figure out what's going on and they want to just sit down in the back of the car 242 00:26:16,61 --> 00:26:22,87 and talk to us so I was I was starting to sit down into the car and these two young black men they were walking by 243 00:26:22,88 --> 00:26:27,57 and one of them said without moving his lips at all don't get in the back of the car. 244 00:26:29,36 --> 00:26:32,89 You know because it has these dudes like they knew that when you get in the back of a cop car 245 00:26:32,90 --> 00:26:37,43 and you close the door you can't get back out and so until they let you get it 246 00:26:37,44 --> 00:26:42,10 but you so you know I think they were it the cops were trying to isolate me because they didn't know like I was just 247 00:26:42,11 --> 00:26:47,47 some angry dirty dude rolling around in this yard you know when someone called the cops right 248 00:26:47,77 --> 00:26:56,43 and then I was so I was making so little money as a blacksmith in a welder that I think they still I got a hundred 249 00:26:56,44 --> 00:27:03,62 dollar bill on my nightstand that was a Christmas bonus so that got taken like I couldn't believe I had a hundred 250 00:27:03,63 --> 00:27:05,38 dollars so I kept it in my house. 251 00:27:07,32 --> 00:27:13,22 And then they and then they looked at taking a bull full of change and then left this because it was new 252 00:27:13,46 --> 00:27:20,20 and I think they took a CD burner like it this tells you how long ago this was. Was like a one X. 253 00:27:20,21 --> 00:27:27,60 CD Yeah totally so that the landlord the landlord was very slow so you're a pair the Duracell timidly affectively 254 00:27:27,61 --> 00:27:31,19 nailed it shut like there was a zombie outbreak going on outside. 255 00:27:32,62 --> 00:27:36,43 So it got me thinking that it but I've uploaded see more images for yes 256 00:27:36,44 --> 00:27:40,45 and this one is I think this one's hard to figure out so it's only if you can see if you. 257 00:27:41,93 --> 00:27:53,87 Could you want take a swing at first. So it looks like a. Key blank and you modified cutting. Has one caught. 258 00:27:57,01 --> 00:28:05,03 That makes it kind of like more like a key with and has a notch. Crosswise makes me feel there is a way of jamming. 259 00:28:06,08 --> 00:28:10,59 An existing lock and my guess is that you relate. 260 00:28:11,75 --> 00:28:15,79 With the keen there and then you can easily break it like Ben did back 261 00:28:15,80 --> 00:28:24,27 and forth a hollow me break along the notch that you made. Me realize her. 262 00:28:27,58 --> 00:28:35,27 Look on useable Well because it's an intentional weak spot right sort of at the base of the key so if used in there 263 00:28:35,28 --> 00:28:38,87 like wiggle that little I know where you copied the key it's like a handle 264 00:28:38,88 --> 00:28:43,10 but it's not really handles It's like a flat wide spot that you put your fingers on right we go back 265 00:28:43,11 --> 00:28:51,44 and forth it would snap off is that well I mean you guys went he wasted no time that's so this is exactly what is so 266 00:28:51,45 --> 00:28:59,35 it's it's known on line so the fork you know the tutorial I found it was just some sort of grandfatherly on You Tube 267 00:28:59,36 --> 00:29:04,19 saying oh here's like a fun little project you can do whereas this one is known as a killer key 268 00:29:04,82 --> 00:29:08,18 and so the you're right that the score allows you to break it 269 00:29:08,67 --> 00:29:15,73 but the important part about the single so it's a key blank with only one basically one tooth carved into it whereas 270 00:29:15,74 --> 00:29:17,59 usually you have multiple C. 271 00:29:18,02 --> 00:29:24,67 and If you look at your keys the way that the teeth are cut is they always have a draft angle that's coming both to the 272 00:29:24,68 --> 00:29:29,20 left and the right of each peak so the idea being that as you move the key in 273 00:29:29,21 --> 00:29:36,60 and out there's always a slope for the pins to right along so in this case there's a really hard right angle so the key 274 00:29:36,61 --> 00:29:43,16 will go in but then as each pin gets behind this ninety degree angle the pin drops down 275 00:29:43,66 --> 00:29:51,07 and then we try to pull the key back out it's just a you know a vertical pin hitting a vertical wall so there's no 276 00:29:51,08 --> 00:29:53,26 longer a way to move in the opposite direction. 277 00:29:54,72 --> 00:29:59,98 So the idea is you you stick this in it in gauges all the pins and no longer be taken out. 278 00:30:00,01 --> 00:30:03,08 And then he just snapped the head off to sort of. 279 00:30:04,19 --> 00:30:08,93 Really drive the point home although I don't know if it even matters because it's not like you can pull it out with 280 00:30:09,10 --> 00:30:10,04 wires or anything. 281 00:30:11,67 --> 00:30:18,38 But it definitely makes it even if you were to pull I mean it really kills the look you have to entirely of these 282 00:30:18,39 --> 00:30:20,13 and some of the good that thing. 283 00:30:21,19 --> 00:30:24,58 Yes Oh so the funny thing here is that when you look for these on line 284 00:30:25,05 --> 00:30:31,46 and I know Rob has a soft spot for the sort of survivalist and tactical gear set 285 00:30:31,47 --> 00:30:34,65 but I believe those who are not who do not approach it with irony. 286 00:30:35,94 --> 00:30:43,93 So so this is definitely advertised in these really macho bad ass like you know put put this in your book out kid you 287 00:30:43,94 --> 00:30:50,48 know if you need to like like like break a lock so that they you know that they're regular people who were just 288 00:30:50,49 --> 00:30:52,48 paranoid as you can't get through and. 289 00:30:53,93 --> 00:30:58,46 I think it was also marketed as that way you know speaking of red strikes and all that stuff 290 00:30:58,47 --> 00:31:03,76 and planned communities if your landlord wanted to kick somebody out 291 00:31:03,91 --> 00:31:09,26 and it was concerned that they were going to try to you know force occupancy you could just make sure to get them 292 00:31:09,27 --> 00:31:15,41 outside and then you just go and you do see the lock in this way to prevent people from re entering the building. 293 00:31:16,92 --> 00:31:24,83 So it's definitely it was definitely framed when I saw it online is either like a. Post-apocalyptic. 294 00:31:25,97 --> 00:31:28,22 Tactical you know much of a thing 295 00:31:28,26 --> 00:31:35,04 or it was like here's a way to disenfranchise your renters which made it a lot more icky 296 00:31:35,05 --> 00:31:40,55 and I haven't been able to test it you know because I unfortunately I had some luck sitting around by a three mile out 297 00:31:40,56 --> 00:31:45,11 when I was replayed rekeying my doors but yeah I mean if you stick this in a lack it's kind of done 298 00:31:45,15 --> 00:31:53,22 or if you if you were to take. A key that has been caught and added a ninety degree angle like. 299 00:31:54,66 --> 00:31:59,95 You think it would work as. So I think it it may. 300 00:32:00,49 --> 00:32:06,71 I think with a lot of keys there's a significant one thing that surprised me just buying a blank that was unmodified is 301 00:32:06,72 --> 00:32:13,17 that there's really a lot of metal there that can be carved away and so my understanding is that 302 00:32:13,18 --> 00:32:20,86 when I look at the keys of my key ring the majority of that extra metal is gone once you have conventional peaks 303 00:32:20,87 --> 00:32:26,45 and valleys in the key so I guess it would just depend on the key that you happen to have in the amount of meat that's 304 00:32:26,46 --> 00:32:31,49 available but I was surprised to find that these blanks I think they're actually all brass 305 00:32:31,53 --> 00:32:37,13 and then they just have a cyst shiny coating that makes them look like steel so you could you could do this with a file 306 00:32:37,14 --> 00:32:41,52 in like three minutes so it was it was a very accessible process. 307 00:32:44,06 --> 00:32:46,88 You guys Man you guys a powered through that excellent work. 308 00:32:49,99 --> 00:32:58,31 Yeah that would be a really mean prank he would share it with. I don't have to make make sure not to excell uses. 309 00:33:01,68 --> 00:33:03,44 What are you going to do with it is going to. 310 00:33:05,52 --> 00:33:09,05 Be ground you think is I guess like they put it in a little box 311 00:33:09,06 --> 00:33:15,99 and thanks you nazis A I think that ones that you can buy on the line there they're an adult they're bright red. 312 00:33:17,48 --> 00:33:20,92 Or some other kind of neon colors so you don't accidently just use it 313 00:33:21,87 --> 00:33:26,69 but you know you know I felt like there was a dude on thing a verse he was making out of plastic and. 314 00:33:27,84 --> 00:33:29,84 Guessing this would probably work just as well. 315 00:33:31,59 --> 00:33:37,30 So this is more about like that was the crafting thing coming back and which was and 316 00:33:37,53 --> 00:33:44,76 and actually it was kind of thinking I think Rob just shared eight dollars with me as we've started to gain some. 317 00:33:45,90 --> 00:33:46,63 Followers 318 00:33:47,08 --> 00:33:54,49 and I was really starting to think about you know I associate crafts with this sort of it's as much elbow grease as 319 00:33:54,53 --> 00:33:59,98 fancy materials or whatever so you know was there a way that I could keep the budget for this hundred. 320 00:34:00,09 --> 00:34:06,05 Patriotic mouse just as an intellectual exercise and I think this project cost two dollars 321 00:34:06,06 --> 00:34:11,43 and fifty cents because I did buy the keep links. And the fork was just laying around. 322 00:34:13,04 --> 00:34:23,92 One thing I really like about the fork. You take one tool cutting half and it turns into another to. Think. 323 00:34:25,78 --> 00:34:32,09 Yeah there is and you know the guy on You Tube I mean when he does it I think he says you have to use two tools and 324 00:34:32,10 --> 00:34:38,25 when I did it there were all these different problems that came up with the particular design of fork that I had in 325 00:34:38,26 --> 00:34:39,50 that particular strike plate. 326 00:34:40,53 --> 00:34:47,26 So if you look carefully at the images like the four Tantalus pounded flatten out and Dylan and ground down both 327 00:34:47,27 --> 00:34:49,92 and with that height then so I kind of cheated on that. 328 00:34:51,10 --> 00:34:53,97 And I mean perhaps you'll still regard that as craft I don't know but. 329 00:34:55,02 --> 00:34:59,67 Yes I do but it is nice to imagine that you just take a fork snap it in half 330 00:34:59,68 --> 00:35:01,66 and then do you want it to other operations 331 00:35:01,67 --> 00:35:07,29 and it's ready to go that was not my experience that the key went very fast but I've yet to try it. 332 00:35:12,02 --> 00:35:17,84 Yeah three code you're going to have that's it yes. So I sent you. 333 00:35:19,06 --> 00:35:25,58 Each A said he Beach one of you a very certain of the product Yes and that I'm going to have. 334 00:35:26,81 --> 00:35:31,40 And I'm going to load a picture they want I have so I ended up making tree. 335 00:35:35,69 --> 00:35:39,86 And I have to admit when I get a package in the mail I just open it 336 00:35:40,09 --> 00:35:44,65 and say so even though it's set all over the fret you know this is from Federico 337 00:35:44,66 --> 00:35:51,90 and it's for this episode somehow in my mind that met open it right away so I'm going to leave it to stir things up 338 00:35:51,91 --> 00:35:59,80 here. So I'm going to tell you a little bit tell. Me Yeah I do yes. 339 00:36:00,04 --> 00:36:05,15 Or or should we use reveal it and then I'll tell you the process no no go fight it. 340 00:36:06,34 --> 00:36:16,69 So so when I heard a cracking security. The first thing I went to was like handcrafting. And. 341 00:36:18,03 --> 00:36:22,33 So the first thing I wanted to make was. Like a fake security camera. 342 00:36:23,98 --> 00:36:29,15 Because I had a had an experience which is if you're a camera at some point like I used to work at this restaurant 343 00:36:29,16 --> 00:36:35,42 and and there was a security camera pointed at me all the time and then one day I was cleaning some documents 344 00:36:35,43 --> 00:36:44,86 and I found the box where the camera at you know came in and it was like a fake camera had a blink you know 345 00:36:45,62 --> 00:36:51,18 and like realizing in spirit you know I realized oh so all this time this thing has been looking at me 346 00:36:51,19 --> 00:36:58,21 but he's actually not even looking at me so I wanted to make something like a camera out of plywood that was like 347 00:36:58,33 --> 00:37:10,38 clearly fake but then that then put it like an L.E.D. On it. But I felt I was a bit too cynical so so I. 348 00:37:13,63 --> 00:37:19,36 So I so kind of made me think a lot about all these sort of security measures 349 00:37:20,13 --> 00:37:23,53 or things that are supposed to out security but they're really not that effective. 350 00:37:25,31 --> 00:37:32,16 Like they're not actual security such as cameras I mean even even cameras that work don't necessarily add that much to. 351 00:37:33,81 --> 00:37:40,94 You know they don't know how to make anyone safer or like so it made me think oh it would be called to make 352 00:37:41,13 --> 00:37:46,53 or like other things like a I'm not super anti gun 353 00:37:46,54 --> 00:37:50,43 but I still think that like I go on wouldn't necessarily make you safer. 354 00:37:51,48 --> 00:37:56,29 Yeah I think that statistically develops triple So that's what this economy answerable 355 00:37:57,02 --> 00:37:59,66 and so these kind of lead me it started me thinking about like. 356 00:38:00,23 --> 00:38:05,21 So so these things are kind of like security blankets that doesn't to me. 357 00:38:06,55 --> 00:38:12,47 But like me think about this notion of the security blanket and. And so the. 358 00:38:13,76 --> 00:38:15,30 But I remember having a blanket 359 00:38:15,31 --> 00:38:23,59 and I didn't feel safer although I you know I knew that the blanket wasn't going to do anything for me it made me feel 360 00:38:23,60 --> 00:38:31,37 safer so so it made me think about the feeling of safety is also important regardless sometimes of actual safety. 361 00:38:32,69 --> 00:38:38,78 So then so then I thought I'd like to make a little charms you know that are related to safety. 362 00:38:40,12 --> 00:38:47,71 So then I going to make a tiny security camera on a tiny gun and a tiny blanket. And these say the. 363 00:38:49,84 --> 00:38:52,43 Reminded me of like prayer beads. 364 00:38:53,79 --> 00:38:58,12 And the other charms and kind of like they're really just aspects of it 365 00:38:58,51 --> 00:39:07,88 and that's were these objects I made came from from from the notion of prayer beads because there are these like 366 00:39:08,00 --> 00:39:16,86 objects that you can whole. And you can play with it. And he makes it it makes it. 367 00:39:17,97 --> 00:39:25,97 You know it gives you a sense of security in a sense kind of slightly related. Like the fidgets been or craze. 368 00:39:27,04 --> 00:39:34,61 Where like you know playing with your hat you know playing with something like kind of reassures you somehow. But then. 369 00:39:35,74 --> 00:39:44,23 So I wanted to make this thing. But then there is relevant. You guys know these comic X K C The. 370 00:39:46,17 --> 00:39:55,50 Yeah everything there is it relevant. Everything Have you seen they want to pass or strength. No. 371 00:39:57,27 --> 00:40:06,30 So that's an important part of the puzzle but. Maybe maybe I'll let you describe and then I'll explain. 372 00:40:09,06 --> 00:40:22,60 Yeah sounds good Should I open my Yeah. OK so. Last week Federico sent both Taylor and I a package in the mail. 373 00:40:24,90 --> 00:40:28,36 And inside the box there is a small loop. 374 00:40:30,94 --> 00:40:35,91 At least inside my box there is a small book looks like it's a homemade on bloke which is really cool 375 00:40:36,84 --> 00:40:40,51 and there's a small wolf cat which is Abilene your studio name. 376 00:40:42,56 --> 00:40:48,21 Sticker and it says Wolf cat open for crafting security episode of opposable thumbs pod cast 377 00:40:48,22 --> 00:40:49,57 and there's a small smiley face 378 00:40:50,01 --> 00:40:56,36 and then it says pull in the first thing I thought it would explode is will this explosion. 379 00:41:00,83 --> 00:41:03,12 Knowing that it wouldn't but it was the first thing that popped it was. 380 00:41:04,32 --> 00:41:16,01 Just yeah yeah here's where the audio channel just goes dead as I open up OK So I open it up oh. Whoa whoa. 381 00:41:18,60 --> 00:41:37,02 Oh my God OK. So. Man OK So there's many small wooden pieces blocks. Wouldn't you know wooden blocks. 382 00:41:41,80 --> 00:41:49,19 Wow So there's a one two three. Twenty seven wooden blocks sort of have a C. 383 00:41:49,20 --> 00:41:52,34 Sheep Some are turned and one direction 384 00:41:52,35 --> 00:41:59,10 and some are turn another I think there's magnets holding it together it feels like it anyway. And each block has this. 385 00:42:00,04 --> 00:42:07,66 Two words it looks like maybe the laser is something very very precise made these letters. 386 00:42:08,97 --> 00:42:11,90 And the first and the letters are the words are. 387 00:42:13,79 --> 00:42:16,25 The Spanish word and an English matching word 388 00:42:16,29 --> 00:42:22,16 and know enough well wait I mean yes I know you know enough Spanish to to know that there are going to different the ME 389 00:42:22,87 --> 00:42:31,36 Yes these are they variations making sense OK cool Should I keep keep going Federico or do you want to jump in 390 00:42:31,37 --> 00:42:35,66 or I think you know ones were great for me I was going to add a couple things to your this 391 00:42:35,67 --> 00:42:38,57 or yeah yeah sure so yeah beyond a simple C. 392 00:42:38,58 --> 00:42:46,09 Shape if you imagine taking a cube so there's twenty seven of these cubes so if you were to take right that's table saw 393 00:42:46,84 --> 00:42:53,13 or so presumably these are manufactured as part of a larger piece because I can imagine taking these little you know 394 00:42:53,35 --> 00:43:01,39 three quarter inch cubes running but it has the right curve so you have that that's part of the council about that OK. 395 00:43:02,82 --> 00:43:08,50 So so if you take you know the curve the amount of with that split away from a cut on the machine 396 00:43:09,03 --> 00:43:14,71 and if you were to penetrate halfway into a cube from one facet you know one direction 397 00:43:15,15 --> 00:43:23,05 and then go to the opposite facet and then turn the block ninety degrees so that the idea is that yes it's a C. 398 00:43:23,06 --> 00:43:27,35 Shape if you look at it from one direction but there's actually two cuts in each block 399 00:43:28,15 --> 00:43:35,94 and those cuts allow for a joint to this which I believe is an magnets I think it's like a stretch he going to rubber 400 00:43:35,95 --> 00:43:41,05 band or something yeah yeah you can try and pull it apart and put it in different shapes. 401 00:43:42,56 --> 00:43:44,54 I'm just now holding it proper in my hand 402 00:43:44,55 --> 00:43:50,62 and yet differently things are being revealed in like I said it's a it's like an elastic together. 403 00:43:52,03 --> 00:43:58,89 And you know you can sew it only wants to turn in certain directions but not unlike a Rubik's cube you can. 404 00:44:00,04 --> 00:44:04,82 Urge it to turn in different directions but twisting here and pushing there and so forth 405 00:44:05,64 --> 00:44:15,12 and so the X K C economic were referring to alludes to this idea that if you just come up with a sentence that has four 406 00:44:15,13 --> 00:44:20,56 random words in it if you can put a sentence together it's more likely to be memorable 407 00:44:20,63 --> 00:44:27,66 and that essentially is long enough that it will stop me password guessing at least until quantum computing becomes a 408 00:44:27,67 --> 00:44:39,72 reality. Yeah. OK And so is this a way to generate those phrases Yes that's what I was. 409 00:44:42,37 --> 00:44:55,99 Erap give me a sample phrase you're generating. I'm I'm sort of OK with C.M. Unfurling it. So it reminds me of. 410 00:44:57,17 --> 00:45:04,08 In the sort of post Rubik's Cube era of the late eighty's there's that there was a thing called the snake in the snake 411 00:45:04,09 --> 00:45:10,11 was triangular Yeah shapes I think had this but that it's very similar vibe it's very similar 412 00:45:10,41 --> 00:45:12,99 and it's actually called a rubik's snake 413 00:45:13,48 --> 00:45:19,08 and a rubik's no one that it's an existing So now they want a made bed there one you are referring to the one that has 414 00:45:19,09 --> 00:45:24,65 a triangular shapes so it's related it's like a similar field. 415 00:45:27,69 --> 00:45:39,22 So yeah I wanted to so yeah the you have the comic is that. He says that we have trained humans. 416 00:45:40,40 --> 00:45:45,98 We've now created all these passwords that are really hard for humans to remember but you see for machines to break. 417 00:45:47,05 --> 00:45:50,32 And that a simple password like for random words. 418 00:45:52,86 --> 00:45:59,98 Because it's because of its length is that it would be harder to do to break it. I haven't a computer again as he. 419 00:46:00,09 --> 00:46:06,87 Caracter so I was thinking about this way of like generating sort of more secure passages that are easier to remember. 420 00:46:08,43 --> 00:46:10,28 So the first one I made. 421 00:46:11,63 --> 00:46:19,30 That I wanted to send to Taylor because I figured the shipping would be longer than it's all in English so that one has 422 00:46:19,31 --> 00:46:28,32 more words. So my idea is that you so I was going back to like handcrafting as you were saying they. 423 00:46:30,17 --> 00:46:39,79 Sort of I did because you know writing. A piece of code that generates random words. But he's not as tactile. 424 00:46:41,35 --> 00:46:47,26 Like I would in say You know I don't think I would sit pushing you know a button to get me around the words 425 00:46:47,50 --> 00:46:51,07 but I would like play with something like these that I don't like you know play with my hands 426 00:46:51,08 --> 00:46:54,55 and perhaps find a random combination of words that is memorable. 427 00:46:55,80 --> 00:46:57,46 Or you could like I don't know put it on your desk 428 00:46:57,47 --> 00:47:03,75 and find different configurations of the object were like perhaps remember a password. 429 00:47:05,49 --> 00:47:11,29 So the first one I made was an English rule so that if I just learned how to turn it I just figured out like you can 430 00:47:11,33 --> 00:47:20,12 turn them because of the slot in each one it's almost like twenty seven six sided dice like square dice Yeah in 431 00:47:20,13 --> 00:47:22,37 sequence held together with elastic. 432 00:47:23,67 --> 00:47:24,84 And then there's a word 433 00:47:25,00 --> 00:47:31,22 and then there's there's the Spanish word in the English word on each side of each of the twenty seven each of the dice 434 00:47:31,26 --> 00:47:36,64 six dice twenty seven dice stacked in sequence but then there's a slot 435 00:47:36,65 --> 00:47:45,78 and them so you can rotate as you desire in any direction oh my God OK so I had so I just got the light bulb just came 436 00:47:45,79 --> 00:47:49,42 on for me so I had like blurted out Oh so he got so Taylor is in English 437 00:47:49,46 --> 00:47:55,36 but then once I made that one in English I was like oh these be great to make him a good bilingual Yeah 438 00:47:55,37 --> 00:48:02,90 and so I made a bilingual on that I send you and then. And then after that I was like So what do I do now. 439 00:48:03,98 --> 00:48:12,25 And so I'm going to show you a picture of the one I have. Here. 440 00:48:23,53 --> 00:48:30,83 So one of the images that's going up right now I just to describe this a little bit more part of what makes this device 441 00:48:31,26 --> 00:48:32,39 sort of precious 442 00:48:32,40 --> 00:48:40,14 and tactile is that there would is also a uniform so I'll be curious to find out if these are actual different species 443 00:48:40,15 --> 00:48:46,73 of wood or if they're just colors or different treated or stained or whatever but it's a really attractive. 444 00:48:48,22 --> 00:48:53,40 And it's really the scale is really excellent for the hand so it really. 445 00:48:54,54 --> 00:48:56,78 Isn't I mean I've made a lot of interactive work 446 00:48:56,79 --> 00:49:01,82 and I've always been told with encouraging people to do what they're supposed to do 447 00:49:02,34 --> 00:49:09,66 and mixing up the words on the surface of this thing requires no additional prompting it's sort of it's the natural 448 00:49:09,67 --> 00:49:15,80 behavior is that you. Screw around with it you know looks nice feels nice. 449 00:49:17,24 --> 00:49:23,75 Not usual experiences in the digital realm right yeah it works great so as I say that the so they want I made it you 450 00:49:23,76 --> 00:49:29,01 guys can see instead so it's also bilingual but I you when read Japanese. 451 00:49:30,22 --> 00:49:38,61 And my partner's epa knees and I I don't speak any deaf and he said you just learn words and and and 452 00:49:39,09 --> 00:49:46,09 and I know I have to read he got out which is the. Simple phonetic alphabet. 453 00:49:47,36 --> 00:49:59,98 And so these one I made were each word is the word in English and is written in Japanese with he gonna. Kill some. 454 00:50:00,01 --> 00:50:06,10 And you think so first made me think about these. Security in language. 455 00:50:08,40 --> 00:50:14,41 Or how so for example there is one this idea came because my partner uses. 456 00:50:15,59 --> 00:50:18,41 A lot of passwords in Japanese as she writes them in. 457 00:50:19,84 --> 00:50:24,67 Iran isn't going to like the phonetic version in English so for example like in the picture. 458 00:50:28,99 --> 00:50:38,58 Boat which is and so she will ride if you and he as a password. So that's kind of like it made me think about how. 459 00:50:41,06 --> 00:50:44,34 A password is kind of like a language of two or like as. 460 00:50:45,51 --> 00:50:49,84 You understand another machine understand said but like the idea is the No one else should understand it 461 00:50:49,85 --> 00:50:52,73 or should know it or should be able to guess it. 462 00:50:54,46 --> 00:51:00,50 And they way which like different you know speaking different languages creates that sort of division sometimes 463 00:51:01,01 --> 00:51:06,89 but as a speaker you know a native speaker of another language like my first language is Spanish. 464 00:51:08,29 --> 00:51:12,88 Sometimes I can see how and when you read a group of people 465 00:51:12,89 --> 00:51:19,36 and they want to speak Spanish because they're creating the sense of sort of safety among themselves like this shared 466 00:51:19,37 --> 00:51:24,56 thing but it's also a sense that it I feel very ambivalent about these. 467 00:51:29,10 --> 00:51:32,56 Because yes it's a sense of safety among ourselves who speak these language 468 00:51:32,57 --> 00:51:40,88 but it's also a way of saying people that cannot understand it like you don't belong to the circle. But it S. 469 00:51:40,89 --> 00:51:48,82 A password generator is I think it's OK. Yeah and to be bilingual makes you almost inherently more. 470 00:51:50,10 --> 00:51:56,60 Like your security level just get super boosted you could like come by and words from different languages 471 00:51:56,61 --> 00:51:59,64 or spell a word. 472 00:52:00,01 --> 00:52:05,45 From one language you like using the characters of another something like you have all sorts of different new options 473 00:52:05,46 --> 00:52:11,02 that pending on them as a monolingual secretary wouldn't have it has always been something if a computer is just 474 00:52:11,03 --> 00:52:18,78 guessing characters based on a link you know as the ecstacy he points out capitalizing the first letter in the word 475 00:52:18,79 --> 00:52:27,76 and doing other kind of standard please speak English substitutions that might be easier for human to rake depending on 476 00:52:27,77 --> 00:52:30,21 the language they're speaking you see them saying like F. U. 477 00:52:30,22 --> 00:52:34,96 Ne I know that's an actual example I mean that one could get cracked in like thirty second. 478 00:52:36,43 --> 00:52:40,08 You know it going minor whatever they're using these days whatever the kids are used. 479 00:52:41,59 --> 00:52:47,42 So I think yes and no but that to me also conceptually feeds back and it would Federico is talking about. 480 00:52:49,14 --> 00:52:53,58 The use of a language for example to establish those that are inside the circle 481 00:52:53,59 --> 00:52:57,22 and those that are out is both protective and protected 482 00:52:57,61 --> 00:53:03,83 and similarly here multilingualism I think would not be a guarantee of a safer password. 483 00:53:05,58 --> 00:53:13,29 Right yeah I assume most attacks just for some ease sake if you if you're running the clock. 484 00:53:14,67 --> 00:53:19,64 Like you would run a dictionary attack and modified versions of the dictionary attack first. 485 00:53:22,18 --> 00:53:27,85 And so you you might I guess just dodge the bullet from a from a from a pure effort standpoint. 486 00:53:29,81 --> 00:53:32,79 If you could combine different languages into one pass 487 00:53:32,80 --> 00:53:37,00 but yeah certainly yeah it would it would yeah if you're running like G.P. Use. 488 00:53:38,25 --> 00:53:43,87 Like for bitcoin mining to crack the password we're where we're in trouble link is going to be our only. 489 00:53:44,96 --> 00:53:49,48 Our only friend there is super cool you know so you had asked about the wood 490 00:53:49,49 --> 00:53:56,05 and I was curious about that as well so yeah the wood is it's popular. The green tint good. 491 00:53:57,32 --> 00:53:59,98 Or all of it and sometimes you get like these poor. 492 00:54:00,04 --> 00:54:05,29 Sort of is like heavily in he has like a darker stains I did like choose the pieces that had like. 493 00:54:07,30 --> 00:54:12,48 These big arcs things and then mixed it up oh and then where you just. 494 00:54:13,55 --> 00:54:19,37 Gritting your teeth and running tiny tiny blocks through the table sorry. 495 00:54:20,74 --> 00:54:22,69 So I made a jig 496 00:54:22,83 --> 00:54:32,55 and let me show you the jig Yeah yes that's what we're looking for so he said yeah I kind of wanted to talk about the 497 00:54:32,68 --> 00:54:42,85 well so at some point yeah so there. So yeah this thing was basically entirely made on the table saw. And. 498 00:54:44,80 --> 00:54:51,08 And I have a I have a relationship with that thing and I know it's like it. 499 00:54:52,14 --> 00:54:59,36 Is like such a wonderful tool and it allows me to make so many things but like I I'm constantly thinking about it 500 00:54:59,37 --> 00:55:01,52 and like how he can like take my fingers. 501 00:55:02,86 --> 00:55:11,27 It's like there's like sort of like it's a monster it's like it's like which I did anyway that's going to come cycles. 502 00:55:12,33 --> 00:55:16,39 So I can take your fingers so you treat it with a lot of respect. 503 00:55:17,96 --> 00:55:23,87 And so we speak you know which So I send you a little image where like this shows me using if you want to describe it. 504 00:55:26,49 --> 00:55:35,41 Yeah no it's this animated GIF is the pencil. It's you know Jimmy dressed that your heart out the rest. 505 00:55:36,71 --> 00:55:42,12 Part of what I'm going to have at this Jake so so you know what are the measurements are these like three quarter 506 00:55:42,13 --> 00:55:43,51 square Yes. 507 00:55:44,75 --> 00:55:52,84 So yes so what I would have assumed is that you would be fabricating pieces of wood that were three quarter square with 508 00:55:52,85 --> 00:55:53,72 a long length 509 00:55:53,73 --> 00:55:59,01 and then you would be ripping that down the table so that is what happened that was the first Got though I could read 510 00:55:59,02 --> 00:56:04,27 it there for. Scott went out when I did the first knots I did take a long you know a long. 511 00:56:06,16 --> 00:56:09,19 I did like the first one that for the second one I had to do the. 512 00:56:10,61 --> 00:56:16,43 Yeah yeah that makes sense because you're turning it so you no longer able to take advantage of the long pieces right 513 00:56:16,44 --> 00:56:23,81 the jig is so cool and I feel like so cool I can't decide if I like the finished product or that better yeah. 514 00:56:25,19 --> 00:56:32,27 I want to talk about that too yeah I mean besides being super afraid of the table so I think I mean 515 00:56:32,28 --> 00:56:39,33 and loving it at the same time. I feel like I'm execution of jigs and I. 516 00:56:41,55 --> 00:56:44,88 Like some things as you say like they're more interesting than they're trying to protect 517 00:56:45,37 --> 00:56:51,33 and so I made a little closeup here you see show you that So the first think the first problem I ran into was 518 00:56:51,52 --> 00:56:53,78 when I was cutting the squares on this lead 519 00:56:54,16 --> 00:57:00,18 and I would go back then sometimes they would jump out so I had to figure out a way to hold them so I made that thing 520 00:57:00,19 --> 00:57:01,52 to hold them first. 521 00:57:02,93 --> 00:57:06,76 And then I had to have the spring to hold the squares 522 00:57:07,34 --> 00:57:12,47 and then as I was like pushing the spring every time I wanted to pull out a square. Cue. 523 00:57:13,60 --> 00:57:21,80 My finger was getting super tired of pushing that my thumb was getting tired of pushing the screw so I ended up making 524 00:57:21,81 --> 00:57:29,30 the little breast. And so so that's how they do give all this is like one thing they'll have another. 525 00:57:30,88 --> 00:57:33,40 But at the end it's going to an interesting object. 526 00:57:36,03 --> 00:57:42,83 And have you seen it this way I posted a link there have you seen this years or yeah I know there's met the 527 00:57:42,97 --> 00:57:46,79 when they'll. Yes I'm a huge fan of the guy. 528 00:57:48,26 --> 00:57:50,41 You know he's there yeah we should totally post these 529 00:57:50,42 --> 00:57:56,27 but you know his whole thing is like the privacy of Jiggs over Jake is as important as. 530 00:57:57,95 --> 00:58:02,50 Is he the guy too who's made like his multi. Full of his own bandsaws from scratch Yeah. 531 00:58:03,67 --> 00:58:06,86 Yeah I know my gosh I really wanted to build one of those. 532 00:58:08,30 --> 00:58:15,96 But I ended up buying a cheaper one that was made that was missing at top wheel so I build the top wheel it's actually 533 00:58:15,97 --> 00:58:21,85 following his instructions that's awesome. Well this is this is great. 534 00:58:22,98 --> 00:58:29,99 Yeah just it's document is so tightly you know what I mean it's pretty rare that you can encounter up here and. 535 00:58:31,57 --> 00:58:38,38 That's exactly what this needed. Yeah yeah Incidentally I did find the youtube video. 536 00:58:40,68 --> 00:58:42,61 That tells you how to build these things. 537 00:58:43,67 --> 00:58:50,18 I just didn't do it exactly the way he did but I'll put the link to because that it's a very nicely documented. 538 00:58:53,12 --> 00:59:00,78 Your crosscut sled has a metal handle that right yeah yeah I didn't make this particular sled I would have gone with a 539 00:59:00,79 --> 00:59:08,29 metal handle but it's there. It's nice to see here Jake was an addition that was screwed into your. 540 00:59:09,46 --> 00:59:16,28 System Yeah pretty much. And so was like donated to you all so they could village. 541 00:59:17,35 --> 00:59:25,22 So we have like a shared shop like a one car garage that we kind of Dedicated to be in a shop and. 542 00:59:26,57 --> 00:59:32,65 Yeah it's like the sort of nice things about living with other people we can share some tools Yeah 543 00:59:32,69 --> 00:59:37,06 and so the person who had these particular it's all made that sled 544 00:59:37,33 --> 00:59:45,15 and he gave it to us Joe Cool School of the sled came with a so that's like a nice i think like a homemade thing this 545 00:59:45,16 --> 00:59:53,81 lead is such a wonderful additions that they both will like it makes these kind of detail work possible yeah I also 546 00:59:53,82 --> 00:59:59,05 want to point out I'll have to take a look at the envelope but I feel like Federico got this thing to me. 547 01:00:00,82 --> 01:00:02,30 After the challenge was announced. 548 01:00:03,46 --> 01:00:07,17 It's so not so much your grass senses 549 01:00:07,67 --> 01:00:11,09 and I feel like I've had it in my aunts I mean there's been I've been having crazy stuff to. 550 01:00:12,31 --> 01:00:17,97 Look at look at houses and stuff but my schedules but yet so incredible work 551 01:00:17,98 --> 01:00:24,80 and an incredibly quickly very impressive yeah yeah I know that with the first average first day I was like oh my God 552 01:00:24,81 --> 01:00:33,16 He sent me this last week and I was panicking about my very tiny project. So you know I would trip a man. 553 01:00:35,09 --> 01:00:38,47 Well that's one less thing I wanted to leave out of was so the. 554 01:00:40,06 --> 01:00:46,93 Then craving for the words I did with these Someone gave me a true printer from two thousand 555 01:00:46,94 --> 01:00:51,83 and thirteen that I just get sick of trying to calibrate that thing 556 01:00:52,40 --> 01:01:03,46 and I just I found this instructive like how to put a laser. At thirty dollars or half a purple laser on it. 557 01:01:05,34 --> 01:01:09,27 And that's what I use for engraving this one and it was really good certainly. 558 01:01:10,94 --> 01:01:17,19 Yeah I know it's like if you calibrated unlike focus it well and you know where your protective glasses it's actually. 559 01:01:18,47 --> 01:01:24,11 OK engraver. So you wait so you made a laser engraver out of your three D. 560 01:01:24,12 --> 01:01:28,44 Printer Yeah because you know listen it's simpler than you would think. 561 01:01:30,39 --> 01:01:34,31 It was just like an old tree printer on a printing would it was not fun. 562 01:01:35,59 --> 01:01:37,83 Yeah I guess I don't know about you 563 01:01:37,84 --> 01:01:43,49 but I'm ready just to give microphone over to federal I don't know I don't know it's like OK. 564 01:01:46,20 --> 01:01:52,77 You guys are doing really good where yeah oh my God Yeah I mean if I take my glasses and get really tight on there. 565 01:01:54,38 --> 01:02:00,50 You know I'm not seeing any of that traditional sort of. Fuzzy blowout that you get from the. You know. 566 01:02:02,23 --> 01:02:10,44 Cast off material from the laser obscuring alliance or something that's an aftermarket and that's really. 567 01:02:11,92 --> 01:02:21,03 Yeah that's a tall impressive. Excell K. Yeah that was awesome OK so. 568 01:02:22,82 --> 01:02:25,87 I have a failed project and I have a successful project 569 01:02:25,92 --> 01:02:30,70 and sadly this castle project is much more boring than the failed project. 570 01:02:32,95 --> 01:02:39,40 So I'm going to I'm going to upload it to vote are you going to tell us which ones failed to do we have figured out. 571 01:02:41,84 --> 01:02:45,25 Well OK so here we go so I'm going to upload the final result. 572 01:02:46,83 --> 01:02:59,75 And you tell me what you see I think that's going to be the best at it OK so here we go. How do you know how well. 573 01:03:04,07 --> 01:03:08,37 Yeah they look like. Those beads that you can. 574 01:03:09,39 --> 01:03:17,39 Put into a little jig and then use an iron to melt it earlier beads It is probably because of you. 575 01:03:19,22 --> 01:03:22,13 And I and so you made them into a pattern of black and white. 576 01:03:25,58 --> 01:03:29,37 And trying to figure out what the pattern is in my head ninety degrees. 577 01:03:31,09 --> 01:03:42,68 It's it's maybe fifty or sixty percent checkerboard just alternating black and white. 578 01:03:36,59 --> 01:03:42,68 but there's a significant amount of clusters safe for Black B. 579 01:03:44,19 --> 01:03:50,11 I don't think there's ever for white be not mistaken so I feel like the black is the signal 580 01:03:50,74 --> 01:03:59,88 and the white is the ground but I could be wrong about that. Do you can you see that there is. There are. 581 01:04:00,01 --> 01:04:05,90 They're sort of they're illuminated they're also backlit Yeah right so it's back in D.C. 582 01:04:05,91 --> 01:04:13,58 Like there is and there are some that are slightly like yes so there's some as if there was something the back. 583 01:04:15,95 --> 01:04:29,82 Yes So let me hang on I believe mistaken it's a graphics. That is open yes nice Yes Oh yeah. So much less stupid. 584 01:04:30,96 --> 01:04:38,92 Oh my gosh that's so rad So yes so let me upload the second image that is exactly what it's supposed to be. 585 01:04:40,10 --> 01:04:48,33 But as you can see it's not I even fear that really like you got to that contextualize by talking about security for 586 01:04:48,34 --> 01:04:56,16 the past oh no I think that would be required it's definitely yeah extremely subtle we're not talking about something 587 01:04:56,17 --> 01:05:06,49 where it's just a graphical image it's pretty well masked by the format Yeah yeah so this is the two of those side by 588 01:05:06,50 --> 01:05:09,39 side so so what you're looking at in the first image is. 589 01:05:10,63 --> 01:05:17,80 Sort of like a four by six sheet of prayer beads two of them stacked one on top of the other the next image is both of 590 01:05:17,81 --> 01:05:24,89 those side by side oh cool so there's like a central in the public it's like encrypted. It's exactly. 591 01:05:26,23 --> 01:05:33,81 Exactly it's a form called visual cryptography and it was. Developed in one thousand nine hundred four. 592 01:05:34,91 --> 01:05:44,29 By an opinion a kind of mathematics paper by these two people last named named or in A.O.R. and Shamir S.-H. 593 01:05:44,33 --> 01:05:53,57 Am I R And what they did is they figured out a way to encrypt messages in images that wouldn't require a computer. 594 01:05:54,78 --> 01:05:59,98 And it's essentially what they call it a one time pad right which meaning like you don't. It's. 595 01:06:00,01 --> 01:06:11,29 Not like a password protected file where the file inside is actually in there somewhere it requires both parts to be to 596 01:06:11,33 --> 01:06:17,76 truly exist like if one of the parts goes missing there is no message you know so if I threw away one of these two 597 01:06:17,77 --> 01:06:24,30 pieces that I created you'd never be able to extrapolate that A you probably would be able to extrapolate that lock was 598 01:06:24,31 --> 01:06:25,59 what was supposed to be created 599 01:06:25,60 --> 01:06:32,28 but by combining the two you can see that the lock exists so I'm going to upload a couple of quick. 600 01:06:33,46 --> 01:06:43,79 So how I got to this was. I had heard about you know cryptography and it sort of was pretty I was like OS really cool. 601 01:06:47,19 --> 01:06:53,24 And I had seen a demo online where it sort of two to transparent P.S.U. 602 01:06:53,25 --> 01:06:57,16 Files that you can kind of overlay and see what the images and. 603 01:06:59,47 --> 01:07:08,06 And I found this person's Python code that would allow you to take your own to file and create the two. 604 01:07:09,94 --> 01:07:13,47 Files that were there it ends up creating two more to files 605 01:07:13,48 --> 01:07:19,87 but two files that you could then create which would make your overlay pattern happened in a sort of reveal the visual 606 01:07:19,88 --> 01:07:21,19 cryptography piece but. 607 01:07:23,11 --> 01:07:25,83 And then I was like I had heard of prayer beads 608 01:07:25,84 --> 01:07:30,72 and I like that they were kind of pixel art it's kind of a way to make I think a lot of people use probably beads for 609 01:07:30,73 --> 01:07:35,25 sort of pixel art stuff so if you're making like a Super Mario Brothers character 610 01:07:35,26 --> 01:07:36,66 or something like that something sort 611 01:07:36,67 --> 01:07:42,00 and then to know it BIT think that it's not you that will be so if location is making I think yeah. 612 01:07:43,13 --> 01:07:48,95 Yeah yeah and Federico you told me other where there's like a little jig that you have and you put the beads and. 613 01:07:49,98 --> 01:07:53,52 That allows you to make them so I took I took the two files that the. 614 01:07:54,66 --> 01:07:59,98 That the visual cryptography It's called the vision kit makes that allows you to sort of take an image. 615 01:08:00,62 --> 01:08:03,43 Encrypted quote unquote into the two images 616 01:08:03,67 --> 01:08:10,80 and then I I fed that in to this Web site that allows you to create prohibited patterns and. 617 01:08:12,67 --> 01:08:18,89 The first mistake I made is the first time I did it it was a super small image is fifty by eight eighteen pixels it was 618 01:08:18,90 --> 01:08:22,44 really small but it turns each pixel into a four by four grid 619 01:08:22,96 --> 01:08:28,46 and what's amazing about this proly would be website is that actually tells you the amount of time it will take you to 620 01:08:28,47 --> 01:08:29,67 make your pearl or bead. 621 01:08:31,50 --> 01:08:34,12 Thing just based on how many beads it is and 622 01:08:34,55 --> 01:08:40,54 and each image would have taken four hours of time just to load the beads in without doing any ironing 623 01:08:40,55 --> 01:08:44,32 or anything like that to glue the beads together and 624 01:08:45,20 --> 01:08:52,03 and it was also like eight thousand beads per something really really huge. So then I. 625 01:08:53,20 --> 01:08:58,34 And I was so dumb to be like well if I just back it down a little bit get it down to like two hours per day that's you 626 01:08:58,35 --> 01:09:04,20 know a super intense night you know having a drink or something putting on my headphones into upon a ton of podcast 627 01:09:04,21 --> 01:09:05,09 and loading all these in 628 01:09:05,75 --> 01:09:12,92 and then I also realize that his calculation is different than mine because with the pearler bead pattern I'm creating 629 01:09:12,93 --> 01:09:21,09 There is no way a human brain can know what color to put in next because it's just noise like each of each one is noise 630 01:09:21,10 --> 01:09:26,16 so you're always having to look at your original pattern to know which color comes next where if you were making like. 631 01:09:27,35 --> 01:09:28,57 You know like I was yelled out 632 01:09:28,58 --> 01:09:33,70 or something you kind of know what the face is going to look I believe so link up let's just be clear a link. 633 01:09:35,19 --> 01:09:46,09 Thanks for this. Yeah we would just we would have just got a ton of e-mail. So the trolls. You know. 634 01:09:47,93 --> 01:09:52,26 Yeah in a big way yeah we would have heard about that which would have been great please please please send us your 635 01:09:52,27 --> 01:10:01,52 troll emails but. What I miscalculated on is the clear Pearl or be. AIDS are not clear enough. 636 01:10:03,37 --> 01:10:10,20 And so I ironed them up and got them ready and I was like and I like expose them to the light 637 01:10:10,25 --> 01:10:14,52 and then I realized like these these clear be just aren't clear enough 638 01:10:14,53 --> 01:10:23,93 and so then I was like well maybe I can polish the fiber optic you know in point you know like if you know I was hurt 639 01:10:23,94 --> 01:10:27,53 like with fiber connections they have to sort of they have a little thing that Polish is the end of the fiber 640 01:10:27,54 --> 01:10:34,60 connection in order to make it more smooth and so I looked into like so prayer beads or I think. 641 01:10:35,94 --> 01:10:40,72 High density polyethylene plastic and so I heard you could polish a cheap piece I was like maybe that will work. 642 01:10:41,91 --> 01:10:46,82 But it didn't in my case I tried to flame polish it with with like a propane torch 643 01:10:46,83 --> 01:10:53,92 and I tried to polish it with like wet sand paper but it's just that the opacity is embedded in the B. 644 01:10:53,93 --> 01:10:58,44 It's like no matter how much you polish it you're just going to get to more of a opacity you know question you have 645 01:10:58,71 --> 01:11:03,59 Yeah so you have like white and clear or just black and clear like. 646 01:11:04,71 --> 01:11:07,16 And it looks white because it's so opaque and 647 01:11:07,17 --> 01:11:15,05 when you are laying the beads because the picture is I can see paper pattern in the back and yet transparency. 648 01:11:16,12 --> 01:11:17,34 So you could do that. 649 01:11:18,72 --> 01:11:19,94 And it would help 650 01:11:20,50 --> 01:11:27,47 or you have to like have the pattern as it totally helpless Yeah I got I had heard so I saw the site and was 651 01:11:27,48 --> 01:11:33,96 and they were like get the clear the site is amazing like they have links to like all the stuff you get it's like go 652 01:11:33,97 --> 01:11:35,35 get the clear square Pearl 653 01:11:35,36 --> 01:11:39,28 or be things that way you can lay this template underneath you know like it's really smart 654 01:11:39,64 --> 01:11:45,70 and they also it's so it's one thing if you're just like wow people are amazing like this site is you know just 655 01:11:45,71 --> 01:11:48,61 someone's home brew website it looks very. 656 01:11:49,73 --> 01:11:50,42 Mundine 657 01:11:50,61 --> 01:11:56,87 but like it will even like put the color number in each Caribbean so if you have like you know six pinks that kind of 658 01:11:56,88 --> 01:11:59,98 all at the same it'll be like sixteen inside the school. 659 01:12:00,11 --> 01:12:05,39 So you know it's pink number sixteen instead of pin number eighteen like it's really really meticulously done 660 01:12:05,40 --> 01:12:08,08 and really beautiful amazing tool. 661 01:12:09,61 --> 01:12:12,86 But in my case I just had clear and black so it was actually quite easy in that regard 662 01:12:13,60 --> 01:12:19,47 and so I laid the template over the top end just fold it right and but I did find out one thing which is that the P.D.F. 663 01:12:19,48 --> 01:12:21,29 At first with it with the grid was too small 664 01:12:21,30 --> 01:12:26,73 and I thought it was a bug in his program I was like oh the grid doesn't fit right like it doesn't line up to the jig 665 01:12:27,35 --> 01:12:34,04 but what it was was I was shrinking to fit on my print job which made everything too small so I had to like 666 01:12:34,05 --> 01:12:35,75 and check that box after panicking. 667 01:12:38,95 --> 01:12:45,00 So my next piece to talk about this one super briefly it's like three images of the first one first this one is 668 01:12:45,01 --> 01:12:54,69 actually a little bit more visually something interesting is a reveal I guess is. So here's the first image. 669 01:12:57,56 --> 01:12:59,06 Seeing a card in it. 670 01:13:02,90 --> 01:13:08,84 And I couldn't get my joke together type who is that who is it that is so that was is what American politician. 671 01:13:10,09 --> 01:13:12,62 Creosote Yeah OK 672 01:13:12,90 --> 01:13:20,95 but I'm going to do it so Segars is you know you had to go it yeah so it's like a it's a graph paper 673 01:13:20,96 --> 01:13:22,41 and next card three by five card 674 01:13:22,77 --> 01:13:28,24 and it's filled with what looks like just just all capital letters except for one square. 675 01:13:29,44 --> 01:13:39,48 Two you have zero two zero yeah yeah yeah that was a mistake. Forgot to fill in to the squares. 676 01:13:41,97 --> 01:13:46,91 So this card right like if you got it in the mail you would just be like this is garbage right you would just check out 677 01:13:46,92 --> 01:13:49,30 this is this is just a bunch of characters. 678 01:13:50,89 --> 01:13:57,71 Similarly I'm uploading another image if you were to get this card in the mail you would also be like I don't know what 679 01:13:57,72 --> 01:14:03,27 this is and it's not telling me anything. Revis is uploading What was your use of these. 680 01:14:04,40 --> 01:14:11,18 Forms at all influenced by the presence of the. What do we have again with that U. 681 01:14:11,19 --> 01:14:19,30 Boat in the Enigma Yeah the eating machine was on it that German U. Boat did they recover that U. 682 01:14:19,31 --> 01:14:22,66 Boat like someone heroically like dove into the sinking U. 683 01:14:22,67 --> 01:14:25,51 Boat in my career replugged the hole or something you know 684 01:14:25,57 --> 01:14:30,53 and then they found they had been women for the specific story I do know that the Enigma. 685 01:14:32,07 --> 01:14:38,54 Code something about the code books were like lined lids so that once you were captured you just throw it overboard it 686 01:14:38,55 --> 01:14:46,33 would sink really well to sink hard ice so this next picture is a three by five card with some holes holes punched in 687 01:14:46,34 --> 01:14:56,50 it was sort of that sort of various you know ways. So you see them and you overlay the cards and you can read a little. 688 01:14:58,68 --> 01:14:59,11 So 689 01:14:59,74 --> 01:15:07,56 when the card is the key Yes So this is what they call a grille cipher G R I O E N I assume it's like I think of it like 690 01:15:07,57 --> 01:15:08,23 a grill. 691 01:15:09,31 --> 01:15:16,06 Like up on the front of a car something where by exposing part of an IT something behind it through viewing it through 692 01:15:16,07 --> 01:15:22,28 the grill meaning is created and so out of the random jumble of letters that I drew on the card. 693 01:15:24,29 --> 01:15:29,44 And then looking at it with the other card laid over it you can read my message to. 694 01:15:30,59 --> 01:15:39,55 Federico on terror which is opposable thumbs so so much to understand the earlier was the year. That was the failure. 695 01:15:40,75 --> 01:15:43,87 I don't know man. I'm there. 696 01:15:45,28 --> 01:15:51,31 Yeah you couldn't tell which one was the failure I like I like the part of the bugzilla you know. 697 01:15:53,27 --> 01:15:59,98 This one you can totally understand but it's less daring you know I mean exactly yeah yeah yeah. 698 01:16:01,16 --> 01:16:07,89 I doubt it probably beats I if I could just get them clear it would be so cool to be able to make something arisen I 699 01:16:07,90 --> 01:16:12,88 wanted to make the password to my wife I network at home and so you could sort of 700 01:16:13,19 --> 01:16:19,53 and there would be like a kind of maybe motorized overlay that like would would like merge the two. 701 01:16:20,71 --> 01:16:25,79 But you could push a button or something like that to grids of beads would overlay one another 702 01:16:25,80 --> 01:16:29,17 and you would could like see what the message was it would be the password to our wife and it work. 703 01:16:30,95 --> 01:16:34,17 And then I realize that was the one that would originally would have taken me like. 704 01:16:36,10 --> 01:16:42,39 I don't know six hours each or eight hours each or something and also been eight thousand beads per one 705 01:16:42,40 --> 01:16:47,96 and I thought I've never done this before it's never a good idea to take on like a super huge project with something 706 01:16:47,97 --> 01:16:52,25 you would never ever done before you know like it's like oh maybe I should search small and see how it goes 707 01:16:52,36 --> 01:16:56,12 and in this case it was smart because the opacity of the beads kind of bit me 708 01:16:56,13 --> 01:17:03,03 and that's one thing you might be interested in I know I've seen this in the projects where you read 709 01:17:03,73 --> 01:17:16,32 and then you take a syringe full of. Fill in the different roles but. I think that. Yeah. 710 01:17:17,97 --> 01:17:19,35 I was thinking of maybe getting like. 711 01:17:21,53 --> 01:17:28,04 Like one possible implementation Lego jumped out of me at first you know was like a possible that I was I don't know 712 01:17:28,05 --> 01:17:33,81 how you connect Lego side to side like I don't know that that complicated. Or also like. 713 01:17:35,33 --> 01:17:38,13 Vinyl cut you know like you could do it in a vinyl cut thing. 714 01:17:39,51 --> 01:17:44,45 On my class or something so if you had like a window that you lifted up you could like get some sort of message and. 715 01:17:46,49 --> 01:17:52,56 It would you know so yeah so I had a couple of other from the failure right you sort of Oh but I could do this 716 01:17:52,57 --> 01:17:59,98 and so that's maybe part of it I mean I'm not buying that this is. OK I see things I don't know I think. 717 01:18:00,01 --> 01:18:09,90 If you hadn't introduced it in that way I would just think it is like that's here. You know I mean yeah yeah yeah. 718 01:18:12,22 --> 01:18:16,25 I don't know never never introduces. Doing that so. 719 01:18:21,44 --> 01:18:28,54 I think the thing that would have been if I had just become so i also just felt so bitten like I was like busted my 720 01:18:28,55 --> 01:18:31,93 butt on it and I was like OK here we go here we go here's the test and I was like no. 721 01:18:34,45 --> 01:18:39,97 Like it was I was like like you just feel like it's like catastrophic here's like oh my god like what. 722 01:18:41,65 --> 01:18:48,43 So anyway thank thank you so much for both actually being able to decipher what it was I mean. That's. 723 01:18:51,78 --> 01:18:58,64 OK So we're about to roll off into the what we're into this Federico I saw some stuff that you had to google doc you 724 01:18:58,65 --> 01:19:00,58 want to talk about any of that stuff yeah. 725 01:19:02,39 --> 01:19:07,99 It was already mentioned the whole table saw relationship and the fat pencils. 726 01:19:09,54 --> 01:19:18,22 That Pencils was it is from Jimmy the rest I I really like them that. You can get these. 727 01:19:20,42 --> 01:19:22,31 Listeners who've never heard these you can get these. 728 01:19:23,72 --> 01:19:29,62 Really think pencils somehow are meant for children to be able to group easier 729 01:19:30,19 --> 01:19:34,97 but they're really nice in the shop because you can use them to hold things that 730 01:19:35,41 --> 01:19:42,47 when you're cutting things in that they will store the bandsaw So they're like specially fat easy to hold stick. 731 01:19:44,36 --> 01:19:52,12 At the end that helps you do things. You know how to hold things so your own fingers are not in the way of the blade. 732 01:19:54,76 --> 01:19:59,07 Then I mentioned turning the tree printer into a laser engraver. 733 01:20:00,59 --> 01:20:07,16 Thirty dollar laser that's a very simple product it's essentially you buy these thirty dollars laser. 734 01:20:08,38 --> 01:20:11,35 Alley Express got it nice 735 01:20:11,65 --> 01:20:18,33 and you use stick it somehow in front of the I mean you can disassemble your extruding your nozzle 736 01:20:18,34 --> 01:20:24,33 or you can use you know fast and somehow. You do have to replace the. 737 01:20:26,73 --> 01:20:32,27 You have to I mean you have to connect the laser to the power that comes from the extruding head. 738 01:20:33,67 --> 01:20:37,07 And then figure out the G. Code on the laser when you want to. 739 01:20:39,22 --> 01:20:45,24 So the three printer I had of us soley doodle to from around two thousand or. 740 01:20:47,00 --> 01:20:50,30 So this is like a light I like this project because it was like. 741 01:20:51,49 --> 01:20:57,99 I see a lot of tree printers are going to start kind of showing up because like now you can get the nice ones for 742 01:20:58,53 --> 01:20:59,57 considerably cheaper. 743 01:21:00,84 --> 01:21:08,31 So it's nice to have a way of reusing the older ones if you're not extruding plastic anymore 744 01:21:09,03 --> 01:21:12,51 and then these products make me made me enjoy Inkscape a lot. 745 01:21:13,63 --> 01:21:21,24 You know that's a software tool is a useless trader and I like Illustrator for many things but Inkscape is fantastic. 746 01:21:23,19 --> 01:21:27,27 For some uses like for example I really like this napping. 747 01:21:28,42 --> 01:21:33,82 Because you can it has like more options for select selecting how things nap to each other so when 748 01:21:33,86 --> 01:21:39,60 when I was doing the engraving the words on these these cues it was easier to say select the group 749 01:21:39,61 --> 01:21:44,60 and tell it to snap to the center of the group which is not something you can easily do in a straight 750 01:21:44,61 --> 01:21:53,99 or it has tons of extensions which is so I using scape to turn the Pats into G. 751 01:21:54,00 --> 01:22:06,26 Code that recklessly and on the into tapings extension. So I really enjoyed that and then there is her she text. There. 752 01:22:08,07 --> 01:22:13,33 The text generator I used it was written by the people from evil my scientists. 753 01:22:14,80 --> 01:22:21,72 And it's it's included now with a new version of Inkscape so you'll find it in the extensions render menu 754 01:22:22,08 --> 01:22:32,38 and what it does is it generates funds that are sent in great what will. Essentially funds that are C.N.C. 755 01:22:32,39 --> 01:22:39,83 and Laser friendly sort of mind single life funds including including Japanese which is going to be impressive. 756 01:22:40,90 --> 01:22:47,42 Yeah so the reason these makes life easier. Read a laser in particular is that I being have to use any raster. 757 01:22:48,58 --> 01:22:57,60 So the laser would use follow vector line to create. Letters which is considerably faster. And brass ring. 758 01:22:59,34 --> 01:23:04,54 So I don't know. If you do any vector work and I. 759 01:23:05,75 --> 01:23:10,50 Think he should like to play with Inkscape a little bit the really nice open source tool. 760 01:23:11,95 --> 01:23:13,60 Not something I use for this project 761 01:23:13,61 --> 01:23:23,67 but I really enjoy getting scape has like a really solid tiling set up like you can create so for example you can grab 762 01:23:24,24 --> 01:23:26,54 an image of Victor and. 763 01:23:27,86 --> 01:23:36,04 And tile it and he has a number of settings where you can change the offset but then it clones each vector so 764 01:23:36,05 --> 01:23:42,59 when you make changes to the original He changes all of them so it's a nice like tool for making patterns. 765 01:23:46,06 --> 01:23:50,72 That's cool so that's what I always heard about Inkscape but I've never never ever tried it and I'll dig in 766 01:23:50,73 --> 01:23:59,99 and that's great to get to it's free open source it's not the best looking piece of software that is like is very very. 767 01:24:00,01 --> 01:24:06,43 Functional It's like a sort of. Swiss Army knife or something. To add to that if you want. 768 01:24:07,49 --> 01:24:10,17 That direction you can get G.I.M.P. 769 01:24:11,10 --> 01:24:19,34 Shop alternative Yeah campus what I used actually to create a very small one tickle by one pixel great image again the 770 01:24:19,35 --> 01:24:25,88 top was like giving me hell yeah yeah now I can piss off I'm yet to the rescue. And. 771 01:24:27,13 --> 01:24:30,26 You're finished with my list or you want to share yet a point. 772 01:24:31,29 --> 01:24:40,62 And somehow in gender you've mentioned music and one thing I've been listening to a lot is the band called Bastien. 773 01:24:42,85 --> 01:24:49,72 So I'm a big metal head I think metal is on there represented in a lot of stuff I listen to. 774 01:24:51,05 --> 01:24:57,20 But I found them recently there have been a band from the Bay Area and 775 01:24:57,63 --> 01:25:07,29 and if you're into like that metal that sounds really mean and kind of raw and I think that you would like the best. 776 01:25:10,29 --> 01:25:15,19 Incidentally one of the singers is a woman she sings it is like wonderful girlie boys. 777 01:25:16,79 --> 01:25:23,73 And it works really well I don't know so while I was in grading hundreds of words in these little cues sort of things I 778 01:25:23,74 --> 01:25:34,09 was listening to. And then some that I found randomly. Is this You Tube channel Japanese religion. 779 01:25:36,80 --> 01:25:40,86 I literally found it like three days ago. And they do. 780 01:25:42,53 --> 01:25:44,26 They do features about Japan 781 01:25:44,59 --> 01:25:51,21 but it's not it's not your standard You Tube channeling that their videos are like half an hour long so they're a 782 01:25:51,22 --> 01:25:53,95 commitment and they explore like different. 783 01:25:55,36 --> 01:25:59,98 Parts of Japanese culture but for some they have a half an hour show that it catered to. 784 01:26:00,04 --> 01:26:06,12 Scissors in Japan and his war you watch and I love scissors and. 785 01:26:07,29 --> 01:26:15,12 So they talk about all the different kinds of scissors and how they came to Japan and how for example at the time 786 01:26:15,34 --> 01:26:25,28 when swords were going out of style in Japan sword makers started making sisters. And so watch they have a. 787 01:26:26,46 --> 01:26:32,03 Clip of some guy forging a pair of scissors It made me kind of add that to my. 788 01:26:33,82 --> 01:26:39,27 Maker's bucket list when I was going to force my own scissors at some point so. 789 01:26:43,80 --> 01:26:50,04 I got a couple things to really quick one of them is Jeremy fielding as You Tube channel 790 01:26:50,05 --> 01:26:53,47 and patron pages is really great he. 791 01:26:55,02 --> 01:27:01,66 Has been doing just many many many projects with motors of various kinds and just he really is into motors 792 01:27:01,67 --> 01:27:08,42 and just explores all these different facets of them and he has this really great style of like something that 793 01:27:08,43 --> 01:27:13,63 when you look at it you're like first you're like oh that looks just sort of thrown together but then 794 01:27:13,64 --> 01:27:21,40 when you start to dig into it you're like oh my gosh this took for ever to do You were like you kind of realize it's 795 01:27:21,41 --> 01:27:29,23 like oh this is probably like a fifteenth aeration of this or something but before he he recorded it 796 01:27:29,91 --> 01:27:33,13 and he made his own lathe from scratch and it's so beautiful 797 01:27:33,71 --> 01:27:40,16 and his latest patriotic e-mail the title is just a motor made from microwave parts 798 01:27:41,08 --> 01:27:43,93 and I thought that was it was really compelling and great 799 01:27:44,57 --> 01:27:48,76 and also tied back to Dan's project from last week so that was cool. 800 01:27:49,96 --> 01:27:55,63 And then the site there's a site called hardcore pro or dot com which is really great it's not an adult site. 801 01:27:58,02 --> 01:28:04,51 You can imagine it there is part of it. Yes yes there is a rule if you want to believe. 802 01:28:08,46 --> 01:28:13,82 It has some really great tips for people who do large scale or complex parolee 803 01:28:13,83 --> 01:28:17,93 or projects like just different techniques for heating up the iron and stuff 804 01:28:17,94 --> 01:28:21,88 and that stuff was infinitely helpful for me never having done it before 805 01:28:22,29 --> 01:28:30,94 and then I was I been listening to this album called Black origami by this artist she Lynn and. 806 01:28:34,32 --> 01:28:40,94 Thirty four an artist she's from yes she's from Gary Indiana it's a really great really intense 807 01:28:40,95 --> 01:28:45,38 but also beautiful electronic music record and all them all into all that stuff in show and it's. 808 01:28:48,62 --> 01:28:53,77 You know so I got Anybody got anything else I just get I just get one thing which is. 809 01:28:54,85 --> 01:29:00,75 Not really related to what it was working on this week but it's shrinkwrapped it's used for bundling things together. 810 01:29:02,30 --> 01:29:07,99 At home had enough he has it work much with this but it isn't in the press is moving my studio and I had so many. 811 01:29:09,93 --> 01:29:10,51 That need to go 812 01:29:10,52 --> 01:29:16,96 and bundles that you know where it's difficult to manage if you're carrying it by yourself so you buy these. 813 01:29:18,66 --> 01:29:25,75 Rules of shrink wrap movers and I found that the cheaper you go the better because the fancy ones if these rep 814 01:29:25,76 --> 01:29:29,90 or a script that don't spin so you bake you basically get something that looks like a. 815 01:29:31,89 --> 01:29:34,06 Toilet paper roll but it's made out of. 816 01:29:35,07 --> 01:29:39,05 Plastic instead of paper and the handle sticks out at one side 817 01:29:39,06 --> 01:29:45,16 but it's just blowing my mind useful this is so I'm going to start keep him around not just want to move that. 818 01:29:46,25 --> 01:29:48,31 SMYTH That's a great tip Yeah cool. 819 01:29:50,13 --> 01:29:57,16 That's it I think we're I think the next challenge time crafting the next challenge the rider eco What do you get for 820 01:29:57,17 --> 01:30:08,59 us. Oh my. I had some ideas but like. That conversation made me think more about jigs. 821 01:30:13,28 --> 01:30:21,26 So I don't know if it would be jigs specifically or modifying. I mean. 822 01:30:25,51 --> 01:30:32,07 I think a lot of fighting tools falls under you or do we need to be more explicit. Well. 823 01:30:33,61 --> 01:30:39,94 Part of it was thinking about like what is it like with like the tool that makes the tool. 824 01:30:43,67 --> 01:30:57,31 But I think we could keep it simple and it would be J. IGS. Level that's great. Since they actually came out. Yeah. 825 01:30:58,50 --> 01:31:03,65 Maybe as US I really like that phrase the tool that makes the tool really interesting way to think about it. 826 01:31:05,71 --> 01:31:07,32 He would use that as a sub kind of. 827 01:31:09,09 --> 01:31:14,71 This is great I just want to run and start working on this all night and I said yeah yeah. 828 01:31:15,74 --> 01:31:20,09 In the jig is the thing that I sadly feel like I when I'm in a rush. 829 01:31:21,33 --> 01:31:24,96 I I always I'm like I want to make a jig for this kind no it will be better 830 01:31:24,97 --> 01:31:29,23 but I'm just going to try to like freestyle it and then it blows up in my face not literally 831 01:31:29,24 --> 01:31:35,08 but you know Mike Oh I thought I could do this and now I can't and if I just made it a it would have been much better. 832 01:31:36,23 --> 01:31:43,83 I have a similar sentiment which is that they will so I'm like I always think something like OK I can spend you know 833 01:31:44,01 --> 01:31:47,93 fifteen or twenty minutes making a jig that is way better than spend their. 834 01:31:49,36 --> 01:31:59,98 Time at the hospital or like losing a finger so I would confess that a lot of the dues I made. Based on fear. But they. 835 01:32:00,05 --> 01:32:04,98 They make everything better at the end. Up as a sausage as a difference. 836 01:32:08,83 --> 01:32:16,81 It would still really hurt if you get tagged with that plate or I mean even the small stuff will get back. Through. 837 01:32:18,70 --> 01:32:19,09 It point. 838 01:32:20,25 --> 01:32:27,37 So you get you get some is you want to lay on us you can find finished versions of our projects that projects that 839 01:32:27,38 --> 01:32:33,81 opposable pikas dot com shout out to Taylor who just took on the redesign of the site and it's looking awesome 840 01:32:34,23 --> 01:32:37,80 and we may just just may have that ready for this episode 841 01:32:37,84 --> 01:32:42,32 and it looks great way better than my first pass Thank you Taylor for taking that on. 842 01:32:43,34 --> 01:32:48,14 If you sing it I believe my suggestion was used to know it would present still 843 01:32:49,00 --> 01:32:53,78 but if it's a great if it ever go yeah that's looking great so that's good. 844 01:32:56,55 --> 01:33:03,07 You can listen to episodes directly on opposable podcast dot com You can also subscribe with i Tunes overcast stitcher 845 01:33:03,08 --> 01:33:08,88 and all the other park cast app platforms if you can't find us just search for the phrase opposable thumbs 846 01:33:08,89 --> 01:33:12,95 and it should come up if you're on Google Search opposable thumbs podcast 847 01:33:12,96 --> 01:33:21,71 and you should pop right at the top are awesome logos created by wolf mask you can check out his work at work mask our. 848 01:33:20,64 --> 01:33:21,71 dot co dot U.K. 849 01:33:22,78 --> 01:33:27,87 If you'd like to support some patron you can head over to patron dot com slash opposable thumbs 850 01:33:27,88 --> 01:33:34,64 and give us a sponsor we've had a couple great sponsors and like Hitler said We've gotten up to eight dollars 851 01:33:34,65 --> 01:33:37,83 and maybe a little bit more even at this point and so we're pretty excited to. 852 01:33:38,88 --> 01:33:42,30 Cover our hosting will be the first thing we do so that's really great. 853 01:33:43,92 --> 01:33:48,73 We do have a code of conduct on the site our podcast is dedicated to providing a harassment free experience for 854 01:33:48,74 --> 01:33:55,75 everyone regardless of race gender age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject 855 01:33:55,76 --> 01:34:00,92 matter or religion we actively support of inclusive environment and we want you. To be a part of it. 856 01:34:02,23 --> 01:34:09,15 We have an Instagram account we entered the world of social media here on episode eight. 857 01:34:10,90 --> 01:34:12,37 If you go to Instagram 858 01:34:12,41 --> 01:34:19,98 and our Instagram name I think Taylor for me from right me if I'm wrong is posable underscore podcasts is that scene 859 01:34:19,99 --> 01:34:28,29 right yes that's right yeah cool so we've been posting images there sort of of things that are related to old episodes 860 01:34:28,30 --> 01:34:32,27 we've also been posting a few sort of teaser images of work in progress 861 01:34:32,92 --> 01:34:39,48 and we also are posting final images of some of our products there so if you follow us on Instagram you'll get some 862 01:34:39,49 --> 01:34:41,11 cool stuff related 863 01:34:41,55 --> 01:34:46,21 and also just sort of stuff that's kind of related to things we talk about a podcast that maybe we don't have time to 864 01:34:46,22 --> 01:34:52,68 fully do in the past. One bit of listener feedback Ranjeet who did a really cool. 865 01:34:53,72 --> 01:35:00,24 Great weird ultra track audio track for us a couple of episodes ago sent us a photo of a bone folder in the wild at the 866 01:35:00,25 --> 01:35:01,42 Copenhagen airport. 867 01:35:03,59 --> 01:35:07,85 He was at the airport and was like oh there's a bone folder and so he took a picture of it for us 868 01:35:07,86 --> 01:35:11,77 and sent it to us I had it was just super cool that like the bone folder was spotted in the wild 869 01:35:11,78 --> 01:35:18,51 and at the airport which is you know folder could be seen as a little bit of a danger I got I assume they'll let you 870 01:35:18,52 --> 01:35:19,19 through. 871 01:35:20,43 --> 01:35:26,15 The airport with a bone fuller but I'm not sure but it was cool that this person had one if it is a trash can there's. 872 01:35:27,31 --> 01:35:30,07 Like a store that's holders. 873 01:35:33,10 --> 01:35:38,13 Yeah conference gated like you know I just misplaced mine and I was looking around I wasn't going to holders 874 01:35:38,14 --> 01:35:44,72 and so you can actually buy plastic ones. Now yeah I know if you've been vulnerable to her new which is. 875 01:35:48,03 --> 01:35:53,45 Yet I think there they are something that's pretty rigid So I think it would work out pretty well at first I was like 876 01:35:53,46 --> 01:35:59,98 opening took a plastic one would just be too Bindy but I think it's like phenolic resin or something it pretty pretty. 877 01:36:02,76 --> 01:36:10,59 I think that's it. Yes that is it so super huge think Stuart guest Federico your project was Laghman. 878 01:36:12,63 --> 01:36:14,22 And if you have any events 879 01:36:14,23 --> 01:36:20,15 or activities anything you want to let folks know about here on the on the way out so if you want to find me on line my 880 01:36:20,54 --> 01:36:27,47 main website is wealth cat workshop dot com. Also me if you subscribe to my newsletter. 881 01:36:29,06 --> 01:36:38,62 I only send an email every month. Documenting my art and my general making adventures. I also post things on Instagram. 882 01:36:39,70 --> 01:36:41,28 At wealth CAD workshop. 883 01:36:42,96 --> 01:36:45,22 And thank you so much Taylor 884 01:36:45,23 --> 01:36:52,82 and Rob for having me it was really nice OK Excellent excellent work tonight my man very unsparing Driggs going to be. 885 01:37:13,10 --> 01:37:13,28 Like 886 01:37:13,29 --> 01:37:18,01 when you it's just something where the computer says Oh do you want to change something you think well this is working 887 01:37:18,35 --> 01:37:18,82 but why not. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:00,07 --> 00:00:10,52 If you want to try just a little heads up that we had a. Technical glitch while recording the episode in. Say. 2 00:00:11,54 --> 00:00:18,36 Catastrophic laptop failure but we didn't lose any recording which is great 3 00:00:18,37 --> 00:00:26,36 but our audio quality is a little bit off in places because we had to use our Skype recording instead of using a 4 00:00:26,37 --> 00:00:30,97 recording of each of our voices mixed down into one final mix so. 5 00:00:32,81 --> 00:00:39,78 Apologies there and but we think you'll really super do the episode and it should sound pretty good 6 00:00:39,79 --> 00:00:44,21 but it's a little bit Tenney and weird in a couple places anyway enjoy the pod cast 7 00:00:44,26 --> 00:00:52,77 and oh so we have an answer game now so if you go to opposable underscore pod cast on Instagram you can check us out 8 00:00:52,81 --> 00:01:00,43 and also we're giving away stickers for people who share an episode so. Share an episode of the most newest Ticker. 9 00:01:16,71 --> 00:01:20,49 Welcome to the opposable thumbs podcast opposable thumbs is the past where Taylor 10 00:01:20,50 --> 00:01:24,54 and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 11 00:01:24,55 --> 00:01:33,05 and lessons learned Matthew stanky is our guest this week Welcome Matthew thank you for having me yeah we are excited 12 00:01:33,06 --> 00:01:36,24 to have you as you are a maker of many wonderful things. 13 00:01:37,76 --> 00:01:43,92 My name is Robert I use the his dinner pronoun I run the exoskeleton art space in Los Angeles 14 00:01:43,96 --> 00:01:46,03 and hosts everything art openings that I've been to there 15 00:01:46,82 --> 00:01:54,16 and I'm also an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles so you are OK. Artist. 16 00:01:58,32 --> 00:02:06,11 And really it's. Met on BET and they were former studio mates fifteen years ago seventeen years ago. 17 00:02:08,68 --> 00:02:19,40 While it's been a long time. Tell us a little bit of. All I've got right now as I'm an artist. And musician composer. 18 00:02:22,40 --> 00:02:32,67 And I live in Austin Texas currently although we plan to move pretty soon so currently located based in Austin Texas. 19 00:02:33,79 --> 00:02:45,57 And I do collaboration compose pieces for live performance. I compose music for dance and movement. 20 00:02:47,57 --> 00:02:59,62 I also compose experimental media performances that involve video and robotics and musical instruments that I design. 21 00:03:00,80 --> 00:03:12,94 And I'm about to start making some visual art again it's been a little. Happening. I think the last. 22 00:03:14,30 --> 00:03:18,87 Five or straightforward visual or you're making was in this case 23 00:03:18,88 --> 00:03:30,60 and you're doing I mean it's a long time ago yeah issue already static images are what. I'm back to sculpture. 24 00:03:31,81 --> 00:03:37,71 But probably I think I kind of feel like being caustic I did something caustic work. 25 00:03:38,99 --> 00:03:41,82 Because my mother actually doesn't caustic work 26 00:03:41,83 --> 00:03:45,94 and she talked kind of taught me how to do it so I kind of took it on for a little while 27 00:03:46,65 --> 00:03:54,62 and I wasn't the only other creative thing I had going on at the time was a band that was playing in a kind of focus on 28 00:03:54,66 --> 00:03:59,75 for a bit but. I've moved back to sculpture and. 29 00:04:00,21 --> 00:04:07,65 Kind of you know I don't know I guess I thought of an caustic at the time as sculpture even though it was. 30 00:04:09,64 --> 00:04:15,30 To me it's very well it has to do with death and in case of some kind of object. 31 00:04:16,41 --> 00:04:23,24 Which is the the painting of the drawing itself. But yes I was doing that. 32 00:04:24,87 --> 00:04:27,33 I guess just to back up a little bit 33 00:04:27,88 --> 00:04:36,03 and I had a tiny shop in Brooklyn before I moved back to Austin that was basically like a walk in closet 34 00:04:36,04 --> 00:04:39,06 and power tools stacked on top of each other it was really dangerous 35 00:04:39,81 --> 00:04:47,29 and I was kind of interested in going getting back to designing instruments again. 36 00:04:48,64 --> 00:04:51,82 After having taken a break from that for a while 37 00:04:52,64 --> 00:04:59,92 and it was it was fairly dangerous in the sky one of the reasons why we wanted to get out of Brooklyn was because it 38 00:04:59,93 --> 00:05:07,13 was the limited amount of space that we had so I came back to Austin I just kind of let it let loose 39 00:05:07,25 --> 00:05:13,04 and started building out all these instruments I had been thinking about and trying to design for a while 40 00:05:13,72 --> 00:05:14,63 and I've been doing that. 41 00:05:15,66 --> 00:05:23,11 For the past four years since I've been here I've been creating experimental musical instruments. That involve. 42 00:05:24,24 --> 00:05:25,45 Electro magnetism. 43 00:05:26,95 --> 00:05:36,90 Robotics and combined with like digital music composition so basically composing digitally the 44 00:05:37,38 --> 00:05:42,80 and then creating a physical output whether that's resonating metal using pulse of modulation 45 00:05:42,81 --> 00:05:47,77 or if it's making robotic mallets instruments hitting things 46 00:05:48,53 --> 00:05:59,63 or keyboard playing keyboards whatever so kind of interested in sort of formalizing my my. Experience with that. 47 00:06:00,60 --> 00:06:07,18 And I've kind of gotten to a point where I feel like I've almost made everything that I want to make 48 00:06:07,87 --> 00:06:18,33 and now I'm sort of refining a lot of my ideas. And invention and it's amazing well with the instruments. 49 00:06:19,64 --> 00:06:29,57 With the actual music I'm still I'm always interested in composing music but yeah I really. Put a lot of energy into. 50 00:06:31,72 --> 00:06:38,78 All of exploring these areas I felt like weren't really that defined and I've been able to kind of create my own. 51 00:06:40,05 --> 00:06:41,33 Methods for using. 52 00:06:42,73 --> 00:06:48,26 Like electro magnet like electromagnets to do to resonate drum heads 53 00:06:48,27 --> 00:06:51,35 or metal objects almost like a physical synthesizer. 54 00:06:53,12 --> 00:07:00,81 And I kind of you know now it's more like I've created these tools in this these toys and time to play with them. 55 00:07:02,41 --> 00:07:11,64 So I am more focused on that right now although I do have a little split focus which is kind of the. 56 00:07:13,01 --> 00:07:19,59 The next thing that is kind of it is an experiment with your but I am trying to design a new. 57 00:07:20,87 --> 00:07:24,35 Actuator for robotic mallets. 58 00:07:25,85 --> 00:07:32,72 Percussion that is it doesn't have the has less friction and doesn't involve salon the lights which click. 59 00:07:34,30 --> 00:07:43,20 Mechanical noise so I'm kind of in secret designing a little actually. Which I'm hoping to have done. 60 00:07:44,64 --> 00:07:48,35 In spring I wanted to work on a paper as well. 61 00:07:49,48 --> 00:07:52,92 So that's kind of like my side project 62 00:07:52,93 --> 00:07:59,68 but it's also important I want to also want to make it open source so this design that I'm coming up with anybody could. 63 00:08:00,09 --> 00:08:07,42 Download in you know the whole open source thing you can perfect it hoping that people will perfect it. So yeah. 64 00:08:08,55 --> 00:08:13,15 I want it I don't want to say too much about it because it's not fully realized yet 65 00:08:13,16 --> 00:08:17,27 but that's my goal are you able to share I think you're telling me there was. 66 00:08:18,42 --> 00:08:27,21 Cheering for the paper with your other Q Yeah so the the nine conference the new new interfaces for musical expression 67 00:08:27,22 --> 00:08:34,18 happens once a year and this past year it was that it was in Copenhagen and I got to do a performance there 68 00:08:34,19 --> 00:08:38,36 and meet some really amazing instrument designers and. 69 00:08:40,30 --> 00:08:47,49 I played a performance with other with Rogers and some other roboticists robotic music folks. 70 00:08:48,88 --> 00:08:56,24 I think their group is called E M M I and. I don't know what the acronyms but he was so yeah. 71 00:08:57,47 --> 00:09:04,16 So they and then there's some eight yeah there's that and there's papers and presentations of various instruments 72 00:09:04,17 --> 00:09:07,07 and the big theme this year seemed to be. 73 00:09:10,10 --> 00:09:15,00 Have to feed back in resonance coming from the instrument that you're performing with 74 00:09:15,65 --> 00:09:19,08 and then translating that through software through electronics 75 00:09:19,09 --> 00:09:23,84 and then back into the instruments of this kind of feedback I guess was a big the. 76 00:09:25,52 --> 00:09:31,88 Another big theme I think was the idea of does developing a musical instrument for the public 77 00:09:32,04 --> 00:09:36,91 or versus developing a musical instrument for yourself as an artist 78 00:09:37,58 --> 00:09:43,80 and that yes that sort of design is to design strategies and then the other theme was trying. 79 00:09:45,31 --> 00:09:47,02 They were trying to formalize. 80 00:09:49,61 --> 00:09:58,01 A process for developing music that winds of as they called nine craft in this idea that that new musical instrument 81 00:09:58,02 --> 00:09:59,80 design could follow this. 82 00:10:00,17 --> 00:10:03,65 Process of prototyping instrument 83 00:10:04,04 --> 00:10:13,04 and they're trying to kind of come up with this I miss define this idea what that is the culture around developing 84 00:10:13,05 --> 00:10:17,69 music there's a little difficult to the grab 85 00:10:17,73 --> 00:10:23,57 but that's kind of one of the numbers one of the comp there was one of the workshops I was involved in it was actually 86 00:10:23,61 --> 00:10:24,12 quite fun. 87 00:10:25,33 --> 00:10:31,62 If I did interesting to hear each talk about that formalization because I always associated your practice it's more of 88 00:10:31,63 --> 00:10:37,56 a punk rock sort of I'm going to do this because I feel like it and using kind of the tools and. 89 00:10:38,69 --> 00:10:46,58 I'm thinking for example one of my favorite pieces of yours was a soul to kinetic statue at the end of everything 90 00:10:46,62 --> 00:10:56,27 correctly he's still here. But right there with you discover there are no he's a he's in a box OK. Above the drugs. 91 00:10:57,34 --> 00:10:58,51 So yes. 92 00:10:59,59 --> 00:11:07,25 I find this is the case let things really tense suing the CD or whatever they get pulled into these structures 93 00:11:07,29 --> 00:11:14,08 and then as they're getting formalized they their great benefits in the things are also potentially Lust's they are you 94 00:11:14,09 --> 00:11:23,16 feeling any challenges as you bring your sort of D.I.Y. Aesthetic to a more particularly good academic structure. Yes. 95 00:11:24,73 --> 00:11:33,04 And but that's not but so. I can hold those that sort of tacit knowledge that I have as an artist. 96 00:11:34,29 --> 00:11:37,99 You know to my I can hold that to my own person as an artist 97 00:11:38,63 --> 00:11:44,69 and I can definitely use that to make art like Kermit the man I want to do. 98 00:11:46,22 --> 00:11:51,69 But in order for me to share some of these some of the strange knowledge of the sort of developed over the years has 99 00:11:51,70 --> 00:11:57,27 been like twenty years and as I've been yeah been building I've been doing robotic drum percussion for twenty years. 100 00:12:00,01 --> 00:12:09,15 Yeah I kind of I've had to develop some kind of breadboards as you might say for students for students at workshops 101 00:12:09,79 --> 00:12:18,57 and kind of a language in order to speak with to communicate with other robotic musicians musicians you know composers 102 00:12:18,58 --> 00:12:23,10 who are using robotics. But. 103 00:12:24,21 --> 00:12:26,72 I think that you know 104 00:12:27,19 --> 00:12:33,98 when you formalize I mean that was also an issue you've been interesting point you bring up because the workshop that I 105 00:12:33,99 --> 00:12:38,18 was in was called Digital loop through your digital Lou theory. 106 00:12:39,42 --> 00:12:42,69 Which you allude fear is a person 107 00:12:42,73 --> 00:12:48,32 and an instrument maker who makes stringed instruments violins banjos cellos guitars 108 00:12:49,04 --> 00:12:59,22 and they their you know they their work is their designs are based on transforming the string through the bridge 109 00:12:59,26 --> 00:13:04,23 and the sound board or the pickup and converting that converting those vibrations in the sound 110 00:13:04,24 --> 00:13:07,85 and that sort of science and art being a luthier 111 00:13:07,86 --> 00:13:14,32 and so they were trying to kind of create create an environment that was like a it was a breadboarding in via 112 00:13:14,33 --> 00:13:20,27 prototyping environment. Within a formal context so they were kind of. 113 00:13:22,12 --> 00:13:30,89 In this workshop they were kind of saying hey academia is slow you know this process of documenting formalizing is slow 114 00:13:31,53 --> 00:13:40,97 How can we create a sandbox or a playground for designers to move quickly and experiment. 115 00:13:42,64 --> 00:13:47,55 And they're also the guy they were the group that their group in Africa I don't think they have a name 116 00:13:47,56 --> 00:13:59,98 but they're handful of. Musicians and engineers that I think are at. Sussex but I'm not sure some weren't somewhere. 117 00:14:00,17 --> 00:14:07,22 London you remember what school was. But they developed the Belo board if you've ever heard of that it's kind of like. 118 00:14:08,29 --> 00:14:18,00 A Raspberry Pi. But it's geared towards music you know that's cool. I was actually curious about that I mean I've. 119 00:14:19,44 --> 00:14:21,07 I followed your work for a long time I remember 120 00:14:21,08 --> 00:14:28,15 and caustic work you did that I think about all the time which is it was like this is it's hard to describe painting 121 00:14:28,16 --> 00:14:35,01 but aren't caustic worker or any anything I guess but it was like and it was like. 122 00:14:36,28 --> 00:14:43,65 Sort of alien like figures performing like the cation research. 123 00:14:45,47 --> 00:14:53,91 And that like that like I don't know it like permanently imprinted on me and that image comes up a lot like that. 124 00:14:55,37 --> 00:15:01,40 Yeah yeah I can picture it right and I think it was. Yeah yeah I really like that image a lot. 125 00:15:02,90 --> 00:15:06,03 I was curious about you've been making. 126 00:15:09,49 --> 00:15:16,27 Robotic maybe is the right word instruments for a super long time really and I was curious. 127 00:15:19,17 --> 00:15:26,58 I saw a picture of a drum that you made recently or at least took a picture of it recently and 128 00:15:26,66 --> 00:15:35,15 and it dawned on me at that time like small scale kind of prototyping I mean a factory has changed so much since you 129 00:15:35,16 --> 00:15:40,54 first started making these objects and I was curious about like. 130 00:15:42,14 --> 00:15:48,13 Because when I think of you making an instrument I think of probably like a lot of time in the wood shop 131 00:15:48,14 --> 00:15:53,40 and with like various wing nuts and stuff like trying to set different. 132 00:15:54,81 --> 00:15:59,98 You know ranges of a soul in order something like to get a kind of tune. 133 00:16:00,31 --> 00:16:04,11 The performance you want out of a drummer out of a guitar something and 134 00:16:04,22 --> 00:16:10,30 and I was just curious like how that's what your thoughts are about sort of how maybe that's changed 135 00:16:10,31 --> 00:16:18,17 and if it's if it has provided like a way for your and shipments to become differently nuanced or 136 00:16:18,61 --> 00:16:21,31 or is it kind of just all the same but different cereals out 137 00:16:21,35 --> 00:16:28,05 or I don't know I was curious like how that's been for you yeah laser laser cutters been a big help. 138 00:16:29,79 --> 00:16:39,57 I just I have less time than I used to yeah so I I use the laser cutter. Constantly to do all my latest work. 139 00:16:41,69 --> 00:16:52,31 And I also source parts e-bay that are credibly inexpensive and I see if I can make something 140 00:16:52,32 --> 00:17:02,63 and then you know it doesn't work no big deal. Yep. And then I've recently started three D. 141 00:17:02,64 --> 00:17:07,20 Printing I just build the printer so I'm just. I'm very green. 142 00:17:08,81 --> 00:17:16,27 You some switch shit which gets you to go for I got the Tivo Prussia I three or four I can remember. 143 00:17:18,02 --> 00:17:21,02 Oh yeah I can get through it well if that's a just a. 144 00:17:22,78 --> 00:17:28,88 Joint there would be I think it was like crazy cheap it was it was two hundred bucks. 145 00:17:32,19 --> 00:17:43,75 And I've just been printing parts for it. Just like you know strange fan. And actors things. But yeah three D. 146 00:17:43,76 --> 00:17:48,36 Printing I mean laser cutting especially I think is really great because I like wood 147 00:17:48,82 --> 00:17:57,30 and I like the sound of wood it has a. Nice you know quality as far as you know for instrument making. 148 00:17:58,64 --> 00:18:02,33 Because wood is both resin. And damp sound at the same time. 149 00:18:03,58 --> 00:18:07,57 You can use it to do a lot of different instrument making and it I think it just looks better 150 00:18:07,88 --> 00:18:14,49 and I like the other thing that I am interested in like visually a sculpture with my instruments I'm interested in 151 00:18:14,53 --> 00:18:23,37 making them look like. Kind of like. Like. 152 00:18:24,91 --> 00:18:31,31 You know as if they were invented you know in the early one thousand nine hundred nine hundred twenty S. 153 00:18:31,32 --> 00:18:35,25 Like I'm interested in connecting robotic music with. 154 00:18:36,47 --> 00:18:43,19 You know like traditional like Victorian robotic music which is play or pianos and Calliope's 155 00:18:43,20 --> 00:18:48,81 and I'm interested in being connected to that because I feel like there's a lot there you know 156 00:18:48,82 --> 00:18:56,83 and there's a composer Coleman man kero I really like you he created crazy music for player pianos 157 00:18:56,84 --> 00:19:00,09 and punched his own cards punches on scrolls and 158 00:19:00,92 --> 00:19:06,42 and I think that that technology is really fascinating I also think that it really like many 159 00:19:06,43 --> 00:19:17,00 and robotic music currently does is completely derivative of that so I enjoy going back to that and sort of. 160 00:19:18,03 --> 00:19:29,76 Kind of thinking about various technologies that got overwritten by say like recorded music for example like actually 161 00:19:29,82 --> 00:19:35,85 you know recorded music like turn tape in and vinyl and and thinking about. 162 00:19:37,69 --> 00:19:42,61 You know taking that those I electromagnetism to resonate metal 163 00:19:43,34 --> 00:19:50,22 and you know that idea which was you know like a hymn Holt's resonator which was a very early design used used 164 00:19:50,23 --> 00:19:53,90 electromagnets to resonate pitchforks and so I took that idea 165 00:19:54,26 --> 00:20:00,46 and I created this instrument called the tiny organ which is twenty some. Thing. 166 00:20:01,65 --> 00:20:09,12 Magnets that are resonating tying mounted to a sound board and I'm able to. Create. 167 00:20:10,30 --> 00:20:18,32 Twenty whatever software oscillators to resonate those times through an Arduino But you know back then 168 00:20:18,33 --> 00:20:27,00 but I could have been done then which I think is fascinating in that you can know that sort of lost technology kind of 169 00:20:27,01 --> 00:20:27,89 repurposing it. 170 00:20:29,25 --> 00:20:35,28 It's almost like it's kind of you know it's very it's very safe Ah it's like a parallel universe it's like as if the 171 00:20:35,29 --> 00:20:43,13 limbs you know as if they had a bird never happened you know we would have blimps Yeah yeah. There's a great arts. 172 00:20:44,26 --> 00:20:49,48 Group sort of. In Los Angeles that imagines that the blimp. 173 00:20:51,06 --> 00:20:56,46 Became or is as popular as the blimp used to be which is really not them. 174 00:20:57,55 --> 00:21:03,38 And I sort of think about the world especially in Los Angeles where everyone says in traffic over time. There's. 175 00:21:04,42 --> 00:21:09,07 I have to look at the name of the author but through this really enjoying the solution. 176 00:21:10,13 --> 00:21:17,40 The closer you get the center of the galaxy physics will actually change and its rules so it operated so 177 00:21:17,54 --> 00:21:23,12 and then the galaxy was constantly or the universe I guess I don't think you know measure is here but 178 00:21:23,65 --> 00:21:28,01 but it would sort of almost like the way that a plane S. 179 00:21:28,02 --> 00:21:33,72 To fly through weather systems and avoid things there would be like these systems higher 180 00:21:33,73 --> 00:21:40,41 or lower says six so if you were traveling you know spacecraft that could do you know five thousand times the speed of 181 00:21:40,42 --> 00:21:40,72 late 182 00:21:41,10 --> 00:21:47,00 and you actually hit one of these pockets that you would be slowed way down that it would take you you know generations 183 00:21:47,01 --> 00:21:54,09 to travel through this sort of piece of weather oh my god altered the physics. Make of it what you. 184 00:21:55,27 --> 00:21:59,21 Know that I'm That's interesting I mean it's interesting that we now think of time. 185 00:22:00,45 --> 00:22:09,09 As something that you could manipulate because I don't know if pre-industrial pre-industrial revolution that concept 186 00:22:09,10 --> 00:22:16,14 existed and they definitely know my day job as an animator and I'm constantly working with timelines 187 00:22:16,15 --> 00:22:21,32 and I come home I compose music on the computer with piano roll digital piano rolls and. 188 00:22:22,43 --> 00:22:27,68 Working with a timeline and I can you know reverse go back when I write 189 00:22:28,17 --> 00:22:32,62 when I write music I always write the ending first and then I go back in the one write the intro 190 00:22:32,63 --> 00:22:37,53 and then I write the middle and I think about time forwards and backwards. 191 00:22:38,98 --> 00:22:45,72 And I think that's And it's interesting that especially as an animator you really think about time you know in small 192 00:22:45,73 --> 00:22:52,21 increments fractions of seconds and so any plot it over a graph and over. 193 00:22:53,33 --> 00:23:01,35 The timeline and so that that idea is really interesting I mean I guess I guess music composition is that 194 00:23:01,54 --> 00:23:07,35 and that's when the way it's been you know that may have been one of the first kind of stabs at it no era Yeah. 195 00:23:08,49 --> 00:23:14,30 Definitely. But it's interesting now that. It feels like. 196 00:23:16,22 --> 00:23:25,50 That idea is really in Green Yeah actually like filmmaking you know like substance. Yeah. 197 00:23:26,52 --> 00:23:27,84 I guess really with that whole thing it. 198 00:23:29,18 --> 00:23:34,12 And I'm just remembering a sort of particular book so you know perhaps it was there to correct me 199 00:23:34,13 --> 00:23:42,31 but my understanding is it supposedly invented it where he was the first There's So if this train is traveling from New 200 00:23:42,32 --> 00:23:46,01 York to Los Angeles you don't have to actually show it travel the whole way. 201 00:23:47,84 --> 00:23:52,84 Go Oh shit you know like get the idea that you have been cut out ninety nine percent of that journey 202 00:23:52,99 --> 00:23:59,00 and then get more impactful results for leaving things right it's funny to think of that it's kind of like thinking 203 00:23:59,01 --> 00:24:06,01 about perspective is. Technology that was. Yeah and so weak so. 204 00:24:07,37 --> 00:24:14,01 Writing that train you would just like falsely not the idea like Well I think the idea was that if you were going to 205 00:24:14,02 --> 00:24:19,46 try to depict say you were going to pick someone driving a car from point A to Point B. Going to Sichuan even it. 206 00:24:20,62 --> 00:24:22,09 Before heading to New T. 207 00:24:22,10 --> 00:24:28,30 Was an established idea it was being used still makers you would think well I'm never getting clued 208 00:24:28,95 --> 00:24:30,61 and now he's just making assumptions here 209 00:24:30,62 --> 00:24:35,40 but I think the idea would be you would stick to their lives that all happen in real time. 210 00:24:36,73 --> 00:24:42,32 To show something that didn't happen in real time would be really boring because you have to capture all of it right so 211 00:24:42,93 --> 00:24:51,31 the realizing that the audience could understands what on its face appears to be just a leap forward you know. 212 00:24:52,40 --> 00:24:58,29 They would understand this sort of storytelling shorthands Yeah it's to be regarded as an actual accomplishment as 213 00:24:58,30 --> 00:25:05,39 opposed to just something that exists in the second themselves I wonder if that happened ever happened in like. 214 00:25:06,44 --> 00:25:13,57 Drama like Peter I mean I know that time you know yeah most of it 215 00:25:13,58 --> 00:25:20,20 but you make a good point this film takes all of its its cues pretty much from the theater so I wonder Yeah I mean can 216 00:25:20,21 --> 00:25:26,31 you think of sort of classic see it or where they do that or is it really just here's a scene 217 00:25:26,63 --> 00:25:32,67 and then here's I mean there's you know I mean I guess even in like literature you're you're going from you know 218 00:25:32,82 --> 00:25:38,48 there's time that's missing so it's not a it couldn't be and it can be a completely new idea 219 00:25:38,49 --> 00:25:49,18 but I think maybe what's new about the timeline that is the play head need the fact that you can really screw up the 220 00:25:49,19 --> 00:25:59,75 play head you can go back to this time and. Do this maybe our brains are a little bit more fine tuned to time. 221 00:26:00,56 --> 00:26:06,42 In a way that is different I'm guessing. And you know I know and you. 222 00:26:07,76 --> 00:26:13,45 Oh I just know I mean what makes me think about that is that over the past ten years. 223 00:26:14,85 --> 00:26:19,90 You know only television plots have been come insanely complicated. 224 00:26:21,10 --> 00:26:27,53 To the to the point where I actually can't keep up with a lot of when I watch on T.V. 225 00:26:27,54 --> 00:26:37,02 I can't oh are we watching back or. I mean so that's you know that's something and like how. 226 00:26:38,17 --> 00:26:48,26 That pre-human Taylor mentioned Inception which is like now a shorthand almost in the popular of a cabaret Larry for 227 00:26:48,27 --> 00:26:51,97 that kind of idea of like reality working time warping. 228 00:26:53,34 --> 00:26:55,80 Kind of thing and I told him I'd only ever seen half the film 229 00:26:55,81 --> 00:26:59,71 and I fell asleep so I don't really ever know kind of how washed up until 230 00:26:59,72 --> 00:27:04,36 or sort of said like well you've you've seen the whole thing. You know. 231 00:27:05,67 --> 00:27:11,34 I mean I can't remember it well it's a there's twisters I think recently reply all. 232 00:27:14,15 --> 00:27:20,18 Anarchy it is at this point that if anything is certain it's so referential that recursive in any way just say oh it's 233 00:27:20,19 --> 00:27:23,93 like the inception you know. It's a big. 234 00:27:27,87 --> 00:27:34,02 Read we should really talk about these Let's do it discussions great we should get on to Shela shall we get sick that 235 00:27:34,03 --> 00:27:43,90 recession started Yeah tended to want to go first yes so the challenge the challenge isn't just a Federico is shit 236 00:27:44,82 --> 00:27:53,75 and you know established really loosely I think he sort of flesh a little bit more of its own tools thanks to so if you 237 00:27:53,76 --> 00:28:00,66 guys want to take a look we're trying ourselves a new technology this week where everyone's going to create. So. 238 00:28:13,66 --> 00:28:28,93 I'm seeing a C. and C. Stuff I'm seeing C. and C. Frames. I'm seeing a. Computer in a closet. Oh yeah OK cool on. 239 00:28:32,79 --> 00:28:44,62 The computer in the closet that's the last image is just right now I'm trying. So. From the washing machine the first. 240 00:28:45,92 --> 00:28:55,23 Photo is looks like there's. That what would you call that like some support sort of screwed down. 241 00:28:56,35 --> 00:29:08,54 Yes some Why would brain yeah I wanted to. India and definitely a scene see. I'm seeing the paper the piece of paper. 242 00:29:09,83 --> 00:29:23,41 I guess. And I've got a video. Ideas. Since the videos are always captivating. I'm going to turn them. 243 00:29:25,57 --> 00:29:28,76 Oh OK so it just seems it out two channels 244 00:29:28,77 --> 00:29:37,68 and now there's a photo of two blocks of wood with many many clamps on them so it seems like there's two pieces at 245 00:29:37,69 --> 00:29:39,95 least sandwiched together. 246 00:29:41,33 --> 00:29:47,43 Maybe gluing them together or just holding them together for some purpose and we can see the C.N.C. 247 00:29:48,33 --> 00:29:59,95 Has done quite a bit of work. Oh. Wow So it looks like there's a lot of sandwich later this. 248 00:30:00,64 --> 00:30:07,07 Or remove the layers it's hard to know if it's like the one the bit passes if that's the stuff layer that's removed 249 00:30:07,08 --> 00:30:21,78 layer OK yeah and this is so. Cool. But looks to be. How there's some leather. 250 00:30:23,21 --> 00:30:31,60 And yes yes I love the rolls of leather and I'm guessing that going to make a guess that you've made a form. 251 00:30:34,24 --> 00:30:38,24 To make something with the other that's what I got X. 252 00:30:38,99 --> 00:30:44,40 Yeah so let me begin to get some expert on it so call it work 253 00:30:44,41 --> 00:30:49,71 and this is actually a project it's going in for a longer period of time with Peter Kirkland He's a local Chicago. 254 00:30:51,38 --> 00:30:57,86 Or it clothing designer. Slip my answer saying fashion insider maybe listening right. 255 00:30:58,89 --> 00:31:04,57 As well he's driving out to work on yet another fantastic presents a danger stay awake. 256 00:31:06,25 --> 00:31:11,84 Pressure So yes so there are a number of jigs involved in this process 257 00:31:11,85 --> 00:31:18,27 and it was this week I was trying to think about what I was going to do as I was standing above all these jigs making 258 00:31:18,28 --> 00:31:18,44 them. 259 00:31:19,52 --> 00:31:25,93 And so I just started recording this thing I was working on so the first thing are these strips of wood that you screw 260 00:31:25,94 --> 00:31:30,11 down on the bit of a C.N.C. Table and then if you reset the X. 261 00:31:30,12 --> 00:31:36,05 Was Ciro the bit to be a little bit into the negative territory of wood 262 00:31:36,69 --> 00:31:40,24 and then cause the bit just to go straight up straight to the right 263 00:31:40,68 --> 00:31:46,52 but you can effectively do this make yourself stop so that when you put rectangular blocks on the C.N.C. 264 00:31:46,53 --> 00:31:50,92 Table you know for certain that the lower left hand corner is set X. Y. Is zero. 265 00:31:52,53 --> 00:31:58,50 So that's a way that you don't have to be really really careful about how the black gets placed on the table because 266 00:31:58,51 --> 00:31:59,98 it's sort of made this jig. 267 00:32:01,21 --> 00:32:08,26 For placement in there's also an image you guys talked about where there's a piece of paper under the end mill 268 00:32:08,79 --> 00:32:13,27 and this is a funny example of running you know this hundred thousand dollar machine 269 00:32:13,28 --> 00:32:19,92 but then I guess you're trying to determine where Caesar who is right so how far the bit is away from the material for 270 00:32:19,93 --> 00:32:23,06 it equally You just wind of sticking a piece of paper under it 271 00:32:23,14 --> 00:32:30,04 and then you tell it to reset it Ciro if you can't move the paper anymore since this really expensive device 272 00:32:30,05 --> 00:32:33,48 and this ultra cheap and probably not all that accurate with Syria. 273 00:32:34,93 --> 00:32:39,64 He has how many mil thick is a piece of paper all right exactly so depending on. 274 00:32:40,95 --> 00:32:49,54 The tightness of the tolerances you're looking for you can get this little brass builds shape that you stick on top of 275 00:32:49,55 --> 00:32:50,76 your wood pile 276 00:32:50,87 --> 00:32:56,57 and then select really connected to the bits of the bit just comes down to the slowly until it touches Oh my god then 277 00:32:56,58 --> 00:33:00,41 it would it would add that the exact thickness of the billet 278 00:33:00,56 --> 00:33:08,40 and know where the surfaces while there are something it would use get a pretty close that's cool Yes I mentioned stock 279 00:33:08,98 --> 00:33:13,41 two big pieces that needed to be thicker to account for a screw down 280 00:33:13,75 --> 00:33:21,71 and then these were made into a super mold some working with Peter to make a computer bag so he designs things 281 00:33:21,72 --> 00:33:24,93 and leather and was interested in looking at molding felts 282 00:33:24,97 --> 00:33:30,87 and molding leather so we're going to take these two halves and compress the sheet of Celts 283 00:33:31,38 --> 00:33:36,04 and you say you wet it compress it and then let it through and of course this is something that's worth it to 284 00:33:36,87 --> 00:33:41,64 and so that's to make the pockets for the pay and then also jests Yesterday we went. 285 00:33:42,80 --> 00:33:51,49 And entire house had aft cowhide at the local place in Chicago so we're going to be building nothing else for the 286 00:33:51,50 --> 00:33:59,77 projects not for some of the chicks. And then as a bonus cast so many nice you have the tube. 287 00:34:00,51 --> 00:34:09,27 The two blocks are roughly what like a foot by eight inches from about. Maybe a little bit wider Yeah Tenet said. 288 00:34:10,35 --> 00:34:16,98 You get it. And then the two so the two pieces so there's. 289 00:34:18,36 --> 00:34:24,39 Sort of almost like garlic press or something right like you put the leather in between the two pieces 290 00:34:24,40 --> 00:34:26,61 and then you do what the leather 291 00:34:27,07 --> 00:34:33,15 or do you to smash it so leather I think that's the second thing so we've already done this once for soaps 292 00:34:33,19 --> 00:34:37,84 and it works really well where you just put it in there where you mashed together 293 00:34:37,85 --> 00:34:45,12 and let it dry in that form OK I think the issues for the leather by understanding the letters are in reckoning. 294 00:34:47,04 --> 00:34:52,54 And so that will resist taking water so we need to figure out this a get steamed 295 00:34:52,55 --> 00:34:59,39 and then if the thing is the heater in the sun not sure exactly it is doable steamiest Yeah that's cool 296 00:34:59,40 --> 00:35:01,88 and then the two pieces that you made on the scene see. 297 00:35:03,01 --> 00:35:08,05 You show a sort of side view photo I kind of been in profile of the two pieces 298 00:35:08,06 --> 00:35:12,15 and I was curious is did the two pieces fit together perfectly 299 00:35:12,16 --> 00:35:18,41 or did you create them with that gap knowing that like a piece of material would run between them right so yeah I made 300 00:35:18,42 --> 00:35:21,34 it specifically with the three hundred sixty four skip isn't. 301 00:35:22,71 --> 00:35:26,81 So they were doing that's cool so you can't there's nothing. 302 00:35:28,47 --> 00:35:34,16 Setting that apart so you can't push them together until some of the surfaces it if you if it's not exactly. 303 00:35:35,58 --> 00:35:37,47 Right right that's cool. 304 00:35:38,81 --> 00:35:46,06 Do you know what that the it looks like to sort of hunks of Michael giant pieces of chocolate you know yeah I thinking 305 00:35:46,07 --> 00:35:56,56 it's almost like modern the modern dog bowl yarn. I mean you know there's nothing stopping me from doing that what's. 306 00:35:58,04 --> 00:36:08,08 There. And since it's the rich I think you just made a millionaire I mean the Eames dog. 307 00:36:10,64 --> 00:36:18,78 Man like the modernist dog life that's kind of that's going to happen. You know if you are really very messy. 308 00:36:21,46 --> 00:36:22,69 When you can you know it's you know I think. 309 00:36:23,89 --> 00:36:32,00 If it's interesting because I'm new to see and see a night there's one around the shop they work up. I don't see. 310 00:36:33,33 --> 00:36:37,42 Like you know when you when you first see something like a laser. 311 00:36:38,65 --> 00:36:39,59 Thing you know 312 00:36:39,60 --> 00:36:50,24 or like a three printed thing it's like wow that is so cool just so you know it's like the contours of the wood you 313 00:36:50,25 --> 00:36:53,21 know the edges are so clean and. 314 00:36:54,46 --> 00:37:00,53 So I'm I'm taken by that imagery currently that's why I'm talking about modern Yeah yeah me too 315 00:37:01,26 --> 00:37:06,16 and I think it is the new modernism right like OK to me like 316 00:37:06,23 --> 00:37:11,38 when I look at the house furniture I have to imagine that just looking at furniture that look like that was very 317 00:37:11,39 --> 00:37:20,41 captivating you know dislike look at that like spread the cylindrical pillow or whatever like Ana Ana on a lounger 318 00:37:20,84 --> 00:37:23,01 and now to see sort of. 319 00:37:24,58 --> 00:37:32,31 A newer school version of this like just like manufacturing technique that makes things look really different you know. 320 00:37:35,67 --> 00:37:37,44 Maybe it is going that way. 321 00:37:38,81 --> 00:37:47,69 So you know I really kind of instead of mold really put a lot of effort into it being an attractive thing that's never 322 00:37:47,70 --> 00:37:56,38 going to touch the audience. Which is another. The potential stumbling block a lot of people have this and if there. 323 00:37:57,91 --> 00:37:59,98 Is you know here are all sorts of students you know. 324 00:38:00,01 --> 00:38:03,05 Many professionals to carve something in the sea and sea 325 00:38:03,06 --> 00:38:09,49 and then realize oh if I make the step small enough to get this thing going to the science surface it's going to take 326 00:38:09,50 --> 00:38:13,91 you know a thousand hours for the thing to cut it so then they reduce their step over 327 00:38:13,92 --> 00:38:17,10 and leave a bunch of scale of thing in the wood and they say well I like it that way. 328 00:38:18,46 --> 00:38:20,05 And park itself into it 329 00:38:20,06 --> 00:38:26,48 and so I think there are some missed that acts that are not widely recognized yet at the just being they see 330 00:38:27,02 --> 00:38:35,80 and that a lot of people are trying to sort of passive. Intentional choices. If the if the other place in Chicago. 331 00:38:37,16 --> 00:38:40,91 Yet is a half an S.T.D. or With the name what is it's it's not a. 332 00:38:43,11 --> 00:38:50,29 And individual facing an organization so it is what we call is a business relationship with them yeah it was created we 333 00:38:50,30 --> 00:38:52,00 got back into the show and. 334 00:38:53,64 --> 00:38:59,46 They just said you know the smell was really impressive and it was definitely a working shop 335 00:38:59,47 --> 00:39:04,72 and it was not set up to receive visitors which made it that much greater That's cool yeah sure 336 00:39:04,79 --> 00:39:10,57 and aren't these local counts. That I do not know. If you're a bit. 337 00:39:12,15 --> 00:39:21,22 Able Now I know that is definitely and see that scene as his wife Jill have sort of that's where C.Z. 338 00:39:21,23 --> 00:39:27,63 Makes sort of artist sham and she had started now it's just making him for friends 339 00:39:28,07 --> 00:39:31,09 and then at some point like we're going to hold water 340 00:39:31,10 --> 00:39:34,97 or something a camera what was it that there is somebody called in 341 00:39:34,98 --> 00:39:37,31 and said oh you know can we get like a thousand of these and we. 342 00:39:38,50 --> 00:39:39,06 Just make it up 343 00:39:39,68 --> 00:39:46,34 and thirty of them during Christmas for friends so these kids they're really into the slow weave ments of making 344 00:39:46,35 --> 00:39:49,47 individual objects and you know crafting stuffs 345 00:39:49,51 --> 00:39:55,85 and then that is what the open questions is how far down that rabbit hole that you fall asleep because it can get 346 00:39:56,18 --> 00:40:00,56 ridiculous to the point where you just can't make enough things to satisfy. Anymore. 347 00:40:01,82 --> 00:40:07,03 Interest also tell me that some guy he was reading about isn't it the guy that makes the ship. 348 00:40:09,48 --> 00:40:18,53 That's like this one you would think it is the computer that takes. Months to get each of these things manufactured. 349 00:40:19,61 --> 00:40:26,20 You know only only that week if. Chinese plastic is. 350 00:40:27,80 --> 00:40:33,66 Our credit since there's a stick it's things I need to show that maybe yes maybe we can convince William Gibson listen 351 00:40:33,67 --> 00:40:40,05 to our podcast now that we've talked very slow slow manufacturing processes have advocates that have a advocacy 352 00:40:40,25 --> 00:40:43,13 abacuses about it I love yeah I love that. 353 00:40:45,08 --> 00:40:50,83 Anywhere now that it's like regrettably retail you know they're like OK I guess you can come in like a I totally love 354 00:40:50,84 --> 00:40:57,55 because we've kind of fetishizing the retail experience at this point like the Apple Store sort of redefined Apple in 355 00:40:57,56 --> 00:40:58,47 general dislike. 356 00:40:59,70 --> 00:41:05,81 Like it has made or the retail experience and it's nice to go in a place for dislike I guess you can come in. 357 00:41:07,36 --> 00:41:16,89 You know it's it's all about experiences every every kind of purchasing seems like outside of the Internet every kind 358 00:41:16,90 --> 00:41:23,19 of purchasing time that you have. Your hands can. 359 00:41:25,37 --> 00:41:29,95 I got a new router for my house and like opening up you would think like there was like some sort of. 360 00:41:31,55 --> 00:41:40,48 Tiffany lamp or something and it's like I'm going to last. That you're going to just. Go. 361 00:41:41,91 --> 00:41:46,11 I want to I'm getting started and I'm learning in addition to learning three D. 362 00:41:46,12 --> 00:41:54,21 Printing right now I'm also going to start backing forming I'm interested in vacuum forming. 363 00:41:56,52 --> 00:42:07,02 Acrylic sheets as I don't know how they. I'm hoping to get to. You know sixty Maybe a and I don't know we'll see. 364 00:42:08,83 --> 00:42:17,33 And so I made myself a little starter vacuum former And this is totally not my idea I just. 365 00:42:19,31 --> 00:42:24,66 Googled backing farmers and this guy made one with a toaster oven 366 00:42:24,67 --> 00:42:32,03 and so I was like OK I'll make one with the post haven't and having like very little free time. 367 00:42:33,44 --> 00:42:42,85 These days I decided I was just going to laser cut one really quick so laser cut it back in former box 368 00:42:43,66 --> 00:42:48,16 and I'm in a couple different frame. And I have not tested it yet. 369 00:42:49,29 --> 00:43:01,46 My vacuum is full of dust so I've got to clean it first and then I run a test. But why I'm doing it is partly because. 370 00:43:02,50 --> 00:43:08,56 I keep thinking about I'm constantly thinking about bubbles and like. 371 00:43:10,16 --> 00:43:20,41 Contain spaces I'm constantly coming up with images of. Ideas in vol my own fascination with. 372 00:43:21,75 --> 00:43:32,46 Vacuum chambers and in encapsulated space. I collect relays and the guys do enough but I just love mechanical relays. 373 00:43:35,26 --> 00:43:37,32 And I have another one that's like. 374 00:43:38,50 --> 00:43:43,43 It's some kind of road it's some kind of mechanical sequencer switch that rotates 375 00:43:43,44 --> 00:43:50,10 and clicks little switches almost like a music box but it's switching mechanism 376 00:43:50,14 --> 00:43:59,98 and it's a very it's a like a larger relay that I really enjoy looking at. So I want to make some sculptures. 377 00:44:00,06 --> 00:44:07,29 That are that sort of investigate fascination with encapsulated spaces. 378 00:44:09,37 --> 00:44:17,78 TAYLOR Do you remember the professor of the artist to Joe care member whose last name is very old is than sculpture 379 00:44:18,27 --> 00:44:25,63 shows something. Maybe. You should read or to. 380 00:44:29,67 --> 00:44:35,40 I'm not sure he was like oh he made you know I know he made kinetic art you did puppetry. 381 00:44:37,52 --> 00:44:38,73 Term his last name 382 00:44:38,74 --> 00:44:45,46 but anyway he said something I had him as an advisor so I feel embarrassed like your members last name really cool guy 383 00:44:45,50 --> 00:44:48,37 and really really like interesting 384 00:44:48,38 --> 00:44:54,52 and older which it was really you know it's really nice to have kind of a friend who's older when you're younger. 385 00:44:55,74 --> 00:45:02,27 But he also you know he used to say always pay attention it was like his biggest mantra was pay attention to what you 386 00:45:02,28 --> 00:45:08,86 pay attention to and so I'm interested so when I was thinking about creating a vacuum farmer 387 00:45:08,87 --> 00:45:18,07 and creating these sort of like bubbles incased things I was trying to figure out why why am I fascinated by this 388 00:45:18,08 --> 00:45:25,71 and why are other people fascinated by this or are they and you know. In Copenhagen I went to the ark and. 389 00:45:27,64 --> 00:45:30,57 Museum and had a really amazing collection 390 00:45:31,27 --> 00:45:37,42 and there was a piece like pink bubble lamp that was I just couldn't stop looking 391 00:45:37,43 --> 00:45:42,70 and I saw all the people does not stop looking at it it was this I don't know what it was it was something it's just 392 00:45:42,77 --> 00:45:49,06 it's you know it's like a jewel it's also you know there's space in there 393 00:45:49,07 --> 00:45:56,78 and I just don't I don't really I'm still trying to comprehend what that you know desire you know it's a deal to zoo 394 00:45:56,79 --> 00:46:06,25 want that that bubble that thing. I'll send you guys that you have to be great to get a picture that it's cool. 395 00:46:07,93 --> 00:46:15,19 About the the your vacuum farmer Yes. I'm going to describe it a little bit just what I'm seeing. 396 00:46:16,60 --> 00:46:17,50 There is a toaster oven. 397 00:46:18,86 --> 00:46:20,63 It looks like a kind of mid-sized toaster oven 398 00:46:20,96 --> 00:46:27,36 and there's a wooden frame it looks like that you've created that seems like it would slot into the toaster oven it's 399 00:46:27,37 --> 00:46:39,39 like the width of the of the toaster oven creating right yes it's been there is like a laser cut sheet with like a 400 00:46:39,46 --> 00:46:46,83 grill so like there is maybe those. Oh it's oh it is about six Yeah OK yeah. 401 00:46:49,80 --> 00:46:57,92 And then you have an actual like Shop Vac back human is that right now connected to one of the side panels Yes. 402 00:47:00,05 --> 00:47:03,16 And then the inside there's a channel that sort of. 403 00:47:04,47 --> 00:47:13,32 A boy like subtracts some of the space in the side so that it focuses more on the air underneath the grill. 404 00:47:15,54 --> 00:47:22,75 You know it's just it's just a laser cut little box inside of there with the top that kind of I don't know how explain 405 00:47:22,76 --> 00:47:24,40 it it's just like a little channel 406 00:47:24,48 --> 00:47:31,58 and they're so eliminate some of the extra space you know real i'm I had made one that was more shallow 407 00:47:31,77 --> 00:47:38,83 but then I realized that I'm hitting the right trying to let down so I'm like I need to just make a bigger box 408 00:47:38,84 --> 00:47:48,94 but I don't. Deal with all that volume so I. Asked do you do you cut a hole through the toaster oven for the air hose. 409 00:47:50,23 --> 00:47:54,19 Oh no the toaster oven is just to heat the plastic on the frame. 410 00:47:55,54 --> 00:47:59,98 OK So you assert that you should eat into the toaster oven by itself you. 411 00:48:00,01 --> 00:48:06,43 Yeah and then you put the form on top of the grill and then you turn turn the the vacuum on 412 00:48:06,44 --> 00:48:17,92 and then you pull down over the warm and it's supposed to suck all the air and you know in case the form supposed to. 413 00:48:19,34 --> 00:48:27,59 Suck it down all over the sea so once once the acrylic sheet has become soft from the heat of the toaster oven you sort 414 00:48:27,60 --> 00:48:35,23 of pull it out almost like pulling out like almost like a beehive like like wax out of a beehive he pulled the sheet 415 00:48:35,24 --> 00:48:41,44 out and then you input it then you put it in a box and it's still kind of wavy because it's so hot 416 00:48:41,48 --> 00:48:46,49 and then you turn on the vacuum and that shapes the plastic around whatever you have 417 00:48:46,50 --> 00:48:55,25 and you pull it over the box OK OK Got it OK cool that makes sense I was I was like man you how does the hose not melt 418 00:48:55,77 --> 00:49:04,33 but but now I mean yeah yeah it's deep it's about seven inches. Box there when. 419 00:49:05,57 --> 00:49:09,72 They were in college he would spend an hour just 420 00:49:09,73 --> 00:49:15,90 and sanding it like at some point at some point he came really like he was having a lot of. 421 00:49:16,91 --> 00:49:27,67 Respiratory distress and he was getting really freaked. Out is so I just love making. Well. 422 00:49:29,62 --> 00:49:32,62 Well I you know I don't live in a big city anymore in. 423 00:49:33,79 --> 00:49:39,14 The garage I have a you know a little shop and I have lots of ventilation and nice. 424 00:49:41,97 --> 00:49:46,68 Little ations one of the things definitely that matters more that you know it's like 425 00:49:46,69 --> 00:49:52,69 when I was sixteen like I could have been bothered to like open the garage door went to spray painting my skateboard 426 00:49:52,70 --> 00:50:00,46 deck you know. How high is the vacuum former box like how big a. An object. 427 00:50:02,48 --> 00:50:06,22 It just you know if you imagine four pieces of toast that's with OK. 428 00:50:07,41 --> 00:50:11,66 So that's sort of it's just you know it's a starter vacuum warmer I want to say. 429 00:50:13,03 --> 00:50:17,24 Once again once I get cooking on this stuff you know once I get go on and I'm. 430 00:50:18,41 --> 00:50:24,32 Really good at scale that's great do you do you have any sense of what you will be making with it. 431 00:50:25,52 --> 00:50:26,80 Yeah so I want to make. 432 00:50:28,63 --> 00:50:35,25 I got an opportunity to show in a gallery that's opening up in very soon in the fall 433 00:50:35,56 --> 00:50:42,42 but probably not going to show till spring so. I had a conversation with an artist that I met New York. 434 00:50:44,58 --> 00:50:50,24 I've lacked ambition as an artist like not as to make art or good art but yeah 435 00:50:50,38 --> 00:50:54,71 and I'm just now starting to think about what what would it be like to sell art. 436 00:50:56,48 --> 00:51:00,03 And kind of like oh you know maybe if I didn't you know 437 00:51:00,28 --> 00:51:05,10 but I mean if I maybe if I sold art I could I could make some money that would be great. 438 00:51:06,22 --> 00:51:08,70 And so I started thinking and I you know asked him. 439 00:51:10,34 --> 00:51:14,44 How how do you like Why how do you make art to sell 440 00:51:14,78 --> 00:51:23,27 and he was like well I am personally very interested in what people desire and that's why where I start 441 00:51:23,85 --> 00:51:31,99 and so I thought OK I'm as an experiment I'm going to do that I'm going to make some stuff that I think is desirable 442 00:51:32,00 --> 00:51:38,22 and I think that other people might desire and sort of play with that as an experiment I guess. 443 00:51:39,37 --> 00:51:42,31 And so that's where I got started. 444 00:51:44,15 --> 00:51:51,20 But paying attention to what I pay attention to I'm very fascinated with you know like I said these sort of like 445 00:51:51,21 --> 00:51:59,98 and capture related transparent translucent spaces so I think some of the one of the themes I want to work with. 446 00:52:00,14 --> 00:52:09,32 Are or is space and geography and I think I'm going to use three D. 447 00:52:09,33 --> 00:52:20,95 Printing for some of it encapsulate maybe some small scale landscape allegory imagery. Might do some. 448 00:52:22,09 --> 00:52:27,68 Instruments like clock kind of looks sort of like clocks or relays. 449 00:52:29,89 --> 00:52:37,06 I want to try out of different I might actually reference another piece they did in grad school to tailor solaces to 450 00:52:37,07 --> 00:52:45,22 peace with as an ant farm with these sort of like encapsulated little chambers where ants were organizing garbage 451 00:52:45,23 --> 00:52:51,74 and plastic. Like I really enjoyed sort of the. 452 00:52:52,85 --> 00:52:58,30 Autonomous Jurassic elements of that was sort of like dealing with elements that were. 453 00:52:59,41 --> 00:53:07,43 As a Sara Lee of my own making just like the ants so I think I want to try a bunch of different things. 454 00:53:08,82 --> 00:53:10,05 In these little spaces 455 00:53:10,06 --> 00:53:17,90 and use the actual space to you know the idea of these bubbles to cure a these various experiments 456 00:53:17,91 --> 00:53:23,29 and some of them might be more narrative some of them might be more just sound experiments. 457 00:53:24,40 --> 00:53:28,81 Some of them I think I want to I also want to make radio transmitters and some of them 458 00:53:28,82 --> 00:53:36,53 and have them transmitting like tracks of compositions Yeah that's. Different tracks. 459 00:53:37,87 --> 00:53:46,42 Say I'm going to play with play with I I I don't it's too early to really know. If I get good at three D. 460 00:53:46,43 --> 00:53:53,89 Printing I'd like to crank out some things but I'm very green with three D. 461 00:53:53,90 --> 00:54:01,95 and I can't I can't get a very good print right now so. Yeah that's cool idea. I've always been to. 462 00:54:03,86 --> 00:54:06,19 The dying ness of radio 463 00:54:06,52 --> 00:54:15,64 and that like radio is this broadcast medium that like we have less access to I feel like like now. 464 00:54:17,14 --> 00:54:20,65 Like you could you could stream you know a radio station if you wanted but. 465 00:54:21,81 --> 00:54:27,92 On on on your desktop or browser or whatever but and I guess like maybe radio stations now have an app 466 00:54:27,93 --> 00:54:29,74 or something that you could like listen to that. 467 00:54:30,77 --> 00:54:36,36 With but I it's funny that like in a way like this mass medium is like. 468 00:54:37,54 --> 00:54:43,98 There's a certain kind of element of like it being a bespoke object that you could sort of have a radio receiver be 469 00:54:43,99 --> 00:54:47,19 this novel thing in your house that receives just. 470 00:54:48,23 --> 00:54:56,42 Just its own thing as opposed to all the things like it would be like just like making a newspaper with only your own 471 00:54:57,26 --> 00:55:02,83 work with your own story on it or something or you know in a way that like it's a mass medium 472 00:55:02,84 --> 00:55:10,73 but that somehow it gradually closing itself off just because other things have become more more of the day to day go 473 00:55:10,74 --> 00:55:17,18 to ways of getting information where with the radio I feel like it's like that it seems like there could be a situation 474 00:55:17,19 --> 00:55:25,73 where more of the channels are either just things that no one really listens to are just dead air you know like over 475 00:55:25,74 --> 00:55:32,40 time or it doesn't matter and like you just make your own thing with so like eighty nine point six or whatever 476 00:55:32,41 --> 00:55:38,71 and like that could just be the radio could just be someone's like unique way to understand a sound yeah it's like it's 477 00:55:38,72 --> 00:55:53,87 an ocean becomes an ocean literally and sonically and. Yeah yeah. That's cool. Oh yes only I still am. 478 00:55:56,62 --> 00:56:04,72 Now Rob listens to the radio and traffic in. I don't become a pod cast nerd. 479 00:56:06,95 --> 00:56:09,76 But I do listen to I have a short wave radio on my desk. 480 00:56:11,08 --> 00:56:12,33 And I listen to that 481 00:56:12,34 --> 00:56:19,56 but the problem is it slays my productivity because I become so into turning the dial like just to listen to weird 482 00:56:19,57 --> 00:56:23,89 stuff that it's not like a thing I listen to in the background because I just start. 483 00:56:25,05 --> 00:56:28,12 Tweaking the dial around and I'm like what's that what's that like. 484 00:56:29,28 --> 00:56:34,68 And there's so many weird it becomes an instrument more than it becomes a listening device like I listen to the weird 485 00:56:34,69 --> 00:56:35,60 sounds that it makes 486 00:56:35,61 --> 00:56:42,51 and make weird sounds with what I'm hearing so quickly that I've stopped it I should take it off my desk 487 00:56:42,52 --> 00:56:47,13 and I put it somewhere else like make it make like a school desk chair with a built in 488 00:56:47,14 --> 00:56:48,16 or something so I could to sit there 489 00:56:48,17 --> 00:56:55,45 and mess with it as opposed to trying to actually get something done listening to like some world radio station in the 490 00:56:55,46 --> 00:57:05,58 background. Yeah. You bad you have to get things done yes and this is. Sitting going into shortwave as much cooler. 491 00:57:06,90 --> 00:57:07,57 When the east. 492 00:57:08,94 --> 00:57:16,14 Coast is the only thing you're doing other I feel like there's something about this undertaking where it's it special 493 00:57:16,15 --> 00:57:18,48 because it's something that we're all doing around the edges. 494 00:57:19,63 --> 00:57:36,08 Every day life yeah right you know you can't spend a thousand dollars on your project. Yes. So. I was. 495 00:57:40,72 --> 00:57:41,75 I recognize this. 496 00:57:44,89 --> 00:57:52,07 Is this incredible election it would appear to be cans that were disassociated from the one nine hundred fifty S. 497 00:57:52,32 --> 00:57:58,69 Shelter they're all to me Rusty their backs are up break you know there's like hundreds of them this is your house 498 00:57:58,70 --> 00:58:04,37 right yeah there's a thousand and. Eighty of them yeah I've counted them I've sort of them into size. 499 00:58:06,57 --> 00:58:15,79 And here in this next one I am seeing a jig I'm seeing a some pokers and can. 500 00:58:18,80 --> 00:58:25,79 Older holding apparatus with those screws that look like the stick the can on their own you poke holes in. 501 00:58:27,13 --> 00:58:33,34 The head is definitely what it is yeah yeah they're fleshed out a bit there's. So. 502 00:58:34,87 --> 00:58:43,14 There's clearly illustrated spots where they can shift the acreage and what I'm trying to figure out is serious these. 503 00:58:44,47 --> 00:58:49,02 Two holes that are that distance apart. Seems to. 504 00:58:50,87 --> 00:58:59,39 Can't figure out why it's a recycle what you think is bring like this there's some oh there's a dual It's a dual spring 505 00:58:59,75 --> 00:59:08,07 actuated ogre and yes it is. It's two screwed if I had screwdrivers that I sanded down and. 506 00:59:09,50 --> 00:59:18,40 Rethink you know all they need to make holes that are spaced a specific way on each one that's right yeah so I have a 507 00:59:18,41 --> 00:59:29,93 thousand rusty tin cans that I collected from sort of abandoned landfill out in the Mojave Desert. And. 508 00:59:30,98 --> 00:59:38,56 I have always wanted to do something with these cans like make some sort of. Desert trash art object. 509 00:59:41,41 --> 00:59:46,89 Because I was like the desert is as I learned living in Southern California is an extremely fragile place it's like a 510 00:59:46,90 --> 00:59:52,90 place that is one on one hand trying to clue you in on the other hand kind of like 511 00:59:52,91 --> 00:59:59,11 when you make a mark on the desert that Mark sticks around for a really long time you know so there's a you know a lot 512 00:59:59,12 --> 00:59:59,98 of people sort of have this kind of. 513 01:00:00,01 --> 01:00:04,03 Cavalier attitude about the desert of like oh you could do anything out there and it's like you could but 514 01:00:04,50 --> 01:00:11,40 but it will define last for a long time so I was like if I want to make like desperate art which I'm pretty into like 515 01:00:11,44 --> 01:00:15,89 Can I just use materials that are already there you know because then I'm not. 516 01:00:20,06 --> 01:00:24,52 I don't know that because then it's like well it's already out there so if I add a little bit to it then I feel kind of 517 01:00:24,53 --> 01:00:30,82 OK but if I was like to go you know squeeze a bunch of construction adhesive out there I wouldn't feel great about it. 518 01:00:32,47 --> 01:00:37,56 So I've collected these cans and of course with many great art projects you have a great idea you do X. 519 01:00:37,57 --> 01:00:45,38 Amount of work that somehow resulted in a giant pile of stuff being at your house for a long time and then the Part B. 520 01:00:45,39 --> 01:00:53,19 Of doing the work hasn't yet happened so what I want to do is make a sort of giant rattlesnake rattle out of all of the 521 01:00:53,20 --> 01:00:53,81 cans. 522 01:00:54,97 --> 01:01:03,70 And I need a way to kind of stitch them together and the cans are of about eight different sizes 523 01:01:03,71 --> 01:01:05,64 but most of them have about the same width. 524 01:01:06,69 --> 01:01:14,04 And there's three main Can sizes that have the same what So I have I've sketched on to the turntable the turntable is a 525 01:01:14,08 --> 01:01:16,55 sort of thirteen and turntable almost like a record player 526 01:01:16,80 --> 01:01:19,68 and then there's like a wooden arch that spans the record player. 527 01:01:21,04 --> 01:01:27,73 With the two screwdriver sticking down through the arch as a way to like quickly poke two holes in a can 528 01:01:27,83 --> 01:01:32,34 and then move on to the next can the movement next can have a thousand of them to do. 529 01:01:37,14 --> 01:01:43,27 Yes exactly because I'm going to I want the holes to be this I have to thread. 530 01:01:44,96 --> 01:01:49,16 Like kind of natural fiber yarn string through through the cans 531 01:01:49,65 --> 01:01:56,12 and I want them to kind of hang correctly you know that kind of distantly hang like evenly hang so I need the holes to 532 01:01:56,13 --> 01:01:58,68 be in a kind of repeatable centered fashion so. 533 01:02:00,52 --> 01:02:01,24 I tested it out 534 01:02:01,25 --> 01:02:08,36 and it it does work so I'm excited about that so now I just have to punch thousand cans with holes so we'll see how 535 01:02:08,37 --> 01:02:17,57 that how are you going to mount the rattle. I think what's going to happen is I think it's going to be. 536 01:02:19,78 --> 01:02:27,81 Kind of hung from a pole so the wind I'm hoping the wind will sort of create the rattling sound. 537 01:02:30,23 --> 01:02:36,78 It won't be nearly as fast rate as like a snake rattle which is sort of based on this kind of very high speed vibration. 538 01:02:39,02 --> 01:02:47,47 But I would like it to be sort of have a kind of winch Amy like clanking sound I guess so I think yet the yarn to get 539 01:02:47,48 --> 01:02:49,02 the thread going to sort of be. 540 01:02:50,59 --> 01:02:55,72 Some of the cans actually are close on both sides which is a problem because they were sort of open with the old school 541 01:02:55,73 --> 01:03:01,26 like can puncture. Some I have to open up but I'm going to thread the thread through through one of the ends. 542 01:03:02,86 --> 01:03:06,07 So did you so did you get these cans. 543 01:03:07,62 --> 01:03:15,69 I did I spent I spent a couple afternoons in like one hundred seven degree heat filling the back of my truck with rusty 544 01:03:15,70 --> 01:03:16,23 tin cans 545 01:03:16,24 --> 01:03:21,36 and the reason why they sort of still work is the desert in the desert things rust to like a certain point there's just 546 01:03:21,37 --> 01:03:26,60 not enough rain for them for that sort of chemical reaction to keep going so there's a lot of things like a surface 547 01:03:26,61 --> 01:03:31,36 rust comic a Deseret rod car right where like it's rested on the outside 548 01:03:31,37 --> 01:03:38,80 but it's still sort of mostly structurally real. Recently just it's just there's something really interesting. 549 01:03:40,74 --> 01:03:52,19 You know or I mean. Took it away yeah sort of. Lends complexity to your. And I think. 550 01:03:56,82 --> 01:03:59,95 There's which has really gotten more cans out there which is. 551 01:04:00,04 --> 01:04:05,28 It's kind of like which is kind of good and I had thought of I wanted to do it on site 552 01:04:05,32 --> 01:04:13,39 but it's it's a little bit of a precarious place that's somewhat It's kind of heavily monitored it's by a solar. 553 01:04:16,36 --> 01:04:18,20 Power Plant and. 554 01:04:20,43 --> 01:04:26,59 There's definitely lots of kind of white contractor contracted security trucks that drive by and stuff 555 01:04:27,57 --> 01:04:30,53 and they thought you know oh this is weird this guy's plane cans of the desert. 556 01:04:32,31 --> 01:04:34,81 But I thought if I was doing something obviously arty 557 01:04:34,82 --> 01:04:39,90 or strange out there they would give me grief so I was like well take the cans out 558 01:04:39,94 --> 01:04:53,83 and then return them in its final form. Yeah. Yeah thank you. Yes. 559 01:04:58,14 --> 01:05:06,08 I had a real hard time like because I made a horrible mistake which is I was like a jig jig What will I make 560 01:05:06,24 --> 01:05:09,76 and it's like that's not actually how you make it. Actually yeah. 561 01:05:10,87 --> 01:05:15,23 Yeah you make a jig through doing something else and then realizing that you needed to great and then. 562 01:05:16,26 --> 01:05:21,02 Not the other way around and so I got like I spent days just looking online at people's jigs 563 01:05:21,03 --> 01:05:25,14 and there are many amazing once you know. But. 564 01:05:26,53 --> 01:05:29,37 And like I would get some ideas that I would fail and it's maybes and fail 565 01:05:29,38 --> 01:05:37,92 and I was like oh I have this giant problem I need to solve these giant bag plastic bags of tin cans I need to deal 566 01:05:37,93 --> 01:05:42,21 with so and I need some way to process thousand of them without. 567 01:05:44,38 --> 01:05:48,37 To Mass experience it without like to see you know working your your face off. 568 01:05:50,30 --> 01:05:54,39 Sanding something down or sort of doing each one by hand and needed a faster way to do it 569 01:05:54,43 --> 01:06:06,16 and I was like oh that's what it is for. Well. Already ready to. Do it with an issue and we are. Just. 570 01:06:10,18 --> 01:06:14,24 A couple things came to mind. You me just give you one. 571 01:06:15,65 --> 01:06:19,11 I mean if you want to talk about multiples that's fine but it's ultimately up to you you. 572 01:06:20,24 --> 01:06:33,16 Know one of the things that I was thinking about is. And this is a little more like. Abstract I guess. 573 01:06:34,28 --> 01:06:40,52 One of the things I was thinking about is design the design versus art and. 574 01:06:42,56 --> 01:06:50,23 How Design and I work you have been working in the design industry for quite a while and it's all about. 575 01:06:51,35 --> 01:07:01,40 Solving problems. That is the goal to solve problems. And then I think OK so. Maybe Art is about. 576 01:07:02,92 --> 01:07:09,68 Problems and probably. Doesn't want to idea is to create a problem. 577 01:07:11,83 --> 01:07:16,38 I think it's kind of on the other one if you if you want a little something a little more. 578 01:07:17,65 --> 01:07:23,77 Tangible The other thing I was thinking about a storage that's because partly because. 579 01:07:25,02 --> 01:07:36,07 Space is such an issue right now and. Population explosion housing bubbles. Cost of Living. 580 01:07:37,22 --> 01:07:47,50 You know refugees it's all about how about get off my lawn it's all about. You know. The story is my other is my other. 581 01:07:49,87 --> 01:07:59,98 The other thing that I would. Love. What are you going to yeah I don't know I was going to let you guys. Do. 582 01:08:00,32 --> 01:08:03,98 Yeah you know we can pick so you can you can pick. 583 01:08:06,38 --> 01:08:26,24 All right so I first want I say create a problem is that right if you create a song from the second one is storage OK. 584 01:08:14,26 --> 01:08:28,42 story. Storage solutions. I mean storage solution is a little more maker E. Design E. I don't know if that's. 585 01:08:30,68 --> 01:08:38,81 Your guess but I also like the idea I like the idea of subverting you know the design thinking yeah. 586 01:08:41,25 --> 01:08:49,44 And so the problem solving with me problem so I think I would personally be interested in that one. Yes me. 587 01:08:52,66 --> 01:08:55,53 I think it was cool there are lots of really good if you said it like. 588 01:08:57,98 --> 01:09:03,14 Do you want to do that would you like to be called to be create a problem our problem creating or. 589 01:09:04,66 --> 01:09:05,96 Problem making problem. 590 01:09:12,78 --> 01:09:20,20 That we're just you know thinking oh well I don't know making problem it creating problems of the interest this is. 591 01:09:22,34 --> 01:09:23,90 Creating problems like yeah. 592 01:09:25,74 --> 01:09:31,76 You can find photos of her finish projects at our projects site called Project stuff opposable Pod Cast dot com We'll 593 01:09:31,77 --> 01:09:33,88 have Matt stealers and my project there. 594 01:09:35,18 --> 01:09:38,76 Will also have links to show notes where we post other stuff 595 01:09:38,77 --> 01:09:43,43 and we also now have an Instagram account called posable underscore podcast 596 01:09:43,68 --> 01:09:44,92 and we've been posting lots of cool stuff 597 01:09:44,93 --> 01:09:51,72 and spam accounts so please check that out you can listen to episodes directly on opposable Pod Cast dot com You can 598 01:09:51,73 --> 01:09:55,01 also subscribe to opposable thumbs with i Tunes overcast ature 599 01:09:55,46 --> 01:10:00,89 and all the other platforms there's also a cool new one I just. I was checking out. 600 01:10:01,98 --> 01:10:05,95 Called breaker Yeah the pipes codebreaker 601 01:10:05,96 --> 01:10:11,41 and like you can see other people are listening to it I mean I think a lot of things that people do a podcast is tell 602 01:10:11,42 --> 01:10:13,55 their friends or other people about what they're listening to 603 01:10:13,90 --> 01:10:16,73 and I like that this app has has those things already built in. 604 01:10:18,65 --> 01:10:19,31 If you're listening 605 01:10:19,32 --> 01:10:25,12 and you would like an opposable thumb sticker we can get you one just share a podcast episode on social media rate us 606 01:10:25,13 --> 01:10:29,90 on i Tunes or since smoke signals or do some other cool thing let people know about the pod cast 607 01:10:29,91 --> 01:10:32,89 and let us know about it and will mail you a sticker so. 608 01:10:34,21 --> 01:10:37,56 You can send us your address and like a screenshot or whatever it is. 609 01:10:39,28 --> 01:10:43,84 To opposable podcast at GMO dot com or to sup on social media or something 610 01:10:43,85 --> 01:10:46,77 and we will look at your sticker so please let people know about the show 611 01:10:47,14 --> 01:10:52,08 and we would love to send you a sticker in the mail. Easy to. 612 01:10:54,90 --> 01:11:02,53 Can also hit us up on patriotic patron dot com slash opposable thumbs we would like to thank Nick our latest Patriots 613 01:11:02,79 --> 01:11:08,74 Bonser Thank you Nic Nic has now joined the League of Patron supporter of bad asses 614 01:11:08,75 --> 01:11:15,10 and we would like to see you join as well if you can we have three sponsorship here is there you can check out anything 615 01:11:15,11 --> 01:11:16,20 you can do and it really helps 616 01:11:16,21 --> 01:11:21,75 and it's you can even donate like literally two dollars a month so that would really be great. 617 01:11:22,90 --> 01:11:29,83 We would like to think wolf mask our logo design or if you get a sticker from us you'll have a mass great. 618 01:11:31,23 --> 01:11:34,78 Neon wrestlers logo in your very hands. 619 01:11:36,53 --> 01:11:41,29 We do have a code of conduct on the site our podcast is dedicated to providing harassment free experience for everyone 620 01:11:41,97 --> 01:11:43,06 regardless of race gender 621 01:11:43,07 --> 01:11:49,41 or age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject matter or religion 622 01:11:49,45 --> 01:11:52,55 or lack thereof we actually support an inclusive environment 623 01:11:52,59 --> 01:11:59,98 and we want you to be a part of it you can check out our full code of conduct over at our site. Do you have any links. 624 01:12:00,23 --> 01:12:02,91 Anything that you want to share that you think people would be into. 625 01:12:04,24 --> 01:12:14,98 You can access all of my current work well aberrations my blog. Current recordings and video. Audio recordings. 626 01:12:16,31 --> 01:12:28,81 At my website. His eye is amazing there's a really great picture of ants on your site. That that project was the. 627 01:12:29,86 --> 01:12:35,86 You made at ant farm is that right yeah. Yeah I wanted to make something that. 628 01:12:37,98 --> 01:12:45,04 I was sort of interested in alchemy and kind of using and throwing elements together and what do you get when you 629 01:12:45,35 --> 01:12:49,06 when you do this this and this was the ideas they would you get 630 01:12:49,07 --> 01:12:54,75 when you mix plastic which doesn't compose with an initial process of. Dirt. 631 01:12:56,49 --> 01:13:06,25 And then kind of creating this landscape allegory from this generative narrative I guess I'm. Long duration from that. 632 01:13:07,91 --> 01:13:14,50 Can we see what the ants did with the plastic like it is there they they created their own little infrastructure around 633 01:13:14,51 --> 01:13:19,74 and made it the best they could with it that's what we have something to learn from that. 634 01:13:20,88 --> 01:13:26,83 Thanks so much for being out it's really great to hear what you're up to your work is super cool everyone should go 635 01:13:26,98 --> 01:13:28,17 check out your site for sure. 636 01:13:31,43 --> 01:13:36,49 Do you do you tour at all these days or do you do you plan shows in the future 637 01:13:36,50 --> 01:13:43,70 and why should people look out I don't I don't tour like I used to as a rock musician Yeah right you can to go city to 638 01:13:43,71 --> 01:13:50,65 city right I make trips so do a performance and say Houston and then come back 639 01:13:50,66 --> 01:13:53,82 and then fly out so I flew out to Copenhagen 640 01:13:54,31 --> 01:13:59,98 and did a performance there that's not to say that I won't go in the future Right right. 641 01:14:00,53 --> 01:14:03,12 And I usually when I do you soar the U.S. 642 01:14:03,38 --> 01:14:11,72 I always do best in the West because it will probably come down to your neck of the woods how cool that I saw you last 643 01:14:11,73 --> 01:14:17,01 that machine project you know was there few years ago OK so yeah yeah 644 01:14:17,02 --> 01:14:20,21 when I played it yeah that was definitely one of the more. 645 01:14:21,36 --> 01:14:28,20 Yeah that was a super super project is a great place for your work to I think it's really great Yeah so yeah folks if 646 01:14:28,21 --> 01:14:33,32 you see Matthew Sankey's name appearing in your entertainment look entertainment newspaper 647 01:14:33,33 --> 01:14:37,62 or some like that definitely go it's an amazing experience his work. 648 01:14:38,87 --> 01:14:44,17 Changed how I think about kind of robotic music in a lot of ways there's a very sort of aesthetic you see wrapped 649 01:14:44,18 --> 01:14:45,92 around automated music 650 01:14:45,93 --> 01:14:52,34 and that kind of blew the doors off of that in my head it was really great so thanks so much for being on the podcast 651 01:14:52,35 --> 01:15:01,35 and we're excited to see other stuff and we will be digging into your topic creating problems. Thank you yeah thanks. 652 01:15:18,72 --> 01:15:34,86 Also have one of those W K R P boom mic stands. Everybody recording right. Now. If you care P. 653 01:15:34,87 --> 01:15:36,57 Is difficult to make it look at. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:16,21 --> 00:00:22,22 Wow OK so it's awesome to have you on Great to be here yes thank you I mean I've listened to. 2 00:00:23,48 --> 00:00:30,90 Simple for a super long time and and it was like definitely like I was like those are people I know and stuff 3 00:00:30,91 --> 00:00:39,39 and like they're doing a podcast so cool to have I don't know it's like yeah you know like you know the feeling is 4 00:00:39,40 --> 00:00:46,53 mutual I've been enjoying opposable thumbs to Oh thanks yeah I mean you guys have such a interesting well we should 5 00:00:46,54 --> 00:00:48,31 start because I have questions for. 6 00:00:50,80 --> 00:00:54,47 Welcome to the opposable thumbs podcast opposable thumbs is a podcast where Taylor 7 00:00:54,48 --> 00:00:59,27 and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks and we talk about our accomplishments failures 8 00:00:59,28 --> 00:01:05,78 and lessons learned the route simple podcast you know Eric Knutson and Kelly Klein our guest this week Welcome Eric 9 00:01:05,79 --> 00:01:11,06 and Kelly here that all Robin Taylor Yeah I think I think having a song you. 10 00:01:12,28 --> 00:01:16,57 Know for before yeah this article this is cool I need to say for something. 11 00:01:18,58 --> 00:01:23,57 My name is Robert Jack the checks are safer My name is not used to he. 12 00:01:25,72 --> 00:01:30,85 Run a very small exoskeleton Artspace in Los Angeles and hosted a frequent art openings and events 13 00:01:31,11 --> 00:01:36,05 and I'm an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 14 00:01:37,32 --> 00:01:40,76 So you would hope concerned I'm based in Chicago or I'm an artist 15 00:01:40,77 --> 00:01:45,67 and educator DHEA way engineer a noted tall person he is kind of. 16 00:01:46,75 --> 00:01:53,66 Well we're both tall people too so there's a zero You mean yeah so you got a quote here way out number Well you know my 17 00:01:54,03 --> 00:01:59,98 this is a little on the side but my parents met in a club for tall people but we talk about that one. 18 00:02:00,01 --> 00:02:07,25 One of the club again it was called the tip toppers you know not to be confused with the Mile High Club of Denver 19 00:02:07,26 --> 00:02:12,14 but you know anyways it's all going to water there be a good bar for tall people. 20 00:02:13,33 --> 00:02:21,97 So so well what do you guys ringing in it let's do stats real quick oh yeah oh dear while we're at it I'm sixty two 21 00:02:21,98 --> 00:02:29,29 Kelly I'm a mere five ten you know five ten is decent My mom's ten. 22 00:02:30,98 --> 00:02:36,62 I think of that is sort of a minimum height for people although my wife's only like. Is she. 23 00:02:37,65 --> 00:02:40,71 I understand that because I think I'm normal height 24 00:02:40,72 --> 00:02:45,82 and people who are telling me are tall people who are shorter than me are short like I'm the standard by which all 25 00:02:45,83 --> 00:02:54,89 things are judged you're in the club. TAYLOR How tall are you six four X. Four S. 26 00:02:55,54 --> 00:02:58,12 Who's the I'm forgetting the actor's name 27 00:02:58,13 --> 00:03:04,08 but it's somebody you know it's recruit six five in your first in a cell for the circus tall so I think I'm just just 28 00:03:04,09 --> 00:03:11,55 at the edge of the circus to all I'm only five nine and a half. And half counts darn it. 29 00:03:13,06 --> 00:03:19,54 You do a very point see here though that point here that helps I don't notice that Taylor is tall we're both huggers 30 00:03:19,55 --> 00:03:20,69 We're from the Midwest and so we. 31 00:03:23,40 --> 00:03:29,35 And I notice that Taylor is very tall when it when he hugs me because he has to like a really stupid over me 32 00:03:29,39 --> 00:03:30,66 and I was like oh it's so cute. 33 00:03:32,33 --> 00:03:36,93 When I was teaching or rather when I was working a terrible job in the Midwest I was walking around in 34 00:03:36,94 --> 00:03:42,77 and undershirt because I didn't know any better at work in this young woman who's very short 35 00:03:43,26 --> 00:03:49,05 and wearing sort of the classic Midwestern makeup she was walking in front of me but then forgot something 36 00:03:49,06 --> 00:03:54,66 and turned around and did this face plant right in my chest and left behind a sort of shroud of Turin. 37 00:03:56,93 --> 00:03:58,62 And can't make up I wish to pick. 38 00:04:00,35 --> 00:04:01,83 We interrupted you guys on your 39 00:04:01,87 --> 00:04:10,20 or we I interrupt you so please finish off your self introductions well so Eric Knutson and Kelly Coyne here 40 00:04:10,21 --> 00:04:17,12 and we are route simple which is a blog and podcast and publishing empire correct Oh yeah. 41 00:04:21,10 --> 00:04:28,33 So how to tie it to stuff now too low tech home tech as we like to say the first thing I'm noticing because I have a 42 00:04:28,34 --> 00:04:34,14 little catching up to do given that you're in episode one zero five two I have it right that's right well it's one 43 00:04:34,15 --> 00:04:39,34 hundred five and are you measuring these like hotel guest rooms where it's actually just the fifth episode 44 00:04:39,35 --> 00:04:44,52 or is it literally is it really one hundred five episodes because we're really excited that weren't right 45 00:04:44,53 --> 00:04:49,78 and well that's where you made it past the critical three so that means we're going to keep going you know 46 00:04:49,79 --> 00:04:56,26 and you know if that's those are accurately measured cast you know I don't know how it happens it's just they just add 47 00:04:56,27 --> 00:04:57,26 up they add up. 48 00:04:59,21 --> 00:05:08,90 So I Erica we met as I remember this in a window over Utah that is correct yeah it was at the Center for land use 49 00:05:08,91 --> 00:05:12,11 interpretations residents center 50 00:05:12,12 --> 00:05:19,20 but we were not residents at the time somehow we had just converged there at the same time well if I remember correctly 51 00:05:19,21 --> 00:05:25,81 you were welding a very impressive tower there yeah Deborah Stratmann 52 00:05:25,82 --> 00:05:31,40 and I way that exactly yeah yeah yeah you know that and the tower is still up and up 53 00:05:31,41 --> 00:05:35,85 and going which is great whenever it's like a proving ground for our I may begin this wrong 54 00:05:35,89 --> 00:05:41,13 but you were definitely a cohort in this action there was that many there are many targets. 55 00:05:42,35 --> 00:05:48,59 Because the target Oh it's hard to believe that it's going to go see him right that's right Steve Raul 56 00:05:48,60 --> 00:05:54,13 and I you know go ahead that's right that's right Bessie it was yeah thank you thank you and it was 57 00:05:54,48 --> 00:05:59,98 and the targets were so amazing. Because I remember. 58 00:06:00,20 --> 00:06:05,54 The ones that I thought were so just I mean there were many that were great like this is kind of tragic 59 00:06:05,55 --> 00:06:07,31 but you know like Saddam Hussein 60 00:06:07,32 --> 00:06:13,01 and like different kind of infamous characters right that you you know people want to shoot which is horrible 61 00:06:13,16 --> 00:06:19,98 and weird but interesting but then there was these targets that were like police test targets 62 00:06:20,88 --> 00:06:27,69 and they were meant to make you kind of second guess yourself so like you could there was like a paper a V.C.R. 63 00:06:28,07 --> 00:06:34,30 You know like other things and you could you could make it like the person who has like the ski mask 64 00:06:34,31 --> 00:06:37,45 but they're they're not holding a gun they're holding a B.C.R. 65 00:06:37,97 --> 00:06:42,61 And so like you you're not supposed to shoot them because they're not armed but then like there was a pregnant woman 66 00:06:42,83 --> 00:06:45,67 and so like you could give her something to put in her hand 67 00:06:46,47 --> 00:06:50,19 and it's like well you would maybe wouldn't be inclined to shoot a pregnant woman 68 00:06:50,20 --> 00:06:56,65 but if she had like a MAC ten then you should you know like it was this really interesting like how do you create these 69 00:06:56,66 --> 00:06:57,82 sort of unexpected. 70 00:06:59,37 --> 00:07:06,49 Target scenarios anyway that I'd like is burned in my brain so much because I was just like Who are these these people 71 00:07:06,74 --> 00:07:09,78 who have this tube full of really interesting target images 72 00:07:09,79 --> 00:07:12,08 and then it now it of course it all makes sense many years later 73 00:07:12,12 --> 00:07:18,00 but you know what's funny about that is that what Matt Cooper to runs a center kind of commission Stephen I put 74 00:07:18,01 --> 00:07:29,43 together a target museum because that particular hangar is near an old World War two vintage target range so his idea 75 00:07:29,44 --> 00:07:31,00 is we should have a target museum 76 00:07:31,17 --> 00:07:37,75 and the funny thing about those targets is that I'd like to say that I curated them however I just ordered the sampler 77 00:07:37,76 --> 00:07:44,00 pack which literally of all of those including There's one that I can't remember the name of 78 00:07:44,01 --> 00:07:47,90 but it's kind of a classic one from the one nine hundred fifty S. 79 00:07:47,91 --> 00:07:54,31 That still printed over and over and over again it has a name and it's just sort of hairy dude you know and 80 00:07:54,32 --> 00:07:59,99 but yeah then there's the other ones with the add on like yeah you could add a screwdriver or A B C R R. 81 00:08:00,04 --> 00:08:10,54 Or right or a gun is a literal the addition the actual object or an image of. It was a tape on a flat you know B.C.R. 82 00:08:10,55 --> 00:08:24,78 It on right so they were great there was another Want to someone behind a couch like a really crappy seventy's clad. 83 00:08:17,82 --> 00:08:24,78 couch I remember that was a good one yep yep. Yes like oh they're behind something but they're just have a V.C.R. 84 00:08:26,82 --> 00:08:31,44 You can't shoot the burglar who's just committing like breaking and entering you know 85 00:08:31,45 --> 00:08:36,51 but if they have a gun then you're suppose and it was really you know it seems like Oh is that the intention the V.C.R. 86 00:08:36,52 --> 00:08:40,74 Wasn't random it was to indicate somebody who just burgled the place yeah 87 00:08:40,75 --> 00:08:47,97 but not not armed so you had to like make the call like oh they're not armed so I can't not like you don't get points 88 00:08:47,98 --> 00:08:50,75 for shooting unarmed person which these days doesn't seem to fly. 89 00:08:53,26 --> 00:08:55,27 The other I know this is breaking a confidence 90 00:08:55,28 --> 00:09:01,98 but that that whole thing almost ended up in the Whitney Museum has some cure Whitney came through 91 00:09:02,49 --> 00:09:05,94 and I think Matt wisely said no we've got some other stuff. 92 00:09:07,25 --> 00:09:14,43 Yeah yeah it seems like out of context it wouldn't really well you know exactly had to be it had to be there in the 93 00:09:14,44 --> 00:09:16,72 middle of which is a really extraordinary place. 94 00:09:18,12 --> 00:09:22,94 For sure anyway so I had to I just it's funny it's like when you just like you know 95 00:09:22,95 --> 00:09:27,12 when you first meet someone you don't really so many times it's at a party or something 96 00:09:27,13 --> 00:09:33,49 but for you I was like whoa whoa what is going on so anyway there's a really cool actually because I remember that 97 00:09:33,50 --> 00:09:34,78 tower came down 98 00:09:34,79 --> 00:09:42,28 and you guys were welding it back together like immediately it had to really press me because you know that the comp 99 00:09:42,29 --> 00:09:46,87 the commitment to it was really impressed reckless reckless commitment. 100 00:09:48,94 --> 00:09:55,42 And the rest I want to give a quick shout out to Macedonia which I think is our largest listening group that's 101 00:09:55,81 --> 00:10:07,17 primarily English as a first language world. Macedonia and so. Hello Macedonia Yeah. That's funny. 102 00:10:09,27 --> 00:10:16,49 You know we just hit hard before we dive in we just hit we're almost at two thousand downloads which isn't a brother 103 00:10:16,60 --> 00:10:23,82 who wasn't yet Thanks but not not per episode just just in total congratulations but yeah that's pretty nice. 104 00:10:25,01 --> 00:10:29,94 I'm going to. Read that's one thing you mean when you were running that. 105 00:10:31,18 --> 00:10:33,35 Is you would have if you would sit open hours at the gallery 106 00:10:33,36 --> 00:10:39,86 and if you talked to one person you would just talk to him for eight hours if they stayed there yeah I was I was really 107 00:10:39,87 --> 00:10:46,04 impressed that you would just think like oh I had a really good singular conversation today after that keep that with 108 00:10:46,05 --> 00:10:56,03 me. So when I think I think when I first met you both I knew. A book I believe you both worked on. 109 00:10:57,33 --> 00:10:58,79 Called as Emma 110 00:10:58,85 --> 00:11:04,82 and I I'm not missing a separate homegrown evolution the urban homestead there are been homes that yes yes oh yeah 111 00:11:04,86 --> 00:11:06,78 and and then I knew the blog. 112 00:11:07,95 --> 00:11:13,30 And then I was just like it is an empire but because in your forecast like this mall in fire. 113 00:11:14,42 --> 00:11:25,61 And I was just curious how I mean it's super infectious like what you how you both have. Found. 114 00:11:29,20 --> 00:11:31,15 Truly like a like a D.I.Y. 115 00:11:31,16 --> 00:11:41,11 Means of embracing sort of life approaches and also people that you love to hang out with 116 00:11:41,12 --> 00:11:49,54 and like like your lives feel very legible and inspiring but through but not through like a T.V. 117 00:11:49,55 --> 00:11:49,81 Show 118 00:11:49,82 --> 00:11:55,35 or something like that you know like like like just through the the means that you found successful for yourselves like 119 00:11:55,77 --> 00:11:59,98 making a book or having a blog or making your own podcast and I was just cure. 120 00:12:00,01 --> 00:12:11,83 It's how if if that was something like Did you sort of have like a connection to D.I.Y. 121 00:12:12,01 --> 00:12:18,90 Culture before you you both started doing these endeavors or is and this was sort of an extension of that 122 00:12:18,94 --> 00:12:23,80 or did you start with the book or the blog and just sort it started rolling from there 123 00:12:23,81 --> 00:12:30,74 and I was kind of curious about like Historically out how you sort of fell into sort of paving paving is maybe not a 124 00:12:30,75 --> 00:12:31,13 good word. 125 00:12:32,14 --> 00:12:41,13 For having Yes deep paving your own way Exactly yeah in through that through this kind of world well I think we both 126 00:12:41,97 --> 00:12:43,82 always done lots of D.I.Y. 127 00:12:43,83 --> 00:12:44,37 Stuff 128 00:12:44,48 --> 00:12:54,21 and it a certain point I realized that I could put it all together on a blog Oh that was survival way so yeah it was 129 00:12:54,22 --> 00:13:01,26 kind of like finding a unified field theory of all the crazy things that we like to do which by the way is actually if 130 00:13:01,27 --> 00:13:02,05 you go to the L.A. 131 00:13:02,06 --> 00:13:10,76 Central library it's all on the lower level too that's always where we are it's like wearing yeah it's fairly often too 132 00:13:11,02 --> 00:13:14,78 although kind of might have been the you know I saw you Eric was in front of the library. 133 00:13:15,84 --> 00:13:23,08 That's not funny that's likely very like yeah yeah yeah there's a kind of a level to you know lower level too that's 134 00:13:23,09 --> 00:13:27,43 where I always am which is where all the sort of how to books gardening. 135 00:13:28,67 --> 00:13:33,70 Woodworking and some sciences down there cooking that kind of stuff 136 00:13:33,92 --> 00:13:40,36 and that's that kind of sums up a lot of Kelly in our mutual interests I think it goes way back I mean I think 137 00:13:40,37 --> 00:13:46,11 especially for Eric Eric lost his mother this year very sadly she was ninety two 138 00:13:46,49 --> 00:13:56,56 and she was an extremely crafty lady so she she did everything you know you. Were sorting through her house and. 139 00:13:58,02 --> 00:13:59,98 Sixty years of D.I.Y. Material. 140 00:14:00,60 --> 00:14:01,34 Packed in there 141 00:14:01,85 --> 00:14:07,52 and I think he inherited that from her you know I think he grew up doing things with her I didn't come from a crafty 142 00:14:07,53 --> 00:14:09,05 family I had to find that myself 143 00:14:09,06 --> 00:14:15,85 but I can certainly see a trajectory from young Eric you know your mom had you gardening growing carrots in the 144 00:14:15,86 --> 00:14:22,67 backyard you were building things you were doing your own little radio shows with your with your cassette tapes you 145 00:14:22,68 --> 00:14:30,30 know just you know I mean it's a real direct line you know tell me how you have you heard those I have not not have 146 00:14:30,31 --> 00:14:36,55 heard about them are we talking about reel to reel or Oh yes all these were we'll show you not really 147 00:14:37,17 --> 00:14:44,05 but you know every ad that from at our age every every kid had went through a period of fascination with like the 148 00:14:44,06 --> 00:14:46,84 cassette recorder I remember playing with our house that you know water 149 00:14:46,85 --> 00:14:54,04 and listening to you in the chipmunk thinking yeah but you had a reel to reel Oh yes yes but you can do it facts on 150 00:14:54,05 --> 00:14:58,40 and I think you had to reel to reels at one point you could feed one tape through to the other 151 00:14:58,84 --> 00:15:07,82 and do a man's delay right now you are like your very own Throbbing Gristle or something but. Yeah. 152 00:15:09,00 --> 00:15:16,54 Culver City is thriving Rowsell Yeah. There are a lot. Of us here. 153 00:15:18,20 --> 00:15:23,12 As a fellow person who did not I mean my dad was very crafty although I didn't grow up with him. 154 00:15:24,50 --> 00:15:30,04 And so I had to find it too so Kelly Did you have a transformative moment how did you get there if you weren't farming 155 00:15:30,05 --> 00:15:34,95 carrots as a two year old and so I you know I have to say I'm going to back pedal that I just realized I. 156 00:15:36,75 --> 00:15:44,09 My dad was was a maker you know he like to do home home improvement he was always pounding on something 157 00:15:44,10 --> 00:15:48,97 and adding something on to something else. And one hand hammer and the. 158 00:15:50,66 --> 00:15:59,98 But I wasn't encouraged to do stuff and my mom certainly is more of the retail sort of mindset so. So I often feel. 159 00:16:00,01 --> 00:16:02,18 I get about Dad I think he probably set. 160 00:16:04,95 --> 00:16:09,95 An example for me and then I had like the grandparents out of the Depression era 161 00:16:10,30 --> 00:16:14,17 and they think that generation really helps all of us. 162 00:16:15,19 --> 00:16:18,37 Of this age if you grew up with like a depression you're a grandparent 163 00:16:19,12 --> 00:16:26,17 or Eric's mom was an older mom so she could sort of bridge that as well you know they have that you know keep it fix it 164 00:16:26,21 --> 00:16:29,35 make do do it yourself like that was very much. 165 00:16:30,81 --> 00:16:35,53 That the baby boom generation did not have that my parents were boomers so. 166 00:16:36,75 --> 00:16:44,78 I learned from them too so I don't there was not a great conversion moment by any means I was always I was kind of a 167 00:16:44,82 --> 00:16:49,97 like to draw and make things all the time from the time I was little 168 00:16:50,01 --> 00:16:57,66 and I think you know it just I think it caught on fire when we moved into our own house and we for the first time had. 169 00:16:58,68 --> 00:17:06,75 Place to do things you know you can't do much you know we always tried specially early on to focus some of our writing 170 00:17:06,79 --> 00:17:13,62 and our stuff on apartment you know stuff you can do when you're in an apartment but things really took fire 171 00:17:13,63 --> 00:17:14,23 when we had. 172 00:17:15,27 --> 00:17:19,98 Our own little crack house the only thing we want you know and land 173 00:17:20,50 --> 00:17:26,70 and you know we had it was also you have to learn a lot really fast to like I got a yard full of weeds What do I plant 174 00:17:26,71 --> 00:17:31,16 what do I do how do you start a car you know I want to we've been you know baking bread 175 00:17:31,17 --> 00:17:37,95 and stuff at home in our apartment but the house was a whole like as a whole level up and I go on a limb 176 00:17:37,96 --> 00:17:45,56 and guess that the crack thing wasn't just a turn of phrase. It's pretty close to. 177 00:17:48,34 --> 00:17:55,47 What was the what's an example of what would lead you to describe it as a crick Yes Well it was more a house with 178 00:17:55,48 --> 00:18:06,71 cracks what was full of crap literally cracks everywhere. And so. The foundation crumbling. 179 00:18:08,89 --> 00:18:14,05 Had been kind of abandoned for a long time before we moved in so there were you know I remember the first time I peeked 180 00:18:14,06 --> 00:18:21,93 in the windows I saw a lizard crawling across the floor inside which I thought it was a good omen. You know definitely. 181 00:18:25,15 --> 00:18:32,39 TAYLOR How did you how did how did how did how did you get into making things I was going to ask you the same thing 182 00:18:32,40 --> 00:18:39,83 but I think. And I don't know we talked in a previous episode about making napalm. 183 00:18:41,21 --> 00:18:48,05 An arc is cook book in a really dangerous way I'm trying to think if there was like I mean I was part of a group that 184 00:18:48,06 --> 00:18:53,07 was really imaginative and so we were doing the whole Dungeons and Dragons thing and all that stuff. 185 00:18:54,51 --> 00:18:56,44 And Renaissance Faires. 186 00:18:57,82 --> 00:19:04,31 Actually that might be the place where it got started like making in retrospect you know precocious plea. 187 00:19:05,39 --> 00:19:12,30 By hank of fabric and drape it on your shoulder like a toga and then think of yourself as costume and. 188 00:19:13,59 --> 00:19:19,33 Yeah I don't know I mean it's definitely struggle for a long time without really having any sort of people to talk to 189 00:19:19,34 --> 00:19:25,97 open up that and then also never having discovered the library. Like Eric and Kelly had. 190 00:19:27,56 --> 00:19:35,17 Really to wait till the Internet showed up for a who are right but some true up well what about. I. 191 00:19:37,77 --> 00:19:45,72 So I had a grandmother who was a florist and also a hobbyist painter but like a pretty pretty good one 192 00:19:46,25 --> 00:19:52,95 but not like a fine art painter like. Someone who painted for themselves but also you know would. 193 00:19:54,26 --> 00:19:59,98 Show other people that her paintings and stuff and that I think she always encouraged just you know draw and. 194 00:20:00,01 --> 00:20:04,69 And stuff and she always had like her paints out and stuff so he would kind of get into that 195 00:20:04,70 --> 00:20:12,58 and I think she sort of in retrospect she probably put up with a lot of like child horseplay with her kind of expensive 196 00:20:12,59 --> 00:20:20,85 stuff which is to her credit very nice and then my dad is a very D.I.Y. Person but not for sort of D.I.Y. 197 00:20:20,86 --> 00:20:31,75 Reasons he's quite thrifty in Soho. And he's an accountant if you told the story he saw what he saw the area. 198 00:20:35,46 --> 00:20:36,31 I have nots. 199 00:20:38,24 --> 00:20:40,31 He was at Wright Patterson Air Force Base 200 00:20:40,32 --> 00:20:47,49 and I'll just say this really quickly is my dad is an accountant he's not prone to. 201 00:20:48,75 --> 00:21:00,11 He's prone to the pragmatic even even in its most irrational forms. And he. Yeah he he really. 202 00:21:01,27 --> 00:21:03,96 So he was a Wright Patterson Air Force Base they were for the government. 203 00:21:05,39 --> 00:21:14,60 And he really feels pretty strongly that they he saw a room. That had. 204 00:21:15,69 --> 00:21:21,00 Animal tissue listed as the its main sort of container and 205 00:21:21,61 --> 00:21:26,90 and he was like you know if if the government has aliens This is where they would be he was like it had all the 206 00:21:26,91 --> 00:21:33,53 trappings of like government contractor manages the air conditioner like like all the things you know. 207 00:21:34,75 --> 00:21:42,23 And so I kind of I believe what he saw like he doesn't say like I saw aliens you know like but he was like. 208 00:21:43,29 --> 00:21:47,75 Why why would there be why does this room exist and it 209 00:21:48,07 --> 00:21:55,71 and if it is aliens This is what this is what it would be you know like this is this would be this is exactly the set 210 00:21:55,72 --> 00:21:59,69 up that felt like someone who is a lifelong government employee This is. 211 00:22:00,01 --> 00:22:05,97 Actually how it would be it wouldn't be this like crazy room that you need to fingerprint and stuff to get into 212 00:22:05,98 --> 00:22:10,70 and Mike a Tom Cruise outfit to go see like you just walk down the hall 213 00:22:10,71 --> 00:22:17,62 and it's like a letter headed letter in a frame on the door that says don't go and yeah right right. 214 00:22:19,24 --> 00:22:21,53 So he he was a very D.I.Y. 215 00:22:21,54 --> 00:22:24,92 Person and we sort of bonded over some of that stuff 216 00:22:24,93 --> 00:22:32,78 and also I had some selfish reasons like he would start to work on the car and it would maybe not be working so well 217 00:22:33,39 --> 00:22:37,83 and he would get mad and I would end up kind of finishing working on the car for him. 218 00:22:39,04 --> 00:22:46,52 Or with him because I had like real strong reasons for wanting a functioning car like on a Friday night. And so like. 219 00:22:47,62 --> 00:22:50,59 I would like hustle to figure out like how to bleed the brakes on the car. 220 00:22:51,97 --> 00:22:53,55 And he would get mad and want to quit 221 00:22:53,59 --> 00:22:59,56 and so so I would sort of take over projects at times because I was I was into it 222 00:22:59,57 --> 00:23:01,57 and also I had sort of my own selfish reasons 223 00:23:01,74 --> 00:23:08,55 when I got no way I was going to get out so that he tricked exactly I don't know forgot I told him about paycheck 224 00:23:08,56 --> 00:23:17,22 and speaking of back houses back was just like a punk rock house you know a window Florida where many many a lot of 225 00:23:17,23 --> 00:23:23,96 innocence was lost in the offices of the Love Shack It was yeah it really was 226 00:23:24,00 --> 00:23:34,13 and almost every way I mean it was a place that we all loved but but it wasn't. You know. Yeah. Yeah. 227 00:23:38,78 --> 00:23:40,71 Yeah that was quite a place. 228 00:23:41,82 --> 00:23:51,88 Shout out to the people who survived the hey check their up they're going to Macedonia you know. Should we. 229 00:23:53,08 --> 00:23:59,95 Not projects. Push drifts too many times let's. OK so. 230 00:24:00,36 --> 00:24:05,59 I have plays on slick a little sip package for you guys 231 00:24:05,60 --> 00:24:09,85 and I'm Bill if you're eating in faster internet that I'm accustomed to. 232 00:24:11,63 --> 00:24:27,32 That will so hopefully it won't take you too long. I was. Over there it is oh yeah there it is. 233 00:24:28,33 --> 00:24:31,28 Off to turn this over to Kauai to interpret the code Yeah. 234 00:24:35,31 --> 00:24:42,15 I see how there's some descriptions in here I see beautiful soup that's always a good sign it's a really good library 235 00:24:42,38 --> 00:24:52,67 or you turn me on a beautiful soup because it's a good one. Oh. There's an Islamic poetry R.S.S. Feed. 236 00:24:55,87 --> 00:25:02,85 And it looks like you have a file called Poem dot T.X.T. With the right flag flip so you can write to it. 237 00:25:07,06 --> 00:25:18,64 It is an array and replace your placing. H.T.M.L. Breaks with maybe a line break. And I think those two men. 238 00:25:21,37 --> 00:25:25,35 OK So I think Code Yeah the code. 239 00:25:26,46 --> 00:25:34,23 Oh print the default printer so it could be that the if you guys are finding it's too much of an uphill battle let's 240 00:25:34,24 --> 00:25:39,39 bring in the visual media OK but hopefully that will give you some context for what's taking place here. 241 00:25:42,47 --> 00:25:47,00 Erica Kelley I'll let you describe the photos from start with th one here and. 242 00:25:48,33 --> 00:25:59,80 Letting you know oh wait a second no that. That's another photo so I think it was OK. You'll get to that really yeah. 243 00:26:00,36 --> 00:26:08,54 Yeah you know I should try to let that want to know your we go OK as I see a cardboard box with maybe a power supply 244 00:26:08,55 --> 00:26:16,21 or something in the bottom what that is my right Owen a some kind of board maybe a Raspberry Pi or do we know 245 00:26:16,22 --> 00:26:23,34 or something there. You got it OK you know stead of Honda keys in the background. 246 00:26:24,41 --> 00:26:28,47 OK we get you know you need to tell the brand of my storage space. 247 00:26:32,31 --> 00:26:37,58 That's a that's one hundred dollar key and I know about that So anyways don't break that sucker 248 00:26:37,92 --> 00:26:40,25 but they are used in the. 249 00:26:41,34 --> 00:26:45,37 The dealer didn't have the second key so he had us come back 250 00:26:45,38 --> 00:26:53,34 and beat him in a parking lot you know it was Long John Silver's on the cross like a drug deal you know that's one 251 00:26:53,35 --> 00:26:59,96 hundred elec Yeah yeah that's why. There's a law going to get us a box too so. 252 00:27:02,00 --> 00:27:14,17 Notable sponsorship I might go up there were. We played the video doing it. Oh nice. 253 00:27:15,44 --> 00:27:21,64 So it's a one of those like receipt on earth turning out. A. 254 00:27:22,82 --> 00:27:32,30 Islamic OH MY believe it's not right by Mario as seen in the printers mounted I think in a hole in the law getting this 255 00:27:32,31 --> 00:27:40,28 block so inside the box is still. Still there as great high so I am guessing that the Raspberry Pi is. 256 00:27:41,35 --> 00:27:44,99 Running the code which is going and getting the poems 257 00:27:45,00 --> 00:27:51,46 and printing them out on the printer no new get it for a case you know no need to use plastic 258 00:27:51,47 --> 00:27:58,94 or write just yesterday severe. Severe. You know you you write what you know yeah. 259 00:28:01,52 --> 00:28:07,15 So of course just as a reminder of the challenges creating problems that was offered by Matt Stone he 260 00:28:07,69 --> 00:28:15,11 and it he really he hit close to home on this one for me because I'm always sort of debating with my academic 261 00:28:15,12 --> 00:28:21,09 colleagues about the distance between design an art and I kind of feel like art can do it all 262 00:28:21,10 --> 00:28:23,14 and then design can do a subset of art. 263 00:28:24,54 --> 00:28:31,72 You know I mean like there's there's a certain amount of flexibility that a particular kind of designer takes away from 264 00:28:31,73 --> 00:28:32,20 them so. 265 00:28:33,78 --> 00:28:37,42 And so this where around like I was working on it 266 00:28:37,43 --> 00:28:41,36 and then at a certain point I said to myself well where's the problem and I had to kind of go back around 267 00:28:41,37 --> 00:28:49,52 and think on it so what I arrived at was you know the my average really the average Americans interaction with. 268 00:28:51,28 --> 00:28:55,70 Middle Eastern culture is you know broadly Islamic culture is just consuming oil 269 00:28:56,56 --> 00:29:01,58 and one of the only tangible things you get from that after you burn it all is that receipt 270 00:29:02,11 --> 00:29:11,94 and so here I could use the receipt as a document of my relationship to Islamic culture not as just a consumer of you 271 00:29:11,95 --> 00:29:16,90 know a natural resource little eventually be gone but as a consumer of the culture itself the actual culture. 272 00:29:18,30 --> 00:29:19,31 So this is an R.S.S. 273 00:29:19,32 --> 00:29:25,64 Feed that gives you different Islamic poets every day and then it prints on this receipt 274 00:29:25,65 --> 00:29:30,35 and you have this tangible little object that you can regard instead of just you know. 275 00:29:31,59 --> 00:29:38,05 Your telephone where you get these sort of diaphanous immaterial pieces of media that you can ignore. 276 00:29:39,07 --> 00:29:46,80 More easily than a concrete object. Yeah that's the rule there you go does it does it print a different. 277 00:29:48,19 --> 00:29:56,11 Is it a poem of the day or I was want to know about that kind of how a different poem it's printed Yes So the R.S.S. 278 00:29:56,12 --> 00:30:01,69 Feed claims to be a different poem every day although I ran it yesterday and I. The same poem so I did. 279 00:30:02,75 --> 00:30:03,45 I thought double check 280 00:30:03,46 --> 00:30:10,23 and the other thing that I haven't yet put in is the scheduling to make it just happen every day you know how you have 281 00:30:10,24 --> 00:30:14,45 this plugged in twenty four seven so that it would pick up at the right time yeah 282 00:30:14,94 --> 00:30:19,97 but there's a couple of projects that were done with the rest reply like I did some stuff looking into the. 283 00:30:21,10 --> 00:30:24,78 Bus and train predictors for the Chicago Transit Authority 284 00:30:25,38 --> 00:30:31,91 and I haven't quite gotten to the point yet where I have yeah way electronics I made myself that are just running 285 00:30:31,92 --> 00:30:33,86 twenty four seven and plugged into the wall. 286 00:30:35,71 --> 00:30:39,43 So I suppose I have to just you know take that last leap 287 00:30:39,67 --> 00:30:45,00 but I'm looking forward to trying to build more of these things where I set up challenges for myself flick I'm not 288 00:30:45,01 --> 00:30:51,99 really for poetry so that would be the second layer like not only should I confront a poem every day 289 00:30:52,00 --> 00:30:56,35 but also a poem from a culture that I hear a lot about through different portals you know 290 00:30:56,36 --> 00:31:03,29 and try to get a different perspective oh yeah it's cool yeah I mean I think it's funny like I live with a a poet you 291 00:31:03,30 --> 00:31:03,44 know 292 00:31:03,63 --> 00:31:12,68 and I didn't really honestly tell her so that yeah you know she's she said she she's sort of clowns on poetry because 293 00:31:12,93 --> 00:31:19,10 that's the only art form people can people like openly hate you know like well that in performance art performance art 294 00:31:19,11 --> 00:31:22,09 Yes Or that's true yeah performance art that's a good point yeah 295 00:31:22,58 --> 00:31:28,76 but he was because I hate poetry like they just are totally flat out like no no qualms about it were you wouldn't be 296 00:31:28,77 --> 00:31:32,58 like I hate music you know but yes 297 00:31:32,79 --> 00:31:39,77 but I do find I think the thing about poetry is is people at least I was exposed to poetry in like middle school 298 00:31:39,78 --> 00:31:47,15 or something in your sort of mix expected to just be able to understand it like there's not no one ever says like just 299 00:31:47,16 --> 00:31:53,62 take from it what you are getting from it you know like or read it ten times over the next two weeks 300 00:31:53,63 --> 00:31:59,57 and see what you think how you think about what you read changes over time or something like. 301 00:32:00,01 --> 00:32:04,98 You're just sort of it's about you look at yourself so you look with the Do you really just think like you know art is 302 00:32:04,99 --> 00:32:16,52 what you make of it. No no I mean I I mean they they had intention right like when they wrote it and I hope. 303 00:32:17,70 --> 00:32:20,21 That I understand what their intentions are 304 00:32:20,22 --> 00:32:26,22 and sometimes I don't agree I don't just enjoy it because it's art you know like like sometimes it's but 305 00:32:27,15 --> 00:32:29,02 or as I'm as I don't care for it or whatever but. 306 00:32:31,62 --> 00:32:38,28 But I do think it's important I think with poetry is that the form is asking you to not. 307 00:32:39,55 --> 00:32:42,86 To reject this idea one hundred percent comprehension you know. 308 00:32:44,22 --> 00:32:47,10 In a way that I think make people makes people uncomfortable. 309 00:32:50,30 --> 00:32:55,53 And I think that's cool but in tell your sort of understand like it's fine if I don't get it 310 00:32:56,36 --> 00:33:04,30 or don't always get it I'd always get the same thing compared to you know. It's not super pleasurable. 311 00:33:06,53 --> 00:33:07,71 All right well should we hit. 312 00:33:08,79 --> 00:33:17,62 Erik and Kelly's contributions Yeah so and so we were real this one photo of the time right so. I guess. 313 00:33:18,86 --> 00:33:30,41 So yeah the words were the Cisco on hold music. Was her. 314 00:33:33,15 --> 00:33:39,34 I love the whole music so much I will admit I listen to it at work like oh my headphones there's a there's a You Tube 315 00:33:39,55 --> 00:33:44,48 video of it on loop for a couple of minutes and it's really yes you know I found that one too. 316 00:33:46,22 --> 00:33:52,68 I have a music degree actually you know you know we're back in music school I was I actually pitched to someone I knew 317 00:33:52,69 --> 00:33:59,98 from music school maybe doing a live you know just gone hold you know like a twenty four hour live version. 318 00:34:00,92 --> 00:34:07,17 Oh wow wow right that's awesome we need to make that happen I think I uploaded something did I upload something yes I 319 00:34:07,18 --> 00:34:07,74 see. 320 00:34:08,91 --> 00:34:16,61 What appears to be a piece of paper maybe laying on cement looks like replica index card 321 00:34:17,16 --> 00:34:25,98 and then it has the word Biden's as annoying as Joe Biden. Yeah and then. 322 00:34:27,30 --> 00:34:30,31 I wouldn't know these are seeds in the next image but the 323 00:34:30,35 --> 00:34:37,82 but the title gives me the rubber you're more earthy than me to recognize what you see I would have thought it was 324 00:34:37,83 --> 00:34:40,94 worse seeds like that I've been called more earthy. 325 00:34:42,45 --> 00:34:49,49 At school oh soil and seeds yeah I will admit I'm reading the names as well but they're on top of concrete yeah. 326 00:34:50,70 --> 00:34:53,61 You know. And that soil does not look. 327 00:34:55,07 --> 00:35:02,51 It doesn't look like soil that roots simple would approve of well that's in there everything has it's been you know 328 00:35:02,52 --> 00:35:04,34 what you know what kind of soil that is. 329 00:35:05,94 --> 00:35:10,37 Or let's you know rebel and see if we can look at your eye right it looks very. 330 00:35:11,68 --> 00:35:16,25 Yellow in color it kind of reminds me of what you might get up a baseball diamond if it was wet 331 00:35:16,26 --> 00:35:22,82 and then you yeah you know you could you maybe build something into that to think about that I was a precursor of 332 00:35:22,83 --> 00:35:30,13 concrete maybe you know yeah in a way it's what you get when you dig you know the layout way but 333 00:35:30,67 --> 00:35:33,92 when you dig down here at least in L.A. A lot of parts L.A. 334 00:35:33,93 --> 00:35:41,36 That's what you we actually built an oven out of that you know oh yeah you know I can't even believe I didn't ask any 335 00:35:41,37 --> 00:35:43,27 questions about that the bread making. 336 00:35:44,31 --> 00:35:46,76 There is that yeah we'll get to that later we have to yeah 337 00:35:46,77 --> 00:35:50,99 and also it so you you is it was it a bread haven't you made with this clay 338 00:35:51,00 --> 00:35:53,81 or was it you know like a different kind of I know that was. 339 00:35:55,37 --> 00:35:59,98 We did along with Venlo sure from the Center for land used for protection Yeah. 340 00:36:01,51 --> 00:36:09,56 And my forgetting her Curt from when there was a class in our backyard to build and we talk as though here 341 00:36:09,57 --> 00:36:17,42 and that was Tom Sawyer you know right now. I see the fourth image looks to be. 342 00:36:20,36 --> 00:36:31,86 Balls of clay that I think have the seeds embedded in them. Yeah nice. Oh yeah don't go. You know but we. 343 00:36:32,98 --> 00:36:36,76 We take it we took it a little further so you got you got the first part right there 344 00:36:36,80 --> 00:36:40,95 but we're taking this one a little bit further because all sort of other than the. 345 00:36:41,98 --> 00:36:46,47 Other people have done seed bombs before so although it's only with by. 346 00:36:47,59 --> 00:36:56,07 US they will come that's what we'll talk about the Bidens in a moment. OK What's so the last image Oh yeah we go oh. 347 00:36:58,31 --> 00:37:06,34 Yeah there's a model rocket. Really you guys have some great documentation here too you are serious. 348 00:37:07,93 --> 00:37:12,15 What is it called again when you lay everything out on the table at right angles. 349 00:37:14,40 --> 00:37:22,48 You know going yes no link knowing really there's no art for you. Here Oh but it really quick it's. 350 00:37:24,08 --> 00:37:30,31 The sort of wacky fancy artists person who makes all the like space cardboard space. 351 00:37:33,92 --> 00:37:41,30 Like like a full scale Di Rama's of space stuff. I don't know how O.-O. 352 00:37:42,08 --> 00:37:52,63 Well know all I think was very you know so first used in eighty seven by a janitor is for editorship simply to me. 353 00:37:54,05 --> 00:37:57,41 Tom Sachs is host and pick up. This. 354 00:38:00,69 --> 00:38:10,93 Real You know you launched a seed rice and there's a video too that is so cool you know I'm guessing that the. 355 00:38:12,67 --> 00:38:23,25 So the nose cone separates Yes parachute Specter and see if. That is correct for you now because. 356 00:38:24,54 --> 00:38:31,86 This is a preexisting idea that your show gave me the impetus to. To launch. 357 00:38:33,14 --> 00:38:37,51 Because you know it's like right Kim Jong on those missile launches 358 00:38:37,52 --> 00:38:42,83 and I've always thought well you know I should look simple and you know our little dictator Right exactly. 359 00:38:43,85 --> 00:38:51,29 And then you remember I don't know the governor of California after the whole you know the new president that we want 360 00:38:51,30 --> 00:38:51,98 to say his name 361 00:38:52,02 --> 00:38:58,08 but you know the governor said well you know after that after the weather satellites were canceled he said well why 362 00:38:58,09 --> 00:39:02,89 don't we California is going to launch our own damn satellites and there was wild applause 363 00:39:03,37 --> 00:39:09,10 and that that was the second point is like OK Governor Brown Kim Jong un why not do it simple we need to you know we 364 00:39:09,11 --> 00:39:16,26 need to take the seed bomb idea and weaponize it in a way that is so cool so 365 00:39:16,27 --> 00:39:24,56 and I had I happen to hold on to a childhood rocket that was sitting in the garage not rocket dates to nine hundred 366 00:39:24,57 --> 00:39:26,47 seventy five or so I think. 367 00:39:27,68 --> 00:39:28,08 Crash 368 00:39:28,09 --> 00:39:34,61 and the charge that was it was it yeah it was the same it was the same yes propellant so I would that was one of the 369 00:39:34,62 --> 00:39:42,36 other things was like Would forty year old you know rocket motors still work and the answer is yes you know. 370 00:39:44,25 --> 00:39:51,60 This level is very satisfying so I will also the digging that this is taking place just in someone's driveway a little 371 00:39:51,61 --> 00:39:51,77 bit 372 00:39:51,78 --> 00:39:58,35 or are there I yeah you know I thought about I was just too lazy to go to an open field I thought I know yeah really care 373 00:39:58,36 --> 00:39:59,98 about them you know and also. 374 00:40:00,01 --> 00:40:06,36 Course we wanted the seed bomb to land somewhere right at all we thought all just two in the driveway 375 00:40:06,41 --> 00:40:12,36 and there was one witness which was a guy walking his dog he was very excited it's like you're going to want to rock it 376 00:40:12,37 --> 00:40:19,70 and I said something lame like it's an art project which made him walk away away. And then. 377 00:40:21,38 --> 00:40:27,21 So you know yeah launching the rocket was much easier than fooling with the video on my slow Mac. 378 00:40:27,22 --> 00:40:28,23 I mean the thing went up. 379 00:40:29,27 --> 00:40:37,51 You know it came down like just steps we thought it was going to catch in the palm tree right you know Carol nearly 380 00:40:37,52 --> 00:40:45,33 that but but there's a secondary charge of course in the rocket which expels the parachute and the seed 381 00:40:45,43 --> 00:40:52,39 and a payload I should say for some of gun use the word payload in regards to route simple project but yes. 382 00:40:54,95 --> 00:41:05,15 So the sea yes there is this year about right seat selection Well I should say that we launched a dummy scene seed bomb 383 00:41:05,16 --> 00:41:11,13 here just like Kim Jong on this our neighbors don't kill us these are neighbors don't kill us because that is my least 384 00:41:11,14 --> 00:41:19,02 favorite plant this year it's a plant that showed up well it's not well you know here's a love hate relationship. 385 00:41:20,11 --> 00:41:27,34 Oh you know I think we'll go back and explain the basic concept was that we were thinking about making a C. 386 00:41:27,35 --> 00:41:33,24 Bomb with weeds with weed seeds with invasive Yeah plants as opposed to. 387 00:41:35,21 --> 00:41:37,74 The prefer evil plants which are usually found in the seed. 388 00:41:39,36 --> 00:41:48,37 Although you know the originator of the seed bomb is is mass nobody who coca who was a kind of on the extreme natural 389 00:41:48,38 --> 00:41:59,91 farming kind of spectrum basically and he would just mix random touchable seeds just anything in a big. 390 00:42:00,01 --> 00:42:02,43 Bucket and then mix it with the soil 391 00:42:02,44 --> 00:42:09,79 and then toss them around you may see what he want to see what would happen he would like to just you know so chaos 392 00:42:09,80 --> 00:42:14,53 and then watch and see what happened out of the chaos usually Now 393 00:42:14,54 --> 00:42:18,08 when people makes the bombs it's a very it's a favorite activity for like. 394 00:42:19,26 --> 00:42:23,98 Kind of green green because they are actively it's what it is up from a culture trope 395 00:42:24,02 --> 00:42:30,02 but it's been carried into popular culture so you know I think probably at this point everybody's kids are making C. 396 00:42:30,03 --> 00:42:33,84 Bombs at some point you know at school or at a fair or something 397 00:42:33,85 --> 00:42:38,33 and they usually have wildflower seeds in them they're very sick very innocuous and. 398 00:42:39,40 --> 00:42:47,62 We thought it be fun to do oh did you is there an episode where you interviewed that person Yeah well we interviewed 399 00:42:47,77 --> 00:42:54,42 who quit okas translator because for Coke is no longer alive so we interviewed a guy named Larry corn who's a very very 400 00:42:54,43 --> 00:43:01,76 interesting very nice Yeah well you know link to that episode that was a couple years ago now we have Yeah yeah a while 401 00:43:01,77 --> 00:43:11,35 ago. Yeah. So the bite in seeds what what happens to well if I if I was your neighbor. 402 00:43:13,12 --> 00:43:18,26 Well well Biden's this is a plant that we had never we thought we knew are weeds 403 00:43:18,85 --> 00:43:27,61 but this is a weave that was new to us as of last summer and but we found out researching 404 00:43:27,62 --> 00:43:31,52 and identifying it that it's an incredibly common weed it's all over. 405 00:43:32,80 --> 00:43:39,89 It's from South America originally I think it's spread its little self all over the world it's a pretty plant I think 406 00:43:39,90 --> 00:43:47,27 for wheat especially it's not too big it has pretty little dark green leaves look like rose leaves 407 00:43:47,28 --> 00:43:53,25 or something along those lines. And little flowers that are either white or yellow. 408 00:43:54,63 --> 00:43:59,98 And there's actually Bidens that are grown as garden plants like different. 409 00:44:00,01 --> 00:44:02,46 And I'm from Variety different varieties OK 410 00:44:02,50 --> 00:44:08,16 but the weeds themselves are much there off what are the some of their common names like devil. 411 00:44:12,23 --> 00:44:19,77 Take something they need like they have many many common names because everybody knows what they are because they 412 00:44:19,81 --> 00:44:24,42 create these awful awful seeds that stick in your socks or your pants 413 00:44:24,43 --> 00:44:32,96 or whatever I mean they're they they deploy seeds like no other we have ever encountered thousand pounds they stick in 414 00:44:32,97 --> 00:44:38,50 your clothes and they stick in your skin the first time I met them I was I was weeding in the backyard and 415 00:44:38,87 --> 00:44:44,78 and I got I had rows of these seeds just standing upright in my arm. There. 416 00:44:45,92 --> 00:44:53,21 Bidens It's like by dental but by two to tooth by then. And so they their. 417 00:44:54,33 --> 00:45:02,20 Their seed pods look like little Sputniks they're round you know with the seeds bursting out in all directions from the 418 00:45:02,21 --> 00:45:08,11 center and they're black and skinny but at the end of every seed there are two teeth 419 00:45:08,57 --> 00:45:13,80 and those teeth are what grab onto anything else going by their little hitchhikers 420 00:45:13,81 --> 00:45:21,26 and they want to they want to take over the world so one came into our yard it was a pretty had pretty foliage it had 421 00:45:21,27 --> 00:45:25,89 little flowers we didn't know about the seeds when we first saw growing I was like that's a weed 422 00:45:26,17 --> 00:45:31,93 but so we have never seen before. Like while that it go and then as it bloomed. 423 00:45:33,40 --> 00:45:41,64 It it attracted insects like few other plants that I've seen there's like I have a top I have a top ten of you know of 424 00:45:42,31 --> 00:45:50,64 plants that pollinators love and this is on that list I've never seen except for maybe. 425 00:45:52,08 --> 00:45:59,47 Fennel has that kind of draw fennel in full flower there's just a few of them that have poppies in full flower. 426 00:46:01,32 --> 00:46:05,00 The Thistle family in full flower these things bring a lot of insects 427 00:46:05,01 --> 00:46:12,84 but the Bidens like oh my gosh like I was like well how sweet it's this innocuous weed it's it's you know it's not 428 00:46:12,85 --> 00:46:19,82 Woody you are stockier weird or oversized it's just this pretty little green plant little tiny flowers 429 00:46:19,93 --> 00:46:26,48 and all the bugs love it and I'm like well let's just let that go. And then the seeds came. 430 00:46:27,76 --> 00:46:30,37 And then we started pulling them up as fast as we could 431 00:46:30,38 --> 00:46:39,01 but it was already too late every plant creates millions of children thirty thousand thirty thousand yeah one plant we 432 00:46:39,11 --> 00:46:47,34 spent all of this spring pulling Bidens weeds just desperately out of our yard because although we'd all been impacted 433 00:46:47,41 --> 00:46:52,18 you know by the by the seeds. So of course we want to spread. 434 00:46:53,80 --> 00:46:54,50 Yeah 435 00:46:54,56 --> 00:47:00,86 but to go all stadium out of seeds like if each one was in a chair I mean thirty thousand my God So I like that it's an 436 00:47:00,87 --> 00:47:08,79 amazing really efficient beautiful plant it's useful to the you know to the natural world I'm sure I don't know what 437 00:47:08,80 --> 00:47:10,62 its properties and soil are 438 00:47:10,63 --> 00:47:17,27 but I'm sure it probably does good things for the soil it feeds the all the insects in the world 439 00:47:18,24 --> 00:47:22,70 and it's actually medicinal I looked you know I investigated a bit 440 00:47:22,71 --> 00:47:30,02 and it actually is as a herbal cure I mean it's incredibly bacterial 441 00:47:30,54 --> 00:47:38,41 and it's also a tonic for mucous membranes so it's good for many many things I've got some of it think shearing 442 00:47:38,42 --> 00:47:46,07 and alcohol where it's made this like bright green sort of elixir that if we ever get like a flesh eating virus 443 00:47:46,08 --> 00:47:49,54 or something we can pour it on our selves and I think it'll heal. 444 00:47:51,78 --> 00:47:59,78 Everything there is that it's in it might do that too yeah. But yeah we should take a picture of the tincture hoops. 445 00:48:00,66 --> 00:48:06,66 But so but Eric mean we can go back to well you know I mean we should step back 446 00:48:06,67 --> 00:48:13,35 and say we course we were responding to your last guess math years challenge to create problems because he was saying I 447 00:48:13,36 --> 00:48:18,06 remember in the podcast he was saying well he's a designer and you know it's about solving problems 448 00:48:18,07 --> 00:48:25,62 and you know our work is very much about solving problems too we unintentionally create problems all the time 449 00:48:25,66 --> 00:48:28,30 but you know intentionally creating a problem 450 00:48:28,49 --> 00:48:33,33 and you know seeds are creative so I thought it was seeds creation right so 451 00:48:33,39 --> 00:48:43,10 and problem Bidens But there's all sorts of dialogue in the plant community about invasive species versus native 452 00:48:43,11 --> 00:48:54,37 species this is a this is a contentious area very complex subject. And so. I kind of tried to get into. 453 00:48:55,71 --> 00:49:04,61 But it also is touching it is also touching on that because who's the Bidens a problem for it's not a problem for 454 00:49:04,65 --> 00:49:12,51 nature it's a problem for us some would argue it has some sort of role in this particular screwed up you know 455 00:49:12,52 --> 00:49:17,37 environment that we're in some would say others would say well no we need to get rid of it but 456 00:49:17,38 --> 00:49:21,51 when you know I mean we're you know we created a world 457 00:49:21,52 --> 00:49:26,13 and you can an urban environment where nothing is allowed to live except for the most. 458 00:49:27,51 --> 00:49:32,67 Noxious plants you know and you know and God bless them you know and they come through 459 00:49:32,79 --> 00:49:36,93 and they come through in the cracks in the sidewalk and they grow with no water 460 00:49:37,03 --> 00:49:39,50 and they grow they've been run over by the car six times. 461 00:49:40,94 --> 00:49:48,14 I admire them so much and Bidens is certainly one of those because it's so deceptive it's so sweet and innocent 462 00:49:48,88 --> 00:49:51,41 and now the sense we that I don't know how. 463 00:49:52,42 --> 00:49:58,68 I don't know why we were Bidens free for We've been in this house for almost twenty years never seen abidance before. 464 00:50:00,20 --> 00:50:05,56 It carried on something traveled hitchhiked into our neighborhood ended up in our yard. 465 00:50:07,75 --> 00:50:10,32 We were fooled by it which is wonderful. 466 00:50:11,44 --> 00:50:15,89 It was despite our weeding efforts it's spread and now I'm seeing it up 467 00:50:15,90 --> 00:50:23,02 and down the block in the neighborhood it's not too bad yet it's by no means the dominant We are neighborhood 468 00:50:23,03 --> 00:50:28,79 but I already there's a little burdens and you see one and you know thirty thousand more next. 469 00:50:31,06 --> 00:50:32,25 Maybe they'll take over 470 00:50:32,26 --> 00:50:40,52 and surely does it grow outside of California as well because everywhere I go yeah yeah oh yeah that's a great picture 471 00:50:40,53 --> 00:50:46,26 of the rocket you know every day that writes a rock regular orange that I think they have made since one thousand. 472 00:50:47,34 --> 00:50:54,47 Totally You know it really will burn to look for an orange but it was a perfect launch it was amazing you know 473 00:50:55,36 --> 00:50:59,75 and it's what like fifty feet you know exactly where they are the feet of the Jackson chair 474 00:50:59,76 --> 00:51:05,70 and went off payload deployed everything was great is this you know anything we're missing was one of those like fancy 475 00:51:05,71 --> 00:51:11,28 tracking cameras like NASA has you know when they do a launch or something I really want one of those but well. 476 00:51:12,57 --> 00:51:20,97 You know how high up it's not a huge bottle rocket as model rockets cost as Curacao high it well it was a it was a a 477 00:51:20,98 --> 00:51:23,56 six engine which I looked up I think was a six 478 00:51:23,57 --> 00:51:29,72 or eight anyway it's should have been it probably about four hundred fifty feet so you know maybe a little higher than 479 00:51:29,73 --> 00:51:35,61 the real estate agent ruins the neighborhood also has right now if you see what neighborhood in L.A. 480 00:51:35,62 --> 00:51:39,94 Are yellow and well this is we call it happy foot sad foot after the 481 00:51:39,95 --> 00:51:46,67 but I had the famous podiatrists sign some call it so relate some call it a park it depends on what mood you're in 482 00:51:46,97 --> 00:51:53,12 but we caught half of Sappho happy that's had ice. And it is a sign in L.A. 483 00:51:53,62 --> 00:51:59,98 That is a rotating sign and as I understand it as Jen describe it to me when you. 484 00:52:00,01 --> 00:52:07,07 Driving What street is that you would typically drive on to pass by sunset sunset and then you know sunset and bent 485 00:52:07,08 --> 00:52:27,24 and. Show your goods all right cool I have only four images now upload them. Sort of one one at a time. When I was. 486 00:52:31,98 --> 00:52:36,21 The first one yeah it's a good three D. Printed something or other that Roe Yeah. 487 00:52:38,26 --> 00:52:52,67 This is really a little trouble with that he should. Say that yes that is the third thing I've ever three D. 488 00:52:52,68 --> 00:53:00,59 Printed that you print that at work and here's that here's the second image. We do have a three D. 489 00:53:00,60 --> 00:53:04,32 Printed work I've never used it but I do work in that kind of place where we have a three D. 490 00:53:04,33 --> 00:53:07,06 Printer you should experience three D. 491 00:53:07,07 --> 00:53:13,46 Printing room just so we can yes just so we can tell people like I'm the office to really have a three D. Printer. 492 00:53:16,74 --> 00:53:19,23 Some tubes coming out of a house it looks like. 493 00:53:22,78 --> 00:53:26,92 You know I think I'm seeing drilled a hole through the wall of this house which I'm very excited about. 494 00:53:28,06 --> 00:53:33,84 I did I did know weatherizing of it but I guess that's so it had to go away yeah. 495 00:53:35,60 --> 00:53:40,85 I guess you know it's true and it's like our green water installation you know the whole know 496 00:53:40,86 --> 00:53:46,93 when you know yeah you know it's Wow So this is solar powered three D. 497 00:53:46,94 --> 00:53:54,25 Printing giving much away here you know that's what it is yes it is I go next year is the spoiler I guess really 498 00:53:54,26 --> 00:53:59,98 but yes so that in the second picture there's a solar panel and a battery you know what I'm assuming is some. 499 00:54:00,01 --> 00:54:06,41 That alternator way to convert what's coming out of the solar panel into usable voltage 500 00:54:06,42 --> 00:54:14,37 and amperage I've read about yeah you know that yeah yeah then the yellow box is an inverter thing in the middle is a 501 00:54:14,38 --> 00:54:19,04 charge controller so it's just sort of doing the work to make sure the battery doesn't over charge. 502 00:54:22,25 --> 00:54:26,73 The yellow boxes essentially converting twelve volts into one ten. 503 00:54:28,02 --> 00:54:33,82 There's your funky adhesion have anything to do with you know variations and voltage levels 504 00:54:33,83 --> 00:54:38,72 or is it just that's just you know the printers it's just because I don't know what I'm doing. 505 00:54:40,92 --> 00:54:46,88 I wondered that too and so I I I plugged the printer back into the. 506 00:54:47,95 --> 00:54:50,87 Record I went ten and reprint it and it looks exactly the same so. 507 00:54:52,52 --> 00:54:56,90 It looks like you're just going for the equivalent of one wall thickness on your letters 508 00:54:57,45 --> 00:55:02,16 and that's why you're having your issues yeah yeah I really just. 509 00:55:04,44 --> 00:55:12,39 Did the best I could for my first shot so so I got to. Prove I three mark two. 510 00:55:13,55 --> 00:55:26,48 So looking at that one I've always been curious about three D. Printing I never have tried it. And so I I got one and. 511 00:55:27,62 --> 00:55:36,60 Thank you Tex turned and. I but I also was a little bit like. There is a critique of three D. 512 00:55:36,61 --> 00:55:41,61 Printing that I think is valuable which is you know do you. 513 00:55:42,77 --> 00:55:46,69 It is a really interesting and cool creative tool 514 00:55:46,70 --> 00:55:57,71 but it it does in courage you to think in terms of plastic like like that you are you are making a plastic world 515 00:55:57,72 --> 00:56:02,61 and you're sort of expressing your creativity. In this sort of way that is. 516 00:56:04,48 --> 00:56:11,75 I don't show up troubled you know and so I I I decided that before I took the three D. 517 00:56:11,76 --> 00:56:14,20 Printer out of the box and put it together and stuff that I would. 518 00:56:16,07 --> 00:56:18,53 Read this thing that I had seen before 519 00:56:18,54 --> 00:56:24,30 but never kind of dug into call that added to vist manifesto Taylor you might might know those those people. 520 00:56:26,98 --> 00:56:42,70 And I thought it was pretty cool like it's it's sort of. The speculative fiction he. Video that kind of ask you to. 521 00:56:43,82 --> 00:56:49,28 To kind of push yourself out beyond what. What. 522 00:56:50,83 --> 00:56:54,58 May be lots of You Tube videos might I'm dissing You Tube here 523 00:56:54,59 --> 00:56:57,55 but like what like a lot of classic kind of uses of three D. 524 00:56:57,56 --> 00:57:02,75 Printing might might lead you to you know like like like like three D. 525 00:57:02,76 --> 00:57:09,36 Print your self a cutting board I don't know whatever you know whatever it is like like yeah it's you can change Yeah 526 00:57:09,37 --> 00:57:16,10 Yeah right yeah and so I was like well I like this thing and so they have this cookbook P.D.F. 527 00:57:16,80 --> 00:57:19,54 Called that additive this three D. Additive this cookbook. 528 00:57:20,67 --> 00:57:26,15 And there was some interesting stuff in there and there is this guy who's named Jesse Jackson. 529 00:57:27,23 --> 00:57:28,58 Not the political figure. 530 00:57:30,10 --> 00:57:37,25 Who had an article called speculative prototyping making plastic printing sustaining and playful and he has a sort of. 531 00:57:38,39 --> 00:57:43,73 Image of this person who may or may not be him like riding a bike a bicycle powered three D. 532 00:57:43,74 --> 00:57:46,74 Printer and I thought that was it was something 533 00:57:46,75 --> 00:57:52,86 and I have some I had had some spare solar parts around because I like making solar powered stuff and I was like. 534 00:57:54,02 --> 00:57:59,98 I don't propose that I'm like successfully trading my I like good in. 535 00:58:00,06 --> 00:58:08,94 Tensions of like making a solar powered thing so I kind of carbon offset my curiosity about a thing that is inherently. 536 00:58:10,36 --> 00:58:12,69 Making plastic goo in the world you know 537 00:58:12,94 --> 00:58:21,84 but like I was like it does make me want to sort of make my own additive best manifesto which that it exists and urges. 538 00:58:23,37 --> 00:58:27,57 You have to make some decisions about how you want to frame your creative work right like 539 00:58:27,90 --> 00:58:31,04 and so if you're expressing that creativity through three D. 540 00:58:31,05 --> 00:58:35,74 Printing What are your terms and I thought that was cool 541 00:58:36,19 --> 00:58:43,52 and so the firsts this this son this printed like Key Cheney admittedly looking. 542 00:58:45,06 --> 00:58:50,88 Plastic silver gob that says the word sun is the first line in my manifesto which is. 543 00:58:52,02 --> 00:58:55,41 That if I'm going to use a three D. Printer I would like it to be powered. 544 00:58:56,58 --> 00:59:03,53 In a way that is ecologically sustainable through human powered by power sun power or wind power I guess and. 545 00:59:04,69 --> 00:59:06,68 And as I get more familiar with the printer 546 00:59:06,72 --> 00:59:14,50 and do some more thinking about printing continued to build this sort of three D. Printed manifesto for three D. 547 00:59:14,51 --> 00:59:14,83 Printing. 548 00:59:16,32 --> 00:59:22,60 Now at the same time you can really go down the rabbit hole or read and try to figure out like all the trap is oil. 549 00:59:24,04 --> 00:59:28,14 That's driving that thing you know how much water was consumed and so forth 550 00:59:28,15 --> 00:59:35,57 and production of all those materials Yeah so it's an interesting question for me once you open the Pandora's Box of 551 00:59:35,58 --> 00:59:45,82 trying to account for what you have wrought. How far down do you go it's all turtles man all the way down. But. 552 00:59:47,93 --> 00:59:55,76 I don't know what do you guys make of that because it's I mean we have some bonafide people of the earth has correctly 553 00:59:55,77 --> 00:59:59,98 atoned your power situation reminds me we interviewed just. 554 01:00:00,04 --> 01:00:05,80 Really great journalist who does a magazine or a online magazine called low tech magazine. 555 01:00:06,81 --> 01:00:10,01 And I just sent you something here you know it's really fantastic 556 01:00:10,02 --> 01:00:17,19 but he took his apartment in Madrid basically off the grid doing exactly what you're doing so he you know he's a 557 01:00:17,20 --> 01:00:23,71 journalist so he only uses a laptop so yeah yeah I think he goes down and goes to sleep when the sun goes down 558 01:00:23,72 --> 01:00:28,93 or something like that anyways he just threw some solar panels out on his balcony you know 559 01:00:28,94 --> 01:00:37,05 and you know that's what he does that's cool yeah I sort of decided I didn't my panel will be placed somewhere that's I 560 01:00:37,06 --> 01:00:38,37 imagine quite a bit more efficient 561 01:00:38,38 --> 01:00:46,35 but I just I got this admittedly done yesterday so I was you know I kind of needed to just burn in for a few days 562 01:00:46,36 --> 01:00:51,89 and make sure everything's OK and then I'll move to the panel and sort of also like a weatherproof. 563 01:00:53,25 --> 01:00:55,04 Charge controller a little bit and stuff but. 564 01:00:56,89 --> 01:01:02,49 Yeah I was curious and know you're both curious people you know and and you're 565 01:01:02,50 --> 01:01:07,49 but you're also both I feel like quite thoughtful about. How. 566 01:01:08,62 --> 01:01:18,04 How I feel like a lot of your thinking is probably dedicated to like rethinking a lot of stuff in your life that was 567 01:01:18,05 --> 01:01:26,01 maybe different twenty years ago you know that you decided like I'm going to rework this thing that maybe is going to 568 01:01:26,02 --> 01:01:32,46 quote common sense or common knowledge in your life and so I was curious like how do you address 569 01:01:32,50 --> 01:01:38,38 or think about this type of thing where you're like I want to do this thing but I know it's like GROSS You know. 570 01:01:40,04 --> 01:01:46,70 Yeah and then the moment we slip up and end up in Costco totally you know I don't know how I got here. 571 01:01:48,41 --> 01:01:52,61 But you know I know exactly what you're talking about I want to do this thing 572 01:01:52,62 --> 01:01:59,95 but it involves a lot of plastic you know actually I got a SUV eat device I can still see my. 573 01:02:00,46 --> 01:02:07,51 Kelly was protesting with me because that's the same problem right it uses Can years a lot of plastic I mean sometimes 574 01:02:07,52 --> 01:02:11,75 you can use jars and things well it's an unnecessary device and it's sad to. 575 01:02:13,15 --> 01:02:13,60 Leave it 576 01:02:13,61 --> 01:02:23,65 and then as you did at the EX Yeah yeah yeah that's what they're fantastic talent to me soft yoked part well they are 577 01:02:23,66 --> 01:02:26,48 that's going to do you have it only takes three hours to. 578 01:02:28,00 --> 01:02:33,13 Go and but I must admit I've been considering building one out of a storage container. 579 01:02:34,37 --> 01:02:44,22 You know residue so you can do that yeah yeah that's true but it would kill me have you have you forgiven Eric. 580 01:02:46,79 --> 01:02:53,52 After eating something are you just like I don't know I have remained unconvinced that it's worth the just worthwhile I 581 01:02:53,53 --> 01:02:56,87 you know I mean yeah the heart the eggs are good. 582 01:02:58,27 --> 01:03:04,78 Are you looking at there you know we've done well Eric's not very often we don't eat meat often 583 01:03:04,79 --> 01:03:15,79 but I don't you know I Eric makes fish I make fish my old you know primeval way I think it's better if you fire you 584 01:03:15,80 --> 01:03:20,01 mean you know over fires a great technology and. 585 01:03:21,50 --> 01:03:25,17 We've done me I haven't seen the wonderous effects 586 01:03:25,18 --> 01:03:32,46 but maybe arcs doing it wrong I don't know I'm still like I know you know ouch I'm just like I don't know what the big 587 01:03:32,47 --> 01:03:39,45 deal is I mean I understand for restaurants that it's very convenient for them to be able to hold food you know almost 588 01:03:39,46 --> 01:03:40,94 on a temp you know 589 01:03:40,98 --> 01:03:48,57 but for the home like OK well I'm going to make dinner it'll be ready in four hours it will be you know not much 590 01:03:48,58 --> 01:03:50,50 different than you know what. 591 01:03:51,79 --> 01:03:59,98 What we would have if you know I was just allowed to fry in a pan in five minutes and just realize that. The food. 592 01:04:00,01 --> 01:04:03,81 Is in a plastic bag Yes right right Oh yes often that makes it. 593 01:04:05,91 --> 01:04:10,99 It seems like so we're always seeking updates from the people we have on the purpose 594 01:04:11,00 --> 01:04:18,71 but we need to figure out if you guys could please update us moving forward whether this situation changes. 595 01:04:19,75 --> 01:04:26,71 Based on you know yeah maybe some blog post I blogged about yeah the best thing has been the hard boiled egg yeah our 596 01:04:26,72 --> 01:04:32,02 molding software a big stew you know they're too wet I don't like the way they come out 597 01:04:32,03 --> 01:04:34,30 but I do like the way the hard boiled eggs come out 598 01:04:34,31 --> 01:04:41,30 but you can make those with I mean it's hard it's I admit that it's hard to time hard boiled eggs so that you get a 599 01:04:41,31 --> 01:04:48,96 nice soft bright yellow yolk you know and how long does it take to make the hard boiled eggs and I think it's an hour. 600 01:04:50,71 --> 01:04:50,92 And. 601 01:04:52,24 --> 01:04:59,22 I just was talking about mom about this speaking of the rumor generation where she was saying she didn't really like 602 01:04:59,23 --> 01:05:03,24 her boiled eggs and I finally found out that she always boiled hers for twenty minutes. 603 01:05:05,73 --> 01:05:11,04 Chocobo you know boy you're going to blow your mind that you were noting that she called me later I can't believe a. 604 01:05:13,69 --> 01:05:18,83 Nice trick you know so this and so forth we know that's apples and oranges 605 01:05:18,84 --> 01:05:23,52 but you know she's basing this off of a different era. 606 01:05:24,75 --> 01:05:26,56 Pathogens like yeah 607 01:05:26,57 --> 01:05:34,31 and like cookbooks full of gelatin objects aspic Oh you know hey you know oh speaking so Taylor mention this 608 01:05:34,32 --> 01:05:42,09 but we so one of the things we try to do is have people who have been on the park asked before to sort of let them be 609 01:05:42,10 --> 01:05:45,32 able to like keep keep keep it going 610 01:05:45,33 --> 01:05:53,38 and so we asked all of our previous guests if they have something coming up in the world that they would like to let 611 01:05:53,39 --> 01:05:59,94 people know about to call into a phone number and we'll will post it in the past and so we'll insert those right here. 612 01:06:00,17 --> 01:06:09,43 Bam hey this is Meghan Chan are spending the summer mostly in the great outdoors so why you know meditate on how to 613 01:06:09,44 --> 01:06:16,03 synthesize eight years about technologies like electronic eating competing with natural systems in the healing 614 01:06:16,04 --> 01:06:22,79 practices of hygiene witchery the fire got a pretty good can and a ton of bricks had collected 615 01:06:22,80 --> 01:06:29,29 but I'm sort of hitting a wall with completely understand you know wrapping my head around quite here can mix so that's 616 01:06:29,30 --> 01:06:34,81 what I'm up to you. Hated the opposable thumbs. I. 617 01:06:37,35 --> 01:06:44,63 Write this in the form trigger I just returned from a one month for this residency in Iceland it was the first person 618 01:06:44,67 --> 01:06:47,45 to pilot an underwater winter to Ruby. 619 01:06:48,79 --> 01:06:54,82 Tectonic rift between the North American and your region plates made for some really cool footage 620 01:06:54,86 --> 01:06:59,36 and I'm excited to use to consume upcoming exhibitions in Texas thanks. 621 01:07:02,33 --> 01:07:15,62 AG political Come on and I need to use the church. So I started a collection of. Parties the makers to come accounts. 622 01:07:16,75 --> 01:07:26,83 That count is called The Cat and the artist with no spaces so follow me send me your cat pictures tag me 623 01:07:27,00 --> 01:07:38,56 or you they hash tag. With no spaces. I even got a picture of Rob's cutter really think he's been. Thank you. 624 01:07:43,74 --> 01:07:52,88 Hello this is Matt and I'm currently working on a recording of my new performance place and it sounds like. 625 01:08:43,37 --> 01:08:51,48 I rather doubt this is Dan time currently working on an essay on border politics. 626 01:08:52,59 --> 01:08:59,66 And today I learned how to drive a bobcat. Yeah that's exciting to. 627 01:09:01,13 --> 01:09:13,40 Get takes right in your chair this is her I'm calling from a. Balcony. In East Berlin and you're not on. 628 01:09:14,78 --> 01:09:18,59 Kind of half a holiday half trip and. 629 01:09:20,07 --> 01:09:35,19 I haven't been here for sixteen years so up to rediscover it completely change and say. I am doing what I. 630 01:09:36,25 --> 01:09:38,80 Want to show it all on Saturday at one P.M. 631 01:09:38,81 --> 01:09:46,35 I'll be back in time for that in Chicago and I'm going to read this record night for Lent. 632 01:10:05,81 --> 01:10:12,23 Air can tell you an episode twenty we will be contacting everyone just as an update 633 01:10:12,35 --> 01:10:19,15 and we hope we will be curious about those who beat deep do you do you I feel like some blind taste test might be yeah. 634 01:10:20,48 --> 01:10:27,81 Yeah. Yeah but I understand there's more to it than just flavor. 635 01:10:29,11 --> 01:10:35,30 But is it real to you well read should we should we kept up with the biz What do you think it yeah I think we need we 636 01:10:35,31 --> 01:10:39,91 need our challenge. Right Eric and Kelly Kelly and Eric. 637 01:10:41,24 --> 01:10:48,60 Well Kelly came up with a pretty good chance so do we articulate it here fully I mean yes not sure I know rules OK yeah 638 01:10:49,46 --> 01:10:57,58 yeah so we were we were fought side by the way that the project we did was also inspired by Marshall McLuhan would call 639 01:10:57,59 --> 01:11:06,74 some of his hair brained ideas probs always thought so so this was a prose was a pro. That's what that means. 640 01:11:07,89 --> 01:11:10,51 Oh I was like What's up with the probes thing 641 01:11:10,77 --> 01:11:21,74 but I was like OK cool Well her probs so yeah I thought it was amazing Yeah Yeah Yeah well OK how does this what we 642 01:11:21,75 --> 01:11:27,93 were describing this one way because I wasn't well there it was because I wasn't sure if I like your seed idea 643 01:11:27,94 --> 01:11:35,05 or not it was exciting it's all his genius. But I couldn't think of anything better really. 644 01:11:38,59 --> 01:11:45,80 I went you know I felt like you know there's a practice that needs to be outlawed you know in speech writing 645 01:11:45,90 --> 01:11:49,48 and newspaper articles you know which is. 646 01:11:51,34 --> 01:11:59,38 Somebody somebody school paper people it happens sadly in the adult world this wealth that when there is a. 647 01:12:00,04 --> 01:12:01,23 Word in question 648 01:12:01,24 --> 01:12:07,54 and the speech starts off with someone saying Well according to Webster's Webster's Dictionary defines. 649 01:12:09,08 --> 01:12:12,02 Excellence as you know knowing 650 01:12:12,03 --> 01:12:19,09 when you hear that you just know it's going to you know you know you're on a downhill slide there. But I did it. 651 01:12:21,08 --> 01:12:25,69 Despite my lifelong rid of the practice like what is a problem and. 652 01:12:27,70 --> 01:12:30,57 It's just something that annoys me that's kind of problems 653 01:12:30,58 --> 01:12:37,09 and then there's math which is a lot like a big blank spot in my head so I'm like there's annoying things 654 01:12:37,10 --> 01:12:39,69 and then there's math problems what else. 655 01:12:41,66 --> 01:12:49,74 So of course as a noun it's the first definitions any question or matter involving doubt uncertainty 656 01:12:49,75 --> 01:12:55,80 or difficulty so that I was like oh it could have just something annoying it could be a matter that involves doubt 657 01:12:56,35 --> 01:12:59,64 and I kept playing with that like matter you know doubtful matters 658 01:12:59,84 --> 01:13:02,64 or doubt because Doubt is an interesting place to be. 659 01:13:04,11 --> 01:13:09,11 In so and lately I've been I've been reading Charles Ives 660 01:13:09,12 --> 01:13:14,54 and steins book the more beautiful world our heart knows as possible so this is really just riffing off of Eisenstein 661 01:13:14,55 --> 01:13:18,84 I'm not can take credit for this philosophically and Eric is agreeing so. 662 01:13:21,33 --> 01:13:29,88 Constructivist filmmaker it all no no no no not that isn't studying No this is a living Eisenstein wrote here also 663 01:13:29,89 --> 01:13:32,93 wrote a book called Sacred economics he's not. 664 01:13:35,00 --> 01:13:42,67 He kind of travels a different intellectual world than academic writing you know I don't even know I mean I describe as 665 01:13:42,68 --> 01:13:46,21 a totally unaware of it barely aware of academic writing. 666 01:13:47,80 --> 01:13:53,44 Because he he's not a professional anything which is why i like he's like he's like just a. 667 01:13:54,93 --> 01:14:00,42 Thought stylist Eric is a thought stylist and Eisenstein so I thought style. Really. 668 01:14:01,49 --> 01:14:05,12 So without qualifications he makes beautiful things happen. 669 01:14:06,89 --> 01:14:10,53 So the beautiful world of hearts knows it's possible it's a book. 670 01:14:12,22 --> 01:14:20,45 It's about climate change in some ways it's also it's about emotional sort of despair that we can feel being up against 671 01:14:20,46 --> 01:14:26,86 this insolvable problem and. One of the things he recommends is. 672 01:14:29,10 --> 01:14:35,62 Sitting in a state being OK with sitting in a state of unknowing or uncertainty 673 01:14:36,16 --> 01:14:42,15 or inaction like that these things are actually OK and probably preferable to action 674 01:14:42,28 --> 01:14:52,33 when the actions we have been making so far are just making things worse you know because we you know we just reiterate 675 01:14:52,88 --> 01:15:01,83 the same kinds of solutions to the things that this is how we got into you know like what is the what is that over use 676 01:15:01,84 --> 01:15:07,65 of just along with the dictionary definitions is that we're alone overused quote about. 677 01:15:08,74 --> 01:15:13,37 What is the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results. 678 01:15:14,78 --> 01:15:19,39 All right so we it's like that it's like when you when you're not getting the results you want 679 01:15:19,40 --> 01:15:23,49 and you keep doing the same kinds of things over and over again why not stop 680 01:15:23,82 --> 01:15:29,84 and be OK with being just saying I don't know. You know. 681 01:15:31,08 --> 01:15:38,33 We are our culture doesn't let us stop we're always asked to produce keep producing keep answering you know you know 682 01:15:38,34 --> 01:15:43,81 and you know activists are what the world is on fire do something now do something fast we have to do it now 683 01:15:44,14 --> 01:15:51,51 and he's like that's just not going to happen let's sit back and be in this space and there's more to it than that 684 01:15:51,52 --> 01:15:59,46 but leave it there about being in this this place of doubt so that we're the uncertainty you're working with doubt 685 01:15:59,58 --> 01:16:07,17 or doubt. Alan underneath Well uncertainty actually so I was imagining why I shouldn't say I had an idea for. 686 01:16:08,78 --> 01:16:11,49 I had an idea which I couldn't make. 687 01:16:13,60 --> 01:16:17,95 So I'll leave it to someone else to make a better maker than me 688 01:16:18,61 --> 01:16:25,92 and I need someone to make it an uncertainty generator uncertainty generator so to help us 689 01:16:25,93 --> 01:16:34,91 when we need to be uncertain and we don't know how. It's the first thing that comes to mind. 690 01:16:37,01 --> 01:16:39,49 Resonate with any of you guys when I said that I was a Dungeons 691 01:16:39,50 --> 01:16:46,73 and Dragons nerd Oh yeah you share this so I remember reading this comic strip where you guess remember 692 01:16:46,74 --> 01:16:48,79 when it was like the Pentium three processor 693 01:16:48,80 --> 01:16:53,48 or whatever it was had some kind of basic fault where it would do math wrong. 694 01:16:55,41 --> 01:17:02,11 You know so you'd ask it to do it calculation it would get it wrong by like you know fifteen decimal places out 695 01:17:02,12 --> 01:17:06,82 or whatever yeah so I'm reading this comic strip where someone had cast magic missile 696 01:17:06,86 --> 01:17:14,41 but it missed by like point zero zero zero nine the meter when this is a spell that never misses. 697 01:17:17,42 --> 01:17:21,59 I've laid myself really there. It's OK with you. 698 01:17:22,64 --> 01:17:31,29 It is that the challenge create an uncertainty generator in uncertainty generate a little kid so that generator is part 699 01:17:31,30 --> 01:17:43,04 of the challenge something that generates uncertainty. Yeah that sounds great. Oh man do it yeah yeah yeah. 700 01:17:44,24 --> 01:17:49,24 Oh oh we have what we're into an era Kelly you have some items that you've listed 701 01:17:49,25 --> 01:17:59,44 and so we're we're curious for you to tell people about them I C three items. Sure so in your lists you know we began. 702 01:18:00,01 --> 01:18:03,30 Yeah please please see I think the first one was plunger router so. 703 01:18:04,39 --> 01:18:10,48 That's your space right you know it's mine well actually was inspired by your guest Federico who we know 704 01:18:11,02 --> 01:18:17,37 and yet had a whole you know the theme was jigs is right and I guess I got to thinking like what. 705 01:18:18,43 --> 01:18:24,72 What what machine needs a Jag like Jim needs tonic right and that would be a POS router 706 01:18:24,84 --> 01:18:28,47 and own one for years never really gotten very good at it 707 01:18:28,48 --> 01:18:35,78 and I decided like I'm going to devote the whole summer to the plunger outer because I think with a plunger router you 708 01:18:35,79 --> 01:18:39,58 could save the world so that right Co is true oh yeah you can do anything. 709 01:18:41,16 --> 01:18:46,06 Absolutely could do dentistry with it if you wanted to but you know it's yeah yeah 710 01:18:46,32 --> 01:18:51,90 but no I go to the kitchen mixer tool handle totally yeah who needs any other tool 711 01:18:51,94 --> 01:18:54,28 but I just so I went down the garage 712 01:18:54,29 --> 01:19:01,23 and Kelly will test I made a more distant ten in joint that was suited to you know yeah I proudly made some decks to do 713 01:19:01,24 --> 01:19:05,98 that inspired by your show so you know that's so cool 714 01:19:06,66 --> 01:19:15,63 and then Kelly what speaking of well what's going to be well there's a low level storm in our office here because I've 715 01:19:15,64 --> 01:19:21,09 got the like I'll take care of that you're talking about the care of the well you're going to Iowa we have a puppy. 716 01:19:22,19 --> 01:19:28,72 And he was asleep for most of this conversation but he is up and he's in full force 717 01:19:28,73 --> 01:19:33,20 and he's While we've been talking I just keep like taking things out of his mouth. 718 01:19:35,00 --> 01:19:39,39 Or shoving alternately shoving other things the acceptable things into his mouth and 719 01:19:39,79 --> 01:19:46,94 but he's not really having anything of it so he's just as just as his cue came he found a box of photos 720 01:19:46,95 --> 01:19:48,08 and Eric's been sorting through. 721 01:19:49,51 --> 01:19:58,53 You know taking those away putting them somewhere high yeah he's in full rebellion he wants out of this room he is a 722 01:19:58,54 --> 01:20:06,12 Saluki and so. So you put on the list. It is. He's a Saluki which is a. 723 01:20:07,52 --> 01:20:12,84 Not a real popular dog yet they are from the originated in the Fertile Crescent 724 01:20:13,31 --> 01:20:19,60 and are some of also known as Persian greyhounds. From moving things you. 725 01:20:21,99 --> 01:20:29,10 Know this because I used to teach in southern Illinois where the Saluki was our mascot all right really so yes they are 726 01:20:29,11 --> 01:20:38,80 the mascot of yes. Yes most people do not know what a Saluki is but you people would. People from that school and. 727 01:20:40,59 --> 01:20:43,43 People from England where they're more popular 728 01:20:43,47 --> 01:20:49,34 and of course people from the Middle East know it so these are what you're doing particular kind of training with him 729 01:20:49,76 --> 01:20:55,16 yeah he's well he's a pup still he's pretty stupid in many ways but I've started doing. 730 01:20:56,60 --> 01:21:02,95 I'm really interested in dog training as general field and we're going to doing a lot of things with him 731 01:21:02,96 --> 01:21:09,86 but I've started him out with there's a little known sport called Canine knows work 732 01:21:10,72 --> 01:21:14,49 and it's based on it's based on drug sniffing protocols 733 01:21:14,58 --> 01:21:24,49 and you can teach your dog to be a drug sniffing dog essentially except they don't sniff drugs they sniff. Some like. 734 01:21:25,66 --> 01:21:29,24 This sense that are hard to. Like. 735 01:21:30,69 --> 01:21:38,25 They Birch oil or something like that so he's learning to be a scent hound even though he's a sighthound. 736 01:21:39,27 --> 01:21:47,94 And looks like you have one more week you declaring Oh declaring me kind of like because I'm going to my mom's house 737 01:21:47,95 --> 01:21:52,22 right now it's much on our mind so yeah we're definitely jettisoning stuff 738 01:21:52,33 --> 01:22:03,75 and kind of rethinking works of Marie condo sort of. The dory. Oh yeah flattering bartering. You know. 739 01:22:04,79 --> 01:22:12,31 It's interesting because like I was saying at the beginning Eric's mother was a maker with sixty years of projects 740 01:22:12,32 --> 01:22:15,22 under her belt in that house I mean she 741 01:22:15,80 --> 01:22:24,21 and she lived in that same house for sixty years so everything is packed in her everything from you know what did she 742 01:22:24,22 --> 01:22:33,13 not do leatherwork watercolors carving cords Ukranian a. Jewelry making. 743 01:22:34,61 --> 01:22:41,08 Gardening What is the Ukraine authentic Oh Ukrainians are kind of interesting it's a really anal retentive she's got 744 01:22:41,09 --> 01:22:46,51 about fifty of them now I have to figure out what to do with because each of them is a lot of hours of her work 745 01:22:46,52 --> 01:22:48,61 and I have to like give them to all her friends or something 746 01:22:48,62 --> 01:22:54,61 but they're little like wax resist sort of process hand painted a. 747 01:22:56,96 --> 01:23:04,54 Blown hard boiled eggs that you I think the process has to do with painting designs in wax 748 01:23:04,55 --> 01:23:12,95 and then dipping them over and over again so you have like a layered. Your color effect like like the teak on in. 749 01:23:16,49 --> 01:23:26,80 No you. No no no it's one takes forever for her to make you know we have a whole lot of. Yes Oh yeah everything. 750 01:23:28,52 --> 01:23:33,58 Totally threw me I don't know what oh oh oh we're we're so we're rethinking now. 751 01:23:36,06 --> 01:23:43,08 It's one of the hardest things when you when you are people who make things you are it whether you're an artist 752 01:23:43,09 --> 01:23:47,66 or a homesteader or whatever you're going to start having clutter like a lot of it 753 01:23:47,67 --> 01:23:53,73 or because you know that we are people who are like that could be useful you know either like you find something on the 754 01:23:53,74 --> 01:23:59,94 street or in the thrift store and you drag it home or you just got from it you should ever throw anything away. 755 01:24:01,12 --> 01:24:06,11 So the thing US will stack up different kinds of containers or tools 756 01:24:06,12 --> 01:24:13,24 or whatever even if you maybe you're not doing that kind of thing anymore you think you could probably go back to it so 757 01:24:13,25 --> 01:24:21,18 you still have it I have a lot of raw pigments from my temper up it's needed also use this someday probably yeah yeah 758 01:24:21,33 --> 01:24:28,84 and those cost money so I'm keeping the you know and but her life you know and 759 01:24:29,28 --> 01:24:35,31 and the cleaning up afterwards it's been a hard lesson for us you know because what did you know how many of those 760 01:24:35,32 --> 01:24:37,04 things would she ever go back to and. 761 01:24:38,08 --> 01:24:39,65 We've discussed this on the blog 762 01:24:39,66 --> 01:24:46,29 and we get mixed reactions because a lot of our readers are also hardcore makers they're like I'm not giving up my 763 01:24:46,30 --> 01:24:49,06 stuff you know take your minimalism and shove it. 764 01:24:50,11 --> 01:24:50,80 It's all right 765 01:24:51,04 --> 01:24:58,92 but we're getting to the point where it's like you know I'm going to trust the universe I can have what you know stuff 766 01:24:58,93 --> 01:25:02,27 for what we're doing on hand right now 767 01:25:02,31 --> 01:25:07,23 but I'm not going to keep stuff just in case you know not to keep such as Because it looks like maybe it has 768 01:25:07,24 --> 01:25:11,23 possibilities for the future yeah I could go out and buy another one 769 01:25:11,24 --> 01:25:19,75 or I can find we live in a culture of vast material waste and it's. Or abundance of cheap new materials you know. 770 01:25:21,21 --> 01:25:26,80 His mom had a bag full of zipper she cut zippers out of things before she threw them away. 771 01:25:29,41 --> 01:25:30,49 And so yeah yeah 772 01:25:30,61 --> 01:25:35,27 and she also had a collection of interest dippers that she'd bought in stores that she not actually used 773 01:25:35,89 --> 01:25:37,67 or many zippers there for 774 01:25:37,86 --> 01:25:44,35 and the interceptors were neat because they showed all the packaging design evolving through the through the twentieth 775 01:25:44,36 --> 01:25:48,76 century you know and the earliest slippers are like twenty five cents each and they're seventy five cents. 776 01:25:51,34 --> 01:25:53,47 And the inflation is here is that zippers. 777 01:25:55,68 --> 01:25:59,98 But you know and I was looking at them I said I try to so I'm miserable at it but I'm trying. 778 01:26:00,01 --> 01:26:05,42 To get better but I was looking at them like should take some of them zippers home with me I was like NO NO NO NO. 779 01:26:06,51 --> 01:26:08,95 No this will never going to be right 780 01:26:08,96 --> 01:26:14,08 and color the right length they will not you will just have to zippers thing around until you die 781 01:26:14,09 --> 01:26:20,07 and someone has to throw them sit for a way no. I can buy is a bigger picture of somebodies. 782 01:26:22,08 --> 01:26:27,93 I'm just picturing the Saluki for a working amongst Ukrainian. 783 01:26:33,37 --> 01:26:38,26 What you would see right now is really the look he has a bag of toys like all of his chewies 784 01:26:38,27 --> 01:26:41,17 and things I throw into a bag just to keep them off the ground 785 01:26:41,18 --> 01:26:46,93 and he's like methodically emptied the whole bag out of boredom while we've been in here so now we're in call deep into 786 01:26:46,94 --> 01:26:55,90 toys and weird stringy things. That are clutter it looks pretty bad doesn't it look like a minimalist house right here. 787 01:26:57,48 --> 01:27:03,21 You can find photos of our finished projects at our projects site called Projects that opposable Pod Cast dot com 788 01:27:03,25 --> 01:27:05,20 definitely go there so you can see Eric 789 01:27:05,21 --> 01:27:13,48 and Kelly's amazing slow mo video up there model rocket launch site where you going to get that only at projects that 790 01:27:13,49 --> 01:27:18,06 opposable Park has dot com We also have links in the show notes and will be posting. 791 01:27:20,04 --> 01:27:25,27 Project photos and other related stuff into our brand spanking new Instagram account. 792 01:27:26,60 --> 01:27:30,39 We are opposable underscore pod cast at Instagram 793 01:27:30,40 --> 01:27:36,88 and we've been getting like she like what's people sort of into it which is cool you can listen to episodes directly on 794 01:27:36,89 --> 01:27:42,45 opposable bypass that com You can also subscribe to opposable thumbs with i Tunes overcast if you're 795 01:27:42,46 --> 01:27:45,64 and other party test app platforms Oh Eric 796 01:27:45,65 --> 01:27:52,69 and Kelly I I was curious if you had any thoughts on this I have noticed that many of our listeners I think don't 797 01:27:52,73 --> 01:27:57,62 actually listen with a podcast app and just so used to in a browser Yes 798 01:27:57,63 --> 01:27:59,98 and I was wondering if that that's not actually so. 799 01:28:00,01 --> 01:28:04,85 Sounds like something you're familiar with as well yes I don't I don't understand it but I don't go there 800 01:28:04,86 --> 01:28:09,79 and yet at the computer and they they play it well there's people who are not podcasting 801 01:28:10,09 --> 01:28:16,83 but they're interested it's probably people who are not podcasts you know there's people who are podcasts Well there's 802 01:28:16,84 --> 01:28:19,78 people who are podcast users who are into podcasts like Eric 803 01:28:19,79 --> 01:28:25,66 and I you know so we both have a podcast list each of us have podcasts our phones were plugged into it half the time we 804 01:28:25,67 --> 01:28:25,76 have. 805 01:28:26,84 --> 01:28:31,23 And there's people who just ain't you know but they they know you were something 806 01:28:31,27 --> 01:28:38,68 or they've heard of this people you know so a certain number of our listeners are not podcast listeners 807 01:28:38,69 --> 01:28:49,19 but they like our podcast and so they just listen including my mom. Eric's and daddy so they Hi guys. They'll be. 808 01:28:50,40 --> 01:28:54,17 They'll be you know listening to it on their laptop or their i Pad 809 01:28:54,18 --> 01:28:57,59 or something like that because they don't want to go through the hassle they just won't. 810 01:28:58,71 --> 01:29:03,08 I mean I kind of it seems pleasurable in a way to listen to something 811 01:29:03,09 --> 01:29:08,37 when it strikes me I get a link as a I have so many pockets in my guest app. 812 01:29:09,57 --> 01:29:12,10 I mean I love to kind of poring through them and picking what I want to listen to 813 01:29:12,11 --> 01:29:14,48 but I can imagine some people just find that burdensome 814 01:29:14,49 --> 01:29:19,42 but it's interesting that you've had a similar experience so that's cool OK cool I didn't know if it was just us 815 01:29:19,43 --> 01:29:24,23 or what about twenty percent of our Yeah you know it's a little our. 816 01:29:25,42 --> 01:29:30,07 You know it's a race and having a math wall but yeah there's a number of people who. 817 01:29:31,56 --> 01:29:34,88 Who who listen online you know solely. 818 01:29:36,01 --> 01:29:44,00 Oh so we your listeners we would like to send you an opposable thumbs sticker in in trade for one thing which is 819 01:29:44,01 --> 01:29:46,95 sharing a part cast episode. 820 01:29:48,36 --> 01:29:54,55 That you like on social media or or through some other means sharing it be e-mail or whatever 821 01:29:55,12 --> 01:29:59,98 or reading us on i Tunes or sending spoke signals to your friend about my cast or some other. 822 01:30:00,04 --> 01:30:02,14 Cool thing just let people know about the podcast. 823 01:30:04,30 --> 01:30:07,69 Or can tell if I have more experience than now we do on this buy buy a lot but. 824 01:30:09,27 --> 01:30:13,85 I think for me anyway like I don't really care that much about i Tunes ratings 825 01:30:13,86 --> 01:30:17,25 but like I think it would it's more interesting 826 01:30:17,26 --> 01:30:22,48 and probably more appropriate for a party as like this to like the sort of rise so micro of people to sharing it 827 01:30:22,49 --> 01:30:25,97 because they think it's cool it's much more interesting to me 828 01:30:25,98 --> 01:30:30,77 and seems cooler way to get to know about something other than like stars 829 01:30:30,78 --> 01:30:38,22 and the i Tunes App So you know so so we would like to send you a sticker for doing that work for us. 830 01:30:39,49 --> 01:30:45,20 We do a lot to try to promote the show but you actually are a much better way to get the word out about the show 831 01:30:45,21 --> 01:30:50,50 and if you like it would be great if you let someone know about it so just let us know that you did share it 832 01:30:50,51 --> 01:30:51,34 and give us your address 833 01:30:51,35 --> 01:31:04,06 and we'll drop you a sticker in the mail there are very cool cigarettes are our very cool logo created by the artist. 834 01:31:00,10 --> 01:31:04,06 mask and you can check out his work at both Nascar dot co dot U.K. 835 01:31:05,42 --> 01:31:09,01 We'd like to give Nick a shout out as our top patron supporter Thanks Nick. 836 01:31:10,13 --> 01:31:12,66 If you'd like to join in the league of Patron support 837 01:31:12,67 --> 01:31:19,49 or bad asses please go to patron dot com slash opposable thumbs to sponsor us we have three sponsorship two years there 838 01:31:19,87 --> 01:31:29,54 you can check out some of them are very very inexpensive if you have a small pendant minority owned woman own business 839 01:31:30,30 --> 01:31:40,02 and you would like to sponsor an episode and we will be happy to talk about your thing and in exchange for money 840 01:31:40,72 --> 01:31:47,35 and we can figure that out online or whatever but it would be cheap so just give us a yell at opposable pod cast at G. 841 01:31:47,36 --> 01:31:48,00 Mail dot com 842 01:31:48,40 --> 01:31:55,33 and we'd be happy to let you sponsor one of our shows we do have a code of conduct on the podcast we're dedicated to 843 01:31:55,34 --> 01:31:59,98 providing harassment free experience for everyone regardless of race gender age sexual. 844 01:32:00,01 --> 01:32:05,12 Interaction disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject matter or religion 845 01:32:05,13 --> 01:32:09,34 or lack thereof we actively support an inclusive environment and we want you to be part of it 846 01:32:09,75 --> 01:32:12,77 and thanks for coming along on the right with us so far. 847 01:32:13,84 --> 01:32:19,72 Thanks for listening to opposable thumbs works like to have you on board we we Eric 848 01:32:19,73 --> 01:32:27,24 and Kelly can probably tested this too like we don't often hear from listeners even though like I see the listener 849 01:32:27,25 --> 01:32:33,05 number and I'm like oh that's cool that's kind of a lot of people and occasionally someone will give us a shout 850 01:32:33,06 --> 01:32:37,38 but I think it's just easy to not do that or feels weird maybe if you're listening to do it 851 01:32:37,61 --> 01:32:43,78 and I think it would just be cool to hear from people around the world who who are listening to the podcast 852 01:32:43,79 --> 01:32:44,51 and think it's neat 853 01:32:44,52 --> 01:32:52,36 and are doing cool stuff so please let us know that you existed I would be personally happy to hear that see what 854 01:32:52,37 --> 01:32:57,72 you're up to or hear from so. Anyway that's it a huge thanks to Eric and Kelly. 855 01:32:58,84 --> 01:33:05,94 Do you I'm sure you all have many interesting things that you're up to and if you have any that you want to share 856 01:33:06,21 --> 01:33:09,29 or websites that you're doing art or books stuff or whatever. 857 01:33:10,34 --> 01:33:16,36 Let us know please tell us what you're what you're doing well thanks Robin Taylor pretty much people can just go to the 858 01:33:16,37 --> 01:33:22,45 blog roots Simple dot com and they'll find some amazing there so the blog the podcast you know 859 01:33:22,46 --> 01:33:29,27 and future projects I do have a there's a guy named Stanley Ginsberg I'm hoping to get to do it right Brad class in the 860 01:33:29,28 --> 01:33:33,35 fall and that will be announced on the blog so he's an amazing Baker 861 01:33:33,36 --> 01:33:39,57 and rye expert that's the next event coming up you know that is my level Gregory that I love a bragging rights like you 862 01:33:39,58 --> 01:33:45,93 know corn bread so that's that's coming up now but you'll find out about it on roots of. 863 01:33:49,22 --> 01:33:51,69 Things like well thank you for having us. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:16,27 --> 00:00:20,43 Welcome to the opposable thumbs pod cast opposable thumbs is a pipe cast where Taylor 2 00:00:20,44 --> 00:00:24,73 and Rob tackle a new creative challenge every two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 3 00:00:24,74 --> 00:00:34,97 and lessons learned Aaron O'Brien is our guest this week Greetings Aaron Bush will show us a convulse Well actually 4 00:00:34,98 --> 00:00:42,91 because it's actually very him my name is Robert I use that he has your pronoun I run the exoskeleton arts base in Los 5 00:00:42,92 --> 00:00:45,47 Angeles which hosts very infrequent heart openings 6 00:00:45,48 --> 00:00:51,33 and events I also run the exoskeletal newsletter which is that infrequently sent e-mail newsletter 7 00:00:51,38 --> 00:00:55,85 and I'm an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 8 00:00:57,38 --> 00:00:57,64 Hoke 9 00:00:57,65 --> 00:01:05,50 and said that I'm an artist based in Chicago I'm also an educator DIA were engineer Kit Campbell Vangelis noted tall 10 00:01:05,51 --> 00:01:11,56 person. But he is kind of guy I'm Aaron O'Brien and I use she or are they. 11 00:01:13,63 --> 00:01:22,06 A conceptual performance artist an extremely lucrative career I make things but they start from ideas 12 00:01:22,07 --> 00:01:28,61 and I use a variety of different mediums to do so like video or food. 13 00:01:30,45 --> 00:01:36,62 And some of the food tastes really good so people have encouraged me to take those outside of the gallery space 14 00:01:36,63 --> 00:01:45,33 and into. Your living room so I havea. Sausage Company called Meet my friends. 15 00:01:47,80 --> 00:01:51,81 And because being an artist is so lucrative i also a private chef 16 00:01:52,76 --> 00:01:59,89 and a trainer with an organization called Center for story based strategy where we train social. 17 00:02:00,01 --> 00:02:06,96 Since organizations how to use narrative strategy to build their organizations and their campaigns. 18 00:02:08,21 --> 00:02:12,86 I feel like I mean I'm so excited by all of the variety that you just listed there 19 00:02:12,87 --> 00:02:20,64 and at the same time I feel sort of anxious on your behalf because that must be such it's like such a self generated 20 00:02:21,25 --> 00:02:28,69 way of being you know to me I mean at least at least going to work for me in part is established by somebody else 21 00:02:28,70 --> 00:02:35,78 or at the container but it sounds like you're sort of creating your day minute by minute is that accurate it is 22 00:02:35,79 --> 00:02:41,62 and talk about uncertainty generators that certainly. On the news or. 23 00:02:43,14 --> 00:02:52,87 From day to day will the right get paid well I bet he still says. Yeah I think it's definitely possible. 24 00:02:54,51 --> 00:03:03,28 But you know I think for me I chose that particular hustle so that I kid you know have the quality of life that I have 25 00:03:03,32 --> 00:03:10,69 in Los Angeles and to live in Los Angeles and to be able to live in Los Angeles and say spend six weeks and Vietnam 26 00:03:10,70 --> 00:03:14,15 or three months and Paris or these other sort of. 27 00:03:16,34 --> 00:03:20,43 Adventures that are a little bit more flexible when you're creating your own hustle. 28 00:03:22,66 --> 00:03:36,74 Yeah it's only what you've been in Paris for a little while now is that right yeah I've been here I guess it's like two. 29 00:03:31,35 --> 00:03:36,74 months now. And I have another month and a half before I head back to L.A. 30 00:03:37,98 --> 00:03:44,25 That's cool is there is there a project or anything you're working on there are you visiting friends or hanging out 31 00:03:44,26 --> 00:03:52,32 or what's what takes you to so I work for a family in Los Angeles as a private chef and. 32 00:03:53,47 --> 00:03:59,64 So they are in Paris working for the summer and instead of cooking for them I am. 33 00:04:00,81 --> 00:04:09,51 Left with the care of their child their very adorable four year old so I am adventuring through Paris through the eyes 34 00:04:09,52 --> 00:04:17,62 of a four year old I've seen every So that's also part I know all the all the fun things for kids to do in Paris 35 00:04:17,63 --> 00:04:21,17 and I'm actually getting to see Paris practice my French 36 00:04:21,18 --> 00:04:29,51 and do my own sort of research projects which of course I'm doing in the side time I mean yeah you know it's funny as. 37 00:04:30,95 --> 00:04:31,43 Own eyes 38 00:04:31,44 --> 00:04:39,05 or stand here to fill the well i've just like been so busy busy busy doing all kinds of projects that I'm like well 39 00:04:39,27 --> 00:04:46,81 what if I just like taking art and those awesome exhibition and meet new people and learn new languages. 40 00:04:49,49 --> 00:04:54,67 I mean it would be worth it just to see where Dan Brown's novels take place to just by itself. 41 00:04:57,26 --> 00:05:03,64 Except you have to you know brave the crowds the bastions of tourists which is just her right. 42 00:05:04,91 --> 00:05:11,68 In my in my personal opinion I have a very hard time with the large touristy areas like as soon as I turn a corner 43 00:05:11,69 --> 00:05:15,87 and I see something really touristy I'm like oh OK Back pedal the other way. 44 00:05:19,18 --> 00:05:24,48 It was it was funny you know when I was semi Braben I took from the cast about having young children 45 00:05:24,68 --> 00:05:30,94 and as artists with young children one of the first things I was thinking was you know to be able to go abroad this 46 00:05:31,44 --> 00:05:35,84 must require that you have no kids and yet there's a kid on the other end wait there for you so. 47 00:05:37,07 --> 00:05:37,44 Yeah 48 00:05:37,45 --> 00:05:46,84 and it's actually you know I think for me it's not my father was in the State Department so he was a career foreign service 49 00:05:46,85 --> 00:05:47,19 officer 50 00:05:47,20 --> 00:05:56,15 and diplomat so I spent my whole life traveling before I was even born like in utero so to me I have never known anything 51 00:05:56,16 --> 00:05:59,98 but traveling at any age I like I you know when I moved back to this. 52 00:06:00,01 --> 00:06:04,33 States I remember meeting friends who were you know born 53 00:06:04,34 --> 00:06:07,78 and raised in the same town lived in the same call the sack in the same room 54 00:06:07,79 --> 00:06:13,06 and I thought this was incredibly bizarre I was like not only your whole life here in this room like you went to 55 00:06:13,07 --> 00:06:16,67 kindergarten like twelve grand to these people really. 56 00:06:17,83 --> 00:06:23,48 It seemed so foreign to me so for me I have always been travelling so 57 00:06:24,34 --> 00:06:30,39 when people say oh it's so hard to travel with kids might well you know I got dragged around the planet whether I liked 58 00:06:30,40 --> 00:06:37,46 it or not and you know exploring the city with a four year old just definitely an intriguing way to see 59 00:06:38,07 --> 00:06:45,61 and experience a city and learn the culture and kind of social more and what's acceptable and not acceptable. 60 00:06:46,81 --> 00:06:55,56 You know I say do it you know travel with kids take them so before we share responses to this week's challenge of that 61 00:06:56,01 --> 00:06:58,20 remind me what's the word again a virtue of. 62 00:06:59,53 --> 00:07:02,57 Uncertainty generates certainty generators so you know it 63 00:07:02,58 --> 00:07:09,99 and we had a conversation over email because you would listen to some previous episodes and it sounded like Rob 64 00:07:10,00 --> 00:07:14,73 and I and I'm curious to hear more like it does it do we come across as pretty techie. 65 00:07:16,83 --> 00:07:26,67 After Oh sure yes yes do you guys feel stuff that actually works like you know who in that video yes exactly for the 66 00:07:26,68 --> 00:07:27,50 time being. 67 00:07:28,54 --> 00:07:38,31 Yet you know also in my life experience like knowing Rob's work like it's all very functional tech stuff and 68 00:07:38,35 --> 00:07:45,09 and the episodes that I have listened to I was like wow this is really take a step like at one point I was like I have 69 00:07:45,10 --> 00:07:50,66 no idea these words they're speaking of you know it's English but I'm not sure what they're speaking about. 70 00:07:52,07 --> 00:07:58,62 So you know I have to say it was a little bit tiny bit intimidated I was like I make ideas guys. 71 00:08:00,21 --> 00:08:04,63 If it makes you feel better in this episode and I'd like to say I did it just for you 72 00:08:04,64 --> 00:08:12,65 but this was my thing blows up when I when I turn it off for the first time. I thought well. 73 00:08:13,89 --> 00:08:21,03 I do feel so much better you know I mean I like that you you both embrace the idea of like create creating something 74 00:08:21,04 --> 00:08:24,07 over the course of two weeks and embracing sort of its successes 75 00:08:24,08 --> 00:08:31,83 and failures because part of that I endeavor to do is is an endeavor and failure and really celebrating failure 76 00:08:31,84 --> 00:08:36,41 and embracing failure in all of my. Art practice. 77 00:08:37,61 --> 00:08:44,84 You know is there once you embrace it does it cease to be failure is there it is there an additional term 78 00:08:44,85 --> 00:08:52,05 or is it just that we have to re-evaluate our notion of what a failure is you know I often tell people if you aim for 79 00:08:52,06 --> 00:08:57,67 failure you can only succeed because if you fail you succeed and that was your goal 80 00:08:58,21 --> 00:09:05,61 and if you succeed well then you succeeded as well so. Yeah you know. I mean what was the thing in the. 81 00:09:07,56 --> 00:09:11,70 Hitchhiker's Guide To The Galaxy where you learn to fly you just have to throw yourself at the ground 82 00:09:11,71 --> 00:09:12,83 and miss I think was the. 83 00:09:13,98 --> 00:09:20,02 Exactly it's like if you really try hard you'll somehow manage to either fail 84 00:09:20,03 --> 00:09:26,19 or succeed whatever you however you define that you know I think for me as both a perfectionist 85 00:09:26,20 --> 00:09:29,11 and a child of immigrants 86 00:09:29,15 --> 00:09:37,25 and Asian American like I failed spectacularly in every way that I was supposed to succeed so if I were I'm not 87 00:09:37,26 --> 00:09:40,25 comfortable with the fact that like I'm queer 88 00:09:40,26 --> 00:09:47,58 and mixed race I'm an artist I'm like genderqueer I don't succeed in performing femininity very well like all of the 89 00:09:47,59 --> 00:09:48,29 state I am 90 00:09:48,30 --> 00:09:55,78 and I make no money like you know all of the measures of success I fail spectacularly so in order to be just OK with 91 00:09:55,79 --> 00:10:00,92 myself I have to be like wow failure I'm really good at failure. I'm good at something. 92 00:10:02,24 --> 00:10:03,98 You know just last night my wife 93 00:10:03,99 --> 00:10:10,93 and I watched get out have you guess well yeah maybe excellent excellent read you haven't seen it really want it so if 94 00:10:10,94 --> 00:10:16,09 you guess a bit of it there spoilers involved. Are you really have you not seen it yet. 95 00:10:17,26 --> 00:10:22,65 I could just remove my headphones for you if you want to be yourself for one second I just am so curious as they are in 96 00:10:22,66 --> 00:10:23,22 about something. 97 00:10:24,35 --> 00:10:28,17 Yeah so hang I will send you and I will send you a little message in Skype 98 00:10:28,37 --> 00:10:31,18 or in slack once we're done talking about it will just be a minute 99 00:10:31,19 --> 00:10:35,60 or two Yeah perfect Yeah sounds nice to this feel so illicit. 100 00:10:36,90 --> 00:10:43,56 Private chat room so so arid It sounds like we have consumed movies from a similar generation 101 00:10:43,64 --> 00:10:50,65 and so forth so would you watch get out were you bothered at all by a similarity to a very specific movie from our 102 00:10:50,66 --> 00:10:54,20 earlier conception of movies do you know which movie I'm talking about. 103 00:10:55,68 --> 00:10:58,70 You know it kind of remind me of a couple films that were. 104 00:11:00,77 --> 00:11:08,38 Being John Malkovich was the one that was the most apparent to me I mean I love the shift in the filter the fact that 105 00:11:08,39 --> 00:11:11,53 you had cats are you familiar with this movie have you yet seen it 106 00:11:11,54 --> 00:11:17,21 and that everything is so so Catherine Keener the fact that they were doors that were only partial height 107 00:11:17,78 --> 00:11:25,42 and the fact that they were doing that kind of Wes Anderson paneled basements shag carpet old timey T.V. 108 00:11:25,74 --> 00:11:32,02 With a grainy television signal right group of old white people that had this sort of brain. 109 00:11:33,62 --> 00:11:35,59 Where you will put more spoiler words on the up so 110 00:11:35,78 --> 00:11:41,16 but I just like there was so much stacked up because that movie was so influential for me you know getting into Charlie 111 00:11:41,17 --> 00:11:41,59 Kaufman 112 00:11:41,60 --> 00:11:50,05 and so forth yes yeah like I was just so frustrated because I felt like it was too close like what I wanted more distance 113 00:11:50,06 --> 00:11:59,98 between the two but I'm curious for your thoughts on the movie you know I think. I didn't even register for me. 114 00:12:00,40 --> 00:12:06,52 Similarity until you mention it now. I think more than anything you know. 115 00:12:07,64 --> 00:12:15,06 I had heard so much about get out so that by the time I saw it I think I'm not I'm not a fan of horror genre 116 00:12:15,19 --> 00:12:19,24 but it turns out that's not really whore it's more thriller per se. 117 00:12:20,77 --> 00:12:29,21 Psychological horror is that a lot of Yeah you know I think what I what I appreciated about the framing of the film. 118 00:12:30,40 --> 00:12:35,68 One probably the reason I appreciated it is these sort of similarities to sort of Being John Malkovich 119 00:12:35,69 --> 00:12:42,70 but also that there that it was the the racism that was the scariest you know like the stuff that you. 120 00:12:44,38 --> 00:12:51,69 Am I going to survive this you know because I have these moments I think as all persons all people of color 121 00:12:51,70 --> 00:12:57,54 or like queer people queer people of color gender queer people you have that moment where you're like is my life at 122 00:12:57,55 --> 00:13:02,78 risk in this situation so here and was you know 123 00:13:02,82 --> 00:13:09,80 and I think also even as a female you know like you have these moments where like I don't know if I mean danger 124 00:13:09,81 --> 00:13:11,00 and for what reason. 125 00:13:12,59 --> 00:13:21,43 Yeah OK so so Being John Malkovich I guess is like a flight of fancy because it's so absurd that you don't really 126 00:13:21,44 --> 00:13:27,75 picture yourself in those situations I don't think anybody would fully Where is that because it is kind of surreal that 127 00:13:27,76 --> 00:13:30,01 you know like here on this thirteenth and a half floor 128 00:13:30,02 --> 00:13:33,12 and there's you know wrist sort of like these in between places 129 00:13:33,13 --> 00:13:37,67 and you know I mean I think dialogue wise also was a little bit ludicrous. 130 00:13:38,84 --> 00:13:44,67 But I think all of those films were a little sort of I think that's why outreach now which was characterised there. 131 00:13:47,00 --> 00:13:55,82 Was a are get out no no to Being John Malkovich I think some of the dialogue is definitely not like conversations that 132 00:13:55,83 --> 00:13:59,54 you imagine transporting to friends. Sure OK. 133 00:14:00,54 --> 00:14:04,99 I'm glad we're talking about this because it's it's warming me up to the differences 134 00:14:05,00 --> 00:14:09,24 and I'd also like to add as my wife is mixed race 135 00:14:10,07 --> 00:14:17,01 and her mother's Chinese so so it's also interesting to hear about this because I'm experiencing it from the side you 136 00:14:17,02 --> 00:14:17,20 know 137 00:14:17,55 --> 00:14:26,98 but the fact that the girlfriend in the movie early on she does this sort of white person thing no officer he won't he 138 00:14:26,99 --> 00:14:28,09 won't give you the ID 139 00:14:28,27 --> 00:14:36,89 and I've totally been guilty of being offended on her behalf even as a fundamentally rep you know like it's not really 140 00:14:36,90 --> 00:14:37,61 my problem. 141 00:14:38,96 --> 00:14:42,79 So yes so there are certainly parts of the movie where it's great 142 00:14:42,80 --> 00:14:45,18 when you watch something that is a sensibly a horror movie 143 00:14:45,19 --> 00:14:52,52 but really it makes you think about how you interact with other people interacting with your spouse right you know how 144 00:14:52,53 --> 00:15:00,63 it relates to the separate Yeah like how implicated you are by race by proxy Yes you know who you're in a relationship 145 00:15:00,72 --> 00:15:06,95 with which is incredibly intriguing although she was trying to avoid the police officer for maybe some other reasons 146 00:15:06,99 --> 00:15:11,20 that that's a good point I hadn't had breaks into that either of it 147 00:15:11,21 --> 00:15:17,83 but it also it strengthens it because it it adds So there are two narratives going on 148 00:15:17,87 --> 00:15:23,87 and you don't have access to the second one until you look back in retrospect So that's that's nice exactly because for 149 00:15:23,91 --> 00:15:31,06 you know like for him I think you know were I in that relationship that would be like yeah she's got my back OK look if 150 00:15:31,30 --> 00:15:34,11 I'm totally fine I trust her you know problem. 151 00:15:36,23 --> 00:15:39,00 Nice OK well I don't want to I don't want to bore up too much 152 00:15:39,01 --> 00:15:46,47 but actually I look for more of that side of well which we should totally have a movie review in every episode OK let 153 00:15:46,48 --> 00:15:46,66 me. 154 00:15:47,79 --> 00:15:53,18 Tell that come on back OK great so you know what we'll have to come up with some mega spoiler alerts because you know 155 00:15:53,19 --> 00:16:01,09 that's that's one of those ones it's nice to go into without prepared. And. Right we just we. 156 00:16:03,05 --> 00:16:07,14 So I guess we'll have OK We'll talk to you about it later you'll have to go see 157 00:16:07,15 --> 00:16:14,33 and get right away because you get to edit the Pakistan like twenty four hours right I do but I'll I'll just. 158 00:16:15,61 --> 00:16:20,58 Assume that all that stuff needs no editing and I'll just let it was pretty good yeah no you're in. 159 00:16:22,78 --> 00:16:27,21 I feel like I want to watch it again though I have I think that will feature. 160 00:16:28,57 --> 00:16:37,36 With with one of the movie with the with the wedding you know I was like OK. Dude Rob you didn't get that. 161 00:16:41,42 --> 00:16:44,43 I don't I don't get it so I guess you'll see yeah. 162 00:16:46,55 --> 00:16:50,30 Well shit I could talk about this so they I'm going to turn the baton to you because. 163 00:16:51,52 --> 00:16:56,58 Yeah we'll have to make it like a sister episode a daughter episode that's all movies who wants to go first. 164 00:16:58,54 --> 00:17:03,82 Taylor goes first see Taylor F.L. You know it's well you know let me let me lead off with the. 165 00:17:05,03 --> 00:17:22,26 Elegant failure because that'll put everyone at ease. How. Well I will say I can see how this might turn it on. 166 00:17:25,63 --> 00:17:33,27 You know that was a spoiler alert because you told us it was. OK I say yeah so it looks like a. 167 00:17:34,42 --> 00:17:39,47 Parent to me of course a dive in but it looks like there is. A piece of sort of P.V.C. 168 00:17:39,48 --> 00:17:48,79 Pipe looking something or another. I don't know what be in it so we're looking at it sort of. 169 00:17:49,97 --> 00:17:55,69 Like Taylor I have you down on the thing. You know looks like the P.V.C. 170 00:17:55,70 --> 00:17:59,98 Pipe is maybe filled with some sort of a poxy or has some sort of cap on it in a. 171 00:18:00,08 --> 00:18:02,92 Dude you'll figure out what is just going to. 172 00:18:04,46 --> 00:18:11,74 Hit a chord Oh it's a quarter Yeah it is a quarter a quarter that looks a little fried. 173 00:18:13,06 --> 00:18:20,63 It looks it looks fried for sure yeah it's very. Singed Yeah yeah and it's. 174 00:18:21,97 --> 00:18:28,97 Kind of soldered on each end so the quarter is sort of like a pop down into the maybe I guess it's probably a half inch. 175 00:18:28,61 --> 00:18:30,70 P.V.C. And. 176 00:18:32,30 --> 00:18:40,26 There's a little Axel kind of soldered on each side so the quarter is kind of suspended in the middle of the pipe. 177 00:18:41,34 --> 00:18:48,41 Does the quarter since sure no or is it just looks like it could turn looks like it could turn Yeah yeah 178 00:18:48,57 --> 00:18:53,93 and then there's an amazingly nice for the machine anything and the nerve to. 179 00:18:55,11 --> 00:18:59,59 Screw looking thing that goes into the side of the P.V.C. 180 00:18:59,60 --> 00:19:00,04 Pipe 181 00:19:00,58 --> 00:19:10,53 but this point I have no idea what that what that is true that's the blowup as it looks I think yes it is yeah yeah it 182 00:19:10,54 --> 00:19:20,74 looks awesome so the picture never to help fill in some of these gaps OK to say OK is it on fire. Plugs into that. 183 00:19:22,92 --> 00:19:28,72 Yes So this looks like an attachment that you would plug right into your chain tank or your barbecue 184 00:19:28,81 --> 00:19:33,57 or something of that nature you have some sort of you have a box double gas chamber. 185 00:19:35,68 --> 00:19:39,25 Yeah or like you and I see an air hose in the background. 186 00:19:40,32 --> 00:19:48,35 That could be going to a compressor propane tank something like that and there's like a large on off switch switch 187 00:19:48,39 --> 00:19:58,15 but valves Yes And then like a couple of pieces that I think just converts that the threads on the bow of into. 188 00:19:59,41 --> 00:19:59,98 A piece. 189 00:20:00,04 --> 00:20:06,04 Pipe that's going into that he pipes so yeah there's definitely some pipe bomb looking your stuff you're supposed to 190 00:20:06,68 --> 00:20:15,85 like yeah yeah like something somewhere maybe not I don't think anyone appointed to those offices you might think. 191 00:20:17,30 --> 00:20:24,14 That there's just like an empty chair. With a pair of headphones that has are going to say shag. 192 00:20:26,50 --> 00:20:28,96 Yes Yes Yes All right so 193 00:20:29,11 --> 00:20:44,32 and check out that movie if you're going to really see it with that there's a good sound component here too. Oh. Oh. 194 00:20:50,29 --> 00:20:59,38 Wow heads or tails. Exactly Oh my well. It's hard it's hard to know at this particular time through. 195 00:21:03,66 --> 00:21:14,78 That is cool is pretty. So so you blast a shot of air through this tube clips which point. 196 00:21:15,95 --> 00:21:27,79 Yeah flips the coin seemingly hundreds of times per second. It also injects. Yes And then we see about. 197 00:21:30,19 --> 00:21:37,78 Four seconds in. Did it do what I hear it off the entire chunk of P.V.C. 198 00:21:37,79 --> 00:21:46,45 Pipe so the Air Force is so strong that you can't. Contain that quarter in its place. 199 00:21:47,58 --> 00:21:55,64 So see if you go it's going to determine what the do in their second four because that thing is the last piece of 200 00:21:55,65 --> 00:22:06,65 information. Oh I. That's your stock. So when you twist. 201 00:22:08,02 --> 00:22:10,90 Down it should the coin should collide with it 202 00:22:11,33 --> 00:22:16,63 and then make it all right because otherwise you'd have to like that so it would be a hard stop on the cost so that I 203 00:22:16,64 --> 00:22:17,87 like the way the strings that. 204 00:22:19,51 --> 00:22:26,49 You know so you get as you get it right there so basically there's a so it's compressed air in the compressed air is 205 00:22:26,50 --> 00:22:29,50 coming in at a smaller diameter than the P.V.C. 206 00:22:29,51 --> 00:22:31,36 Pipe so it's off to one side 207 00:22:32,25 --> 00:22:38,74 and then so that because it is the coin to blow into specifics it would always blow clockwise for example depending on 208 00:22:38,75 --> 00:22:45,87 your point of view right and so the thumbscrew is actually a spring loaded stop so you twist the thumbscrew 209 00:22:46,39 --> 00:22:49,83 and then it shoots down about half an inch 210 00:22:50,24 --> 00:22:58,98 but it's on the opposite side for the air that coin right according to its flipping around right so the idea is that 211 00:22:59,79 --> 00:23:03,44 the air is still blowing up from one side 212 00:23:03,59 --> 00:23:10,09 and then the stuff prevents the quarter from continuing to rotate the air pressure should just sort of lock the coil 213 00:23:10,10 --> 00:23:16,50 and in place it either heads or tails right and then it just sticks Absolutely 214 00:23:16,51 --> 00:23:27,01 and so so so yes I mean it's going to land heads or tails whatever yeah it is true so yeah it definitely worked once 215 00:23:27,05 --> 00:23:29,52 and then now I just the problem is a U.C. 216 00:23:29,53 --> 00:23:33,36 Berkeley so I could just come back through with a poxy and then try to make 217 00:23:33,40 --> 00:23:38,31 and maybe you know make the whole thing out of metal in order to keep it or more stable 218 00:23:38,32 --> 00:23:43,05 but you know that I just did a bunch of research on engines and motors and stuff. 219 00:23:44,18 --> 00:23:52,93 And I was thinking about you know sort of original mechanical computing and all that and how engines 220 00:23:52,94 --> 00:23:55,44 and machines are about taking one kind of force 221 00:23:55,45 --> 00:23:59,98 and converting it to some kind of useful work so that got me into working with these. 222 00:24:00,44 --> 00:24:03,76 And I just wanted to do air stuff too I've never really done air powered stuff. 223 00:24:05,04 --> 00:24:10,50 Also never saw her directly on to currency before so that was kind of fun yeah to do you know 224 00:24:11,16 --> 00:24:15,14 but you know I'm pretty you know you know once in charge of that you know right now you're. 225 00:24:16,27 --> 00:24:25,40 You know we're just we're just broken eighty tiny. Yeah I wonder if you were to just can't like stop the air. 226 00:24:27,23 --> 00:24:31,70 Well right you're just not project that quarter across the room. 227 00:24:32,99 --> 00:24:36,93 You know I mean I think so so this I definitely went out at eight A.M. 228 00:24:36,94 --> 00:24:39,79 This morning to do this video and blew it up 229 00:24:39,80 --> 00:24:43,54 and then I didn't have time you know if I'd been thinking I would have tried it 230 00:24:43,58 --> 00:24:46,36 and then I could experiment with a couple of other but he said there whatever. 231 00:24:47,56 --> 00:24:53,33 The goal was that the air pressure would make it go really fast like you know and 232 00:24:53,34 --> 00:24:57,55 when you hear the phone taps it down but it really sounds like a jet engine taking off 233 00:24:58,06 --> 00:25:03,02 and so I like the the big paired with the smallest of the results. 234 00:25:04,55 --> 00:25:08,73 But my little design couldn't quite handle the big part right. 235 00:25:09,94 --> 00:25:15,58 So there is a small dollop of macho in here but I was also kind of delighted 236 00:25:15,59 --> 00:25:23,51 but I like the way the way that it is actually really flexible so it didn't really bug me that much I'm. 237 00:25:24,68 --> 00:25:27,91 Just a little bummed that it isn't some sort of a blowtorch device. 238 00:25:29,28 --> 00:25:36,80 But I was you know just like when I first saw the images the second image you know having worked in catering 239 00:25:36,81 --> 00:25:39,46 and service you know you know like. 240 00:25:40,53 --> 00:25:42,98 This tour and you're like trying to get it to work 241 00:25:42,99 --> 00:25:46,93 and there's a line of people in there like hey when's the next order you know like and you're. 242 00:25:48,11 --> 00:25:55,73 Trying to connect something to make fire and you know ways towards next time just. 243 00:26:00,01 --> 00:26:04,29 There And remember you get to decide what the next challenge is so I do you that's right. 244 00:26:08,66 --> 00:26:15,59 Yeah yeah yeah wow OK So did it land heads or tails you know it's funny I didn't even look. 245 00:26:18,31 --> 00:26:20,11 I just I just went inside 246 00:26:20,12 --> 00:26:25,80 and you know what about my day at that point made by little you know certainty has been generated you know you're right 247 00:26:25,81 --> 00:26:30,20 you still don't say it's for it it's for it it's sitting out there the gross 248 00:26:30,21 --> 00:26:35,71 but I should i should go in there with my eyes closed and cover it that never Yeah we're going to look. 249 00:26:36,81 --> 00:26:41,14 Just like poor hunk of a poxy I just opposite you know this never know it be like. 250 00:26:42,53 --> 00:26:51,84 Who's that who's that artist guy at Paris air you're going to Schrodinger that oh yeah that one but my gosh the. 251 00:26:53,13 --> 00:27:00,83 Artists we can never stop hearing about from Paris a Parisian artists contemporary artists so do show up. 252 00:27:01,86 --> 00:27:02,71 Yes thank you. 253 00:27:04,00 --> 00:27:04,44 I don't know 254 00:27:04,45 --> 00:27:10,76 but there's hundreds of years of French are we talking contemporary we're talking you know it's really like. 255 00:27:12,19 --> 00:27:19,36 You know the guy with that French guy we all know he has the I think uncertainty has like a certain kind of like. 256 00:27:20,48 --> 00:27:22,87 You know way like thread through his work you know like. 257 00:27:25,76 --> 00:27:28,50 The vial of Paris air and it's like is it really Paris Aaron 258 00:27:28,70 --> 00:27:36,25 and then there's like some ball with like a thing inside it you know the thing actually inside it anyway so I mean all 259 00:27:36,26 --> 00:27:39,27 the data is kind of screwed with their ideas. 260 00:27:42,31 --> 00:27:47,15 Yeah yeah you go see oh yeah because he also had the large glass and then 261 00:27:47,16 --> 00:27:55,71 when it was broken by movers he left it as is yeah I come from a very distinguished lineage here guys with my explode I. 262 00:27:54,71 --> 00:27:59,98 couldn't P.V.C. Do shopping quarter have you guys. 263 00:28:00,04 --> 00:28:05,00 Scene there's another podcast that just came out with one of the actresses from Broad City 264 00:28:05,15 --> 00:28:11,71 and I'm forgetting who it is from Brad city but I guess she was a graphic designer before she became an actress 265 00:28:12,23 --> 00:28:15,53 and so now she goes to moma with a famous person 266 00:28:15,57 --> 00:28:18,97 and does these little fifteen minute casts about some item from the collection. 267 00:28:20,27 --> 00:28:27,55 And I think it's called a piece of work but it's the first one they did I think it was with Hannibal Burress 268 00:28:27,59 --> 00:28:29,19 and they were looking at the shops. 269 00:28:30,29 --> 00:28:32,36 You know the one with the bicycle wheel 270 00:28:32,37 --> 00:28:40,51 and the stool Oh yeah I'd be curious if you guys think about it it's pretty reductive in some really hoping I think Ru 271 00:28:40,52 --> 00:28:46,84 Paul is on the fifth one and some really hoping that they can and it's so short it kind of has to be 272 00:28:46,85 --> 00:28:48,61 but I'd love to see those get a little longer 273 00:28:49,10 --> 00:28:55,02 and really get into it because it you know they were a little bit stuck on the you know in a bicycle will be a piece of 274 00:28:55,03 --> 00:28:55,20 art 275 00:28:55,21 --> 00:29:01,42 and so if you listen to it as somebody that's gone through you know any training it's it's a little bit a little bit of 276 00:29:01,43 --> 00:29:04,00 a snooze when you would hope that you know it's really. 277 00:29:05,58 --> 00:29:08,72 Because I was listening thinking oh I've been waiting my whole life for this podcast 278 00:29:08,73 --> 00:29:13,13 but then you know I don't know maybe we should we should make it yeah yeah right 279 00:29:13,22 --> 00:29:17,65 and it was the first episode I mean you know and I understand they're pitching to a really broad audience 280 00:29:17,66 --> 00:29:22,28 but I'm curious to see how that one develops Yeah definitely check it out. 281 00:29:24,25 --> 00:29:27,30 Oh yeah it's called a piece of work I linked to insurance 282 00:29:27,31 --> 00:29:33,49 but I also put in a selection office so you can see what it's like Abbi Jacobson That's cool yeah all right who's who's 283 00:29:33,50 --> 00:29:36,60 next dude's I guess we're going by the official thing so here 284 00:29:36,61 --> 00:29:41,58 and that would be you right oh hey oh OK I only have one I have several bad pictures 285 00:29:41,59 --> 00:30:02,68 but I have one reasonable picture and this girl I wouldn't mind seeing the bit pictures to. Get. Well. Who. 286 00:30:03,74 --> 00:30:20,54 Yeah when you started the no. I'll join you. Yeah I think it breaking low I think we're. Broke it. Was OK so. OK. 287 00:30:23,99 --> 00:30:29,21 Is it is the right word a bell jar is that the right word for what a build a building 288 00:30:29,22 --> 00:30:33,21 or thing you know for a thanks race to keep it period. 289 00:30:36,98 --> 00:30:45,32 Yeah I think you build your is a specific kind so what I'm saying is more like a hopper Yeah Hopper Yes that's yeah 290 00:30:45,33 --> 00:30:49,86 that's a better sort of sort of yeah like a funnel and open up glass vessel. 291 00:30:51,17 --> 00:30:57,90 That's mounted so it's it looks like a cup at the top and it has a long skinny sort of pipe 292 00:30:58,53 --> 00:31:02,83 but it doesn't quite look like scientific glass and I can see there's some text on the side 293 00:31:02,84 --> 00:31:07,31 but I was it's a Kona So perhaps this is a brand that. 294 00:31:08,75 --> 00:31:13,78 You know people in the food industry might be aware of but maybe it's scientific I don't know 295 00:31:13,97 --> 00:31:16,01 but what you describe the more exciting parts of. 296 00:31:17,49 --> 00:31:23,64 It yes so it looks like it doesn't look like there's a hopper a definite looks like a cross between some sort of 297 00:31:23,65 --> 00:31:34,08 scientific equipment meets coffee making thing meets. Freebasing equipment. 298 00:31:37,60 --> 00:31:46,43 And speaking of freebasing equipment there so the hopper. Has like oh about maybe an six to eight inch looking. 299 00:31:48,39 --> 00:31:52,91 Glass pipe that comes out of the bottom of the hopper and there's a cork in the bottom 300 00:31:53,89 --> 00:31:57,83 and then there's what looks like kind of a. Yeah kind of a. 301 00:32:00,39 --> 00:32:09,48 Some sort of pipe glass pipe and store the hopper is filled with various pharmaceuticals. 302 00:32:11,17 --> 00:32:18,68 Some of them look recognizable as maybe like a fish oil I think a sample if I ever pills and there are. 303 00:32:20,79 --> 00:32:26,55 Various various things that probably wouldn't kill you but then there's definitely nicest ones 304 00:32:26,56 --> 00:32:32,84 and they're the pink that's not concerned about yet there are some pink pills in there that are very interesting. 305 00:32:35,35 --> 00:32:48,33 And so yeah so it looks like. A device for randomly. Consuming a pharmaceutical. 306 00:32:49,90 --> 00:32:55,71 You know so I just can just see what happened I just put a link up on the shared link so yes really with the slang the 307 00:32:55,72 --> 00:32:56,67 Jeffries. 308 00:32:58,40 --> 00:33:06,67 Supposedly what it's saying on Urban Dictionary is that this comes from the movie get him to the Greek though talking 309 00:33:06,68 --> 00:33:12,20 to I have an in-law who is well informed in this territory he does. 310 00:33:13,33 --> 00:33:16,47 Epidemiology with drug usage and so forth 311 00:33:16,99 --> 00:33:23,20 and so he he was in it we're just talking about the state of the Jeffries But apparently this is sort of a college kid 312 00:33:23,21 --> 00:33:27,76 game where you just grab a whole bunch of random pills and crush of all up 313 00:33:28,00 --> 00:33:34,90 and then you just take a take a big swallow and see what happens. So the. 314 00:33:35,96 --> 00:33:43,29 So this is like this is like a high class Jeffries device but I think I think if we find out that there's a lot of. 315 00:33:44,34 --> 00:33:48,60 Stuff that's good for you and here maybe we're wrong about the pink pills 316 00:33:48,61 --> 00:33:54,03 and maybe it's just Les Yeah right you know it's the uncertainty is generated by how much healthier you'll be 317 00:33:54,04 --> 00:33:57,88 afterwards but I kind of Esther's if I go in a way to make you poop better. 318 00:34:00,01 --> 00:34:02,06 Oh I think there's a certain we're supposed to take five 319 00:34:02,07 --> 00:34:09,71 or ninety eight yeah so maybe we are we just degenerates in assuming this pipe is for smoking as it. 320 00:34:10,86 --> 00:34:18,93 Is there is there another entry point into the. You could go into many you could be yeah. 321 00:34:19,97 --> 00:34:22,14 There's many like off label uses it sounds like. 322 00:34:23,26 --> 00:34:28,40 This whole thing is I have yes it is yeah yeah it is definitely off label and 323 00:34:28,41 --> 00:34:36,24 but it's part of the answer it's like yeah what is this I'm also really digging the stand you know sweet describes 324 00:34:36,25 --> 00:34:38,44 glass element but there's this really create. 325 00:34:40,05 --> 00:34:47,05 Quite Art Deco but it certainly appears to be of an older era so the stand you know has this great maybe wood 326 00:34:47,06 --> 00:34:50,12 or plastic black shiny handle 327 00:34:50,31 --> 00:34:56,20 and these sort of Croom shiny silver parts that are whole you know there's a part that holds the glass 328 00:34:56,66 --> 00:35:02,50 and then the stand has this great kind of clawfoot looking thing so it appears antique at least in part. 329 00:35:04,09 --> 00:35:07,66 Yeah although it's the same number eight eighteenth century Parisian chemist you know 330 00:35:07,67 --> 00:35:15,96 or barbell I mean yes yeah yeah so yeah my chemist I mean like drugstore chemist Yeah yeah so maybe this was maybe this 331 00:35:15,97 --> 00:35:24,45 was acquired least in part it one of those great open air markets they have. And I. 332 00:35:26,08 --> 00:35:31,47 Really want to hear some more hey man up here all week yeah wow I want to hear about this 333 00:35:31,48 --> 00:35:36,79 but do you know do you want to say anything else before we go no no no I think that yeah air and air 334 00:35:36,80 --> 00:35:38,87 and lay it out it's you know. 335 00:35:39,96 --> 00:35:46,41 This idea of uncertainty generator I was trying to think about you know where to some certainty come from. 336 00:35:47,52 --> 00:35:49,65 And Doubt it comes from not knowing 337 00:35:49,66 --> 00:35:57,79 and you know one of the sort of media things that came to mind was like I have all these spices 338 00:35:57,80 --> 00:35:59,62 and I remember what that is. 339 00:36:00,08 --> 00:36:04,65 Sure and then I don't label it and then I'm like well if I taste it I'll be able to remember what it is 340 00:36:04,66 --> 00:36:09,90 and I do the scene going to travel so I have this giant pile of vitamins and pills 341 00:36:09,91 --> 00:36:16,17 and make sure I'll know which one is which and then I never actually remember which is which. 342 00:36:17,85 --> 00:36:21,44 But then that you know I was thinking about this I. 343 00:36:23,87 --> 00:36:27,68 Know currently the debate around health care 344 00:36:28,09 --> 00:36:35,42 and for me I was laying the crap my going to have health care want to get back to the city it's like Should I just stay 345 00:36:35,43 --> 00:36:36,06 in Paris 346 00:36:36,07 --> 00:36:43,58 and like you know because they have health care here like if I get hurt if I break my leg if I get sick I can go to the 347 00:36:43,59 --> 00:36:47,95 hospital here you know like if I were in the city it's have to think through that a little bit more 348 00:36:47,96 --> 00:36:56,30 and in fact even though I do have the Affordable Care Act my silver level plan which is kind of you know between fancy 349 00:36:56,31 --> 00:37:05,15 and not fancy of the Affordable Care Act packages does not cover me for one single urgent care facility within fifty 350 00:37:05,16 --> 00:37:08,73 miles of my house I live in Los Angeles that to be free as. 351 00:37:09,75 --> 00:37:16,12 Well so I was thinking you know how you know this idea of uncertainty with medications like are you going to be able to 352 00:37:16,16 --> 00:37:20,91 access medication like our you know like when I first got here I was sick 353 00:37:20,95 --> 00:37:26,76 and a friend of mine who is a doctor was like it's cool whatever you need we can get it for you you know. 354 00:37:28,66 --> 00:37:33,19 But I was like wow if I was in the states where i actually be able to get these prescriptions would I be able to get 355 00:37:33,20 --> 00:37:39,79 them filled would I even be able to you know like I basically like saw the doctor right up until the day I left 356 00:37:39,80 --> 00:37:44,96 and then they were like Yeah we'll tell you later what you have we don't know so there was also of those 357 00:37:44,97 --> 00:37:47,37 and surge here is how you embark on a three 358 00:37:47,38 --> 00:37:53,99 and a half month journey like what's wrong with my body I don't know something grave could be totally fun thing because 359 00:37:54,07 --> 00:37:59,94 you know. And for me you know my best friend actually has. 360 00:38:03,12 --> 00:38:05,73 Two tumors in her head in her brain 361 00:38:05,89 --> 00:38:16,18 and you know I as her chosen family have been has been I've been involved in this process over the last three years of 362 00:38:16,19 --> 00:38:21,21 like going to radiation with her going to chemo with her you know just hanging out with her 363 00:38:21,30 --> 00:38:23,27 when she was in between treatments 364 00:38:23,28 --> 00:38:29,69 and you know for a lot of Americans who are about to lose their health care because it's on the chopping block 365 00:38:29,70 --> 00:38:35,08 but that uncertainty of like there are you going to be able to go to the doctor are you going to be able to even you 366 00:38:35,09 --> 00:38:42,74 know get access to it to find out if you're sick much less to get access to the medication to make you better 367 00:38:43,07 --> 00:38:49,80 when you are sick. So that was kind of percolating on that idea. 368 00:38:51,44 --> 00:38:59,03 Figurative Lee and literally and I had found Yeah object at one of these open air plea markets in Paris 369 00:38:59,04 --> 00:39:02,67 and was like why is this so cool just to have it. 370 00:39:04,06 --> 00:39:09,16 It's a vintage coffee maker that part of the well so the stand of it 371 00:39:09,17 --> 00:39:14,40 and the top glass vessel part are a part of this vintage coffee maker. 372 00:39:16,21 --> 00:39:21,88 And then it didn't come with the other parts and I had been doing research around you know looking at this 373 00:39:21,89 --> 00:39:25,12 and I was like wow what if you get this amazing thing that can do this amazing thing 374 00:39:25,13 --> 00:39:31,89 but you only get half of it like how do you get the other parts like do after order I'm off after like search every 375 00:39:31,90 --> 00:39:38,12 market for the bulb that goes at the bottom of the little heater part like you know there's other parts to make this 376 00:39:38,16 --> 00:39:40,48 functional and I know how those parts. 377 00:39:41,52 --> 00:39:48,01 Like how expensive it is is it to actually get those parts and I was like wow that's kind of theoretically 378 00:39:48,02 --> 00:39:52,38 or like you know to think about how we have access to health care 379 00:39:52,39 --> 00:39:57,72 but don't have access to health care you know like we pay a lot of money for the privilege of going to the doctor to 380 00:39:57,73 --> 00:39:59,99 pay a lot more money to the the. 381 00:40:00,01 --> 00:40:10,68 Dr like my best friend her chemo treatments you know even with really good health care her co-pay is ten percent so she 382 00:40:10,69 --> 00:40:15,55 pays two thousand dollars each time she gets treatment she gets ten treatments a year 383 00:40:16,12 --> 00:40:20,76 but each treatment is actually twenty thousand dollars a pop for her to sit there 384 00:40:21,12 --> 00:40:24,69 and poison her body with kid with her for eight hours yet. 385 00:40:26,77 --> 00:40:34,67 This little nugget at the bottom that looks like I think you guys were it does look very much like crack pipe 386 00:40:34,71 --> 00:40:38,53 or some sort of. Drug paraphernalia. 387 00:40:39,90 --> 00:40:46,10 I found in the Chinese market there's like a sort of wholesale retail store of like restaurant goods 388 00:40:46,11 --> 00:40:49,88 and I like to peruse the shops Yeah if somehow these 389 00:40:49,89 --> 00:40:56,51 and I was applying these for what is this this looks like some chemistry experiment it's actually the cork there you 390 00:40:56,52 --> 00:41:01,49 put it in the bottle so you can perfectly measure to milliliter shots of alcohol. 391 00:41:02,67 --> 00:41:03,93 Oh my gosh wow 392 00:41:04,39 --> 00:41:11,73 and they had this is the effect of degeneracy exactly at two millimeter for millimeter by different size shot 393 00:41:11,74 --> 00:41:17,68 measurements and so you buy this you put it on top of the bottle so I got a shot open the cork at the end 394 00:41:17,69 --> 00:41:22,78 and poured out. But it fit perfectly into the palm of his sort of. 395 00:41:25,35 --> 00:41:34,54 Hill distributor so you know conceptually I'm thinking about these uncertainties 396 00:41:34,55 --> 00:41:37,43 but how do you how do you represent that. 397 00:41:39,18 --> 00:41:46,46 Yeah well you also have to get this made well traveling abroad the flow and I think. We. 398 00:41:47,53 --> 00:41:55,96 Are less sure by a couple do you so just grit Europe yes here I was a little because they apparently didn't get the 399 00:41:55,97 --> 00:41:59,98 message about what the next show theme was so I was the. 400 00:42:00,13 --> 00:42:07,63 Yeah right I mean I'm fairly well they're made of definitely definitely yeah this is really cool yeah have you. 401 00:42:09,38 --> 00:42:09,94 Had to try to. 402 00:42:12,67 --> 00:42:20,98 I have and just so you know just to reveal the pain pills or the B twelve so it could be scary 403 00:42:20,99 --> 00:42:25,44 or could be dangerous Yeah the whole you know the twelve 404 00:42:25,45 --> 00:42:31,78 when it releases you know I mean there was always what is B twelve Yeah I don't know maybe it was like urban legend 405 00:42:32,08 --> 00:42:35,97 when I was younger like. OK this is. 406 00:42:37,16 --> 00:42:37,81 Your permission 407 00:42:37,82 --> 00:42:43,34 but I remember being told at some point that there was this sort of conspiracy theory that the government didn't want 408 00:42:43,35 --> 00:42:49,87 people to actually have functioning brains that worked which is why they like to be twelve out of everything so that 409 00:42:49,88 --> 00:42:52,35 like you had it in order to get enough B. 410 00:42:52,36 --> 00:42:58,64 Twelve to have your cognitive functions operating at the level of the brain's capacity you had to either take the 411 00:42:58,65 --> 00:43:00,93 twelve or take acid I don't know that. 412 00:43:02,18 --> 00:43:10,82 Was an urban legend maybe I think yeah again like super props for yeah being able to pull off something this cool. 413 00:43:11,85 --> 00:43:13,74 In a different country 414 00:43:13,79 --> 00:43:19,85 and like with clearly a full plate for yourself probably like getting everything done so yeah that's awesome well. 415 00:43:21,11 --> 00:43:22,40 OK so. 416 00:43:23,42 --> 00:43:27,92 I'm going to post a link to a video I have a couple so I have three things that I made 417 00:43:27,93 --> 00:43:29,94 and there are variations on on a theme. 418 00:43:31,63 --> 00:43:39,93 And I'm going to post a link here that I hope works for both of you I'm not exactly sure how heavy duty this video is 419 00:43:39,94 --> 00:43:58,35 I'm a little worried that it's giant but we'll see how it goes with Comcast now baby. I'm I'm. I'm not. That's really. 420 00:44:02,70 --> 00:44:09,42 Yes there we had employer get married started nineties I had the same wallet the air I had this war game wallet as well 421 00:44:09,87 --> 00:44:18,89 like you. The classic. You know the try for work whether chain wallets. 422 00:44:20,05 --> 00:44:33,77 With a heavy duty looking chain the wimpiest possible clip at the end this is very familiar to me. We're sitting here. 423 00:44:44,73 --> 00:44:53,88 There was also a gum wrapper THE KEEP QUIET Oh yes J.C. Penney's it doesn't even exist anymore. He's a mix and used to. 424 00:44:57,39 --> 00:44:57,64 Oh. 425 00:44:58,82 --> 00:45:07,02 I think I stole that from to do a queen so I just have to put that out there work and oh dear this looks scandalous. 426 00:45:09,95 --> 00:45:17,73 Something about explosive materials there's pictures there's pictures in this wallet this ninety S while searching I 427 00:45:17,74 --> 00:45:24,45 should also add that Rob is committing the curdle sin of the vertical oriented Yeah I'm sorry my phone over 428 00:45:24,46 --> 00:45:31,00 and over to try and get it this is it it says on the back of this photo. Stop turning it around. 429 00:45:34,00 --> 00:45:39,63 I didn't realise it was going to be vertical didn't he left on her last corner these are secret messages. 430 00:45:44,77 --> 00:45:50,73 From their peers or equipment and gear. Test all six devices. 431 00:45:52,36 --> 00:45:59,84 There's a challenge here we have a mission I feel like we're on a mission Oh my gosh there's. What is that. 432 00:46:00,22 --> 00:46:03,11 Action continue smashing key will fall out. 433 00:46:04,62 --> 00:46:05,80 Of the no hard drive 434 00:46:05,81 --> 00:46:13,76 and a hard to write a hateful kind of here we're talking about here oh we're on like a journey Oh my goodness we're 435 00:46:13,80 --> 00:46:15,78 going down the hallway stop turning your phone. 436 00:46:20,01 --> 00:46:22,67 Underground other pipe that's going to Parisian two 437 00:46:23,37 --> 00:46:29,78 or Vietnamese It is the third from the bottom we have to find the third cable connected to some. 438 00:46:30,85 --> 00:46:38,87 US So there it is reach is reading text that's found in the back of a pilot also never a battery that says. 439 00:46:40,23 --> 00:46:46,75 What the skin first to charge the battery make sure that something are in place to prevent shock Ouch. 440 00:46:48,69 --> 00:46:58,37 With the skin I don't know if these are not my suggestions I know Dad this is a photograph of one of those traffic 441 00:46:58,38 --> 00:47:06,94 signals but it says No dad. Oh. Are we going to head can only be traffic signal I said. 442 00:47:08,43 --> 00:47:13,57 I feel like we've been charged with some sort of a scavenger hunt. So. 443 00:47:14,86 --> 00:47:19,10 We have to complete this mission that has been you know. 444 00:47:20,19 --> 00:47:27,53 Bequest to us in this wallet of sorts you know this one's This one's complex it also tells us to keep quiet so where we 445 00:47:27,76 --> 00:47:31,87 are we failing right off the get go I mean we didn't just hear Nary. 446 00:47:34,53 --> 00:47:40,52 Oh it's not I also like it's kind of punk rock but then the receipt is for eleven pelligrino. 447 00:47:45,52 --> 00:47:53,89 OK So represents this is a more media set I'm doing so this is the second video Apologies again it's the vertically 448 00:47:53,90 --> 00:47:59,98 oriented video which should never happen in my life exactly Shulman ever maybe or maybe you want to feel read. 449 00:48:02,69 --> 00:48:07,86 The uncertainty Well wait away to sure my thing to see this video. 450 00:48:11,16 --> 00:48:11,95 More pictures 451 00:48:11,96 --> 00:48:20,46 and now we have a while at that's less ninety's this is sort of an evening's well maybe even the best port of Poti the 452 00:48:20,47 --> 00:48:27,23 honey bucket. This one this one is really hard to interpret because everything is. 453 00:48:30,01 --> 00:48:35,27 One of the photographs is the fork lock from a previous episode. 454 00:48:39,36 --> 00:48:46,47 Memory there's an indication of memory as an electrical day or climbing into a sewer something. 455 00:48:47,77 --> 00:48:56,60 Fifty feet down it's a measurement on a bucket so the second wallet. Is a little more adults maybe. 456 00:48:58,02 --> 00:49:02,57 There is a where you would normally put a picture of your kids or your driver's license 457 00:49:02,58 --> 00:49:05,23 or something there's a sort of fancy red sports car. 458 00:49:06,55 --> 00:49:12,87 And then these pictures are a little harder to get because they're going so fast 459 00:49:12,88 --> 00:49:17,08 but there's like a crazy sports car with an eagle mural on it 460 00:49:17,53 --> 00:49:24,07 and it says will he's under the rear we're driving down the highway. 461 00:49:25,80 --> 00:49:35,75 There's a landmark to note is a particular parking spot oh. You will have to dig for it the shipping container. 462 00:49:39,16 --> 00:49:43,27 Get me it takes less who I didn't even catch that well. 463 00:49:45,26 --> 00:49:51,80 You know there's like we're saying there's a electrical diagram to memorize climbing a certain distance down a ladder. 464 00:49:53,78 --> 00:50:03,42 There's an image of a hill just bad to point five It looks exactly. The mess that they made on Breaking Bad basically. 465 00:50:08,13 --> 00:50:13,23 I did not see Breaking Bad. Were. 466 00:50:16,29 --> 00:50:22,90 One of the features of that show was the the meth which is a crystal on the substance could be recognised because of 467 00:50:22,91 --> 00:50:35,14 its blue. Quality. OK Aaron if you get the third video it's a different more. Like a more modern world I think. 468 00:50:36,71 --> 00:50:55,29 It's like a. Mack truck limousine some sort. Expect pick up in September September OK. This photo is of. Things down. 469 00:50:56,56 --> 00:51:00,83 Destination it says on the back of text Morvern thinks yes. 470 00:51:02,14 --> 00:51:12,07 This may have been cans for a previous episode smash jar smash the jar is that is there's a pause there's a jar fixed 471 00:51:12,08 --> 00:51:13,61 into a wooden pole 472 00:51:14,05 --> 00:51:22,47 and some Lotus pockets keys in the bottom did to a sledge awesome can't wait to stick my hand in that. 473 00:51:26,01 --> 00:51:32,64 Again these container shipping containers of some sort but they have a second container not the first container. 474 00:51:33,82 --> 00:51:36,55 Have air vent so there's something inside. 475 00:51:39,88 --> 00:51:48,51 Someone is drawing this one seems to have more in common with the the second list so I was like it's a parallel set of 476 00:51:48,66 --> 00:51:51,35 those. More Internet. 477 00:51:52,41 --> 00:51:59,98 And there is a picture of cage is in Cubase in cages for purpose that's exactly what it is of course anything. 478 00:52:01,03 --> 00:52:08,10 Illuminated. To hear all the boxes of the technical material that we need to test. 479 00:52:09,42 --> 00:52:13,60 And surgical gear that's why we have to test it you want to make sure that works. 480 00:52:17,95 --> 00:52:22,71 You seem to figures in red as to people here Jane D. 481 00:52:22,72 --> 00:52:27,72 From No four they're assholes but useful Well now we know you're assholes 482 00:52:27,73 --> 00:52:34,74 but I'm going to getting the impression that all three of these well it's are giving us different perspectives on the 483 00:52:34,75 --> 00:52:37,33 same of it's true 484 00:52:37,34 --> 00:52:44,21 and there's some sort of a stem with a cocoon execs at maturity in a jar in a mason jar it's very hipster. 485 00:52:47,73 --> 00:53:04,97 Or tis no exotic I don't know what I'm looking at here warms maybe. Three stages of point. Warms larvae. Oh. I don't. 486 00:53:06,57 --> 00:53:07,91 Know mandibles it says 487 00:53:07,92 --> 00:53:13,58 but that means you have to look at that the teeth Yes Mostly I'm just noting the dirty fingernails. 488 00:53:14,73 --> 00:53:25,22 Trying not to see the. Bite will be painful result three days of a picture of somebody with their arm sort of bound in. 489 00:53:26,27 --> 00:53:35,04 The past. Someone. This was intense man is this is that all your documentation. 490 00:53:36,10 --> 00:53:41,25 You know so yes said that that is three wallets so I. 491 00:53:44,13 --> 00:53:49,64 I have had an idea that this is one of those projects where it's like I've had this idea in my head for. 492 00:53:50,79 --> 00:53:59,98 At least eight years well probably nine years way to percolate up on my list yeah. I just really didn't want to do. 493 00:54:00,01 --> 00:54:02,07 And I really have now. 494 00:54:03,53 --> 00:54:10,96 And and what I've always wanted to do with wallets is to so when you see a wallet on the ground right. 495 00:54:12,17 --> 00:54:17,82 I can imagine like I feel like everybody thinks one thing which is someone drop their well right like. 496 00:54:20,75 --> 00:54:27,25 And so what I've always wanted to do is to make art pieces contained inside while 497 00:54:27,73 --> 00:54:34,44 and then I I leave the wall it's just on the ground in various places for people to experience. 498 00:54:35,70 --> 00:54:41,04 And so this is my first three at temps at that idea. 499 00:54:43,21 --> 00:54:50,40 And so what I did is I went through all of the photos I had my computer over the past like ten years 500 00:54:50,41 --> 00:54:55,97 or however long I've been capturing digital photos and just randomly picked ones that I thought were cool 501 00:54:56,77 --> 00:55:00,19 and so I did about sixty photos got the sixty photos 502 00:55:00,20 --> 00:55:07,21 and then I broke them up into different categories either interesting object location or. 503 00:55:08,31 --> 00:55:13,12 Experience or vibe right like like thinking that maybe isn't a recognizable location 504 00:55:13,85 --> 00:55:22,06 but has some stuff going on in it and then I was like How do I create a stir different intriguing mysterious. 505 00:55:24,25 --> 00:55:33,97 Situations out of these stories and so I took roughly ten ish photos. And some receipts that I had laying around and. 506 00:55:35,50 --> 00:55:44,07 Essentially created a wallet that that a mysterious person has has dropped and it has sort of an important 507 00:55:44,26 --> 00:55:46,97 or critical mission for this person inside the wallet. 508 00:55:48,38 --> 00:55:53,20 And then the person who finds it would just find this wallet with these photos and stuff in it 509 00:55:53,21 --> 00:55:59,98 and just be like What is this like what what are these photos what is this mission and. 510 00:56:00,16 --> 00:56:10,01 And I I wanted the photos to be not really readily accessible as far as like if you were to like see you know San 511 00:56:10,02 --> 00:56:10,50 Francisco 512 00:56:10,51 --> 00:56:15,08 or something like that there's a couple places like on receipts where you can which gives that a little bit of believable 513 00:56:15,09 --> 00:56:18,04 context but it's not like super easy to figure out 514 00:56:18,29 --> 00:56:28,73 and so one of the stories the ones we just talked about is about a sort of underground. Bunker where. 515 00:56:30,07 --> 00:56:39,18 They're being being grown that people then. Get get bitten by and we don't really know why. 516 00:56:41,07 --> 00:56:49,61 And then the other one is a sort of yeah more pharmaceutical drug kind of underground lair I think that one is the one 517 00:56:49,62 --> 00:56:55,03 that you have to go into you could deduce that like oh you've got to go into a port a port a toilet 518 00:56:55,58 --> 00:56:59,38 and then like that's a fake portfolio and that actually takes you to an underground bunker. 519 00:57:00,47 --> 00:57:08,52 And then the other one is more misty The first one is a little bit more mysterious scenario but 520 00:57:08,56 --> 00:57:14,99 but yeah so this was me trying to sort of create a compelling narrative through just photos I have 521 00:57:15,00 --> 00:57:21,13 and through this kind of experience of you just picking the wallet off the ground on the sidewalk I mean like what is 522 00:57:21,14 --> 00:57:28,12 this. It reminds me. I'm hesitant to google it for reasons. 523 00:57:29,23 --> 00:57:31,97 But there's I think there's always these kind of like fortune. 524 00:57:33,05 --> 00:57:39,06 Narratives that are oh it's unclear whether or not they're true but it's somebody claiming you know to found the 525 00:57:39,07 --> 00:57:39,65 or whatever 526 00:57:40,14 --> 00:57:47,26 and the people will probably you know eleven year old kids are taking these photographs that try to make it seem like 527 00:57:47,70 --> 00:57:51,37 you know something super creepy as happened to them or or whatever but. 528 00:57:52,69 --> 00:57:59,13 Yeah I love it I'd be curious to see if is it important to you that the photographs are found because I would love for 529 00:57:59,14 --> 00:57:59,98 the photographs that. 530 00:58:00,01 --> 00:58:06,62 To all the work that the text of the text helps with what do you think about yeah that's a good question yeah I debated 531 00:58:06,63 --> 00:58:11,28 about that about yeah contextualizing the photos are making him feel. 532 00:58:13,34 --> 00:58:18,08 Like it was just photos and no text what does that look like or maybe the text only appears on the receipts 533 00:58:18,09 --> 00:58:24,06 or something you know so there's like a last. Even less framing but I chickened out and I went with the more. 534 00:58:25,99 --> 00:58:31,48 Have you ever read the think there is this great example I think it's an Atlas Obscura which ones of being like half 535 00:58:31,49 --> 00:58:39,07 the links that are sure that the. Simpsons already did it but they had this great story or wherever I read about. 536 00:58:40,59 --> 00:58:45,46 They took a corpse the United States government or at least the allies they took a corpse 537 00:58:45,50 --> 00:58:51,50 and dressed it up like it was a higher level military officer during World War two 538 00:58:51,98 --> 00:58:58,95 and then he had a briefcase attached to his hand that had all these fake documents so they put him on ice 539 00:58:59,00 --> 00:59:05,34 and they shot him out of a torpedo tube so he'd get washed up on I think of the coast of Spain 540 00:59:06,11 --> 00:59:09,41 and then the idea was like not only did they have to have all the fake documents 541 00:59:09,42 --> 00:59:15,83 but they did all this stuff like a fake ticket to a particular play in the U.K. 542 00:59:15,84 --> 00:59:19,41 At a certain you know so that as they were as the Germans 543 00:59:19,42 --> 00:59:26,63 or whoever was researching the validity of the material they had to create the sort of story that was you know evidence 544 00:59:26,64 --> 00:59:33,40 to support how this person would have made their way to this particular coast on that particular day wow that's cool 545 00:59:33,44 --> 00:59:39,24 that seems like that would be up your alley I'll try to find that Yes Yes hopefully so each of the wallets is for one 546 00:59:39,25 --> 00:59:46,99 of us Oh well yeah Taylor you get you get that trucker a while and your name is stamped on the wall. 547 00:59:48,35 --> 00:59:59,98 Just your first name and Taylor you get the other more kind of eighty's while but that's an area that I mean.. 548 00:59:55,65 --> 01:00:00,35 That's you you get the eighty's Well and and your initials T. H. 549 01:00:00,39 --> 01:00:04,68 Are stamped on that wallet and then I have like them more than the last one. 550 01:00:07,24 --> 01:00:14,12 In my first name is stamped on that wallet and I just want to ask like I will I will mail it to you 551 01:00:14,39 --> 01:00:22,51 and I'd like you to leave it in a place in or wherever you are that you think is would would. 552 01:00:24,27 --> 01:00:30,46 See rightward would conjure a mysterious interpretation. 553 01:00:32,35 --> 01:00:40,72 Of of this so so a place that maybe frames the story even well like a weird a weird place in your town 554 01:00:40,73 --> 01:00:46,15 or place that gives you the creeps or something like that OK I'm going to go in the middle of the night in the old. 555 01:00:49,29 --> 01:00:51,18 New middle of the Paris and leave it here. 556 01:00:53,47 --> 01:01:01,90 I was nervous about realising mailing I was like if you intercepted this package Well I think you think oh there are 557 01:01:01,91 --> 01:01:08,80 some photos in there there's there the underground photos are from the cattle Yeah I was like that looks like a 558 01:01:08,81 --> 01:01:10,96 catacomb Yeah yeah 559 01:01:11,00 --> 01:01:17,47 and then there's another one that is a photo of like a bunch of wiring like a white like conduit tubes 560 01:01:17,84 --> 01:01:24,44 and that is from there's a museum in Paris that I really love and have always been fascinated by 561 01:01:24,45 --> 01:01:31,69 and probably going to see of like it's like the anatomy museum if you with a proper name is put insurance 562 01:01:31,70 --> 01:01:41,11 but it's like tons and tons of animal scale so life is a shot or is it a museum. It's a museum there's a museum of. 563 01:01:42,81 --> 01:01:49,61 Every part of American history yes yes yeah I think that's any time this is you know a little bit 564 01:01:49,62 --> 01:01:57,22 and I wanted a nice man is this museum I know upstairs and downstairs Yes yes you're in our world the basement 565 01:01:57,57 --> 01:01:59,98 and in this museum because I've been there. 566 01:02:00,01 --> 01:02:03,55 Like five times with a kid Well that's where you get a job at the well 567 01:02:03,56 --> 01:02:10,90 and I think so yeah I mean look I actually send it to my fullest I might be able to answer right yeah right yeah 568 01:02:10,96 --> 01:02:15,03 because it has there's this amazing kind of like the the I think it's the base 569 01:02:15,04 --> 01:02:20,77 but the downside is that building has a really interesting arched ceiling and they're like vaulted ceilings 570 01:02:20,78 --> 01:02:25,97 but they were sort of bent the conduit to run around all the vaults It's totally amazing looking Yeah 571 01:02:26,15 --> 01:02:32,20 and so I took Ed taking a picture of that I was really into that and then decided to use it. So. 572 01:02:33,54 --> 01:02:39,78 Apologies again for the vertical video I think you're getting you know the stretch so was good for me yeah. 573 01:02:41,18 --> 01:02:48,92 So Rob I think we should we should do the finishing up is I thought also one of these went great yeah yeah yeah we're 574 01:02:48,93 --> 01:02:50,69 going to yeah I feel 575 01:02:50,70 --> 01:02:56,65 and that's kind of also I love how it was very analog even though we're watching it in a digital format like the video 576 01:02:56,66 --> 01:03:01,82 itself yeah so you know yeah I'm. I prefer that. 577 01:03:03,82 --> 01:03:10,64 It reminded me a lot I have you know this story about like these ideas of like discovering like developed. 578 01:03:11,84 --> 01:03:17,56 You know like what's the story totally that. You have to whether those photographs. 579 01:03:19,16 --> 01:03:21,44 I know I have coffee grounds that I was going to like. 580 01:03:23,53 --> 01:03:29,82 But I was really nervous about just destroying them so I was like maybe after the pod cast all done come 581 01:03:29,83 --> 01:03:34,10 and see how torn up they get but I did run over the wallets with Mike with my truck. 582 01:03:36,54 --> 01:03:38,78 So Aaron it's challenged there 583 01:03:38,79 --> 01:03:45,56 and lived on it some real challenge time OK so here I am in a foreign country with a language that I speak. 584 01:03:47,93 --> 01:03:53,59 Sort of I mean OK so now I took French when I was in high school I started learning it when I was like. 585 01:03:54,66 --> 01:03:59,98 Seventy when I was in Cameroon because when the driver sees me in the game room which is a French colony. 586 01:04:00,07 --> 01:04:06,16 So people speak French but it's African French which is a little different than French French 587 01:04:06,20 --> 01:04:12,43 and then I took French all through high school but two years of my French that I took I took 588 01:04:12,44 --> 01:04:22,80 when I was it living as an exchange student in Italy so I'm not sure what I got out of that. But being here I've been. 589 01:04:24,45 --> 01:04:28,24 You know spending time with a whole new set of cousins that. 590 01:04:29,58 --> 01:04:35,07 Are from my mom's one of her older brothers and I know everyone 591 01:04:35,11 --> 01:04:40,93 when we gather speaks in French that they know I can actually understand and sort of make my way in. 592 01:04:42,30 --> 01:04:48,92 And then in Vietnamese so they're speaking sort of a mix of I would call it Viet Ses It's like the enemy is 593 01:04:48,93 --> 01:04:53,17 and Hansei is always a together 594 01:04:53,57 --> 01:05:04,24 and for me as a polyglot I speak I think English is my you know native language the enemy is was my first language 595 01:05:04,25 --> 01:05:06,06 but I don't really speak it that well. 596 01:05:07,41 --> 01:05:10,08 French My Italian is better than my French 597 01:05:10,65 --> 01:05:16,10 and then I speak some Spanish of course in the immersion program in Los Angeles so I have moments where Mike I don't 598 01:05:16,11 --> 01:05:19,45 know what language these words are coming at me in 599 01:05:19,84 --> 01:05:26,70 and I'm trying to discern what language I'm supposed to be understanding because I also live here in Paris in the 600 01:05:26,71 --> 01:05:34,34 thirteenth home the small which is Chinatown essentially and I live in these great big towers that are. 601 01:05:35,36 --> 01:05:36,37 Thirty three stories 602 01:05:36,38 --> 01:05:42,11 and there's five of them so there's essentially thirty thousand people in like less than a square mile 603 01:05:42,85 --> 01:05:48,67 and everybody's an immigrant I guess in the sixties and seventies the mayor was like we're going to be like New York 604 01:05:48,68 --> 01:05:54,38 and they built these huge towers and then all the French Persians were like We're not going to live there 605 01:05:54,63 --> 01:05:59,98 and it was all recent immigrants who moved into these towers so it's continued in that tradition. 606 01:06:00,32 --> 01:06:05,64 You know thirty forty years later so it's a mix of lag. 607 01:06:07,22 --> 01:06:11,98 Predominantly Asian but also like various African countries 608 01:06:11,99 --> 01:06:16,57 and so I you know people earnestly speak to me in the elevator and I don't know what language they're speaking 609 01:06:16,61 --> 01:06:17,05 but I don't. 610 01:06:18,31 --> 01:06:24,05 Like Yes I I don't know what language it is but we're trying to communicate and so I've been 611 01:06:24,09 --> 01:06:32,73 and also I'm you know engaging in the city with a four year old so part of my job is to interpret everything for him 612 01:06:33,08 --> 01:06:39,03 like life right like what is that why does that work how does it work like that what is that for plan of the it's look 613 01:06:39,04 --> 01:06:43,69 what is that about my kid except. It's not for children. 614 01:06:45,65 --> 01:06:49,58 And then also like explaining like people say things to me in French 615 01:06:49,59 --> 01:06:54,30 and he'll be like what if they say I'm like they said that you can't do that why can't you do that I don't know because 616 01:06:54,31 --> 01:07:01,10 they're French they say no so stop touching the different animals in the zoo shop you know like you know everything is 617 01:07:01,11 --> 01:07:07,78 like. A process of interpreting and translating So my. 618 01:07:09,34 --> 01:07:22,28 My charge to you and to your future I guess is to create some sort of interpretation device. That can translate. 619 01:07:23,92 --> 01:07:35,55 Different languages and. See how that goes for you. Well that too I took somebody who wants us to feel horrible. 620 01:07:38,26 --> 01:07:42,90 I mean it may not be like an actual linguistic language that everyone knows 621 01:07:42,91 --> 01:07:47,49 and speaks Oh it's much like Esperanto is like that passed right or left 622 01:07:47,53 --> 01:07:55,30 but like I was just I was enjoying years sort of your impish delivery they're like you're your dear you're daring us 623 01:07:56,26 --> 01:07:59,19 here's a little bit of the area yeah well but I'm drinking it. 624 01:08:00,07 --> 01:08:07,77 I did this one and Performance Project it's ongoing where I take basically like fifty different spices 625 01:08:08,11 --> 01:08:13,57 and I lay them out on the table and people have to come up with someone they want to create an homage to 626 01:08:13,58 --> 01:08:20,78 and they identify six or seven adjectives but then they have to smell and taste all these different spices 627 01:08:20,79 --> 01:08:25,09 and translate those spices into those adjectives 628 01:08:25,10 --> 01:08:32,07 or translate those adjectives into a spice that represents that that energy that character that Essence 629 01:08:32,32 --> 01:08:37,09 and combine those spices into something else that makes like a spice mix for that person. 630 01:08:38,56 --> 01:08:46,76 May not be a language necessarily of the many languages of the world that people speak could be about dialects it could 631 01:08:46,77 --> 01:08:54,75 be about literally translating reinterpreting you know for example when I've listened to previous guest episodes 632 01:08:54,76 --> 01:09:00,15 and understood who heard step were essentially jargon or very technical. 633 01:09:03,36 --> 01:09:08,45 Oh man I feel like for once I already know what I'm going to do oh. 634 01:09:09,55 --> 01:09:17,55 That's good the boom that never happens no usually usually the first week is just like what am I doing Yeah you know 635 01:09:17,68 --> 01:09:24,07 this week is so hard I think and I think I get what I have a question about the challenge I have a question about 636 01:09:24,12 --> 01:09:24,38 but you know. 637 01:09:25,94 --> 01:09:28,64 I wrote down some things just as you were speaking about it 638 01:09:28,65 --> 01:09:35,03 and I just wanted to maybe get some clarification are some guidance for us in our next guest. 639 01:09:37,96 --> 01:09:45,19 Do you so often so the challenge becomes the title of the podcast and so we try to come up with maybe one 640 01:09:45,20 --> 01:09:51,54 or two words that embrace the concept in a way that sort of give our guest and Taylor 641 01:09:51,55 --> 01:09:56,15 and I a kind of place to keep coming back to over this first week where we're like OK what do we do 642 01:09:56,16 --> 01:10:03,09 and what do we do OK OK The phrase is this like as a. Way to kind of turn it over in her head and I was curious. 643 01:10:04,72 --> 01:10:10,33 If there's a couple of ways we could do it we could do we could use the word translation 644 01:10:10,37 --> 01:10:12,84 or we could use the word interpretation 645 01:10:13,54 --> 01:10:18,74 or both we could use the word devices which in some ways might conjure up physical objects. 646 01:10:20,28 --> 01:10:25,10 I was curious if you if you wanted to sort of summarize it into between one 647 01:10:25,11 --> 01:10:34,00 and three right words where would you go well just complexify which is not a word yeah this situation. 648 01:10:35,03 --> 01:10:43,09 You have the translation and it can be done of written text and interpretation is down of verbal or audio right up 649 01:10:43,10 --> 01:10:51,70 and so yeah because they're so different. Yeah I think. You could just pick what right. 650 01:10:54,13 --> 01:10:57,21 Many many moons ago when we had pagers. 651 01:10:58,53 --> 01:11:05,52 There was a young Asian American girl who had an odd green strike across her hair she had a crush on me 652 01:11:05,53 --> 01:11:09,73 and she would send me these texts and I was like kind of you've got to stop one. 653 01:11:11,13 --> 01:11:16,65 Like there's nothing that's going to happen between us even though you're really cool too I don't understand these 654 01:11:16,66 --> 01:11:20,81 texts that you're giving me like I don't know what you're sending me I don't know where they meet 655 01:11:21,32 --> 01:11:29,67 and instead of stopping texting me she gave me a small laminated card that like like what each text is meant to like a 656 01:11:29,68 --> 01:11:34,10 little text dictionary it was leading me to make you feel much better. 657 01:11:35,89 --> 01:11:38,56 It was like No no the whole point was stop texting me 658 01:11:39,09 --> 01:11:49,40 but Maria very insistent on communicating with me created this sort of key as it were for these text messages so that I 659 01:11:49,41 --> 01:11:53,19 would understand that one four three means I love you little fast. 660 01:11:54,51 --> 01:11:59,98 You know you can type out basis with like the numbers you have at things like a three five zero for. 661 01:12:00,07 --> 01:12:01,29 Thank you Nancy you know. 662 01:12:02,91 --> 01:12:12,19 So it could be some sort of a key for understanding a language or interpreting you know it could be an actual device. 663 01:12:13,40 --> 01:12:20,51 You know so one of the links that I posted on our little. Google doc here was about. 664 01:12:21,78 --> 01:12:29,33 Artificial intelligence creating their own language between themselves that they started basically in order to 665 01:12:29,34 --> 01:12:33,34 communicate faster among themselves develop their own language that humans couldn't understand 666 01:12:33,38 --> 01:12:38,60 and so then the humans were like well what works so stop know they put the kybosh 667 01:12:38,61 --> 01:12:42,88 and they said like we can no longer continue with this experiment. 668 01:12:44,01 --> 01:12:52,70 Because that AI machinery was creating a new language that was not understood by the humans that were that created this 669 01:12:52,74 --> 01:12:57,20 artificial intelligence so it could just be creating a new name with. 670 01:12:59,57 --> 01:13:04,10 So it could be it sounds like we have a lot of options that we feel like the key. 671 01:13:05,75 --> 01:13:10,64 I really like the short that word is there any However it could be 672 01:13:11,07 --> 01:13:20,67 but that's just my two cents a linguistic she actually of understanding has that. You know that a key of understanding. 673 01:13:22,37 --> 01:13:25,14 What we have so it's good to be yeah I got it. 674 01:13:26,27 --> 01:13:30,57 It's been typed here and you had a couple things that you were into that I just wanted to give you a quick second. 675 01:13:31,85 --> 01:13:44,87 Oh right so one I did link to my best friend's blog my best friend from the shipper as who has this journey with this 676 01:13:44,88 --> 01:13:45,71 tumor in her head 677 01:13:45,72 --> 01:13:53,30 and her blog posts are really phenomenal sort of way to think about our relationship to health care and 678 01:13:54,30 --> 01:13:59,67 and social justice and what does it mean to be you know diagnosed with some tumors in your head. 679 01:14:00,80 --> 01:14:07,47 You know those sort of uncertainty generator of you know so the life we live. 680 01:14:08,77 --> 01:14:10,14 So that's there 681 01:14:10,15 --> 01:14:21,03 but then I also put a couple links to projects that I'm working on like my my sausage is this hologram project that 682 01:14:21,04 --> 01:14:25,68 I've been doing called Vietnam more than love which highlights 683 01:14:25,69 --> 01:14:30,30 or projects a positive image of a beauty Cuvee enemies in Vietnam 684 01:14:30,31 --> 01:14:35,10 and in the diaspora that has instructions on how to make these cool little D.I.Y. 685 01:14:35,33 --> 01:14:41,02 Hologram projector so you can watch these specially formatted videos on your i Phone or your tablet. 686 01:14:42,58 --> 01:14:54,51 Go and then I made a cookbook because you know I'm not busy enough and. My friend Tammy when who runs. 687 01:14:55,67 --> 01:15:01,44 Passenger pigeon press we collaborated on a cookbook at called adoptions 688 01:15:02,07 --> 01:15:10,48 when a seasonal rumination on love which has a couple different seasons including monsoon season seductions season 689 01:15:10,49 --> 01:15:12,66 and it's my first cookbook 690 01:15:12,70 --> 01:15:20,14 and so there's a link there to how you can get your hands on this hand printed letter press hot print. 691 01:15:21,39 --> 01:15:33,52 It is very small edition. Cookbook with some recipes that are actually conceptual performative ruminations on love. 692 01:15:35,48 --> 01:15:41,06 Awesome Wow that's cool did you have any other links that you want to share anything you're into here into the design 693 01:15:41,07 --> 01:15:42,66 of my project was really aided 694 01:15:42,67 --> 01:15:49,85 and abetted by the McMaster code downloadable cared for so you're affected by this in the past 695 01:15:49,86 --> 01:15:56,61 but if you go to McMaster just about everything even down to the screws if you go as if you're going to purchase 696 01:15:56,62 --> 01:15:59,77 something but just click to get its model instead of buying it. 697 01:16:00,21 --> 01:16:04,46 You can actually get a really highly detailed and perfect measure three D. 698 01:16:04,47 --> 01:16:09,96 Model so I could just download you know that particular valve I was going to use in the different pipe nipples 699 01:16:09,97 --> 01:16:15,26 and stuff because I had worked with pneumatic systems before and so at first I had a really complicated 700 01:16:15,27 --> 01:16:20,20 when I was designing out and then the process of playing with the stuff in three D. 701 01:16:20,21 --> 01:16:23,66 Really helped so I didn't have to buy it all first what I wanted 702 01:16:23,67 --> 01:16:29,82 and what I didn't want to buy That's great yeah that's great I did not know that even though I've been to that Web site 703 01:16:29,83 --> 01:16:30,71 of a bunch site 704 01:16:30,72 --> 01:16:37,55 and never dug into that do you go should we do it to night yeah it's really cool I always buy something and I get it 705 01:16:37,56 --> 01:16:41,46 and it's like six times because I did it for six times smaller than I imagined. 706 01:16:42,52 --> 01:16:47,03 I have done this to not have the same sort of. For writing things that I'm buying. 707 01:16:48,13 --> 01:16:54,60 Also weirdly and McMaster stainless steel is almost always cheaper than other things when it comes to hardware 708 01:16:54,61 --> 01:17:03,02 and it always always surprises me so that's another master trick for you no rust spots in Chicago that's good I only 709 01:17:03,03 --> 01:17:06,73 have one thing and that's. There Carter who's a house D.J. 710 01:17:06,74 --> 01:17:11,29 I like a lot he just released a mix on accelerator which is like a. 711 01:17:12,30 --> 01:17:16,53 Culture magazine I guess I don't recall them anymore but their five hundred podcast 712 01:17:16,54 --> 01:17:22,38 and it's super great museum like a techno fan but I love to Carter's mixes and. 713 01:17:23,66 --> 01:17:24,95 I've been jamming that like all week 714 01:17:24,96 --> 01:17:29,68 and it's been actually like a super This is a little bit like sad old electronic music person 715 01:17:29,69 --> 01:17:35,20 but it's like really boosted my productivity. Like like. 716 01:17:36,66 --> 01:17:39,06 Just like jam out to this mix but I'm working on stuff 717 01:17:39,07 --> 01:17:41,88 and enjoying it so I definitely encourage you all to check it out. 718 01:17:43,13 --> 01:17:49,70 Cool thanks will wrap up the challenge you can find photos of our finished projects on our project site called Projects 719 01:17:49,71 --> 01:17:50,65 dot opposable park S. 720 01:17:50,66 --> 01:17:57,91 Dot com Again that euro is project stuff opposable podcast dot com It is looking awesome Thank you Taylor for rocking 721 01:17:57,92 --> 01:17:59,94 out you can listens. 722 01:18:00,01 --> 01:18:06,11 Episodes directly unopposed ballpark Us dot com You can also subscribe to opposable thumbs with i Tunes overcast 723 01:18:06,12 --> 01:18:08,85 ditcher and all the other high caste app platforms. 724 01:18:10,47 --> 01:18:16,60 We would like to send you an opposable thumb sticker so if you share a podcast with a friend or on social media 725 01:18:16,85 --> 01:18:18,76 or rate us on i Tunes or do something like that. 726 01:18:19,83 --> 01:18:22,71 Just let us know you did it and send us your address and we'll drop you a sticker in the mail. 727 01:18:23,77 --> 01:18:25,71 And you have stickers in the mail coming to you as well. 728 01:18:27,48 --> 01:18:33,22 Are our sticker on Logo was created by will mask you can check out his work it will mask our U.K. 729 01:18:33,34 --> 01:18:35,53 He's a super nice person really great to work with. 730 01:18:36,93 --> 01:18:44,96 We have some patriotic awesome this nick we'd like to have Nick a shot at our top picture on supporter Thanks Nick if 731 01:18:44,97 --> 01:18:49,91 you'd like to join Nick in the league pitcher on supporter of bad asses please go to patron dot com slash opposable 732 01:18:49,92 --> 01:18:56,21 thumbs to sponsor us I just want to quit shit to our history and listeners do so. 733 01:18:57,96 --> 01:19:02,51 Yeah yeah yeah Australia's really picked up in the in that in the in the download numbers 734 01:19:02,98 --> 01:19:09,12 and you know thanks Thanks Audie that's great our podcast is dedicated to providing a harassment free experience for 735 01:19:09,13 --> 01:19:15,35 everyone regardless of race gender age sexual orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject 736 01:19:15,36 --> 01:19:19,83 matter or religion or the lack thereof we actively support an inclusive environment 737 01:19:19,84 --> 01:19:28,28 and we want you to be a part of it you can check our full code of conduct over at our site and. What else we got. 738 01:19:29,65 --> 01:19:35,60 All we have left is to say thanks to Aaron So Aaron thanks you so much for being our guest you know you had a ton going 739 01:19:35,61 --> 01:19:36,00 on your own 740 01:19:36,01 --> 01:19:44,16 and now that you are first person in a different country of the United States national international keeping the 741 01:19:44,17 --> 01:19:51,02 International Open coming is there anything else on the way Iran that you want to let people know about have any shows 742 01:19:51,03 --> 01:19:59,98 or live in person thingamabobs or just website updates Well my web site Erin dash O'Brian dot com. 743 01:20:00,53 --> 01:20:08,27 Has most of the fun things so you can kind of see my work coming projects that I'm working on I'm thinking about 744 01:20:08,28 --> 01:20:21,47 refugees and resisting food so it's coming there's a couple we'll see about me possibly Portland in the fall. A few G.E. 745 01:20:21,48 --> 01:20:47,12 Resistance dinner. Maybe. That'll Portlanders keep it out. I used to see tell used to. 746 01:20:48,19 --> 01:20:55,86 Bike up this kind of enormous hill towards Pasadena and. Air and ice path would often overlap. 747 01:20:57,60 --> 01:21:01,99 In the morning and I would be like. Playing up the hill. ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### ####################################################################################### 1 00:00:16,25 --> 00:00:21,87 Welcome to the opposable thumbs podcast opposable thumbs is a podcast where Taylor Robb Tecla new creative challenge 2 00:00:21,88 --> 00:00:25,05 every two weeks and talk about our accomplishments failures 3 00:00:25,06 --> 00:00:32,93 and lessons learned our show Romo is our guest this week Greetings Arturo How are you all do a good Have a good we are 4 00:00:32,94 --> 00:00:38,77 excited to have you on my name is Robert I use the he has gender pronoun I run the exoskeleton arts based in Los 5 00:00:38,78 --> 00:00:43,44 Angeles and I'm also an experienced director at an interactive agency here in Los Angeles. 6 00:00:44,79 --> 00:00:49,29 And Taylor Hoke Ansen basted of Chicago who artist. 7 00:00:50,67 --> 00:00:59,84 Engineer noted tall person and I like that he is pronouns and I might go I go by his and I'm an artist 8 00:00:59,88 --> 00:01:09,10 and educator from Los Angeles I mostly draw I also write and take photographs. And most of my work is collaborative. 9 00:01:10,11 --> 00:01:14,05 Although I do have a personal individual studio practice. 10 00:01:16,30 --> 00:01:17,64 For the past ten years 11 00:01:17,65 --> 00:01:24,22 or so it's been a little strange talk about projects for me because I mostly work outside the context of the art world 12 00:01:24,23 --> 00:01:25,01 and the art market. 13 00:01:26,58 --> 00:01:31,82 I distribute a lot of my work through scenes and postcards and as gifts 14 00:01:32,38 --> 00:01:37,88 and I'm also a public school teacher I teach visual arts and media at the L.A. 15 00:01:37,89 --> 00:01:44,48 River or that's in north east Los Angeles and I'm part of art of the United Teachers Los Angeles. 16 00:01:46,26 --> 00:01:51,80 So I love this for many reasons but one of them I remember having a conversation with a friend of mine 17 00:01:52,28 --> 00:01:54,19 and she accidently said well you know 18 00:01:54,23 --> 00:01:59,98 and anybody who is truly going to make it in the art world has since moved away from Chicago to L.A. or. 19 00:02:00,01 --> 00:02:03,38 New York without realizing that she was talking to me who had not moved away. 20 00:02:05,33 --> 00:02:12,79 But I do I do so enjoy talking to other people where it turns out that not every single human in Los Angeles 21 00:02:12,80 --> 00:02:19,45 or New York is part of this you know grind of a system where you make it where you know if you do it correctly right. 22 00:02:21,94 --> 00:02:24,76 Yeah and it's mostly I mean I think that was the thing that kind of. 23 00:02:26,44 --> 00:02:30,00 There's many things that are maybe off putting about Los Angeles to someone from afar but. 24 00:02:31,54 --> 00:02:37,52 When you get here you kind of realize like oh it's actually way more complicated 25 00:02:37,53 --> 00:02:44,91 and interesting than you think it is you know like like there's like a very expensive marketing arm of Los Angeles that 26 00:02:44,95 --> 00:02:51,25 functions one way but then the rest of the city just does its thing yeah and some for L.A. Has been continuous and. 27 00:02:52,28 --> 00:03:09,62 Since it was taken from a mainstream Islam has kind of kind of never stops and. Somehow.. 28 00:03:01,84 --> 00:03:09,62 Has been to flatten out in a certain way. Make it make it simple and palatable How have you lived in L.A. 29 00:03:11,44 --> 00:03:18,31 Five generations Wow. That's awesome. You know while. 30 00:03:21,27 --> 00:03:27,64 I feel that I feel like as a white person I should instantly be ready to talk about which of my ancestors landed on 31 00:03:27,65 --> 00:03:34,93 Plymouth Rock. That was a much faster to a go you are right you know. 32 00:03:36,15 --> 00:03:39,71 As it as it turns out Rob and I we did our two hours on whiteness 33 00:03:39,72 --> 00:03:45,77 and then we wash our hands will never have to have the work done clearly clearly and I'm going. 34 00:03:49,64 --> 00:03:54,31 I was just curious did our show did you did you grow up near where you live today 35 00:03:54,32 --> 00:03:59,98 or did you go up into the part of the California I really. Know I grew up in Highland Park So OK it was. 36 00:04:00,12 --> 00:04:02,52 To the neighborhood I live in now which is Lincoln Heights. 37 00:04:04,43 --> 00:04:07,85 Wow that's cool I knew you were a long time 38 00:04:07,86 --> 00:04:12,23 but I didn't know it was that long that's cool yeah my mom's side it's actually Southern California 39 00:04:12,24 --> 00:04:17,69 and my mom say we go back five generations and that's actually between Pasadena. 40 00:04:19,36 --> 00:04:23,79 And and Wilmington and some petro 41 00:04:23,80 --> 00:04:31,41 and Long Beach Oh yeah yeah so so would that be is the general idea that a generation is about thirty years 42 00:04:31,42 --> 00:04:38,43 or like how far back does that put your folks and Mexico where in California rather. Than seeing. 43 00:04:40,61 --> 00:04:47,16 One hundred twenty hundred fifty years yeah it's about that actually yeah. But I mean the fifth. 44 00:04:48,33 --> 00:04:57,19 Generation and sister was and there was an immigrant to California to this area and then her and her son was also. 45 00:04:58,24 --> 00:05:04,92 So he was already he was already a child when the thing OK. Yeah at that point. 46 00:05:06,02 --> 00:05:12,15 I mean even up until very recently the border wasn't militarized there was a lot of it was porous there's a lot of 47 00:05:12,16 --> 00:05:22,51 people who just lived lives that where there were back and or. It's I saw. Speaking of the border I saw. 48 00:05:24,00 --> 00:05:32,25 A visual art work shoot I had to look it up and post it and show notes but it was. A video artist's work. 49 00:05:33,56 --> 00:05:40,22 That was from I think the seventy's and it was one of the border locations 50 00:05:40,26 --> 00:05:47,98 and it was it was just like it looked like just if you dislike hopped out of your car on the freeway 51 00:05:48,13 --> 00:05:52,37 and like started recording like it was cars went back and forth that quickly you know like 52 00:05:53,06 --> 00:05:59,89 and I think it was into you want to and you know sort of San Diego like that that that border crossing and it was like. 53 00:06:00,54 --> 00:06:02,58 I mean it literally like the freeway was just you know. 54 00:06:03,82 --> 00:06:12,04 It's like whoa man I'm like now you wait like you could easily wait two hours like like usually to just in your car 55 00:06:12,05 --> 00:06:16,06 with a car running like with you know it's horrible 56 00:06:16,14 --> 00:06:22,47 but yeah I was I was already theater media totally you you are an art teacher in Los Angeles 57 00:06:22,75 --> 00:06:25,62 and I have seen I have been to your school once 58 00:06:25,66 --> 00:06:34,34 and I think I was dropping off something for Jen who was visiting one of your classes and it was really cool 59 00:06:34,35 --> 00:06:41,02 and I was curious if you could just talk a little bit about how the school is structured it's like many schools kind of 60 00:06:41,03 --> 00:06:48,00 packed into one it might in my remembering that quickly Yeah that's right the campus is called so on yes up on my own 61 00:06:48,67 --> 00:06:59,59 and. And it's actually it's actually a. Series of it's a it's a larger campus that has five schools and. 62 00:07:00,60 --> 00:07:02,92 The unique thing about the campuses that. 63 00:07:03,99 --> 00:07:10,34 Are one of the neat things about it is that where colocated with charter schools so these are public charter schools 64 00:07:11,29 --> 00:07:21,04 but that's. That's not usually the case with with the public schools yeah but but there was a whole trend. 65 00:07:22,48 --> 00:07:27,11 Maybe about ten years ago too. To open smaller schools up. 66 00:07:28,15 --> 00:07:35,07 Because the data and studies and and a go at all evidence showed that. 67 00:07:36,75 --> 00:07:40,06 Humans just like to be around smaller communities right. 68 00:07:41,45 --> 00:07:43,16 Now that we exist better 69 00:07:43,17 --> 00:07:50,05 and smaller communities where more people know us then you know going to school with four thousand 70 00:07:50,06 --> 00:07:52,31 or six thousand students and three tracks 71 00:07:52,32 --> 00:07:58,92 and you know those where those created a lot of dysfunction just because of the structure of them so yeah so it's. 72 00:08:00,13 --> 00:08:07,37 When you put all the numbers together it works out to be like one big high school that are made up of. 73 00:08:09,67 --> 00:08:17,36 Smaller schools everything's between you know three three fifty and four hundred students at school. 74 00:08:19,46 --> 00:08:25,27 And it's great it's it was actually part of another another. 75 00:08:28,85 --> 00:08:35,91 Response to population growth and and the fact that schools were totally overcrowded and 76 00:08:36,28 --> 00:08:42,73 and kind of inhumane places because of that overcrowding so they built a bunch in the schools 77 00:08:42,74 --> 00:08:44,60 and that used the overcrowding. 78 00:08:46,37 --> 00:08:54,23 And as a result I get to work at a brand new school I think maybe you saw Rob with we have we have built in project 79 00:08:54,24 --> 00:08:57,06 areas and built in speakers where 80 00:08:57,07 --> 00:09:04,98 when I first started teaching if you wanted to show a video you would have to like sign that sign up for a T.V. 81 00:09:04,99 --> 00:09:10,19 That was on wheels and then that will it over and right nobody could hear it because the volume then go up higher 82 00:09:10,55 --> 00:09:17,31 and it was just a mess but now everything's kind of built into it so yeah I mean I will say that I feel like. 83 00:09:19,75 --> 00:09:23,96 My sense of what public schools was like is kind of largely shaped by the wire. 84 00:09:26,26 --> 00:09:29,63 You know and how did you did you go to private school room No I didn't but 85 00:09:29,67 --> 00:09:35,90 but like of like I just assumed it was use here like oh it's so much work it's so bad I whatever 86 00:09:36,33 --> 00:09:39,12 and I'm sure certainly in places it is done describing map 87 00:09:39,13 --> 00:09:45,36 but like you just think like oh this month these must just be like a little meat factories you know at this point. 88 00:09:47,49 --> 00:09:50,49 But I was you know you like your students were super engaged 89 00:09:50,50 --> 00:09:56,84 and like they were they were I don't know like it was really impressive and cool and it wasn't like a fancy 90 00:09:56,85 --> 00:09:59,98 but it was certainly like nice and it was cool that like. 91 00:10:01,20 --> 00:10:08,74 Your room was set up it was a really creative place you know it wasn't like like at my public school we had a lot of 92 00:10:08,75 --> 00:10:14,85 these things called portables which was a like a double wide trailer right that had like this you know high traffic 93 00:10:14,86 --> 00:10:15,91 flowing and stuff and 94 00:10:15,95 --> 00:10:22,98 and Florida totally yeah yeah yeah so it was it was I don't know school like there was a kind of neat vibe 95 00:10:22,99 --> 00:10:27,76 and I guess probably you are a work in action but I was just it was pretty neat 96 00:10:28,06 --> 00:10:35,30 and the students were seem really interesting So how did you become an arts educator. 97 00:10:37,34 --> 00:10:39,40 Well I've always taught I've always. 98 00:10:40,80 --> 00:10:51,64 Probably I mean even since I was a child that was making art my parents were both artists so my father hasn't painted 99 00:10:51,65 --> 00:10:58,51 in many years when I was growing up he was a. Steady painter and he made ceramics. 100 00:11:00,89 --> 00:11:06,05 And my mom still was an artist today she's a wood worker. And she's. 101 00:11:07,53 --> 00:11:15,31 She makes clothes and curtains she works with fabric. And she's also a master planner an organizer and. 102 00:11:16,87 --> 00:11:22,45 She's the type of person if she needs a box a certain size for certain objects she's going to make it out Taylor we 103 00:11:22,46 --> 00:11:31,39 have to get out here as mom and. She that's great Do you think she'd be interested in such a thing I can ask you. 104 00:11:33,20 --> 00:11:43,32 Wait wait wait is she right there NO NO. That would be X. Rat Yeah OK sorry. 105 00:11:44,54 --> 00:11:49,67 Yes So I grew up around art so I was always you know I grew up around art I was. 106 00:11:51,28 --> 00:11:55,35 I was taken to self-help graphics as a kid I got to know. 107 00:11:56,49 --> 00:11:59,98 She got an artist in the community really early on before I ever. 108 00:12:00,01 --> 00:12:09,67 Really knew what art was what being an artist meant but at the same time I had a parallel track of always tutoring. 109 00:12:10,86 --> 00:12:19,91 Starting probably in high school and then definitely into college being a tutor for younger people and. 110 00:12:20,96 --> 00:12:27,88 And I knew that. I knew that I didn't necessarily want to be the type of artist. 111 00:12:30,63 --> 00:12:38,24 Who household who was part of the hustle to get in to make a living to sustain a life in the gallery system. 112 00:12:39,46 --> 00:12:46,27 And so teaching was always there for me and I actually left after meeting session who. 113 00:12:48,89 --> 00:12:52,39 Was also a teacher he's a teacher at Bravo medical magnet. 114 00:12:54,37 --> 00:13:01,86 Who he he provided me a model along with a few other people who are producing artists who are artists who are who are 115 00:13:01,87 --> 00:13:06,50 producing really interesting work and dynamic work and had a you know like a living practice 116 00:13:06,79 --> 00:13:12,58 and who are also public school teachers and and it made sense to me I made sense to me 117 00:13:12,59 --> 00:13:16,62 and I'm not some I think some people and some artists thrive off of. 118 00:13:18,84 --> 00:13:25,31 The thrill of instability and and I find it really hard to work when I'm when I'm not stable 119 00:13:25,55 --> 00:13:33,03 and so it just makes sense to my life to continue teaching and and and making art at the same time. 120 00:13:35,14 --> 00:13:37,20 You know there is kind of a room meant to says I'm. 121 00:13:38,25 --> 00:13:44,50 Being irresponsible and are making like taking risks that would expose yourself or your family. 122 00:13:46,01 --> 00:13:50,71 And yeah but I think there's a lot of pressure not to make those calm 123 00:13:51,31 --> 00:13:56,54 and cautious decisions because it's not really associated with creativity read right you know but it 124 00:13:56,55 --> 00:13:59,98 but it is a very creative thing to try and you know little. 125 00:14:00,11 --> 00:14:01,94 Live a life that is stable 126 00:14:01,95 --> 00:14:07,84 and make work that is exciting at the same time yeah yeah I think it's true I mean a lot of hardness of. 127 00:14:09,57 --> 00:14:13,76 Building and it is it becomes really hard after a certain point in your life. 128 00:14:14,96 --> 00:14:19,89 To continuing and you are making work about being precarious you know. 129 00:14:22,03 --> 00:14:28,01 You know I went I went to school with this guy Mike Williams or Big Mike as we all called him 130 00:14:28,02 --> 00:14:35,57 and he her member so well that he made somebody cried during a critique you know usually it's the other way around 131 00:14:36,26 --> 00:14:37,68 someone else's work and they cry 132 00:14:37,97 --> 00:14:44,80 but he made a critiquer cry because he had his studio was arranged in this really messy fashion 133 00:14:45,10 --> 00:14:48,25 but if you examine it really carefully it would say you know fuck you 134 00:14:48,26 --> 00:14:51,48 and so forth kind of written as you would examine different surfaces 135 00:14:51,90 --> 00:14:54,06 and one of the one of the students started to cry 136 00:14:54,07 --> 00:15:00,39 and she said you know you're the truest artists I've ever met so far like I if anyone's going to make it in this field 137 00:15:00,43 --> 00:15:06,57 you will and I just feel so rejected by you that you're pushing away on a school and I 138 00:15:06,84 --> 00:15:10,54 and I think the last time I heard about that I haven't talked to in years 139 00:15:10,55 --> 00:15:19,26 but he was touring with a rat he made like an art rap group that was touring Japan singing songs about werewolves 140 00:15:19,27 --> 00:15:21,01 and he broke his arm doing a staged 141 00:15:21,24 --> 00:15:28,19 or something like that I feel like like that dude yeah he could he could totally live in that space permanently 142 00:15:28,20 --> 00:15:31,74 and that would just I would find it so exhausting after like fifteen minutes yeah. 143 00:15:35,29 --> 00:15:41,63 Or right so I also as you mentioned I know a lot of your work as a collaborative practice and I 144 00:15:41,68 --> 00:15:47,21 and I know of quite a few projects you've done with sets you Foster who you mentioned and also such Bayless 145 00:15:47,22 --> 00:15:50,31 and I was just curious what you're up to right now if you're collaborating with folks 146 00:15:50,32 --> 00:15:54,08 or if you have other things that you're doing solo or what's taken. 147 00:15:56,11 --> 00:15:59,98 Well I have an ongoing collaboration with session room. 148 00:16:02,80 --> 00:16:10,21 So she wrote so she wrote a book called City Terrace field manual it was about partly about his experience growing up 149 00:16:10,22 --> 00:16:19,86 and City Terrace but also. I mean to limit it to. Describing it as a memoir doesn't really do it justice. 150 00:16:23,13 --> 00:16:25,72 But that's how I first started knowing his writing. 151 00:16:27,80 --> 00:16:34,44 And I actually met so she through his daughter Marina who's was my age and we played soccer together. 152 00:16:35,76 --> 00:16:39,32 When we were kids and I always knew somehow he was a writer. 153 00:16:41,70 --> 00:16:47,54 But I didn't I didn't know what he wrote until I read City Terrace field manual when I was in college 154 00:16:48,23 --> 00:16:53,78 and I started sending him drawings and this was kind of like through mail and 155 00:16:54,26 --> 00:16:58,87 and then he he sent me back some poems that were titled The same title I had given the drawings. 156 00:17:00,49 --> 00:17:01,65 When I got those poems back. 157 00:17:02,99 --> 00:17:07,85 I felt I just couldn't produce a drawing that was better than the palm or match them all 158 00:17:08,63 --> 00:17:17,28 and it took me you know took me about half a year maybe to finally get it to where I wasn't embarrassed to send him the 159 00:17:17,29 --> 00:17:19,25 time back a new drawing back 160 00:17:19,84 --> 00:17:26,00 and that's how we that's how I remember us starting to work together so it's an it's been an ongoing collaboration 161 00:17:26,54 --> 00:17:27,91 and we've done work. 162 00:17:30,77 --> 00:17:37,11 Ranges I mean we've done performances called the recent rupture Radio Hour which is kind of a talk show like a fake 163 00:17:37,12 --> 00:17:40,31 radio talk show in front of a live audience. 164 00:17:42,97 --> 00:17:48,50 Most of our practice is actually driving and walking around East Los Angeles and north east L.A. 165 00:17:49,28 --> 00:17:52,97 and Looking at things and seeing things and discussing history. 166 00:17:54,53 --> 00:17:59,43 And some of those walks have been folded into collaborative videos that he and I have made. 167 00:18:01,10 --> 00:18:06,38 That are like silent films and subtitles. We. 168 00:18:10,34 --> 00:18:15,16 We've worked on written pieces together that are published online but I think our biggest project 169 00:18:16,05 --> 00:18:22,74 or biggest project is. Is a book called The East Los Angeles vertical transit lines which is. 170 00:18:24,24 --> 00:18:31,29 A novel that I contribute photos and drawings to and some writing and Seshu that's actually wrote. 171 00:18:32,29 --> 00:18:42,54 Most of it and it's about. This. Derivable. Durable transit company that keeps getting resurrected. 172 00:18:43,95 --> 00:18:52,20 Every few generations after it gets lost and yes bins of history so is this related to the the image that I see 173 00:18:52,71 --> 00:19:00,69 when researching you where it looks like an enormous Paddy Power and squash. Who I read about that you have. So. 174 00:19:01,94 --> 00:19:07,44 We have we have different obsessions that come that that come up through conversation I mean a lot of our conversation 175 00:19:07,45 --> 00:19:10,90 and collaboration does have a lot to deal honestly with. 176 00:19:12,13 --> 00:19:19,21 With jokes like just laughing a lot together and racing and verbal riffing back and forth. 177 00:19:20,63 --> 00:19:30,91 And that's where we have a whole I'm going. Riff of. Vegetables that are humans and and and. 178 00:19:32,10 --> 00:19:34,97 Human like vegetables and vegetable like humans 179 00:19:35,69 --> 00:19:42,56 and so one of the technologies at the dreadful company this fictitious durable company came up with was solar powered 180 00:19:42,84 --> 00:19:51,35 solar powered originals that were grown on rooftop gardens. So that's that's the squash surely I. 181 00:19:52,56 --> 00:19:59,56 Should have in a project. For sure. You're going to go on a limb today and go first and then are true as custom. 182 00:20:00,04 --> 00:20:03,36 Why don't you go second and then I'll just be able to take a nap. 183 00:20:06,22 --> 00:20:18,32 So Aaron has given us the challenge of keys of understanding. And. I. Wrestled with this one quite a bit. 184 00:20:19,60 --> 00:20:29,47 But I have something. As cool how many days ago did you get started in earnest What's your wrestling was over. Well. 185 00:20:31,23 --> 00:20:39,19 I started super wrestling last. Thursday. That's about a week ago. 186 00:20:40,32 --> 00:20:47,38 What's that what's the one week mark to starts getting a little panicked Yes Yeah yeah I Archer I'm curious 187 00:20:47,39 --> 00:20:52,43 and maybe we can talk about this when we when we see your work but I think for Taylor 188 00:20:52,44 --> 00:20:54,68 and I you know we have this is our twelfth time doing this and. 189 00:20:55,79 --> 00:20:58,06 We're used to having you know roughly two weeks to work on stuff 190 00:20:58,91 --> 00:21:06,25 and you know you spin that first little while just being like. You know and then. 191 00:21:07,37 --> 00:21:07,73 Taylor 192 00:21:07,74 --> 00:21:12,63 and I have got this place where it's like we don't speak to one another about this we talk to one another about like 193 00:21:12,64 --> 00:21:15,19 various podcast things but not what we're working on and. 194 00:21:16,69 --> 00:21:24,13 But we both have sort of I think we both now I know like about a weekend you start to get that like feeling of like oh 195 00:21:24,64 --> 00:21:30,14 God what am I going to do because you just know like well if I have to order something 196 00:21:30,15 --> 00:21:31,48 or something it could take a few days 197 00:21:31,49 --> 00:21:36,55 or I have to you know do something let it cure overnight like I do all this stuff 198 00:21:36,98 --> 00:21:42,65 and this is actually a project that doesn't normally happen to me but I debated back 199 00:21:42,66 --> 00:21:48,26 and forth between two projects for too long and that was the thing that made it made it tough for me. 200 00:21:49,96 --> 00:22:11,13 By a problem so I have too many. Have too many not good enough ideas OK let's see. Here comes. Close. 201 00:22:13,30 --> 00:22:26,19 And so it looks like. When I'm with you now is. Black and White Aleck and white things are printed. 202 00:22:28,34 --> 00:22:39,72 Looks like letter size paper folded in half. And it has multiple pages. On the start in the last photo I see which is. 203 00:22:40,79 --> 00:22:47,24 Looks like instructions for or bicycling in the city so there is. On the left hand side. 204 00:22:48,95 --> 00:22:56,47 Of the paper there is immediate foreground of a dashboard of a car and I have very icon like an abstract in. 205 00:22:57,51 --> 00:23:02,11 And then we're looking through the windshield of the car kind of from the driver's perspective 206 00:23:02,12 --> 00:23:04,86 and then there's a road disappearing into. 207 00:23:06,36 --> 00:23:15,57 Then your perspective towards a series of skyscrapers in the distance and between the city that's in the distance 208 00:23:15,58 --> 00:23:24,26 and and the driver's test or it is a one two three four. Or bicyclists like that using. 209 00:23:25,68 --> 00:23:26,25 Gestures 210 00:23:26,26 --> 00:23:33,52 and turning signals you know one of the things that I'm noticing is that so I didn't realize that there were two 211 00:23:33,53 --> 00:23:35,86 acceptable terms for turning right. 212 00:23:37,24 --> 00:23:37,93 Something about it 213 00:23:37,94 --> 00:23:44,10 when on a bike I mean I suppose there's the one that you're supposed to do which only the fancy folks do 214 00:23:44,11 --> 00:23:47,40 and then there's the one that everybody actually does which is just pointing to the right. 215 00:23:53,45 --> 00:23:53,68 You know 216 00:23:53,69 --> 00:23:59,33 and first of all man Archer Oh really really I mean talk about somebody who's practiced their formal analysis to. 217 00:24:00,28 --> 00:24:07,91 He nailed it. As a very clear picture our teacher like in the house where you have got practice in this. 218 00:24:10,53 --> 00:24:14,77 Yeah I think I mean there's definitely it's a graphical language 219 00:24:14,85 --> 00:24:20,68 and on certain pages I'm reminded of the kind of so you know you could call them I come. 220 00:24:21,81 --> 00:24:25,98 It's that sort of thing where something is really stripped down and just presented in black 221 00:24:25,99 --> 00:24:35,69 and white in a simple lines as possible some are more of the others so for example there's a little bad that looks like 222 00:24:35,70 --> 00:24:37,91 a spray paint can and there's one that looks like 223 00:24:37,92 --> 00:24:42,81 but not killers there's also one that looks like two people having missionary sex. 224 00:24:44,46 --> 00:24:50,09 And so well or perhaps money being burned 225 00:24:50,31 --> 00:24:57,73 and so I'm particularly attracted to the ones that you know this kind of iconography I can a graphic language I think 226 00:24:57,74 --> 00:25:04,33 usually is intended to simplify something so I'm really interested in the ones that leave me with more questions than 227 00:25:04,34 --> 00:25:10,74 they answer. You know and I think I'm liking the fact that I connoisseur was. 228 00:25:12,14 --> 00:25:18,65 So clear and instantly recognizable that there are some that's in this. And the community. 229 00:25:21,29 --> 00:25:27,27 There's a multi-tool I think if you're a bicyclist you know some of these a little better like yes one 230 00:25:27,28 --> 00:25:38,17 and certainly bicyclists oriented Yeah there's one on the upper right. On the right and on the upper right. 231 00:25:39,52 --> 00:25:40,79 Yes And that's you know. 232 00:25:43,95 --> 00:25:48,98 It is you know and I think that might be hard for people who don't know what an honor to looks like 233 00:25:49,03 --> 00:25:57,05 when it's wrapped it's true. But what's the little lingo whatever that thing is sticking out of the top. 234 00:25:58,93 --> 00:25:59,94 And is that the. 235 00:26:00,01 --> 00:26:06,74 Is that where the air is added because the proportions care confusing to me have it's like a festival it totally is 236 00:26:06,75 --> 00:26:08,07 yeah yeah yeah. 237 00:26:11,96 --> 00:26:17,09 The first page has kind of and a night night scape with the skyline 238 00:26:17,88 --> 00:26:24,59 and a bike up in the skyline which is lacking wheels which I haven't have you get an answer for that 239 00:26:24,60 --> 00:26:29,50 or should we just keep moving well I kind of reminds me a little bit of I goes by. 240 00:26:32,23 --> 00:26:34,35 For those who don't know as you describe with those are. 241 00:26:35,58 --> 00:26:45,78 My understanding is that a ghost bike is an old bike that's painted painted all white and. To a tree or to. 242 00:26:47,09 --> 00:26:53,73 Any and the like a poor and he anything and the tie to it serves as a marker 243 00:26:53,77 --> 00:27:03,42 or a place where a bicyclist was killed yes but a whole rash of those in the Chicago lately. I'm sure in L.A. Too. 244 00:27:04,68 --> 00:27:10,95 So if we look at the second page we have a number of items some of which are accompanied by check marks 245 00:27:11,36 --> 00:27:19,00 and some of which were the check marks are conspicuously absent so the present items would be helmets and locks 246 00:27:19,01 --> 00:27:31,66 and so forth but absent our sunglasses apples men's and money. And then we see a diagram from above. 247 00:27:33,96 --> 00:27:41,60 With the flow of traffic both for cars and for bikes and some X.'s and Archer what do you think the X. 248 00:27:41,61 --> 00:27:49,66 Is signify in this image. You know it's Law hard for me to. 249 00:27:52,11 --> 00:27:57,70 See I mean there are some that look like they're just danger points like you're writing on the right side of the road 250 00:27:57,71 --> 00:28:06,45 in your writing close to our car or that part. Open it's darn you you get the open door and might be that you're. 251 00:28:07,50 --> 00:28:14,40 Some of them seem to refer to blind spots or points where. A bicyclist. Is in danger. 252 00:28:15,69 --> 00:28:21,70 And there's one in an empty parking spot and maybe I'm just not you know that one stumps me you know and that not that. 253 00:28:22,79 --> 00:28:27,31 Well versed in bicycle safety maybe that's a danger that I don't know about. 254 00:28:30,44 --> 00:28:43,04 Well given that I've never seen where a helmet ever I don't know how well versed he is. And. He's very well versed. 255 00:28:44,60 --> 00:28:48,37 Exactly I mean he's still here that's gotta count for Sutton. 256 00:28:50,00 --> 00:28:56,18 Yeah and then at the end we have a long I guess is two more pages a long list of. 257 00:28:57,21 --> 00:28:59,99 Definitions for the icons but then the. 258 00:29:01,23 --> 00:29:09,71 Archer Do you recognise I mean it looks in some cases that there's a French ship headed to the end of a like the 259 00:29:09,72 --> 00:29:19,91 skanking sky cyclist. Maybe these are these are credits or the icons. They are. 260 00:29:21,11 --> 00:29:27,62 Why they're so different I mean yeah the more you look at them like you're saying Taylor The more you in the you start 261 00:29:27,63 --> 00:29:33,50 to see like the stylistic or like even gestural variations and some have way more movement in the other. 262 00:29:34,92 --> 00:29:36,74 Yeah they're just different approaches. 263 00:29:39,36 --> 00:29:40,50 So I'm going to go in a limb 264 00:29:40,51 --> 00:29:47,65 and suggest that in some cases there are individuals that were crediting with an I come through ship 265 00:29:47,89 --> 00:29:57,27 and then in other cases it might be agency named Yes. That is so like an experience directive and. It's going to. 266 00:29:59,17 --> 00:30:11,14 Be to synthesize. As. For the other practices. Yep I find the last card to be one of the most pleasing images where. 267 00:30:13,37 --> 00:30:20,08 Instead of before we get that sort of field painting with you know kind of chaotic placement Now the. 268 00:30:21,47 --> 00:30:30,08 Bicycle figure is repeated in a grid like fashion where the head is the same spot as the spoke of the front wheel of 269 00:30:30,09 --> 00:30:32,02 the bicycle and the back wheel ASBOs 270 00:30:32,03 --> 00:30:37,60 and so you get this really nice pattern which you don't have to squint at it too hard for it just to blow out to a 271 00:30:37,61 --> 00:30:38,70 total obstruction 272 00:30:38,74 --> 00:30:43,52 but it's also really easy to let it snap back into its original you know it's originating forms that's 273 00:30:43,53 --> 00:30:53,84 but yeah yeah thanks. Thanks as I mean that is that is a super. It's a perfect description of why this is so so. 274 00:30:55,16 --> 00:31:00,63 I'll give you a little bit of. The why I guess so it's a scene. 275 00:31:04,53 --> 00:31:11,24 It's like a you know a half letter folded scene and this scene originally had text in it. 276 00:31:12,63 --> 00:31:19,77 That was going to be both Spanish and English and I had a moment. Where I decided like. 277 00:31:21,08 --> 00:31:29,39 I'm going to see if I can get away with no. No words and let the keys of understanding be just icons or just images. 278 00:31:31,28 --> 00:31:36,73 In this scene is I've always wanted to do this project and in one form or another 279 00:31:37,21 --> 00:31:44,52 but it had a sort of general concept in my head which was to create as a. Teen that has a little. 280 00:31:46,02 --> 00:31:49,64 Attachment method like a hanger or something which I still haven't figured out 281 00:31:49,65 --> 00:31:54,85 but that that I could give to other people who ride a bike in Los Angeles. 282 00:31:56,02 --> 00:31:59,98 And what it in like in a way of like oh I see here's a bike. 283 00:32:00,19 --> 00:32:06,46 To a post I'm going to attach Ezine to their bike so I don't really see them face to face necessarily 284 00:32:06,47 --> 00:32:10,66 but they get this sort of little thing that I've made for people who ride bikes in a way 285 00:32:11,15 --> 00:32:19,60 and it's sort of meant to celebrate and maybe maybe educate or create understanding around becoming an urban cyclist. 286 00:32:21,54 --> 00:32:32,85 And so their original title of the scene which is no longer on the scene itself is called. City by bicycle and. 287 00:32:33,95 --> 00:32:41,24 It is also funny about this as as happens in crits also is every time you make a design decision 288 00:32:41,25 --> 00:32:42,15 or create a decision 289 00:32:42,16 --> 00:32:49,55 and you think yourself like oh someone might interpret it this way chances are it's almost one hundred percent chance 290 00:32:49,76 --> 00:32:54,94 that yes someone is going to interpret it that way you know it's like whatever you have a doubt about like should I do 291 00:32:54,95 --> 00:33:02,41 that I don't know and so originally the bike was black on the on the front page of the scene 292 00:33:02,94 --> 00:33:06,25 but the background is it's meant to be a night sky and the background is quite dark 293 00:33:06,26 --> 00:33:10,12 and on my printer at the the bike with washouts I don't have that nice of a printer 294 00:33:10,44 --> 00:33:14,09 and so I'm like I'm going to flip the bike white and then I printed it out 295 00:33:14,10 --> 00:33:16,81 and I was like oh shoot it kind of looks like a ghost bike. 296 00:33:18,82 --> 00:33:21,38 And are to tell you now that he's like I think it's a ghost. 297 00:33:22,99 --> 00:33:28,70 And I was like you know so you're just like oh there it is like I knew someone was going to think that it does look 298 00:33:28,71 --> 00:33:31,70 like a ghost bike and here it is but I was kind of OK with it 299 00:33:31,71 --> 00:33:36,96 but you know it is always a little bit painful to hear like oh shoot like I should have made it look like gray 300 00:33:36,97 --> 00:33:43,19 or something right but we were just going to firming what you already totally yeah yeah. And I wanted to. 301 00:33:44,31 --> 00:33:51,74 I feel like every graphic design thing about bicycles focuses on the wheels you know like the motion of the wheels 302 00:33:51,75 --> 00:33:57,69 or the text follows the curvature of the wheel I mean the wheel is just it's a spoke wheel it's a super interesting 303 00:33:57,70 --> 00:33:59,10 visual object you know. 304 00:34:00,18 --> 00:34:06,70 And so I was like I want to make something the cover of the scene not have wheels on it because I just thought like how 305 00:34:06,71 --> 00:34:13,48 do I sort of get away from this kind of trope right about designing graphics designing around a bicycle 306 00:34:13,49 --> 00:34:17,82 and so I decided to make the wheels instead buildings in the sky on the L.A. 307 00:34:17,83 --> 00:34:22,35 Skyline and so that's why the bike is sort of attached to those two buildings. 308 00:34:23,76 --> 00:34:29,90 The second page is a checklist of just like stuff that you the check boxes were meant to sort of imply like this is 309 00:34:29,91 --> 00:34:33,98 kind of required where the unchecked boxes were kind of mentor or imply optional. 310 00:34:35,24 --> 00:34:40,74 Which is why sunglasses Apple's all men's and pocket change are unchecked but things like a helmet. 311 00:34:41,76 --> 00:34:44,91 And a spare tire are checked 312 00:34:44,92 --> 00:34:51,52 but what do you wear a helmet No I do yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah I'm pretty myself. 313 00:34:53,19 --> 00:34:59,52 In Chicago I survived with no helmet and no lights as like. To be young and down. 314 00:35:02,63 --> 00:35:08,21 I remember one time bucking with you and you're like Dude Run the stuff so that's OK. 315 00:35:12,47 --> 00:35:18,65 I'm better now but yes so so much to the point that I'm now advocating you know bike lights a helmet 316 00:35:18,79 --> 00:35:21,99 and I'm now the person who you know has turned the corner 317 00:35:22,61 --> 00:35:24,47 and is now telling everybody else what they should be doing 318 00:35:24,57 --> 00:35:31,03 but the next page of The next day just definitely like safety advice around writing in the street 319 00:35:31,36 --> 00:35:32,76 and that one mysterious X. 320 00:35:32,77 --> 00:35:36,83 Between the cars is I've always heard this thing that's I think pretty interesting 321 00:35:36,84 --> 00:35:45,23 and I feel like it's it's kind of right which is hold your line so like if you're writing don't depend if you dip in 322 00:35:45,24 --> 00:35:50,35 and out cars don't know what to do with you you know when they're trying to get around you. 323 00:35:51,58 --> 00:35:54,30 It is tempting to depend who just feel safer you know 324 00:35:54,97 --> 00:35:59,98 but never then you get a come back you're going to come back out right right and that that action I thing. 325 00:36:00,23 --> 00:36:07,03 Is feels dicey it's also if someone is opening their car door and you're behind them they won't see you 326 00:36:07,10 --> 00:36:12,18 but you're going to pop out on where if you hold your line they might see you in their side view mirror. 327 00:36:13,37 --> 00:36:15,42 But you shouldn't be in that zone but yeah 328 00:36:15,53 --> 00:36:18,21 and then I was also trying to show like don't write on the sidewalk right like. 329 00:36:19,37 --> 00:36:24,77 Because cars coming out of alleyways a particular Chicago. Will plow right and you but also in Los Angeles. 330 00:36:26,03 --> 00:36:32,55 Did you ever did you ever hear about this dude I heard this interview with this guy who made his bike safer by 331 00:36:32,56 --> 00:36:36,26 attaching a pool a little too familiar with all my gosh really. 332 00:36:37,31 --> 00:36:41,99 You know so the idea was just that you take a pool noodle and you hook it up. 333 00:36:43,19 --> 00:36:46,86 Behind your seat and then you have it hanging out to the left out into traffic 334 00:36:46,87 --> 00:36:53,68 and oh I just instinctually nobody wants to touch the noodle with their car so it would give them 335 00:36:54,02 --> 00:36:57,90 and give them more space that is great sense yeah. 336 00:36:59,38 --> 00:37:05,18 The next pages is merit badges now so these are side kind of meant to be like cool things you could do on a bike. 337 00:37:07,68 --> 00:37:12,66 And they're meant to be sort of octave like one of them is a joint you know one of them is a spray paint can 338 00:37:13,57 --> 00:37:18,03 or getting busy or watching a movie or listening to music on a boom box or going swimming 339 00:37:18,04 --> 00:37:21,59 or something so they're kind of meant to be like adventures you could have on a bike. 340 00:37:23,66 --> 00:37:25,12 Not actually on top 341 00:37:25,29 --> 00:37:33,63 but then you could try to track Yeah yeah my answer that yeah definitely you can bury money on your bike then go for it 342 00:37:33,90 --> 00:37:42,00 you can too bad. So I'm obsessed with this service called the Noun Project I don't know if you guys know about it all. 343 00:37:43,50 --> 00:37:47,10 It's essentially stock iconography instead of stock photography. 344 00:37:49,51 --> 00:37:54,79 And many of them are just by attribution so you can reuse them as long as you attribute who the person is. 345 00:37:56,27 --> 00:38:01,78 And so I wanted to just see like that the thing that's great about it I'm number. Object and that's great about. 346 00:38:03,61 --> 00:38:10,94 Stock iconography is the curiosity of like being like I wonder if there's a joint in here you know like like. 347 00:38:12,95 --> 00:38:18,79 Or like it's just really fun to get the results back for icons more than it is for photos you know. 348 00:38:20,16 --> 00:38:24,00 Or like because it's also something the someone really crafted. 349 00:38:25,11 --> 00:38:27,41 From scratch and I say the photography isn't doesn't have a craft 350 00:38:27,42 --> 00:38:32,85 but like like if you search joint you're like How would you draw a joint you know like like 351 00:38:32,92 --> 00:38:37,24 or you could search words that might be easy easily photographs 352 00:38:37,25 --> 00:38:42,73 but not so easy to create as an icon like wilderness right like organise 353 00:38:42,74 --> 00:38:48,82 or toher fi is a is a pretty you kind of know what you're going to get but wilderness as a as an icon 354 00:38:48,83 --> 00:38:52,25 and you're just like I don't know what's going to come back so it's really fun to. 355 00:38:53,53 --> 00:38:58,09 Do that and if you it costs a little bit of money which is a little bit sad but. 356 00:38:59,62 --> 00:39:04,14 I think they people who contribute to the now project actually do get a little bit of money so it's good 357 00:39:04,40 --> 00:39:10,14 but it's really fun so if you if you search certain things like I think I search burning money 358 00:39:10,15 --> 00:39:13,10 and I was just so happy that earning money had a result. 359 00:39:15,25 --> 00:39:19,35 That I Used To accept that that would be fun so and that's what the credits are for the icons. 360 00:39:20,83 --> 00:39:26,49 And so yes so that's my project and I in the middle of making this I didn't realize like the last I think five 361 00:39:26,50 --> 00:39:31,36 or six times I've seen you are true is that you're either biking on your way to work or home from work so I was very. 362 00:39:32,46 --> 00:39:33,98 About your. 363 00:39:35,10 --> 00:39:41,12 I don't know just like what you thought about the project and you both live in urban environments 364 00:39:41,13 --> 00:39:47,07 and I don't know just kind of curious what you guys thought about it. I really like. 365 00:39:49,24 --> 00:39:59,71 Locking my bike up and then coming back and finding this on my bike Yeah yeah cool. Because I think sometimes. 366 00:40:00,59 --> 00:40:06,12 Sometimes bicycling this. A solitary action. 367 00:40:07,74 --> 00:40:14,56 And there is that bicyclist I think like lifting your hand a little bit or ring your bell 368 00:40:14,57 --> 00:40:19,67 or nodding your head is at another bicyclist as a passing by there's like a solidarity in that. 369 00:40:20,84 --> 00:40:21,92 With other bicyclists 370 00:40:21,93 --> 00:40:29,06 and this is just like this is like way more than a nod this is just like almost like saying I care about you this is 371 00:40:29,10 --> 00:40:37,60 you know we're where we're both doing this or or both or both and this yeah I really like this especially the type of. 372 00:40:39,02 --> 00:40:45,01 Those stuck icons and like badges I was right before you had said Adams I was thinking they're almost like. 373 00:40:46,43 --> 00:40:53,87 And the stickers and oh yeah I'm on your bike Yeah you know yeah that would be so cool I got you know it's milk 374 00:40:53,88 --> 00:41:00,57 and stuff. Yeah and I think my bike on the train so I got the train when our. Sasha. 375 00:41:04,13 --> 00:41:07,17 Yeah I think the thing that I'm responding to 376 00:41:07,18 --> 00:41:15,31 and I'd be curious to see where this ever to be expanded is I get the impression that you did not like none of the 377 00:41:15,32 --> 00:41:18,68 stuff was illustrated but you're right you're just you're accumulating 378 00:41:18,69 --> 00:41:24,39 and kind of framing it maybe with the exception of the sky the skyline I did like the sidewalk 379 00:41:24,84 --> 00:41:29,31 and like that kind of stuff in the arrows that are in the street and things 380 00:41:29,32 --> 00:41:34,71 but none of the none of the hard work was done some you know it is interesting though like the bike frame in the sky 381 00:41:34,72 --> 00:41:39,20 that's actually it didn't have handlebars or a bike seat 382 00:41:39,21 --> 00:41:43,72 and so I kind of you're like oh I can't stocks only gets you so far right so you have to come to be good 383 00:41:43,73 --> 00:41:46,92 but yeah the the bulk of the hard work was definitely money. 384 00:41:48,19 --> 00:41:51,46 Well I mean that's not the exact angle I was taking 385 00:41:51,47 --> 00:41:57,41 but it reminds me of him in the studio way back in the day up some of the show knows who did this project instructor 386 00:41:57,42 --> 00:41:59,92 were and so they would be the. 387 00:42:00,94 --> 00:42:07,21 You know how there was a fed for a little bit in graphic design with making something look like the seat Picard from an 388 00:42:07,22 --> 00:42:09,35 airplane yes the safety of your actions 389 00:42:09,99 --> 00:42:14,79 and so this was one of the videos I remember really well I think this guy did a bunch of what they called bumpers for 390 00:42:15,06 --> 00:42:16,72 for M.T.V. Yeah where. 391 00:42:18,14 --> 00:42:20,60 One of them was called The Death of bling bling and so 392 00:42:20,92 --> 00:42:26,24 and so they were like two young black youths who are saying bling bling to each other 393 00:42:26,61 --> 00:42:30,65 and then one of them is talking to another guy and then it gets picked up by the N.B.A. 394 00:42:31,13 --> 00:42:33,48 And then there's like a white guy in the audience 395 00:42:33,49 --> 00:42:38,41 and he starts saying it in the very end there's like two white grandmas telling each other bling bling and then 396 00:42:38,42 --> 00:42:43,13 and then it's this you know bling bling R.I.P. and Gives the you know date lived. 397 00:42:45,07 --> 00:42:52,92 But I feel like one thing I crave is to see because at the moment like part of the comments here it think you're making 398 00:42:52,93 --> 00:42:58,22 has to do with the fact that you're not really author and you're you're synergize ing it as you said before 399 00:42:58,90 --> 00:43:04,01 or whatever and. It makes me wonder about if there's ways to. 400 00:43:05,45 --> 00:43:13,32 Underscore that distance even more you know I'm saying like it like I still couldn't totally tell if this was all 401 00:43:13,33 --> 00:43:16,88 assembled out of clip art or not right right 402 00:43:17,14 --> 00:43:22,63 and so you know could that mood be shot even harder it gets it gets me thinking yeah yeah. 403 00:43:24,32 --> 00:43:29,86 Hopefully I did put a link to the podcast this episode in there because I was like Oh hopefully maybe if I don't want 404 00:43:29,87 --> 00:43:30,28 to do it 405 00:43:30,29 --> 00:43:35,84 and so I was like well someone will get if they're just like what is this maybe they'll get some context you know from 406 00:43:35,88 --> 00:43:37,33 listening to this so we'll see what happens. 407 00:43:38,62 --> 00:43:46,93 But the stickers It is great to like could you could you go around with a sheet of stickers as a sort of like informal 408 00:43:46,94 --> 00:43:49,94 biking agency and Grant other people status. 409 00:43:51,69 --> 00:43:54,41 With your stickers would be kind of great and then it would you know 410 00:43:54,42 --> 00:43:59,84 and then the abstraction could really come through like you know necessarily grant the joint smoking wonder. 411 00:44:00,15 --> 00:44:06,30 He's actively smoking a joint but maybe yeah I don't know it's the way their bike looks to me yeah yeah yeah. 412 00:44:11,21 --> 00:44:19,31 Right I meant well thanks all that was great yeah thanks for sure sure oh you are next Yeah it seems you get so I have 413 00:44:19,32 --> 00:44:36,64 a video and you know. Well. Oh. A. 414 00:44:38,77 --> 00:44:45,03 Stack of paper cards that look like maybe business cards or at least that portion Yep 415 00:44:45,99 --> 00:44:54,00 and one of them on the tops is how are you but even when they're fanned out the text is small enough 416 00:44:54,01 --> 00:45:00,67 and centered enough that we can't make out text on the other correct link but there's maybe fifty cards there 417 00:45:00,75 --> 00:45:08,76 and I get forty thirty. I'm go with forty eight All right. This is like the prices were yes. 418 00:45:09,95 --> 00:45:13,65 If you guys ever read the B S C P foundation. 419 00:45:15,03 --> 00:45:19,70 Are you familiar with this this is this is going to go off on a limb here but as C.P. 420 00:45:19,71 --> 00:45:24,21 Stands for what is it secure contain protect 421 00:45:24,22 --> 00:45:31,84 but it's been totally getting into it's this this wiki where people let me get this video downloading while you guys 422 00:45:31,85 --> 00:45:34,01 are you guys Well I'm talking to. 423 00:45:35,84 --> 00:45:42,87 Their video oh there it is yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah it's good and them like it well were down it comes talk a bit 424 00:45:43,04 --> 00:45:47,95 but the so it's this this wiki where people write these short science fiction stories 425 00:45:48,37 --> 00:45:58,08 but it's in a shared format where you to it's as if a government agency is currently containing this particular alien 426 00:45:58,09 --> 00:45:59,99 force or object or. 427 00:46:00,01 --> 00:46:00,83 Each or whatever 428 00:46:01,15 --> 00:46:07,19 and so it's framed like it's a secret document that you're not supposed to be reading with redacted parts 429 00:46:07,20 --> 00:46:07,75 and so forth 430 00:46:08,47 --> 00:46:15,04 but a lot of them lean into pop culture So for example you take like Pat say Jack who appears to have been the same age 431 00:46:15,05 --> 00:46:18,66 for fifteen years and then you can like build an S.E.P. 432 00:46:18,67 --> 00:46:21,96 Story around you know he invented white or like Second Life 433 00:46:21,97 --> 00:46:26,77 or set of children Wow that sounds great a little bit off topic 434 00:46:27,16 --> 00:46:30,66 but let me tell you if you if you're putting I'm putting it up if you look at the S.E.P. 435 00:46:30,67 --> 00:46:35,05 Foundation I mean you can just read it all night if you get that kind of science fiction. 436 00:46:36,14 --> 00:46:36,84 Yeah that's right well 437 00:46:37,09 --> 00:46:43,83 and I can do you want to do should we start this thing at the same time yeah we'll start same time if you want Ted you 438 00:46:43,84 --> 00:46:47,75 want take the first minute and a half and I'll take the last minute. 439 00:46:49,23 --> 00:46:55,65 Effort just for fun I want to see if we can put up. I'm ready. To go. 440 00:46:57,29 --> 00:47:04,58 So reading and breaking Western bones is the title. So we're starting out with four. 441 00:47:05,70 --> 00:47:10,53 Groupings of cards but now they're being laid out sort of shuffled through. 442 00:47:11,87 --> 00:47:22,85 And one's been separated and I believe it says I want. It's. Made clear for us. And then now we have. 443 00:47:23,93 --> 00:47:34,15 To shuffle through so I went pure. And now we're looking through a shuffled a group of. I believe it's now owns. 444 00:47:36,27 --> 00:47:42,15 And reading it food I want pure food is the since it's been constructed. 445 00:47:45,87 --> 00:47:51,71 So that's constructed and then someone I assume is search hero kind of lets it lay for a second 446 00:47:51,72 --> 00:47:59,74 and now the cards are flipped over you know. And what are they revealing. Appears to be to you betcha. 447 00:48:00,01 --> 00:48:02,23 Six separated by a horizontal line 448 00:48:03,17 --> 00:48:10,40 and now they're coming up to the camera so we can make them out so I want at the top it says I will commit violence if 449 00:48:10,41 --> 00:48:16,13 necessary to achieve my goal at the bottom my body and mind are at rest and I'm aware of my life. 450 00:48:18,11 --> 00:48:26,48 So there appears to be like the happy answer the good answer in the evil answer for example appear on the other hand he 451 00:48:26,49 --> 00:48:31,16 repeats a yet flipped over this is far removed from the earth and from systems of reproduction 452 00:48:31,17 --> 00:48:37,08 and other biological process sees the bottom is as if you don't know that mountains walk you don't know your own 453 00:48:37,09 --> 00:48:43,93 walking well. OK food the food current is to spin brought up to the camera. 454 00:48:45,50 --> 00:48:49,46 Building blocks of fuel to the human machine 455 00:48:50,05 --> 00:48:58,50 and the bottom is has replaced word with whatever action is currently happening should be speaking in my case so it 456 00:48:58,51 --> 00:49:04,25 seems to me like we might be looking at sort of in the most general terms a Western 457 00:49:04,26 --> 00:49:13,40 and non-Western perspective on the same concept so for example I want peer food could be interpreted in what presumably 458 00:49:13,41 --> 00:49:19,44 is the sort of Western industrialized way I will commit violence if necessary to obtain building blocks for my machine 459 00:49:19,45 --> 00:49:23,14 body that are far removed from the earth and systems of reproduction 460 00:49:23,15 --> 00:49:27,35 and biological processes whereas on the other side we have my mind and body 461 00:49:27,36 --> 00:49:30,08 or rest knowing that mountains will flip Reid 462 00:49:30,09 --> 00:49:37,89 and break bones that one I was having a little bit of trouble keeping up just visually with the video so I'm not 463 00:49:37,95 --> 00:49:43,33 totally positive that all of this was constructed from those specific cards and Arturo can can tell us 464 00:49:43,34 --> 00:49:48,38 when he starts talking but the general sense that I'm giving is you have these sort of two paths 465 00:49:48,39 --> 00:49:56,05 and one is like the industrialize presumably negative interpretation and the other is more maybe holistic 466 00:49:56,06 --> 00:49:59,92 and spiritual or positive. Yeah. 467 00:50:00,66 --> 00:50:06,62 Yes I mean I feel pretty on board with Taylor's understanding and description of it so I'm curious. 468 00:50:08,04 --> 00:50:19,05 How we did it and other things you'd like to add. Yeah you guys did great. When I got that challenge it was. 469 00:50:20,35 --> 00:50:24,68 I've been thinking a lot about forms lately and how form implements this. 470 00:50:25,76 --> 00:50:28,98 Meaning of Mormon meaning are related and so 471 00:50:28,99 --> 00:50:41,88 when I got this I that the challenge he's of understanding now was trying to. I was trying to. Think about what form. 472 00:50:43,43 --> 00:50:44,54 Language takes. 473 00:50:45,72 --> 00:50:52,36 And so yeah I was going through that same process the first week I was OK I was just in the brainstorm mode. 474 00:50:53,98 --> 00:51:05,09 And and so I was thinking a ribbon or braid I was just trying to find that would flip and intertwine 475 00:51:05,10 --> 00:51:13,90 and be complex with each other yeah but. But I all but I also. 476 00:51:16,60 --> 00:51:21,43 Well a deck of cards can do a lot of things that are like that even though they're somewhat. 477 00:51:23,60 --> 00:51:29,87 Binary they just there's just a front and just about yeah in combination like that and like a terrible deck 478 00:51:29,88 --> 00:51:38,14 or something can be very complex because of the way that you place the cards like the position becomes important 479 00:51:38,18 --> 00:51:46,55 and resonant and and the position of the of the card. Upside down or right side up becomes important. 480 00:51:47,68 --> 00:51:52,99 The position close to each other so I thought with a deck of cards there is a little bit I mean the language becomes 481 00:51:53,41 --> 00:51:59,98 or the the tool becomes very complex very quickly and very powerful very quickly so I decide. 482 00:52:00,01 --> 00:52:08,91 Did you make a deck of cards that would. That would take that would translate a language and. 483 00:52:10,07 --> 00:52:14,82 And I was thinking about translation. And translation being. 484 00:52:16,15 --> 00:52:21,58 Basically being about moving bones I think that's where the word translation comes from. 485 00:52:23,13 --> 00:52:26,48 Oh really you know I think it's translate that to this which is that. 486 00:52:28,33 --> 00:52:40,35 So I think originally it was about translation was about moving to. The relics of. A secret people. And. And. 487 00:52:41,60 --> 00:52:44,01 Zen dog and dog and who is a. 488 00:52:48,25 --> 00:52:54,03 Zen Zen Master from the twelve hunters Japanese Zen master talks a lot about inheriting the bones of ancestors 489 00:52:54,04 --> 00:52:59,15 and understand and herding or trying to being transmitted the marrow bones 490 00:52:59,16 --> 00:53:06,38 and skin of the ancestors so I thought that was an interesting. Connection. There. 491 00:53:07,84 --> 00:53:17,73 So that's why the video is called breaking bones. And I'm going to upload one more thing which is it's a P.D.F. 492 00:53:17,83 --> 00:53:22,99 That's a P.D.F. Of the. Of the full bird thing. 493 00:53:25,19 --> 00:53:34,97 And and then from there maybe I can describe the method Yeah great yeah. So there's I think there's sixty eight. 494 00:53:36,69 --> 00:53:44,06 Sixty eight and they're separated into into verbs nouns as activists and also phrases coming commonly use phrases. 495 00:53:45,25 --> 00:53:50,96 And then there are there are two you describe it well there are on the front of the card those one word 496 00:53:51,37 --> 00:53:59,98 or one phrase and that's that's an typical usage that we that we all use and on the back there's a. There's two. 497 00:54:00,01 --> 00:54:08,45 Joyce's two interpretations and. On this P.D.F. One is called Western destroyer So that's the bone breaker. 498 00:54:09,58 --> 00:54:13,18 And that person is somebody involved in it the colonizing. 499 00:54:14,24 --> 00:54:16,17 Process who speaks 500 00:54:16,18 --> 00:54:23,38 and a voice that breaks Western in order to reclaim their own life from the oppression of that western. 501 00:54:25,47 --> 00:54:32,32 The other voice is the Western interpreter and that's somebody who's very similar somebody who might have to school 502 00:54:32,33 --> 00:54:41,12 and learn the language and become a master of that language and who is now able to hear words like criminal 503 00:54:41,65 --> 00:54:52,13 or law order or illegal or savage and completely different ways because they're aware of history of that word. And. 504 00:54:54,67 --> 00:55:00,56 You know so I see I see one voice as trying to contradict or break break the spell of the word 505 00:55:00,57 --> 00:55:09,57 and the other one is simply an interpreter. And so you get two interpretations and in a way you get an interpretation. 506 00:55:10,90 --> 00:55:19,41 On the back of the car but you also get. An alternative an alternative way of looking at the World. 507 00:55:21,33 --> 00:55:29,06 Listeners there is a lot of material here. That's great really just such a density of ideas it's really hard to. 508 00:55:30,71 --> 00:55:34,60 Do it justice in this format do you feel like Archer Oh that. 509 00:55:37,01 --> 00:55:40,16 I have so many questions yet as detailed point like there's a lot there. 510 00:55:41,78 --> 00:55:46,36 When you would flip over a card and we could sort of read the two on the back I found myself. 511 00:55:48,85 --> 00:55:53,44 Trying to deduce which which one I wanted to pick you know like mine 512 00:55:53,55 --> 00:55:59,27 when presented with two choices you have ever like OK well is it heads or tails I want to pick and so. 513 00:56:00,19 --> 00:56:05,01 I don't I don't remember offhand like if I picked like all across the top or all across the bottom 514 00:56:05,02 --> 00:56:09,63 or a blend of the two but I feel like it was a blend of the two and I was just curious if you. 515 00:56:11,34 --> 00:56:24,99 Like if you had a sort of maybe and. Goal like deep was that do you find yourself picking across the two. 516 00:56:26,07 --> 00:56:32,49 Or do you feel like you're creating one as a kind of cat just as a pure counterpoint to the other 517 00:56:32,50 --> 00:56:34,77 but you have a strong allegiance or sort of. 518 00:56:35,88 --> 00:56:39,31 Like personal coded attached to one way 519 00:56:39,32 --> 00:56:43,97 or the other I don't know it's kind of curious like how how you feel like it functions for yourself 520 00:56:43,98 --> 00:56:51,17 and then like now that you've heard us walk through it did it did it map to how you thought we would understand it 521 00:56:51,18 --> 00:56:54,42 or are you that yeah yeah. 522 00:56:56,43 --> 00:57:03,46 It's not that way especially Taylor said about holistic Yeah and really it's like non-dualistic a lot of Western 523 00:57:03,96 --> 00:57:05,70 and from other cultures. 524 00:57:07,06 --> 00:57:14,88 Western thought is that I'm most familiar with a lot of western thought is highly based on desire preference 525 00:57:15,15 --> 00:57:16,97 and dualistic thinking. 526 00:57:18,13 --> 00:57:25,82 Like Stuff like we say the word that we like we like things a lot things a lot or we don't like things 527 00:57:25,86 --> 00:57:30,71 or things are good are our. Right and so. 528 00:57:32,06 --> 00:57:37,74 The if I have an I don't really have an allegiance to one or the other I find it more interesting to know. 529 00:57:38,99 --> 00:57:42,86 I mean there are three choices and the cards like you could say I want here. 530 00:57:45,05 --> 00:57:47,05 Or you can say the other either of the other two. 531 00:57:48,59 --> 00:57:57,62 Are Really it's more helpful to need to hold them all in my head at the same time right because that gives me a better 532 00:57:57,63 --> 00:58:04,53 understanding of where I'm at I think. I think the. Text that is the interpretation. 533 00:58:05,60 --> 00:58:14,02 Of these words is reminds me of a type of voice that I'm familiar with just having grown up. 534 00:58:16,66 --> 00:58:19,35 Going to she got all grown up multi generation. 535 00:58:21,05 --> 00:58:28,55 Now he's gone on Los Angeles and then having been among the first of my family to go to college 536 00:58:29,45 --> 00:58:37,24 and this is like a familiar is a really familiar experience that most people who are first generation college students 537 00:58:37,69 --> 00:58:40,96 get they they sense that they're they've gained all this knowledge 538 00:58:40,97 --> 00:58:46,99 and they've been encouraged to take this journey yeah I also feel like once they cross that bridge that there's kind of 539 00:58:47,00 --> 00:58:49,84 like not a very easy way to get back. 540 00:58:51,20 --> 00:58:56,75 You because you become alienated from people who didn't follow you through the college yet 541 00:58:57,03 --> 00:59:02,81 and so that's kind of the background on the interpreter that's somebody who has gained a lot of knowledge 542 00:59:02,82 --> 00:59:05,59 and now see things that they couldn't see before. 543 00:59:08,19 --> 00:59:18,87 And then the more holistic view which is I feel it's more it's not settled it's more of a dynamic view. Is. 544 00:59:21,20 --> 00:59:29,41 That's that's just the attempt for the for the rich rigid interpreter to break free of it you know I can you learn you 545 00:59:29,42 --> 00:59:33,04 learn the codes of society and then you try to break free of them. 546 00:59:34,16 --> 00:59:41,52 In a creative way and sometimes for some of us we had to go through and learn that learn that language really well. 547 00:59:42,54 --> 00:59:47,01 And there's always a bit of like to learn it really well you really got to jump into it. 548 00:59:49,60 --> 00:59:53,50 As experience a learning in a way right yeah yeah you got it right 549 00:59:53,51 --> 00:59:59,98 and I really want to see these with the test images like in a material. They were. 550 01:00:00,08 --> 01:00:06,98 Really Rich Yeah the word listening is really really interesting in the excell sheet or the P.D.F. 551 01:00:07,55 --> 01:00:09,74 We can we can both P.D.F. or If you're cool about it. 552 01:00:10,83 --> 01:00:18,77 It's cool to see the list of the list of words and is really compelling just in general like violence passed away 553 01:00:18,78 --> 01:00:27,12 and shooting a few neighborhood house sinks where religion I was curious how you got to those words. 554 01:00:29,45 --> 01:00:36,75 They just they just came to me I was just kind of like riffing on certain ones I started with with words that I knew I 555 01:00:36,76 --> 01:00:44,70 wanted to. Say with words that I had noticed and in myself I mean. 556 01:00:47,62 --> 01:00:55,49 That were gestures or habits and myself that I felt are inherited from just a legacy of. Alone and there's a. 557 01:00:57,36 --> 01:00:59,47 Story with those the ones that jumped out at me most 558 01:00:59,48 --> 01:01:05,91 and those were like very very strong kind of verbs that are based right like this is what I want I'm going to center 559 01:01:05,92 --> 01:01:11,33 myself in the world I like this I don't like this I don't want this this is what I desire 560 01:01:11,84 --> 01:01:16,63 and then after that then I start to think about legal listed terms you know 561 01:01:16,64 --> 01:01:24,54 or are terms that seem the nine maybe aren't And of course like anything I mean right now with a highly authoritarian. 562 01:01:26,03 --> 01:01:34,08 Overtly authoritarian. National political atmosphere like Law and Order back on. 563 01:01:35,41 --> 01:01:39,03 Our back and on everyone's you know back on it 564 01:01:39,29 --> 01:01:43,38 and everyone's mouth right there was an order there's a lot of talk about. 565 01:01:44,72 --> 01:01:50,69 You know undocumented people and the use of the word illegal and and criminals 566 01:01:50,70 --> 01:01:59,15 and then that to me that's just harkens right back to the ideas of seventy three in the frontier. And so. 567 01:02:00,01 --> 01:02:05,27 And then some of them were were a little more. You know some of them led me to things like. 568 01:02:06,64 --> 01:02:15,43 Spiritual and evolved because well the example in the video was I want pure food and that really came from. This. 569 01:02:16,50 --> 01:02:19,80 Like I don't really want to remember his name but. 570 01:02:22,81 --> 01:02:26,85 He quote unquote invented I'm using I'm using the word invented really loosely but. 571 01:02:29,40 --> 01:02:35,59 He developed a product that was like a a complete male that you can mix with water 572 01:02:36,42 --> 01:02:43,71 and he called it I guess ironically Soylent Oh yeah yeah and I saw like a mini documentary on him 573 01:02:43,76 --> 01:02:46,37 and I felt OK like this is a guy who's talking like that. 574 01:02:47,51 --> 01:02:50,28 This is this is him this is a guy who says 575 01:02:50,38 --> 01:02:58,59 when this guy is saying I want your food he wants food that is separated from any type of biological process you know 576 01:02:58,60 --> 01:03:02,22 he he wants to strip away and that's what he means by pure. 577 01:03:04,15 --> 01:03:11,95 And in the same way some people say that there are spiritual and what they really mean. Is that they won't. 578 01:03:13,04 --> 01:03:19,67 Under any circumstances challenge our Explorer or illuminate any type of historical cultural religious realities 579 01:03:19,68 --> 01:03:24,19 or current injustices and they're not going to name the mechanisms of exploitation They're just 580 01:03:24,20 --> 01:03:30,28 and the all the all peaceful RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT RIGHT. 581 01:03:31,75 --> 01:03:34,99 Yes I just I guess it was just like a series of riffs you know it just kind of stemmed 582 01:03:35,00 --> 01:03:43,25 when word would lead to another yeah yeah it's cool it's a great list. And you know it's it's great. All right Taylor. 583 01:03:47,11 --> 01:04:04,24 I mean I was. Some type of. Electronics yeah yeah like your sister. 584 01:04:06,13 --> 01:04:10,79 And it looks like it looks really small but it's yet large on the screen 585 01:04:11,27 --> 01:04:19,74 and then gets sick as a bit like like that's all with me like a black cats all with yummy nails oh he does. 586 01:04:20,97 --> 01:04:32,40 And I'm never going to see those any different. From here and. What I don't know what it is I don't know what it does. 587 01:04:34,41 --> 01:04:41,90 This looks like there's a P.D.F. Here that looks like a description of. What it is. Right. 588 01:04:43,39 --> 01:04:52,51 It says by Fairchild Semiconductor. It looks like it describes itself as a sixty vote logic in channel mosfet. 589 01:04:56,81 --> 01:05:00,77 I'm looking through here to see if Taylor has done any sort of wicked. 590 01:05:02,60 --> 01:05:05,53 And ended up that's just that's just a don't want to do it OK cool. 591 01:05:08,07 --> 01:05:15,98 Let's see if the word fuck comes up if you read the whole. Thing you know it's in there somewhere it's in there. OK. 592 01:05:17,72 --> 01:05:29,23 Arturo pilfered to dive in and I will as well I'm on number three OK. A schematic. And there is. 593 01:05:30,24 --> 01:05:35,72 Are Or do know now I know someone of some of the students know how to. 594 01:05:38,45 --> 01:05:42,69 Lead the lights arranged in the so-called breadboard it is. 595 01:05:44,84 --> 01:05:50,16 And then this letter is called Yeah it's been a while since so it's a looks like a diagram of. 596 01:05:51,34 --> 01:05:59,41 An electronics Yep you know with like four Ellie. And it looks sort of chained together kind of lettered. 597 01:06:00,31 --> 01:06:20,52 Together and there's and this. Is him between. The Arch we know and he's. Open up image number four zero. Zero. Point. 598 01:06:21,74 --> 01:06:33,51 Drop Yes right right right with what I see as I and me there's like three main. Yeah like. 599 01:06:34,74 --> 01:06:40,45 Yeah went around kind of like in a triangle the point of the triangle down towards us. 600 01:06:43,11 --> 01:06:48,04 I think and trying to describe everything else that's going on is really hard and. 601 01:06:49,41 --> 01:06:55,47 Yeah there's like yeah they're all sort of connected together yeah. I think that. 602 01:06:56,72 --> 01:06:59,97 You were on the right track with just him as late. 603 01:07:02,84 --> 01:07:06,98 Short Yeah we would've been looking forward of eight away from what I was doing 604 01:07:06,99 --> 01:07:11,44 but it you know so the mosfet this is actually going back to the earlier episode 605 01:07:11,45 --> 01:07:20,30 when we had then both you know we had this discussion about the TIP one twenty. And how this was a sort of antiquated. 606 01:07:21,72 --> 01:07:29,71 Piece of circuitry that wasn't very good at doing its job which is to use a lower voltage to switch a higher voltage 607 01:07:29,76 --> 01:07:36,62 right so so a frequent thing in electronics for those that aren't familiar is you'll want to take like imagine you have 608 01:07:36,63 --> 01:07:43,71 power coming out of the wall you don't want to necessarily use that high voltage high current to make decisions you 609 01:07:43,72 --> 01:07:49,78 want to use a very low current and low voltage to make decisions which will then influence whether 610 01:07:49,79 --> 01:07:55,27 or not high voltage is passed on to something that you want to derive that makes sense yeah yeah. 611 01:07:56,77 --> 01:07:59,98 Yeah so the mosfet is in the same packed. 612 01:08:00,27 --> 01:08:06,92 It has it's same tip one twenty package but it's able just to handle switching much higher voltages and currents 613 01:08:07,31 --> 01:08:12,90 and it's pretty inexpensive so so I've drawn the circuit for myself over and over again 614 01:08:13,37 --> 01:08:18,65 and then every time I buy some of these you know I have to research it and I draw the circuit 615 01:08:18,66 --> 01:08:27,09 and then it gets lost in the studio so I was thinking about to Rob's point how do you take a circuit that's really 616 01:08:27,10 --> 01:08:30,42 useful that you want to keep it around and render it 617 01:08:30,47 --> 01:08:36,21 and it really is that aside way that lends itself to you know just sort of hanging up in your studio. 618 01:08:37,90 --> 01:08:41,06 So this is not so much the explosion of the interior. 619 01:08:42,24 --> 01:08:44,81 Yeah but it's it's the basic circuit 620 01:08:45,70 --> 01:08:51,53 and it substracted circuit right because the load you know would have five volts coming in or twelve volts 621 01:08:51,54 --> 01:08:58,56 or whatever and a light bulb and maybe a resistor and some other components I'm trying to strip down. 622 01:08:59,61 --> 01:09:05,71 To only give as much information as you absolutely need just as a reminder of how how the general pinout of the mosfet 623 01:09:05,72 --> 01:09:06,80 were Yeah yeah 624 01:09:06,84 --> 01:09:13,71 and then Yes And so then I was trying to kind of balance that Fritzing diagram on there that I didn't make 625 01:09:13,80 --> 01:09:19,62 but it was an example of a perfectly informative circuit diagram that's just really boring to look in. 626 01:09:21,31 --> 01:09:22,92 But then you had the P.D.F. 627 01:09:22,93 --> 01:09:28,99 Where unless you're an electrical engineer there are also really intimidating to look at so this is trying to kind of 628 01:09:29,00 --> 01:09:34,83 meet them in the middle Plus you know just spending some time making it look interesting 629 01:09:35,17 --> 01:09:42,27 and I really spend a lot of time trying to not have it be too computer so I laid the whole thing out with it's actually 630 01:09:42,28 --> 01:09:47,40 three point perspective but with you know here I imagine that I actually took a ruler and a pencil. 631 01:09:49,99 --> 01:09:57,67 And tried to do do something you know and then I was just colorized colorist on the computer. So they have all. 632 01:09:58,93 --> 01:09:59,98 Yeah I mean many things. 633 01:10:01,14 --> 01:10:09,30 So many things in the electronics world at least in my experience of it there are all these things that you. 634 01:10:10,54 --> 01:10:18,23 That are supposed to seem clear like there's a notch on one side and if there's a knot on one side that means this or 635 01:10:18,65 --> 01:10:19,23 or. 636 01:10:20,99 --> 01:10:26,89 Or one of the legs is shorter right and so that short leg means this 637 01:10:27,25 --> 01:10:35,28 or like this this one is the flats that if there's one with a flat side it means this and it's like. 638 01:10:36,94 --> 01:10:41,25 Like it almost makes me feel more dumb. 639 01:10:42,61 --> 01:10:46,21 Because it's like an all of this coding that is supposed to make things easier 640 01:10:46,44 --> 01:10:52,70 but if you can't remember the coding then you can't in coding like like if you can't remember the physical properties 641 01:10:52,71 --> 01:10:59,46 of the thing then you're still just as screwed as you were to begin with plus you're doubting yourself like well is the 642 01:10:59,55 --> 01:11:05,28 flat side mean ground or does the flat side mean positive you know and it's just like 643 01:11:05,36 --> 01:11:11,35 or like if you look at power adaptors right there's there's a white stripe that runs on one of the wires 644 01:11:11,36 --> 01:11:15,39 and it's like OK I know the but the white stripe is that the positive comment that I or their leg. 645 01:11:17,08 --> 01:11:19,80 Like it just is constantly taunting you with like you're close 646 01:11:19,81 --> 01:11:26,96 but not close enough so yeah this is a really cool it's really cool to yeah have a have a reference that feels very 647 01:11:26,97 --> 01:11:35,18 solid you know and very understandable Yeah that's cool. And everybody get the yes. 648 01:11:39,28 --> 01:11:44,87 All right that's all I get out of school excellent work. That's cool yeah that's awesome. 649 01:11:46,84 --> 01:11:53,72 Arturo The time has come for the best purchase of the show are you ready to lay down the challenge. 650 01:11:55,11 --> 01:12:08,58 Yeah yeah I think so. In a simple. Challenge just to make a flag. Oh. Yeah. 651 01:12:10,70 --> 01:12:20,11 Oh my God they get Philip on to work on the last Yeah we made of this work but. A friend of Taylor and I have. 652 01:12:21,49 --> 01:12:23,98 Has had this project is called flagpole. 653 01:12:25,61 --> 01:12:29,49 I'm not sure one side a little yet up there I don't think it was to have Yeah it's. 654 01:12:30,55 --> 01:12:30,94 Full 655 01:12:30,98 --> 01:12:40,98 and he asks artists to make flags for it all really which is a yes a really interesting project in that like shoot Taylor 656 01:12:40,99 --> 01:12:50,37 now you and I have to make a flat. Yes I'm yeah cool OK yeah yeah that's cool. Man. 657 01:12:51,63 --> 01:12:58,59 I also love about this because it was like this with the whiteness to wear you know to the extent that I mean I knew 658 01:12:58,60 --> 01:13:00,00 hung a lot better than I know it's here 659 01:13:00,01 --> 01:13:07,28 but to the extent that I think I understand what Archer is perspective is like kind of being and with 660 01:13:07,97 --> 01:13:11,76 and then also finding out that maybe I'm not right like that like when Arturo 661 01:13:11,77 --> 01:13:19,46 when you started talking about making your project to acknowledge your Western perspective I realized oh kind of the 662 01:13:19,85 --> 01:13:28,03 stereotype in my head was that the author was representing themselves as not part of the negative you know Western 663 01:13:28,18 --> 01:13:31,23 culture but you said no it's because I want to be aware of it 664 01:13:31,27 --> 01:13:38,13 and this other thing you know sort of competing for internal attention so I'm going to enjoy having my notion of you on 665 01:13:38,38 --> 01:13:39,53 my shoulder totally where. 666 01:13:40,65 --> 01:13:44,71 I really like that as well yeah I thought that was super interesting also about your project 667 01:13:44,72 --> 01:13:51,68 or that it was like I could feel your. I could I could get a sense of. 668 01:13:52,84 --> 01:13:57,32 Some of the thoughts that were in your head about like what is my relationship to this work I'm making 669 01:13:57,33 --> 01:13:58,25 and how it's not. 670 01:14:00,17 --> 01:14:05,63 It's not really one of the other that it's just a kind of amalgamation of lots of things on our own I don't know if you 671 01:14:05,64 --> 01:14:09,19 actually thought that but that's that's how it felt to me that was really cool you know 672 01:14:09,20 --> 01:14:18,68 and now we have to make a flag so. Scary. Yeah I love this yeah it's a given every good yeah. 673 01:14:19,80 --> 01:14:25,79 Should you have any any links or anything that you want to share or any lake tools that you use 674 01:14:25,80 --> 01:14:33,21 or anything like that that your interest in to sharing with the people that are listening yeah I have a I have actually 675 01:14:33,22 --> 01:14:39,66 you say patient lists or a lot of. I mean I wrote those but. They're not. 676 01:14:41,25 --> 01:14:51,90 I don't know how many of any of our thoughts are our thoughts. So. People should definitely listen to John Trudell. 677 01:14:53,64 --> 01:15:00,02 Native American. Philosopher and great poet and musician and. 678 01:15:01,15 --> 01:15:07,27 And and spokes person yeah cool Joy Harjo who has 679 01:15:07,87 --> 01:15:12,66 or has a book that I really enjoyed called Conflict Resolution for holy beings. 680 01:15:14,91 --> 01:15:24,63 And some of the language one or two lines of of the deck of. Cards came from. Hard Joe's poems. 681 01:15:26,15 --> 01:15:35,71 I've been thinking about feldspar as a. As a mineral. Elsewhere usually used to make nice. 682 01:15:37,19 --> 01:15:42,88 And there's a lot of especially around long pocket area there so there's a lot of. 683 01:15:44,23 --> 01:15:51,33 There's a few feldspar naturally occurring feldspar deposits that were that were used as centers of nice making. 684 01:15:52,99 --> 01:15:59,81 Lots and then that's a really cool look at MIT or oh yeah that's it's beautiful and and long parking area that's. 685 01:16:00,88 --> 01:16:08,60 That's actually. It's like a it's a red it's a red. Feldspar which is really beautiful. 686 01:16:09,63 --> 01:16:12,91 It's cool and then I mentioned I mentioned Dogan. 687 01:16:13,99 --> 01:16:19,92 And there's there's a while back I don't know what year it was Gary Snyder the the B. Poet. 688 01:16:21,03 --> 01:16:24,23 Read some translations It's like a four CD set of. 689 01:16:25,41 --> 01:16:34,36 His readings of this of this collection called Moon in a draw and it's kind of a weird reading. 690 01:16:36,14 --> 01:16:40,47 I don't know I don't know what his intentions were but sometimes it's easier to listen to dog 691 01:16:40,48 --> 01:16:46,22 and then it is to read him. But it kind of hit you because it's highly complex. 692 01:16:48,53 --> 01:16:54,43 And and I post a link on this to post a link to one of their share of it 693 01:16:54,44 --> 01:16:58,62 and one of the audios because now they're available online 694 01:16:58,63 --> 01:17:02,81 but there are actually really hard to find online it took me forever to find this. 695 01:17:05,90 --> 01:17:14,07 And and then just as a reading list just something I think that. Everybody should look into would be. 696 01:17:15,34 --> 01:17:23,69 Fairies I have the very very nice idea. Of education as a liberation as a practice of liberation. 697 01:17:25,27 --> 01:17:32,23 And also you know even if you don't have children and you're you're. 698 01:17:34,08 --> 01:17:37,87 You're still investing and in public education and. 699 01:17:39,27 --> 01:17:43,88 And we're seeing a privatizing of public education and 700 01:17:44,27 --> 01:17:50,91 and though you know I I know I know whatever I know the historical legacy I'm stepping into every time I step into a 701 01:17:50,92 --> 01:17:59,98 public classroom but but at the same time the alternative. Is a little more of the same colonial mindset. 702 01:18:00,01 --> 01:18:02,05 That I'm trying to explore and those are. 703 01:18:03,31 --> 01:18:08,54 The privatization of education is like super complex and has many faces 704 01:18:08,55 --> 01:18:12,89 and its charter schooling is very complicated but. 705 01:18:15,80 --> 01:18:20,99 That as a as a trend it's it's also troubling So I think it's just that people 706 01:18:21,42 --> 01:18:27,12 when we say education people I think she went to all of us to kind of know what they mean 707 01:18:27,13 --> 01:18:28,56 when these were in education 708 01:18:29,20 --> 01:18:37,61 and for areas I really didn't like things to start like at least getting a point of view an education that is not you 709 01:18:37,62 --> 01:18:44,95 know strictly need to know to let Terry and who are. Not just an instrument to get money or and. 710 01:18:46,73 --> 01:18:53,83 So he's a good place to start awesome that's a killer list of things you do that was very good. 711 01:18:55,12 --> 01:19:03,50 I have one thing do you have anything. Oh I think I already weirdly. Are shoehorned mine in about the C.P. 712 01:19:03,51 --> 01:19:06,64 Finish and so definitely recommend it and. 713 01:19:07,97 --> 01:19:11,58 And also you know just Manby in my studio 714 01:19:11,59 --> 01:19:17,09 and get it I didn't have a ruler that was long enough so I just had a long piece of wood. 715 01:19:18,93 --> 01:19:20,93 Like a script with it cut it Sable so 716 01:19:21,13 --> 01:19:29,58 and then it was so brain freeing to sit down to do a perspective if you're going at it I might have to do similar that 717 01:19:30,06 --> 01:19:30,37 school. 718 01:19:31,52 --> 01:19:36,65 Studio where it's practice I mean it's great this piece of paper and a piece of wood 719 01:19:36,74 --> 01:19:44,24 and that was his way my project I'll admit that in my piece that I was working illust Adobe Illustrator which is the 720 01:19:44,25 --> 01:19:50,77 antithesis of sitting down at your desk but I actually turned on the perspective grid instead of the actual grid 721 01:19:51,79 --> 01:19:53,04 and I was like wait what I just did. 722 01:19:54,61 --> 01:19:59,98 So I tried to use that and I could not get it to go as easily as just do it but I have no. 723 01:20:00,29 --> 01:20:08,54 Yeah I have only one thing which is. I don't even know how it happened but I started listening to there's a. 724 01:20:10,07 --> 01:20:16,17 Band called Dying Fetus and their. Brutal death metal band which is sort of a certain category of death metal. 725 01:20:18,03 --> 01:20:20,48 And they have a new record out called wrong one to F. 726 01:20:20,49 --> 01:20:29,50 With and it's really harsh in this really really weird way that I'm I'm liking. 727 01:20:30,71 --> 01:20:40,78 And there's a one track off of it called ideological subjugation which is maps to many of their titles are these kind 728 01:20:40,79 --> 01:20:48,28 of very soft almost kind of. Titles but. It is. 729 01:20:50,75 --> 01:20:56,29 There it's quite good and I don't know what it is I like about it like I think I can articulate 730 01:20:56,30 --> 01:21:02,11 but I like it a lot so if you're into listening to new things dying foetuses new album wrong one to F. 731 01:21:02,12 --> 01:21:07,96 With this is my pick. All right you can find photos of our finished projects. 732 01:21:09,05 --> 01:21:12,95 On our projects like called Project stuff opposable podcast dot com will post. 733 01:21:14,08 --> 01:21:18,30 All of our stuff up there and you can check our hero school videos and photos. 734 01:21:19,36 --> 01:21:22,98 We'll also have links in the show notes of all the stuff we've been talking about there's a lot of really good links 735 01:21:22,99 --> 01:21:25,98 that are to our trio sent to us so different check those out 736 01:21:26,77 --> 01:21:30,63 and you can listen to all of our episodes directly at opposable podcast dot com 737 01:21:30,90 --> 01:21:39,98 or subscribe with your pod cast listening application of choice your web browser itunes overcast at your extra We would 738 01:21:39,99 --> 01:21:45,33 like to send you an opposable thumb sticker if you would like one just share a podcast episode on social media rate us 739 01:21:45,34 --> 01:21:51,39 on i Tunes or do whatever it you can think of to share opposable thumbs with someone else 740 01:21:52,02 --> 01:21:56,84 and we'll send you a sticker in the mail so just send us your mailing list your e-mail address scuse me and 741 01:21:57,36 --> 01:22:06,05 and I will send you a sticker. Our logo is created by a really cool artist from the U.K. 742 01:22:06,06 --> 01:22:11,85 Called wolf mask you can check out his work at wolf mask Art Deco the U.K. And if you're in need of an illustrator. 743 01:22:13,14 --> 01:22:17,74 And not someone you can just synthesize now the project icons for you. 744 01:22:18,78 --> 01:22:24,30 Mass could be a really great person to get in touch with We'd like to give Nick a shout out as he's our top pitch on 745 01:22:24,31 --> 01:22:30,10 supporter Thank you Nick if you'd like to join Nick in the league of Patron supporter banning ISIS please go to patron 746 01:22:30,11 --> 01:22:35,26 dot com slash opposable thumbs to sponsor us we have three sponsorship tears there you can check out 747 01:22:35,55 --> 01:22:37,39 and anything you can donate really helps. 748 01:22:39,46 --> 01:22:44,67 Our podcast is dedicated to providing a harassment free experience for everyone regardless of race gender age sexual 749 01:22:44,68 --> 01:22:49,50 orientation disability physical appearance body size knowledge of subject matter or religion 750 01:22:49,54 --> 01:22:52,64 or lack thereof we actively support an inclusive environment 751 01:22:52,65 --> 01:22:58,52 and we want you to be a part of that you can check out our full code of conduct over at our site thanks for listening 752 01:22:58,53 --> 01:23:03,93 to opposable thumbs were really psyched to have you on board were really psyched that we've made it to twelve episodes 753 01:23:04,59 --> 01:23:07,13 we're going to keep on coming and please keep your comments 754 01:23:07,14 --> 01:23:15,23 and suggestions coming along as well also if you decide to take a challenge on with us like if flags is speaking to you 755 01:23:15,24 --> 01:23:17,78 right now make a flag and send us a photo or a video of what you made. 756 01:23:19,35 --> 01:23:27,63 Also we're going to start posting on our picture on blog just other things that artists who we've spoken with 757 01:23:27,64 --> 01:23:32,70 and other cool links and stuff on there so we're going to sort of activate that blog in a more compelling way 758 01:23:32,96 --> 01:23:37,89 and so different things that are true as up to our show for free to send this all that stuff 759 01:23:37,90 --> 01:23:39,54 and will post it for you down the road. 760 01:23:40,91 --> 01:23:45,60 And thanks for being our guest do you have anything that you any links or activities 761 01:23:45,61 --> 01:23:51,99 or anything else you want to share with people here at the close enough so they can check out yeah you know I think the 762 01:23:52,00 --> 01:23:53,73 best first 763 01:23:53,74 --> 01:23:59,98 and foremost you can look at my own website I was thinking I'll think you know her buying looks like a Japanese. 764 01:24:00,30 --> 01:24:13,65 Company that sells skin lightening cream. Yeah. So what's the U.R.L. So W W W dot Are you M B O that's your. 765 01:24:15,69 --> 01:24:19,97 And definitely definitely see that one that's like the opposite of any. 766 01:24:21,58 --> 01:24:32,78 Internet website but I let it expire and then they got it from me. And my new website is W W W All all countless. 767 01:24:35,22 --> 01:24:42,19 And yeah I think. If you keep an eye open for the East Los Angeles or durable transport line book. 768 01:24:43,61 --> 01:24:47,96 Wanted to give a shout out to my school and my students Ellinger high school 769 01:24:48,40 --> 01:24:50,47 when you get a shot at the public educators 770 01:24:50,48 --> 01:24:59,10 and unionized educators unionized tenants in Los Angeles in the good work and to all people asserting their right 771 01:24:59,19 --> 01:25:02,72 or a dignified existence and relationship with this beautiful land. 772 01:25:04,79 --> 01:25:10,47 And into the progress is getting better without them that's the way there that's awesome thank you thank you. 773 01:25:11,75 --> 01:25:32,92 Thank you so much every show that was awesome thanks for sharing. Those people that I know I know that we can. 774 01:25:34,08 --> 01:25:40,94 You know if you find that to be true to up. 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